Focus on Africa
Why Eritrea hosted leaders from Egypt and Somalia
The leaders of Egypt, Somalia and Eritrea, countries which all have strained relations with Ethiopia, have been meeting in the Eritrean capital, Asmara. Can Eritrea help de-escalete tension between its neighbours
Also an app that helps detect illnesses in people with black and brown skin
And the Ugandan bill, seeking to restore respect for the elderly!
Presenter: Charles Gitonga Producers: Rob Wilson, Yvette Twagiramariya and Victor Sylver in London. Technical Producer: Nick Randell Senior Journalist: Karnie Sharp Editors: Alice Muthengi and Andre Lombard
- Broadcast on:
- 11 Oct 2024
- Audio Format:
- other
Hello and welcome to this podcast from the BBC World Service. Please let us know what you think and tell other people about us on social media. Podcasts from the BBC World Service are supported by advertising. Hey, I'm Ryan Reynolds. Recently, I asked Mint Mobile's legal team if big wireless companies are allowed to raise prices due to inflation. They said yes. And then when I asked if raising prices technically violates those onerous to your contracts, they said, what the f*ck are you talking about? You insane Hollywood f*ck. So to recap, we're cutting the price of Mint Unlimited from $30 a month to just $15 a month. Give it a try at mintmobile.com/switch. $45 up from payment equivalent to $15 per month, new customers on first three month plan only, taxes and fees extra, speed slower above 40 gigabytes of details. Hello, I'm Sumis Omaskanda from the Global Story Podcast, where we're looking at America's relationship with China. Diplomacy between the world's two largest economies remains characteristically choppy, but could the result of the US presidential election unlock a calmer future? The Global Story brings you unique perspectives from BBC journalists around the world. Find us wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, I'm Charles Guitonga and here's what's coming up for you on this edition of Focus on Africa. We'll hear from the creators of a mobile application that seeks to raise awareness of the symptoms of maternal and neonatal conditions on black and brown skin. This app seeks to ensure that there's proper education, both for the healthcare providers and for the patients. And also, I think the most important part is to eliminate bias in healthcare through accurate information of these conditions. We only see sinuses represented on white skin and this shows a bit of bluish population. But on black skin, you do not see the purple and blue coloration. And in Uganda, we'll hear from the minister behind a new bill that aims to restore respect for the elderly. It's Friday, October 11th. First, we go to Eritrea. The president of Eritrea, President Isayas Afuarki, has been hosting the leaders of Egypt and Somalia in his capital, Asmara, this week. The meeting heightened political tension in the region. That's because many see this meeting as a concern for Ethiopia, which hasn't been invited due to strained relations with all the three countries. There are two key issues at the heart of all this. The first is that Ethiopia is building a massive dam on the blue Nile in the north of the country. And Egypt has long been concerned that the dam will have a massive impact on its water supply. The second is that Ethiopia recently signed a deal with Somaliland to build a port and a naval base on the Red Sea. The problem is that Somaliland is a breakaway region of Somalia, and Mogadishu says the deal is illegal and considers it an act of aggression. By the way, we've been covering both these stories for a while here on Focus on Africa. So if you want to know more, just scroll back through the podcast feed and you'll find episodes on both. Now, the tensions have even reached a point where some analysts are asking whether there might be a full-scale conflict as a result of what's going on. So let's dig a bit more into that meeting between Egypt, Somalia and Eritrea. I've been speaking to regional expert Dr. Hassan Kanenje, Director of the Horn International Institute for Strategic Studies. Of course, Ethiopia is not part of this summit because this is an axis against a disababa. Let's face it. Both capitals are not exactly big funds over a disababa right now, and I think it's an attempt to bring the heads together in trying to increase pressure against a disababa. To the extent that that is happening at the doorstep of a disababa, I think it's something that is further going to fuel at the tension that we are seeing, because it's going to harden negotiating positions if any negotiations were to take place. And specifically looking then at Eritrea and Somalia, they have grown quite close at the moment. What do you think is the basis of this alliance, or is it just a case of my enemy's enemy is a friend? It's an alliance of convenience. It just happens that both capitals are not big funds of Prime Minister Abiyet Minsk government right now. And so because they having a common enemy is convenient for them to work together, not to mention Eritrea has been working the past in actually training some of the Somali forces. And so they have a long history going back. Somalia is having a conflict with the over the memorandum of understanding what signed between a disababa and Somali land, or a geyser, which is kind of a breakaway region of Somalia, and Somalia does not recognize it. And so because Somalia itself is looking for allies in its struggle, you know, gets a disababa over the NYU, it's very convenient that Eritrea that understands Ethiopia very well, it's brought into the fold of Mogadishu. So looking specifically then at Somalia, Ethiopia, Eritrea as well, I mean, are we looking at a situation where we are looking at tensions that could flare up at any moment between any of these countries or just even among all of them? You know, when you're having a situation of relative chaos that are not probably managed, anything can happen. And so you cannot rule out potential conflagration between Somali forces and Ethiopian forces in the near future, considering that Somalia has met it, but only clear that they do not want Ethiopia to be part of security architecture in Somalia, as long as it maintains its memorandum of understanding in the use of the pot in her geyser with Somaliland. With regard to, for instance, Eritrea, Eritrea, which has literally been, a counter has been heavily sanctioned in the region. There was hope when there was an approach more between Asmara and the disababa, but that quickly fed it with the peace that was met between TPLF and Addisababa, in which I think Asmara thought they were left out. And so at the meantime, they've actually been kind of playing a spoiler role in Addisababa and they're not exactly different customs. And so you will not be surprised if, for instance, they may support non-state actors in conduct some activities inside Addisababa again, which again may then push Ethiopia perhaps to take some kind of action against Eritrea, you know, reminiscent of the war that they fought between 1998 and 2000. Help us understand, then, just those two parties that you've just mentioned, Eritrea and Ethiopia, because they have had a very long and tricky relationship. They fought a very long war until they got independence in the early 90s. So what's the beef between them and why does the relationship look so delicate? Because at some point, we thought they were friends, but now it turns out they are not. When Preminsa Abihamint came to power, he seemed to be very keen to re-establish relations with Asmara, not the least, because also it may allow Addisababa to access the sea. But I think after the conflict broke out, which they by and large were fighting along the same side when a war highlights it. And this is the conflict in Tigray, is it? Yes, the conflict in Tigray, the peace that was arrived at, it appeared not to including or to factor in the interests of Asmara. And so I think Asmara saw it as a betrayal of making peace with the kind of party that Asmara considered to be enemy, which is a TBLF. And so that, I think, destroyed the kind of relationship and then a Prashmo that had been built and the kind of engagement that has been going on several years prior to that. And so you expect that unless something again, there's a move for a wider talks to prevent that or to bring back a new Prashmo with Asmara. The tensions are likely to continue and you're likely to see perhaps a little bit more closer relationship between Mogadishu and Asmara, as well as Mogadishu and other capitals that may be perceived to be enemies of Addisababa. There are also some international dimensions to this because these countries do have alliances in Turkey or the UAE or Kenya. Talk to us about that. The international dimensions, yes. At Turkey, for instance, is the biggest soft power in the Hon of Africa and have invested extensively and heavily in Somalia. But Turkey is also a friend in many aspects to Addisababa as well as other countries in the Hon, and I think that explains why I think Turkey has been trying to make some efforts towards creating some kind of negotiations between the parties in Mogadishu as well as in Addisababa. But is the Hon of Africa being a theater for global geopolitics? Of course, you expect other actors are very involved and interested. So it's not just, for instance, the Turks and Egyptians who are in the region, the Gulf countries, they're investing heavily, not just in ports, but also in security and maritime aspects. The big powers and the emerging powers are also extremely present, as illustrated by about 14-minute basis just in Djibouti alone. So that tells you the vitality and the critical importance because of the strategic location of the region as well as each having as a gateway to the greater East Hon of Africa. Tell me if you see how this plays out. Are we looking at a situation where a war is imminent or it's not going to get as far as that? A war is probable, but it's not likely. If you're going to have a framework or an architecture that is going to allow more participation by other countries that may not require, for instance, robust Egyptian presence, then that is going perhaps to reduce some of those tensions. But if, for instance, Egyptians are going to be involved in ways that are going to be perceived to be hiding the interests of Ethiopia, there's a likelihood that you may start seeing challenges inside Somalia as well as challenges within the region. And so I think what happens in the next two or three months is going to be critical in determining the general direction of the country when it comes to matters of peace, security, as well as fighting extremism and terrorism within the Hon of Africa region. All right. Thank you very much for your time. Thanks for having me. That's Hassan Kanenje from the Horn International Institute for Strategic Studies. A student midwife in the UK has created an app to help detect symptoms of illnesses on people who have black and brown skin. 23 year old Ruby Jackson said she was inspired to create the app after visiting a neonatal intensive care unit during a placement in Ghana. It was after she noticed that there was a general lack of understanding about how some conditions present in people or babies who are not white. I've been chatting with Ruby about how and why this idea came about. I actually came as an idea that I wanted to do for my dissertation but the actual one of the ideas that kind of originated was following a trip to Ghana. So during my trip we did I went on international placement there and then we went up to the NICU, the neonatal intensive care unit and they were showing us a baby who had drawn this and they're kind of saying look at the palms, look at the soles, this baby has drawn this and it was quite unwell with drawn this and I sort of realised that it was my first time actually seeing how drawn this presented on a baby with black skin and while this was partly due to the demographic of people I've looked after it was also a massive issue of there not being enough representation within you know our education of how different conditions present on black and brown skin. Ruby how did you end up in Ghana? So we had the opportunity to go actually in our second year for international placement so I went with an organisation called Work the World and I was really keen to go to Ghana. I'd actually spoken to a lot of the Ghanaian nurses that worked at the Trust I work at yeah I was really excited to go and it was an amazing time I learnt so much and yeah it was really eye-opening so yeah it was part of my elective placement in year two. So you're in Ghana and you know patients are being presented with symptoms in a way that you're not seen before in terms of the condition jaundice and how it manifests itself in different people. At what point do you think that you need to create an app about this? Obviously technology is kind of moving forwards now a lot of the information that we've been signed post, women and families who is digital leaflets and flyers and I thought this would be a great kind of opportunity to have a platform that's you know accessible biotechnology on our phones it could be used by clinicians on iPads, it could be used by students and universities during presentations and also it's accessible to the families that we look after so that they can access education that's inclusive and representative. And who do you hope will use this app the most? So my main obviously my main absolute main priority and objective is to improve outcomes and experiences for back and brown birthing people and families in our services so I hope in terms of that side so women and families they'll use the app they can refer to it if they have any concerns about any signs or symptoms and then hopefully they can escalate any concerns and then in terms of the clinicians so midwives, health visitors, nurses they can learn more about how conditions may manifest themselves when black or brown skin and then also as I said yes students as well. Yeah so you've said that at university you are taught to look for yellow skin when somebody has joined this for example as one of the symptoms that they may have can't that be seen on black or brown skin? So yeah it can be seen depending on skin tone as well don't get me wrong and like I said when I went to Ghana they said you know look at the palms and the soles of the hands but it's just different to see and we won't talk about how it may present more clearly on different parts of the body. So this app then how does it work? Talk us through that. Well on opening the app there's you can access information about the baby or the mother and it will take you to a range of different conditions and there are also highlights conditions that disproportionately affect black and Asian mothers as well and babies so to educate the users around that and it also in app sign posts people to release four resources. And have you had it tested yet and if so what's the feedback? Yeah so it hasn't been tested yet it's just going through all of the kind of regulatory processes and then hopefully it will be trial within some London based trusts. So you do work in those words what's in your view is the reason why black women in the UK are more likely to die during pregnancy because that is what statistics and research tells us. So yeah I feel like that is a very very good question and I mean there's you know the research clear there's a whole umbrella of factors so I couldn't really say that I couldn't say one thing but I mean from my aspect of where I'm trying to tackle an issue is the kind of aiding detection and diagnosis and also in terms of experiences making black and brown women and families feel more seen and heard within our services and empowering them to access how they need it. I'm wondering is there an aspect that there's a lack of being able to detect symptoms earlier in black communities or people of black and brown skin? Yeah I mean I couldn't give you a kind of you know definitive answer from one of the kind of ways I see it is that and this is across wider medicine there's a massive lack of representation and inclusion and even from the clinical terminology that we use for example it's in a lot of guidelines it will say a well baby a well normal baby at that should be pink a baby that has dark skin will not be pink and I think these are very we have a lot of very westernized practices and I think that is due to the massive lack of inclusion and representation and that manifests itself into teaching so that's all clinician knowledge can be poor and then signs and symptoms of conditions are picked up much down the line when the condition has already worsened so I do think that could definitely have a role to play in the poor outcomes. Ruby Jackson I've also been speaking to third-year medical student and design of the app Chidia Berry eBay in Nigeria. One of the issues in health care you know we learn health based we understand that diagnosis has become a problem most likely because there's lack of resources there's lack of adequate training of medical students or medical doctors to be able to diagnose skin conditions understand that certain conditions can affect their population so this app seeks to ensure that there's proper education both for the health care providers and for the patients and also I think the most important part is to eliminate bias in health care through accurate information of those conditions. So tell me how you then go about diagnosing illness in children who are darker skin. I think it's it's really it's to the practical condition let's say as I'm telling you a case study of a sinuses it shows a bluish purple discoloration on the skin in most textbooks or in most medical literature we only see sinuses represented on white skin and this shows a bit of bluish top population but on black skin you do not see the purple and bluish coloration rather you see a dark or a gray and white presentation right and because of this people miss that notice or do not understand what what sinuses present like on black skin and most importantly cases where it's difficult to identify clobbing now clobbing on the fingernails or babies or children so this is like one of the case studies where it was difficult to re-identify those conditions on black skin and also another case that I would like to mention is I think for jaundice it's about maybe an increased below levels in the blood where the skin looks yellow which for example on a white skin it is identified in yellow coloration but on the black skin it can be somewhat difficult to identify those coloration so this application understands to give your population understand the difference in precision and helping physicians diagnose properly understand certain condition when they teach the black and brown patients. Have you then as a medical student thought it odd that your medical notes were about white children? I think this has really been the foundation to my work because as a medical illustrator working with a lot of organizations and as a student also last year we took a course in pathology we started a lot of skin conditions and it was hard to realize that all the skin condition we actually learned in school was all skin condition on white people and then I asked myself question how can this be represented on black people which are population predominantly black people you know so I've always thought about it and this has also been the motif of my work to see how to improve access to these resources and access to this information medical student to ask what does heat trash look like on a black skin and it was hard to realize that most of them said it look reddish on a black skin and that is because all our resources all our medical centers will only show heat trash on white people like so this has really concern for me even as a medical student and I also really just questions and what I would say also is because of they're not really conscious efforts in the African population to improve adequate resources to education so I think recently a lot of others have been trying to incorporate diverse networks or diverse images that says books or in a medical handbook. Picking up on your example there how does heat trash look like on black skin? On the white skin you'll see a bit of redness but on black skin the redness is not visible you only see little skin patches you know like it looks a bit of gray color I mean the difference that there's after the redness on the black skin and there's further redness on the white skin so these are like distinctive difference there. What does that look like you know the fact that you're not able to diagnose properly? Well I think it decreased in outcome in health outcome because we've had a lot of cases where doctors not just in Africa but in the western world the United States and the United Kingdom where they literally missed that most patients and children, women and the rest because the doctor didn't know what this looked like on black people. It has been a real-time concern because outcomes are going to be decreased, patients will feel not seen and not heard and also not just about children now because you would say children might not have the ability to speak for themselves but then in terms of Montana health it decreases the level of trust you have between the health care receiver and the health care provider overall generally it just affects health care outcome. So you've been part of the design for this application what will the end result look like and how will it work on a day-to-day practical terms? I'm excited to see how it's going to be used in the health care and how it's also going to improve outcome for people, for black people and most importantly seeing it used in a real life scenario in the hospital is going to be amazing and also one thing I would say is that the concept behind this is to educate people in preparation for that semis on the field because it would look so maybe unprofessional right to be fiddling with phone, you are turning to a patient you know but the idea of this is that we need to educate patients, educate people around certain conditions so while they go in the field to deliver health services they are fully aware and prepared for certain conditions and know what is good with that. So the whole concept is education and also help make friends be better doctors. All right eBay thank you so much for making time for us. Thank you Chidi Aberi, eBay in Nigeria. This is Focus on Africa from the BBC World Service. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. With the price of just about everything going up during inflation we thought we'd bring our prices down so to help us we brought in a reverse auctioneer which is apparently a thing. Mint Mobile unlimited premium wireless ready to get 30-30 ready to get 20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-20-15-15-15-15 just 15 bucks a month so give it a try at mintmobile.com/switch 45 dollars up from payment equivalent to 15 dollars per month new customers on first three month plan only taxes and fees extra speeds lower above 40 gigabyte CD tail. Hello I'm Sumis Omaskanda from the Global Story Podcast where we're looking at America's relationship with China. Diplomacy between the world's two largest economies remains characteristically choppy but could the result of the US presidential election unlock a calmer future. The global story brings you unique perspectives from BBC journalists around the world. Find us wherever you get your podcasts. In many countries around the world there are sets of laws protecting the rights of older people. In fact over 14 years ago the United Nations presented its recommendations with one of the most noteworthy being the proposal for an international legally binding instrument dedicated to safeguarding the rights of older people. The UN Convention would ensure that age discrimination is prohibited in the law, services uphold other people's dignity and attitudes behaviors towards those who are aging. Just recently Uganda's government said it's taking steps to restore values and respect for the elderly by implementing a law. That's after statistics showed a rise in neglect and abuse of older people within the community. The person behind the plans is a minister of state for older persons Gidudu Mafwabi Dominic. He emphasized the growing disconnect between the younger generation and the elderly, adding that the younger generation was largely influenced by modernity and western culture. We are going to hear from the minister next, but first what do young Ugandans think about the elderly in Kampala? Here are a couple of views. If we really want to enforce values it starts at home. It should be done in the African traditional society all the way, but look, these days appearance don't have time for their children. So most parents are busy at work and they come back late in the evenings, others send their children to school in budding schools. So how shall reinforce the values and morality when those children don't spend time with their parents? There are many forms of disrespect. It can be categorized into various things, but still in different societies consider something disrespectful whereas others don't. Like Uganda, the Bhaganda, the Bhaganda people who is kneeled down as they are greeting elders which is known to the same to some other cultures. So if you find an elder from such a side, if you don't greet them when you're dealing down they'll find they will find that disrespectful. But on the other hand some people don't even care how they greet them or not. I've been speaking to the minister himself, Gidudu Mafwabi Dominic, to find out more about the government's concerns when it came to Uganda's elderly. Well first of all I need to give you a little background. We as older persons within the Constitution as a special interest group in the country. We are recognized and we are all inclusive in all aspects of the country. As much as we are the eldest, there are four interest groups, but we are the youngest, we are the latest and there are a lot of developments we are carrying out and we realize that there is really necessity to protect the older persons. And if you may recall the theme this time was protection and promotion of older persons right everyone with responsibility because aid is not an option. This aligns very well with our formative action and we are reminding our young generation to respect the elderly, take care of them so as to get the blessings and we cannot compromise these cherished values. They have been built in our culture but we want them to go with modernity. So we are revising our policy so that they actually affect our day-to-day life like in service there is very if you go to hospital, should the day-to-day line up, if you go to banks, should they be given priority, if you are traveling in the bus and you see a very old person, shouldn't it be common sense that yes these people should be given preferential treatment. So we want to get in the supporting law that is going to support our policies to ensure that our older persons get what they deserve. Okay so some of the things that you've described are quite specific like you know transport, having to queue in banking halls and all of these other places. It does sound like what I would quote-unquote good manners that many of us growing up in many African countries were taught when we are very young. Have those things really gone away or why do you feel the need to put it down in writing as part of the country's law. You see now two students stay less with the parents. So that old culture where the influence of the parents is dominant is well enough and the modernity has come in, technology has come in. Young people move much faster and so on and in most cases they're in boarding schools. So when we reflect and see what is happening in the countryside we see important that we bring in the policies, where our policies will just work without supporting law. We leave it there. For reasons like now we're having a lot of cases regarding land abuse, sexual abuse, gender violence. So you may find this necessary to have the supporting law. So that with the concerned we'll know yes if I don't do this this will happen. So let me ask you because you've talked about our wide-ranging issues. How far does this law go? What are the other things that this bill is looking at? It's a wide range but we can't do omnibus. We shall introduce this, see how it works and then see how we can change here and there. So it's a gradual process but we want to make a start and everybody should know that yes we care. Minister I'm just curious how you might legislate. For example a young person not standing up or letting an elder person through in a queue or stand up when they walk in and there is nowhere for them to see it. How do you enforce something like that? We are creating norms, some of them will be legislated for reasons like those to do with the land. If you are my son it doesn't automatically mean that the land I have with you at. So we said no if you take your father's land without his consent it's criminal. We shall introduce this thing gradually and the way we think is necessary. We want it to be natural. I understand Minister I mean if it comes to transfer property that is quite straightforward into what a law can do about that. Part of this that I was trying to understand was the point that you started on that ensuring that younger people are respecting their elders which you felt those values are sort of fading away. How do you legislate that? You see there are those things that may not be in black and white but within the community it should be understood that yes what you are doing is not respite. We may not arrest you but the leaders will caution you. They say no for us the agreed well of life is this so that if you abuse is criminal that they're supporting law but a thing like you go to the bank and the old person is in a true you don't do anything if we are talking about it on radio in the charges and so it will be imbibed in your head that no if an old person comes I must give way. It's like a law so it's a mixture. Some will be regulated others will be communism. So Minister that by telling me what were the you know the cultural norms regarding taking care for older persons in Uganda and whether that has changed and why is it changing? When I was young we never went to boarding schools. We stayed home we provided the labor. Every morning at wake up take the cows, take the water, clean the compound but this has changed the children go to boarding schools. Their parents are a lot so they need sustainable income. For them replace these services they used to get from their children. So you can see that there is one demand when empowering these various categories of people in the country so that they are self-sustaining. Right. Minister need us to close this interview but in very few words then is it in law who is an older person in Uganda and who is a young person? How does the law define that? An older person is someone who is 60 years and above. Then a young person is someone who goes up to 31 years. They learn to get one. Thanks very much to Gidudu Mafwabi Dominic. Uganda's minister of state for older persons. Lots to think about there. I wonder whether you agree with the minister. It got me thinking about how attitudes towards the elderly are changing in many countries not only in Africa but around the world. And that's focus on Africa today. It was produced by Rob Wilson, Yvette Togiramaria and Victor Silva in London. The senior journalist in charge was Connie Sharp and Nick Randal was a technical producer. Our editors are Andrew Lombard and Ali Smudengi. I'm Charles Gittonga. Goodbye for now. Hello, I'm Sumis Omaskanda from the Global Story podcast where we're looking at America's relationship with China. Diplomacy between the world's two largest economies remains characteristically choppy but could the result of the US presidential election unlock a calmer future? The global story brings you unique perspectives from BBC journalists around the world. Find us wherever you get your podcasts. [end] [BLANK_AUDIO]