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Hello, good evening, welcome to Talking Coffee to me, Chris Brack, and it's actually it was going to be three of us, but Kebs decided to not pay the internet bill. So it's just me and Ashley. So we're going to talk about everyone's favorite defender, Joel Mathis, who was sadly retired at the age of only 33, which I've got to be honest, actually, that caught me off guard. I was just waiting for the announce that he signed in January for some of us to recover from his knee injury. So I was a little surprised if I found out he'd retired. Yeah, I haven't seen much media from him at all, so I don't know where he is in his recovery process. But I was surprised to get that because I thought, you know, surely someone in the lower half of the table in the Bundesliga or maybe in the Bundesliga 2 would be interested in Joel Mathis because, I mean, we were talking off air about his ability to come back from an injury and slot right in and although it was an ACL injury, I wouldn't have put it past him to come back and play at a competitive level again, especially for maybe one or two more years. Yeah, I'm surprised, like, especially if you probably excited one to be sniffing around with him in January, you know, even to us, even someone like a villa, having someone like a Joel Mathis in your squad with his experience would be quite handy, you know, so, but listen, maybe for him, maybe it could have been totally for him. One injury to many, maybe he's just thought the recovery of this at 33, I don't want to do this again, you know, it could also be that just thing that he's had enough. So, yeah, I saw the ocean puts in air, there was a rumor that he was going to leave because at one point, you thought that's a good career move. Yeah, I saw that during the transfer window, I think it was late August that there was someone that was reporting that they were saying that they were coming in from and I was like, well, I mean, it makes sense from a leadership perspective, even if he doesn't play that often. So yeah, it's a shame that nothing like that ever materialized. Yeah, yeah, it is a shame. So I perfectly honest, when we signed it on a free from Shalka, I was just generally like, yeah, okay, cool. And this is rather time where we were still getting used to the whole clock when you lay out and go, I've never heard of this fella, we'll see what it looks like and this being pole arrives, you're going like, you're going to get like, oh mate, he's going to have to sort of bulk up of it to cope in the prep because there's nothing other than he just think the same. All I knew about was he had played defensive med, he'd done well for Cameroon in the World Cup, but he's also a centre back. And I thought, okay, fair enough, we could do a couple of centre backs, you know? And yeah, I would say he had a tough start, you know, because he had to play alongside Kegsey Lovren, you know, he had a Miller at left back, you know, client at right back, you know, it wasn't the easiest little side to come into, he's just coming off the back of a loose neuro-pleak fan or something, this could be an interesting character. And everyone knows, I'm not going to rewrite history, I was not a job, that's it, fan for the first couple of years of it. Looking back, probably was harsh, I think I mixed him in with Kegsey Lovren and Cannon went the boat for saying, so, yeah, Liverpool can keep it clean sheet, so I can't just sort of damn the ball when I can't be doing that, but, you know, to be fair to him, he was a really good centre back, very underrated, very underrated, probably I would say, by people outside of Liverpool, I would say. Yeah, I agree, I mean, I think even now, even as a Champions League winner, as a Premier League winner, I don't think that you'd find many people putting his name in amongst, you know, the top centre backs in the league, which is a shame, because I do think that if he wasn't as injury played as he turned out to be, some of the performance levels that he reached, I mean, they really were top drawer, and, you know, it's a shame that he will only kind of be remembered in that light by Liverpool fans. I don't think that history will kind of look back on him and shine the same light that they do on Virgil, but there were some games throughout, especially through those title winning seasons where he was putting up Virgil level performances. Yeah, I mean, what comes to it, I mean, the run to the Champions League final, the one we won, there's an argument he was played by the Virgil, which takes some doing to be fair to. He unfortunately did get some really unfortunate injuries at the wrong times, you know, I mean, he missed out with the Champions League fan of Kiev, because he picked hamstring injury, I think we've tried a nursing through games, and the one I probably a lot of people forget is we all remember the Ali Savi, it's Napoli, the big save. The last moment of that game is him going up to bang ahead the clear and getting caught after he kills it, right? No, he don't see him in for months, he like, that's how it was. I thought it was innocuous ones, but you were like, oh, it'll be fine, he'll shake it off, and then he like, he's popped a shoulder, you're like, oh, oh shit. And it wasn't the worst possible time, too. Yeah, that was always his unfortunate side of him, well, let's get his injuries down the way, because I was blessing me out a lot, and I thought it's only when you look through the list, he had some big injuries, when you think the injuries he went through, when you think of, you know, overplayers, Oxford Jamblyn, people of that hill, probably never recovered from this level of injuries, and to be fair, he kept coming back, you know, so he had a really bad ankle injury, he had a couple of bad handstrings, he said, two big knee injuries, and the big one probably for him was the ankle injury, which was, that was the season when we had no centre backs, and to be fair to him, we were top of the league with him at centre back, and he literally had Henderson next to him for being your next to him, he had everybody next to him, and he was doing really well, and he unfortunately, because a horror ankle break. I can't remember exactly what that was in his ankle, because it just felt like it could never heal, like I remember feeding articles and watching, like, for updates on his ankle, thinking, oh, it's just an ankle injury, he'll be back in maybe three months, and three months turned into six months turned into like the whole entire season, and I certainly was anticipating it to be that long of an injury when you went down. Yeah, because that was the first look of either holograph, and Kabback, which was, because Litchy, it was ankle surgery, and he was dumb, it was a big injury, but the one person who loved him, both on and off the page, was Virgil, and it was very telling when Virgil came back from his knee injury, it was well known in the press, and came out, when Virgil was getting his first game back after his injury, he insisted he wanted, he wanted a matter next to him. Yeah, I think they just had such a good partnership, they knew each other's game inside-out, I can't just felt he could leave MATUP to it, and MATUP could just sort things out, and he was quite happy with that, you know, maybe the other side of the fact he had to talk through a little bit, because of it, you wouldn't go for MATUP, which was one of those guys who could just leave him to it, and you know, they were a good combo, you know, for somebody who had absolutely no pace, I mean, literally, you know, his walking pace was his running pace. He's very rarely got done for pace, you know, quick win this. Yeah, I've had those real long legs, you're right, there was something so symbiotic, like not even getting to the off-field stuff, which we'll get to later, but there was something so great about the relationship he had with Virgil, where they just played off each other's strengths, and I feel like, I think you're right in that Virgil didn't really have to talk him through things, but it just felt like they added calm to each other's games, like even though he was sort of a weird little baby giraffe, and you don't look at him and say, "Oh, calm," but that's what it seemed like. When they played with one another, it's like they just kind of had that telepathic knowledge of where the other was going to be, and they covered each other really nicely, and when I was looking back at some of the replays of videos of Magic today just so we could talk, like, I didn't realize just how much I missed those long-field passes that he had, and I feel like between him and Virgil, we had such a great kind of weapon from the back, almost like a quarterback thing going on, where they could just do those cross-field balls, and I had kind of forgotten that Magic had that in his locker, but they just did such a good job being, like, thinking to each other's yang. Yeah, and as Kev, he would have said this on the show, but, you know, it did pay his internet bill, so we're seeing his point. When you watch his back, he fairly rarely goes to the ground, he fairly rarely... And he doesn't get... He doesn't get yellow cards, he doesn't get red cards very often either. No, it was all about positional play, you know. I think all the slowness he had in his legs, he had all the quickness in his head, I mean, speaking of his head, you know, goals-wise, you know, he loved it, his goals he got, he only got 11, but they were some cracking head as he got for us. He probably should have scored more heads than he did, because he was good in the box, he was good in the air, and that's probably one thing I would say. I mean, I remember his first goal against Palace, when he absolutely bangs the head, he's got a winner against Ajax, but his best goal contribution is the most dramatic thing you would ever see, which is his first ever assist is to set up Divock Origi to win the Champions League. That's his first ever assist for Liverpool, you know. Fair play, you don't do anything else after that. He stands up for the really important moment, you know, I think, I think between that and then the lead's goal, those are the ones that he's going to be remembered for, so that assist and then that, that Maisie Matip, like, little through the pitch, that everyone knew that eventually that would come to a goal, and I'm so glad that wasn't something that just sat and never happened. I'm so glad that he got the chance to finish one of those Maisie runs, because that's for me what I will remember him as, is that Baby Giraffe just sort of, like, you know, on ice, going through countless defenders, I believe he played it off to Mo, who played it back to him, and it was a wonderful finish, considering that he didn't finish that many with his feet. So, yeah, between those two, you know, very fun memories. But his little Maisie runs, it became the meme, didn't it, you know, like, her thinking baggens out of love during a go-go on adventure? Yeah. But when you, when you, when you look back at all those little Maisie runs, he does. You feel really, I don't remember getting calls as in. And they relieved so much pressure. It's something that I think actually becomes a Liverpool trait from defenders, where you're kind of seeing Kanate do that a little bit now. You're seeing Kwanza do it a little bit now. Where it's kind of something that we've adopted as a defensive style. Yeah, Kanate started to bring into his game a little bit now, I think it's, I think it's for us, you know, if you can't do the virtual booming pass, you know, it's something different. And also, how many sets back decide they're going to go for a wander and he comes off regularly. I thought, I thought, I thought, I thought, I was growing up. And take out with one of my favourite, which is, uh, remember Mattips screaming at the grass? I mean, I'll be honest, he did take a foul against him quite personally. And he, some of the meltdowns he'd had over it, over a little funny walk he'd do. The Everton funny walk. The Everton funny walk, I mean, listen, it's not funny because he absolutely snaps to you. Yeah, but he walks over like a, like a really serious headmaster. It's like he has no elbows and no knees. And he just kind of marches over there. It's, I don't know, he deserved all of the meme credit that he got. And the whole no-context Joel Mattip account, if you haven't seen it, I'm sure that we've never seen it. But if you haven't, it is one of the, you know, prime old Twitter accounts. I feel like that's going to be one of those things that we look back on. And you know, sometimes we're like, oh, like those were the good videos of YouTube, like way back and way back when I feel like that's gonna be prime Twitter that we recall 20 years from now. Yeah, it's got to be, I didn't start with sense of it. Yeah, it was, it was a DM at Shalka. Yes. You couldn't imagine that now, could you? Joel Mattip, is that what I mean? I already have nightmares about like Fabino switching back and forth between center back and defensive midfield. I don't need nightmares about the other reverse happening with Mattip. Yeah, I mean, he didn't do any interviews, so it was quite funny, but most of Joel Mattip stuff we know him for is the lip pull stuff, you know, a coconut water conversation never is never not for me. 'Cause there is its own little five minute segment because that to me is like the best piece of media that they have put out from the club in reach comfort. The outtakes makes me awful. It's just so good. Like, and it's so him too. I don't know why it works, but just like the way that he just deadpan reads it from the book with the little facts. I don't know. For me, that's one of the funniest and I think that was during COVID too. Yeah, his voice though, when he spoke, I was like, that voice does not go with that body. It just doesn't work. How does this weird little, this weird, very deep German accent, you go like, it's not the voice I was expecting to hear. It's a very old, it's just, you're looking like, that's just not the voice I expect you to have. No, which we add to him. I mean, we'll talk about him in Virgil, the loving. I mean, the Virgil of his, is Joe Mattett t-shirt, which Joe Mattett you could tell is absolutely dying inside. 'Cause he's definitely one of those socially awkward people where he's inadvertently funny. But him and have you seen the one of him and Gomez bolding with that? Oh my gosh, yes, great. It's so funny. But Van Dyke started in- Like a mini TV series. Yeah, Van Dyke trying to do site gangs with him and he's just like, he's having none of it. I think he's quite cut, he's quite cutted. He's got a Wistaprint commercial that they, it was a partnership with Wistaprint that they did, and it was after the t-shirt. So the t-shirt was in like a preseason media day, and then they took that image and they blew it up and they put it on a giant blanket, and they gave it to Virgil as a Christmas gift. So he just had this enormous, like larger than life image of Mattett on a giant blanket that he was just cuddling on in a couch. And it was just, that was like the greatest period for media there. Yeah, or the reveal of his FIFA card when you realize Joe Mattett's like me, he was, "I don't play FIFA. I don't know what this means." But then they're trying to explain to what how bad his dribbling stats were, and he was like, "I think my dribbling skills are quite- His dribbling skills are pretty good." He was absolutely offended, not quite as offended as and Kanate. Oh gosh. That still is making me laugh now when they said like 75 pace goes yeah, and the level is going, it's gone down, and you just see absolute disgust. I hate this game. So the thing with Joe Mattett, we all do it within, is we all remember the funny stuff he does, the training stuff, how eccentric he is. I forget how good a footballer he was. I think that's to his detriment sometimes is he became a meme because he was so likable, but at the same time he forgets he was a really, really good defender. I mean the debate would be, yeah, debate would be, he's got to be up there with one of the best frees we've ever signed. I think the same as Milner, Marcus Babble's the other three I can think of. Gary Mac, but over a long period. I just think he got more longevity out of it. Milner probably edges it because he got more games out of Milner because he covers so many positions. But this is a guy who was a part of Liverpool in the title, I was a big part of Liverpool in the Champions League. And he also was involved in FA Cups and League Cups, you know, he kind of likes winning trophies for him, which is understanding. Yeah, he was quoted, I mean, it's full rundown. So he did, I'll get his exact number of appearance stuff, 200 more appearances that came to in the end, which I'll be honest, he kind of thought it would be more than that. That's... I mean, he didn't really have, I think what was it, 2021-2022, that was his most prolific season. He had 43 appearances that season. That was the most he was able to get throughout his whole career. Yeah, because his first three seasons, he got low 30s and all comps, which isn't bad. And after that, the Danklin knee injury is really course over, which is just shame, because he's such a good player. And you just, you know, it's what you wanted. I mean, you know, even last season, you were looking going with the, again, turning his ACL, but when you saw the injury, you were like, didn't look much, you know, and they're almost innocuous ones. And again, you look, I'll be honest, with 10 games to go, you probably could have done with your automatic coming in for a bit of calmness. Yeah, I think that would... Anybody else who just needed the rotation at that point? Yeah, I think that would have helped. You know, that, that's sometimes where you, you, you miss him. And that's when you miss him a little bit, unfortunately. But it turns out, you know, winning things, you know, Champions League 2009, Super Cup 2019, Premier League 1920, League Cup 2022, FA Cup 2022. So, you know, not bad. So it's not bad for a career, not a bad start for a career, you know, quite a few near misses as well. So, you know, he did what he did really well in his career, but I mean, not that Champions League run, he was majestic in that. He was unreal, especially the, the boss again, you know, him and Van Dyke, you know, really helped keep Messi and co-quiet. Yeah. And I know he wasn't fully fit, but in the final, he had had it came in his pocket. He didn't. Yeah, I think he wasn't fully fit either. So, no, but kind of matched up nicely. Yeah, I mean, yeah, but he just calmed us, personified, you know, and allowed Trent to get forward, could cover Trent and didn't really get shown up at all. You know, but yeah, the assist for Divock Origi still sticks in your mind. It's probably, you know, he's best, one of the best moments for him. And it was nice when we all found out later, we're like, Oh, that's great that it's Joel. Well, no one expected him to be all the way up at the, you know, all the way up near the goal line there. I didn't think that was him at the beginning. Well, I was shot with a handball for the head. I was shot with a handball. So, I, and then you sell it with your ego. It's only when you get to like the third replay, you go, Oh, it's massive and fast. Because for ages, like, no, I didn't pass it. I just thought it was just deflected. Then you watch the, you know, it's a considered path. It was not even like a look at deflection. You know, he knows where it's going. Yeah, I don't know. There, he's one of those players. He's like the ultimate unsung hero for me in, in this particular time period of Liverpool. I think, like I said, he'll be remembered so fondly by Liverpool fans. But I don't know. I hope other, I hope people will remember him beyond just Liverpool. Yeah. His goals celebrate. He goes to still in the title, the title runs season. Yeah, I remember that one. He absolutely loved these just scream, just scream out, just scream. That was his goals. I'll just scream. All his celebrations were great. I was watching the replay of him doing the Super Cup. And he's just like in the back with his little magic jazz hands. And it's just, it's just, it's just so, it's just so, it's so, I know I looked stupid, but it was great. He sold the state. It was the flood that, isn't he? Yeah. I think he just does it like intuitively. I don't think he thinks about being funny. I think he just acts normal and it comes across as funny. Yeah. Yeah. Thaws got a, you know, a tantrum versus Swansea, the angry walker, everything. Outmuscling Kane, L'Acaco, and he, he, he views with, with Cloth, Mazy runs. I think he answered his critics. He did. He did. You know, and he would still, if he was, if it wasn't for the injuries, he would still be a Liverpool player now. Because I do think he'd have gotten it. He would have extended his contract comfortably because he probably Virgil's best partner, you know, I think of walks with him, then he injuries probably that 100 too much unfortunately. Yeah. I mean, sadly, you know, his loss is Quons' gain because I, I think that we probably wouldn't have seen Quonsa last year. But I agree. I think he probably would have gotten at least, least one more year. And he probably would have played quite well because like we've said earlier, he comes back from injuries really well. And I think, you know, anyone that has had to manage injuries throughout their career, there's got to be an incredible amount of willpower there where it's like, you know that your body is kind of failing you and, and you're able to fight back and get back to playing fitness. And so that's something that we didn't really see much from him because, you know, he's a very quiet guy. But I'm sure that he had to go through a lot of internal struggles to, to get match fit that many times. Yeah, it must have done. Yeah. But you're right, if he, if he hadn't got that last knee injury and he was still around now, that would have been the perfect three to rotate. You know, karate, Van Dyke, Matip, and then you still drop Quonsa in every now and again when you needed to, he just gave you what you needed. It was just that nice calm influence. And he worked well with karate, he worked, you know, I'm sure, and he worked well. Him and Gomez, the short time they played together, was a good combo. Again, they, they sort of complimented each other really well. So, you know, it's just a very sad end unfortunately to, you know, a good Liverpool career. But you said, then, Klopp said some nice things about, but I haven't seen the Klopp interview, but you will enter it off there. Klopp was pretty glowing about him. He did. Let me see if I can find the full quote. Give me one second. Well, well, we that in the chat gives you a favourite geometric moment. The Volvo XC6D plug-in hybrid is about performance, not just on the road, but in life, with not only trunk space, but room to make memories. It's electric with a backup plan, where the only speed that matters is how fast you can slow down. The Volvo XC6D plug-in hybrid performance where it matters the most. Visit VolvoCars.com/US to learn more. At Sierra, discover great deals on top brand workout gear, like high-quality bikes, which might lead to another discovery. Getting back in the saddle isn't always comfortable. 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So, Clop said, "In all the years that I have been involved in football, I'm not sure I have come across too many players who are more loved than Joel Matton. I'm not even sure it would be possible to say anything bad about him. A wonderful professional, a wonderful footballer, a wonderful human being. We've been blessed to have him with us for as long as we have, and now all we can do is wish him well as he heads off in a new direction. His qualities as a player are there for all the sea, and as a club we have benefited from them since the very first moment he joined. I don't think he has had too many headlines over the years, but he has only ever been a very famous figure within our group. I've said before that if there was one person who wouldn't care if he was underrated it would be Joel, but the truth is we could not have rated him more highly. Not only has he set the standards for himself, he has set them for others, and this is one of the main reasons why his time at Liverpool was so successful." Very eloquently, Clop, but that sortable perfectly. He was, he's one of the people always described that as you need three to play the piano the rest of carrier. He was probably one of those, what you call a piano carrier, but I always felt, especially there were times last year you were looking going, "This feels like a jobmatic game. This is a game that needs jobmatic." He's definitely those players that when he's not around, you're going, "Ah yeah, there are times you missed that." I mean, listen, the forest loss this year, he probably wouldn't have maybe done with a jobmatic, because he's dominating the air from a set piece, or one of his little amazing runs. Just a force of foul, just a force of something because you don't have many centre backs who want to run at you, because it's a very unusual technique. Tom Bollinger said, "We always find wonderful ball-playing centre backs, but subtly injuries get them like Aga." Yeah, that's a fair comparison. You know, it's quite a fair bit, but I suppose maybe that was why he's the rest. I'm pretty sure he's going through his whole career and never gone for a transfer fee, which is quite an impressive feat for school. He's also never gone to red card, which is an impressive feat for a defender. Especially these days, yeah, because these days you get a red calf kicking the ball away and you can have three months of debating it. You know, it's grand, isn't it? Yeah, I think, you know, with him, like you were saying, so much of his strength came from his intellectual capacity to just read the game. And I think that Virgil gets a ton of credit for that. Like, so often we hear pundits come out and say, you know, he's three steps ahead of them in his mind. And I think Joel Mathik was like that as well. I don't think he got any of those accolades, but I think, you know, especially because he knew the limitations of his body, he had to be that much more intelligent. And he had to kind of position his body in a way that, you know, maybe allowed him to not have to go to ground or not have to make a rash tackle because, you know, you see it a lot in the Premier League now. I mean, you see it with a lot of Manchester United defenders that, you know, they don't have that intellectual capacity and they're just butchering people left, right and center. And that's how they're defending. And Mathik, to me, is like the opposite of a Mark, like a Martinez, you know, he has all of the intelligence and none of like that kind of vicious, I'm going to just take you down attitude. And that, I don't know, that to me, I love that in a defender, that to me is just game intelligence from top to bottom. Yeah, and listen, we all love the big blocks. We could also we all like the categories, you know, the gnome for the big blocks. But there was a lot to be said that if you went for a big block like that, looks, I'll make you out of position. And the best defenders, very, very rarely go to ground. Virgil van Dijk, rarely goes to ground, you know, Hanson in his prime. No, he did. One of my favourites of all time, Sammy Hippier, you know, very rarely had to go to ground. Also, wasn't quick. You know, so, you know, there's a lot to be said for maybe that's the benefit of not being a quick defender, because you have to learn to be better awareness. But yeah, I've always had to think for the defensive rules under our flying tackles consistently, generally set out of position. And it's a, you know, that's what they have to look out for. So I thought, yeah, it's just it's a thing that could be learned. And I think you've seen that stylus, you know, we've karate doesn't seem to fly in as much. Quands are definitely dozens, you know, he's more about positional plays. Again, this could just be a becoming a Liverpool trait again, which is, that's kind of the thing you want from his sense back as well is, you know, get the position, right, that you don't need to overthrow yourself, which is the ocean leads should lead to less injuries. I mean, you'd like to hope so. I mean, I sometimes, I think, you know, it's sad that matchup couldn't have been part of this kind of backroom medical staff revolution that's happening at Liverpool, where, you know, you see them really doing a great job on some of the players that were more injury prone. Like you do wonder if with a different training regime or a different diet or, you know, whatever it is that makes that magic combination that, you know, is working for them right now, it would have been great to have seen him just get a couple of seasons back to back where like he really didn't, because that's kind of what it felt like was hardest for him where he would have one good season, then it would immediately drop off. And he wasn't really able to string any of those seasons together, and we couldn't see him for a run of games. And I just, I think, I think he might have benefited more than almost anyone else with, with all the changes that are happening in the back. Yeah, maybe like a, also like a, just a stylistic change from a little bit more control. It's more, it's more control. It's more, it's a little bit more possession based. And so you probably less exposed one on one, which means you're less stretched, which should reduce your risk of getting injuries. You know, it's all, but it's also more workier, but ultimately, the way clock played, you know, which was more pace, more health, a scale-through at times, he played a lot on that style and made it work. So he knew how to do, he was the Carver's in the chaos, which I think is what you need around that sort of time period, but like people's give you their best moments, or what do you guys remember about Magic? And what are the moments that will stand out for you? Yeah, the one thing that we never got to see, because, you know what, I wish we could have seen it once was an episode of take a penalty in the shoes out, didn't we? I didn't take one, I swear, I saw it. There he is, I can't look, he taught one. I think he missed a penalty. Because he didn't do the super cup, he never gets a super cup, but he wasn't on the pictures leave for the Chelsea World War one, so I want to include the keepers. I feel like he just missed out on any of those. I could be wrong, I probably am. I'm sure it's all the correct minute, isn't it? Carver's coming back to the back, it's coconut facts, that's his favourite. Sure, that's it, moment. The coconut facts? The coconut facts, definitely, though. Yeah, and take a second, he's unlucky, but was the young girl away at Spurs. Yeah, that was a bit of a killer. I think we also thought, I think it was us either one player who didn't want it to happen, so he played so well in that game when we were down to nine, which is still a mad statement to say that we were down to nine men, and we got a draw. I hate that that's like, kind of at the end of his career and will be remembered, like fresh in the mind, because it's one of those things that you wish was just like buried back in like 2016. Because, I don't know, that was a kick in the teeth, that particular performance. Like, it was so good, and then to have it end like that, I don't know. That was definitely his unluckiest moment. Yeah, definitely, definitely. It's so quite his legacy that, what is your opinion, his legacy? I mean, I think his legacy, we talked a little bit about the playing style, and kind of using those Maisie runs as something that kind of is a signature within the Liverpool defensive style now. I think that going forward, like I will kind of always remember those as a dual-matop Maisie run or like a little we're going on an adventure run. I think in terms of partnerships with Virgil, like kind of trying to find that Ying and Yang going forward, like he's a great example for how, you know, you can have one center back that is kind of all glitz and glamour and is in spotlight, but the other one can be just as important. And I think continuing to look for those partnerships is something that I'd like to see the club do. And I think probably just looking at what he does off the pitch and his demeanor off the pitch and the fact that, you know, he was never in the spotlight. He was never, you know, in any sort of trouble. He was never in any sort of media whatsoever, which, you know, is crazy thinking about the amount of media coverage that exists in the world. You know, the fact that I don't remember a single negative story about dual-matop ever. I just remember him with a smile on his face and, you know, him just bringing like a great character into the dressing room. And I think that if those clubs quotes didn't say it already, I think that's really going to be like his legacy is how good of a player he was to to really round out that like fantastic like group of players during one of our greatest periods in history. And I think, you know, his character was the backbone for that among other characters. But for me, he will be remembered as one of the ones that, you know, he was a leader, he was a comic relief. I think, you know, there's so many things. I don't know, I'm talking endlessly here. What do you think? No, I love what you say. I agree. I mean, we said like you didn't hear any stuff in the press about him. When he wasn't playing, because I got to start the season, we get the champs league. He's on the bench. Yo, Joe Gomez has took his spot. Don't hear any moaning, don't hear any grumbling, don't hear. I'm not getting my chance. So, you know, I need my opportunity. He just waited for his option, but when he got it, it was quite hard then to dislodge you, you know, and literally, Joe Gomez picks up a, I think Joe was breaking his ankle at Burnley. Matip comes in. And when Joe comes to the state, you're like, can't actually get you a game. And that was it. And it was literally then we had to sort of wrap him in, caught him one a little bit for the champs league games, because it's like, we just need Joe to be fit for these. That's our aim. Joe will be fit for all these big games. You know, that was credit to him. That's what you need. Madjap all with a great point, which is a Wishes goal of Gates Chelsea in the cut file and stood the one where they gave the imaginary file of his verge up. Yeah, that would have been nice. That would have been nice for him to have these Alan Kennedy moment, the unlikely here. Yeah, that would have been quite nice. You know, the unlikely here always, oh, yeah, that, you know, that was the final dramatic one for us. There was a certain place where I wish they had that moment. That would have been quite nice for it. Yeah, yeah, kind of like the semi-cast moment where he got his, his penalty win or the Kelleher moment where he got his penalty win, just something where, you know, he gets his moment in the sun. Yeah, and the co-it's made a good point. We are going to talk about our sponsor as well, but we'll cover this first, which is about Zoe's Plagues. We have retweeted at our socials. I mean, for those who don't know, Zoe's Plagues is a hospice for babies, which is sadly going to shut down this year. So there's a lot of fundraising going on to try and raise money to keep this going because this is a crucial sort of facility. You know, it's a horrible thing to have to imagine going to hospice for your baby. But in fact, something like this in the Northwest is going to be taken away. And it's quite concerning and quite worrying, you know, for all the good work they're doing. So, you know, it's googly. You can see there's plenty of fundraise things going on, you know, and anyone could help support that. That would be most, most appreciated because it is a big thing. Now, it's like a separate note. Tonight, we are sponsored again by Football Prizes. And it's also something you were doing, uh, defend the site. So the latest prize is $3.95, for $4.99 tickets. And the closing date is 15th of October. It's to win a Trent Alexander Arnold signed and custom framed lift pull shirts. So if you want that, go to football prizes.com and all the details are in the description below. And of course, there's our two charities partners, which is the Lighthouse Cafe in Dublin, which is help feeding the homeless in Dublin and fans supporting food banks in the Northwest. So the aim is to raise 10,000 euro, 5,000 euro for each charity. Links to the description below. If you can give, please give. If you can't share it around your social medias or kept it coming around after you. That's just also the reason Kev's not, he's thrown, he's thrown a tantrum because nobody's sharing it enough. So we also need to do that. Thanks for the heads up because I would have got out there because I'm not very good at remembering those things. So I was asking, does the Champs League Final assist counters a moment? Yeah, it does. I mean, it's, it's a big moment. It's an iconic, it's part of an iconic goal. You know, so, and he's listening, he plays with my iconic game. He has a boss of four nil. He's a big part of that. You know, so, but yeah, it would have been nice for him to get a winning goal. That would have been probably really would have been the icing on, on the cake, you know. But again, you know, he plays well in the Champs League tournament, the League Cup Final way against Chelsea. In fact, both of them play as well, because he comes on as a sub, and if he comes on a sub to me for when Van Dyke gets injured in the FA Cup Final, and then pretty certainly starts the League Cup Final, and then comes, and then comes off for Karate. Both games, he plays well. Yeah, I mean, I think it's interesting that we're, we're talking about his moment in the sun and whatnot, but I bet if we sat down with Joel Mathip, he probably, he probably would be just fine closing, closing the book the way that it was, and not having that moment, because it does seem like, it seemed like he was quite happy to kind of take that sideline approach. It seemed like he was really happy to let other people shine. And, and I think that's another part about his legacy is his just selflessness in the team, and just ability to let other people shine and, and really bring up the best in them. Um, you know, so maybe it's fitting that, you know, his moments are a little bit more subtle, because he was a little bit more subtle. Yeah, uh, match up with the great one as well. And he pops and go in the head. Uh, I think he's not even on the pitches. He's, he's on the subs, and you see him since you're out and go fucking hell. So, but you can see his shoes throughout, and there's a cab wrangler of the outside. It's just these smile, like, little candidates of him just like popping out behind other players, just like with this little goofy grin. Um, and there was, like, just comic relief. Yeah. Oh, she said his celebration of sorts case, new castle winner, capale gets the last minute winner. Um, I don't know if it's a noon as well. So often, man, what you, what Joe was, what Joe was doing on that one. Uh, and he did love a goal celebration. You had, he knew how to celebrate a goal. I feel like, I feel like so many of the, the lingering images of me, like for him in my head are, are those celebrations or him just, I don't know, there was one, I forget what game it was, but there was one where he gets tackled and he sort of like inchworms his way down the pitch. Um, there, there's so many where he's just, he's being like the goofiest person that you can imagine. And it's kind of like how I imagine like I would be if I was just like thrust into a game where I like, I wouldn't know what to do with myself. And I'd just be limbs everywhere. And I would just be doing silly things with my body. And I feel like that's kind of what he was like. He was just sort of like an every man's man kind of thing. Um, so I just, I don't know, I appreciate how relatable he was. Yeah, you could tell, because you could tell about every player speaks glowingly, like he said, there's no trauma, but you never heard, you've never heard of anyone, you know, listen, never a backward football is now when they leave now, the truth comes out. There's no what did you really think of? You know, like, we all know Peach Michael and Roy Keating each other. And they're quite apt to tell you that they hated each other. You know, it was just fine. Well, I forget on, no one mentions Joe, or if they do mention him, it's always in a glowing thing of, you know, it's great to work with all these, these hilarious or, you know, it's just got to be around, everyone likes him. Yeah, I think it must have been a really good example for the younger players coming through. And I think about those players now, like whether it was Curtis or whether it was Harvey Elliot, to have him kind of be like a grounding figure in the, in the backroom area. And I mean, there, there are so many of so many players in Liverpool's dressing room that kind of fall into that category. And they're all leaders in their own different way. And I think Matip was a leader in his own way. And it shows that you can be a leader while also kind of being more quiet and more reserved and just, you know, a little bit funny. But I think that I think it's a good example of how to be professional, you know, for those younger players. So I think that I hope that they looked up to him. And I think it would be wonderful if for his legacy, they were able to kind of take that just sort of like, you don't always need to be in the limelight attitude forward with him. Yeah, I agree. Great. So, I'm still, there are many sort of Joe Matip moments could have there. I mean, what, so I was asking, I can't repeat the exact phrase, but it said, what's this about the Cameroon FA that they made that he ended up quitting? That was an interesting one because he retired from the football. Pretty young. And I think they did like a lot of work to convince him to play for Cameroon and not for Germany, because he was eligible to play for both. Yeah. You know, so it is, it is interesting. I, you know, I don't know how much of that was down to the injuries and him just trying to manage his own body. I could have been here. You know, I also think that like he tried to retire and they basically said no. And obviously, he can play a game for us because of the Afghan and eventually, after he's missed, I think he'd run your items like that. I think then feet for, you wait for them, went, well, actually, if he's retired, you can't then hold them to play for you. I mean, they've been trying, I think up until maybe it wasn't last year, I swear they tried to call him up last year. It might have been one, one year. I think he offered for one World Cup to come out. I think I too said he had to refuse to let it go, let it go because it'd been retired for so long, which is ironic. The one time he says he wants to be a bit selfish, he says, oh, I'll go on, I'll give myself one last World Cup. They're like, no, no, thank you. No, thank you. They're probably going to want to, but yeah. He's actually, it's interesting that we're talking about that because we were sharing a clip earlier between a couple of us about how there is a little bit of action that's happening between FIFA, where they're talking about players and how many games they're playing. And I think that Joel Matches is a really good example of a player needing to take control of his body and what he's going to be doing with his career because I think that's what he was doing. I genuinely think that he knew that his body could only take so much and put down. Kept said this as well, said he said you can see a lot of footballs retiring from international football for the 30 because they'll just need to preserve their own. It's the player association now, isn't it? Who are? When you need mealtime inspiration, it's worth shopping king supers for thousands of appetizing ingredients that inspire countless mouthwatering meals. 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It's certified for that road trip you've been meaning to take, certified for your growing family, certified for small steps and big leaps. No matter where the road ahead may take you this season, Volvo hopes you enjoy every moment and are confident in the certified by Volvo vehicle you've trusted to take you there. Contact your Volvo retailer today. Legal action has taken, sort of say like thief in your way for a reason, the power with the amount of oversaturation of football. They're basically saying enough is enough, I think was the quote that they used where there needs to be a limit put on the number of additional games that you can throw into a calendar year and they pointed to the expansion of the Champions League and they pointed to the expansion of the Club World Cup and of the World Cup and how they kind of all happened quite close together, all of these expansions and they really feel like it's reached a point where player welfare is all like it's a tipping point basically. It was quite clever. They can do it all. Yeah, it was quite clever because he also positioned it as well as it's not good for the domestic product either because they're saying like we're again having to reorganize domestic competitions, domestic leagues, we don't have much flexibility with that. It said some cut compositions have been scrapped or adjusted against where only certain teams go and it's said so we don't get to do a full domestic competition. I mean England's one of the few that still has two. Most countries have been off having two domestic competitions because they've just gone like cards. There's just not enough space in the calendar so whether anything happens. Yeah, I mean it was clever how they also he also pulled in the Super League and how he basically said that the fans have spoken that they care about domestic leagues, they care about domestic competitions and that this push for big international Super League style competitions is not what the average football or football fan wants and so that was just interesting how to use that argument. It's funny with the Super League where you wait for the good guys and now they've created the Champions League which basically is the Super League. Yeah, I mean I don't think in reality neither of them were ever the good guys. No, no but it's funny how that got that got forgotten very very quickly wasn't it? But you know, it's interesting the interesting moment we live in so I think before we carry on with your matter so rest of the week, keep keep the bell icon on because we'll have a few of things the international football is nearly over. I have not really been following with that. I did see generally the England games, I've actually turned them on that in a second off because I forgot they were on. Trend goal was very good. I saw the trend goal that was about well for us like no. I sadly went to Anfield and watched Manchester City beat Liverpool which was a bit of a bloke and 92nd minute winner for Manchester City so Liverpool still have yet to win at Anfield which is a bit of a... I thought they had a pretty good turnout though. Yeah, yeah the the cop was full and the lower Kenny was pretty much full so you know could turn out you know no comps either so it's all paid for. I think it was like a tenor for adults, four quid for kids you know so you know if you want to you want to get yourself to watch games at Anfield, there's still two more games to be played at Anfield they're going to be playing Chelsea, not Chelsea's only Man United and Everton. So good opportunity to get to get to see a game at Anfield you know because we know it's it's kind of like the oldest trying to get one for the men's game so look and you know what it's good game good game the result wasn't what I wanted but the game was good you know it's good to get a game back at Anfield I'm going to Saint Helen's on Sunday so we've got back-to-back football on Sunday it's about the women are women against Palace and then we've got the Chelsea game which... How's how's that working out with their move to that stadium is that good for them so far? Results... results wise hasn't been great the actual facilities in the actual stadium is really good um it was good it was good that um listen we went tramming was good to us but I think facilities wise it's better Saint Helen's better park facilities just it generally is just more where they went the game to go it's more professional you can see whether it's done a 10-year lease there as well so I think long-term it will be a good move this year it's just been a bit of an indifferent start I think Liverpool have got a record so far of winning every game at half-time one-milk unfortunately we're going to turn one of them into a win that's and it's been a story this season of lots of late equalizers or late winners so but listen it's early days you know they're currently fifth so you know it's not too bad but it's time to go you know and look the aim is to try and get closer to that top four that's the idea you know only top three get um European football so but we will see on the positive side with this young Katie we've got Olivia Smith is really good at 19 and she's how holds the record now for our first ever goal at Anfield and again seeing it it's worth a watch you know she does bang it from outside the box um going to share with you I saw that no no that was hoping just that was the week before uh it's an open place uh comes out so she's hated from the edge of the edge of the box bottom corner good goal uh very exciting tellings you know someone's good with man city of targeting and targeting with um constructive fouling but sort of a compliment to how well she's playing is like teams are now trying to think of a plan for this 19 year old so exciting times you know so that that's all all good look forward to look forward to the pelvis game not pelvis game chills game go through the games but i'm looking forward to getting back away from international football um i like the routine i like the routine of having games um i think it's going to be a challenge um you know i'm hoping that having Virgil come back a little bit early you know i know that he wouldn't have wanted to get a red card but i think having him come back a little bit early having Salah come back a little bit early um it looks like Elliot is well on his way to recovery which is great i don't think he'll be ready for the Chelsea game but um he was running on grass he was doing some weightlifting today in some of the media so i think there's a couple things to be positive about there um in terms of the lead up um so hopefully they'll have a little bit of time to prepare um and i yeah i'm looking forward to it i think i'm kind of tired of the the storyline of Liverpool haven't faced anyone um i'd like to kind of just get this game over with hopefully with a good result um and kind of kill that storyline um because i do think that Liverpool have been good i think that there's room for improvement obviously and i think they're still transitioning into a new style but i don't know i kind of just want them to have something to hang their hand their hat on so that the media doesn't continuously use that as a stick to beat them with i mean if you look at city the obviously daddy asked them you know at home but city well they've won all their home games oh sorry everyone knows i don't defeat it at home they've got the records of our go behind every home game which is something we were doing last year and that's not sustainable you've got to eventually get to a point where that's going to be fixed you know so but listen it'll be interesting because i asked about it they had a tricky run ask them i would say um but they've got the interest on coming up so we'll have to see how it how it goes but i'm actually looking forward to this run i can see some some of our fan bases getting quite techy you know it's so many games it's all difficult runs but kind of what you're in it for you want you want to have this run again you want to have these run difficult if you mean you're in the big big competitions and that's what you want to do yeah everyone in the chat kind of pointing out that the Kelleher has had a lot of um a lot of action the last couple of games for um looks like he's been busy so that's good at least he's getting a little bit of match fitness i think for me that sort of i i always worry a little bit when alie's not there um and that that's not to speak badly about kelleher because i you know i think he's probably the best second keeper in the entire league yeah but he's not Allison he's not Allison so i think that that's that's one thing that you know again i hope i hope he shows up and and silences me and other critics um he usually tends to i usually tend to get really worried and then he has a fantastic game and i'm like oh yep nope that's fine that's why we love him um so i'm hoping for more of that um if you're also a rock and go wrong go yeah i mean it looks like um so i was like i had a really good game today i think he scored a brace um so i was like so i was like care for something i think grandpa had a bit of a difficult game against um germany i think i didn't even show that in the united states i was i was kind of pissed off because that was the one i wanted to watch yeah careful saying he's getting a bit it was a bit of a lesson for him in terms of how how germany controlled by midfield but he did say that's kind of gonna do his development the world of good because that's what that's what you're gonna need to learn isn't it how how to cope with that sort of stuff uh i mean the more the more that he faces the more he learns exactly you know so i spoke to the only thing you've got to hope is the uh the south american life start up you know it's how how much that takes out from me that's probably the only concern and the counter thing's going to play choose tonight well talk is he's going to start choose tonight early i was wednesday morning playing Bolivia but luckily i think it's always that it's not altitude this time because lesson last time we had to play at altitude it's first game that was a bit of a been a hard going i can't even imagine it'd be incredibly difficult yeah but least at at least it's a wednesday morning so you know and we're not playing till sunday so i think the fixture has been kind and that way in which i've got a game till sunday so we've got a little bit longer to um what about deas when does he play you know i don't know if stopping out i'm sure someone in the chat can tell me yeah so yeah so so you know when you like a few you know a few puns pretty the i-2 finish comfortably i had a lookable we'll see how that goes that's looking interesting well oh yeah right let's let's find out where they are then we'll make a move uh kem skive open kem skive open i think he i think he needs to get gave up on his internet now yeah he's get he's just gave up completely kem he's had enough a whole hour and two minutes in and he's finally had enough yeah well i don't know i've just seen his mess enough give it up so like i don't know when he sent that if i was trying to deal with my router for an hour and two minutes i probably would have smashed it against the wall already i don't i don't have that kind of patience with technology when technology goes bad i'm like i have to walk away yeah i'm i'm not the best good good luck working on it i see in it no i would not be good at it i t i'm one of those people that's like oh did you you know did you smack the side of the screen a couple times or did you turn it back on and off again it's based off that work so i mean it especially with the older computers it actually used to work quite a bit i don't i don't think the new tech responds well to that anymore uh get on the company for i'll say get on the company kev big time now i had to issue his wife i hope for christmas maybe she can his own satellite dish oh you have to know okay let's see we've got okay so everyone plays on so it's tuesday for me so it'd be wednesday for you guys um so we've got columbia verse chili and then we've got iragway equator and then argentina ballivia those are all um i mean a little bit sad nunis play nunis are getting to get for your gua actually could work it off later that's true we haven't talked about that give him more minutes which is probably what he needs you know just a few more game measures from chairs and columbian fans will be fine yeah but you know but no i mean in all seriousness him getting game time getting a little bit of rhythm i'd love him to bang fugals so that he can get a little bit of confidence because i do feel like he's such a confidence player yeah also be able to just get a tune out of it and you know different environments you know something's used to it you know it could help us because he's going to get games in this run you know we're all going to have we're we'll keep saying slots gonna have to rotate but i think he really is going to have to rotate in this run i can't see he's doing the trick we were doing so far but you know i think so but i'll ask you to do it a little bit i was trying to do it like the correct way but i can't i can't we're just gonna skip it we'll move on they're gonna make me pronounce like adidas which i know i say in the american version or puma which i know i say in the american version or nike like i look at as long as you don't say a lumen of foil will be okay see i'd like sorry you could i that is how i pronounce it but you know i i know i know it's that's fine you know i get it i get it cool right listen it's uh five past eleven so let's let everyone get away because it's um well it's fab's then for us and not i'm not sure what is it in about what is in your end uh five past six so it's dinner time dinner time i eat it better cool so listen that was our little tributes uh the lovable joe mattep you know hopefully we get to see him come back at him for some point you know i don't like that i would like him to come back for like some sort of testimonial game legends game it's a legends game the wolf your leg game in march oh commercial maths for legends game i'll be so happy we've got joe and we have got that to look forward to in in next five six years we're gonna start our legend games are gonna be fantastic to have a bobby back and i don't know they're gonna be really good yeah my bed the thirsty so that's what to look forward to so cool but listen until then thanks ashleaf and can you all like subscribe and all that good stuff uh click the bell icon and no doubt we'll have more exciting stuff coming very very soon until then take care this podcast is part of the sports social podcast network [BLANK_AUDIO]
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Chris, Ashley and Kev look back at the career of Joel Matip as the former Reds defender announces his retirement from football.
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