When the Narcissist Texts You: The Anxiety and Chaos Inside – Episode 310 of the Divorce University Online Podcast. We all know that feeling, when you see your narcissist’s name pop up on your phone or when you get a message notice and you are immediately triggered. Your emotional world starts spinning out of control and you haven’t even opened the message! The familiar patterns kick in and you’re sucked back into the emotional vortex. If this sounds familiar, this episode will help you break free! To learn more about how I can support you in achieving success in your custody matter, please schedule a free strategy session at www.divorceuniversityonline.com/vip-coaching. Thanks for listening!
Divorce University Online
When the Narcissist Texts You: The Anxiety and Chaos Inside
>> Hello, you are listening to the Divorce University online podcast with your host, Tammy Ferreira. >> Hey, guys, Tammy here. And in this episode, we are going to talk about when the narcissist texts you, okay, or messages you or emails you or whatever method of communication you're using. And the anxiety and the chaos, it's just immediately sort of bubbles up in you. And I think that we can all relate to that feeling of what it's like to just have their name pop up or have something pop up and it just immediately, the feelings just go all over the place, right? I think that's true for pretty much every client that I've ever spoken to. They all say, yeah, yeah, yeah. So this seems to be very common theme when you're dealing with a narcissistic person, okay? So before we dive into this week's episode, if you are listening to the podcast, please don't forget to rate and review me and also subscribe so that you get notified as new episodes are released each week. If you are watching me on YouTube, please also, if you like the content, hit like on the video and also subscribe to the channel so that you get notified as new videos are released. Now, if you're listening to the podcast or watching YouTube and you're not on the other platform, go check it out because it's a little bit different, content's a little bit different on the podcast, you get the full episode on YouTube, you get kind of little mini version of the episode, but you get other content on YouTube that you don't get on the podcast. So yeah, check them, check them both out. So when we are dealing with a narcissistic person and they text us, what happens is you are triggered from all of the trauma that you've been through with this person. And when you've been in a really long relationship with a narcissist, for instance, for me, my first marriage was 17 years, that was the person that I think was a narcissist, he was never diagnosed. But I was in that relationship, I was in the marriage 17 years, and then we were in the relationship about a year prior to that. So 18 years total, I had known him for about six years when we started dating five or six years. So, you know, 24 years, essentially, of kind of being conditioned in this relationship. And so it's no wonder that then you have this response that's sort of in your cell memory, right? It's almost like in your DNA, it's a visceral response that a lot of times we can't control. And so if you're a person that tends to automatically go into your feelings, which I think that more women lean that way, not all women, not my husband was that way too. I think he was a very feeling person, and he would automatically go into his feelings in many situations. I think that his legal training trained him to go analytical in certain things. But in relationship things, a lot of times he leaned emotional and I'm kind of funny, I'm kind of the opposite, I'm not the typical girl, I kind of lean more logical. And I won't cry, but I might stand and argue with you. I always say, if I'm crying, you better run because I'm really, really ticked off into the breaking point. If I am crying in front of you, I don't really do that with people. But nonetheless, whatever our dynamics are, we tend to go into those historically triggered feelings that we would have in the relationship. So when you get those messages from them and you're already having that response and you haven't even opened the message yet usually, right? I have people that say, I'm just so stressed out all day, even thinking about the fact that I have to open this message, or I sometimes have clients that actually will hire me to do nothing but help manage their communication with their ex and check the app and only tell them what they need to know and all these things to create a buffer for them from having to read the vitriol that's on there a lot of times because it is attacking, it is belittling, it is gaslighting, it is all of those things because that's what narcissists do. So that's not going to change. I think that we somehow come out of the relationship sometimes thinking, okay, if I just get away from this person, this will change. Well, if you have children with this person, then unfortunately, you're always going to have to have some kind of interaction with them. And so when you do, it's going to create these types of triggers. If you don't have children with them and you don't have to have that interaction, then okay, that probably solves your problem, get away from them. But I think that we believe that getting out of the relationship will solve a lot of these problems. And then when it doesn't and we're experiencing similar feelings, we really just don't know what to do with that. Because I left, I got out, I divorced, I whatever in order to not continue these unhealthy toxic relationship patterns, right? And yet now I find myself confronted with this message that's creating that exact same feeling in me that was the catalyst for me leaving. So I got out to not have to feel that anymore, only I'm still feeling it. So what changes? The part that you have to look at is this person isn't going to change just because you left them. I would love to think that people, you know, go through some crisis like that and they get all this inside and they work on themselves and they make changes and become better and all that type of thing, but as we all know, most of the time for people that are narcissistic, that doesn't happen. The statistic is very low. It's like less than 1% of the diagnosed people are actually able to make changes and overcome that pattern of behavior. Now, again, I'm always careful with this because we all have narcissistic tendencies, right? It's just that some of us are more further over on the spectrum than others and depending on how far you lean, then you know, you get into a therapist or a psychiatrist diagnosing you with narcissistic personality disorder. So even if you see narcissistic traits, it doesn't mean that that person is a full-blown narcissist, but it also means that they could very well be and many, many times they go undiagnosed because they don't like going to therapists and why don't they like going to therapists because they don't want to be exposed. The same reason that they isolate people because they don't want one person in their life talking to another person in their life because if you compare notes, guess what? They might lose their their mask, right? They might lose their ability to keep everybody emotionally manipulated in the way that they want. If you know, their lies are being cross-checked, so to speak with each other, okay? So when you first get that message, I think the feeling that we all have first and foremost is just dread, just the dread of dealing with it, the dread of knowing what it is, the dread of hearing the attack and many, many times, especially if you're following the tips that I give you on how to communicate and how to deal with them, this part should start getting better. If you don't know what I'm talking about when I say that, go back further on the channel and listen to more, okay? Because there are definitely things you can do that will change these patterns. And no one can tell me this doesn't work because I have worked with hundreds and hundreds of clients and clients that can successfully carry this out, it works. Usually if it's not working, it's because the client doesn't sometimes, but not others. They're not real good at it. They don't get the emotional support they need, you know, they don't get the coaching they need, they don't get the help and support they need to help keep them on track. Because when you're emotional like this, you go into what's familiar. You don't go into what you logically know you should do. I think you can eventually, but that takes time. And when you first come out of that relationship and this is all fresh, you may know things logically and still not be able to do them emotionally. And that's why I feel like the coaching and the support services are so important because you need somebody to be able to say, am I being crazy? What's going on? Am I reacting the right way? Am I overreacting? Should I not reply to this? Should I reply? Whatever the case may be, you need that sounding board to help you process emotionally because the emotions are the things that work against us the most. So we already have dread as soon as we get that message and we haven't even opened the message yet. So what I usually tell people to do is look, set one time of day that you're going to look at this and don't think about the rest of the day. You know, if there's something urgent, you'll know they'll get a hold of you. You know, I had a client the other day who said we were actually on the phone at the time and the client said, oh my gosh, the other parents calling me. And I said, don't answer. And they're like, what will they have the kids right now? Well, of course they have the kids right now. That's why they're calling you because they know that you're going to pick up because they have the kids and you're going to be worried. That's exactly when they call. And I said, don't answer. You know, you have a parenting app in place that's supposed to be used. If there really is an emergency with one of the kids and it's life or them, they'll leave a message or they'll send a text or they'll do some kind of follow up or put a message in the app or something, the phone call, especially in the very beginning, is usually manipulation. And of course, just a few days prior to that, the same thing had happened. The client had answered it and then it just became this big old discussion about the relationship and about, you know, what wasn't going to happen in the settlement of the custody and the support and all those issues. And so, you know, the client just kind of fell into that trap by answering because that's that anxiety, that's that fear, that's that chaos that comes up in us or like, oh my gosh, I got to figure it out because what if something's wrong and they play on those emotions. So if you can resolve yourself that you're only going to answer once a day, you're going to read through the messages and you're not going to think about it the rest of the time. And when you do sit down to do that, you know, try to make sure that you're in a good state of mind. Okay. And if you find it like you do it before bed and then you can't sleep or you're ruminating about it all night, okay, the night before bed maybe isn't the best time of day. You know, like, I'm not really a morning person, if I was going to do it once a day, my time would probably be five o'clock in the afternoon, right, when my work day is kind of done and I have some time, but I haven't, but but but again, it done before I go into my evening so I'm kind of enjoying my evening without, you know, that hanging over my head. So determine what what works best for you if you're a morning person and that's when you're have the best control of your emotions and all that, then that may be the time for you to do it. So once we get past the dread and we just deal with ourselves and say, all right, got to do this, right? Then we have anxiety, right, because we actually read the message and now we're having anxiety about what the message actually says, whether that's threats, you know, that you're not going to get what you're asking for in court, you're going to lose, you're going to all these things or you're such a terrible parent or, you know, you're, you know, you told the child this or that or, you know, where are these shoes that belong at my house or, you know, whatever, whatever, whatever the case may be, I could probably run on with like a hundred examples of all the different types of things. But we start having anxiety because then once we read read the message, we're in a state of trying to figure out what's going on. Okay, did I do something wrong, did, did I, should I not have done that, is that really going to happen, you know, are what they say, what they're saying true. All that type of questioning of ourselves, again, these are very conditioned responses from having been in this relationship. Kate, you're questioning your parenting, you're questioning your negotiations, you're questioning, you know, what your attorney did or didn't say, you're questioning the judge, you're questioning, you know, based on what this other person is saying, you know, I can remember this, this exact discussion, I don't remember what the specifics were, but my ex has been made some threat to me early on about court. Okay, now when I went through my divorce 20 years ago, I didn't know anything about 18. Okay, close to 20. But I didn't know anything about court, okay, I worked in health care, I worked in finance, I have an MBA in accounting, I'm kind of a numbers person by education, and I didn't know anything about the law. And he would start rattling off all this stuff like, oh, you know, we're going to court, the judge is gonna blah, blah, blah, blah. And then when I started dating Thomas, it was really kind of convenient because I would come back from those discussions and I would be like, is it true that the court's going to, you know, whatever, what the claim was that my ex has was making that day? And Thomas was like, no, and I'm like, what? And that was really kind of the first step in starting to pull the blinders off of me to where I kind of went, Oh my gosh, he's just bullcraping his way through life, right? He's just bluffing his way through everything. And this is what they do. I had a client tonight that had this exact same thing where the husband was like, oh, you're going to, you know, you're going to do this and do that and we're going to go to court if you don't accept this settlement, we're going to go to court and you're going to get, you know, half of what I'm offering you and you're going to block and it's just like, that's all threats. It's all threats. You need to fact check that before you have an anxiety response to it. Okay. Because half the time if, you know, they said to you something like, Oh, well, I'm offering you a hundred thousand dollars and you go into court, you're only going to get $10,000. You know, if you fact check that with an attorney, you know, or somebody that knows something about that, many, many times they're going to be like, uh, no, then you're like, and then you've let that threat stop you from advocating for yourself essentially, which is what they're trying to get you to do. This is how they've done the whole relationship. They've managed you through bullying you and you've caved and that's why you keep getting that result. And that's why that results carrying over because you're still caving. Okay. You have to change what you're doing for this to change your anxiety, your stress about these messages isn't going to change until you start figuring out your part in this, the way you're processing, the way you're responding, the way you're viewing them. Okay. Because they're not going to stop doing what they're doing. That doesn't happen. You, well, I would say the quote from Jim Rohn, it doesn't get easier. You get better. That's what happens. You get stronger. You recognize that, that they don't know what they're talking about. You recognize that you have more power than you think you do. And you recognize that there are certain things that are in your favor too in this process, right? Usually it's not everything all being one sided. That rarely if ever happens unless one person is just incarcerated or a drug addict or something really severe, right? But assuming that you're a normal functional adult, it's, it's never completely one sided like that. In case, so don't let them convince you that you have to, that you have to take the crumbs that they are offering you because that is what happens. And so we, as a result of that anxiety, we then want to respond, right? Because what happens is when you're feeling anxious, you want to try to control something usually a lot of times that, that'll be our response to anxiety, especially if you're control enthusiast like me. And I am admittedly so. That was my husband's little affectionate term for it. Tammy is a control of enthusiasts. It that's how I get rid of the anxiety. Okay. Something I'm worried about something. Okay. Let's go. Let's do something about it, right? I'm worried about maybe my business or how much I'm going to earn next month. Okay. Let's sit down and figure out how we're going to release content. How are we going to promote this product? How are we going to get more sales calls? How are we going to, you know, whatever it is, you start working on it. You know, I'm worried about, um, you know, the, the, um, leaky faucet in the bathroom or whatever. Okay. You know, let, let's do something about it. Let me get under the sink. See if that's something I can fix myself. Let me look at where it's coming from. Let me figure out if I know any friends or if my kids know any friends or anybody that can come and look at that for me and fix it or if I'm going to have to gather the money for a plumber. Whatever it is. Things that you're worried about, a lot of people just sit back and worry, especially in the context of this stuff because they don't know what to do. And so that's where that desire to respond immediately comes in is because you just want to go, Oh my gosh, and you want to respond so that you get, you get some control back over the situation or you think you do. Okay. What happens is you send that response and then they twist it like they do and they come back at you with another round and here's what's interesting. A lot of times, even if you say something nice, it will still invite another round of something not nice. It's funny because I had a client a few days ago who sent me a copy of a communication and the, this was a female client again where dad had sent a note and said something to the effect of, Oh, the daughter did great on her test this week, whatever it was. And mom wrote back and said, great to hear, you know, good to know what whatever it was, the phrase she was she used. And then I said, you know, I probably wouldn't have even said anything just because even just that little comment is going to like give him enough attention that he's going to respond in, in some negative fashion probably. And then, and then that, and again, it's just another time we have to go through this process, right? The dread, the anxiety, the desire to respond, all that stuff. And sure enough, today I get a little note from her and dad had come back and said something like, yeah, let's hope you can, you know, make sure she does equally as well on your end or something to that effect. So it's never, you're never going to say something nice and get a nice response back, right? So your goal is always to minimize. Now I know sometimes you're under court order to respond and you should never go against your court order. Under court order to respond, you respond, but I will say that, you know, if you're not under that order or there's no, yeah, if you're not under that order, then you don't need to respond, you know, or if there's no question or whatever, or it's just notifying you of something or something like that, I always just say received. I don't, you know, if a client needs to respond because under court order, my word is always received. So we want to respond immediately, and so we kind of just knee jerk and we start responding and of course that response involves defending ourselves if we're being attacked, right? It's your natural human response if you start being attacked to defend yourself because they're going to say, well, you know, you're the one that that asked to, you know, have a different time and you're going to be like, well, no, I said the child had a doctor's appointment, which was going to happen during our normal transition. So I suggested that we do this as an alternative. And so even by defending your actions in that way, you're just going to get more blowback, more blowback, more blowback. So always where you can just don't engage with it or say received or whatever you can do because the more you engage, the more this cycle of the dread, anxiety, desire to respond, all that pattern just keeps going for as long as you'll allow it to go because they don't care, right? They're they're the master manipulator, like they don't care, they'll go all night. Long as you'll keep responding, given a little cookie of attention, they'll keep engaging with you negatively or positively. They don't care. And so you have to close it off, you have to learn how to close it off on your end, but you have to be able to close it off in a way that doesn't get you in hot water with the court, right? Because sometimes people don't respond and they should. Sometimes they respond too much. So you have to kind of you have to really kind of nuance, you know, you have to educate yourself and kind of learn where that line is. And it also varies with the type of person you're dealing with. Some narcissists, the boundary can be not quite as not quite as high. Some of them require sky high boundaries and you never let them down. Like it just depends on the person in the situation and the type and in severity of narcissism that they have. And so when I'm working with people, one of the things I always tell them is like, you've got to figure out where this lies for you because we all also have different tolerance levels. And so as I work with people and I start to see how their ex response to things, what the communication looks like and all of that, I start to get a good feel for how to calm the situation down and where that line is kind of that you need to maintain in order to bring that peace into your life, but you defending yourself to them isn't even worth your breath. They're not going to listen to it. They're not going to go, Oh, yeah, you know what? You're absolutely right. That is what I did. That's what I should have said to you. And I am so sorry. Like that's never going to happen. If that was going to happen, guess what? To be with that person because they would have already done it a long time ago. So you go through this process and then what happens as my husband used to call it, you're sucked back into the emotional vortex. That's what happens and they are constantly trying to pull you back into that. And my husband used to say you can't get too close because you get too close to that opening. You get sucked in and then you're fighting with them and engaging in all of the conflict all over again that you didn't need to be right. So we don't want to go through the dread, the anxiety, all of that stuff. So you got to take a deep breath. Don't feel the need to respond immediately. Take a break if you can before you respond. When you respond, let it set. Come back even 30 minutes later and reread it or have somebody that you trust that knows something about this. Okay, not just any random person, somebody that knows something about this and have them come read it. You know, Thomas would do that with me a lot and I would be like, yeah, don't send that because I knew, right? I knew the rules and I knew what we were trying to accomplish. So it's important that you give yourself space in this, right? We tend to want to jump on it, defend, respond because we think all of that is going to get rid of the anxiety. In a little bit, you have to learn to be okay with just sitting in your emotions and being able to tell yourself that you don't need to feel this way. The only reason that you feel this way is your own fear and insecurity and they're really not somebody to be afraid of. Okay? So doesn't get easier, but you get better. That's the good news. If you'd like to learn more about my services or how I can support you on this journey, you can go to divorceuniversityonline.com/vip-coaching. There's a link on that page where you can book a time to speak to one of my staff and learn more about my services and how I might be able to help you. Thanks for watching.