Grant and Danny
Scouting The NY Giants With Dan Duggan
And to help us preview Sunday's game, we've got Dan Doug and senior writer for the athletic who covers the Giants. So Dan, why don't we begin with how loud the noise is surrounding Daniel Jones going into week two. I don't mean literally because the boost started after the second play of the opening drive. So it was pretty loud on Sunday, but I think that kind of sums up how ugly things and how toxic things really have been around him and the team. And it's only continued through the week. The one thing that's always kind of stood out about Daniel Jones is kind of remarkable. There's lots of bad quarterbacks. There's lots of overpaid players. Nobody seems to take as many shots from other players, whether it be current or former, than Jones. And I think that's ratcheted up already here where Vikings had a linebacker say he felt bad for Jones at points during the game when the crowd is brewing in. But you just never really hear players talk that way about opponents. So that's the root in the outside. And then around the team, the fan base here is like done. One game into year six and everyone just feels like they're ready to move on. Further inside the wall, the team is rallying around him, but you can't imagine there'll be a very long leash if he performs like he did in the opener. You know, it could honestly be like Sunday could be make a break for him because he goes out there does not play well. I get to watch in defense. It just gave up 37 points to Baker Mayfield. I think that's a really probably considered making a change. Yeah, I mean, whether he's good or not is a whole nother conversation to your point. But why you see such a punching bag as you put it? I always say with quarterbacks, you're either in the cool kids club or you're not. But you get the jacket where I mean, Baker Mayfield has stunk for a long time. He's now played a lot better here since last year in Tampa. But like he was a dog though and guys liked him and rallied around him. I mean, Daniel Jones just never had that cologne. I don't know if he went to Duke or he's nerdy or he's just quiet. Like what is it about him that makes him such a target? Yeah, I don't know. It's probably like a sociological experiment to do. He has like the kind he comes from that sort of privilege background, a Duke guy. And I think, you know, this probably he came into the Giants and everyone thought he's going to be the next Eli man. And he was just sort of like put on a pedestal. Maybe he didn't deserve. But I mean, you go back. He got booed by Giants fans on draft night when that pick got announced. So you see, he didn't have a very long runway. And then even the funnier top of Baker Mayfield come up near the first two answers. He took a shot at him in a GQ interview before Jones even played a game. Saying basically like he was saying how teams don't know how to draft quarterbacks. I think he used Joe as an example. Like this guy's never won and you know, a team took him in the top 10. So yeah, I don't know what is exactly. He just sort of has that aura bottom where people don't really like him and don't give him the doubt. And you know, then his play has certainly not helped quiet that down. And it's obviously, you know, hit the one stretch there in 2022 where, you know, they thought maybe he could be the guy. And then since then it's been just an absolute disaster. Basically, since the ink dried on that contract, it's been all downhill from them from there from there. The athletic stand. And with this here on Grant and Danny. So Dan, this is tough to quantify, but just want to get your sense of this. My neighbor buddy of mine is a Giants fan. And this is what he said to me. I actually hope he doesn't play well this weekend because I don't want anyone to have any kind of excuses. Like how common do you think that sentiment is among Giants fans? Almost like actively rooting against him to force some kind of change versus just booing because they're frustrated. No, I think that's real. I think there's a lot of Giants fans just done with him. You know, they didn't love the contract, but they felt like, all right. You know, maybe that playoff season was a start or something. Obviously, last year was a disaster. You know, like a lot of fans want to move on in the draft. You know, we started hard knocks that, you know, Shane and the Giants wanted to move on with that ad. Sort of a backdrop. I think it kind of takes a little bit of safety in that way. It was where, like, the team can't shield him and say, oh, we love Daniel. Like, no, we saw very clearly that you were willing to trade up. I mean, Brian Davos in hard knocks saying he'd be willing to trade up for Jayden Daniel. So that just kind of makes for an awkward backdrop to a lot of this stuff. Like this week, Brian Davos answered questions about that. It's just kind of awkward. So he knows the team doesn't really have his back. But so, yeah, you're asking about the fans. No, I definitely think that's a sentiment that exists because, listen, I think what the most likely outcome is is, you know, Daniel Jones goes out on Sunday, plays okay. You know, it's a throw for 200 yards, two touchdowns. They win 20 to 13. So it kind of quiets down the bench, Daniel Jones chatter. But where does that get the team? You know what I mean? If they're going to be one-on-one, then they play at Cleveland, then they get Dallas on a Thursday night. So probably right back where we are, you know, right now in a couple of weeks. So I can see fans just saying, I want to rip the band aid off. Go out and stink in Washington. There'll be no excuses. They'll have to make a change. Because, listen, I don't think Drew Locke can perform any better necessarily. But I can at least sympathize with fans who just want something different. And I think that's where a lot of fans are at. And I was actually going to say, where does it get them if they play Drew Locke or Tommy DeVito? I don't know that that gets them anywhere either. Our guest is Dan Duggan, covers the Giants for the Athletic. How about the rest of the offense? Where's the offensive line at? And it's build. I know that was a big emphasis watching their off-season hard knocks. They were terrible last season, gave up a record number of sex. And what about the weaponry and how it's coming along, the leaked neighbors being the key ingredient? Yeah, and listen, if it was just Daniel Jones playing bad in the opener, I think it would be a lot easier to stomach. But nobody really played well in that game. Again, he's the focal point. And, you know, if he played better, I think it would help the other guys. But nobody really had a good game for the Giants. The offensive line was certainly not the disaster. It was last year, which, you know, it was historically bad. And it was just, I mean, they were just putting guys out there that weren't even NFL players. They're much better than that. But I think the ceiling for this group is like league average. And again, that was, I can't understate. That would be a huge improvement for the Giants. But it's still not going to be a great line. You have Andrew Thomas that left tackle, who's a great player. Everyone else is kind of journeymen vets or John Douglas Smith is a second year guy who didn't really show a lot of his rookie. So they're just hoping that's a passable group. And I would say in the opener, they were. I mean, the run blocking wasn't very good. Even if you look at the box score, five sacks. One of those was Jones trying to scramble. And he got caught like at the line of scrimmage. A couple of he kind of, I think the protection was fine. He either held the ball too long or scrambled into sacks. So the whole line was fine. It wasn't great, but it was fine. And then, yeah, the weaponry. Obviously, you know, they won't take on Barclays course three touchdowns last Friday night. And then, you know, I think they know there's a downgrade there. But certainly Devin Singletary and none of those young backs really distinguished themselves. So yeah, the neighbors is the guy. I mean, he was awesome in training camp. Even last week, you know, the first game was quiet game. You know, the offense, they didn't do much. They're doing four catches for, you know, 60-some on guard. So like that's going to be a bad game as a rookie. I think it kind of tells you, you know, the impact he could have. But aside from him, nobody made any plays. Like, I mean, it was just a really depressing effort. I mean, it's got six points. Both of them came on short fields after turnovers. So it wasn't as if they even had like one really good drive. It just, they just did not play well. I mean, obviously said, started at the quarterback, but nobody had a great game for the, for the Giants. Dan, you've, you've chronicled this thing for a while. And we're talking about sort of the stadium for the Giants here. Regardless of what's been going on over the last several years, the Giants have just owned Washington, eight, three and one over their last 12 matchups. I know neither team was particularly good, but that's like chiefs over the Raiders kind of stuff. You know what I mean? Like what, do your best quantified? How has that happened? How's it been that way? No, it's crazy. And that's why I'm like, you know, if you're Daniel Jones and you have to have kind of a make or break game, he couldn't have picked a better opponent. You know, this is certainly the team that he, he has to feel confident going at. Now, I know it's kind of like silly for us to say that because you go back to some of those wins. That's like two or three coaching staff to go for the Giants and probably for the commanders, you know, as I think about it. But it is, there is still something. He goes in that building. He certainly feels comfortable. You know, some of the players obviously have been there for a while, but yeah, I mean, I do think there is a difference where I mean, I think he had lost his success against Jack Del Rio defenses. So, you know, and he did not have any much success against Dan Quinn defenses the last three years. Now again, I know the personnel in Dallas, much different than what you guys have in Washington right now. But that might be a little bit of an equalizer where, you know, I think that they were very comfortable joining us at defense the last couple of years. So, I think at least schematically, you know, it will probably be more of a challenge this week. You know, I don't know if Washington's personnel is, you know, kind of up to par, but yeah, I mean, listen, if you're the Giants, there's nobody you want to see on the schedule more this Sunday for, you know, things are already looking pretty bleak here. So, if you're trying to turn things around in Washington, the schedule has to be kind of the best-case scenario for them. Dan Duggan covers the Giants for the Athletic in New York on Grant and Danny. Am I wrong in assuming neighbors is the only guy really who can dominate Washington secondary, which is a real poor spot for this defense. But I don't worry about anybody other than Malik neighbors. Yeah, I mean, listen, I would say this, like the Giants strength of their offense has to be their receivers. But yeah, it's a lot of it is kind of potential or young guys who haven't really, you know, made their marks yet. But so obviously neighbors is that guy who I think, you know, if something kind of a game, you know, a game-breaking performance would be him. You have Wanda Robinson, you know, he's kind of an underneath guy, sort of a slot gadgety guy. So, you know, he'll have the ball in the stands a lot, you know, maybe he makes a big play. Darius Layton is kind of like old reliable here where, you know, no one ever like seems to want him. And then by the end of the year, you look up and you leave the team receiving. And then Jalen Hyatt is kind of a wild card. He really didn't play a lot in the opener. But a guy that traded up for the third round last year, I believe against Washington, the game here last year, he had a long catcher too. Like he'll do that. Like he, you know, if you leave him one on one on the outside, he's a threat to, you know, have a four yard catch down the sideline. The problem and why he didn't play a lot is he hasn't really developed much of anything else. But I mean, that's four guys there that at least bring something to the table. So again, if Daniel Jones is going to have a ball at that performance, it's going to be because of those guys down field and chiefly neighbors. I mean, he is definitely the guy who has that ability to really be a kind of a game changing presence. Dan, you mentioned the hard knocks off season. It was great theater for us. I can't imagine it was, you know, anything less than that for you guys up there, especially, you know, just the, the, the access is just unbelievable. What we got a lot of insight. But I wonder what the feeling was after that or kind of even during for Brian Dable and Joe Shane, respectively. Just to me, I wouldn't be inspired if I was watching that as a Giants fan going. They're talking about players the way like me and my fantasy buddies talk about it. Do you have a good year this year? I was kind of slowed down as a running back or what just it was like this surface level conversation making these multi-million dollar decisions. What's the big picture thought right now in Dable and Shane? No, I'm with you. I definitely had that impression too. Like, really? That's why you made these decisions? I mean, listen, we have to at least acknowledge that, you know, they're in these buildings 16, 18 hours a day and we're getting snippets of conversation. I'm sure some of maybe the real granular stuff, either HBO edits out or the Giants didn't want out because of competitive reasons. They don't want to get into there. They're analytical breakdowns of certain players. But yeah, some of those conversations definitely came across very surface level. I mean, I think what happens a lot of times with the, you know, these regimes are evaluated. The coach is kind of the one who's in the firing line. He talks to media every day. You see him on the sideline every Sunday. But I think Dable has probably done a better job in his two years. And listen, that's not saying much based on where they are right now. But if you look in the totality of it, you know, one coach of the year in 2022, because it got a pretty weak roster to the playoffs, no one saw that coming, won a playoff game. Shane came in, obviously inherited a bad situation. Like every new GM does, you know, not too many GMs win the Super Bowl and then right off into the sunset. So he had a, you know, had a bad roster, a bad cap situation. Now we're in year three. This is the time when you want to see the, that first draft class. The two top 10 picks came on Thibodeau, Evan Neal, and that first draft class. You want to start seeing those guys making strides. You want to see them free agent additions. The trades, all these things he's done really start to get your team, you know, over the hump. And it feels like they're at best. They're running in place. So I mean, I think that this is a big year for both of those guys. Again, usually the GM, he has like more grace. But I mean, I just look at this roster right now. And man, for year three, this is a lot of holes. And, you know, the biggest one being quarterback. You've been here three years. They haven't addressed it. You know, they obviously doubled down on Daniel Jones after one year. So now you're going to go into next off season. If we fast forward and things don't change, still needing to fill the most important position on the field and then not feeling like at least the rest of the roster is in great shape. So yeah, it's like I said, you can probably hear it in my answer here. Things are pretty bleak around this team right now. And I know it's only one week and things can change. But it was very discouraging start. That's relatable content. I will say, Dan, although with year one of a new quarterback and a new coach, we're going to be a lot more patient. But I think people are expecting a lot more than we saw in that first game, something you guys know all about. Speaking of expectations, though, the one area of the giants that I feel like just needs to be good because the talent is there is getting to the quarterback. They trade for Brian Burns. They still have a cave on Thibodeau who only had one pressure last week, but his own to Washington. Dexter Lawrence is one of the best players in the league at the position. So I guess number one, how do they do against Minnesota? I know Sam Darnold lit it up just getting home. And then secondly, is there any reason to believe they shouldn't be able to win the line of scrimmage up front against Washington this week? Yeah, no, so Minnesota disappointed. Like I said, all the way around. The only guy that you could probably say showed up was Dexter Lawrence. I mean, he is just a monster. Like, he really is at that point now where he could maybe take the mantle from, you know, Aaron Donald being retired and, you know, Chris Jones is still kind of at the top of his game, but he's going to be in that conversation, I think, this year. I mean, he just he just dominates guys. It's crazy. And I assume you'll see it again on Sunday, and Washington's in tears may be better than their tackles, but I mean, I don't think anybody there is going to be able to match up with Dexter Lawrence 101. And he'd be double team. So it's like he's he's just a problem week in week out. But the edges were a disappointment. You know, I mean, like I said, they made all that investment in Brian Burns was a trade and a huge contract. And then I said, I touched on Thibodeau, you know, number five pick a couple years ago. Like they have built this team in this defense. If they're going to win, it's because the pass rush is going to dominate games. I mean, the secondary is young. It's improving. So it needs to be, you know, that front four just getting after the quarterback did not happen. Sam Darnell completed his first 12 passes was never really in trouble. Just kind of picked them apart methodically. You know, that obviously that's why you lose games 28 to fix. They just couldn't impact the game enough. Now you fast forward to Washington. The one thing Minnesota has is really good tackles. I look at Washington tackles. They're certainly not in that class. And if Brian Burns and Camon Thibodeau don't, you know, kind of dominate this game or have a, you know, big impact on this game, that would be alarming. Because I mean, you again, you just look at the talent you're going against and what the Giants have invested in these guys. They need to take this game over. I mean, I guess with Jane Daniels, maybe you're not going to get to make sacks because, you know, he's obviously elusive and he's going to take off, but they need to be chasing him out of that pocket and making life hard for him. Because again, that's how this defense is built to win. It's not going to be because they're this great secondary. It has to be the guys up front taking control of the game. Dan, any key injuries or maybe like half a dozen guys that probably just need to rest to give Washington a good chance and then give me your prediction. Yeah, I mean, the only one that's a little bit concerned is Malik neighbors popped up on the injury report yesterday, limited with, it says just like knee soreness and, you know, Dave will study fine. He's listed as a full participant, not questionable, but, you know, we only got to see a little bit of practice today, but, you know, he doesn't look like a guy. He's 100%. So, I mean, listen, if that knee doesn't feel great, you know, I think that could help Washington for sure. Because again, he's kind of the engine that's going to make this thing go. But again, they're saying there's no concern. So, you know, I guess we'll just see him. He kind of played every snap in his first game as a rookie. So they're certainly going to lean on him. So if his workload is limited, that'll be noteworthy. And as far as prediction, I put it in print this morning. So I don't want to contradict myself. I think I said like Giants 23 to 16. Like I think it'll be a typical Giants commander's game, certainly not the most beautiful aesthetically pleasing game. I think, you know, Daniel Jones will find a little bit of that magic to do enough to kind of like save his job for a week. And, you know, again, like I just think if this defense can't control this game, like I don't know, you know, I don't know who they're going to stop because it needs to be a lot better than it was last week against McDonald's. Dan, thank you for the time and all the insight helping us scout the Giants. We appreciate it. Yeah, you got it, guys. Appreciate how Dan's work in the athletic, Dan Duggan on Grant and Danny.