(upbeat music) - We're back in on Canucks Central, it's Dan Ricio and Satyar Shah. It's the Kintec Studio, Kintec Canada's favorite orthotics provider, powered by thousands of five-star Google reviews. Soarfeet, what are you waiting for? - Canucks Central is for enzyme-Pacific Vancouver's Premier Chrysler, Dodd-Ram and Jeep Superstore on Second Avenue between Canby and Maine, or at enzyme-Pacificcrisler.ca. We now go to the dispatch plumbing heating and air conditioning hotline and welcome in our Monday guests. He joins us every Monday, it's Don Taylor, the legend himself, Donnie and Dolly, tend to noon on check TV Monday through Friday. Thanks for this, Donnie, how are you? - Very good, guys, how are you? - We're doing pretty well. It's been kind of weird, you know, I know Saturday, there was a lot of uncomfortableness when it came to Thatcher-Demko leaving the game and today I know Dolly Wall gave a bit of an update and we talked about it here about a month, maybe a little bit less, hopeful a little bit less, two to four weeks, all kinds of different timelines on Thatcher-Demko, but it doesn't feel like the existential crisis it might have felt like in prior years. - Well, I think everybody's worried because of last year, everybody in connection anyway is worried because of last year, we're missing three months with the groin injury and right off the bat, Elliot Friedman reported that it wasn't a groin problem and we're understanding, maybe you've heard that it's lower, it's the knee, two to four weeks, but as if the knee is not a big deal, but yeah, I think it's the best that you can hope for when it comes to bad news and Thatcher-Demko and the specter of last season. I think it's pretty much gone away, but it came back in a significant way over the last 24 or 48 hours or so because of this injury and what happened with Thatcher last year, what happened to the team when he wasn't around? - Yeah, and that's always the big question and concern is what is it gonna look like without him, but you feel better about how the team is playing and also what is he going to look like when he does return and can he get it back to his top form? Now, obviously a lot of questions too, Donnie, about his workload so far and it did kind of coincide with more questions coming up the past couple of weeks about how many games he's starting, how he's on pace to play over 60 games and they wanna keep that number under 60 and it's always easy to say in hindsight, perhaps he should have played less than he did play, but how much of that should we take into consideration as workload leading up to this injury? - Well, we live in the talk show world so a lot, but it's funny guys and look, there's knowledgeable people in this market and people who have followed hockey for a long time and I don't know anybody who wasn't doing a talk show on TV or radio or who wasn't listening or texting into a talk show on TV or radio, emailing whatever the case may be, who wasn't wondering about that workload and that him starting 11 or 13 games in February, when things have been going pretty good for the Canucks up until then, they were having some trouble and there were some games in there, like I would say the game in Chicago or the game in Seattle where it's like, what's he doing starting? Shouldn't it be Casey to Smith? If I'm not mistaken, the Chicago game was before the Minnesota disaster, which Casey to Smith was a part of. So people were really wondering about it and this happens and you can't help, but question the hockey minds and the Vancouver organizers. They're like, they've done most things very well this year, but you just can't help but question them given that everybody was asking those questions about Deppko's workload in February. I don't think a lot of people find this surprising and they know there are a lot of people out there who are long time cannot fans and we got emails and texts like this today. Like, oh my gosh, this is so kenak that here they are just second overall, it's such a great season. Turning things around after a real top grind, Rick Tock had called it in February and now this happens with one of their big, big stars. If not, they're number one star. You can argue that in Thatcher, Deppko. So I get why some people are really frustrated right now. I get it too and it is unfortunate, but at the same time, I thought and I felt that this organization's goal-tending department has deserved the benefit of the doubt on pretty much anything considering they have who's sort of thought of as the best goal-tending coach and goal-tending leader in all of the league and Ian Clark and he's the guy that's made the decisions on who starts for pretty much the last number of years. Like, that's what he does and, you know, given that I don't really question him on much else 'cause I'm not the goalie guru that other people are, I find it hard to question him on this, right? Like, you can't choose your battles just because of what's happened here. I mean, Deppko could have gotten hurt in game 40 just like he did in game 49. We'll never really know the true answer. - Yeah, I saw a tweet today and I think it might've summed things up that injuries happen. Like, you could be as careful as can be and especially when it comes to goal-tenders and a large stretch across the crease, whatever the case may be and injuries are gonna happen. As far as Ian Clark goes, we had Bruce Boudre on the show today and he raved the bottom and feeling much the same way that everybody in this market feels is that, you know, over the past several years and going back to his first goal with the Canucks, you could say what you want about the Vancouver organization from a negative point of view. - I've never, honestly, I've rarely heard anybody say anything bad about him. So why wouldn't you trust him in this situation? And in fact, you know, when it came to those games that he was starting that raised eyebrows in February, a lot of the conversation was, well, Ian Clark must know what he's doing. And maybe there were no indications then that he was getting tired or anything like that. But maybe it's just a case of injuries happen and you can't really blame anybody here including Ian. - Yeah, I mean, and ultimately what's done is done, right? And at this case, at this point, all I'm hoping for is they can get Thatcher Demko up to speed in time for the postseason. I think that's the only thing that matters here. Can you be healthy in time for the playoffs? But until the playoffs, of course, they have 16 games remaining. And everything we've seen from Arthur Sealov's has been positive. So I guess the positive spin you can also put on it is and Rich was mentioning, you can hone in on your defensive play, but maybe getting Sealov's a few games and getting the Smith a few more starts, at least maybe a shorty up a bit, more goal-tening-wise heading into the postseason. - Yeah, and I think maybe, you know, sat in one of the knee is a real serious area when it comes to health. - Yeah. - I think I take knee-over-growing just because they'll, you know-- - They'll get what you mean. - Yeah, okay. Yeah, health-wise, I'm talking. I take knee-over-growing just because, you know, anything soft tissue, you're only, I'm sounding like a doctor, tends to linger. - Yeah. - As long as it's not something that has to be surgically repaired or anything like that. As far as Sealov's goes and the Smith goes, I think teams, really good teams. And look, they've buckled down defensively the last four to seven games or so. I think this goes back to any level of hockey or whatever hockey you, you know, ball hockey, beer league, whatever, when your backup's in there and whatever we talk to a lot of NHL guys about this, but, you know, you tend to tighten up and be more conscious of what you're doing defensively, especially if it's for a significant period of time. So maybe, maybe that is a silver lining here. Not that they weren't playing well defensively, especially during this four-game win streak when what they've only given up a body with three goals in the four games, been really, really impressive. And it'd take a very few penalties. But maybe it goes even to another higher level, you know, knowing that he's not gonna be around for a while and that you better play well defensively in front of your goaltender or you're gonna slip. - Well, that's their identity now, isn't it? It's not we're a high-flying offense. We're gonna run and gun with teams. Rick Tockett has completely changed the posture and identity of what this team is. Like, they're a defense first hockey club now. - Rick, Gabe T. Miller had a really good interview last week, probably on sports that, where he said that he felt that, he wasn't saying so much that things were easy, but the offense was easier early on, that they were racking up the goals. And the stats showed you that, but he knew all along that they were capable of playing really good defense. And that's what they had to get back to doing. And you've seen it over the last, again, four to seven games, especially during the win streak, that they can buckle down and they're a fresher team too, right? If they've had some days off versus fed to worry. So it's the way maybe they have to play now and they've shown that they're capable of doing it. They get some really good teams too. - Yeah, and I think we won't know, obviously, about this team until the playoffs, right? We can talk about projections all we want, but all we can judge them by is what they can do in the regular season. And this game coming up against Colorado, obviously they haven't beat the abs yet. Do we need to see the Canucks beat the abs before the playoffs, I feel like they have a chance against them if they are lucky enough to play them at some point in this postseason? - Sure, wouldn't be a bad idea. The problem is is that there's the abs. I think a lot of people expect the nights to be pretty good, depending on what happens with the players that are injured and they're roster. And then there's the Oilers. There's the Dallas Stars that nobody talks about that I think I bring up every week on this show and I apologize for that. It's just, yeah, okay, beat the abs, but there's just so much more there. But Colorado is really interesting because they finally address that number two center hole in a real significant way with Casey Middlestadt by making a bold move. And they're clearly, they're going for it. So are the Canucks and so are all those other teams I mentioned, the West, it's just so interesting. - How do you feel this nine game home stand there, Donnie? Feels like a chance for the fan base to really get on board and start to get the playoff flags out once the sun comes out this weekend. It feels like a really good prequel to the postseason. - That's a great point. And the thing is the second longest home stand in team history, but that's a great point about the weather. So you've got all these games at home in a row, virtually unprecedented in March when the weather's going to starting to turn. And that's one of the strange things about hockey in Vancouver is that when you talk about playoff hockey, people in this part of the world, in this city in Canada, they don't associate ice cold and rain with playoff hockey. It's more about, and let's hope it happens, it is supposed to happen later in the week, it's more about warmer weather, the sunshine, and the parties and playoff hockey. So yeah, and they have to play well first, but that's a great point about the weather turning and them having a long home stand and just that feel that playoff hockey is just around the corner. A lot of people looking forward to it. - Yeah, I mean, we haven't seen playoff hockey almost in almost a decade in these parts, right? I mean, it's been forever. And, you know, as far as, you know, the trade deadlines come and past, right? And, you know, coming into the season, it's really interesting how many existential questions we had about the Canucks won, how good are they going to be? Is their plan going to make any sense? You know, the trade for heroinic last year won some games down the stretch. Was that going to be worth it this year? What's going to happen with Elias Pedersen? Well, I mean, they've answered all of these kind of questions with flying colors, not Pedersen signed to an eight year contract. And I know, you know, this year still matters, but it's really remarkable to me that even though we're not at the end of the season, this year already seems like a big win in terms of direction with the team, getting their star guy signed long-term. And I'm not saying, you know, first of all, an exit, it's going to be acceptable, I'm not. But I'm just saying, it's really interesting how far we've come in the, what, seven, eight months since the off season, and how we view this team not only this year, but for the long-term future now. - No, it really is, and it's happened so quickly that for anybody that's followed this team for a long time, it's hard to believe. It just seems that there's a real focus with this organization as much as we do, you know, all of us, you know, criticize it. There's a focus with the organization. I think a real confidence in this organization amongst the fan base that hasn't been there for a long, long time. Have they, have there been, you know, down periods? I'm sure I guess, and, you know, the question marks around that tough February, and maybe the decision to, you know, start Denko, possibly too much, but yeah, it's happened quickly, sat, and it does seem to be a whole lot of confidence in the organization, but again, I wonder what it will be like in the post-season, because I just don't know what's going to happen, I mentioned all those teams in the West, and I think there's a lot of teams in the West feeling that way. So it'll be interesting to see what happens depending on like, will it still be there after a second round playoff exit? Like, would it still be there after two rounds? Like, I don't know, I don't really know at this point, but it has move very quickly. - You know, I know Quinn Hughes has been the favorite for the Norris for pretty much all season long, but I'm watching him on Saturday in that first period against Winnipeg, Donnie, and it's just like, it feels like Kale McCar should have to do a lot to overtake Quinn Hughes at this point for the Norris trophy. I mean, he's just been unbelievable. And lately, his game has even gone to yet another level. - Yeah, just the moves he makes, the way he uses his edges and the way he escapes. And I think as much as anything is, I just love his work along the opposition to the line. And the passes he makes that are pinpoint with distance and accuracy. It's just a crispness. It's just amazing and the moves he makes at the blue line. I just love that because there's that element of danger there. No coach wants a turnover. No coach especially wants a turnover at the opposition blue line, because everybody's caught deep. And it's just marvelous to watch. When's the last time anybody you know? And maybe this conversation changes when the playoffs come around. But who mentions Quinn Hughes' size now or lack thereof? Nobody talks about it anymore because he's just so damn good. He has the puck all the time. That's a pretty good defense. He's not only one of the best players in Connect's history, one of the best players in the league right now. And he team would just love to have him. It's just a pleasure to watch. - The final one I got for you is on the input Colson. And you know what his game is looking like. I thought he was one of the better forwards again against Winnipeg Jets. And it looks like we're finally seeing him play fast, play with confidence, but also use that frame of his. And I'm not saying he's this big rough and tumble guy that's gonna be knocking guys over and fighting guys, but he can play with a lot of force. And if he can bring that to the lineup, then that would be a really nice welcome addition. - Every time I hear Rick talk and talk about him or you're not the third anybody involved with the Kodak organization, they say something that is said of every player who's, it seems that every player who's close gets this said about him. He's got to move his feet. And the last two games, each game he's had five hits. And to me that tells me he's moving his feet, not reaching, not taking penalties, going right through a player's logo. And I think that's a rule that that stat for him, I think is really important. Obviously goals and assists are important. But I think that hit stat with that frame and that willingness to keep his feet moving and the awareness that he's got to keep his feet moving, I just think that's really, really important. You tend to notice bigger guys and he is, he is thick, he is bad in a good way. He is big, you tend to notice them when they're not moving their feet, but you also notice them when they are and when they're hitting people and he's doing that right now. That's something we didn't see from him on a consistent basis. But I thought these last two games, he took his NHL game to another level and has a lot to do with that hit stat. - Donnie, we appreciate the time as always. Thanks for this. - Outstanding always fun guys, thanks so much. - There he is, the great legend Don Taylor. Joining us on the dispatch plumbing, hitting and air conditioning hotline, the first call, the only call. Pod Colson, looking pretty good. - He has, he's looked really good. He's been on the Neil's Hoglander plan. - Yes. - You know, and Hoglander right now is really staking a real claim to remaining in the top six and playing the way he's been. And the way football's shattered, he was really good. He was really good. And the thing that's impressed me the past few games is defensively too. You know, like he's been in the right spot. There was one sequence in the third period against the Winnipeg Jets. And Suter made a play along the wall. And if Hoglander had blown the zone, he would have received the pass in the neutral zone and could have been off to a bit of a chance or two on one or at least a rush opportunity of some sort. But he doesn't get there because he's staying patient, protecting the middle and waiting for that pass to come across, right? Before he would be too eager to jump out, small little play, right? And yes, you're missing the chance perhaps to get the puck and go the other way. But guess what, you're not given up. And that's a great chance going the other way. Or being there for your teammate, being there for support. And also understanding game situations. - Yeah. - It's better for us to be protective here than, you know, be overly ambitious, play as smart. And I do think his recognition on small things like that are very positive. And to me, that's going to be his key for him to stay with Pedersen on that line is those types of things. 'Cause scoring has always been there this year. The, you know, the four checking and the chance generation's been there. It's been more about can they trust them to do things. And that's been a real positive 'cause they already feel pretty confident in terms of trusting Oakland. I mean, put Colson in those situations 'cause of the maturity in this game. And to see both guys kind of get that early on right now is very positive. - On pod Colson, I do feel his offensive reads are still a touch slow at times. And there's some work you can do there and maybe just getting a little bit more comfortable with his line mates and building a little bit of chemistry on the offensive end. That can still grow a little bit. But Saturday, his defensive IQ and his defensive awareness really popped for me. And like there was numerous shifts where, you know, he ended up having to be the low forward in the defensive zone and essentially be, you know, man in the slot while Lynn Holm and Garland were the guys up top covering the point and he did well. You know, he's always engaged defensively, always scanning the things you love to see. And it's a real testament to the work they're doing in Abbotford with some of these players, the way that they're getting them to play. I did want to address the text from one of our listeners. Frank's Air Valley Reach said, "The Sharks were calling teams on Barabano saying take this guy for free and referencing that I mentioned in the last couple of weeks, last little while that Barabano of is a guy that I kind of like as a player and I think would be a good cheap bet if you were bargain shopping at the deadline." I'm not disputing what Frank said. I actually probably think that is a real scenario that could have played out. The Sharks trying to get rid of Barabano of, but realistically, unless they retained 50%, they probably weren't getting rid of a $2.5 million cap hit for a guy who scored three goals this year. It has been a depth forward. Once they retained half on hurdle, they had used all of their three retention slots, so the Sharks couldn't retain, which means, yeah, they were probably trying to give guys a way for free and couldn't do it because no team, contending teams, generally didn't have cap space to take on salary. - The asset they were going to get was going to be for the retention. - Yes. - So if they would have got a fifth or a sixth or something, it would have been because they're retaining half the salary. But you're right, and I think that was something that got in the way for him. Otherwise, he probably would have found a home. - Yeah. - And could have Vancouver have been interested? Had they retained, we knew Vancouver at some point had at least looked at Barabano, right? Now, how great was that interest? Was it enough to try to facilitate a third team? Like we mentioned though, on deadline day, the price to get a team to facilitate a trade went up, or at least, teams are holding-- - To be a third party retention team was costing a little bit more than it was earlier in trade season. - And I don't think the Canucks had the appetite to pay a third or maybe even a fourth for that type of player, where they're like, is he moving the needle enough? Again, you mentioned three goals. Would you like to have them if you paid six or perhaps a future fifth or something? Yeah, perhaps, right? To give you some added depth or whatever. But once that price got to a bit of a higher pick, it just doesn't make sense. He hasn't played well enough. - No. - He may not even break the lineup with the one the Canucks have right now. Is he beating out? Even PDG US goals and back to back? - No, you may as well just have like, pod coals in or field digits up, and that's the thing about it. I still think he could be a bargain option in free agency this summer. He scored 47 points last year, 15 goals. But retention, ultimately, the Canucks stayed quiet on deadline day, mostly because getting a third team to retain ended up being more costly than they were comfortable paying. - We spoke to Patrick Alveen, and if you missed the interview, you can go back and check it on the podcast. But he was very disappointed. They weren't able to make a move. And not just a depth stuff. Like they were trying to add a top six forward. Like I do think at some point, they thought they were very close to getting to Foley. You know, once they couldn't get gensole, they focused in on to Foley. I thought they felt like they had a good chance at getting him. And they were probably disappointed. Obviously they didn't kind of come together at the very end. You know, somebody mentioned we talked about, you know, a depth defenseman. To me, the thing I would have liked to see, and I get getting a top six guys tough. I wasn't even too worried about the forward. Unless you can get like this gritty forward or something with some size. I wasn't too worried about the depth for that. You can always add it. For me, it's more about, I think the Canucks have a really nice decor up to seven. - Yeah. - To Noah Juleson. - Mm-hmm. - Once you get past Noah Juleson, to me, it's a big fall. Now it is for most teams. You know, I'm not saying something that's not a big surprise. I do think the progress for their young defenseman in Abbasford this year, hasn't quite been as good as they had hoped. Now, that doesn't mean they won't figure it out, or they don't have promise. We always mention progress is not always linear. Development is not linear. They're ups and downs, peaks and valleys. As players, you know, learn to be professionals in everything. And I think that's part of it from McCord and Herosse, both have had injuries too, right? I don't think Jet Wu's at a place where his game's, you know, reliable enough to feel good in the NHL, at least in a big spot in the playoffs. Well, that has been injured in and out. Matt Irwin, I think what he's done is provide some leadership, but I don't think his game is really shown to be at the caliber where you feel like he can be an option here too. So I worry that if they have to go too deep, when injuries happen, that I don't feel good about Freedmen. So I had hope they were able to get another defenseman to upgrade on Freedmen. Obviously, they weren't able to pull that off either. Chad Rui, who I think is a guy they looked at, but ultimately goes to the Rangers for a fourth round pick. That's one of my biggest advice was, 'cause I do think they have some concern if they hit some defensive injuries, and they weren't able to, you know, add a bit more depth in that regard. Yeah, you're kind of hoping Guillaume Breasbua finds his stride here. You know, he did look pretty good in some of the games he played earlier in the season. Even going back to the last season, it looked like he was starting to take some strides as a player, but obviously has been out with injury for most of this year. We'll get to more of your texts. There's a really good one for Tony and Van that we'll get to a little bit later on in the show. Also, Mike Stevens is joining us winners and losers, a little bit of the trade deadline, and that sort of thing plus his take on the Vancouver Canucks. It is Canucks Central. (upbeat music) Back in on Canucks Central, it's Dan Richo, and Satyar Shah. Canucks have a light week on the schedule. Just play in the avalanche on Wednesday here at Roger Serena, and then in our next game after that Saturday. So some days off for a team that's been among the busiest in the National Hockey League this season. Let's go back to the dispatch plumbing, heating and air conditioning hotline. We welcome in our next guest from NHL Network and the co-hosts of the Staff and Graph podcast that is Mike Stevens. Thanks for this, Mike. How are you? - I'm doing well. How are you guys? - We're doing pretty well as things would have it, the Canucks first in the Pacific Division. But of course, everybody a little bit uneasy about the Thatcher-Demko injury. Now, early speculation on the timeline is two to four weeks, maybe a month, it looks to be a lower body injury, but as we've kind of talked about earlier in the show, the Canucks don't profile as a team that relies a ton on Thatcher-Demko in the way that they used to in years past. - Yeah, maybe not as much in years past, but I mean, he's one of the straws that stirs the drink. I mean, Thatcher don't go, you know, anything that has a, I would say just a world-class goaltender like Demko, and he was, you know, coming in as a vesna candidate for most of the season, you know, it is a big loss. And it's gonna be a big test as well. This is a team that has been playing phenomenally this year above a lot of people's expectations, that's for sure. But they definitely, you know, they've been on a bit of a PDO bender, as they like to say, you know, they've been benefiting from some great shooting lock and all that, not to say, not to take anything away from the team, obviously they've been playing phenomenal hockey. But a lot of, you know, in due to the fact that they have, you know, a very, very good goaltender, one that they can really rely on and allow, you know, any lapses he can kind of clean up. And, you know, now that he's, now that he's gonna be out for somewhat of an extended period of time, you know, this will be a great test for them to see, you know, all right, can we take ourselves up the bootstraps? Can we, you know, can we sort of pull together and show that, you know, we are capable of riding without our all-star goalie? And if they're able to do that, I mean, the, you know, I think the conversation goes even more to the fact that the Canucks are legit contender. - Yeah, I think, I mean, come post-season, if they don't have Dr. Demko, even if they play fantastic as a team at his highest level, it really takes away a lot of their, you know, high-end talent and in terms of being able to go on that deep run and perhaps even get to the Cup final. But in terms of what they have as a group, and let's just say perhaps that Demko's ready to go in the post-season, how do you think the Canucks stack up in the Western Conference at full health compared to the other top teams, especially after some of them loaded up at the trade deadline? - Yeah, like I was gonna say, hey, they're looking really good based on the fact that everyone's firing it on all cylinders right now and they really haven't gotten the best out of the least win home since that trade. So they're still in the level that he could hit. You know, and then Vegas goes and they build the Harlem Globetrotters somehow, you know, in the middle of the, like it's being able to add, you know, Thomas Hurlill, Noah Hanifen, you know, Anthony Mantha all in one trade deadline and it is just unbelievable. And so, yeah, look, there will definitely be something of a, I would say, coming together time or an acclimation period for you guys like Hurlill and even Stone, who's out of the lineup as well, to come back during the postseason, maybe they won't, you know, hit the ground running, but this is an insanely deep team. A team with so much depth in the Canucks, they have, look, they have depth, like they wouldn't be where they are if they weren't able to get contributions from up and down their lineup at all, pretty much all three position groups, but man, it is tough to see anyone taking down Vegas right now. If everyone is back healthy, if they all play to sort of the, you know, if they all played to their top potential, I mean, Vegas is the team to beat and we saw last season, like I was, you know, on hand to cover the Cup final in Vegas in Florida last year. And the thing that stood out to me, yes, they had an incredible forward group. You know, Mark Stone, Elevated, Jack Eichl, really showed that he is that superstar, that he's always been, but their blue line was just unbelievable. Like, they basically have rolled three pairs regardless of the situation, you know, all three pairs could basically play 20 minutes a night and they were, they were set and they added no a hand up into that group. So it's, it's tough. I mean, if there's any, I think the Canucks can really go toe to toe, you know, with, with any team out there right now, but Vegas seems to be in a class with zone. - My only question with Vegas is, do they have too much to have to integrate and get it all right in the postseason for them to really, and that's the thing, right? Like, I mean, we know that Mark Stone could probably return in four months and play in a Cup final, whatever, and still look okay 'cause you showed it last year, right? So I'm not worried about him necessarily, but tomorrow's hurdle has barely played and now he's gonna come back and new team and everything. How is he gonna fit in adding Hanifin? When Martinez gets healthy too, there are a lot of moving parts. My only question is, do they have too many big pieces to be able to get it all clicking together in times to have success in the playoffs? - You know, that's a really good question and it's a legitimate concern because I mean, you know, I cover the Leafs and I saw it through the last season, they, they loaded up big at the deadline. They, you know, they got Ryan O'Reilly, you know, O'chari, Luke Shen, Eric Gustason, Jake McCabe. That's, those are a lot of huge pieces, a lot. Like, you know, I don't think they're at the level of the Hanifins and the hurdles or anything, but those are huge foundational pieces they brought in and it was, it was really difficult for everyone to get chemistry sort of towards down that stretch and into the playoffs. Like, they were a disjointed team because they added so many pieces to the deadline. They had nine NHL caliber, caliber defensemen, which forced them to go 11 and seven and no one could develop chemistry with each other. And the same upfront, it's like they're, it was tough. So there is something to be said when it comes to, yeah, team on paper, they added a ton of big names and it's great, but there is, there really is sort of a, I don't know, like do you like the playoffs runs on vibes and you really do have to sort of meld together as a team and I wonder, you know, hurdles good. They say hurdles is likely going to come back or has the potential to come back before the playoffs start. That's great, but like what? They're going to be two or three games before the playoffs hit and then he's going to be coming back and you know, who knows, like Vegas will probably rest on you guys, game 82, if they're already in, like how much of an actual game situation is that going to be? So it's a really good question. Like I honestly, I don't know, if any team though is able to integrate players into their system like that, if any team is able to sort of be able to run an acclimation process mid-season, it is Vegas. They're used to adding guys. They, that's basically all they've done as they're in their existence as a franchise is shuffle guys in and shuffle guys out and they all need to play together really well and you know, perform better than some other parts. And if any team you do, it's Vegas, but that is a legit concern and that might be the Canucks edge if they ever meet them there. - Yeah, team bonding night on the strip. You guys figure it out before the playoffs, you know? - It's pretty easy out there, like team bonding. - It's, it is interesting though. I mean, with the way the playoffs could shake out here in the Western Conference, I don't see anybody taking over the Canucks in the Pacific Division and even with the Demco injury, it's a 10-point gap that they've got now on the Oilers who still have three games in hand, but 10 points with less than 20 games to go. I mean, that, that feels like a bit of a chasm for the Edmonton Oilers to overcome and they've got a ton of back-to-backs, a really heavy schedule the Oilers do. But your prize for winning the Pacific or winning the Central might be, hey, here's the Vegas Golden Knights in round one because they might end up as a wild card now, Mike. - Yeah, look, that's the way it goes. Like again, I bring it to my, you know, my time covering the Leafs in that, you know, they get home with advantage, it's great. They finally are able to do that and they feel Tampa, two years in a row, you know? So it happens, like, that's the thing with this playoff format is that you, you know, you could end up with a cakewalk in the first round regardless of what seed you are. Or if you're a top seed, you could end up with a team that, you know, is just putting it together towards the stretch. And it's really tough. But hey, look, that might be, that might be the, if they're able to conquer Vegas, they're able to sort of catch them off guard, catch them at the first step of that, like we said, acclimation process where maybe some of the new guys hadn't quite adjusted yet, then man, do you think about the confidence boost that gives a team? A team that, you know, is somewhat as unbattled tested as the Canucks 'cause I mean, this is a relatively new scenario for this core is, you know, top seed, you know, home ice advantage, all that. You're able to knock out the Vegas with Knights, a team that everyone is sort of all like crowning already is back to back jams from the first round. I don't know about you, but it could be a, it could be a scenario where they do what the Panthers did except the Panthers weren't the number one seed. - So you could tell me if my Vancouver bias is showing a little bit here with this next statement. Quinn Hughes is the clear favorite for the Norris trophy. Is he that much further ahead than Kale McCar or anybody else? - I think he is the favorite. Like, and I'm coming in here with my Eastern bias, you know? So I think we're united on that front. I think that Quinn Hughes is the favorite. He's being unbelievable. Like, he was already very good. And then he took a step like this season that is just, as put him into the stratosphere. But I don't know if it's run away yet. I don't know yet, but like, Kale McCar is, he's doing a ton of things. He's, you know, he's able to play the penalty kill, which is a big sort of differentiator, I think. But, but Quinn Hughes, man, he is, this, this should be his year. Like, unless McCar really turns it up and makes it even more kind of interesting, then maybe there's an argument. But look, what Hughes is doing this year, offensively, defensively, you know, in a year where he took over the captaincy, like it just goes to show like mentalities. He's, he's got the kids that he's locked in, you know? So I think, I don't know if it's a clear favorite. Like, I don't think we can sort of wipe our hands of any of the other contenders that are coming up here because there's still a little bit of a wrong way to go. And, you know, there's, you know, it's not as quite of a, I would say a favorite situation, but man, he is, he's leading the pop, that's for sure. - Well, since we're talking about the hardware stuff, the hard trophy, I mean, Austin Matthews has had a pedestrian past 10 games, only scoring five goals. I mean, that's the type of goal scoring he's had, that five and 10 seems like a cold streak for him. But there's a bigger gap now, all of a sudden, I think in the hard conversation with how Nathan McKinnon's playing. And, you know, they're here in Vancouver tomorrow and they got us some help on the deadline. To me, he's my favorite to win the hard trophy. How do you kind of see the hard trophy race right now? - Well, what I want to say is, and I don't want my Eastern bias to come in here. So I will be as objective as humanly pop, but look, Nathan McKinnon is having an unbelievable season. You know, pretty much like he is showing that he is one of the two three best players in the entire league, if he hadn't already, he's taking this bad team in Colorado and he is bringing them to new heights. And I know it's crazy to say for a team that has, you know, three guys who are making over $10 million and next year it'll be four. But I really do think that when it comes to the heart, it's most valuable player. And awesome after you, last time I checked, he had close to 40 goals. I think it's like 39 to this point where his goals would either bring the Leafs within one, tie the game, or put them ahead. And I mean, that's the definition of a guy who is dragging his team forward. Like, I'm not a sign of the Leafs as a lot of people in this market are. I think they're operating somewhat like a paper tiger and although, or a house of cards, or however you want to call it. And what Matthews is doing, I can't tell you how many games you know, you sit down and you watch and it's just a slog and everyone looks like they're skating through concrete and it's a, you know, a one, one, one game or the Leafs are down one, whatever. Matthews just rips off two goals in the second period and that's the difference right there. And that's a hard trophy front runner to me as a guy who's on pace to score seven goals, maybe 75. And basically is the engine that drives this team. It's Matthews, they didn't have Matthews this year. I would, like the Leafs I think would be, I don't want to say they'd be a lottery team, they definitely wouldn't, but they'd be close. Like it's being tough with the goal tending, going back and forth, you know, with Marner, you know, going back and forth a little bit with Tavares' dip, like Matthews has taken this team and really pulled them up by their bootstraps. And if you look at the amount of injuries they've had and everything like that, McKinnon, he's a phenomenal player. And if you told me that he won the hard trophy today, I wouldn't, I wouldn't bad night. I would say that's, that's awesome. But Matthews, I think, and again, I know it's crazy to say given the salaries that have been paid to Toronto, but I think he does a little bit more and a little bit less. - Yeah, and I don't know if I necessarily agree on that because McKinnon, I mean, we've seen Jared Bednar run McKinnon hot for so much of this season. It's almost as if Bednar just didn't trust his bottom six for a lot of this year. And you know, that's where I think Colorado's deadline comes in and that like they were active because they needed to be active, right? The way their coach was deploying that roster, he just felt like he didn't have a lot of guys he could trust. So he didn't have a lot of horses beyond his top guys. And they went out and they tried to solve some of that. And that's why I think they had probably the best deadline maybe outside of Vegas. - Oh yeah, well, they basically upgraded every position. I mean, they already had, they didn't really do much on the old timing. I mean, like they, Ryan Johansson was reported that there was legit friction in that locker room and he just, he lost favor like right away there basically. So he wasn't getting it done. There were a lot of the guys and like you said in that bottom six that just, you know, Bednar did not trust and they go out and they get, you know, they get middle stat, do Haim and Trenen. And that solves a lot of problems. And then even on the back end, going out and getting Sean Walker, paying that first, but still, and then in the process, being able to get rid of Johansson. I mean, it's a remarkable deadline for what they're able to do. If it wasn't, like I said, if it wasn't for Vegas, getting Thomas Hurdle for like 10 years on the dollar, the way that they did, I don't know how they convinced my career into that trade, it's absurd. But if it wasn't for that, like I would say, Colorado's a clear winner here because they basically reinforced every positional sort of weakness that they had and they were already a pretty darn good team to begin with. So look, if Vegas, like we said, Stumbles out of the gate, Colorado, they're quite, they're up there. - Yeah, and that Central Division race, those three teams are almost in a dead heat for the top spot. It's the best race out of all the divisions at the top three 'cause all three could still win the division. But the only real compelling race for me is in the Eastern Conference for the playoff spot. 'Cause we know in the West, it's all, but, I mean, it's all done, essentially, unless Vegas falls apart, I mean, Nashville's one, eight of the last 10, so they don't have a regulation loss in what 11 games or whatever it is. So, I mean, they've really solidified their spot, but who do you think ultimately gets in to the postseason? 'Cause the Islanders knocked out the Red Wings last night, so they kind of look like they're teetering here, losing five in a row. How do you see the playoff picture shaking out in the East? - I think the Islanders are gonna go pull it out. Like, I would not have said that even when after Patrick Watt took over. But, I mean, man, he is, there's something, there's something to be said about, you know, a guy, I would say sort of like a big name boisterous guy coming in and sort of corralling that team, 'cause they look like someone, you know, they used to have this identity, right? The Islanders, they were the team that, you know, you hated to play against, and especially in playoff type hockey, because it was just grind, grind, grind. They were like the devils of the 2000s, except they, you know, it was sort of fast forward to our crazy offensive era that we're in right now, 'cause they were able to sort of stymie everybody. I don't know if you remember the bubble series between them and Tampa, but if you want to stop watching hockey altogether, like it was crazy. And yeah, they lost, I mean, obviously it's not a shock that when Barry Tropp left, they really did lose that identity. And they were floating around in the team without an identity. They weren't good enough defensively to be the sort of trapped, you know, all-of-work defensive team. And they definitely didn't have the juice up front. They definitely didn't have the sauce to sort of pull it together as an offensive team. Yeah, Watt comes in and really galvanized everybody. I mean, Matt Barzal is different, though, Horvat looks different. Everyone's sort of pulling together. I think the Islanders, and especially, like we said, with Demko, if you have a world-class goalie, you can really do anything. And all possibilities are endless and you are surrounded as a world-class goalie. So you add all that together. This is a team that looks like they like playing for their coach. They're hitting their stride at the right time. I think they pull it out. Like you said, Detroit has fallen. Pittsburgh is basically completely out of the race at this point. And even, like, they're looking, they should tank for celebrating at this point. Like it's bad. So I think the Islanders are pulling it out. Mike, we appreciate the time as always. Thanks so much for this. Oh, thanks for having me, guys, anytime. There is Mike Stevens, NHL Network and Staff and Graph podcast. Yeah, great stuff for Mike. A lot of fun, man. And, you know, on the Eastern Conference playoff race, it's fascinating because a couple weeks ago, we were talking about it looks like the playoff races are set. Yeah, more or less. Maybe Philly falls out, but Philly just keeps finding a way to stay in it. And I know they're in somewhat trouble right now, too, with how they've played. But the Red Wings decided to lose five games in a row at the exact worst time possible. Because that's essentially sunk all the ground they made up and the positioning they had in the playoffs. I mean, they did not look like a team that was going to fall out two weeks ago. And it shows you how a five-game stretch can really turn your season around for the worst if you have it at the wrong time. And it looks like they're in a lot of trouble right now. I don't feel very confident about the Red Wings. Yeah. Islanders won six in a row where Red Wings have lost five in a row. And there's your difference, right? That's a 10-point swing in a matter of a couple weeks between those two streaks happening at the same time. And yeah, the Red Wings don't no longer control their own destiny. Yeah. And that's crazy from where they've been most of this year and how they got hot around the time that they were playing Vancouver. It's interesting that it's played out this way. But the Red Wings, they still lack a little bit of a-- I don't think they play the best game. Defensively, they're not that great. They have some good pieces. But their defense core was kind of put together by paper mache with all the free agent signings they made in the summer. And it just doesn't really go well together. And I think that's what you're kind of seeing with Detroit's up-and-down defensive game all season long. Whereas the Islanders, new coach comes in, all of a sudden, they're getting a little bit more. I don't know if it's buy-in, that's the right word. I haven't watched enough of the Patrick Wai Islanders to know exactly how much they've changed in terms of what they do. But you do a quick look at the numbers. And they're a completely different team from what they were before Patrick Wai showed up. Yeah, they've been far better in terms of their overall team play. But also, they were one of those teams that their underlying numbers weren't horrible. But they had some good things going for them, right? Especially because they have a legit top line with Bar Zal the way he's been going, especially with Bo. He's been getting caught as well lately. And that's really helped him get back into this spot. And just on the Red Wings quickly too, though, I understood. And especially now when we see the discussions around Phillip Pironic, they already have Maurice Sider who's going to get a massive contract as off-season, right? And I can get it. He's that Sider, Hironic may not be on their first unit power play because of that. And really, is he an $8 million plus defense man, if that's what he's what he's asking for? So I understand-- the more I see now, I can understand perhaps why they wanted to make the move. But what I don't understand is why they made that move, and then spent all that caps based on Justin Hall and Shane Gosses-Bear. And Justin Hall has been such a poor fit. There were rumblings of the deadline that were trying to move them. Trying to just get rid of them. So it's like, I can understand why you made the Hironic trade, right? Big picture and everything. But I don't understand the moves you made on your blue line to make it better. Because they're worse. They got worse on the blue line with the off-season they had. And they had ample cap space as well, right? So I think Shannon has done-- I mean, Eisenman's done a lot of great things, right? Yeah. Not development has been as good as they had hoped. They have a lot of guys still waiting to break through. The additions they made up front have worked. The defense doesn't quite look good. I mean, how many more years before they turn it around and how many years before people start asking questions, is Eisenman really right for this job? If they missed the playoffs, I'm not saying Eisenman gets fired. That's going to be a real tough year for him in his standing, doesn't it? It has to be. With the amount they've spent, not just in this free agency, but even going back to last free agency when they got Andrew Cop and some other players. They wasn't just on defense that they spent money. They JT Confer, David Perron, they've been spending money in free agency for the last couple of years. He had to bring out, give him a lot of money. Gave to bring out a lot of money, spent some draft capital there. In one way, I could understand why they haven't had a ton of prospects really come through as much as they've been a lottery team for a while. They haven't had any lottery luck. And you can blame some of that on Ken Holland for taking Zadino over Queen Hughes. We've been over that conversation over a time, Zadina. Really profiled as a high end prospect at the time, but it was still strange that they passed on Queen Hughes, who they would have known from being in their backyard so much. It's a really weird build for a team that's been as bad as they have for as long as they have. Yeah, it has been. And do they have enough high end? Yeah. They have Larkin, of course. But Cider's the only guy so far. Now, again, they have guys they've drafted over the years, and maybe Lucas Raymond finds that other gear and becomes a star. But so far, the only high franchise caliber talent they've been able to draft is Morit Cider. Yeah. Larkin was there before. Yeah, Eiserman got there, right? And this is where the Canucks, as much as they didn't get lottery luck, they at least nailed the fifth overall pick on Pedersen, and they nailed the seventh overall pick on Queen Hughes, right? And that made the difference. They don't hit those two picks. Maybe we're having the same conversation right now about where the Canucks are at compared to where the Red Wings are at, right? So lottery luck is a part of it. But you also have to make the best of what you have. And that's something that they're still trying to really figure out there as an organization. Did want to get a couple of texts in before we hit the break. How is Hughes not a clear runaway for the Norris? Way more points. Plus, minus possession time. Get this guy off the radar referring to Mike Stevens, who is just on with us. And I'd like to say that Quinn Hughes is the runaway over Kale Macar. That is my own personal feeling. But as far as points goes, I think their points per game are probably bang on the same amount. Macar's got 70 points in 60 games. Hughes has 76 points in 66 games. Honestly, to me, it's pretty much neck and neck. But I think Quinn, because he's been, I'd say, it's slightly more consistent offensively. And he hasn't been injured. Honestly, to me, that's the edge. There isn't a lot separating them. To me, the discussion isn't even so much about, you know, is Quinn Hughes better than Kale Macar? I think what Quinn Hughes is showing this year is that he can be in the same stratosphere as Kale Macar. He spoke about how Macar's in a stratosphere of his own. He's in rarefied air that no matter how good Fox is, no matter how good high skin it is, no matter how good Quinn Hughes is, they don't quite operate on the same plane. Well, Quinn Hughes right now is operating on that same plane, right? And I think that's what's super impressive about it. And I would give him the edge right now for the Norris. I wonder if Roman Yossi is winning some votes with the way that he's played lately. I don't think-- - You'd have to. You'd have to, you mean, look at what he's done. He's been unbelievable lately. Are the three finalists at the moment, not Hughes, Macar, and Yossi? I think the way Yossi has come on lately certainly has him, at the very least, on finalist radar, or should have him on finalist radar. But I don't think you can discount Noah Dobson, who's had an unbelievable season as well, and Evan Bouchard. That's probably the consensus top thought. Yeah, I mean, I know you don't like Bouchard, but I mean, his points are gonna do a lot of the talking. I like Bouchard, actually. I think he's really good on the power play. He's a really good puck moving defenseman. Fantastic skill plays really well with the star players on that team. And defensively, when he's in his own zone, it's not too bad. I just don't think he's that caliber. Yeah, with his overall game, the impact he can have with his skating as well, 'cause I don't think his skating is plus or anything. He's really good. I just don't think he's Nora's caliber good. I'm just saying, that's probably the top five. I'm just saying. We'll see how the voting shakes out at the end of the day. But it looks like Yossi could be a finalist again this year with the way that he's come on towards the end of the year. Final one, Tony and Van. Reach, buddy. You're talking about Pod Colzen, like you're scared about it, affecting PDG out of the lineup. Pod's has NHL hands, body, and now has rebuilt his confidence. I'm sorry, Kuji. Our PDG is 13th, maybe 14th, which is amazing. Pod's will be in the middle six come playoff time. That's Tony and Van. Well, Kuji, I can't really disagree too much. If you listened to the show last week, I was actually taking heat on the weekend for saying, that Philadelphia Giuseppe probably comes out of the lineup once Dakota Joshua comes back. Calling you a traitor to your own people. I am. I am basically a traitor of my own Italian people. But I did want to bring this up because, well, Phil Giuseppe scored twice in back-to-back games. And two, that post-game interview on Saturday. I mean, is there any interview with PDG that's not great? And we know one thing too. He's no stool pigeon. He ain't no rat. He ain't no rat. He asked what he said himself, ain't no rat. We try to get him to give us an update on Thatcher Demko. Yeah. And he's like, I'm not a rat now. I'm Italian. I don't break that easily. It was so perfect. I killed over laughing and listening to that. Oh, man. Dan Riccio, Satyarsha. You're listening to Canucks Central.
