WBCA Podcasts

Talk Of The Neighborhoods

This week on Talk of the Neighborhoods, at-Large City Councilor Erin Murphy joins us to talk about the year ahead at City Hall and her recent unsuccessful primary bid for the SJC Clerk position. Then on the second half, we'll talk with cancer survivor and MOPSS, (Mass. Oncology Patient Survivors and Supporters) founder Thomas Healy, and oncologist Dr. Mark Varvares, Harvard Medical School chair of Otolaryngology Head and Neck Surgery, about their continuing efforts to pass legislation that would require medical insurers to cover certain dental procedures for cancer survivors.

Broadcast on:: 26 Sep 2024
Audio Format:: other

- Good evening and welcome to Talk to the Neighborhoods. I'm Joe Heisler, your host, coming to you from the BNN Live Studios in Eggelson Square. And tonight, we're also being simulcast on our sister radio station, WBCA 102.9 FM. Tonight, a terrific show in two parts. First up, we'll catch up with at large city councilor Erin Murphy. She just has come off a bruising democratic primary campaign for the Suffolk County SJC clerk and one race in which she just came up short. And then on the second half, we'll shift gears to Beacon Hill and we'll talk with a couple of advocates for, it's called MOPS, the Massachusetts Oncology Patient Survivors and Supporters Organization. They just came up short as well at the end of the legislative session. Their bill, which would have required medical insurers to cover certain dental procedures for cancer survivors also came up short and we'll find out what they're doing to try and get passage of their bill and one of several bills that didn't make it in this session. All that and more tonight on Talk to the Neighborhoods, stay tuned, we'll be right back. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - All right, we're back with Talk to the Neighborhoods. I'm Joe Heiser, host tonight. In this first half, we're catching up with another Boston City Council. She just, she's an at-large council representing the entire city. Just came off of a rather bruising democratic primary campaign for Suffolk County SJC clerk position, somewhat obscure, but perhaps the one race on the ballot, the primary ballot in September, earlier this month, that got the most attention and always pleased to have her back as a guest to find out as well. What's on tap for the year ahead in the Boston City Council, Aaron Murphy. - Thank you, thanks so much for coming in. Nice to have you here. How are you feeling? I know I talked to various people over the course of the summer and you're working at very hard. It was a very tough campaign. - Yeah, I definitely was the candidate. I feel fine. I mean, I was the one candidate who was working, you know, campaigning out there every day. A lot of it was the same as being the at-large city council. You know, I'm someone who shows up every day. So just connecting with voters. And, you know, what I heard over and over again is they, people were really afraid to lose me in my voice, my advocacy on the council. So I think in the end, people-- - Might have worked against you. - Yeah, you're hard working on the council. - Right, 'cause I keep hearing that, you know, 'cause like I said, Tuesday was the election on Wednesday. I was, you know, right back out there, no rest there. So continuing, like even today, I was at an event this morning and three women from the north end came up, you know. And what I usually hear is, sorry you lost, but we're happy you lost. We're happy you're still there for us. So, I mean, it makes me feel good that at least they know that my advocacy and my willingness, right, to talk about issues. I say it time and time again, and we said it, I think last time, this is my second full term. Last term, I feel like we were a body that got a lot more done in this term. There's a lot of counselors who aren't willing to hold hearings or hold the administration accountable. - And I'm gonna talk more about that because one of your colleagues was here a couple of weeks back and I talked about that as well. But back just to the race just for a second. And you were, ran against a public defender, basically, who was making her first run for public office. What do you attribute the fact that you weren't able to win that seat? I mean, there were a lot of-- - And there were a lot of people, people who I feel should never have weighed in, but that got behind her and wanted the message to be, even though it wasn't true that this, it's a managerial, you know, paperwork type job. In some ways, maybe I did dodgeable at very questions I got a lot to is like, won't you be bored? Why don't you want to continue to be, you know, a strong advocate, you know, for the people? - Well, they call those positions the velvet coffin. - Yeah, and I'm way too young to, yeah, I don't want to retire anytime soon. I'm only 54, yeah, so my opponent was much older. So yeah, definitely I'm not in any, no, I don't see retirement in my future. I did see though that I could have done a wonderful job and advocate, you know, making sure the court, and there's a lot of chaos on the council, right? We saw it last term, so I did see that maybe this was a way for me to step out of that chaos and. - Do you think part of it, and, you know, I don't want to dwell on it too long, 'cause it's in the past, and I know you're one of these people that likes to look forward, but that part of it was you, the people that you crossed swords with on the council or the administration, now Mayor Wu endorsed your opponent. How much of an effect do you think that had on it? - No, I think when the colleagues who did endorse my opponent, I think they did it 'cause they do what the mayor says. I don't think they really thought that in any way, 'cause no one could really think if they actually read the description that I wasn't more than qualified. Everyone absolutely has a right to pick sides. I've, not many times what I have endorsed people, right? So you do have to make a decision. I respected that they did that, but many of them, it wasn't because they didn't think I would do a good job, it's because they were asked to. And I heard from a lot of people in the state house too, that they were asked to endorse my opponent. - And Mayor Wu, why would she weigh in like that? - I'll never know, she will never tell me. I mean, she doesn't answer my texts or calls when I'm reaching out about council things. So I don't think we'll ever have that conversation, unfortunately, about why she wouldn't. - Well, that's politics, right? - That is, you certainly know what you've ran before and came up short, then ran again and was successful. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And what does it mean for your city council tenure? You said you're right back at it as a change, how you look at your work on the council and what you set out to do? - No, and when I was campaigning, it just made my days longer, I didn't ever stop, but I still went to all the council meetings and hearings and showed up to all the important events throughout the summer from my constituents. So nothing's changed there. And I think that shows that I continued and my office continued to, we didn't shut down our council office in any way to run for this. It was, yep. So we're just still advocating right now, advocating to make sure our buses get our kids to school and all of the things that I think are important issues that the council should be addressing, constituent service issues, you know? - No, and I know it's more than a year out at this point, but you had to discourage you from running again? - Not at all. - No, we don't win everything, we never give up, right? Yeah, no, I'm not discouraged at all. And I know, especially hearing throughout, I mean, I knew people didn't want me to lose me on the council. I didn't realize that many people would actually make it a point. And the turnout was low, but it was low for both candidates. So all of the theories of what happened, I think it came down to people seeing me in my strength right now, 'cause on the health side. - Well, I know one of your supporters, Councillor Ed Flynn, District Two Councillor, was here a couple of weeks ago and he said he thought that your colleagues didn't really treat you fairly and that they kind of ganged up on you. And I don't think he used those words. - Right, I mean, lots of people have said that. Lots of people have reached out kind of apologizing, not that they need to. I'm a true believer that I cannot control at all what people do and how people act and how they treat me. I can only keep my head up high and continue to do, but I promised my, you know, the constituents, all of the residents in the city of Boston, what I'll do, where I keep showing up with a smile and doing my work and-- - And you're still smiling. - I'm still smiling. - And as a change though, your relationship with your council colleagues? - No, because once I knew early on that, and we already know how the council's divided, right, that the people who were going to do what the mayor said, I mean, they endorsed her early on. So it's not like I just found out a few weeks ago after the election. - In some ways, I think, you know, you learn a lot, and I definitely learned, you know, and like you say, politics is a dirty game. I definitely learn who your true friends are, you know, who will always, no matter what it is, you're needing to go into battle for, like who will be there for you and who will actually make decisions on their own and not be told what to do. I think that says a lot about my role with my colleagues on the council in that sense, that if there's an issue, like lots of people, lots of my colleagues don't even want to sign on or talk about school issues, right? I mean, we recently saw the MCAS scores of plummeting across the state, but they still want to advocate for what the administration wants. - Well, and it hasn't changed how you approach business. And do you think any regrets about running? - No, no, I mean, of course I went in it to win it. I could not have worked any harder. We ran a very-- - That's what I kept hearing over and over again. - And I still bump into, I would say 90% of the people I talked through still don't know who my opponent was. I think I did what the people of Suffolk County deserved, and I introduced myself to those who didn't know me yet out in Winthrop, Chelsea, and Revere. I worked hard here in the city of Boston, and I think, you know, we have a lot to be proud of. - And it may well serve you well if and when you decide to run for re-election, and I'm assuming you're probably planning on that, in a year when most people wouldn't be campaigning, you were out there. - I was out there, and you learned a lot on the campaign trail for sure, yeah. And you have a lot of questions, like, who are these? Where are these votes coming from? - Well, of course, and it's different because when you're running at large, you're running for one of four seats. - Very different. - So, you know, people have a choice, and then, you know, whether you're their first choice, or beyond that, you know. - But the data from the November at large election showed, you know, Ruth, she and I were only, you know, a couple hundred votes away, that we definitely were very popular, you know, I was popular across all 22 neighborhoods, but there were many precincts that it was clear I came in first, or I got one or two votes of people, right? 'Cause we know not everyone uses all four votes in all neighborhoods across the city. So, yeah, I think we continue to learn from it, right? The data, to me, is fascinating, too. - I'm sure it is, as you look across, and of course, the city has changed, and continues to change pretty dramatically. But, you know, there's been a lot, that's been said lately, that identity politics has come into play more and more, so, and I'm wondering if you felt that, whether it was, well, I'm not sure, a race, or a neighborhood, or what you-- - Or the message that, you know, she's an attorney, you're not, even though there's very good reasons why you don't need to. I think they harped on one thing that wasn't true, and kept going, and people do, I mean, and the people who got behind her were powerful people, and I respect that. - Right, right. - And they worked out for her, so good for her, right? She got the right people behind her to help support her. - Well, and she was here, and she certainly seems capable, so as certainly you were as well, I think that, you know, maybe some of that quizzes might have been unfair, but that's the nature of the business, right, so-- - Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a very long job interview that I did not get at the end, but like I said, it got me, you know, in all of, you know, it got me out there, not anymore, 'cause I'm always out all the time, but it definitely, it was a nice way to, you know, be a candidate, but also be the counselor and show up, so. - Well, and again, Erin Murphy is here, she's, of course, at large Boston City Councilor, and here tonight, we've got a few minutes left, I would let's look, start looking back. - Forward. - Look forward. You said you just came here from a council hearing, and what are you working on these days, and what are your priorities now, for the rest of the year, and next year? - Yeah, I mean, as a chair of strong women, families and communities, this week had a hearing to pass a lot of grant money that comes through a lot of the different departments, like age strong, making sure our seniors are getting their vouches, their food, you know, their transportation, you know, advocacy, you know, oombudsman going into senior housing, all of that is important, the human service department, I think it's probably one of the most important in the city, they're all important, but making sure that the constituents get the services they need, so that's work that we continue to do. Always have been and always will be a strong advocate for our schools, a lot. - And you said, and the committee has said again. - Strong women, families, and communities, so lots of departments. - So lots of departments. - What they haven't discussed about on women. - It started out that way, I think, Diana Presley, how it created that many years ago, but obviously women, families, so, but the departments it falls under is all of human services, you know, BCWIF, our community centers, our senior centers, may as an office of housing, a lot of different departments fall under that committee. - Working the way you'd like to see them working? - Yeah, I mean, I mean, for me, a lot of-- - I mean, those departments, those-- - I mean, I've had, this is the thing to, ribbon cuttings are fun, celebrations are great, but my role and my job I do take very seriously on the council is that when city government isn't working, and when we see that we need to support and step up and help our constituents, we have to address it. That's something I'm willing to do and highlight. I've been doing it with school issues when there's concerns. Last summer and the summer before, I was highlighting youth summer jobs, how do we get it better, right? There are definitely city departments, all departments could do better, and how is my role on the council, someone who can advocate and support to make it better? And to lift up the voices, people call me and share their concerns with me. So it is important that these commissioners, it's important that this-- - They say, "No, you're listening." - Right, and they want, right? And so it's important to me, even though it doesn't happen, but like I think the superintendent of school should pick up my call. I think when I called the mayor, she should answer me. When I wanna share concerns and work with the administration, that it's important that they listen to my voice also. People elected me to advocate for them. - Right, what do you attribute that to? I mean, they're a failure to-- - Politics? - I think it comes down to politics. Yeah. - Well, and I know I saw something, I'm trying to remember where I might've been in a Boston Herald story about the council, and you saying that some of your legislation or proposals, we're not getting a hearing under the council. Now we had Henry Santana here, new at large council, one of your colleagues, and asked him about it. And he said, "Well, not true at least for himself." He said that he had just had a hearing. In fact, on a proposal, I think, from you know, I'm not sure. And that he was, he was open to-- - Not sure when he was here, but even the hearing we finally had that I filed in April, just this week. It was about special ed services that aren't being delivered to our universal pre-K, our three and four year olds who are getting seats, which is a wonderful thing, opening up more seats for our little ones, but not getting the special ed services was my concern. And invited was Superintendent Skipper and K-Sail, they had a special ed, and neither of them showed up to the hearing, or the hearing that I filed with Council of Land about, I think, the Reggie Lewis Center, and talking about when there was concern about our student athletes not having proper places, and the pictures of students at, you know, Tech Boston, training for track, running up and down the hallways in the school, so talking about what is the agreement, you know, with Reggie Lewis, and no one from, you know, Athletics and BPS showed up, no one from BPS showed up. So it's one thing to say you're having a hearing, but if we're not using our power and our role on the council to make sure, when we file hearing orders, it's, we don't work with the administration to find out what works best for them. We set a date, we make sure we give them adequate time, 48 hours is required. - And that's part of the council's role as oversight. You know, like recently we filed a hearing about the buses, Council of Flynn and I, and Henry did say that he would have an expedited hearing. We, last week got him to say tomorrow, 27th at 10, would be, you know, the first available, and said, "That's great, let's do it." And then, you know, BPS email back saying that they couldn't make it, that October 29th would be the first day they could come. - So basically-- - But the BP, like administrative, right. 20% of the school year will be done, but it's not best practices, and it's not what the charter or the role of the council is that a chair of a committee would be allowing the administration, in this case the Boston Public School Department, to weigh in and be on an email chain about when, they don't tell us when they wanna come and talk about issues. We bring up issues, I'm very concerned about this issue, it was placed in the education department, the chair should be holding a hearing, and then also working with me to make sure that we're holding the administration accountable to come in, something. I know the current mayor did a great job of, she was always holding the administration accountable. So I think, and when she was a council, absolutely. And it diminishes our power as a body. I think us on the council, people see departments across the city hall know that they are not expected to show up anymore to come to the city hall. - How will that direct or determine how you approach? - Well, in that case, I think you stopped-- - The coming year, now. - Right, so hearings used to be a powerful tool the council had, but if we're not having hearings or we're not ensuring that the right people come to answer our question, they no longer become useful, so you have to use other means. And in this week I went and spoke at DECI, right? I signed up to give public testimony to the Department of Education. Wrote a letter to the school committee, right? So there's always other ways, you never defeated. - Have you talked to the council president? - No, she's not, it has been brought up that hearings aren't happening. We say it on the council floor, we write it into our council hearings, but she has not stepped up to make sure that they're happening. - Well, of course, when you were here last year and we're talking, and you were here this spring as well, but about the environment on the council, which some people described as rather toxic. This is last term. Is it any better? - Different, it's not as loud. - What do you want? - I don't, I think we're less effective as a body. - No more, we don't work that cohesively together. There is a group, right? But it's mostly just rubber stamping, the administration and not really supporting and advocating. So I think, you know, my first term, there were definitely, you know, media and conversations about behavior, but we got more down last term. I think we definitely-- - Than this term, and no, it's more cordial-less term. - Well, I would say it's less, you know, it's not more cordial. I would just say that no one's banging their face to like get on the front page of a paper, maybe, but there, I wouldn't say it's more cordial. It's just nothing that, you know, it's more behind the scenes, but we definitely-- - Trust writing to say the least, but not so frustrating that it's discouraged, you know? - No, never discouraged. And, you know, I'm here, and this term is not even halfway over. So we're just getting started on the, you know, the things we need to get done here. - More to come. - Yeah, absolutely. - And see, and hear more from Aaron Murphy. And at large city council, it's been second in last year's council elections, and, well, we shall see what the next election cycle brings. - Yes. - I appreciate you coming on the show tonight, and again-- - It's been great, yeah, thank you. - Keep up the good work, nice to have you here. When we return, we'll shift gears a bit to Beacon Hill now, and talking about coming up short, some advocates joining me for an act to require medical insurance to cover certain dental procedures. It sounds complicated, but I'm sure my guests will help to explain it, including the founder. He's the cancer survivor himself of the Massachusetts oncology, patient survivors and supporters organization, and also Dr. Mark Bivaras and oncologists from Harvard Medical School. Stay tuned, we'll be right back. - For the 11th year in a row, the Big Head Festival brought the community together to honor the monumental sculpture, Eternal Presence, crafted by Roxbury's own John Wilson. Participants took part in the cherished tradition of washing and waxing this iconic sculpture. A groundbreaking work that celebrates the Black community as the first of its kind to depict a Black figure. - For my father, having the sculpture here was of tremendous importance and significance. He grew up here, and he grew up not being able to see images that looked like him. So he wanted to make a monumental African-American presence in his community for kids to be able to look at and see themselves and all their potential. - I brought my two sons to the Big Head Festival. What I see when I look at the Big Head is longevity, curiosity, I see myself, I see a community that is banded together to raise up where we've been to where we wanna go. - With sleeves rolled up, attendees showed their deep respect for both the artist and his creation, meticulously caring for this awe-inspiring piece of art. The festival also featured vibrant singing and dance performances. Local vendors and a Special Lifetime Achievement Award presented to Isseem African Dance Historian and choreographer Deanna Battle. - John Wilson was able to create a piece of artwork that now lives within the community that I can look up to. My son can look up to other folks in the community, can come and see something that represents them. Not only does the statue look like them, but it was created by somebody who looks like their father or their uncles or their brothers. So it's important for the community to have a sculpture that belongs to us, to say, hey, this belongs in Roxbury because the person who created it came from Roxbury and he left us something that was great. The festival drew in families and community members who reflected on its significance. And for many attendees, the big heads sculpture symbolizes representation and a deep history of the black community in Roxbury. - I see a young black man in the community with his eyes focused on his future, his dreams, how he's gonna get there. And I should say, in all honesty, it's more than just a young black man. It's the black men of the community. John Woodrow Wilson, a son of Roxbury, wanted to give his community, the community of his birth, a monumental image of itself that placed it in human history and in global contributions. That work becomes eternal presence. We polish eternal presence today because we think of it like a grandfather that we look after and take care of. This is a ritual of caring and remembering. - The Big Head Community Festival serves as a powerful reminder of Roxbury's rich heritage and diverse community. This year's Boston Local Food Festival featured over 100 of Boston's local farmers, restaurants and vendors. With the goal of shedding more light on why choosing local is what's best for our communities and our environment. - Local food production is one of the most important topics in current events right now. Due to the fact that our food system is based upon global exports and that's going to slow based on climate change. So the best chance we have to ensure food for the future is to support our local farmers. - Local food is so important because when you buy local, you also help grow the community. When you spend money outside of the community and dry and grocery stores or big box stores, that money is gone forever. We're never going to see it again, but when you spend it locally, it goes back into the community, helps grow the community. And then you get to know your farmers too, which is really important. - By choosing to buy local, we invigorate our community economies and support local farmers. Ensuring that everything from honey to flowers, barbecue sauce to fresh produce, high quality products can reach residents who might otherwise lack access. - If you don't have a local place, like a market next to you, or if you have to spend all your dollars at these big corporations, I would say look to your local farmers, look to your local community, see what other resources that you have. Can you build you a garden in the backyard? These are things that us as Americans, all over the world, we need to really focus on keeping ourselves in a clean, sustainable environment, having organic products put down our body because your body is what fuels your life. You can't do anything without your health. - Local food production is very important to us because it is more financially sound and it's much easier to be able to afford to have the quality of food that is also financially something that a family can afford. - Attendees learn that eating food that doesn't travel too far is an easy way to get the freshest, most nutritious food possible while supporting New England farmers. - I would say getting on board on, you know, and eating local food has a great advantage supporting the farmers that are here locally, but also eating inherently a healthy food that doesn't have to travel miles and miles away. You know, so you get the food with a nutrition and as it's freshest as it can be. - Eating local means not only like fresher and higher quality, it also means that you're investing in your local communities, in your local farmers and those people in turn pay it back. Like we use peppers from other farmers who are growing in Massachusetts and Maine. We are using herbs that are grown in Massachusetts. So by buying our honeys, you're also investing in those farms as well and we're your neighbors. (upbeat music) - We're getting close to the first pitch here at Fenway Park, but no sign of only the great monster. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Ladies and gentlemen, it's Wall-A. (upbeat music) - Okay, we're back with more of Talk to the Neighborhoods I'm Joe High City host. In the second half tonight, well, we'll shift gears onto Beacon Hill. Of course, this past legislative session ended July 31st. Some very important pieces of legislation passed, but some very important pieces that did not make it across the finish line. And one of those tonight, my guests will be explaining as a bill that would have changed how insurers cover certain dental procedures for cancer survivors. And it's a bill that was put forward by MOPS, the Massachusetts Oncology Patient Survivors and Supporters Organization. And here tonight to join me to talk about it is himself a cancer survivor and the founder, one of the founders of MOPS, Tom Healy. Nice to have you here, Tom. - Thank you, Joe. - Also Dr. Mark Bovaris, an oncologist, a chair of Harvard Medical School, otolaryngology, head and neck surgery department. And guys, nice to have you here. - Thank you. - Nice to meet you. - Good to see you. - And Tom, nice to have you here as well. - Thank you. - All right, for our viewers who are not familiar with this, first of all, tell us what the bill would do. And I understand it's gonna be refiled in the next session, but tell us what the bill does. - So this will be a, we'll be back up on Beacon Hill again this January, but we've had previous bills to House Bill 1094. Even though this bill didn't move past the joint committee on healthcare and finance, we'll be prepared next session to file a new bill with my state rep, Paul McMurtry, as the petitioner, along with state Senator Michael Rush and others sponsoring the next bill. So, what we're trying to do is file a legislation so that head and neck cancer survivors can get the coverage like other cancers have received over the years. And it's basically the dental side of it to take it out of dental and have it covered under medical. So, we're working through the process on that as we speak. And we look forward to, you know, engaging more sponsors, more head and neck cancer survivors, more state reps and more state senators to get that done. - Yeah, we'll talk more about strategy in just a minute, but why is that important? Why hasn't it been covered? You understand our cancer survivor and why is the dental side of that so important? - Well, I think it comes down to one thing, quality of life issue. A lot of patients when they're diagnosed may be in their 30s, 40s, the prime of their life and the quality of their life is being drastically affected. So, if we make these changes for them, it's just gonna change their life that much better for them as they move forward. You know, we're working on the, looking at the numbers and we think it can get done. Especially with people like Dr. Vavirus helping us to get that done. - Well, and I'm gonna ask you, Dr. Vavirus, why is the dental aspect of that so important? How does that come into play for those who have cancer and head and neck? - Yeah, that's a really great question, Joe, and it's really at the crux of this whole matter. And that is, we're talking about patients that have cancer of the mouth. So the tongue, the gums, the floor of mouth, the tonsils, the throat. And in order to care for patients with that disease, our cancer's in those locations. Many times patients have to have surgery to remove the tumor, reconstruction, and then oftentimes have to have radiation therapy to follow, to see that the cancer doesn't come back. Radiation, in addition to the surgery, which alters the anatomy of the head and neck, radiation with or without chemotherapy really changes the way the salivary lands work. So patients after they've received head and neck radiation have something called zerostomia, dry mouth. Dry mouth leads to dental caries, which leads to dental disease. And many times patients after treatment for head and neck cancer need to get just simple dental extractions to be able to maintain a healthy lifestyle and good oral health. And oftentimes there's difficulty getting those cover, those extractions covered because of the insurance issues. Dental issues after head and neck cancer treatment are in an insurer's no man land, no man's land. Because typically the medical insurance won't cover it 'cause we'll say, well that's a dental problem, but it's a dental problem that's a direct result of treatment for a medical problem. So that's one big category is simple dental care. Another major area where our patients need help is in patients that have to have part of their upper jaw removed. One of the ways we rehabilitate those patients is to have a very custom-made, sophisticated denture placed that will replace half the roof of the mouth. Imagine what it's like to try to talk or eat with half of the roof of your mouth missing. With dental maxillofacial prosthetics, a arbitrator is what we call it. Prosthetic can be fashioned that can immediately rehabilitate the patient and back to the quality of life issues. Allows them to lead a much more normal life. These arbitrators, out of pocket, cost $50,000. We've had patients mortgage their houses in order to get the cash to cover the cost to one of these arbitrators 'cause they're just not covered by insurance. - What do the insurers say about this? You said it's a medical, it's an insurers no man land, but how could this kind of fall into the cracks? - Sorry, it's dental, not medical, we don't cover it. It's that simple. - Yeah, that's always been the argument, especially probably about 15 years ago when I filed a grievance or say the insurance company, but I had a hearing up on Peking Hill and I was just told, sorry, and that was it. And then I figured out, I asked myself a question, well, who regulates the insurance companies? And it came down to state reps, state senators getting the bill over to the governor's desk and have it signed to make these changes necessary for the head and their cancer survivors. - And so this, the bill that you had up there and spent a few times there to spend up there. - It is, it was at least straight. - Right, would require them to cover all of these kinds of procedures? The, and are they opposed to it? Why hasn't it, in your opinion, passed so far? It would seem like an obvious solution to a problem that's been identified. - Personally, I think it's gonna be our job to educate the state reps, the state senators as to what the problem is. I think they're not fully aware and understand what's going on. So that's what we plan on doing over the next few months up on Peking Hill and preparing for this next bill. So they can make this type of decision so move this forward or at least engage in conversation through the, through the state house so that we can sit down to see what can be negotiated. You know, maybe everything doesn't get covered but let's get something on the table to find out a conversation on where we have to go with this. - I understand that you also testified, Dr. Baras. - I did. - How were you received? How did the lawmakers react to your explanation which I thought was very succinct and... - Have you ever testified on the state house? They were very attentive and very kind and considerate and they listened very carefully but we didn't get the action that we needed. And I think, you know, this is really about escalating the awareness of a very large group of patients in this country in this state. - What are we talking about now? - So there's 60,000 patients plus a year in this country diagnosed with head and neck cancer. And what is unique about head and neck cancer is we've already kind of alluded to and that is it impacts the mouth, the throat which impacts our ability to communicate, our ability to eat. And this is, that's one of the things that this is all about. If you don't have teeth, you can't chew. You can't chew, you can't swallow. And having the, not having the ability to get full dental rehabilitation after surviving was a very difficult cancer from a treatment standpoint. Means that you don't have dinner with your family. You don't go out with friends. And we know one in importance. - You must start to isolate, yeah. - We know what a very important part of our lives are to communicate. We do meetings over meals. We have family gatherings over meals. A lot of our head and neck cancer patients sit in the back room at Thanksgiving because they just can't eat. It's just too embarrassing for them because either they have no teeth or they have a hole in the roof of their mouth that has not been able to have been rehabilitated. So raising the awareness I think is our first step. - Well, and of course everything. And when you talk about bills on Beacon Hill or the bottom line oftentimes is not what's right but what it will cost. And what any information on what something like this might cost the state or might cost the insurers. - Joe, if I may answer that, if you don't mind. Something we've never done in the past. Up on Beacon Hills, we're gonna request a cheer report which is a cost health analysis, information report out of Beacon Hill so that they can look at these numbers and see what it may, it won't be an exact number but we're a rough estimate on what it might cost the ratepayers, the insurance people might have to cover. But we did recently have a bill up in Maine that did pass. And I think that bill's under 50 cents, 50 cents for the quality of life. I want to throw out one more number for you. - 50 cents in what, I mean. - For the per month. - Per month. - Per month, so it's a few dollars a year, okay. Here in the state of Massachusetts, we have just about 1,200 patients a year that go into all the various oncology centers. So if we start with these and getting these problems solved now, these people are gonna have a better life and if you ask me, it's gonna save the insurance company's money over a long period of time. I'm not a financial expert but I think if they were somewhere where to crunch these numbers, we're gonna look at this as a win-win for everybody. - Well, and now, of course, back to Beacon Hill it's all very political up there and at the end of the day, who gets their bill passed or not? And sometimes it takes several years, sir. I give you your organization, you both and others in the organization, a lot of credit and don't give up because that's the lesson that I've learned and I'm sure you have as well that it sometimes will take several years to get through to somebody and it depends upon a little bit of luck and timing as well but certainly at the end of the day, it's politics is always part of the equation and have you built your organization up to the point where you can put some political pressure on state representatives because they may not say that that's a factor but believe me, it is. - I agree with you 100% and we're working on increasing that sponsorship up most importantly first on the state representative side where they'll make a determination on the bill and then shift it over to the Senate side of the House. So I think we're just under 10 sponsors up on Beacon Hill but like you just said, it's very important that we bring those numbers up because we need 50% of the 160, just over 50% of the 160 state representatives in our state in the Commonwealth. So we're gonna try real hard to get those numbers up to 40, 50 signatures in preparation of this next bill. - Well, and obviously you have this board of people like Dr. Babbarth and his colleagues that do this kind of work but what about dentists and dental insurers and I'm thinking about other interest groups that about the Massachusetts Medical Association Hospital Association, you have their support because while they should be listened to folks I have no doubt about that. They also, you know, hear from these other interest groups and they play a role. - So most definitely from the first day we started this, the first hospital that came on board, Dayna Faba and then Mass General. And as you see, I have a packet of endorsement letters here one from Dr. Mark for Virus but we might have close to 40 hospitals across the states endorsing what we're doing, supporting it and not one hospital across the state has said no to what we're doing. So it's, you know, I just got off the phone this week Children's Hospital, I think where by next week we'll have their letter of support. So we're gonna keep moving in this direction and keep, you know, building up our support team both at the medical level, political level and oncology survival level. - Dr. Vivar said, do you colleagues fully on board? They are aware of how important this is to well-- - Fully, yeah. - Yeah, we've had colleagues at MGH that I work with just recently write a major letter to one of our major journals discussing this very issue. It is becoming a front of mind issue across the country and you know we've concentrated on the quality of life but if the finances matter there is a financial win for the state because right now there's a job day is lost, right? Because people can't work. Because you know, nerves, exactly. And so this program would more than likely pay for itself. We're gonna do the financial analysis but getting people back to work, one, it's what we need to do because it's the right thing to do for people but it's also gonna have a benefit to the state. - And is there any organized opposition to your bill? What about the medical insurers or is there a way to bring them in on it as well? - Tom. - Well, we haven't actually heard anything from the insurance side on this yet. I'm expecting that we keep growing in every arena and I think it's just a matter of time before they pick up the phone and want to sit down and have that conversation. So I think that might happen this year. This next session up on Beacon Hill. - Because sometimes there's a quiet opposition, you don't see it coming but it's there. - And I think the financial analysis would be very helpful for that as well to try and figure out. And I guess my final question, we've got just a few minutes left, is how do you keep going? You haven't gotten frustrated? You haven't given up? Tom, I've known you for a while. I know how tenacious you are in your beliefs and I think part of it is over the years the people that I've met from the day I made a decision that someone has to do something. So it might have started with me but we have the people that are in our LOPS group and I have to mention the name of three individuals on our standing committee, Valerie Goldstein, Amy Gross and Kathy Happeney, who have gone through head and neck cancer different types 'cause Dr. Virus will tell you one of the key things too is even though you diagnosed with a former head and neck cancer two people can have the same cancer, yet the results for both can be totally different. One person can have something out of bare minimum, yet someone else treated the exact same thing, he's the expert so I'd like to get his answer to that question because, you know, and I see these people Joe, they're my new heroes in life, they really are and I'm just so proud of what we're doing. - Yeah, well, and you started this organization when, how long has it been going on? - Oh boy, probably close to 10 years ago but with this group we've been at it now for just under five years. By monthly meetings, excuse me, every other week, staring committee meetings, trying to figure out what we're doing next, what are we doing media, what are we doing politically and what are we gonna stay with it when we're not giving up? - Well, and of course Dr. Virus, your expert in medical care but when you got brought into this discussion as well, not just this discussion but up on the hill, you opened some eyes for you and your colleagues and what's necessary to, you know, I know it's one thing to treat a patient but you're talking about treating the whole person and what's involved in the costs and their lifestyle and quality of life, you said? - Right, so I've been treating head and neck cancer patients for 30 years and we really live with these patients. Because if we cure them of their cancer, they've got a lifetime of ongoing issues. Again, the majority of them are related to dental as a result of the prior therapy. So we've been hearing this for many, many years from our patients and I'm so grateful that I've been able to connect with Tom to help him and his mops group make something happen here. - Well guys, keep up the good work. Again, the organization's called MOPs, Mass Oncology, Patient, Survivors and Supporters and their bill that they're hoping to get passed on Beacon Hill. Coming up, probably the next session in starting in January would require medical insurers to cover certain dental procedures for cancer survivors, head and neck surgical procedures. And guys, thanks so much for coming in. - Thanks so much, Joe. - It's happy to have you here, Tom. - Joe, thank you very much. - Thank you so much. - Thank you for having you. You've been watching "Talk to the Neighbors" here in the Boston Neighbour Network. We're here tonight and every Thursday night at the same time will be back next week. Until then, for the entire staff and crew here at the Boston Neighbour Network, have a pleasant evening. Good night. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [MUSIC PLAYING]