[MUSIC] Fan morning shows, 4'10, 5'9" in fan bed, and it's Frank Gunning. Leafs, Flyers tonight and no Mitch Marner tonight. And no Mitch Marner tomorrow in Washington against the Capitals. New power play with Timothy Lillegrine and Tyler Batuzzi. >> Yep, remaining on power play one witch on tomorrow's though. But okay, so nothing matters, right? >> I mean, in the grand scheme of things, absolutely, with this team specifically, even more so. >> Nothing matters, you know? It's just the universe is expanding eventually. >> Dump on your country, apologize for it later. Ben will always welcome you back with wide open arms. >> No, you, no, to you, no apologizing ever matters. You are who you say you are and you can never change. For you, you can never change, evolution can never happen. Yeah, the universe is expanding, and not only will the Earth, you know, cease to exist one day, eventually lighter than you think. But life in the universe as a whole will cease to exist. >> Because everything- >> There's going to be another. >> Yeah, anyways. And then to the more micro, nothing matters with this least team because you can't extrapolate. Because they've been so good. They've thrown up 115 point regular seasons, and they've lost in the first round. Nothing matters. They play it at Montreal. Canadian's team that finished more than 20 points behind them in the regular season. Standings were of three games to one, and they lose to them. So nothing, nothing matters, except for maybe this. >> Mm, and you got, have I found something that matters? >> Mm-hm. >> Okay, so last March and April, so of last season. Okay, okay, you may recall, may believe some mates moves the deadline. >> I've heard. >> And then they won a postseason series for the first time in 19 years. >> Mm, close my eyes, my picture to far is on one knee right now. >> Wild, wacky stuff. And those, that final month and a half of the regular season, these power play was good. 28%. >> Mm-hm. >> You know what it was in that first round series against the lightning? >> I bet you have the number for me. >> 29%. >> Whoo. >> Is that the one thing that matters here, Brent, carrying over? Because it's not just that the power play's gone stale during the postseason. There's been times where it's like, yeah, the numbers look good. But God, they just, they don't look good by the end of the regular season. Is that the one area that you can actually carry over, or is it an indication of something that is going to carry over into the postseason? >> It is the easiest, I shouldn't say easiest, because I think if you were playing a kind of, and this is a much harder thing to quantify, but if you were playing a structured solid team game, I think that is the thing that can kind of carry over the most. But that's such a nebulous thing, it's hard and impossible to quantify, quite honestly. In terms of the metrics that you can point to, power play is the thing that leads itself most to that continuing to happen, right? It's continuity, it is skill players taking advantage of an opportunity, and most importantly, it's so much predicated on confidence, especially with those guys. If you feel like you have the, and not, no, Morgan Riley is maybe the guy you don't want feeling this way, and he's not in power play one right now, so it doesn't matter. And if you have the confidence, or the understanding that you're going to have success to where you can take that extra millisecond, it's not even a half second, it's a millisecond with the puck to open up a different passing angle, or open up a better spot for yourself. I do see a world where that can kind of carry over. Now, the thing is, is I also do kind of believe that with penalty kill as well, so it also kind of matters who you're matching up against. I'm not even going to the nightmare scenario that is the least killing penalties. I'm just talking about, if you end up with the Florida boss, and it's probably going to be one of those two where they're rolling on the penalty kill, I think that carries over almost just as much as a good power play does. Yeah, Leafs couldn't score on the power play in the Panthers series. They look correct now, but it was a huge part of the reason why they were able to get over the lightning in the first round. Tyler Bertuzzi was so good, despite the fact that the Bruins lost in seven games of the Panthers season ago, we all talk about the ten points that he scored in the seven game series. Three of his five goals though came on the power play. Yeah. I think you made a very astute comment earlier in talking about the power play and how it changes in the post season. That, well, I mean this team's offense entirely is like, hey, let's try and pass it to the back of the net. But specifically on the power play, I got to tell you, it feels like that's the reason why it dries up at the worst possible times for this team is because they try to get too cute and they're capable of being so cute too. That's the thing. They can see it. They've done it before. And yeah, the things get bogged down at five on five during the post season, but man power play, here's where we get to do our thing. But you got the best penalty killers in the NHL up against you in the post season. Maybe Timothy Lilligren is going to be more apt to just sift it on goal from the point. When you got a couple of big bodies trying to whack the puck into the net, one of those big bodies is Tyler Bautuzzi, who has shown proof of concept in scoring three power play goals for the Bruins a season ago. Is he, no matter what happens to your results wise, rest of the season, is he, I must have on power play one considering what he's done in that role last season? >> I think it is up for discussion. I still think you want John Tavares in that spot, and obviously you're not taking off one of Marlar, Marner, Kneelander, or Matthews. I tried to turn them all into one guy there for a second. You're not going to, boy, what a player that be. And if you only had to pay him like 11, oh my god. But you're not taking any of those guys off for Burt. So it really just comes down to Tavares or Burtuzzi conversation. And I think that's an open competition. I think Tavares is probably the better guy in that role. I do still have more confidence. I think you like having them out there for face offs as well, like that part of it can't be discounted. And look, Matthews can take draws, Kneelander can take draws, so it's not that you absolutely have to have them. But that part has to be included in the conversation. But I know they're not going to do this in the playoffs. But honestly, why not both? Can you have Mitch Marner quarterback power play? You go five forwards. >> I don't hate that idea. >> I know it's nuts, but you need to get desperate, I want to see that at least. >> It's like one of the experimenting things that I want to see here with these meaningless regular season games. I want to see that look. >> Well, with the exception of Marner, every guy there, Burtuzzi is a little different in this regard. But all of them can do the thing where they go stand in front of the net, need cross checks and be a big body and screen the goalie. And they can also be skilled players on the perimeter, Burtuzzi more one dimensional in that regard. But Austin Matthews, you don't want to use him as a screener. But if he winds up in front of the net, he's a pretty capable tipper of pox and obviously has good hands to finish in there. William Neelander, go look at his goal map. They're all scored right around the net. I know it doesn't feel like it when he's not going, but go look at the goal map that's where he scores all his goals from. And Tavares and Burtuzzi do a ton of work there. So I think you have to at least see it. I think that it is probably a little too cute, especially, I think the Panthers have been pretty dangerous, short-handed. So you got to, if that's the match up, you got to watch out there. >> So, but should you see it in the regular season? >> Absolutely. Why shouldn't you? >> Yeah, I mean, this is the time for experimenting. This is the time for figuring it out and throwing stuff at the wall. And despite the overall success that the power play has had, just recently, even with Mitch Marner in the lineup, it just hasn't looked the same way it looked over that seven-game winning streak where it was really rolling and it must be said Morgan Riley wasn't playing. So I don't know. Figure it out. >> I don't know who's starting in goal tonight. >> Sorry, one last thing on special teams, just Flyers, Jekyll and Hyde, who they're going to get tonight. Third best penalty kill in the league, dead last power play. >> Yeah, and we know they've scored the most short-handed goals, I think, in the NHL this season. >> So yeah, we'll see. >> We don't know who's starting in net tonight, Ilya Sampsonov was pretty damn good, I thought against the Hurricanes. >> Yes. >> I mean, he allowed four goals, two of those that- >> That's the attacker. >> That's one of the things that we give up when they're losing games and it's strictly his fault. >> So if he doesn't start tonight, because, again, this team is operated in the same manner that Mike Babcock operated with the best goal, he gets to start in game one of a back-to-back. If he doesn't start tonight, are we once again to the belief that this team is force feeding us Joe Wall, that Joe Wall is their guy, all things being equal, they would love for him to take the reins and run with it or is that reading too much into tonight's decision? >> I don't think it's reading too much into it because they, and I understand why, like, you know, maybe I don't understand, but again, it's just the perils of Toronto, if this is happening in Arizona, the coach probably says, "Here's what I'm thinking on goaltending. All right, we good? I'm gonna go play golf, who wants to come?" But here, you message things a little differently. We talked about this. How much is the Capitals weighing on this? Do they want to give that game to Samsonov to let him slay the dragon? I would more look at it as they are still looking at it as an open competition. And I think that Tre living even had some comments on goaltending yesterday and said they have two guys that are confident, and it's like not gonna tip his hand as to who the starter is there, but in my mind's eye, there is a starter for this team right now, and it's Ilya Samsonov. >> Yeah, he has to start tonight. >> I don't, I would like them if they're going to give him that game for the Capitals to just explicitly stay, it's for that reason. I need to know, I need an explanation if Ilya Samsonov is not your starter tonight. Even if it is just, hey, we like the way Sammy's going, we wanted to challenge him against Washington. We think he gives us an excellent chance in the back half of the back to back. I'll hear that because to your point, none of this matters. They lose tonight's game. What does it matter? >> Nothing. >> Nothing. >> Nothing. >> Nothing matters. >> Nothing matters. >> If they lose tonight, it's not gonna affect their postseason positioning. Does it matter in the sense of how does Joe Wall look, how does Samsonov look, how does the penalty go? There's things to take out of the game, but the two points, 1.0 points, if I do what I did yesterday and start giving people three points for wins, none of it matters. A Philly would kill for a three pointer right now. >> Yeah. These are games against teams that very much need the win more than the Maple Leafs. >> So yeah, how much does that matter as well? >> That's good. I think it's good to be playing teams that care, right? Because yeah, you don't care, it seemingly don't care as much as the hurricanes care about getting two points. >> No, that's not how it works. They actually cared the most in the second period, because they, because they went up three nothing. >> Yeah. >> So I was wondering if they could stop caring, but then they cared a lot in overtime because they cared to play. >> Yeah, that's true. >> And then I, wow. >> Didn't care. >> You saying you were the Samsung, I didn't care. Wow. Look at you saying that in the shootout. >> [LAUGH] >> Yeah. They don't care. And I, again, who can blame them, considering where they are in the standings, considering how they will be judged this regular season. It's good to play teams that care. They need the two points that are doing the thing that we thought the least would be doing at this point in this season. Being desperate for points, it's funny how like, you know, the one comment I did think that was interesting at a Brad true living from the GM meetings was like, yeah, I, people were like concerned that we were in a wild card spot and only six points up on a playoff one. And I was like, great. This means we get to see this team play some important hockey. And they did and they responded. And since the all-star break, they've been awesome, but now like, so he was of the belief that that was meaningful, playing meaningful hockey games. But okay, so what do we do with the like, last two months of the season, which are back to being not meaningful? Anyways, it means something for the other guys. I think it means something as far as this team's plan for game one of the postseason. If Joe Wall starts tonight, cuz they're just, I don't, I think Joe Wall's capable of going on a run and returning to the form that we saw before he suffered the high ankle sprain. I don't think we've seen that since he returned safe for like the coyote's game was really good. But since then, it's kind of man, like not as bad as Elia Sampson off at his worst, but not cuz he's still in the NHL, correct? I think given their druthers, they, they would go and defer not to the incumbent to the guy who they think is more technically sound in Joe Wall. And I think if he starts tonight, it's not on merit. It's really not. Cuz on merit, it should be Elia Sampson off operating as the number one. And if you're telling me you just want to play him against the capital as his old team, you're doing mental gymnastics to do that. He's the number one. If it's a meritocracy, he starts tonight. If not, you're telling me you want Joe Wall to get the, the nod in game one of the postseason, all things being equal. >> I, I mostly follow what you're saying, but if they, and I understand goaltending is a different position. So it's not apples to apples. But if they said, all right, you know what Nick Robertson, you're getting power play time tonight. Cuz we want to see what that looks like. And sorry to have number Tuesday, you're not going to get that spot. We want to see what it looks like. They're trying things out. They're seeing what works. They're looking at things before the playoffs. I don't think that it is a definitive that they are trying to hand things to Joe Wall. If he gets it tonight, I think it's a case of they still know they're going to need that guy. Would I start Sampson off tonight 1000% a later yesterday? He should get both first half to the back to back. It makes all the sense in the world. But I still think that with, we talked about them experimenting with five forwards on the power play. Is that the best version of their power play? Maybe. Maybe not. Much like with gold. I think I think the gold ending thing is just it's so, it's so different because it is. It's very much up in the air and the narratives around both guys has been so bizarre. And I think it's a little more important than like how many minutes Nick Robertson gets. It's the most important thing. Hey, we can talk a lot about penalty kill and power play. Out of that is as important as like getting the saves you don't know that they're going to require, especially against the Panthers, if that's who they play the first round. Anyways, Blake Snell finally off the board got some money. Not a lot. I mean, 62 million, I guess I take it to your deal off out after the first year. With the San Francisco Giants who do a nice piece of business boy, Jorge Salera, not like a Blake Snell elite dumpster diving. They did a good job in that regard. So Scott Morris just has Jordan Montgomery left and obviously like he's looking around at the landscape and understanding that, okay, the same thing's going to happen to me. Blake Snell is the reigning National League Cy Young award winner. By the way, Logan Webb, the runner up for the Cy Young award last year. So the Giants have the top two finishers in the Cy Young award race a season ago. Two shabby in a ballpark where it's certainly more pitcher friendly than hitter friendly. If you win the best, the most important award for pitchers in the sport and you can't get paid, I'm not sure I understand the idea of a pillow deal where Blake Snell is like, well, here's the thing. I'm going to have a better season and then go back into the free agent market. And it's not like, well, I just happened to run into this market where there were a bunch of other pitchers and people just, they didn't have money to go around. It was no, this was the one where you were clearly the best guy and you didn't get paid. And apparently, according to Bob Nightingale, the Yankees did have a $150 million deal on the table five years for Blake Snell that he rebuffed. And then at the last second, the Yankees said, yeah, that's off the table. We don't want you anymore, which is hilarious considering the Garrett Cole is going to miss at least a month, maybe two this season. This is a tough off season for Scott Boris. And I think next off season will be much better with Juan Soto. But if you're Blake Snell, I think in particular Blake Snell, because Matt Chapman can make the argument that I didn't have a good season and the finger injury really did hurt me and I am going to revisit my market when I have a great year in San Francisco and a tough place to play for Blake Snell, how's it going to be any better than a season ago? And you're, you didn't get paid to get this one? That's, it's not. I think what happened is he was getting sick and tired of not playing baseball. And he didn't want to get caught with an even worse chair. If the, if the offer went from a hundred plus to now, or sorry, 150 to now 60, what's it going to look like in a week and a half? Give me a uniform. Let me go play baseball. And I'd certainly rather have 30 million than no million. This guy's made 47 million in his career. So yeah, nice, nice chunk of change for him for the, for the two years or one with the opt out there. I am such of two minds of this because when you say Blake Snell, Cy Young winner, that elicits some, that elicits one type of pitcher. But when you dig into the numbers and the walks and how deep he goes into games, there's certainly, there are certainly flaws with the player there. But I also can't, I just picture any other sport and I guess I shouldn't say that because Lamar Jackson could have been had for anybody and he's going to win the, or he won the MVP. And nobody wanted to make an offer for him, but it's just so hard to see in a sport where a guy like this would be sitting out there. It seems like it happens all the time in baseball and it's just an issue. There's no fix for it. I don't know what to do, but there, I don't know if you remove comp picks. If that is a way to go about it, but then the, you know, the, the A's of the world, you're going to start complaining about these things, I, I, I loathe it for baseball. I think it's terrible that a guy like Blake Snell who, yeah, not perfect. Back to back, or two times a young winner had to wait this long and take this deal. Part of that, obviously, is on the agent. Of course, he misread the market, but it's, it's kind of a sad state of the game as well to me. Yeah, not necessarily to me. It led the National League in walks. He, he made 32 starts, but he only threw 180 innings, right? This is a guy who I think you love to have in the postseason, although the rays would tell you that you don't want to keep them in there too long. I think we're cool for both teams who did that. Not good. Yeah. And the ERA was a National League low two, two, five, and, and you can scoff at the advanced numbers. And hey, but who cares what his ex-fip was, what he really did on the field was limit the opposition in scoring runs. That's true. He did that factually. Congratulations Blake Snell last year. You were the best in the National League at allowing runs on a per-nine inning basis. But you can't just ignore those numbers because that's the way other teams are evaluating him. And they're, they're trying to extrapolate what this guy's going to be worth over the next couple of years. And it's, that's an outlier season, like could, could he, could he have a great season? Will he have a pretty good season? I think I feel pretty confident in saying the Blake Snell is going to be pretty good. But is he going to be other world? Is he going to win another Sy Young Award? I think, you know, history would tell you that if you outperform your peripherals to the degree at which he did, you probably do for regression. Hey, I know Alec Manoa, part of it was like conditioning, injury stuff, but what how dare you? Also part of it was Alec Manoa for two years did out pitch his peripherals. This guy doesn't throw him 99, he doesn't miss a lot of bats. But for some reason, he was able to, to gut through a couple of seasons where he's in Sy Young Award contention. It happens. It might not happen immediately following the great year that you outperform your peripherals, but clearly the rest of Major League Baseball. Honestly, I just keep going back to this phrase in class and it's like, wow, Scott Bors really stubbed his toe on this one. And boy, yeah, some of these teams really keeping their powder drying, just not willing to spend. This is a very unique free agent class where all these guys had significant warts. And I wouldn't have paid any of these guys. I actually think it's all smart business, all of them, whether it's Cody Ballinger, whether it's Matt Chapman, whether it's Blake Snell, I wouldn't outlay the type of money that Scott Bors was looking for for any of those guys. I would for Juan Soto, Juan Soto, we're looking at Juan Soto not getting his money, not going to happen because he's going to kill it for the Yankees and the Yankees are going to be under immense pressure to sign them to whatever he's worth. But all these guys, they all, like, I was about to say they all stink. They don't all stink, but they have various levels of scent to them. So here's my problem with that. And you know, I suppose maybe the answer is, well, stop thinking of it this way and just think of it in a vacuum. But I think of all other sports where there is a cap and there actually is a number that you can spend to and you can't spend a dime more than that unless a guy gets hurt by happenstance right before the deadline, then you're, then you're allowed to do it. These teams signed flawed players to deals every year. We don't have a guy who's going to, I'll just bring it back to hockey because of course that's where my brain goes. We don't have some competent middle six winger who is just waiting, waiting, waiting for their prove it. Generally speaking, those guys, even the middle class like gets their money and it is just so mind boggling to me in a sport where, yeah, there's thresholds, but there's no cap that somebody wouldn't just say, oh, one year. And I guess the answer is, well, it did finally happen. The Giants did get to that point, but how does it take this long? Sad day for baseball too strong. I'll walk that back. That's the saddest day, no, God hit by all the pretzels. Oh, the saddest day in baseball was when Joey fought us at the stuff about Canada baseball. That was the saddest day in baseball. And then the two next status were the two apologies. But I think that when you when you look at it, it's just so odd to me that there are flawed players in the NFL and the NBA in the NHL that gets signed to term every year because teams have just got to find a way to scratch that little extra bit better. And say what you will, but the flaws Blake Snell has of course they exist. Can't tell me he wouldn't help a team get just a little bit better. And that's the part of it that just always boggles my mind. And it is clearly a, I don't know, financial, cultural system issue, however you want to look at it with baseball, because it's so different than the other three major sports we have. Yeah. And it's the only one with money. It doesn't. I mean, it matters, but doesn't. The fact that the Yankees wouldn't pony up for Blake Snell when he could have landed in their lap. And yeah, I like to think Cashman just hates Boris and he's like, hey, you want a hundred bill? Yeah. He's gonna have to deal with him when it comes to soda next year. So probably not poking the bear. Yeah. So kudos to you giants. You land all the the bargain bin deals. All right. When we come back, talk to our pal Jason Boogler, sports ad hockey analyst next with the fan morning show continues. Ben and his friend gunning sports net 590 the fan. Unrivaled insight, analysis, and opinions on all things blue jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know, it's been really hard these last seven years in the postseason. They played really good teams and you know, they got into a bunch of game sevens. Okay. It's really just luck. Yeah. What are you going to do? I agree with that, but not when you say it like that. All right. Let's talk to Jason Boogler's sports ad hockey analyst. How's it going, Jason? That sound by just the horrible way to start my morning. Oh my goodness. Gee whiz. Man. That's just, can I, can I get it off my chest? Yes. Please. That's why we played it. Okay. All right. I have been scratching myself since I heard some of that. Listen, since the game on Saturday itself, here's the thing with the Toronto Maple Leafs. On balance, they've been on a pretty good run. There's a lot of positive things to take out of their game over the last even 20 game segment, but over their last really three, I would say top top games. I'm talking about the two games against Boston and I'm talking now against Carolina the other night. I mean, these statements that come out of some of the players and even the coaches mouth, you know, about learning lessons and we played well here, you know, it's not good enough for me guys. I have to tell you, I, there's a way to win and there's a way to lose. And a couple of years ago, we went through a handshake line and we, you know, we could feel that we gained more respect from our opponent, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah. I just, if I'm a fan of the Toronto Maple Leafs and I just walked out of the building and I blew a thousand bucks for myself and my family to watch a really entertaining game against the Carolina Hurricanes. It's really entertaining. I got my money's worth, but I expect them to be able to hold on to a three-nothing lead, four-two lead with less environments up in the hockey game at this time of year. And the response is that, you know, these, this is what we can expect and play off. So, you know, it was a good lesson to learn more way beyond that with this group. And you know, that wasn't what I expected to hear. I expected to hear, geez, we got to be better than that. We blew that. Like at this time of year, getting ready for playoffs against quality of bonus, we got to be better. We got to knuckle down and win that game. And it's driven me crazy ever since, ever since Saturday. So I'm glad I could have this little therapy session here. No, I'm happy to let you vent because, yeah, there's been a, there's been a lot of that going around. Let me just say I've received that exact rant via text several times over the last few days since, since those comments and, you know, not that this is least PR fall, far from it. But you got to put somebody out there other than knee lander. If there's ever a guy to not fall on the sword and be like, well, it is what it is. What do you want from me? It's knee lander. But to that point, how much of that is part of the problem that we've talked about in the past of the way the core is wired. I mean, I'm not doing any referendums after game 65 of the regular season. We'll have that when the playoffs roll around like we do every year. But is that just kind of a microcosm of the way that this core is maybe wired to you? It feels like that to me. It really does, you know, and then we brought in some players in the off season, you know, that we're going to provide more snot and determination into the lineup and, but really at the core, this is the type of like, let me, let me ask you guys are all presented to you guys this way. If we as if we as an audience are presented that type of response to a question and we're not obviously satisfied with it, what do you think the conversation is like behind closed doors? Like, you know, these guys never have enough. They don't have a bad days like when I'm starting players coming through the system and I'm looking for, you know, I always like to go to go to kid and I know that on the day that I saw him, he performed at a high level and on that day, he wrote an exam or he broke up, you know, him and his girlfriend broke up or he was feeling under the weather, you know, he flew whatever, but it was a big game and he, you know, he produced at the highest level of his ability on his worst day and I don't get that feeling sometimes from this group and it drives me nuts and I'm concerned that that's exactly what we're preparing ourselves for again for playoffs. I hope not. I mean, I honestly hope not, but it feels like that and it's just too laissez faire for me. I think most people echo that. You mentioned the conversations in the room. I think some people have looked at this is, you know what, they don't want to throw med red meat to the voices outside. Maybe they're having much stoner conversations. Do you think that's possible or do you think that we're kind of seeing those conversations that are having of how we'll get them next time? Because I think if you're somebody who sees that and you want to believe that that's not the case, you go, okay, they're saying that so it doesn't elicit the red meat response and then they go tear each other to shreds when the media gets out of there. Like, do you think that what they're saying is to us is what they're saying to themselves? Potentially. Yeah. Like, I don't know that again, I don't know that they are programmed to be really hard on each other. You know, like, I remember this, like, this is, I'm all, I'm 53 years old. But way, way back in the day when the Edmonton Oilers were about to become a dynasty in the Wayne Gretzky era era, they lost the New York Islanders when the Islanders were planning out of their era of being a dynasty. And one of the things that Wayne Gretzky put in his book way back in the day was this. He said, you know, when we were done walking by the New York Islanders dressing room after they won the Stanley Cup and we just kind of walked out of the rink, they weren't even celebrating the way we anticipated they would celebrate. And the reason why they were so beat up, they were so bruised, they were so exhausted, they had left everything out, yet we walked out and we still had a lot of energy left in the tank. We still had more to give. And I feel like sometimes that's a Toronto Maple Leafs, like, we look at their opponent or we look at on balance, like, they should be better. They should have more success. And they've been, they've been fine. So I don't want to beat them down over to the last 20 game segment, you know, on balance. And this is the conversation that goes on behind the behind closed doors. Like, they're too satisfied with each other, guys. And I don't like that about them. I think the coaches are harder on them behind behind the scenes. I do believe that. But, you know, do you think that the Florida Panthers, if they blow up four too late on Saturday night to Carolina, do you think any one of their players are coming? Do you think the trucks coming out and talking the same way that some of the Toronto Maple players did on Saturday, do you think the coaches, not a chance, not a chance? And did you see, right, Brandon Moore's face on the bench when they went down the top? Like, he was losing it, okay? Like, he was a, he was a, he was a, he was a powder keg, and something must have happened for them to respond. Yeah. No, I agree. And as far as what the Panthers are saying, after they're against, I have no idea. Do they even have a reporter that's following them? I, I, who would know, it's a, like, they might as well not exist, like, tree falling in the wood stuff. Um, okay. So I agree with everything that's been said here, and I said it yesterday, coming off of that game was very bizarre, and you're right. Even the coach was like, yeah, well, you know, what are you going to do? Hey, win some, you lose some. Now that being said, let me just make the devil's art, advocate argument here. It is like a rather meaningless regular season game. And we thought this was going to be the year, Jason, where these, these games meant something down the stretch, they're not barring something totally unforeseen, okay? Could they mathematically catch the Bruins or the Panthers? Yeah, sure. Could they mathematically lose all their games? Could the 18 wheeler go off the road, I suppose, that would, that would be surprising at this point. And they know, just as we know that they will be judged ultimately by their postseason success or failure. And obviously those type of comments cannot occur at the conclusion of a blown to goal lead even under two minutes ago in a postseason game. I don't think we're getting those type of comments. But the fact that it does happen in the 17th last game of the season and another meaningless trudge towards the end of a regular season, does that impact the way we should view those comments at all? Yeah, the nothing is meaningless to me. That's, you know, like, like I've heard that and I've read that, you know, and I, you know, there's going to be some maintenance here between now and the end of the year. I'm with you. They're not going to, they are where they are. This is where they're going to finish. I mean, the odds of them moving, you know, north or south are astronomical. So they are where they are. They're going to be slotted here. It's just going to depend on who the opponent becomes, whether it be Boston or Florida, you know, or whoever in the, in the first round. Here's the thing, bad habits can creep into your game that you can't fix in a week and a half come playoffs down the stretch here. So these are meaningless. These are every night means something and they're teaching points towards the end of the year. And there's been tons of lessons learned with this group over the course of the last several years. And I always go back to the fan experience too. When I hear, when I hear that, I know that there's going to be maintenance. I know there's going to be certain things that creep into our game towards the end and we know we might give a guy a day off potentially if it's a nothing game and he's beat up in the last week and half of the season. I get that. People are showing up and they have an expectation and these guys are pros making millions of dollars. You can't take a day off. Like if you got your investments on Wall Street today, you know, you want the guy because, you know, your your fund has been doing really well. They're just kind of mail it in for a week. You know, it doesn't work like that. No. It doesn't work like that. You know, show up, play the way that, you know, play to a team identity that's going to be required to have playoff success. And don't forget, there's an underbelly here. Let's call it the back end of the defense. We got to work some things out, don't we? So that's, we don't got to work that out. We got to work out some things in that. There's still a lot of moving parts between now and the puck drop and playoffs. Yeah, there are one of one of the moving pieces that's moving back into the lineup is Simone Benoit. This is a guy who you want to talk about the fan experience. Part of it is the literal zero expectations that he came into the season with, but I don't know that there's a guy that's outperformed expectations, especially from this fan base's perception more than Benoit. He was the odd man out after the deadline, you understand needing to get the new bodies in. And you know, we knew injuries were going to happen so we'd eventually find his way back in. But you know, I felt like this is a guy who, you know, deserves nothing, got nothing to do with it. You put out your best guys there, but he certainly didn't deserve, in my opinion, to come out of the lineup. He has been excellent for them this year. How do you think the layoff could potentially affect Benoit? Do you think it could have helped them maybe? And do you expect that this is a chance for him to maybe reinsert himself back in as opposed to seemingly being the seventh guy on the outside looking in? Yeah, I really hope that that he responds positively. And I think he will because, you know, I'm one of the guys at the beginning of the year, and I think the three of us talked about it. I was, you know, this is a seven or an eight. Like I've always believed that the B and you know, we talked about it when they went through some of their injuries. This guy's a seven or an eight, but you really, he's moved himself into the mix to be a pretty steady six. You know, like Nick Sealer's been way better and filly, like it's a kind of a little bit of an obscene example. But what I'm trying to say to you is that Nick Sealer at 775 and Benoit in Toronto, like these are guys that punch way above their playing weight, don't they? Like they give you way more than what their value actually says they should give. I wish Benoit was the right shot right now because Lil' Grim to me is still the wild card. And like even the other night watching them, there's still a couple of muffins, isn't there? Like get the worst times of the game. So by getting back to Benoit, you know, he leads the team in hits on the back end, that nice leads the team up front. I think he's going to be just fine, he's going to be motivated, he'll be ready to go. And then he's going to give them food for thought. He'll be like, how do we, how do we take them out again, you know, in one of those situations? Well, and Timothy Lil' Grim's going to get a shot on Powerplay one tonight where he succeeded when Morgan Riley was out. Now, maybe it's just, you know, correlation and it's not causation, but is there like a logical reason why you would prefer Timothy Lil' Grim on the number one Powerplay unit over Morgan Riley? No, I read that I saw that that's how he took reps yesterday. I guess the logical reason is that the Powerplay, you know, special teams on balance have been very good recently and they're trying to, you know, restart the engine there. But I mean, come playoff time, I don't see how that's going to be a reality. You know, you got to run with your big horses and I would flip that come playoff time. Yeah. I look at it that way as well. I do want to, I obviously want to stick on Lee's with you, but I have to be honest. Maybe it's just because, I don't know, like, you know, the loss left a nasty taste in my mouth, but I've got Easton Cowan on the brain. He's got up to 34 points on his point streak now. The only guys since 2000 that have had longer ones in the CHL are Logan Stankovin who has been off to an incredible start with the stars, but Dard Crosby and, okay, this one's not quite as good. Alex Rajalov. That was pretty impressive. What have you made of the seeming leap that Cowan has taken? Obviously, this is not going to impact the Leafs in any way this year, but this, we saw Mintum break camp with the club like has Cowan taken a step or is this just kind of the, all of the skills that everyone kind of saw, what led them be intrapped and what everyone saw in camp and it's just kind of coming to fruition this year. Yeah. So from the back half of last year, when you really gain momentum towards the draft and then all the way through this year, for the most part, you know, he just continues to go to a different level every step of the way. And so he's really separated himself. First of all, from the Fraser Mintum discussion in terms of being the best Leafs prospect, like, like, Mintum is really looking like a three for future, you know, leaf kind of role, which is what I thought he would be, but Cowan absolutely. Top six, he's, so his pace is determination. He has had some puck luck. I mean, you have to have some puck luck in streaks. That's just the way it is. But listen, you got to have it. That's my point. Like, you have to go get it. You have to want it. You have to have it. And I'm going to tell you something else. Dale Hunter and Mark Hunter and the way that they've groomed us, kid along in London, to play the way that he's played, they deserve a lot of credit here too, like Dale has pushed all the right buttons and he's creating a future pro that has top six upside. And it's fun to watch, guys. I live here in London. Obviously, there's a lot of noise about it. I'm going to talk to the kid here in the next couple of days, but it's a great story because when they took him at 28, and two most of the scouting staff, you know, most people had him probably in the 40s, maybe even the early 50s, but he's hit the ground running and he's going to give him something to think about next year at training camp again. That'll be interesting. But let's wait until we get there. Yeah, it'll be interesting to see and man, you're lucky that you live in London and you get to see him as often as you do because I was literally sitting here, you know, earlier today, pulling up the schedule, seeing, and they just got the two games left and sitting to see who they're going to play in the playoffs isn't a close enough drive. I want to get a look at this kid. He certainly got everybody excited and let's be honest, it's been a while since the Leaf prospect has done that. Jason, always, always appreciate the time. Thanks so much, man. Yeah. Fantastic, guys. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I hope I didn't aggravate too many people out there. But have a great day. We'll talk to you guys soon. Oh, any people I got. I think you may have aggravated some neck injuries with people nodding in agreement. Yeah. Yeah. Anything you want to get off your chest, this is your pulpit. Okay. Anytime you just tell as I'll, I'll floor yours. See you. See you buddy. So see you boys. Jason Bugo, a sports net hockey analyst living in London, where he goes to see Eastern Cow and a bunch. And there's been a couple of times that I've looked at the Ontario Hockey League schedule and the Kitchener Rangers are, you know, less than an hour away from my house. Yeah. But yeah, the Rangers and Knights have played some great regular season games. I think they're slated to hook up in the first round of the postseason last check. It was a little unclear based on what I was doing. You know, I'm trying to do my job. I was looking at that. Sorry. Sorry. It's not. Yeah. No, it's not like understanding how many alarm fires. No. That was more important. Obviously. Well, no, the difference there is that you were telling me I was wrong about something here. Both of us just don't know. So that can stay there. But if you're going to tell me I'm wrong about something, absolutely not. I'll do the research. And if I was wrong, you'll never hear about it. But if I was right in your face, it's, it's, it's one thing for me to come, he could come to a microphone on Monday. This is going. It's one thing for me to step in front of a microphone or sit in front of a microphone yesterday after a blown to goal lead by the Leafs to a good Hurricanes team and to hear the post game and to say, well, that's kind of that doesn't sit well considering this team's lack of success over the last seven seasons. It's quite another for somebody who's been in a National Hockey League front office to say, hey, guys, like, don't do that. Yeah, that's, that's not a great indicator there. Again, like, it's not just one thing. It's not a one off where it's like, oh, well, here's a team that's been to a couple of conference finals or this is the first year and they're figuring out, blah, blah, blah. This is like, after seven years of, I would say a lack of accountability. And again, going back to even the decision that was about to be coming for Kyle Dubas, he was going to get an extension despite, like, the obvious lack of success compared to expectations and process results, whatever. I'm just telling you, scoreboard, he was supposed to win a Stanley Cup, not win one round and then bow out in five games in the second round. Agreed. There's been a lack of accountability. Everybody gets all the money, all the extension, all the no move clauses despite the lack of ultimate success. So you combine that with something like blowing a two goal third period lead to a good team and then everybody kind of shrugging it off. Yeah, you start to build not a narrative, but a reality of who these people are. And then we're all looking for reasons as to why it hasn't worked out well. Like, yeah, could you blame us all for using that as evidence as to what this team's fatal flaw in the postseason is? No, you can't. And the thing that always is the most jarring about it and, you know, I'm not even saying this if this guy needs to be held accountable, but keep climbing the ladder. The guy at the very tippy top of this, you would think he's the one who would stand for that the least. And that is the thing that always is the most jarring of all this and stand like he can just walk in there and change their minds. I understand you can only do so much as somebody's boss. But that is the thing that is just never jived about all this is that winner, you know, killer out there on the ice, quite honestly, power forward, go die to win cups. And it just, you can't craft it on even when it comes from the boss, I guess they've tried it with Thornton. They've tried it with O'Reilly. They've tried it everywhere. And it's just so jarring that the guy who's in charge of it all. And I don't say this like it's totally his fault. But that is the trait you would think he would least stand for it. Time now for the wake and rake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly, Leafs, Flyers, Philadelphia. This line is a little curious to me. Leafs favored obviously on the road in Philadelphia after a 6-2 victory last time they were there. It was like kind of flattered the Flyers, the final score line, like that was a dominating effort by the Leafs. They're only minus 130 favorites. And the Flyers are plus 110 on the money line, total is six and a half. Leafs on the puck line minus a goal and a half plus 180. God, it's hard not to think about that, it's again, considering the recent history, considering you would think there would be a motivated bunch, although maybe not after Saturday's game against the Huruk games. They'll play the boot call of tape and then they won't be. Yeah, I don't know. It's hard not to look at that, that money line as kind of juicy. Yeah, the money lines juicy. I'd also look at the over six and a half. We took the other side of that very foolishly in the last meeting. They're not going to do that again. So yeah, give me the over at plus 100 for six and a half or the puck line, quite honestly. I like the both of them. Yeah. And it's not, hey, this is not usually a Homer segment. No. I love you. And not often are you going to get that short a line for the Leafs against a team that's clearly inferior to them. All right, that was the Wakenrake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, Sam McKee, of Real Kipper and Bournax, as the fan morning show continues Ben and his friend, Gunning Sportsnet 5.9 of the fan.
