What the Health Just Happened?
Deep Thoughts by Two Twelve | We Can Be Serious...Sometimes
[music] Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to this week's episode of What the Health Just Happened. When we talk about all things community, health care, business and life, is that the intro? - I think so. - I don't want it. - Is it new? - The good, the bad, the ups, the downs, the left, the rights, and everything in between. We bring in a variety of guests to talk about all those topics, so it's healthy versus not healthy in those topics. Health care, community, business, and life, we kind of fumble through that one. It's fine. Today, I'm excited for I got my business partners, the show's sponsors, two 12 benefits. We don't plug them enough. - What's that? - That's our company, right? - Two 12? - Two 12. Yeah, we do employ benefits. Today is going to be, I don't even know, is it going to be fun or not fun? - Are we talking about Gator football? - We're not talking about Gator football. - We're talking about Florida State. - We're not talking about Florida State. - So it should be fun. - What about the Jaguars? I don't want to talk about that either. There'll be a lot of community in health care today. There's a lot going on in our landscape. Joey's pride and expert, Adrian. - You're a expert. - Not in that one. - Maybe in this table. - Okay. - You're the smartest person in this table. We got Trey over there on an extra camera. He's going to chime in some questions. So, if you work in health care, especially employee benefits, health insurance, work for a large hospital system. We're not original, right? It's not just happening in Jacksonville or Gainesville. It's happening all across the country all the time. Insurance carriers negotiate with hospitals vice versa. Sometimes it gets bumpy, or say, take a chance. Yeah, sometimes it gets disruptive. Disruptive. Disruptive. Is that a throwback to disrupt HR? They say that a lot. That was this week. So, I'm going to try to paint a picture. Please chime in and add to this. Currently in Northeast Florida, the largest health care system is going through negotiations with the largest insurance carrier. That is correct. It's all over the news. There's two sides of the story. We're kind of in the middle of it here in different sides. Same thing's happening in Gainesville, right? Largest health care system is fighting with probably their largest carrier. That's right. Yeah, in Alachua County. It's impacting North in Duvall County, too. It's the sixth county area of Northeast Florida. It's UF Health. That's also impacting Jacksonville. So the UF Health, we can say it specifically, right? We're not going to take it. UF Health and Baptist, I think everybody knows that. UF Health is going through it with United. That's right. It's going through it with Florida Blue. It happened in Orlando a couple of years ago. It happened with Borland Grover in this market. It happens. Yeah, it happens. It's happening. I don't know the name of the hospital system or the insurance carrier, but I know it's happening down in Naples right now with one of their big hospitals and one of the insurance carriers. It's common for insurance carriers and hospital systems to go through negotiations, and it's not uncommon for them to go out of network for a period of time. It's just unique in this circumstance because with Florida Blue and Baptist, I think they went out of network once in the mid-90s for a short period of time, but it's a big deal. It's probably, I don't know if it's the two, but it's two of the biggest private employers in Jacksonville. Yeah, like earlier when you guys were talking about it, just playing the average Joe, I had asked you guys like, "Why is this a big deal?" And you guys had summed it up with roughly 50,000 people, and then Jacksonville area would be affected by this. Let me just back up a little bit. We're going like broad strokes here, right? You guys can jump in the weeds. So their contract with each other ends at the end of this month, September. Gotcha. As of October 1st, Florida Blue will not be in network with Baptist. Gotcha. So anyone who has that magical Florida blue card in their wallet, if they want to go see someone at Baptist, they're not in network. What does that mean? You're asking me? Yeah. I do actually know the answer to this question. I mean, it's not going to bar them from going to any Baptist facility whatsoever. It just drastically increases the price point for them to be considered out of network. It changes the rate of pay. It changes probably how that experience is going to feel from a financial perspective. So you're not going to have Florida blue and go to an emergency room and get denied care because that's not something that's part of this negotiation, which we can get into all the details of how they think this is all going to pan out. But it will be significantly more expensive to receive the exact same care that they're receiving now. There is a provision called continuity of care that will be in place for Florida blue members. There's some stipulations to it. Example. So if you are currently pregnant and seeing a Baptist physician, that's continued. That's considered continuity of care. So you can continue through that pregnancy for, I think it's three months on the three and six months. I don't know if it's three months for the blue care HMO plan and six months for the blue options PPO plan. I don't have it in front of me. It's one or the other, but there is some continuity of care provisions to at least cover that through the next three to six months. I'm going to rewind because I'm, again, broad strokes here that I'm just thinking of an average listener. If you have that Florida blue card near wallet and you need emergency care, go seek emergency care. You can't get declined for emergency care. That's the biggest thing. Don't not seek emergent care. I'll get on my high horse of what's an emergency, what's not an emergency because that's a disaster. It's not an emergency as Mr. entrepreneurs. You don't want to open that can. The other thing, so what happens for the average consumer, like you said, that's who's probably going to get affected the most. Sure. But essentially you're going to pay money because it's an out of network visit versus an in network visit. These are completely hypothetical numbers. So let's say traditionally it's $25 to see your primary care physician when you're in network. If you want to continue to see that doctor and you have that magic plastic card that gathers dust in most people wallets, that visit may increase to $75, $100, $150 out of pocket course. Right. Yeah. Correct. So at the end of the day, who is currently out here? Who's getting kneecapped? Yes. It's actually getting kneecapped. I appreciate that you were trying to find a way to put that delicately and not use whatever euphemism was popping into your brain about who's actually getting the short end of the stick. That's right. You should say. Yeah. You got to tread lightly here, right? Because again, I think it's worth acknowledging there's a lot of communication going out from Baptists in U.F. to their patients and then you have the other side of the communication coming from these insurance carriers that are really too far spectrums of the... I mean, yeah, they each have their opinions and we're not here to share opinions. We're just... If you think back aside from the hospital insurance carrier negotiations, when we first started this radio show, what was the idea behind this? It's a podcast. What was it called? A podcast? It's a radio show. It was to engage the community, talk about what's happening in Jacksonville, and this is it. This is why we started this is to openly talk about stuff when it happens and to share it with the community. The reality is, if you have Florida Blue today, just prepare yourself, talk to your doctor, talk to your employer, talk to your HR managers. If you have individual coverage, talk to your providers and make a plan moving forward with that physician to either continue care there. In some agreed upon way, or unfortunately, you have to seek other care either through a different insurance carrier that has that provider in network, or just another doctor in general that's in network, or another hospital system. We're fortunate that there's lots of other hospital systems in Northeast Florida. It's not just the one that we're talking about. There's St. Vincent's Ascension, there's Memorial HCA hospitals, there's UF Health, there's Mayo Clinic. There's other hospitals to choose from. It just happens to be this one in particular is large. I think there's six hospitals. What about the Gainesville market? There's only one hospital system. Yeah, so that's different on the other side. There's only two hospital systems in Gainesville. It's UF Health, which is the largest one. It's attached to the- It's still Shands, by the way. You have to always be Shands. That's a good point. It's attached to the University of Florida who has a really good football team this year. Yeah. Heart noise is down. And then the other hospital system is HCA. I didn't realize they had one in Gainesville. It's North Florida regional, but it's owned by HCA. Oh yeah, it's over by the mom. Yup, across the street from the old school. So if your advice would be to kind of stay put, you know, we're all right. What is your gut feeling on how long this will take to get resolved? I mean, I hope, I hope that there's enough over the next ten days, enough public pressure that they come to an agreement in the next ten days. The likelihood of that? Like, if you're asking me, is it going to happen? Probably not. It's probably going to go beyond October 1st for at least a couple days. So oftentimes towards the finish line, they're meeting behind, you know, behind closed doors. Like, we got to figure this out. This is strictly my opinion. I am concerned that this will be the first time I see it not happen before the deadline. Interesting. But that's why... It's the case right now with UF Health and UHC. What's today's day, the 20th? So it's been 20 days. I mean, it feels like it's been 20 years for me. Why I think these conversations matter, though, and again, if it's one person or 100 people, however many people hear this, it's talking about it openly to express here frustrations and go to Florida Blue and Baptist. But I'm concerned it will go past it. Yeah. Get your together, guys. And... Okay, we were talking about this earlier, but the reason these things happen boils down to one thing and one thing only. Is that correct, the bunny? It's reimbursement, it's hospitals charge X and they want to get charge, or they get... they charge insurance carriers X and they want to get X plus whatever percentage as an increase. That's what it boils down to. Hospitals want to charge more than it's possible. That's a fancy way to say yes. It's about... It is about money. I mean, that's just the reality of it and what each side considers to be fair, right? So... What their butt heads about, right? One side says like, "This is what it's worth." The other side says, "No, it's not worth that." And again, I mean, I should be talking. I should be honest. The consumer. Is there a scenario where a consumer can actually push back and punish these two groups? I mean... I mean, in the same way that you do in a capitalist society, right? Like, you kind of influence things with where you choose to spend your money. I think just in this particular scenario, you know, I was talking with a friend the other day who texted me and was asking me questions about their pediatrician. Their pediatrician's office is owned by Baptist Health. They have Florida Blue as insurance through her husband's employer. Her kids are teenagers and, you know, they've seen that pediatrician. Their entire lives. They started going there when the kiddos were babies. And so when you think about it, like, yes, there is something that we can do, right? Like we can have a... We can make that financial choice not to go to Baptist and to not give them our money. Or we can make that choice to not partner with Florida Blue and not give them our money and the premiums each month. But it's not just as easy of a choice as saying, "I'm not going to go to X department store and spend my money because I disagree with it." We've been talking about relationships that have formed over decades through these care providers who know everything about your family. They know everything about your medical history. And so can you? Yes. But are you likely to? I really... I don't know. Yeah. To add on to that's a great example. Your question, you... Let's use Baptist, for example. What will hurt them is if a large amount of patients leave their health care system to go to competitor. Sure. That's going to hurt their pocketbooks. What will hurt Florida Blue is if a large percentage of individuals and companies say, "We're leaving Florida Blue because we're attached to this hospital system." Gotcha. It oftentimes... But it's not that easy. Yeah. In the past, when this has happened, I think you alluded to it, they come to an agreement at the 11th hour eventually. Like they will come to an agreement eventually. It's just when is that going to happen and how much disruption is it going to cause? I remember last year about this time, an insurance carrier in Orlando Health was going through this similar thing and their deadline was October 1st and they came to an agreement on September 30th at midnight, which is usually how it happens. But there's a hospital system in Sarasota Memorial Hospital has been at a network with Cygna for probably three years and I don't know anything about why it happened and why they're continuing to be at a network. But I do know for our clients that have Sarasota employees or their Southwest Florida-based, Cygna is usually not an option because of that. Are there any good scenarios that come out of a situation like this? No. I don't know. I don't see any positive. I don't remember. I think other than let's look at two to a benefit specifically, so we're in the middle of it and we work with small to medium sized businesses to help them make wise employee benefit decisions and it's tough right now to answer some of these questions. We have obviously we're Jacksonville based and we have lots of clients that we work with in Jacksonville. We also have a big group of customers that we work with in Gainesville. So we're getting hit on both sides and you can only tell people to be patient for so long because I'll give you an example. So let's say ABC company comes and says, you know what, this is going to cause so much disruption. We need to change. This change tomorrow, it takes at least 45 days to do it without complete disruption. Could you do it in 10 days maybe, but it'd be very challenging. So then you're looking at November 1st is the earliest you can do it. There's a lot of things that can happen. Maybe they come to an agreement 10 days into the month, but you've already started moving down the path to change carriers and move things in place to cancel your current coverage and then you can't go back. So it's, which one do you want to do? You want to add to that? That's a, that's a great example. So specific company X, 50 employees, they currently have Florida blue. Most of their employees and their family seek care through Baptist facilities that they're and they have to choose, let's say November 1s, they're open enrollment date like do we stick with Florida blue or do we switch carriers? And then if they switch carriers and in between that time, they come to an agreement. It's too late. Then you got to wait. Do carriers thrive on these kinds of situations to, no, no, nobody wants, nobody wants nobody wants to go through this. Fair enough. The flip side. I got an email yesterday from a, it was just like an update. I was telling the injury in this morning and it said the title of the email without clicking on the article just said, "Atna, HSA hospital negotiations." And I'm like, "Goodness gracious, you got to be kidding me." So I, I click on it and it said, "We were pleased to announce we would come to an agreement." And I was like, "Oh, thank goodness." And we happened to know some people HCA so I sent him the article and I said, "Thank goodness, you guys came to an agreement." And so that would be crazy to think you got three different insurance carriers, three different hospital systems all going through the same thing. But to your point earlier, this is not, this happens all over the United States. Gotcha. It's, it's not specific to us, it just, it's the first time it's happened. I've been in the industry for 15 years, it's the first time I've experienced something like this. You mentioned Bornling Grover, they went out of network. I don't remember how, it was a long time. I don't remember how long it was because I was, I was very new into the industry. And like, trust, I didn't know what I was doing. I didn't know it, I didn't know the answers to your questions back then. I didn't really pay that much attention to it. Mm-hmm. Can I ask a mom question? Sure. This is how I look at it too. What's the largest pediatric hospital system in Jacksonville? Trade never goes the highest. I don't know. I'm not saying that. That's a good, that's, that will be unaffected. That will be unaffected. So no matter what, this is worth acknowledging, right, before we get to that. So if you live in Northeast Florida and your mom, again, I'm not, I love UF Health for a variety of reasons, but most parents in Northeast Florida have a choice between Wolfson's and UF Health. That's just the reality. I think that might change soon. What are mom, where mom's going to pick? Most moms. I mean, just, yeah, ease of access is going to be, is going to be Wolfson's. I mean, you just said UF Health, I don't even know where a UF Health facility is that specializes in pediatrics and downtown, north of the stadium. Yeah. And I know that Wolfson opened that standalone ER facility that was geared specifically for pediatrics. So that just comes to my mind. I mean, good marketing. I drive by there all the time and I have taken one of our daughters to an emergency room that was not a pediatric emergency room and it was not a great experience. It's not to say that they can't do anything or that they're not going to try their very best. But as a mom, if I need an emergency facility, you know, I know that, that Wolfson's is going to have something, you know, to support us. To Joey's point to those, what we're hearing, our understanding is that, that, that should not be effective. They will not. Yeah. My understanding is just as a kid, the kids, the kids will be all right. Yeah. No, no, that's unaffected in this. I had a couple of different conversations with some people that, is it old people that are going to be affected the most? Sorry, old. Yes. I would say, I would say, yeah, because, yes, yeah, we'll also define old because like it's a bit different with Medicare because I guess they're accepted in different ways. I, we, that discussion that we, we're having, yeah, it actually may not impact the Medicare population. Oh, so it's more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, with lots of extra time to research new facilities, with lots of extra time to research new doctors, and, you know, you asked that question about pediatric care from a perspective of like going to an emergency room. So obviously that's not being impacted from our understanding. However, I mean, doctors, offices, pediatricians, offices that are owned by the Baptist system, I don't, I don't know how that is being affected or how that will be handled or managed. I don't know if that falls in the same bucket as Wilson's does. I don't really know. We should just chop up these questions and send it to people that doesn't know. But this, no, this is a good, another good example. We, we work in this space. We live in the space. We service clients in this space and it's still so complicated and unknown sometimes. Yeah. It's frustrating. It's frustrating. What's not frustrating? You asked a question earlier. What's the emergency versus not an emergency, and I'm going to give you some examples. I did. Yeah. So for pediatrics, if you stub your toe, yeah, that's not an emergency. No. Well, unless it's your first baby, and it's bleeding, it might be an emergency. It might be an emergency. Still not an emergency. If you lose a toe, that is an emergency. If you get. Not if it's the pinky, probably. Just put it on ice. If you get stung by a B, there used to be billboards in Tampa. I love these. Stung by a B, not an emergency. Anaphylactic shock for a bee sting. That's an emergency. Yeah. Oh, that can be a new subset of healthy, not healthy emergency. Or not emergency. Not emergency. I like that actually. I do like that. Yeah. E-R, no E-R. Yeah. E-R, no E-R. I'm leaning towards no E-R always. By the way, the second you walk in that emergency room, just to understand your medical bill is going to be a lot. 500? The second you walk in the door, the second you walk in the door, it's $500. And you better hope you don't get admitted because then it gets real complicated. Man. So we just started, I love itemized bills. You can look at what, what things charge for procedures. That would get us in trouble. Yeah. All right. We got two and a half minutes here. Any shout outs? Maggie and Ellie. What's up? Hi, girls. Hi, Mrs. Ross. Hi, mom. Oh, yeah. Number one fan. Shout out. We also have a whole first segment without saying hi. I've been slack and give my mom a shout out. I feel bad. Yeah. We should give your mom a shout out for coming to support you this week at your little speaking engagement. It was so cute. She made you look tall. She did make me look tall. Thank you, Katie, for making me look tall in a picture for the first time ever. I appreciate that. I was like, oh, maybe I am kind of -- Disrupt HR was pretty cool. That's a cool event. Yeah. It was very cool. Yeah. I haven't had a chance to do that before. It was really interesting. I thought it would be odd, the format of just like these very rapid, quick hits. But I regretfully do you think that's where all of our attention spans are going. I mean, seven minutes was like perfect. I'm going -- I think that format is like you cap people at ten minutes. That five minute one, you got to get your point in and get off stage. Yeah. You only had five minutes. You have five minutes to speak. They did a great job. Oh, it failed miserably at that. Yes, you would. You are not a fine. You just speak at Disrupt HR. [laughter] I was just -- My name is Joey Jansen. I'm out. See you later. When I went to South Florida in high school. Let's talk about health care for five minutes. Yeah. It was interesting. It was fun, though. I think that's probably good for the first half. What do you think? Yeah. Yeah, that's good. Feels right. Let's talk about politics next. Yes. Psych. That's what the health just happened. Yup. We'll come back to the second half of what the health just happened. If you're catching us here on the radio and you miss the first half, good news is it's available on your favorite podcast platform under what the health just happened. If you're catching this on the podcast, there is no commercial. Yeah, you know what we talked about the first half. So business partners, close friends, some cool people, Adrian and Joey Jansen with two total benefits who also sponsors the show. First half we talked about this really exciting, fun, joyful time, joyful time where a large hospital system is in negotiations with a large insurance carrier and multiple markets. It's a lot of fun. So anyways, we'll touch on that a little bit more. I think it'd be fun to talk about 212, what it is that we do for any listeners that catch this and really kind of putting a light on what brokers do and maybe don't do. But before that, we're going to do a little game called healthy or not healthy, which is my favorite. We might even play ER versus not ER. I think we should do it do with healthy or not healthy Florida Gators coaching staff. The unhealthiest of unhealthy tray, healthy or not healthy Florida States coaching staff. Is that an elephant? Yeah, it was just awful. We're in a rough place. Health, you're not healthy, the overall sports landscape for Florida right now. Um, I say unhealthy. If only the last season is coming soon, that's not my imagine you're looking good loss one too. Um, healthier. The bucks are good. Aren't they? Yeah, dude, it's lucky. I don't want to. We need to lift it up. Florida State played tomorrow. I thought this was supposed to be like a happy second hour. Second half. I'm in the dumps right now. I know. I'm like it's a little bit like Scott Smith says. As Matt, you would say won't bomb a toxic optimist. I love that term that Scott Smith uses. But right now I'm shot out Scott, shout out health. You're not healthy. Hurricane prep preparation for hurricane, it's, it's healthy to do. I have not done it for this unhealthy to go and buy out water for a tropical depression that hasn't come out. Yeah. Stocking up on beers. Oh, so healthy. Yeah. Do you remember, remember the great beer stock of 2005? Yeah. It was after Katrina they diverted everything. Yeah. Yeah. You get a 24 pack for what? Five bucks. We had, we're not healthy. We were in college. We had pallets. My friends had pallets of beer, Miller Lite, but any of it pallets of beer in their garage. We should mention that was a lifetime ago, pre-kids. 19 years ago. Yes. When we were irresponsible people. And we played those games where you have to put the beer case like on your head and wear it like a hat. What's that called? I don't know. I'm not sure. I'm just sure. I'm like, aren't you the boss? He's over there. I'm putting beer cane boxes on her head. Okay. Let's go. We're going to pivot here. E.R. and no E.R. Okay. E.R. or no E.R. splinter in your foot. No E.R. I would say no. E.R. and no E.R. Broken foot. Mmm. Foot. Not toe. Foot. Like your middle of your foot, whatever that part is. It's like a part of your foot. How about your... Ellie calls them foot knuckles, which I feel like is the most disturbing phrase I've ever heard somebody call Sarah Haggle. It's not as bad as Moose Knuckles. She called... Oh. Oh. I'm going to do the E.R. For real. I'll have to edit that one out. No, we're not. No, it is. I would not go to... I would go to the E.R. for a broken foot, not a... or ankle, but not a toe. Okay. Okay. E.R. and no E.R. Chiptooth. Ugh. Dentist. Mmm. Well, I'm going to follow up with E.R. and no E.R. and no E.R. knocked your two front teeth out. Oh, God. I don't know. I don't like that feeling. I hate this thing. This game's not working out. E.R. and no E.R. is... You're just going to prepare more. If I knocked out my two front teeth, I would go to the emergency room. This doesn't flow as well. Either healthy or not healthy is better. E.R. and no E.R. Healthy or not healthy Ryan Holiday book sets. I love Ryan. Look, if you don't read or listen to Ryan Holiday's stuff, he's my favorite right now. He's always been your favorite. It's been a while. I think he stole my book set. I probably did. Yeah. And then you gave away two of the copies from that book set. Oh, no. He gave away somebody else's book. I honestly got it in my favorite book. E.G.O. is the enemy. Stillness is the key. Obstacle is the way discipline is destiny. They're all gold. Absolute gold. He also has like a daily stoic email that's one of the few. I have like 10 email subscriptions. That's the only one that I read sometimes. Do you get Seth Godin's? Nope. Do you have Seth Godin's? I did. I did. I'm reading one of his books right now. Healthy or not healthy email newsletters. If they're coming from 212 benefits. That's right. Definitely healthy. We do send an email newsletter. Speaking of 212 benefits. So we work with small to medium sized businesses, right? What's that size mean? What's small to medium? Anywhere from 10 all the way up to 500 employees, but really if you're willing it down, 10 to 200? Yeah. You answer that when you say. I would say that's our sweet spot. That would be my same answer. I mean, I would be a bit broader and say like maybe 500 to 500 because I just like the way that that sounds. There's no real. Easier to say. Rhymer reason. And I mean, it doesn't mean that we can't work with clients who are larger. Because there are a lot of factors that I think go into what makes someone a good partner with us. But generally speaking, that's the size of company that we tend to have really built our services around and our geared towards helping them. I like saying this too. So like how we're compensated kind of matters. Yeah. If a business or organization has less than five employees, there's no compensation. Which is. They're still paying their premium and it's still going to the insurance carrier. But the way that we generally get paid is a percentage of that premium and if they're a smaller group then. There are very few places left that work with companies less than 10 employees. Like I said, I like saying five to 500. I think our sweet spot, like my personal opinion is when an organization's getting real close to 50 and they're starting to grow and we can help grow with them. That's a big one for me. I like to grow with companies. You like to grow with companies? Yeah. It's fun. Yeah. It's a neat journey. And there's a lot of stuff that's happening there right too because the person that's over HR and is kind of managing that has probably one million other things on their plate and it's not really until they start, you know, get past a certain size that they really would become hyper specialized in benefits management. Some of my favorite companies that we work with are ones. There's one that comes to mind and you'll probably guess it as I tell the story. We started working with them when they had seven employees, I think four of them were family members and now they've got, I don't know, 55, 60 employees and multiple divisions of the company and they've had great success but it's been cool to watch that growth. That's what I love about the industry is at the end of the day we're insurance agents, brokers, whatever you call it. We represent companies on behalf of the insurance carriers to put together an employee benefits package for their staff but we get to learn so much about every single, really industry because we're not industry specific unlike the other side of insurance can be very, like commercial insurance can be very industry specific. You know, if you're a medical office or a construction company, if you're a good partner of ours, the benefits are the benefits. Yeah. Like what the benefits are might differ but at the end of the day we're just helping support that in that company so you get to learn about industries and this is why I would not be able to disrupt HR because it took me five minutes to say that. I am curious. Can I ask a question? Of course. This is just a totally random. You're not allowed to ask questions on this show only I am. Well, it gave me a mic too so I think I'm allowed to ask a question. It's totally random but I would be curious about what each of your responses are. It's been like the most interesting industry or job that you did not even know was a thing until we started partnering with them as their benefits broker that you were just like, "What?" So we work with so many companies sometimes, you meet them and you're like, "I didn't even know this was an organization." Two of them. Oh, I have a perfect one. They're aquatic. I was a long way. Yeah. That's a good example. That's a great example. We should give them a plug though. What do they do? They build the world. What some of the most fascinating water parks in the world? They do swim or cruise ships. Cruise ships. And the blue ones that he has are boomer basins, so they're building the massive basins we'll call them pools. They don't like when I say that. But these are huge... Yeah. I'm going to tell them that you said pools. We're going to send them. Healthy or not healthy. Basins are called pools. What were the two you were going to say? The tobacco company. Chinook Enterprises. Chinook Enterprises. Chinook Enterprises. So, you got the story. You were there with Adna. And then, goodness gracious, the one that is up on the north part of town. Oh, goodness gracious. They work with... You definitely are. J.A. Are you interested? No. Are you talking about arms? Arms, yes. That's right. So, these two were my two. They were you two. They were you two. Oh, man. Rude. Absolutely disrespectful. I'll let you. So... Clearly, I can't tell the story. We'll take too long. Chinook Enterprises. Super interesting. So, they apply and affix. They have a license to apply and affix a tax stamp to certain tobacco products for certain zip codes in the state of Florida. So, they do not produce the tobacco product, but all of the tobacco products that their, I guess, fall under their purview, get shipped to their facility. They roll it through this conveyor belt. It gets the stamp. It gets packaged back up and sent out to 7-Elevens, Quick Marts, all that kind of stuff. But that is the... That's what they do. I mean, that's what they do. That's wild. That stamp. Isn't that crazy? Like, that's a job. The other one... I mean, I don't mean that too. You created that. You created that. Yeah. You created that. That's fascinating to me. It's just like these things that are around you all the time that just exist, that you don't really often take the thought and energy. How did this come to be? The other one, Arms, they repair a hyper-specialized part of a wind turbine, and they partner with JEA. It's some type of piece of a, I'm butchering this, what exactly it is that they do because I'm not mechanically inclined. But it's part of like the larger energy grids, and there are only like three companies in the whole world that know how to repair that specific part. And so their teams travel all over the globe. They'll be gone for six to eight weeks to repair some like hyper-specialized piece of this turbine or this fan, and I think turbine sounds cooler, but, you know. Here's kind of a point I'm here to, there is a niche in an industry for anything anyone's thinking of, right? If you have an idea, you can create a business out of it. Go make a business. Yeah. And then let us do your benefits. I was going to say that in 2012 to that point on, of course, call 2012 benefits, duh. But that's the industry we're working at. It does not matter your company. If you want to offer employee benefits, most specifically the big three, right? Health, dental, vision, a large gamut of other things, like I don't see our industry ever going away. But some really, really cool companies, and this is, yeah, this show specifically, like I like giving shout outs like Chang Robotics. We don't, we don't work with them, but just hearing about their business and what they do. I'm like, this is crazy. The Leon Hailey brain wellness program. Is it Maca Fuse? Maca Fuse. Maca Fuse. Call us when you're, call us when you're ready to partner. Oh, man. I love it. But we just get, we get exposed to these really cool organizations. Some are, you know, difficult to work with, some are great to work with. That's my next question is like, what's a, what's a good organization to work with and why? Mm hmm. Oh, you're both looking at me. Yeah. Answer this. I want the opposite side of that. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. A good organization to work with. I mean, I think we kind of touched on this point earlier. So those organizations that are really kind of gearing up for growth, whether, whether they know it or not, right? And they're kind of trying to figure out how things are going to work. They're trying to figure out who they're going to be and what their potential future will look like. And they're all kind of trying to figure out what each of their roles look like specifically anyone who's going to be touching their, their benefits program. I think that it's, that's the type of company that we like partnering with because I feel like we bring great value to say, you know, this is kind of what the program should look like. Here's how you can lean on us. Now go do the other 25 things that you need to take care of because a good broker partner can kind of step in and fill the gap here for you so that you don't have to be in charge and so many different things. I also think that maybe companies that are a bit like us and don't take themselves too seriously. You're keeping me. I'm the most serious person at this table. So is a hair. At this table. The age rate might be. Yeah. I think it's a, you know, if you want to be our client of ours, you have to be okay with getting invited to events like Bibs and Ribs on by the way. If anybody listening to this would like more information on Bibs and Ribs, that's right. We got to send that out. Bibs and Ribs. You put this on the radio. You're going to have a lot of people show up. Well, yeah. You got to reach out and bring your own ribs. So same question for you. What's good? We got the bibs. Like, who do you enjoy working with? What's a good client? We can say what an ideal client is and the criteria. Yeah. A lot of the things that Adrian said, but one where we can develop a relationship with the key decision makers at the organization. So that's the owner, the finance person, the HR person, not just one of them, all three of them, ideally. And then partnering with an organization that sees the value that we bring to educate employees on how to navigate their healthcare, that openly invite us in to do so, not just at open enrollment, but throughout the year, where we can sit in a conference room like this and just hang out and work and their staff gets to know us. So then when three months down the road, two years down the road, when I walk in the door, I'm like, oh, what's up, Trey? How are you? How are the kids? You get to know them. You develop a relationship with them because it's all about knowing the person that you're working with and just being able to help them that way. Yeah, that's the perfect customer to me. There's two things you said there too that I love. The goal, I think for most consultants or brokers, especially us here at 212, is to be, again, a partner and extension of their business so that when they have these complicated questions, they don't go to the HR person, they don't go to the CEO, they come straight to us with those complicated questions that we can help. And they're comfortable doing that. Correct. Thanks. Bingo. Bingo. So, again, this is the most 212 plugs we've ever had. If you're a business and want to evaluate your employee benefits, again, jokes aside. No jokes. Call us. Yeah. Seriously. The same thing, we'll go back to this negotiation. We're getting, we're fielding a lot of questions, I think it's not frustrating, but it's tough. We can't really. We don't have the answers. Yeah. Because we don't know. And ultimately, we can't, I can't tell business A, what to do. I can share with you the information. I can tell you what's happening. I can tell you how to prepare. I can give you all the information to make a decision and we'll help navigate that decision with you, but I can't make the decision for you. And I don't know what's going to happen. Because if it was up to me, we'd decrease rain investments and health care costs would go down for everybody. How nice would that be if when you're like, "Hey, your costs went down." Yeah, we negotiated a lot of rate. It was amazing. We'll have another event. Well, there was one industry when you had Keon. Was it roofers? Or comp. Yeah. Or comps. Yeah. He's got the easiest job. The rates have been going down since 2005. Workers comp. I'm just kidding. It's not easy. Jeez. What about a terrible client? A terrible client, but a challenging client, industry-wise, is specifically any industry that has high turnover is really hard to manage, especially for a company that's got 50-ish employees. So, think restaurants, think car dealerships, those are two that come to mind. It's really difficult to manage the insurance industry calls it a churn rate. I think that might be a normal term for turnover. That's every industry calls it a churn rate, but that's fine. When you have high turnover, if you start the year with 50 people in the plan and you turn everybody over and all of a sudden you got 20, it's a completely different subset of people. If you don't have a plan in place to enroll the new hires as they come on, that could be detrimental to the long-term cost of the health plan. I've got thoughts too. You want to chime in on that? Well, I was just going to add on to what Joey was saying. It's a challenge for a traditional benefits program. Groups of that nature might be more advantageous for them to have telehealth options available to them, things that are a bit out of the box, I guess, but yes, from a traditional standpoint, I would think that that's difficult, especially because of the point that you were making earlier, it's difficult to get to know people when there is that much change. Even outside of just adding them to the plan and taking them off the plan and that sort of thing, you don't get an opportunity to build those relationships. Insurance is not anyone's favorite topic really. When you are frustrated and upset about something, you want to talk to someone about it that you know and that you trust. If you don't have that relationship, it just feels frustrating the whole time and everyone just feels angry all the time because it is frustrating. What's the most consistent industry you guys work with? Hold that question because I did want to chime in on, I like that. That's a great question. But to the, we talk about ideal clients, groups to work with and not, to me, insurance is not exciting, it's not, it's honestly, it's a nightmare, it's expensive, but I think for groups to understand like, we're on your side. We are an advocate for you and you alone, right? The conversations we have, the discussions we have, the decisions we try to help you make are ideally for your best interest. So if a company only does want to talk once a year, twice a year and come in and be frustrated with the increases in cost, like you think we're celebrating these rises in cost, it's, that's the most frustrating part of the industry for me. So companies that aren't bought in or engaged in our partnership and relationship, we're probably not the right agency to work with. I would agree with that. So the, the industry we work in the most often, the most consistent. We did a report on this during COVID and back then, there was not one industry that made up more than 9% of our entire block of business. It's, they're, I, I can't even think of one. There is no healthcare IT call or like it's, it is, we probably have a handful and all, like we actually work with a lot of call it in the construction industry, whether it's pure general contractors or subcontractors. We have a good chunk there, but it's not, it's not 50% it's those contractors that they find you guys. Typically you find that there's my phone just rang and that is not, that is not somebody calling me and say, Hey, I want you to do my benefits. It's, we're, we're finding them in various ways. Um, yeah, we, we obviously market research, looked for companies to work with, the best or introductions from clients who work with like, Hey, you really should talk to this group because I call sometimes I call businesses three times a day, five days a week. Same one. Do you guys have a golf course yet as a client? We do. We do. We do. We do. We almost got a couple of other ones. But apparently if you're on the board for one golf course, they won't let you work with them. Um, anything you want to add for, we got about three minutes left here, four minutes. Anything to add on this negotiation? No, just, I think for anybody that hears this, just, um, pay attention, ask questions. If you work for a large organization, small organization, just ask them for updates, um, pay attention to the news because it will be on the news. Uh, I don't, it has not been on lately. There is a website dedicated to it for, for both carriers. Um, I don't remember the one for Florida blue, but if you Google for to blue Baptist negotiations, it will pop up. Frequently asked questions. Frequently asked questions. Uh, UHC is, uh, UHC.com backslash UF health. Um, I've been to that one a lot. That's why I know it. Do you guys know the comms directors for both of these companies? I'm only asking because are they getting blown up right now because of this? Oh, they're. Yeah. If you call Florida blue, there's an automated message that addresses it. Yeah. We're back. We're backlog on somebody else. Yeah. We can't answer anything else. You know, the hardest thing is to know what's here, it's like, is to be patient. Yeah. Be patient. Don't make any rash decisions and ask questions is the biggest one. Yeah. Ask questions so that if you do need to make a decision or you need to seek care, um, that you have all the details that you feel like you can make an educated decision or an educated best guess. If you do have your insurance plan through an employer, you know, go directly to them, get them to discuss, you know, information with your, your brokers because, um, could also call us and we'll call your employer for you and say, Hey, again, this is an opportunity. Reach out to us. Honestly. We're helping to help and pointing the right to that website. I do know. It's two 12 benefits.com. It's, uh, all spelled out, not two one two, two 12. Yes. Adrian, Joey Janssen, my, my friends, my, I would say like brother and sister from another mother and mister, love you guys, good times. Call two 12 benefits. That's what the help just happened. [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible]