[MUSIC PLAYING] What are your first impressions of Edmondson and Doer? Oh, they were both great. I mean, Eddie's just a monster back there. And he makes a really good first pass to some of those little great gals for-- We're great. He's been around for a long time for a reason. Everyone loves him in a room. He's got probably top three in the league for best reputations. I've been around so long and talked to so many guys. And he's always on top of the list of, oh, he's such a great dude. And I mean, Doo, you watch David tonight in the PK. And he's great, competes, feisty. He battles hard and super competitive out there. So those guys are going to help us head in the right direction. And we're super happy to have them. To me, they're just very smart to know exactly who they are and what they need to do on the ice. Edmondson, they come to expect that those guys want to stay on the cup and play deep in playoffs a lot and veteran defense. But Doer, I'm just really impressed with his overall awareness and intelligence on the ice. [MUSIC PLAYING] Bad morning, Joe 4759 to the fan. Bad N.S., Brian Gunning. So Joel Edmondson, era off to a nice little start. Although he was in the building in Boston, like him on the ice. Wanted in the mix. They beat Montreal Canadiens, which you should be able to do. Yeah, but at 2024. Yeah. And I'm not making too much of it, but it's all the records do not matter when those teams play each other. I know everyone like Rolls-Riser, that stuff, but it's actually proven true over the last decade. That when the Leafs have been the also ran team, they always find a way to show up against Canadians. And vice versa, when the Canadians have been downtrodden throughout this entire Matthews era outside of that one north division season. And even then, they had the Leafs number for so much of it. So yeah, that's the way I just look at it is this is-- there are just certain rivalries in this league in all of sports where it just doesn't matter where the two teams are at. And I mean, look at how that game started. Maths in scoring, 38 seconds in. And you think, oh, God, it's going to be 100 and nothing. I've been in that building for that core, losing 5-2 on Saturday night. It's no fun. So yeah, I just-- it's the way it works when it's Leafs Canadians. Even when you have a 20-point gap between these two teams during the regular season, the Leafs are up 3-1 in a post-season series. It doesn't seem to matter, does it? Really doesn't. Well, it also helps when you have the mole. Alex Keltz, any act working for you. Mm-hmm. From top 3 pick, just giving the series away, Travis Dermott. Mm-hmm. All right, so the Leafs pick up two points, and in regulation, they beat the Montreal Canadiens. Without Mitch Marner, who missed that game with the lower body injury, it looks like it's foot. Maybe he's back for Thursday's game in Philadelphia against the Flyers. Happy days. Doesn't seem like it's a super, super serious injury. But before we bring on Gord Stelik, we were talking about how-- I mean, this season, we couldn't avoid how well the Leafs have played without Morgan Riley. It was an outstanding record without Morgan Riley. And luckily for him and the discourse, they continued to play well once he returned. Austin Matthews, without him, bizarrely, they've had a pretty good record. Mitch Marner, not so much. No, so without Mo, 19-2 and 1. Matthews, this number might be a game off, because it was from earlier this season. He's just missed the one. But record without Matthews, 34, 19, and 3. Pretty good. He's missed a lot of games, as you'd remember. Their record without Mitch Marner, 14, 13, and 4. What does it mean? Does it mean anything? It is what I have been pondering a lot since that game on Saturday night. The team's true MVP. All right. Let's bring in Gord Stelik, who's been-- You sure we're not going to bring in Kipper with that, Tate? How's it going, Gordo? Good gentleman. How are you guys doing? Doing very well, deadline in our rear view mirror. But all right. What do you make of those numbers that-- yeah. I mean, the regular season statistics and taking with a grain of salt, and again, despite the insane record without Morgan Riley, this team's not better without Morgan Riley, and they've continued to be good since he's returned. But is there anything to-- like, hey, those other guys are very important. And Austin Matthews on pace for almost 70 goals this season, and that's all well and good. Mitch Marner playing in all circumstances, in all special teams, and the things that he does for this team. Maybe, like, we forget about his importance when there's so many players that are making close to his amount of money or more than him. Well, you know, first of all, you know, it's funny you're spinning all those numbers, but then I like when Brett Mitch's gal, Chen Yuck, and his voice just drops, because that's what that's-- that's why we spin these numbers, because the end of the season has-- particularly that year, again, the playoffs against Montreal made no sense. We've always walked away, you know, with something like Gulp, what the hell happened there. So, you know, the nut-- let's face it, like I said, 20 years from now, we'll still be talking about how special it was to follow the Leafs with Austin Matthews and Mitch Marner. It'll be unfortunate if they don't have-- I mean, it's like the Minnesota Timberwolves when they had Kevin Garnett, he really didn't have playoff success till they went to the Boston Celtics. And, you know, here, we're going to-- hopefully, we're talking about some kind of playoff success that they're involved in while playing for the Toronto League Police. But, man, you know, like a couple of weeks ago, that game against the New York Rangers, that building was rocking. I mean, you know, we haven't-- this kind of star players, this number of them, there was, you know, a brief moment, and, of course, that's what Damian and I wrote about late 70s that you had that, and, of course, then, you have one Stanley Cups in the 60s. But, you know, this is-- this is a great moment as far as having, like, two great players and some-- and Willy Neelander and some others just not far below. Yeah, you're right, it is a-- it's a special era. Let's hope they, one day, have something at least-- at least quasi-special to show for it. You know, Ben and I were talking earlier in the show the idea of, okay, Marner's out of the lineup, all of a sudden, the idea of Tavares being your third-line center. That is out the door. Do you think that was more Sheldon Keefe just completely rejigging everything? Because when you have Marner out, or one of the top wingers, it does become a bit of a house of cards, or do you think that that was Sheldon Keefe kind of experimenting with going away from the idea of Max Domi at second-line center? Because that was such a topic heading into the deadline, right, is can you trust a player like Domi in those expanded minutes? I think it's as good option as the ones they have available. But what did you make of Keefe's decision to kind of go back to a loaded top six as opposed to spreading things out across three lines? Yeah, you know, Brett, I think whether he's just trying out all options, but maybe that's the right term because you want to have all options, all hands on deck when you're in the playoffs and it comes down to a lot of bench coaching and adapting and figure out what goes well. I like that they've had, when Max Domi's been on his game, the three balance centers that they've never had before. And last year, part of it was right or right, they got hurt, and then they decided not to put Tavares when O'Reilly was healthy, didn't put Tavares to say a third-line center to get that three-headed monster down the middle. So they've done that now, and he's got different ways he can go about it. And again, what they've lacked in the playoffs quite often is depth. We know that. The other team's depth has been a factor in them succeeding at the end, and when it's besides the Galchenia giveaways and the other things like that. So I just think it's a good chance that they got them, they weren't really in the playoffs, okay, when O'Reilly got suspended, they were still kind of on the bubble. So at least they've taken this run and gone to a safer territory where they're comfortably in a playoff spot right now, so he can look at, you know, look at not every game being that what you want to win them all, of course you do, but, you know, the kind of thing he could try some things out in anticipation of the playoffs. Yeah, I can, and certainly, yeah, putting yourself in the best position to win a postseason game takes priority over winning these games while they would like to finish as far up the standings as they can and maybe have home ice advantage in a first round matchup or, you know, winning the Atlantic stills not out of the realm of possibility. Yeah, the secondary things are actually the primary things. It feels like the remaining, what, fewer than 20 games this regular season. So the trade deadline I mentioned is in our rearview mirror, we know the additions that were made and not surprising that a couple of defenseman are acquired and adept forward as well. Did this team do enough? Brad, for living due enough on Friday. Yeah, he did, I mean, he did enough with, we've talked about it every Monday, the fact that cupboarders bear and it got even a little bit more bear with draft picks. I mean, like, you know, 2025, you're going to be picking your first pick in the fifth round. And that's fine if you're wearing one Stanley Cup ring, okay, but that's not the case. So he really, you know, we've tapped that before big, sexy blockbuster trades, especially last year around the trade deadline and didn't make a difference. So it's the kind of thing that you're big, you got the depthy, okay, upfront, your big guns have to carry it. I mean, that's why it just proportion amount of money goes to your top forwards. They got to be difference makers. You got to hope a goaltender who's not been a difference maker. I thought Joe well played really well last year, but as by and large, not been a difference maker in previous playoffs, and then you're looking your trade deadline pickups. We talk about again, Max Domi and Tyler Batuzzi last year, Tyler Batuzzi was a big deal being dealt from Detroit to Boston. So they're starting to supply their way now about, you know, a role within the Leafs. So that's one Bobby McMahon, what sees about, like you mentioned, you added a fourth line center that can give you a little more depth and two way style hockey. So hey, it's not sexy. And probably there's Stanley Cup chances. There's Stanley Cup favorites were more a year and two years ago, but the Washington Capitals didn't win a cup till they weren't favorites anymore either. So hey, just got a, I thought Brad Trivlin did expect exactly what he was going to be able to do given his limited resources. Yeah, and just, just kind of looking at your living teams, right? Not say he doesn't build good ones. He's built plenty of good teams in Calgary, but I wouldn't go with sexy as the, as the first identifier, right? Like generally speaking, a Darryl Sutter coach team, not, not overly sexy. So it is, it, maybe we should get more, more used to that kind of thing here. Once upon a time Gordo, we all got very, very upset at one Mike Babcock sitting, Jason Spets in front of all his friends and family in his first game as a leaf when he hadn't even done anything to endear his self to the team. Simone Benoit has been the best of soldiers. A great find, a guy who will hit the bodies in his words, even though he can't score a goal for them. Were you surprised that he was the odd man out sitting down in his hometown Montreal? I did look that you have one more game in Montreal this season. I'd be shocked. He misses that one as well. But I thought it was a, I guess a rough break is the way I put it for a guy who has been among the best surprises, if not the biggest surprise and best surprise on this leaf team this season. Yeah. And Brendan Ben. Like when it happened, I kind of go, geez, yeah, kind of your way of thinking. But also I said, and I like the fact Sheldon Keith made a point of mentioning is because you can't acquire new defense and then make them healthy scratches. That's the thing. You got to get them in the lineup. So that was more important than, you know, being put, you know, put out as far as feelings with. And you know, I, I think as well, like you're saying, it's a weird quirky schedule that you're in Montreal relatively quickly again. And I, but, you know, but, but that's the bottom of what we talked about it earlier. He's trying to figure out, you know, defensive pairings and all these other things, try to get them cohesive with the forwards. You can't waste any games, you know, it's interesting, like chatting with Kevin BX about it on Friday, just reiterating that the leafs have a team that those guys need the puck up the middle. Matthews, Marner, knee lander, right? Well, then you've added 2D that dump it off the boards all the time. That's their strength. They're going to have to be a meeting of the minds that maybe, maybe to use that word sexy, a less sexy style by those guys in the playoffs up front in connecting with the D, figuring all that out. So, you know, that's why I think you want to get the new guys in quick. Mm hmm. Is Timothy Lilligren capable of playing that way? It's definitely felt like he, he was trending in that direction when, when Morgan Riley was out. It's been a rough couple of games for him. How likely do you think it is that he's the odd man looking out, looking in when we hit the postseason here? Sorry, Thomas Lilligren. Yeah, Lilligren. Geez, I like, you know, like even, you know, Rasmus Sandeens signs a five-year contract last week with the Washington Capitals, and don't get me wrong. These guys aren't Norris Trophy candidates, but man, it's just, you know, to have guys that come around and, you know, go somewhere else, right? It's just kind of, geez, you've got to develop some D from within beyond Morgan Riley. So I, you know, again, I like Lilligren, I'd have him up there. I thought he played, he played really well when Riley was away, I guess everyone played really well. So anyway, these are the decisions that he's going to have to make Sheldon Keith. And you know, you get back to Mike Babcock and you really realize, because as, as Brent lamented, the Galchenia giveaway and that, and I know, Ben, you remember all these moments as well that, you know, we, we, we in Toronto thought it was going to be a long, long years of playoffs and some success, so kind of let Mike Babcock off that first year when because he had to do it his way, he really cost them the series against the Boston Bruins by not playing Austin Matthews and Marner and those guys and playing Thomas Placannock and whoever was there because they had to learn the Babcock way. So it's kind of like, you know, every year there's been some kind of situation that's factored in. And this is the year that whatever decision Sheldon keeps going to make, you know, fairly or unfairly are going to probably decide whether it comes back or not, because that's just the way it is. Yeah. It's switching gears talking about Austin Matthews here for a sec guard. I mean, no one's going to ring any panic bells or alarms or anything, but just one goal in 11 days this month, one in his last five, you extrapolated it a little more, just two goals in his last eight games, all goal scores are streaky. The better, the better they are generally speaking, the streakier they are. Any reason to panic is too strong a term, but is there any worry? We know late in seasons, it hasn't been uncommon for Austin Matthews to have some lingering injury that we've discussed. I don't think that's what's happening here. My guess would be more of the flu bug that's kind of ripping through the team. And you know, it's just been some of those games of the puck not going in. But are you a little surprised at Matthews lack of goal scoring lately? No, I don't even give it a second thought. I mean, when he was on that tear before that, he had one goal in nine games, I think. And I'm not, okay, people, the number 70 looked like it was there achievable. Maybe it still is, but I didn't get caught up in it. You know, when I did a couple of fan forums all-star weekend, and one was with Austin Matthews and William D. Lander, then it was followed Mitch Marner and Morgan Riley. And, you know, they kind of like the subject about really what matters, let's have some leaves in the voting for the cons Mike Trophy for MVP in the playoffs, right? You know, that would be the ultimate kind of new situation. But no, I'm not worried about us, Austin Matthews and the slightest. Wow. You're already out on 70. He's on pace for 69 goals. And you said 70 is out of the realm of possibility now? No, no, no, no. I did not say that. I just said I never really got caught up in it about that number. It would be neat, whatever, but that kind of debate every day because people ask that question. And I kind of go, I don't know, whatever goals you get, I'm going to watch them. I'm going to see them, but enjoy them, whether it's 75 or 59, whatever. It's been through this a couple of times before Ben. You really thought you were going to radio jujitsu him, put him in your little trap, and he just suplexed you right out of that. Yeah. Don't let him get to you, Gordo. Well, I do remember the old thing where they set you up and that's the sound clip that's used to the rest of the week, right? Right. That's why you got, you got to make sure you qualify everything very quickly. No, we only do that with Kipper. No, not you. We never end. Well, of course, Damien also, of course, you cannot confirm or deny Austin Matthews will score 70 goals this season. What great radio. Good stuff, Gordo. All right. See, man. Thanks for doing this. Okay, guys. Take care. There's Gordo. Stalik. Tried to set a little trap. Wanna know part? Oh, yeah. Here's what, here's what I have to say about Austin Matthews. Last month his shooting percentage was 26%. This month is 5.3 and I don't think that'll hold by the time the calendar flipped April. So I also am not particularly worried, but I'd like him to, I could, it's going to be so long between now and the next time I see him shoot the buck in the net. Like, even if we just wait till the next game, it's been too long. I, uh, I miss it right. Honestly. Yeah. And in an overall sense, his shooting percentage is unsustainably high at over 20%. His career high before this was in the 41 goal season of the North Division, where he scored 41 and 52 games. He hasn't had a month that he's below 20 since, since November, since December of this year. He's playing 20.2%. But remember, he only shot 12.2% last season. So let's take the shooting percentage over the last two years, shall we? Sure. 15.8%, which is below his career average of 16.3%. Now that's a lot of numbers and they tell you in radio, many numbers. I never took radio school. They didn't tell me that. They were just like, why do you hear so much about sports? And I'm like, cause I do. Yeah. That's all they told me in radio school. Here. I, I think what they tell you in radio school, again, I never went. I'll confirm her today in a second. Don't use so much the numbers when you're making your argument because it's hard to, when you're talking to somebody without writing it out, it's hard to like visualize numbers. I, I will be honest as a, as a radio and pod listener, when it gets numbery, I just check out and I immediately just agree with whatever point you're going to like, honestly, make it a lot of, you're making a lot of good points here, man. Yeah. You're making, honestly, that's, it's so many of them. So now you've told me exactly how to jiu-jitsu me. Yeah. I mean, you'll never. Oh, no, it was so hard. It was so hard. You just, all you have to do is be like, look over here, something related to the Leafs, throw a lot of numbers at me and I'm just blindly agreeing with whatever you say. Okay. Here's my point with the numbers with that again, reiterating the numbers. Last year, not good, but should have been better this year. Very good. Maybe too good. Two years together. Normal. So yeah, maybe you follow up a 40 goal season, which was, what a disaster nightmare. Disgusting. With a 70 goal season. And then yeah, you look at 110 goals over a two-year span, 55. That sounds about right. Feels about right for the, I don't know, greatest goalscorer of his generation at the peak of his powers. Yeah, that feels about right. Yeah, but he's not playing very well right now. No, it's, it's not. No, no, no, no scoring. Like, I'm not going to sit here and tell you it's not been the best version of him. I, you know, this is an interesting thing I've been thinking about with this is that I thought about this with the flu bug. We talked about this a little bit is the idea of, and with this core, you know, I think it's not a normal team when we talk about these things of making excuses for them. Because I immediately, you hear, yeah, Matthew's has very good lately. And you'll say, well, there's the flu bug ripping through the team and the shooting percentages just down. You can kind of explain it away to a certain extent, but there is a reflex for a lot of people to say, why, why explain anything away? I'm sick. I have to go to work. And I know that's maybe not the case anymore in COVID or you work from home. It's a little different, but I'm always so curious how people respond to that. The idea of, is it an excuse? Is it just more information? Is it coloring the picture? And obviously we'd feel very different about this if this was a first round series starting up on Thursday or something as opposed to game 60, whatever. Yeah, I think if you're coming to a microphone, if you at your work, you also have a microphone that you get to speak into it about the Toronto Maple Leafs and hockey. If you're coming to that microphone with like, awesome, I just got to figure it out. This is unacceptable. That's an insane thing, okay? That's insane. Man still on pace for 69 goals, like going through a slump. 82 game season, like you're just not going to be at your best for each and every single game. And he's been pretty close to his damn best for most of these games. Suppose season and you go through five games like he went through against the Florida Panthers, then you get to talk about it. That was like the number one talking point coming out of their playoff disappointment. Now you got to talk about all the goals you scored against the Lightning as well and it's all in contact. But no. Yeah, he can go, boy, what a great time to go through a slump on middle of the season in March. Let's get the train back on the tracks at the end of the month and into April and ideally through June. But yeah, right now, that's the way it works, I'm sorry, like Conor McDavid, boy, he does seem to pop off the page more often. There's very few games that you're like, hey, did Conor McDavid play in that one? Just because the things that he does- That Joe's going to say the difference is that the fastest player on the ice just stands out. Generally speaking. And he's never, he doesn't go through his slump through, he's like, I'm not so fast. No. He's always fast. Yeah, that's it. It is just his singular skill will always translate every single night and Matthews will most nights. It's a more subtle greatness from him, but it hasn't been quite to his level. You've been big on percentage chances for goal tending. Do you dare to dip your toe into the water of percentage chances for 70? Where are you at on that? Yeah, I still think, I put it at 51% that he scores 70 because this is, it's not going to be as bad as it's been, what over the, this is almost 10 games now. No, it's been, so the, he had the run of hat trick, hat trick goal, two goals goal. And then since then he has had two goals in his last eight games. Yeah. And one of those was in a Sabre's game where he wasn't like very visible and then scored at the dying seconds of overtime, right? Like this is- Yep. He's just, it has not looked, engages the wrong term, but like just hasn't, hasn't impacted the game the way he was earlier on this season in almost 10 games. And specifically the last two games, the shot totals have petered off just a little bit. Again, it's still three shots in each of those games, but he's kind of more a four, five, sometimes six shot guys. So that also I think is, you know, if we're going to do numbers, which as we learned in radio school, you shouldn't do, I got to be honest, my, my news teacher in radio never taught me that Paul Cross didn't say that he didn't say as many numbers as possible. No, he didn't say because he thought you were going to be a business reporter. No, no, he, this guy was not going to let me leave there without at least having some understanding of how to report the news. And his whole thing was just like, make it easily digestible if the numbers are important to the story, give it in proper context. So yes, don't be gobbledygook with too many numbers. So leaps have a couple of those important games to come. They also have a couple against this flier team that's still battling to get into the playoffs, but you know, allowed a million goals over the weekend. Fliers. Yeah. Oh, the fliers. John Torterrell only got to see four of the seven put up against his team before, and he wanted to stay for more. That was the thing. He wanted to see all of them. He wanted to see the final horn. Yeah. And he, he was going to battle tooth and nail to do so. We'll talk about you talk to our fellas out first over the weekend and the two games suspension that followed and probably where Vegas ranks in your all time, like neutral fan hates that franchise, it's a very good list. All right. That and more next fan morning show continues. Ben Addis, Brent Gouding, sports have five nine to the fan. Unrivaled insight, analysis and opinions on all things Blue Jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Motion, the Torterrella, hey, you go, he's going, no, no, no, you're not going to win now one. This is unbelievable. You gotta go. I'm not. I'm not. This is unbelievable. Got over 700 wins. He says you're going to have to carry me off this bench. Well, it's certainly, it's certainly not unusual for coaches to get involved when their team is just floundering on the ice. And look at all the guys. They played for Torter's back in 04. They know all about this. But in 04, he wouldn't have been tossed out of this bench. Well, it's certainly, it's certainly not unusual for coaches to get involved when their team is just floundering on the ice. And look at all the guys. They played for Torter's back in 04. They know all about this. But in 04, he wouldn't have been tossed out of this bench. I mean, this kind of stuff went on a lot more for the boys back in 04. I mean, it was crazy hard. It was violent. A lot of times. And he's still refusing to absolutely go. This is incredible. What do they do? How long have you been around this game? Have you ever seen a standoff like this that finally there he goes down the tunnel? Van Mornin chose 4.75 out of the van. Van Mornin at his prank gunning. That was John Torterrella. Refusing to leave after being ejected. I'm not leaving. I'm not leaving. I'm not leaving. Yeah. Yeah, he was a... I wasn't sure if the guys were just going to give us that right off the hop of it. I wasn't sure. I'm glad you were ready with your own version of it. I just told you. I only watched movies I've seen before. I don't know how they get in the rotation. I don't know how they do that. But that one, I'm well aware. Mm-hmm. And there's more than a few lines out of the Wolf Wall Street that are worth repeating. Only like two of the lines from the movie can be set on airwaves. Well, that one couldn't. I did a great job though. Yeah. You didn't bleep yourself. No, Commander did it. He's quick on the draw. He did it. So John Torterrella watching his team go down 4-0 to the Tampa Bay Lightning. And again, as you heard, Dave Randolph say, they were honoring the 04 Lightning team. That was the best part of it was watching. Andrew Chuck was the guy who jumps out to me of all of them. It's very tall. It's very tall. And just like, "Oh, Leaf Legend Dave." But seeing the guys in the box, because they've been screamed at, like, towards like that a million times. And it's so... That was far and away the best part of it. Somebody had a very full glass of wine too. Yeah. I could gobble it. Like, I like to think that, like, you know, the like server in that suite went to pour it and he's like, "What are we doing? Thimble's a wine here. Fill it up like I'm a king. I'm a cup champ after all." Yeah. That was splashing all over the place. Anyways, John Turnarella watching his team go down for nothing in the first period. And, you know, some questionable, to his mind, penalty calls against his fliers team. Yeah, getting into it with the officials as he is want to do, they said, "Thanks, but no thanks." Game is conduct for John Turnarella and coming to the microphone very strong with a Game is conduct. I've meant to look this up. What's going on with Torts' hand that he has the cast on it? Oh, I don't know. I actually don't want to know. I like to think he just punched something because he was mad. Like, why search out an answer that's not going to be as good as that? But if I live in that world, it adds to the whole picture. Oh, wall up here with this clap of hand. Get over here. It's got this cast. So funny. I'm not going. No. No, I'm not going to go. And obviously, like, at a certain point, the officials have to say, "Well, then you'll forfeit the game." Right. This, we actually... Oh, God. It's not like we can be like, "You know what? He says he doesn't want to go." He says he doesn't want to go. And it'll just be easier to let Bighons be Bighons. Let's undo the... Let's undo the game misconduct. We have retroactively taken this back. No. Torts wins. Yeah, he obviously was eventually going to leave and did leave. Well, I don't know that it's obvious. Like, thank God he did. Remember, this is a guy who tried to fight the opposing team a few years ago at one of his previous stops. No, he'll tell you just the head coach, but the players weren't going to stop him from that, apparently. Yeah. So this is who he is. Character. Give him the jack absence right now. Yeah. So he doesn't actually walk down that tunnel. And his team, guess what? That's not like pulling the goalie where you get some emotional... The shame? Yeah. The shame pull? No. No. They lost the game still. They lost the lightning. This is also not like baseball. So baseball is the sport where it's like, man, there were a couple of times last season, I was like, this is so lifeless. He was so lifeless. He was so lifeless. John Schneider. Like, I don't know if you have to force yourself to be tossed, but like just maybe just infuse some emotion into... It's a tool in the toolkit for managers. Right. And in a sport now, in this day and age, where so little is worth arguing over because we have automated everything except for balls and strikes. That's the only thing that you can argue. But if you do argue it, you're almost immediately ejected. And Aaron Judge has set the bar, so you better do it at least that well. Right. And he's not Aaron Judge. Aaron Boo. Yeah. He's on a Bobby Cox, like trajectory. You see that happen in baseball so much. Not so much in hockey. Now, why is that, right? Now, they play half as many games, but do you think these coaches are given more leeway? Like it does? We see a lot more expletives. Like I'm not the world's foremost lip reader, but you can tell quite often that Sheldon Keith has used some magic words in his day and age and gotten into it with officials. I don't think he's ever been ejected from a hockey game. So there's two things at play there. The Sheldon Keith I'll pick up on in a sec, but why this happens so sparsely in hockey is there's a literal barrier, like even football and basketball, like you'll see it all the time, Nick nurses at standing at center court, arguing with officials or any, you know, just go to him as the chief ref complaint there in football, coach, you're screaming up and down the sideline. And they literally have guys on staffs called get back coaches where you, there was a great video like during the Rams run of a guy who is Sean McVay, his personal get back coach and he just holds them at the hips and literally he looks like he's like deep sea fishing, raining him in back to the sideline. So that's why you don't see it in hockey is they're just a physical barrier. Only Jim play fair has crossed the threshold and even he didn't do it, but he threw the bench at the official when he was really upset that one time. It's Robbie Fattora. Was it? I always have Jim play fair in my head as the guy who did it. Maybe two guys did it. But that's why it's just there's the barrier now you bring up Sheldon Keith, I guarantee you there are a lot of refs and chiefly the guy who tossed towards out of that game going, you can do that. You can just toss them. What did he say to cross the line because I don't actually have an issue with it. I think part of being a ref is eating it and getting screamed at a lot. Like I think that's just par for the course of the monies for us. That's what the money's for in theory. We pay you for the great calls you make, but I don't actually believe we see very many of those. So I'm going to say the bulk of your paycheck is for eating getting yelled at a lot. But what did he say to cross a line? You know, we talk all the time about needing a pool reporter for rest where they're just going to say, oh, I didn't see that or I saw it differently and it doesn't make anybody feel any better. A pool report there. I didn't see one. No, no word for word. What did he say? No, there was not one because the NHL does not do that. What would have been said? Like, what was it so much that he crossed the line? The other thing about this is track record. At a certain point, it becomes part of who you are and people are more willing to go along with it to go back to baseball. I remember going to Jay's games as a kid with Lou Panella, managing the then devil rays saying, I hope I get to see Lou Panella get tossed, like it became part of it. And I also think this is part of the part for the course, if you're going to be officiating a game towards his end is that he's going to be screaming at you like a maniac. So I would love to know what he said. And I think quite honestly, you know, there's a line for everybody and we don't need to quibble about exactly where the line is, but I don't know. I have a pretty hard time believing that he crossed it. Yeah. Yeah. He doesn't seem like the type of guy. I have no idea. I don't know. Personally, I've just this is extrapolating for the public comments and stuff too. Yeah. Right. And his son is a military personality. He's the army ranger. I believe his son is. Anyways, it doesn't seem like the type of guy to really go in on you personally. Yeah. Attack your character. Like I attack your eyes. Yeah, probably attacking the job you're doing. I also do think part of it was, sorry not to cut you up, but also it's entirely possible to West McCauley also a baseball fan going, okay, I know, like, I know what you're doing here. Is this what you want? You can have it. Here you go. Yeah. And for nothing, you want to wake up your team that has to be part of it. And if you are giving him that and setting him to the showers early, um, if you're John Tortorella, take the opportunity to do what major league managers do in that instance. You're like, Oh, I'm gone. Anyways, got to get my money's worth. Yeah. That was the disappointing part about it. Honestly, like while it was cool and something I'd never seen, like I'm not leaving and that was funny to see. No, just keep maybe not throw the bench on the ice because we've seen that before. But like, at least continue to let West McCauley have it from the bench like directly. Let's see the stream of expletives at that point. It was kind of honestly a little underwhelming. I'm not leaving. And then like, yeah, 40 seconds later, you're obviously leaving. No, get your money's worth, man. Let the officials have it in that instance. Yeah. I'm with you. I, uh, I just have to say entertainment product is also like, you know, a professional one. So I understand why the league has to find him suspension, you know, two games. It's like that's half as bad as what Morgan Riley did. We don't need to relitigate all that, but the suspension I have more of an issue with. But it's an entertainment product. Like I understand you can't just let him, you know, flip the bird to the league for lack of a better term, but also I love it and the map. It happened. Yeah. And that's one of the, the rare hockey clips that's going to break through American sports media over the weekend. So we were debating whether it was Jim Playfair or Robbie Fatoric. You were right. Robbie Fatoric through the bench. Playfair is the one who grabbed the stick, smashes it over the boards, then stands up and like rips his tie and he looks like he's going to go for a whole stir of ripping off his shirt. And it is to keep that on. I'm just giving you play by play of it. He then breaks another stick. So there was more room to go there for Torx. Now this was at the AHL level. I don't know if that changes any things because we haven't seen minor league baseball managers. Like remember the guy who did the Army crawl, he was throwing the rosin bag like it was a grenade. That was probably too much. So there's a lot. No, there's, there's, and you know what, for those guys, there's like a point in like becoming visible. Of course. Yeah. Yeah. Not so much when you don't work for him because I don't know that guy's name. I used to. You did. You would. You would. I was in the Braves organization. Anyways. Sure. Yeah. Sorry. Yeah. No, I know. I'm going to spend the entire break. I know. I know. I know. I'm just going to, I just wanted to talk to you about Anthony Kim and Liv. I guess I, I guess that's my lesson. All I've learned. All right. Um, so it's easy to go to break here. And we talked about it a little bit off the top of the show and the deadline feels like a hundred years ago because it was pretty close to that three o'clock on Friday. But the biggest mover and shaker of this year's NHL trade deadline, obviously the Vegas Golden Knights who go out and get no Hanifin, but like at the last possible second. If that wasn't enough, they go out and get Thomas hurdle who nobody really had on their radar as a guy that could move because the contract is it's not over next year. It's like one of those again, one of those cap friendly contracts that they can't show the whole thing. Six years left on it. And the sharks ate a bit of it. 17% I believe very strange, but I obviously like there's some math that needs to be done there when Oh, yeah, nerd cooked that one up for sure. Yeah, when you're looking at, and I think the Golden Knights have like almost $75 million in salary committed to next year's team already. Oh, yeah. Which sounds, no, they are very much a will build this year's team will figure out next year next year type of organization. Yeah. And like we've said, eventually this is all going to come crashing down and whatever allegedly. Well, and at that point, they'll be able to point to at least one championship, right? And then one other final, although that was before they started spending that was like, what the hell is happening here? Yeah. Anyways, I think and correct me if I'm wrong here, but the prevailing sentiment is that the Vegas Golden Knights, like the Kucharov's dashing until the postseason thing is like way in our rear view mirror now. That is the Vegas Golden Knights who are the number one prime example of, I don't even want to call it LTI art manipulation because Mark Stone does a ruptured spleen. Yeah. Which sounds tough. You want to rupture your spleen for the good of your team. You know what? Maybe we we were going to talk about Anthony Kim in the break. Maybe I'll rupture your spleen and we'll see how you are for the last hour of the show. Yeah. Probably not great. So he had you have to actually be hurt like things do have to happen for you to be allowed to create this team. But yeah, it's all it's going to look stupid when Mark Stone doesn't play another regular season game and then game one of the postseason. There he is in the lineup for the Vegas Golden Knights, but the Vegas Golden Knights, if you're not in Vegas, if you're not a Golden Knights fan, feels like they're the number one team in the NHL for neutrals to hate against, right? Because if and we're talking about sports hate, right? If you're if you don't have a real hate is reserved for Brad March on. Yeah. If you don't have a rooting interest in the other team on the other side of the ice against the Vegas Golden Knights, like who are you deferring to? Probably not the Vegas Golden Knights. Where are they in all of North American pro sports as being that team that just any neutral will give in their brothers root against? What I think makes it interesting is there are many avenues in to hating the Golden Knights depending on the way you view the world, right? When we think of just close your eyes, hated teams like the Yankees and the Cowboys. It's like there's one reason they're the most popular generally speaking. They're good to winning all the time, you know, cowboys, less so Yankees less so lately, but you understand what I'm saying? Wide brushstrokes here and they're always present. They're always in your face. There's kind of typically one path into hating those teams. The Golden Knights give you so many opportunities to hate like I for as much as I complained about the Nikita Kutra of LTIR stuff. Maybe it's the fact that they're in the Western conference. Maybe it's the fact that it doesn't really affect the Leafs. Maybe it's the fact that it's happened so many times. For me, that is not actually what gets my myself up in arms. I know for many people it is. My path into hating the Golden Knights is that they were gifted a franchise that won right away and I have been a fan of a hockey team that I've never seen win anything my whole life. And guess what? I grew up caring about it. I didn't know it existed five minutes before they started winning. So that's one other avenue into it. The idea of it being a non hockey market that has had so much success. Like I think that that's what makes them so hateable and the fact that they just won right away and it's never been difficult. Like I think there are many different avenues into hating them and that's what makes them a uniquely hateable organization across all the sports to me. So to me, the number one team in North American pro sports now that fits that mold, I don't know if there's much of a debate. To me, it's still the Astros. As long as Alex Bregman is there as long as Jose Altuve is there, as long as they still have that stank of trash can banging, to me, there is too much actual evidence that that team is loathsome, that they're the number one team and the winning and that they want another one after that. Like that is, and the Yankees, okay, they're the Yankees in the 27 World Series titles and yadda yadda yadda and the pinstripes and that they're the de facto, like, oh, you're kind of an embarrassing sports fan. If you're a Yankee fan, you don't live in New York because you're just a bandwagon in the hopper. I mean, that's the same argument for the Cowboys, but those teams haven't done a ton of winning recently. I don't know if there is one in the NBA right now. Like maybe you can point to Draymond Green as being the reason why the Warriors. Who hates Steph Curry? I just, I don't see one in the NBA. To me, it's the Astros. And then maybe it's a Golden Knight second, the NBA, the NBA one is the Lakers still. And it's because even though they're a, what, eighth, ninth place team in the conference is still going to talk about all the time. LeBron is this heliocentric figure in the most heliocentric of leagues. And I think that is why, but I think even like the LeBron hate has kind of worn itself out. Like people are tired. They've been fighting those wars for 20 years now. They're ready to give it a rest a little bit if Jordan people definitely are rooting against the Lakers. They are and it's like, I'll just put my hand up. I'm somebody conflicted. Like I root for LeBron James, a flat out dude. It's like LeBron told us tough on me. Okay. It was tough on all of us. But outside of that, I want to see LeBron succeed, but I grew up hating the Lakers. It's just been something about him. Purple and gold. They're the Yankees of basketball. All of that. I've just always detested them. So I think that they are still that team. If they were the Lakers without LeBron and that's Anthony Davis, I don't think people think of it. I don't think about you at all. But I think that right now they're still that team in the NBA. If it's just about winning, it has to be the Chiefs. But like I keep saying, like, I don't, I don't see the, do you think it'll ever come? Well, the Chiefs. Yeah. And it's hard for you to weigh in on the Patriots thing. Yeah. On the page. But I get it. I'm pretty sure I hated the Patriots from the word go and not from the word go because like everyone loved the old one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like underdog story like he was after September 11th and they were called the Patriots and they won. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. When did that evolve? They ripped off three and four years and that was that and part of it was the personality thing there too. I just, I don't see Patrick Mahomes is ever having that personality. Now maybe the Travis Kelsey Taylor Swift of it all takes it in a, in another direction, but as much as Travis Kelsey's had this incredible surge and invisibility and popularity, it'll always be Patrick Mahomes totally. He's the face of the franchise. There's just, it's not going to read about Andy Reed's very likable. You can cheese burgers. Yeah. If it's just about winning, it would be the Chiefs, but I just, I can't, and you would be the guy. Yeah. No. The test case would be able to hate them. Do you have hate in your heart for the Kansas City Chiefs? A little bit, but I don't think anywhere near as much as everybody had for the Patriots by Brady's fourth, fifth, sixth season, whatever year we're at in, in my four, I guess, for, for Mahomes now feels like a decade because he just wins all the damn time. But no, it's not. Same. Like I, I try to work myself into it, but then like what complicates this is I then sound like I'm on Fox News every time I have my comments about, about Travis Kelsey. And I'm like, I'm not, I'm not there. So that's what got to complicate that aspect of it. When I understand that when it comes to Travis Kelsey, hate is like that he's just, he's welcomed the spotlight so much to himself and it's, oh, it's so much about things outside of foot. Who cares? Yeah. You know, again, also like seems like a pretty wholesome character. Certainly not me. Yeah. No, I, I do, I do refer to in my household because my wife is like, how what are those? Like, you know, she's one of these like, I saw the Kelsey brothers. I do refer to Jason as the good one. So I don't know. Maybe that, maybe I do kind of hate the chiefs. I don't know. So do you disagree with Astros one Golden Knights two that I, okay, I just have to be honest. It's like, I do not like even in the summer, it's like, I don't spend my time thinking about baseball that I'm not watching. Like, like when you say Astros, you lay out the case and I'm like, yeah, you're right. But it's just not there for me. Like my, I, I hate laundry much more than I hate organizations. Like he asked me the teams I hate. It's the Yankees still. Like I loathe the Yankees. If you told me I could not pick who's going to win a championship, but ban an organization from ever winning one again, it would be borderline impossible for me to pick between the Yankees and Canadians of who, so that's just the way I sports hate. And that's why I think this is such a good conversation because I think everyone sports hate is so different. Like I can't sit here and argue with the Astros. You'd lay out a lot of good points, but it's like, where are they on my most hated rankings? That's the madmen. I really don't think about you at all until you're here. You come to town and then the trash can jokes come about. And I think, yeah, let's get in on that. That is fun. But yeah, for me to bring it back to where we started with, it's scary how fast the Golden Knights have entered the elitist of tears of hateable franchises. Yeah, the Cowboys can't be there. They're just like, you feel sad? Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, all right. Time now for the Wakenrake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet responsibly. Hey, Raptors are going to play a game against the defending champs at Altitude in Denver. They're going to be without Scotty Barnes. They're going to be without Jakob Pertold. They're going to be maybe without RJ Barrett, manual quickly will be there. But the spread is 14 and a half for the defending champs. The total 230 and a half, Brent. Let's go with the under on this nuggets, generally speaking. They can keep you quiet. And we've seen this with Yokech where he'll perform and try to have a beastly stat line against good teams, but against a team like the Raptors, he's totally content to just play matchmaker and get everybody else going. Raptors aren't going to be able to score a lick. Everybody's questionable. The guys that are there. Give me the under. That's what I like the most. I love the over I thought as long as the Raptors without two of their best defenders and they will be for the rest of the season, it feels like in Scotty Barnes and Jakob Pertold. How do you not take the over there? I know the nuggets probably looking at this is, hey, we don't have to do much to win here and maybe you're not getting the best effort. I don't know if you need their best effort to put up a bunch of points against this addition of the Raptors. And that was the Wakenrake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back where the Leafs potentially in on something bigger before last Friday's trade deadline, we'll talk to Rennell Lewa of TVA Sports next as the fan morning show continues. Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, Sportsnet 590, the fan.
