The Principal Liner Notes Podcast
Connected Conversation with Harmonee McCrea
Harmonee McCrea is an inspiring K-2 Principal who joins me for a connected conversation. She inspires with her leadership and her commitment to wellness. Tune in for insightful ideas for school leadership, fitness, and being grounded in well-being.
Follow Harmonee on X: https://x.com/mccreah10
- Broadcast on:
- 12 Oct 2024
- Audio Format:
- other
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Principal Liner Notes Podcast. This is Sean Gaylord here. I am so grateful as we are winding down or winding up the podcast that I have in these kind of next several final episodes. I've just got a great lineup of guests who have inspired me and that I've been connected to over the years and I am so grateful that kind of one of my leadership and workout inspirations is here and in this kind of final round and I'm so grateful to have just a great leader, a great principal and a great bandmate here, Harmony McCray, who is a K2 principal based out of Indiana and Harmony, I'm just going to keep rambling because, I got to stop rambling because I'm just so, I'm just grateful that you're here, my friend. I really am. Thank you. I'm completely humbled and honored to be here. I live in Indiana, but I serve in Michigan, so I'm right on the line, thank you for having me. That's right, geography is something that I struggle with, but yes, that's right, because I do know that the, and in fact, you're probably maybe the second or third leader out of Michigan that's been on the podcast because there is a strong Michigan principal contingent, so that's right. Apologies to the Memphis people and all of them, so yes, but we, you know, and probably the thing here is you are in two states. You live in one state and then you work in one state that both have a lot of music roots. There's a lot of music that has come out of Indiana, a lot of great music, famous music. You know, I'm talking about, you know, John Cougar, Mellencamp, you know, Indiana, you know, Michigan, you got Bob Seager, Motown, you know, the MC5, the list goes on. So you are in some deep music territory, my friend. You know what better than I do, but I did get to go to a Bob Seager concert and that was by far the best concert I've ever been to. Really? When did you see Seager? That's amazing. Probably. It was in Detroit five years ago, maybe. Wow. Oh, so that, man, that really must have been something because he's from Detroit if I'm not mistaken. That's home or. I'm not sure, but it was amazing. I mean, he's kind of up there, so it was an amazing concert. Yeah. Wow. What a, yeah, I have not seen Bob Seager, but I am a fan, you know, night moves, you know, feel the same, like a rock, like a rock is probably my favorite song it is. I heard that on a satellite radio the other day. So that is way, way cool, and that may have been five years ago was, that was probably his last tour because I think it was. Yeah. Maybe it's been longer than that now, but yeah, I think it was part of his last tour. Nice. So one of the things, Harmony, that I'm always curious about for principals, and I know that folks who are tuning in, you know, or, you know, on some level on their principal journey, but I'm curious because I don't know this part about you, your leadership journey, what compelled you to, to go from, from classroom to administration? Oh, gosh, so I was, I mean, I don't know how far back you want me to go, I was never even supposed to go to college. I didn't plan to go to college until I, until I tore my ACL, when I was a freshman. I played basketball and ran track and my dad was a big supporter of basketball. He loved basketball too, anyway, long story short, he allowed me to run cross country to get in shape for basketball, you know, so I could get back to playing. I ended up getting a running scholarship to go to a college, so I got to go to college. Became a teacher, was a teacher for 11 years, and as you know, probably you have to keep taking classes to keep your certification and all of that. The principal that I was working under at the time encouraged me to get, to go after something that would move me up, you know, if I ever decided to, so looked at a master's program in administration, never ever wanted to be a principal ever, until one day when I was in a staff meeting and I just, it was just a really negative atmosphere, and that's when I was like, okay, now I know that I can go be a principal and remind people why you're doing the work that you're doing. Still was thriving in the classroom, a loving teaching, wasn't ready to leave, but an opportunity opened up in Brunson, Michigan, and I threw my hat, or my name in the hat, just to get experience interviewing, and they ended up picking me, so, so I left the classroom on fire, went to a small K2 building in Brunson, and had the most amazing time, my first five years in principal ship at Anderson Elementary in Brunson, so really it was just sitting in a staff meeting that felt very negative, and I felt like I could, I could change that for a team if, if I got the opportunity, so that's when I decided. Wow, that's amazing, and as a teacher, because I know you've been, you are a principal of a K2 school, had you taught as a classroom teacher the K2 grades? Yeah, first, fourth, and second, most of my time was in second grade. Wow. Yeah, fun ages. They are, they are, and one of the things, and I learned this the hard way, because I've been, I am a K12 principal, so I've been principal on the high school level, mostly, most of my principal ship has been on the middle school level, and then for the last five years, I've been doing elementary, and I had a certain mindset of, of, of elementary when I first started. Now, I had taught elementary school, I had taught fifth grade, and, and I thought, well, when I first became an elementary principal, man, man, I'm going to be doing Legos and Makerspace, and, and I'm, I'm, you know, they're going to, I'll do storytime, and I'll get cupcakes, and, and I'll, I'll just walk around and make sure the lights are on, and I'll help teachers, and I'll be with kids, and I, I had this really warped, innocent view of the gig. Now, I will say, all of those things have happened in my elementary principal ships in some way, shape, or form, but by far, by far being an elementary school principal is the most challenging of all of my principal ship assignments, all of them, all of them, and, and it's a, and, and not in a bad way. It's just, it's a different kind of work. So, so I would ask just from your, your standpoint, what, what are those challenges that, that you have faced as, as a, as a K2, you know, principal and, and I'm sure there's a, there's a lens that you have that is pre-COVID and, and post-COVID we all do. Maybe that lens hasn't changed, but I'm just, I'm just curious, just, as from elementary principal to elementary principal. Well, first of all, say I'm shocked that elementary is the most challenging because I sit in admin meetings and listen to what my secondary colleagues are, are kind of dealing with, and I don't have that. So that's kind of a nice feeling, but I would say, challenges, I mean, my mind goes right to parents because those are their babies. They're very protective in those very early years, you know, where they're first experienced in school a lot of times. So just creating that trust and partnership between the parents and the teachers and keeping peace and, and that is, you know, helping that parents understand the end in mind is an independent learner, you know, a problem solver. So we're going to give them opportunities to experience those opportunities and they're going to be fine. So I would say, you know, parents on some level are probably part of the biggest challenge of elementary leadership. And then I would also say, at least in my current building, just creative cohes, creating cohesive systems, you know, we have some philosophical differences that we, we work through. So just having courageous conversations and, you know, once we're a decision is made, we're all all in and moving forward together cohesively and consistently. So those are some of the challenges I would say that I'm also working through right now. Well stated and so diplomatic because that whole statement there, we can unpack, I, but, but you're right, there, there are, there are folks, and I'll probably say at every level, but maybe more so the elementary when it comes to, you know, some of the curriculum pedagogical approaches, and we'll just leave it at that. We won't, I won't, I don't want to, you know, I won't, we can talk later about, you know, how you may be with a person that has this approach or this lens as opposed to whatever. And then, and then there is the challenge of getting everybody on board. So, so, so maybe, so how, what, what is your approach to that as, as a leader when there, there is a, there could be a, a philosophical difference to pedagogy or curriculum and, and then getting, getting to that, maybe not necessarily buy in because you, and I, because I've been in this situation where this is happening, you may not like what we have to do and you may not fully agree or you may not fully buy in, but I, but I like, I like the term cohesion because by buy in, you know, in change leadership, you know, is, is absolute. And, and, and I've learned that people do not always fully buy into what you're selling as a leader or, or what the district is mandating. And so, I'm, I'm very curious about how you move from there to cohesion. I, I, to me, it's just, it's, it's a very cook, organic term that, that you've met, that the way that you frame it. So I'm just curious, how do you get people to, to get to that level of cohesion, even though there may be philosophical differences because that, that can make or break us as a leader. Yeah, I, it's something I'm still working on, you're eight in my building, I'm still working on that, but last year, I was the worst year of my life. And this year I'm, I'm working to fix the areas that I wasn't able to, I don't necessarily word it. So looking at data, you see gaps, trends of different sorts. This year we're being very, very intentional about looking at the data, talking, having those data conversations, I'm getting support with that, you know, other eyes on it, lots of conversations, but honestly, I feel like it boils down to accountability, accountability for me as the leader, is it important to me, am I making it important to my staff? And then supporting up. So here's the decision that's been made checking in on it, or you know, how can I support you with it? Why is this important to us? How is this going to help them? You know, our end in mind is always student progress, student success. So really that is, that is my focus this year. And having courageous conversations, asking questions, help me understand why, you know, so I don't know if that makes any sense, but data, accountability conversations are the three things that kind of pop out in my head. We need cohesion, we need, we need to know what's working and what's not working. So we need to be systematic and consistent with, with our processes. So it's, it's work, it's going to be continued to work probably forever. Yeah, yeah, it, it, it, I think it, it requires all of those things and, and, but most especially a courageous conversation, which, which is, which is driven by, you know, strong relationships and, and listening to folks and, and, and I know, you know, and I know you're that kind of leader, you know, that is very relationship centered and, and relationship driven. And if you didn't care, if we didn't care, then we wouldn't make that step to have that courageous conversation, which is not always easy. It really is, it is not easy at all to, to, to do. I think the other thing I think that comes to cohesion, and I know that you, you like me value a good workout every now and then, and I, I am not a runner at all. I am not a runner, I've played basketball, I've run my set of laps, my, my knees are a little arthritic. So as, as I reach, as I am, you know, 54 and it's so beautiful to be in a conversation with somebody born in the same decade as me, so, you know, how do you do it, friend, how, how, you know, you, you, you, you, you are a journey woman, when it, when it comes to work out and be in a fit leader, I know that we use that hashtag a lot. Fit leaders are not to Ryan Jackson and, and that community that, that he has built. But when I look at the stuff that you do, as you put up the reps, the sets, the burpees and I'm like, oh my, I, I, I mean, I can burp, but I can't burp be, you know, and then you're doing like three, three sets of like, you got a whole circuit that you do in your home gym, like I, I, I got to get out there. I, I got to get some personal training from your friend. Oh gosh, I, I just know what I could be and want to be. And so I, I've always, I don't mean this disrespectfully. I just, I never want to be a heavy set administrator. I want to be, you know, I want to take care of myself. I want, I want people to see me and like know that I work hard and my health is important to me. It's just something honestly I'm passionate about, it comes easy, like running is, it's just easy for me. So people who it doesn't come easy to that gut it out work far harder than I do and inspire me. But yeah, I just, I feel like my body responds quickly. I can see a change, the change and then the way if I feel, I feel more confident, which helps my leadership, so it's just a win win when I'm consistent, which isn't always. So how, how do you battle through the, the consistency war? I know I do too. And, and I, you know, my, my, how I get through consistency and I post and I hold myself accountable because the, the, the alternative for me isn't pleasant, having had a health, and I don't want to go, I don't want to go back down that, that route again. So, so how do you, how do you push through consistency? I'm really good at mapping it all out every single week and then not making it happen. You know what I mean? But I think as I'm getting older, I, I think I've, I've always been really like, you have to do this many reps or you have to work out and run, you can't just do one or the other, you have to run at least five miles, you can't just run three, like, so that's something internally I battle to, like it's never enough. So as I'm getting older, I'm trying to, you know, some is better than none and try to be more consistent that way, 20 minutes is better than no minutes where before you, you should work out for at least an hour, you know, that kind of thing, but being part of a connected network, like, you know, Fit Leaders, seeing people show up every single day, like you is four o'clock, he's up, it's, it's helpful, like, harm, you can get, you can get back on it to go. So I guess that's, that's how I do it. I hear you and, and yeah, because I, it's funny because the same reaction when, when, when you shared, he's up at four, I look at you and I'm like, because you'll do just did a quick three and I'm like, how do you, you know, and then, and then you go, I did a quick three, but, you know, hey, I did something, you know, so, and I'm like, man, I can't even do a quick one and, and, or a quick point five, so I just, I, and you sometimes will share your, your circuit and you're in that, that kind of beautiful, you know, kind of space, you're, you're in a rural area of, of, of Indiana and, and, and the sun and I see the horizon and I'm like, oh my God, a three or, or then you'll, you'll, I, I did seven. How can you do this? How does this happen? You know, I just, I'm, I'm blown blown away by that. When you run, do you, do you listen to music? Do you listen to pop? Do you listen to my pocket? No, but what's, what's, what's, what's your soundtrack? What's your workout soundtrack? Usually it's music. I listen to the 80s, 80s, that's a lot of times, or I've put together like a run playlist of more recent music, but sometimes it's books, but it kind of just depends on my, like, my mood or my temperament, like what's on my mind because sometimes like, what's on my mind actually as a barrier to getting in the gym or getting, you know, going for a run, like, I, I'm just not in a mental space, which is kind of odd to say because usually you resort to running or working out to like work through it, but you know, sometimes I just, I just can't get there. So yeah, it kind of depends on my temperament, but a lot of times it's the 80s, 80s hits. What, what's that 80s hit that, that gets you through, you know, and I, I don't know if, you know, the terrain, I'm sure you have some, some hard terrain that you're right on or run on. What's that 80s hit that gets you that, okay, come on, harm, come on, and you put it on, I mean, you put on that def leopard, you put on that Duran Duran, what's that song that gets you to that next level, or that, or gets you over that hump when you're running? That's a really hard question. I don't know if I can answer, like, journey comes to mind right now. Yeah, I feel like I'm, I hear journey songs a lot. But honestly, too, like, I listen to Christian music as well. So a lot of times, you know, I feel like God is playing the right song at the right time to, to battle on so. Yes, yes, we can't, yeah, I'm with you there. You know, there is, there is something about, there is a spiritual nature to working out, and, and, and there is, I mean, I would be remiss if I didn't mention that, you know, in my workout routine, you know, that there is, there is a little bit of, there is a little bit of prayer, there is a little bit of, of, of, you know, remembering our why and remembering our purpose. And so I, I, on occasion, we'll, we'll put in a, there's a, there's a song, there's a couple of songs out because I listened to a couple of gospel songs. Well, Oh Happy Day by the Edwin Hawkins, singers, Carlos Santana, the great, the great guitarist did a beautiful album of that was, and he's very, he's very spiritual. And he, he's very, he's very deep. And he's got, he's got a song. It's actually a variation of an old gospel song called Let Us Go Into the House of the Lord. And it's really upbeat, my sweet Lord, George Harrison from The Beatles, that's another one that, that I'll listen to. So yeah, there is, there is something about that component in, in working out that brings brings peace. And I think it has everything to do with, with that, that kind of spiritual aspect, the religious aspect of that. So, so I'm, I'm glad, I'm glad you mentioned that I'm really am. So that's, that's very, that's very cool. Because yeah, I think, yeah, I think your last post, which I appreciated, I think it was Sunday, you said mass and, and then did a quick 10, you know, 10 rounds, not 10 miles, whatever. Yeah, 10 rounds, quick 10 rounds of 380 sets of burpees or whatever you did. And I'm like, and you, and you write them, you write them all down like, Oh my God, you know, what the heck, you know, but, but I very much appreciated you sharing that, you know, and, and, and I got, I just, I felt a very, I just felt a very powerful, more of a powerful connection that I already feel with you. So I was, are you sharing? It was awesome. What, um, you know, in, in, in terms of, of leadership, and I appreciate this piece as well. I want to build on this. Because you, you just share this in talking about your workout journey and connecting workout to leadership. And you're right. There, there is a level of confidence that you get, uh, from taking care of yourself to leadership. There, there is, and there is a confidence. So I'd love for you to expand on that just a little bit. What, what, what is it that, you know, when you do the quick three, um, which, which, and again, I, I joke about that, but it is, but what I, what I appreciate that is something's better than nothing. Right. And, and it's not about being, um, you know, I, I don't have a six pack. I, I'm never going to have a six pack. I have maybe a two pack. That's what I, that's what I aspire for being, being 54 and, and, and, and what have you, but, but there is a level of confidence. So, so what's the connection between your workout journey and then your leadership journey in terms of workouts, giving you that, that, that confidence. So you have that cohesion. Oh, that's a good question. My mind goes lots of different places. I guess, um, when you're taking care of yourself and taking time to take care of yourself, um, I, you're more together, you're more centered, you're more prepared, I think, um, mentally, physically. Um, and so I feel like the way it makes sense in my head is, you know, if I'm taking care of myself, I'm modeling what I want my staff to do for themselves as well. Um, I have more energy. I'm, um, more prepared, which means I'm more confident in my role, like teachers, when you plan, you're more confident in your role. Um, so, I mean, that, that's the connection it has for me. I just, I feel better. So I'm more confident in myself and, and, and the work I need to get done and do. Yeah. No, I can, I can attest to, attest to that, uh, for, for sure. Do you, uh, and, and when you, do you primarily run and do you have a routine for that? Or is it mainly I run and then I, I do cardio in the gym or weights in the gym or? I try to, I honestly like when I map it out every week and don't show up. I, I have a certain number of miles that I want to get to by the end of the month. So I map it out for the month. So I, I like a balance of both. I mean, my goal is to do four strength sessions a week. Um, and then run six times a week, which I'm not hitting that at all. But, but I'm thinking about it. There you go. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Small steps and, and it, and it works. Um, you know, as, as leaders, you know, I, I feel, and I know you know this as well, that our gig is, is to build other leaders and, and to support other, other leaders. Uh, so, so what, what kind of advice or coaching would you give to those who are listening about, about leadership? What, what, what, what, you know, for somebody who's aspiring to lead or, or, or to, you know, is looking to go on that administrative track and you, you've been, you know, you've been in the principal chair for a while now. Um, so, so you've got some wisdom. Um, what, what, what advice or wisdom would you share with, with that, with that group? Um, for, for principals that are currently in the role, but maybe are new. Personally, I just feel like in power and power and power. Just like little kids in the classroom, let me do it. Let me do it. Can I do it? I feel like that's kind of our staff too. How can we empower them and, you know, harness their expertise to just, you know, make greatness happen in our building. And when you're empowering them and giving those, giving them those opportunities, you know, that's feeding them. They're getting excited. They're, you know, they feel special. Um, and then first, for, you know, maybe aspiring principals. Let it be known. Let it be known that you want to lead. What opportunities can you give me to lead or expose me to or experiences? Can you give me? How can I help, you know, take some tasks off your plate so that I can get some experience? How can you partner with me and support me in my desire to become a leader? So I guess just let it be known that that's your aspiration. And, um, you know, if I had a teacher come to me and say that to me, I'd be like, okay, let's go. Um, I've got a sister principal now, you know, you'll be my go to. Um, so just empowering and, and making it known that this is your dream or your next step. Yeah, that, that's what I call on the podcast, a rewindable moment. There are many rewindable moments that you've shared harmony, but that one definitely for those who are listening, running, jogging, doing a quick three, a quick 10, you're on that third set right now. This is a moment to rewind, um, because that is powerful wisdom, uh, harmony. You, you just shared, you're the only admin in your building, right? Yeah. Wow. Wow. How do you, how do you do that? I have, I have an amazing behavior team that I say behavior team. I feel like that's where a lot of our time has spent these days, but I, I just, I have an amazing behavior team of counting myself five people and we just have a system that we work through and, um, you know, I've got obviously outside administrators who will support if need be, which I have, I had to call and thank God. But, um, yeah, it's, it's a village every day. Right on. I want to back up a second too because I can hear, um, educators saying, you know, I, I feel like I'm a protector. I want to protect my family and protect, um, my teachers and I want to take things off their plate, but I would press on them to think about, yes, we want, we want to be cognizant of how much we're putting on our staff's plate, but also, I think empowering them to lead could be different. If that makes sense. Does that make sense? Yeah, definitely. I'm not adding to their play. I'm giving them opportunity to, you know, celebrate them or showcase their expertise, I guess. Yeah, you know, there, and there's different ways to, and there's different ways to do that and, and differentiate that, you know, it's, it's not necessarily del, you're not delegating, but you're, you're seeing a spark that's there, matching that spark with what they can accomplish and it may be a small thing. It may be a big thing. Um, and, and it may, it may be a, a, a quick lap in, in which they do, they do something to give, to give them that confidence to build again towards that consistency and, and cohesion as, as a leader. So, no, that is, that is a very powerful and important distinction to make there. It's not about, all right, guess what? You're going to, you're going to present at the next school board meeting or, um, you're going to sit in the superintendent's office. No, it's, it's, there's just different, different things to do. And, and if, and if you have enough sparks in the building, yeah, then you're creating a, a really positive chain reaction, uh, and, and, and, and if you distribute that, you know, in an intentional way and map that out in an intentional way, it does lead to just this beautiful synergy of strength that, that's being shared and distribute, distributed throughout, throughout the building. So no, that, that is, that is a very powerful coaching distinction, uh, there. So, um, have you thought about, um, you know, just kind of hit me? Have you thought about, um, leadership coaching? I mean, I know you have an athletic background, you're, you're a teacher, you know, you, you, you, you've been, you are a principal, but there, there is, there is something there that, that is, you, you got this kind of coaching vibe. So, um, which, which I appreciate. So have you, have you considered that? I'm actually mentoring my first principal. So, um, no, I haven't until I was asked to be person's mentor. So we'll see. We'll see how it goes. Nice. Nice. Well, I know it's going to go well and that person is very lucky to, to have you as, as a mentor, but I'm just saying, I don't, I don't want to turn this into a career counseling session harmony, but I, I would encourage you to, to pursue that, that there's, there's just something there. I think, I think that, I think that will definitely benefit a lot of, you know, beginning leaders or aspiring leaders. So something to think about. Who knows? I might be, I might be coming to you in a few years. So how much do I pay for consulting? You know, so I need a coach. We all need a coach, right? You know, that's, that's important. Yes, that's important. And, um, you've got a big, you've got a big milestone coming up later, later this month. Uh, you, you will be ringing wedding bells, not for yourself. Uh, but, but for a certain special someone in, in your life. And I'm, I'm so excited. Uh, future mother of the bride here. Thank you. Thank you. Yep. Mollie Jo, my, my oldest will marry on October 26, which is my birthday. Really? Yeah. Was, was that my design or, or that just, it just happened to be that way. That, that was the first opening of the venue. So the venue they selected their first open was October 26. So we get to celebrate that day together. Well, that is, that is great. That is a, I love double celebrations. And, um, that, that will be just a wonderful day. So I'll be thinking about you on, uh, on 26 and, and, uh, maybe looking at my calendar, I'm thinking, maybe, maybe I'll drop, drop that episode then, uh, this episode then and we'll, we'll go for it. So I, uh, I am, I am really, really grateful. Um, real, real quick harmony. Are there, are there folks that you want to give, uh, give a shout out to folks that, that, uh, inspire you, uh, who may or may not be listening. Oh, I hesitate to say names because I'll forget. So all the fit leaders. Yes. Um, you, um, gosh, um, no, getting sure my former assistant superintendent, um, all the other principals across the nation, who post and celebrate and inspire. Um, yeah, just, I learned so much and, you know, you never know who's watching and reading and who you're touching. So I hope everybody continues to post as they are because I'm, I'm taking a violin. Likewise. Well, you definitely make the professional learning network space a better space with your inspiration and, and your imprint because it is definitely inspired and motivated me and, and I've been grateful for our years of, of connection and grateful, uh, for the opportunity for us to finally speak together in, in real time, even though we, we are separated by several, several states from, from North Carolina to Indiana, to Michigan. So I am, I am very grateful for you, harmony and grateful for the harmony that, that you give to so many folks. You, you are a living embodiment of, of your name, uh, for your family, PLN, I'm part of, which I'm grateful for, for the school that you serve and the kids that you, that you have, um, an impact on. So thank, thank you for, um, thank you for all the harmony that, that you provide for all of us. Thank you. Blattered. Thank you very much. It's very kind, generous. It's true. It's true. Um, if folks, if folks want to connect, connect with you, I, I will, I will put all of, all of those in, in the show notes. Harmony is somebody worth following, uh, on X and, and, um, and worth connecting to, uh, and if you're running around, uh, the, the, uh, the, the beautiful, um, uh, rural bread basket of, of, of, of Indiana, you might, you might, uh, you might run into harmony doing a quick five and, uh, so, but definitely, she is definitely somebody worth adding to your professional learning network and, and worth connecting to and, and, and a true gift. So, Harmony McCray, thank you so much, uh, for, for being on, uh, the podcast. Thanks for leading me through it. It was a great time. Oh, wonderful. Uh, friends, this has been just a really special episode and, uh, as, as we wind down, uh, not only this, uh, episode, but we wind down, uh, the series, um, do, do not let these kind of connections, uh, and, and hear. So, so definitely follow Harmony, follow hashtag, Fit Leaders, um, follow, follow all those folks that, that are inspiring you or rather empowering you as, as, as, as Harmony says. So, as I sign off with my typical sign off, don't forget to share with the world your dreams, your visions, your ideas, your Bob Seager songs, because you help make the world a better place just like Harmony and the world definitely needs you. This is Sean Gayler. This is the principal liner notes podcast. I will catch you on the flip side. Thanks for tuning in.