Discover how early crypto adopters differed from today's AI technologists and what this means for the future of digital entrepreneurship. Dive into Projjal Ghatak's insights on how AI adoption is reshaping workplaces and human roles in unprecedented ways.
Ever wondered why Bitcoin should be seen separately from other cryptocurrencies? Curious about how AI can revolutionize business efficiency, management, and career paths? In this episode, Phil Better and Projjal Ghatak explore answers to these questions, providing you with a clear understanding of the transformative potential of these technologies.
Are we ready for a future where AI friends and humanoids share our workspaces? How can we best prepare our children for a world driven by applied AI? Tune in to hear Projjal share his valuable advice for the next generation, delving into the importance of early real-world experience and authentic self-promotion.
This episode wraps up with a powerful discussion on maintaining personal investment in fitness, family, and the future. Projjal's three pillars for achieving success will leave you inspired and ready to apply these principles to your own life. Don't miss this engaging episode of "Invest In Yourself: the Digital Entrepreneur Podcast"!
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Episode Summary:
In this episode of "Invest In Yourself: the Digital Entrepreneur Podcast," host Phil Better sits down with Projjal Ghatak, a trailblazer in the realms of AI and blockchain technology. Projjal shares invaluable insights about the transformative power of AI in modern workplaces, the evolving landscape of cryptocurrencies, and actionable strategies for entrepreneurial success. Discover how AI can optimize business efficiency, enhance managerial capabilities, and reshape the future of work.
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Timestamps:
1. **[00:00 - 02:30] Introduction and Welcome**
2. **[02:31 - 07:45] Projjal Ghatak's Background and Onloop's Mission**
3. **[07:46 - 13:20] The Evolution and Challenges of Crypto and AI**
4. **[13:21 - 21:55] AI in Workspaces: Predictive vs. Generative AI**
5. **[21:56 - 29:30] Human Skills vs. AI Capabilities in the Digital Age**
6. **[29:31 - 35:40] Career Advice in an AI-Dominant Future**
7. **[35:41 - 41:15] How AI Can Revolutionize Business Startups and Management**
8. **[41:16 - 47:00] Practical Insights: Reducing Financial Burn Rate and Staying Lean**
9. **[47:01 - 51:20] Personal Purpose and Future Goals**
10. **[51:21 - 55:00] Closing Thoughts and Contact Information**
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Guest Bio:
**Projjal Ghatak** is the co-founder and CEO of Onloop, a pioneering AI-driven platform aimed at transforming team management and development. With significant experience in technology leadership roles at Uber and an MBA from Stanford, Projjal was recognized as a World Economic Forum Technology Pioneer in 2022. His profound understanding of AI and blockchain technology, combined with his entrepreneurial spirit, brings a wealth of knowledge to this episode.
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Key Takeaways:
- **Distinction Between Cryptocurrencies**: Bitcoin as a stable alternative store of value versus other volatile cryptocurrencies.
- **AI's Impact on Workspaces**: Differences between predictive AI and generative AI.
- **Future Predictions**: Increased integration of AI companions and humanoids in daily work and life.
- **Human Skills in AI Age**: The enduring importance of social, emotional, and unique human insights in work.
- **Career Strategies**: Future-proof career paths focusing on human-centric roles and creative pursuits.
- **Business Optimization**: AI's role in automating repetitive tasks, enabling efficient management, and simplifying startup processes.
- **Financial Strategy**: Importance of keeping expenses low to maintain entrepreneurial freedom.
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Resources and Links:
- **Onloop Website**: [onloop.ai]
- **Projjal Ghatak on LinkedIn**: [Projjal Ghatak]
- **Invest In Yourself Podcast Website**: [investinyourselfpod.com]
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Call to Action:
Enjoyed the episode? Subscribe to "Invest In Yourself: the Digital Entrepreneur Podcast" and leave us a review on Spotify. Visit our website for more insightful episodes and exclusive content. Don’t forget to connect with us on social media!
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Contact Information:
- **Host - Phil Better**:
- [LinkedIn]
- [Instagram]
- **Guest - Projjal Ghatak**:
- [LinkedIn]
- [Onloop AI]
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SEO Keywords:
AI adoption, cryptocurrency, predictive AI, generative AI, human skills vs. AI, blockchain integration, workplace problems, career advice, financial flexibility, Onloop, Projjal Ghatak, Phil Better, early entrepreneurship, maintaining low burn rate, AI-enabled future workplace, transformative partner, human oversight in AI, AI and blockchain use cases, collaborative team development, Stanford Business School, World Economic Forum Technology Pioneer, automating performance reviews, ChatGPT, GPD-3, eloquence bias, knowledge workers, leadership, management transformation, productivity and AI, AI in business efficiency, decentralized infrastructure, future of work, social skills, authentic self-promotion, Candida AI, AI friends, mental health, decision-making with AI.
(upbeat music) - Welcome to "Investin' Yourself" the digital entrepreneur podcast. Join the podcast burger Phil Better as he introduce success for entrepreneur that make their living in the digital world. Now, let's join your host Phil Better and your special guest. Today on "Investin' Yourself" the digital entrepreneur podcast. - Welcome back to another riveting episode of "Investin' Yourself" the digital entrepreneur podcast. I am of course your host with the most Phil Better and today I am very, very, very excited about our guests 'cause they are transforming the landscape of management and leadership in this digital age. They are not only the visionary co-founder and CEO of On Loop since 2021 has been at the helm of On Loop, a generated AI company with a mission to convert every manager in the world into a great manager through their innovative collaborative team development, CTD approach and platform. On Loop is a revolutionizing how the world's top creative agencies and technology companies approach management and leadership, which we all know is very important. He's on a journey to organizational effectiveness beginning with the significant roles at Uber and throughout his MBA at Stanford, his passion for driving business outcomes through effective management is evident in the success and impact of On Loop, a proud naturalizing aporion and an SMAU scholar, our guest has been recognized at the World Economic Forum Technology Pioneer in 2022. So that's a huge. So let's get ready to learn about the change that he's bringing into the management and leadership world. Please welcome our guests, JJ, JJ. Thank you so much for being here. - Thank you Phil, thank you for having me. - Okay, I'm gonna just jump right into it. What made you decide to become an entrepreneur? What made you just decide, hey, I'm gonna go into the crazy world and the ever stable world of entrepreneurship? - Well, you know, I hold myself an accidentally entrepreneur. I don't think growing up anything in my childhood sort of suggests entrepreneurship. And I grew up in a salaried household and I was taught that going and getting a job and being a salaried professional is the way you build a career. I think the wheels first started turning what I decided to leave management consulting at Accenture and to go to Stanford Business School. And the Stanford MBA program is a little bit unique whereby the focus is a lot on you as a person and why people should follow you, which becomes obviously very important in any sort of entrepreneurial venture because you typically have to hire a team, you probably have to inspire customers, do buy a product, you have to sort of inspire people to invest in you. And so you end up building a movement in some shape or form and everything about digital entrepreneurship today, it is largely a movement, right? So obviously the career economy and sort of people getting followership becomes a big part of it. But I didn't actually feel financially comfortable to do it until I left my job at Uber after I'd appeared and my net worth was in the six digits which led me sort of say, okay, I did a fork to not have a job for a year and a half and sort of give this a shot. And so what sort of eventually led me to taking the plunge is really believing in what we do and really believing that sort of helping knowledge workers achieve their full potential at work is probably one of the most meaningful things that people can do given that so much of a kind is spent at work. And I'd felt throughout my career that the approaches that I witnessed in how teams were managed, how teams were assessed in Davila, were just frankly subpar and I felt that we could do it better and sort of rethink how organizations are managed which is what we focus on at On Loop. - So was On Loop did the idea from On Loop? Did that come from having bad managers in your career as a salaried employee and you're like, I have to change this. Obviously after you went to Stanford Business School, you probably said, oh, this is how managed to have to want to be. You know, like they're supposed to inspire not, you know, create fear. Was that was On Loop the idea or the, the, yes. - Yeah, so it was a not, not directly. I think I saw the impact that bad managers had and I've had a time with my career where I've had bad direct managers in this end but that was probably not their fault because I'm a fairly hard to manage. And typically, I always had someone who was their manager's manager or further higher up in the organization sort of provide air coverage to let me do the things I wanted to do. But it was more from the fact that when I led organizations and at Uber, I had the privilege of running both regional and global teams. I felt that processes that we had to go through and the tools that we would give and it didn't really inspire better work. It inspired politics. It inspired people playing visibility games which would sort of let me do quite in this term that I call eloquent bias, which is where sounds better is considered better. And in a global workforce and no offense to you, that usually ends up being the straight white, extra worded male. And a lot of sort of DEI issues, et cetera, that we talk a lot about ultimately boil down to the fact that there are certain groups of people advocating for themselves and their teams more than others. And frankly, calibration that emotions becomes about whose loudest voice in the room versus really sort of measuring work and rewarding good work. And so it was more sort of my observations both at my time in graduate consulting as well as in tag. That sort of felt like there was an injustice that was taking place. And the problem could be very well solved by better approaches and better technology, which is what led to the birth of our group. - I like that. And with on loop, were you already working with AI previously to doing this? Or was it just like, hey, AI blew up in 2020 or 2022 pretty much? And you're like, well, I can use this to make things much better. - Yeah, so we were a DEI company before a DEI became a term. And so we actually started working in a private beta with GBD3 back in early 2021. So GBD3 had come out of August 2020. And all my friends in Silicon Valley were raving about the tech. And actually, before we had raised any capital, I had applied for OpenAI's private beta and got rejected. And I reapplied after we had raised capital and we got in. And in February of 2021, we decided to bet our entire product roadmap on the technology. And so the first use of GFC side tackling was automating performance reviews, which is a highly painful exercise people go through and people largely feels a waste of time because you're sitting and making enough stuff from memory. But if we took a certain microfeedback through the close off the border or six months and then switched it together with generative AI, that was a much better way of actually summarizing so much performance. And so we were the first company in the world to announce automated performance reviews in mid of 2021. And actually, until JAPIDI came out in November 2022, everybody was like, oh, can you trust this AI? Blah, blah, blah. Better people to stay in their minds as soon as the activity came out. And so people's concerns about AI in the workplace just evaporated almost overnight. Whereas we hadn't been at it for a year and a half or two. We skid the blockchain and crypto wave. And we're able to pick the right technological trend. But the reality is that it's less about the tech. It's more around unsolved problems in the workplace. And we deal with topics like goals and feedback, which people have really struggled with, with free AI approaches like performance management or OK, management that became these clunky exercises that took months and everybody felt like this was an utter waste of time. And now with AI, we can take people's uninterrupted observations, take more cells of dots, and then connect them, do sort of help people structure feedback, extract insights around skills, even break down goals, figure out how to cascade through organizations. And so we can take a lot of the manual paperwork out. And obviously, as the technology's got on one screen, we obviously applied it in many different parts of the product. And we were just lucky. We were just lucky that we were able to identify that this technology allows us to solve unsolved problems in a new way. And I think which is why applied AI is just so interesting. There's a lot of attention, obviously, in the base layer of infrastructure and hardware, where companies like NVIDIA and OpenAI today are getting a lot of the attention of the spoils. But really, this is the next wave of the internet. And if the internet's thought as anything, is that applications end up being the most important companies of the stack. And so people are more and more used in the term applied AI, which a lot of people disoff as a wrapper on top of the large language model, but really are building workflows. And as much as people use that GPT, I think it's still going to take a look for the world to figure out how to do the correct problem of engineering for every use case. And businesses will get built, sort of building the right workflows on top of large language models to sort of solve exact workflows that people need without needing people to write prompts. I like that, yeah. Right now, prompt engineering is huge. You can find at least a dozen YouTube channels just on talking about prompt engineering and where it's-- Oh, more than a dozen. I know there's probably dozens and dozens of channels talk about prompt engineering and how people are asking for-- I've seen some job listings for prompt engineers now. And it's so bizarre because you can literally ask Chacha Vt how to become a prompt engineer. Yeah, I literally have a prompt. I use Chacha Vt because, one, it's a free tool, but I really have one of my threads as prompt engineering. I'm like, this is what I need. How do I make a prompt that works it? And it's kind of like really-- I'm like, our business is that dumb. They don't know that the tool will actually do it for you. But it will just continually get it better because that's what it's job is. I'm interested with using OpenAI and using a generative AI for this. Have you seen-- I don't want to say issues or negative situations arrive from people using on-loop to create these-- all the unnecessary workload that managers have to deal with on top of just the regular politics? Have you found some companies are pushing back against it because they don't feel that there's-- because AI has mistakes happen. Do you feel that some people or some companies have pushed back on that because of the errors that can be created by AI? Yeah, I think a couple of things. One is-- it's actually a funny story from 2022. We had actually a time when the models would spit out on really inappropriate summaries. So it was a woman who was talking about feeling isolated or worrying. And instead of summary, it made up a story about how she was single because she wasn't going on an update and that she really should be dating more people. So something I don't know work would be relatively clear. And so if you're using large language models as a company, I think two things are very important is ensuring that the human and the loop in the right places. And that can be sort of internal to us as a organization. And we actually sort of review things the right way model, true machines as well as sometimes with humans to make sure the output is relevant and correct. But the models itself have also got a lot better at putting the right Jackson balance is in place. And the thing is that because the tech is changing so quickly, people might have a bad experience and they get a stuck in the reality is that in a matter of weeks or months, that's actually been solved as a problem. And we generally work at the very top of knowledge work. So we're working with BCLP back tech companies or sort of pretty elite creative and ad agencies. And so at that cost a few of knowledge work, I think there's very strong embracement that the technology is here and that if you're not going to use it, you'll get enough. So at the end of an organizational level, we're just seeing a very sort of deep interest in investing in AI in the right places but driving product. I think sometimes you have pockets of fear in organizations where when something goes through AI, they're not sure what happens. So they're concerned on where that is going and sitting at. Does it being said to somebody? And so in our product, we are very hopeful around the right education and even how we name certain things to make sure that you increase trust. And I think every product builder needs to do the right things to increase that trust between the product and the user, especially around AI products. But I wasn't old enough when the internet came out to remember whether there was hesitation. I'm sure there was, right? And then I'm sure there was fear. And so those are natural with any sort of new technology. But I think what a strategy was able to do is get the product into the hands of hundreds of people within days or weeks. And it's the fastest that any major technological tool has become mainstreamed that quickly. And therefore, people's sort of awareness, as well as adoption of it, is significantly higher than anything else that we've seen in history. And so 75% of knowledge workers survey have already used a Blight AI and some ship or farm anchor and that number is only going to go up. And so I think there are broader sort of fear model errors around AI, around the societal implications. But when it comes to AI at work, I think it's pretty well accepted that it's here to stay. And then if you're not going to adopt it, the loser will be you, not someone else, not the company, not AI. I'm curious, because you brought up crypto and blockchain earlier. Do you find-- because people got burnt, obviously, by the crypto and are still getting burnt by crypto and blockchain, which I still find very interesting, even though we had a very good period of time where people learned. Do you see those two integrating? Block, chain, and AI integrating in the future to become even more powerful? It's not pretty, and I think they're already sort of applications and use cases where that exists. Right. So there's a term called deep aim, which is decentralized physical instruction network. Whereby the belief is, if you have a physical infrastructure that is running the AI is decentralized and on blockchain, it is potentially more secure. It is potentially more efficient. It's potentially more de-risked against sort of outages and things like that, because people can sort of take over tapower loads from other nodes in the system. And so we're definitely going to see blockchain getting used for the right reasons where they are. I think the problem with the crypto is that it was very easy to become a gambler with crypto. And as a result, it attracted gamblers. And so despite the fact that it was largely a computing movement, and it's still a computing movement, the gambling side of it meant that the overwhelming majority of actors in this space were traders and gamblers and not computing folks. And as a result, the good of the technology sort of got out shown by the bad of the ecosystem actors. I think that's way different with the AI, whereby the people building, operating, using, are largely not gamblers but technologists. And as it is from a user case perspective, it's much more pervasive, sort of in society. And therefore, I think it is sort of not smart to actually equate it to doing it anywhere. And think about the hype cycle of crypto and the hype cycle of AI in a similar manner. I think the other piece is sort of differentiating between Bitcoin and everything else. And Bitcoin really is where it is today for a value perspective, is because people see it as an ultimate of sort of value that is not manipulated by sort of federal agencies of countries with regards to currency manipulation. And so it has a very different use case versus the rest of crypto. And it is very much of a gold ultimatum and a fiat currency ultimatum as a sort of value. And so, but unfortunately, often because of sensational media, everything gets clouded as one. And so people start looking at crypto as a holistic piece. People start looking at AI as a particular piece. Now there's a huge of me in predictive AI. And generative AI actually predictive AI is 20, 25-year-old technology, you know, that has been thinking about what shows up in Instagram feeding with AI for a very long time. But in predictive AI, it was a generative AI and transcription is a generative AI. But obviously now every talks about AI as this one thing. And so I think that there is no else to everything. And I think what becomes important is to break it down, do its constitute in parts so you can think about it from a first principle level versus thinking about it as a holistic law. - That's a black box. - I like that. And it's a great thing because, like you said, there is multiple smaller niches, if we will, inside AI, quote unquote, they're smaller rooms. You have, like you said, the generative and then you have the other one. And then we have two artificial intelligence, which is, which we're still trying to work towards. Do you see, because you're in this space and I'm far from it, I'm just looking through the window of this AI world, do you see us coming closer to a true quote unquote AI, nearly sentient, if you will, computer that will maybe change the world? Or do you see that as something that's gonna be blocked because of the fear model that's been happening when it comes to just generative AI? - Yeah, so the reality is that we're already there, right? So there's a company called Handy.AI that I learned about recently that it does AI girlfriends and boyfriends and revenue for that company is off the charts, off the charts. And so we are going to share the workspace with human rights. We will have AI friends. And I think that's good for the world. And if you think about sort of loneliness or the lack of social fitness that people have today, especially in the young generation, that is why all the biggest diseases that's not critical to hospital. And so I think we have to ask ourselves, what is deep in human? And the sad answer is not a whole lot. And it is the sense of purpose. It is a sense of having feelings and it's a sense of sort of irrational emotional connection. That's about anything cognitively is not purely human. And machines are already better at doing a lot of jobs that humans used to do. We used to make everything by hand. We don't anymore, the mid-effectories by machines, right? In our generation, the work of coordination or project management or alignment or all of those things that have to an organization done by human, it was not gonna be better at it than AI in a few years ago. So this is just a continuation of a movement whereby machines have been taking over human jobs for a very long time and they will continue to do so. And therefore it becomes very important than to find what is deeply human. And I believe there are sort of three skills that are quite human that I think will remain elevated above technology. So one, I think we are tribal and social as people and people generally like hanging out with other people. So, publishers between two CEOs will likely be done by two human CEOs. And so if you're in a relationship building industry and you're good at it, if you're stuck at it, you're probably not okay, but if you're good at it, you're probably okay. Two, I think the human brain can combat disparate dots in unexplainable ways that can lead to unique insight. And that also I think will remain sort of the purview of humans for a long time. I think machines will recommend dots in predictable ways but will be harder to do it in ways that are unpredictable. And then three, because of the way society is structured, we will always need humans to make tough decisions or judgment calls because we need to hold someone accountable and we can't put an AI in jail or have them resign or fire them. And so if you're the decision-making role where you have to make nuanced judgment and build relationships with others, your jobs are being safe. If you're in any role that is task-focused, your jobs are not safe and that's the reality. - I like that. - And so I think that people should take this very seriously as I think about their careers and what it means. And frankly, with our generation, you've been told to study matter science and get into the best of acting and consulting and do largely sort of generate knowledge work. As I think about my four-month-old son, I'm not sure that will be the advice I give them. And so I think we will have to rethink what good careers look like. I think things like sports and performances will become a bigger part of life because I don't think we want to watch AI's flater football. I think we'd probably watch shivers play it, right? So the things that are more in the performance route, I think will remain more human. But I think in everything we do in our lives, we should ask ourselves, is there something human should still be doing or should we not have a machine with that? And then they'll do it with it. - I like that idea of how we can make lives a little simpler for people by taking off those tasks that aren't really worth our time, if you will, 'cause like most entrepreneurs, you hire someone to do a task that you don't want to do. - Yeah. - And with AI coming in, more and more people will have that ability at a cheaper price and businesses can start. - Correct. - And it's already happened with software, right? It's much easier to start a software company today than 30 years ago or 20 years ago, right? So, and that will only get easier, right? And a little too high in AI content and AI salesperson and other sort of coordination roles that are rules-based that can be done by AI to a large percentage in the new human table. And that's how we think about managers too. We think a lot of the things that manage it as can be done by machines, including running one on one or running businesses or running, it's essentially conversational AI. And so that can mean that the very best managers can have larger number of direct reports. Versus today, every magic and all you have four or six direct reports 'cause there's too much to do around each person that's entirely shouldn't be done. But if 80% of that job is done by AI, you can take on a 20% more of that large number of folks and that means people will not have happy managers because happy managers can replace AI. And the good managers can run large teams. And that's why we say we're both a manager, a co-pilot, and an autopilot, depending on what it looks like because we can either enable existing managers or we can create new managers that are in machines. >> I'm curious 'cause this is very interesting 'cause you're like, we can help businesses one, lower the managerial amount you need. Through streamlining the business, you can hire more frontline employees, if you will, handily the invites instead of having more managers for it all. What issues, if you will, have you been able to solve outright for these managers? 'Cause I know from working under managers, there's thousands of issues they have to deal with. Yeah, just doing the one on one, but also the politicking that they have to deal. What issues have this like clearly your on loop has just clearly solved for these managers? >> Yeah, the first one which we're close to fully solving is feedback. And people have gone through funds of feedback training. There's so much content on how to get a better feedback. But people don't get better. And that's because it's an unnatural thing to do. What people are good at is making observations. And you can take those observations, break them down into whether it's celebratory or proof feedback. Rewrite it using sort of the right approaches, like situations, behavior impact, and destructive feedback. And then extract skills competencies of behaviors from it, from and not from the observation. And then that allows managers to take their own thoughts and actually structure in a way that can be delivered in packs away to the veteran roles. And that problem, I would say we 90% solve the right. And the second problem, which you're very excited about solving is the notion of goal alignment. And goal alignment is one of the most soul-sucking things that have an organization. Because they don't guess here through the right way. It's not going to be what they're working on. It's hard to see what the most supportive things are. And people sort of go through this like a vicious cycle of planning off the player. And so you can take again very high level goals at a business sets, use AI to break them down, connect them to high level goals, and then make sure you're running things a lot of anxiety within others. So I would say we've figured out the approach. We still haven't been able to fully implement it yet. And it's in the works. And are you using AI to figure out the solution to this problem? - Well, I think that part of it is just understanding human behavior. I think why I feel excited about the opportunity we have as a company is that as a company we are rooted deep in human psychology as well as in cutting it and building the product. And just solve that problem. You sort of need to successfully do all through. And I think it is incredibly solvable with AI. And through our combination of using just algorithms plus generative matching off sort of different things happening in an org. And that will mean that people will have to spend a lot less time on a lot of time doing those projects to make sure they achieve the outcomes of our traditional ones. And Atlassian, which is the brand coming with a tool called Jira, actually just did some research that they've produced in the state of teams report by credit for. And they estimate that 25 billion hours are lost in the fortune 500 because of three reasons. People not having any other roles, people not having access to information and people spending time coordinating on achievement of those goals. And the reason they did that is because they also build products that try and solve this problem in different ways. And the reason why they invested in it now is because AI can solve it. And every CEO we speak to has these lofty goals of the business that doesn't catch it and trickle down, get a track. You know, a very easy matter that's frictionless that gives them full visibility locally. And that's the business critical problem we are trying to solve. - I love that. I want to kind of switch more into your more personal share more about investing in yourself because with everything you're doing, you know, you've worked for some huge companies like Uber, Active Center and now on loop. How do you take the time or what have you learned about investing in yourself to up level yourself? Because obviously with AI, we can just go, how do I invest in myself? And it can give us this whole walkthrough. But I'm wondering, what do you do to make sure that you're on top of your game and you're constantly improving yourself? - Yeah, so look, I think a lot about fitness and I think there's physical fitness, there's mental fitness. It's called social fitness. And there's better and better longevity research that shows that there are several factors that affect. So just how much energy you have as a person and I think as an entrepreneur, you are sort of biggest enemies time and energy to do all the things you already. And so things to increase your energy or your capacity or you'll deal with stress is sort of, I think the best investment you can make in yourself. And for me, it's about investing in all of those three, I'm better investing at my social fitness and mental health than I'm at my physical fitness and that's something I'm trying to change. But I think the best investment in yourself is to make sure you're keeping yourself fit. Because if you don't keep yourself fit, you will make bad decisions for yourself and your team and you might literally die. And learning and growth and all those things just happen naturally, and we talk about it. So there are collaborative team development model that talks about the things that you have to take, care of to perform optimally and that the foundation of it is how full is your battery. And then it's about having clarity on your goals, that it's about in our feedback and then it's continuous learning and growth. But the foundation of it is energy. And I think most entrepreneurs are so focused on changing their goals and trying to learn and grow that they forget that their battery is depleting. And literally, you can have the latest iPhone but at the battery is dead, it can't do shit. So full. And so keeping your own battery charged because it is truly on, I think, the best investment you can make in use. - I have to agree, I have to agree. When you're running on 10%, you're not doing the best work and you're damaging everything. I wanna know, where do you see on loop in the next five to 10 years? And where do you see your self-judger in the next five to 10 years? - Yeah, so I define my life by three purpose pillars and it's the future of my family. It's the future of work and applied AI for the future of work and the future of Singapore as a country. And sort of all of mine waiting time gets deleted in one of those three pillars. I think where I am most excited about on loop is our ability to help companies transform in this new world of a global hybrid workplace that is fully AI-enabled and will soon have immersive VR that will further reduce the barriers that exist between people across parts. And that will mean people rethinking who they hire, people rethinking where their people work. It's rethinking how they work optimally. And I want us to be able to be a popular across that entire journey through a combination of products and software that we build but also services we can provide. And so I think about ourselves much more as a palantier as a company than workday as a company because we can truly drive transformation for companies using AI for their workforce and how they get the maximum arrive from the biggest line item on their P and R. And it is shocking to me that people are the most expensive piece in both organizations and nobody actually owns people of productivity. There's no single person except the CEO that owns the productivity of the largest cost item on the P and R. And that is great thing. Even it's definitely not HR. And so that's where I'm excited about on loop and our ability to sort of help every knowledge worker achieve the full potential in making sure they find the right role for themselves. And I've sort of been developed themselves the right way. For myself, personally, I think I don't think those three pillars will change till I die. I think what will evolve is where I spend time across those three pillars. And today sort of the middle pillar takes up 18% of my time and you know, in the future the two pillars I just have to get a single form might take off more of my time. But it will actually be a Chris, those three pillars. - I like that. I really do. I like how you have those three solid pillars to focus on. And it's a simpler way of moving towards your goals because you know, do they align with these, one of these three pillars? If they don't, you can drop it and it's even easier. We're gonna go back. - I want to ask you something about your 10 year old self. You have your 10 year old, I actually have your 10 year old self here. He's very nice, very kind, very polite. But I'm wondering, what's a piece of advice? Like I know you have a young child, I don't know if you have other child, children, but what's one piece of advice you would love to hand back to your 10 year old self to help them with the rest of life? - Yeah, warrior. - Okay, and start operating in the real world as quickly as possible. And if you can start a business and start a any business, because I think one of the things that is very tough in terms of how both education systems and corporate systems are built is that they don't teach you demanded erosion. And ultimately when you're an entrepreneur, all that you're doing is demanded erosion. And when you start something or you're promoting something or you're building something, you learn the skill of marketing yourself in a way that's authentic and attracts others. And frankly, the earlier you start that, the better. The earlier you start that, you'll get to see how your education plays a role. So you'll realize that algebra really matters, right? Organic chemistry matters less, right? So you also can get to see how the things that you study actually play a role in how you might live the rest of your life. And you might start adopting skills and approaches that may not be visible in your education system. So I have a four month old child, but I have a 12 year old nephew. And I was just in India last week because my mom had surgery, so everybody has one now. And we had a very intense lunch conversation about God. And he loved it. And he was like, this is such an amazing conversation. And both conversations are not happening at all. And are important to everyone, how you think about the world and how you form a world user. And so the faster people can think about the world in our initially operates, I think the faster you get a sense of how things are and the faster you can be successful. I think for me, I am suffered because I started my sort of business building journey at 33 and not attend. And I wish I started attend. And I'll make sure my son Gavin starts at 10, if not earlier, because the earlier you start out there. - And it's true, the sooner you start the more successful you can see in your life when you start analyzing problems at a young age, when you get to our age, you know, mid to late 30s, we're on the backsloot because we're so stuck in our ways in some of the kind of thinking. - Love how to be in a tree, you learn like that. There's love how to ski at 35, all the best. So plus we don't bounce back as quickly when we're at 30 slots. - Great, great. And then the other thing that really prevents you from being out there is, is you're born right in life. Frankly, that is the single largest team that comes in the way, is how to be for yourself. - And when you're in 10, your parents pay for you. So you don't have to pay for yourself, right? And the best thing you can do in your life is to keep your monthly burn low. Lots of salaries are a trap. You can keep you there, 'cause you can't get out of the answer. But if you keep your monthly costs low, you can do what do you want. And we don't teach, you'll do that. - We're teaching people how to be pegs and cogs in a big wheel that just keep you moving and burning out. Jadio, I'm having a great time chatting with you, but unfortunately, you are getting to the end of the episode. So I'm gonna jump off stage here. I want you to let the audience know how they can connect with you. If they're a company looking to have a better impact through their feedback and management, how to connect with On Loop. So the floor service yours. - Oh, now thank you for your time. I really appreciate you tuning in. Link did it the best it has by me. So you can just look at my name or On Loop and you'll look at all of me. Our website's on loop.ai or all of dot com, if you want to find out more about us and these right in. I listen to or read everything that comes with my mailbox. So I look forward to hearing from folks. - Excellent, JJ. I can't thank you enough for being here. It was a pleasure chatting with you. I love everything you're doing with On Loop and changing the workforce and managers to be better managers, which we all need 'cause we've all had that one manager that we, yeah. Yeah, anyways. So I've put a thank you so much for being here and sharing your story with us. - No, thank you. Thank you for having me. There's just a lot of fun out there. - Excellent. To my audience, check out the show notes down below to connect with JJ and On Loop to see if it's a great fit for you. And as always, I want to thank you for listening and remember to always invest. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music)
