(upbeat music) - Hey everybody, just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you about the best place to listen to all your audio titles. You can't beat Audible. Audible ends you enjoy all of your audio entertainment. In one app, you'll always find the best of what you love or something new to discover they have at all. They offer an incredible selects across every genre from bestsellers, new releases, celebrity memoirs, mystery thrillers, motivation, wellness, business and more. If it's out there, they have it. I'm telling you, I spend so much time on Audible. I love these so much, so many titles for the show that we have all of our podcasts and everything else. It's just phenomenal for traveling, it's great. Audible is the destination for thrilling audio entertainment with highly anticipated new releases and next listen recommendations to habituate every type of thriller listener. You're gonna love it. 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It's just that easy. - Welding instructor Alex Declare knows VR training platforms like ForgeFX help students master their skills. - There's a big learning curve with welding, virtuality, simulates that exact muscle memory that they need. - Learn more at meta.com/metiverseimpact. - This week in Wilmington, Delaware, a dirty and disturbing tale surfaces after a young woman disappears, leaving police to question her married boyfriend and all of his other girlfriends. Welcome to Smalltownmurder. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Hello everybody and welcome back to Smalltownmurder. - Yay! - Oh, yay indeed Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigalo, I'm here with my co-host. - I am Jimmy Wissman. - Thank you folks so much for joining us on another wild crazy edition of Smalltownmurder. We got a weird one for you this week. - Great. - It's a murderer, so you, you know, real jerk. - That's weird. - He's a real jerk face. Let's just say that about him. Not a great guy, so we'll get into all of that here. First before we do though, head to shutupandgivememurder.com, get your tickets for live shows because they are out there. They're all for sale for 2024. A couple of them are sold out already including one in November. So get your tickets right now, April 5th, Sacramento. You are up first, April 6th, San Francisco. Get your tickets, still some tickets remaining at those venues, Boston, New York. Those are selling quick in December, so get those as well. So get in there right now and get your tickets. Minneapolis, be our biggest show ever. - You bet. - You can do it and we are excited because we love Minneapolis, so that'll be fun. That's our biggest venue we could, that we've had so far, so. We're excited to do that, can't wait. Shutupandgivememurder.com, also patreon.com/crimeinsports, that'll get you all your bonus stuff there. Anybody $5 a month or above a mere cup of coffee. - Don't call it cheap, it's a bargain. - It's a damn bargain, I'm telling you right now, you get a couple hundred back episodes immediately and then new ones every other week, one crime in sports, one small town murder, and you get it all everybody. This week we're gonna talk about for crime in sports. You don't have to really like sports, this is just interesting, in ring boxing deaths part two. So this is just, yeah, what's worse than getting beaten to death, that sounds bad. Get beat while thousands of people cheer it on, sounds worse, that's really bad. Then for small town murder, we're gonna talk about a guy with a cult, just a man with a cult. He was known as the East Coast Charles Manson, back in the late '60s and early '70s, the Mel Lyman cult, it got real weird and then got, even weirder when they changed religions and everything, it's very strange. That is patreon.com/crimeandsports is where you get all of that and if you wanna hear more, listen to crime in sports, first of all, tellin' ya, this is a plea to listen to crime in sports. It's not, you don't have to love sports at all, to listen to it, it's a comedy show about an idiot who has it all and says, nope, I'll throw it right in the garbage, that's a great story, and whether you like sports or not, I'm tellin' ya. And then, of course, listen to your stupid opinions, our show where we take reviews of everything and anything from around the internet and talk about 'em. - I've been talking about this on. - And it's just the funniest show you're ever gonna hear, so check that out as well, and all of that good stuff. That said, disclaimer time. - Oh boy. - This is a comedy show. - It is. - It's a comedy show, we're comedians, we're standup comics, so we're gonna make jokes at things. The thing is, though, there's a lot of stuff to make jokes about that, isn't you think, oh, it's a murder story, how are you gonna make jokes? Well, there's plenty of stuff around that to make jokes. Maybe there's a bumbling police force that doesn't know how to do their jobs. Maybe there's a murderer who picks a really dumb plan to get away with a murder. - Even more ridiculous. - We have nothing else, we have no recourse. We're not lawyers, we can't put the guy in jail, but what we can do is make fun of him unmercifully, so that's what there is to that, so it's not as bad as you think it is. Put it that way, it's small town murder, it's not as bad as you think it is. So I'm tellin' ya, what thing we don't do, will we go out of our way not to do? 'Cause we don't make fun of the victims or the victims' families. - Why's that, James? - Because we're assholes. - Yeah, but? - But we're not scumbags. - There you have it. - That's how it goes. So that's our general philosophy. If you like that, you're gonna like the show. If you think true crime and comedy should never ever go together, you might not like the show, but if you don't, you've been warned, so no bitchin' later, that's how this works. That's sad. - One of these new every week, come on. - That's what I'm talkin' about. That's sad, I think it's time, everybody. I think it's time to sit back. That's all clear the lungs, arms to the sky, and let's all shout. ♪ Shut up and give me murder ♪ Let's do this, everybody. What do you say? - Okay. - Let's go on a trip, shall we? - Let's do it. - Let's do it. We are going all the way to Delaware this week. - Shit, yeah. - A state that you don't really have any preconceived notions of. - We're lookin' a lot, we get about it a lot. - If I said name all 50 states, there's a couple you might leave out and one of them's probably Delaware. - Yeah. - Yeah. There's a couple, Delaware, maybe, you know, see the Dakotas, if you think of one, you'll think of the other, you know, yeah, you might miss a Vermonter in New Hampshire, possibly. - You might go, Virginia, wait, is that Westford? Is that only one? I don't know how many there are. - I damn rode islands out of a bitch. - Are there two Virginias? - Shit. - This is terrible. - Is there a North? - Goddamn it, Mississippi. - I got out. - Alabama, I got Louisiana, look, that was how it would work. So this is Wilmington, Delaware. It's a northern Delaware, about 52 minutes to Dover, which is, I believe that's the capital there. - That's the capital, yeah. - 40 minutes to Philly, so I mean, it's right there to Philadelphia. - Yeah. - And about 15 minutes away to Claymont, which was our last Delaware episode, which was episode four 22, "Dead in a Ditch." That was the name of that one. That was a weird, a good express. - That could be a lot of these. - It was a good express episode, though, the way it was, I remember that one. - It could be a good chunk of these chunks. - There's a lot of people dead in ditches here. - We have a much more dramatic way of body disposal this week, so it's crazy. But Delaware's a small state, so I mean, everything is pretty close. An hour away in Delaware is like, "Holy shit, that's all the way across the state." - Yeah, basically everything north of Maryland is clocking teeny tiny. - It's a couple of panhandles as how Delaware works, how it's set up. This is New Castle County, area code 302, several mottoes here for this town here. Number one, the corporate capital of the world. - What? - If you know anything about corporations, they all file for incorporation in Delaware. - Oh, okay. - There's certain laws there that are very advantageous to corporations, so like, I used to serve process, serve papers, and all these corporations all had their main addresses, Delaware. That's everything. Every corporation-- - So you bought a cheap shit house there and set up shop there. - There's no house, it's just, that's where they're set up. There's not even an office. - But they gotta have an address there, right? - A PO box, I think, is all you really need. It's just, you have to incorporate in Delaware, so it's really silly. Also, in the middle of it all, is another one, in the middle of it all, all of what? That could be anything, that could be bad. - What is that? - I don't know. - That's a motto? - Yeah, in the middle of it all. - No, you're on the edge. - You're on the edge, but in the middle of Delaware, is that what you're trying to brag about? What are we talking about here? And then the third one is, this doesn't seem like something you'd wanna put on the sign, you know, this is something you'd wanna hide, I think. It could be, and I bet Flint, Michigan would probably argue with them. Quote, "The chemical capital of the world." So, is that something you wanna brag about? - I don't know. Are 3M and DuPont there? Is that what it is? - Our drinking water is terrible. Come on in. - Tainted, come try. - Yeah. History of this town, we'll go through this pretty quick here. In 1868, so this is after the Civil War here, Wilmington was producing more iron ships than the rest of the country combined. - Wow. - So they were really doing that. They also ranked first in production of Gunpowder. So all the ships in Gunpowder came from Wilmington, Delaware in the 1860s. And second, in carriages and leather production as well. - Is that right? - They were pumping stuff out after the Civil War here. Absolutely, and so all of this was great for their economy during the Civil War, they were making all this shit. Fast forward to the 1900s here, the 1980s, there's a lot of office construction and job growth and shit, which happened because of the arrival of national banks and financial institutions because of the 1981 Financial Center Development Act, which loosened up the laws governing banks operating within the state. So that's how you ended up with savings and loans and bank failures and all that kind of stuff. They're like, "Yeah, just do whatever you want." And then shockingly, banks are greedy and they fucked up, and it's weird, right? Strange, they did it again in '86, too. - I can think of it another time. - Yeah, yeah, lots of times that's happening here, but all sorts of banks are headquartered here. So reviews of this town, let's find out what other people think 'cause we're not, we don't spend much time in Wilmington, Delaware. - You've never been. - Don't take our word for it. Let's take other people's words for it here. Four stars, small city, but lots of things to do. Some landmarks and amazing ethnic restaurants make days worth it in Wilmington. There's, from what I understand, there's a lot of good Italian joints here, too. - Oh, is that right? - That's pretty big Italian community here. Two stars, I've lived in Delaware my entire life. Wow, bouncing around that tiny state. Wow, it is extremely dangerous and not good for raising a family. And you're not really what you think of when you think of Delaware. Don't go to Delaware, Jesus, your kids will get shot. - That wasn't the second sentence I was expecting after I've lived here my whole life. - Yeah, it's awful. - Why haven't you left, man? - There's almost no social or financial mobility. Well, there you go, that's why they haven't left. They're stuck due to cost. These schools here are good, considering how underfunded they are. The teachers here go above and beyond to try and offer the best education they can. Wilmington is expensive to live in, although the houses are in poor condition and the neighborhoods are dangerous. It's dangerous and it's in poor condition, but good news is it's overpriced. So, something for everybody. - That news is like, can't afford it. - Yeah, good news is you can't afford to be there anyway, so fuck it. Wilmington is a very small, as very small, so commute time is short and the city is extremely diverse. Overall, a bad city that doesn't fund itself and offers no stability. Okay, and then finally, one star. Everyone here is miserable and there's nothing to do 90% of the year. The roads are congested and the area is being overdeveloped. There you go. - Nothing to do 90%. - 90%, there's a sliver of hope in the maybe mid-August, really, but outside of that, you're fucked. You're not getting anything. People here, 70,926 currently here. It's grown. - Yeah, that's a lot, yeah. - It's grown, yeah. Definitely more than when our murders took place. More females and males by a good range. At median age is 36.3, so right around the national average. Very low marriage rate here. It's only 30%, it's normally 50%. 39.6% of people have children but are single. It's normally 10%. - That's a lot. - It's a lot, yeah. I don't know what's going on at all in the whole town here. We have raw race of this town. 28.3% white, 57.2% black, 1.5% Asian, 0.2% Native American, and 10.8% Hispanic. You don't think of a lot of Native Americans hanging out in Delaware, really. - Not many, no. - It's not where you'd imagine. - Or in Hispanic either, I don't know. - Yeah, well, I mean there's still-- - I don't see authentic Mexican food being from Delaware. - Apparently there's good ethnic food here. - Oh, but there is, yeah. Oh, but there is. Religion, 46.9% religious, so just under the average, and they're spread around pretty good, but as you'd imagine, Catholics are gonna take the most here. Catholics are the Baptists of the North. Even though Delaware isn't really that far north, it's still-- - It's North enough. - It's in the Northeastern area, I would say, more than like, if you'd go down to Maryland, then you're getting mid-Atlantic. So there's that in this county here. Let's see the, oh no, in the town. The unemployment rate is 10.3%, though. That is, it is under 4% in the rest of the country. - Yeah, what's happening there? - I think all the jobs are like corporate jobs, so I think there's not a lot of blue collar work, not a lot of leather and carriage making going on anymore. - True, yeah. So much for all those fucking corporations. - Yeah, I think it's tough there. - I think it is just P.O. boxes, James. - Maybe it is. Median household income here is $49,354 a year, which is about $20,000. - And there's no money to be had anyway. - The national average here, absolutely. And the cost of living, 100 is average here, it's 104. So it's a little bit high. - Wilmington closed. - It doesn't sound great, it's lower. Median home costs $273,100 here. So if we've convinced you, damn it. - I don't know how. - Only place you can live, is when you hear the crime numbers, is Wilmington, Delaware. We have for you the Wilmington, Delaware real estate report. (upbeat music) - Your average two bedroom rental here is about 1,280 bucks a month, so above the national average a bit. Here's a two bedroom, two bath, 1,200 square foot, weird house, it's this little house. The porch has carpet on it. So you don't see a lot of carpeted front porches, for obvious reasons. - Weather and such. - If you use the front porch to get the shit off your shoes before you, this, they're like, no, just wipe it right out of the carpet there. I don't know how that works. The inside too, the kitchen's brand new. Looks like they just redid it HGTV style. Rest of the house is from 1987. So it's a very strange house. Old dingy carpet. - You never heard kitchen so homes James? - That's it, that's what they heard. - They're blowing this piece of shit, yeah. - Fuck, it's so weird. 85,000 bucks for it though. So, need a place to live, that's affordable. Here's a three bedroom, two bath, 1375 square foot house. It's pretty cool, the house is cool, but you don't get the whole house. It's a unit in an old Victorian row house. - Oh cool. - So it's like a floor, you probably get. You know, 1375 square feet. It's 1900, they built this house, it's one of those. It's a cool looking house. There's a big giant fireplace in the middle of the room, which is a weird feature. It's pretty cool, 399,000 bucks for that though. - Say again how many square feet? - 1375. - It's very an awful lot of money. - For an awful lot of money, 'cause you're in, I guess you can walk to getting shot easier, I suppose, I don't know. So, I don't even care. Here's an eight bedroom, seven bath. 11,500 square foot. - Oh, castle. - Gigantic place, 4.71 acres, built in 1875. It's got huge porches wrapping around the house. It's obviously made to be like a bed and breakfast or an inn or something like that. Like, it just screams that. Like, please serve mediocre eggs here to couples who are forcing socialization upon each other. - They're powdered eggs and blueberries in the morning. - Do it, please, that's it. It's got a tennis court and a basketball court. - Wow. - That kinds of shit like that. 1,950,000 bucks though for that. You're gonna pay. - How many times you gotta rent it out to pay for that? - A lot probably. A lot of those eight bedrooms have to get rented out. Things to do here, we'll go over quickly. Here's the main thing of town. And this is a big deal. Apparently, Bob Marley had a place here for a while. - Okay. - So, they fucking love Bob Marley here, which is fine. I'm happy with that, you know? - Is he on the end? - Maybe. Bob Marley's one of those people that kind of like hits a lot of areas in the Venn diagram. - Chats a lot of bars, yep. - A lot of people, crosses over to a lot of different people's genres. Like, it's been like death metal. I only like Norwegian death metal. What about Bob Marley? No, he's cool too. I like Bob Marley. - I like him a lot. - Anything. You could put many people who like, you know, I like this. Oh, classical. A lot of Marley's good too though. Yeah, I shot the sheriff all year. I'll listen to that. So, yeah, three little birds, put it on. They have the people's. - It's not wrong. - It's fucking great. It's gonna have a good time. - You could put a Spotify Bob Marley channel on while you're in the pool. Press play and never even talk with it. And then it always hits. - No one will complain. - It always slaps. - And Bob Marley will come up later on in this episode as well. He'll be making an appearance doing a song, as we know. So, they have the people's fest tribute to Bob Marley. - Okay. - The 29th annual people's, this year will be 30 in 2024. - Yeah. - So, they do it at the Tubman Garrett Riverfront Park. And it says, "The spirit of the people's festival was built upon unity, one love and justice. Good vibes are what you can expect at the People's Festival." There's something for everyone here. I went one time and saw the Whalers play, which is his band, and no one, there was not one fight in the whole club. Like it was just the nicest people, clouds of weed smoke outside. They were offering everybody to come on their bus and smoke with them and shit. - It just feels, it just feels very fucking, who cares about anything? Let's just smile today. - You can't hear, ♪ Let's get together and feel all right ♪ - And punch someone in the face, it's just weird. It's just a strange thing to do. - Yeah, it's not feel my fist, it's not, it's not feel all pain, it's fucking feel all right. - You feel all right, so there's that, and there's also the fairy fest. - Mm, okay. - There's nothing to do with Bob Marley, but it's just children and adults enjoy live performances by the area's premier dance and theater companies without door games. It's just that you go and people pretend to be fairies. They do like a fairy show for you. - Okay. - I don't know what that's all about, exactly. We could make some really low brow jokes. - There's plenty of really dumb jokes. - We're gonna skip 'em. You get 'em, you understand, isn't this or that? We know, okay. - Write your own, keep trying. - Write your own, if you can write your own, we're skipping 'em 'cause we're meeting. - What do I need to do? - People will often ask us to, like, they missed that obvious joke and I go, no, no, no, we didn't miss it. We chose not to say it 'cause we're professional comedians. That's, if you thought of it, we're not gonna say it 'cause you're not a professional comedian. - Sometimes I have intrusive thoughts that are just like, say the dumb thing and get James's reaction. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And then I do it. - Well, there's those, yeah, obviously. Well, sometimes they're funny, but this would be not funny. - No, this would just be hurtful. - This would be dumb. - What's the point? - It would just be too dumb and easy. I'd feel like I'm in the fourth grade. So, crime rate in this town, well, we're interested in here. Property crime, almost twice the average. - Oh, Lee. - That's not good, there. (laughing) It's not good. It's, well, nothing yet. Violent crime, murder ape robbery, and, of course, assault the Mount Rushmore of crime. About three times the average rate. - Triple. - Triple. - Triple. (laughing) - Wilmington is real as fuck, everybody. (laughing) - Thinning changed the name, it sounds folksy in homes. - Yeah, watch out, motherfuckers. - There's homes around here, yeah. - Let's talk about some murder that did not happen on the street in a horrible whatever. Let's talk about this, and I gotta give credit where credits do, obviously, the Philadelphia Daily News, a writer named Jim Nolan, did an ongoing huge series on this case, and really had a lot of info that's, we, you know, - Of course, it's essential. - to this. Jim pulled it off here. So, gotta give credit where credit's due when somebody does a good job of reporting. So, let's start out in July, early July, about July 4th weekend-ish, 1996, okay? So, back in time a little bit here, 1996, there's some fishermen who are out there from Harrisburg, and they went out that day, that weekend to, you know, fish, people go out there and fish and, you know, there's a lot of fish out there, deep sea stuff. So, they pull along, they find a giant cooler floating. - God damn it. - Huge cooler floating. - It's not full of fish. - It's just floating in the ocean. - Yeah, packed full of their, packed full of their allowed take for the day. - It's just cold cuts, and like, you know, beer, cold beer with ice in it, and like, so it is. - Fuck fish, look at this. - Wow, this is lunch for like 20 people, this is terrific. It's a five foot long igloo cooler. - Oh, those are expensive too. - Yeah, real expensive, you see those. So, they pulled up alongside it and hauled it on in. It's empty. There's, they pull it in there. - That's great. - It's pretty, yeah, there's nothing there. The top was missing, so they could tell there was nothing in it from the start. There is a weird hole in the side of it, like a bullet hole almost. Looks like a bullet hole, but they're not, can't be positive in the side of it, but they said shit, it's better. You can still keep fish in it. You can put a bunch of ice in it and put fish under it. It's a big five gallon tub it. - You can't really plug that hole, so as the ice melts, we're getting water on the boat, but. - It's like, it's on the side though, so you'd have to put it up real high for it to get out of that. - Oh, you got it to get, okay, all right. - Yeah, so they're like, fuck it, I'm keeping this cooler. - Keeping the container, yeah. - Yes, and they hang on to that cooler for a while now. So, that said, keep that in mind, and let's go back in time a little bit here. - Okay. - I'm gonna read a little bit about Wilmington, just a paragraph that this, Nolan, Jim Nolan wrote here, 'cause it explains a lot of this case here, just in the way the city's set up. It says, quote, "At the entrance to town on Delaware Avenue, "it announces as a place to be somebody." So, that's what it says in Wilmington. That's another motto of theirs, a place to be somebody. So, four mottos. Wilmington is such a small town that just about everyone has to be somebody for that place to function. So, okay, the- - We'll tell that to 10% that ain't working. - No shit, the DuPont company and the banking industries drawn to Delaware's corporation friendly tax and finance laws employ much of the workforce along with its many state government offices. There are a few Irish bars of note where everyone seems to drink, a few good Italian restaurants where they dine, and no more than a couple of miles separates the half million dollar homes of the state's movers and shakers. Keep in mind, this is written in 1996. From the rundown row houses that feed the public schools and are represented in disproportionate numbers in the state criminal justice system. - Geez. - So, it's a small town, a lot of it runs on favors, and I know this guy and went to school with that guy. - For sure. - It's a, these small cities are very much like that 'cause it's just like a small town on jacked up on HGH. - But he also describes it as like, have everything's and have nothing's. - Yes, it's a big city that they, but they crammed into a small town. It's a small town, but it has all the trappings of all that kind of. - Wow. - So, let's talk about some people first here. - Okay. - Okay, here. Let's talk about, first of all, a young lady. Let's talk about Anne Marie Fahey, F-A-H-E-Y, Fahey. She's born in 1966 from Wilmington. Her family's kind of working class Irish family. That's where she comes from. She's the youngest of six kids. - Jesus. - Yeah, all born within 12 years of each other, too. - Oh, boom, man. - So that is-- - Is she the youngest? - She's the youngest, yeah. - She's the last one. So they were fucking since '54. - And the oldest is only 12. - Jesus. - Imagine having six kids, 12 and 100. That sounds insane. Now, one of them's a baby. Fuck that, I don't think so. So, she's the baby of the family and people pay attention to her and they don't on her. The problem is, when she's about seven, her mother is diagnosed with cancer and dies when she's eight. - What? God or fast, Jesus. - This is brutal. And that's, we're talking early '70s. So, I mean, cancer treatments are night and day to what they were in 1974. - Yeah, but an aggressive form and you can't even process that mom has it by the time she's gone. - No, you're too little. - That's crazy. - Her father was a heavy drinker, which did not help any of this. - That was his cirrhosis, too. - It's doing great. Now, when you're not only, just you're like to drink anyway, but then your young wife dies of cancer and you're left with six children. Anyone will hit the bottle, I think, of that one. - You betcha. - So, he drank very heavily. He used to be an insurance salesman and he's considered an outgoing guy, but he just fell down the spiral of just depression and grief and drank and got the mired in debt and just was a mess. The electricity would get cut off all the time and would shower at school because they wouldn't have stuff she needed at home to shower and stuff like that. Her father ended up just moving away at some point. - Hold. - Yeah, just by taking on. Some of the kids were adults. - Yeah. - I mean-- - Take care of them, would ya? - I raised half of them, that's enough, I'm out. - I did my portion. Your mom was supposed to do her portion, but she's not here, so. - But if the electricity's getting cut off and she has to shower at school, it's a difference anyway. She might as well find somewhere else to live. So, she stayed with friends for a while. People felt bad for her. Her friends, parents, they take her in and then she ended up staying with her older brothers, Kevin and Robert, Jr. So, she ended up with family, at least. And the funny thing is, later on, she had a, that's a really hard childhood. - No shit. - You mean, dead mother, you know, very poor. - Like dead dead. - Drunk dad taking off on you, getting passed around from place to place. And that's hard. She never really told anybody about it when she was an adult. - Wow. - A lot of people, that's all they would talk about. And with her, her friends didn't even know it, like her later on. - Some people, yeah, some people just assume that everybody's like this too. - Yeah, and some people try to put it out of their minds to march forward and they don't want to keep going over it. And then some people like, you know, to wallow in things or they still need to process it. I don't know. So, a friend of hers said, Annie never wanted anybody to know about her pain. A lot of friends told me they had no idea about Annie's rough childhood. That's just how she was. - There's also people that are just like, it's none of your fucking business. - Yeah, that's the other thing too, which it just wasn't what she wanted to talk about. I don't know. - Yeah, and talking about it, what's that gonna do? Is that gonna fix it? - That's the other thing. Yeah, and maybe she already had talked about it. Now she's passed and doesn't want to talk about it anymore. (upbeat music) Hey everybody, just gonna take a quick break from the show and tell you about a wonderful company that does fabulous things for your skin, Curology. - Oh, curology.com, see you our O-L-O-G-Y.com. - Absolutely, and Curology, this is what makes them awesome and different. As you go on their website and go to curology.com. 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So you can do it, or you can get their professionals to do it for you. You can test it out with absolutely no risk to you with SimplySafe's 60-day risk-free trial. You don't love it, return it for a full refund, you bet. So protect your home today. Our listeners get a special 20% off any new SimplySafe system when you sign up for fast-protect monitoring. Just visit simplysafe.com/small. That's SimplySafe, S-I-M-P-L-I, safe.com/small. There's no safe, like SimplySafe. Now back to the show. So she reconciles with her father in 1984. Wow. And she is about 18 years old. She reconciled, and then two years later, he dies of leukemia. Wow. So yeah, that's rough. So by the time she's 20, both parents are dead. Mm-hmm. Do you think he had it, and that's why she shows, maybe? I mean, that's possible. He might've got sick, and he told her about it, and then she said, "Well, you know, "buy guns, be buy guns at this point. "What are we gonna--?" How long are we gonna keep this into the grave? We're gonna keep this going. So she graduated from Wesley College in Dover. Wow. And she had, you know, she went to Spain. She spent the semester in Spain while in college. So she's trying to get outside of her comfort zone in her world, and she grows up too. She's pretty five foot 10. Hell yeah. We're a nice looking young lady too, and confident, and smart. And so, yeah, she's doing fine. She gets a degree in international relations, which-- Oh, wow. Both of us, obviously. I mean, we obviously both have a degree in international relations. But most, you know, a lot of people don't, is the thing, you know? I thought to Russian girl once, does that count? I think so, yeah. Yeah. (laughing) That's a degree in it, yeah. She wasn't even actually, just her parents were Russian. (laughing) She's not even, she's never seen it. She's from Texas, but that's beside the point. (laughing) So she went to Washington, D.C., wanting to become a diplomat. That was her goal. So in 1991, though, a friend of hers tells her that her boss, who's a Delaware congressman named Tom Carper, was looking for a receptionist. So she said, okay, that's, you know, in a politician's office, that's in politics. Why not? I'll take the job. So she takes that job, then Carper gets elected governor of Delaware in 1992. Oh, wow, and she's been there since day one. Not bad. So she ended up going to Wilmington, I guess Wilmington's the capital of Delaware, by the way, not Dover. Is it? I always thought it was Dover for some reason. I do too. 'Cause that's where all the state capital shit is. So she comes home, she goes to Wilmington to work for his office. And it's pretty cool, she thinks. She's working, she's doing the scheduling for the governor. Right. So I mean, that's pretty important in this town. Sure on the fuck. Big deal. Let's introduce another person here into this whole mix here. This is Tom Capano, C-A-P-N-A-O. Or A-N-O, A-N-O, sorry, Tom Capano. He's born in 1949, so 17 years older than her. He's from a pretty good family here. We'll talk about his family. I mean, money-wise, they're considered pretty good here. His parents are very supportive. His mother was alive through his childhood, all sorts of things like that. His father was a carpenter. His father had come to this country in 1923 from Calabria, Italy. And when he was in his early 30s, his father, that's when Tom was born here. He ended up becoming partners with another Wilmington contractor and formed the consolidated construction company. Yep. Which turns out to be a fucking money-maker. You bet. A real money-maker. Especially in a town that's growing and you can just start putting cabinets in everything. Well, and World War II is about to come up too. Oh, there's that too. If you have any kind of factory, you're getting fat government contracts to make something, you know what I mean? So that's a great thing for them. So he eventually, his dad, Tom's dad, eventually buys out his partner and becomes one of the biggest builders in the States customizing his, and custom homes, specializing in custom homes. So they're, yeah, they have money. They do very well. Dad builds a huge colonial mansion here in an area called Brandywine Hundred, which is a very exclusive area in Wilmington. Oh, I knew just by the sound. You didn't have to say it. Brandywine Hundred. You don't have to say anything more. That could either be a really affluent neighborhood or the projects. Brandywine Hundred, what's up? Cause Brandy Greene sounds nice. Yeah, that sounds better than Brandywine Hundred. That sounds like, you know. It sounds like a hundred row houses that are all. The Brandywine Hundred, a hundred project buildings. I think the Nas used to rap about that in the 90s, I believe, before they tore Queens Bridge down. Or it's a hundred acres of nothing but white people. One very affluent rich boat owning white people. Fuck yeah. So dad is a Louis Capano and he spoiled the kids. They all went to expensive all the top Catholic schools in the area. They went to their summers at the Jersey Shore as the law requires Italians to do once in a while. We can't help it, we're told. If you go a certain amount, they'll just knock on your door and be like, how many years since you've been to the Jersey Shore? And we're like, okay, we're packing, okay. We're getting the floaties, all right? Leave us the fuck alone. We're coming every three years. We're coming, okay. I went when I was a good boy. Bring your son, we'll take your pick. I went when I was a kid, it's plenty of time. That's where we went. So everybody said Thomas was his father's favorite also. So he's the favorite son of the rich successful dad here. He did very well in school. He's a very hardworking guy, Tom. He did great in school. His brothers didn't do as well as him in school. His brothers were. Yeah, they were more of like the, kind of from what I gather, the typical kind of rich kids where they're like, ah, it doesn't matter. I'm like, what the fuck do I need to get A's for? I can always go work for my dad. There always go be some dipshit vice president of his company and make 100 grand a year. And sure, that's what they thought. So he though wanted something more. And Tom was very much into academics and things like that. He also was a star football player and he was on the track team as well. So doing very well for himself. His father was so proud of him. He bought him a brand new sports car as well. What car? Oh yeah, don't know. We don't know that. But we know something expensive and this was in the early 70s. So something fucking awesome. Something with a kick-ass crudra. Cuda or like a, yeah, so you know, a van or something. Big motor will drive blower scoops, some glass. Fucking loud. That's what I did. Something we really like a Camaro or something. Yeah, something you can't hear the stereo over at about 5,000 rpms. Yeah, also Tom completes undergraduate and gets his law school degree at well at Boston College in 1974. So yeah, doing great. He's doing it. He really is. A former teacher of his said quote, he was a shining star. Oh boy. And not only that, he had a girlfriend in high school and ended up marrying his high school sweetheart as well. Why the fuck not? Why not be so perfect? Her name, Kay Ryan. Kay. Which, Kay Ryan, I know it's not, but it might as well be Diane Keaton's character name in "The Godfather." Like, it's so typical. Like this kitty's gonna go out there and be like, I gotta fly tonight. I don't wanna freckles. I don't know what it is. Like, I'm gonna fly me a nice Irish girl. Yeah, it's so, it's such a strange thing that we have about that. So I'm married to an Irish girl, freckles. So I understand that's the way it is. It just happens. We don't know why. So they get married out of school and he starts his law career here. First, he's a public defender, which a lot of lawyers are public defenders at first 'cause it's a good way to get experience and they'll hire you if you're fresh out of law school. And it looks fucking great on a resume. Yeah, yeah, it looks good and it throws you right into the deep end of the legal system if you wanna deal with criminal law. Then he becomes a prosecutor after that. Right. Switch his teams. Yeah, he got which a lot of people do 'cause once you get, and then what they do, the weird part is they start out in the public defender's office, then they become prosecutors for 15 years, then they quit that office and get a high-paying defense job. Yeah, in defense. In defense. One of those pay lawyer jobs, yeah. Yeah, they defend like, you know, like Rico cases for drug dealers and shit after that because they know the whole system and they're-- And it's guaranteed money. Oh, that's where the money is. That's when he wants their like 50. They're like, "Okay, now I gotta make money." I've done all this now. Let's get cracking. I wanna buy a beach house now. This is ridiculous. I did a lot of school. So they moved, the parents or him and his wife Kay moved into the Bishop of Wilmington's former house. So the Catholic Bishop of Wilmington. So that's probably a nice house and I'd imagine there's a couple of gold fixtures in it once in a while, probably. You're probably right, yeah. A ruby here or there, maybe. There's a thing or two that's gaudy, yeah. Absolutely. And also, right across the street is the former governor. That's his house across the street. So that's nice. It's a affluent neighborhood. Him and his wife have four daughters together. Four daughters? Four daughters, crank him out. What a curse. One after the other. He just can't. He's like, you know, he's rolling the dice every time, man. Okay, another one. Okay, that's fine. Two's fine, two's fine. And we're not saying you don't want any daughters, but you don't want four of anything. I wouldn't want four boys. I wouldn't want four sons, no. Fuck no, four sons, are you kidding me? No. Nothing works in this house. I keep them in a pit. I keep them in a pit like under the house. That's where I keep four sons. Why do none of the door handles work? They just be beating each other up in a pit wearing like loincloths and beating each other with sticks. The door handles just loose. And if you close the door, it latches and the door handle doesn't work. Doesn't work. We just throw some meat in the pit every once in a while. So yeah, they're doing all of that. And he then after that, he starts, while he's being a prosecutor, he also gets into the politics of everything here, of the city. He wants to be involved in the politics, becomes kind of a political organizer, is an advisor to some people running for office and all that sort of thing. Well, that's also some baptism by fire for politics because there's politics involved with like people getting prosecuted. And then as the prosecutor, you're like, I'm not gonna fucking prosecute that. Why, just 'cause the fucking mayor wants it? There's that. And also he knows everybody is the other thing. As if you work as a defense attorney and a prosecutor, you meet everybody in power and government. So you end up doing that. He helps elect Daniel Frawley, the mayor in 1984, works on his campaign and he gets, people start saying he's, he convinces, he can like broker. Got a knack for this shit. Yeah. He's good at brokering things. He's a deal maker type guy. He can convince, he gets big banks to come in to, they give him credit for this. I mean, the laws got them to wanna go to Delaware, but he kind of funneled them toward the high rise office buildings in Wilmington and said, you guys should move in here. He then works on the reelection campaign for Frawley in 1988. It's a landslide reelection win. So then he quits all of this to work for the family business now, which is Louis Capano and Sons, the construction, but the big contracting business. So one of his tasks here is the problem. His brother, his other brother, Louis Jr. here, he was running the firm and he's got a real problem on his hands that his brother here is trying to help him out with. So Tom is a, you know, he knows a lot of people in government and he knows all the courts, people. So he's a guy you need in this situation. The problem is his brother, Louis was involved in an FBI sting operation. - What's Louis doing? - To nab two city councilmen trying to extort $100,000 in exchange for votes favorable to the business. So he was, yeah, he was talking, doing that. - He was trying to quote unquote lobby, but like anyway. - He's like in a paper bag with cash. It's a different kind of lobbying. - He ugly lobbying. - It's called bribery, as a matter of fact, I believe, allegedly. - Yeah, that's the word for it that we're looking for. - And then you're right, yeah. - So Capano made a legal, this is Louis now, made a legal campaign contributions to one of the men, but no charges were ever filed against him. So he might have got his brother out of that. It might have been a shitty case, we don't know. Then there was a, this was by the way, not the first time he said to help his brothers out. Years before, his brother had been charged with the same brother, Louis, he was running the firm. - He's a good kid. - Charged with throwing a chair through the glass door of his sister's house and choking his brother-in-law in a dispute over money. - My God. - That's wild, shit right there. - That's a funny stir. - That is a great Thanksgiving. - Whoa, it's almost like if you name your kid after yourself and show some fucking pride. - It's almost like crime and sports taught us nothing is what it is. If you've not listened to crime and sports, inordinate amount of people are either juniors or name their kids junior and it never turns out well. - Never, never. - It's never good. - So it's very weird here. So that's what's going on. He's trying to now help his family and all that kind of thing. He leaves the family business in 1990 though. So he only works for them for a couple of years. I think it was just to get his brother, help get him out of trouble, stabilize everything and then move on. - Sorted out and get out, yeah. - Sorted out and get out here. So in 1990, he becomes the Governor's legal counsel. Governor Castle. - Okay, yeah. - So it's his legal counsel. So now he's the Governor's legal counsel. He's doing very well for himself. - Retained by the Governor. - Fuck yeah, he's doing great. He's making, 'cause he's doing private practice stuff too, 'cause he's in a private practice. It's not a government job. He's making 250 grand a year at the time, which is big money in 1996, big money now, but I mean, even then, huge, huge money, even bigger. He's thinking about maybe running for attorney general. If you'll get into, yeah, I mean, why not? I know all the politics, I'm an attorney. This is kind of-- - It's a false position for it. - His friends though said, maybe not. Maybe you shouldn't. They said, you know, first of all-- - Screw me. - Well, they said, you don't really have the temperament to do that. You're not really a, hey, how's it going? Love, how's the wife and kids kind of guy? And that's kind of, you have to be full of shit to be in politics. Let's be realistic here. - Yeah, you gotta be a politician. You gotta be a politician. - You gotta be a politician. And they said, your name also carries a little baggage with it. - Does it? - A little bit of baggage considering, well, the main problem was, 'cause this is like 1992, and the main issue isn't his one brother, it's his other brother. His other brother kind of sullied the name a little bit the year before in 1991. - Louis fucks it up enough, but then the other brother? - Joey comes in and fucks it up a little more. Joseph was charged with kidnapping and raping a 27-year-old woman with whom he had a nine-year relationship. - How does he have such degenerate brothers? - 'Cause they're ne'er-do-well rich kid, ship bags. - Boy, are they fuck-ups. - They're all Anthony Juniors is what they are. Like, the rest of his brother, they're fucking three Anthony Juniors. It's ridiculous. That's a sopranos reference if you don't know, but Anthony Juniors, they spoiled him, they gave him the truck, he didn't want to do anything. - Trying to get him just to go to Rutgers. - Just go somewhere, go to community college, I didn't care. Just go hang out at the strip club and drink beer, AJ, and he's like, "I don't want to." It's like, "What the fuck, tits and beer?" So, he's later, Joseph pleaded guilty to misdemeanor assault charges. So, misdemeanor assault he got. - From the worst. - Rape and kidnapping. - As if he just slapped a woman, Jesus. - misdemeanor assault. You can get in a shoving match outside of 7-Eleven tomorrow and you'll get charged with misdemeanor assault. That is a distance. - Unbelievable. - From rape and kidnap. So, we don't know what happened there. One of his friends here, Kevin Freel, who was a big into the political scene around here, he said, "I told him it'd be a lot easier "if you just changed your last name." - Yeah. - Just be a different person. - Yeah. - Fuck it. The problem is, though, he's also got some issues, Tom. He looks great on the outside, but he's got some other issues as well. He's had some problems with women in the past. Now, keep in mind, he's been married since like 1974, but that doesn't matter with this fucking guy. (laughing) - Yeah, how could you have problems with women? - Yeah, fuck that. So, it's a little bit weird. Now, years before all of this, I guess there's a woman who was a secretary for a Wilmington attorney, and was around her, was around a friend of hers, and she introduced Tom to her friend, and the woman said she didn't want to go out with Tom. Okay, this is 1977. So, he's been married like three years. He began pressuring the woman to go out with him. Not only go out and have sex with him. - Oh, boy. - And the secretary said, "I'm engaged. "I don't want to have sex with you." - Oh, don't worry, I'm married, it's fine. - He's like, "Yeah, I have like, "I'm going to have a bunch of kids and shit. "It doesn't even matter at all." - I have four daughters. - He went to her wedding. She was engaged, she wasn't lying. He went to her wedding, as all the office people went, and then even after she was married, was persistently bothering her to have sex with him. - My worry. - She clearly does not interest it. She's literally marrying a man. Wait till his dick falls out of favor, at least. - You were there when I stood in front of a holy man and took vows and shit. - Yeah, wait till I don't want him to fucking jump up and down on me anymore, and then we'll talk about it maybe. Give this marriage a few years to get old. - Yeah. - So it's insane. So he answers this with a stream of harassing phone calls to her. - Oh, man. - Which is a really at home, at work, in the middle of the night, in the middle of the day. - Oh, Jesus. - He tried to get her to come work for him, which is the last thing you'd wanna do. Now he controls your paycheck too, that's crazy. - Come sit in front of me for eight hours a day, while I, a, control your paycheck and be sexually molest you with my eyes. - Yeah, just to send you, I got a memo for you. Here it is. Oh, no, I'm not gonna fuck you. Okay, never mind. - This is Xerox of your penis, sir. - Yeah, this is not a memo. - Yeah. - So she, she said no, and she tried to, she didn't wanna talk to him anymore, but he became even more persistent. And he would follow her, you know, to her car. He would watch her from his office window. He tried, his family owned the apartment complex where she lived. I don't even know if she knew the family owned it. They own a lot of shit. He tried to have her, he tried to have her evicted from the apartment complex because she's showered. The shower that he could, yeah. He told her quote, "This is my town, my state." - What? - Wait, no. - Is this my town? Ooh, you lucky Luciano? What the fuck are you talking about? - This is of your town. - This isn't your town. And he said that if you don't wanna go out with me, you should just get out or you'll be sorry. Get out of town. Like it's a western. - My town, Montgomery Gentry. - What? She decided that she wasn't gonna be pushed out of town by this fucking demented John Wayne character. - Right. - And said no. So in September of 1980, he contacted a guy who he thought was a thug who we wanted to mess with her. Turns out the guy was actually a confidential informant for the FBI. - Oh no. - So he told this person that he was crazy about this woman. He loved her, he couldn't live without her. And he said, I love her, I'm crazy about her, I can't live without her, hurt that bitch. That's exact quote, unquote, hurt that bitch. - Can't stab her for me. - Very, I hate to see him, he didn't like you. This is amazing. - Hurt that bitch. - Hurt that bitch. I love her, hurt her bad. Wow, he said-- - Don't send her flowers, hurt that bitch. - He even gave her a couple suggestions of maybe how to do it. He said you could just knock her over the head, while she's walking, you could run up and clock her one and she'll fall down just to give her a hint or maybe run her over with your car. - Oh my God, that's how. She'll knock her right out of the road. She'll get the idea then. - Almost murder everything. - That's what it is, it's almost murder. He's like a mobster who she owes 100 grand to. Like, don't kill him 'cause I want my money, but I don't know, I mean business. - He doesn't understand how this works, I don't think. - No. - So the guy said, are you serious or do you want her killed? And he said, no, I couldn't live with that as we told this FBI informant. I don't want her killed, just hurt that bitch. - Yeah. - That's it. - Quote me. - So no physical harm ever came to her. He continued, so he just kept with the harassing phone calls. He just would bother her all the time and try to harass her. She eventually moved out of state, basically. The calls even continued then, and then eventually he gave up. But years this went on. This started in '77, by '80, he was talking about hurting that bitch. She never fucked him. For three years, he stalked and harassed this woman, and she never did anything to invite it. What's so happened? - That's why she left the state. - She had to leave. So now, around the '90s here, Tom meets Anne Marie. Okay, Anne Marie works for the governor. He works around politics. This is how it goes. So she meets him, and he is working as the head of the Wilmington office of Saul, Ewing, Remic, and Saul. And he's the governor's legal counsel, and this work often takes him to the governor's office where she is his scheduler, Anne Marie. So that's how they come in. She's, you know, young. She's got some troubles as well. She's got like an eating disorder, some emotional instability and stuff like that. But, you know, she's figuring it out. - She's had a very tough, anybody that-- - Exactly. - Been through her shit. It's gonna have some flaws here and there. - She's gonna have some stuff going on, but she's doing fine for herself. She's, you know, she's holding her life together as a single person and everything, and this guy, he's still married and has four kids, mind you. - Right. - How the fuck do you have time to harass somebody? - Right. - When you're married with four kids. - What about the dance recital, man? - I mean, dude, what are you doing this from Little League games? Hold on, I gotta go use a payphone and go, you fucking bitch. Okay, come on, sweetie. Hit that ball. Like, how do you have time for that shit? So, yeah, this is how it's going on. One day, Anne Marie, she would, usually, this is the other thing too, she would fold her dirty clothes, which is strange. She's very neat. - Hold, once she puts it in the hamper, it's folded up. - In the hamper, she folds it first. Yes, all of her clothes are folded nicely in her hamper, which would be very difficult to tell what's clean and what's dirty for me, so that would be hard. - Yeah, for me, that's like, you gotta, you gotta, you're pulling all that shit apart anyway, to sort it, and she's sorting it while she does it. - It's gonna not be folded in the machine, I assume. It's gonna go all over the place, so. - She is just folding clothes all day. - All of her shoes were in their original boxes, stacked in their closet in order of like, you know, certain orders she had. She's that much of a neat freak. Yeah, she's very much like that. Her friends called her quote, "Anal Annie." Which is a coincidence, 'cause that is also an award at the Adult Video Awards, I'm pretty sure. The Anal Annie Award, I believe, is for best, best gaping scene, I'm sure. - Every year, the newest starlet is told, that name's already taken. - You're no Anal Annie, sweetheart, that's what they tell her. Well, I know you're all cocky right now. - All full of yourself, but. - Oh, cock strong and. - Cocky and full of yourself, both. Anal Annie, so, but you know, it's just 'cause of her. - 'Cause she's anal-retented. - Like, butt sex, she might, I don't fucking know, but it's not, it's really pretty pointless, or beside the point at this moment. So, she said that she didn't know if she'd ever meet the right guy. She's only in her 20s, I mean, there's no reason to panic here, this is fine. - Calm down, yeah. - Then, in the summer of '93, Tom asks her out to lunch. - Tom. - Tom, he's been married, you know, 20 years or so. - Yeah. - Four daughters, but she says yes. She'll go out with him, 'cause he seems charming, he comes in all the time and. - She talks just to lunch. - It's just lunch, yeah, he didn't say lunch of my penis. - Right. - That's what we're serving. - You are not lunch. - El dente penis is what we're having this afternoon. Pesto El dente penis, enjoy. So, the summer of 1993, and she's single, she's available, and she's pretty and tall, and she just got out of a long-term relationship too, so, you know, that's going well. They have a dinner date in the summer of '93, so apparently the lunch went well. - Lunch went to dinner. - It moves on to dinner at the Risteronte Panorama in Philadelphia. - Fuckin' yeah. - So, very nice, and they have their first kiss that night, and everything else. - Oh. - Yeah, it's getting a little bit more than that, and from there, he really takes charge of the relationship. If they're going to dinner, he's gonna order the wine and the food. She'll have this, I'll have this, we'll have a bottle of this. - Oh. - Yeah, he's one of those guys, weird, I like to call that. Don't tell me what I'm doing. (laughing) I get it if he said like, we gotta have this wine, 'cause it's terrific, I've had it before, and you're gonna love it. We'll have this, that's different. - She'll have that is a weird thing to say. (laughing) I stopped ordering for my daughter when she was about five and a half. I'd say, you gotta tell them what you want now, so. - My daughter tells me what she wants, and I get, 'cause she doesn't even wanna talk to these people. I have to say what she wants, but I'm not telling the people she will have this because I said so. - It's creepy, right? - That's bizarre, and you'll have this because it goes with this is even weirder, I think. You're gonna have that. - We're gonna have this wine. Now pick something that goes with fucking Chardonnay. - That, well yeah, well you could pick the, some people pick the wine before the food, or the food before the wine, but. - Yeah, really? Yeah, I guess that's the point. 'Cause if you really want, if you go out and you're like, I really want fish, then you're gonna have white, but if you really want red wine, then you're gonna go, I'm not gonna order the fish, 'cause I got red, I'm gonna order the sauce. - Or if you're an uncultured piece of shit, you just drink it, whatever you want. - You just cross pollinate that shit. The other thing, and I will say this, there's a problem, number one, he's 17 years older than her as well, and I didn't know, besides when I got a job at a fucking restaurant selling wine, before that I didn't know dick about wine, so that's another thing. And she's an Irish girl, he's an Italian guy, you might know a little bit more about an Italian wine at restaurant, they panorama possibly also, that's all I'm thinking. - Should I just say fucking whiskey neat, please? - We're not having bellies, that's not what we're drinking. Sorry, we'll have a bottle of the Pinot Noir, thank you. - Yeah. - So, their dinner dates would mainly be in Philly. They just go to Philly, because it's not town, it's not where people will see them. - He won't be seen. - Exactly, but they're like in Philly, they walk around like they're immune to anybody seeing them, they don't give a fuck, they're going to the places people go, the popular hot spots and shit like that. He's buying her expensive drinks, our expensive gifts, and dresses, giving her cash, and giving her plain tickets to go with him places. - How? - I don't know how he's hiding this from his wife, I have no idea how he's doing that. - But, unless you put it all on credit cards and then just pay a credit card bill, not-- - That's probably what it is, or just it goes to his office, like in Mad Men, the private executive account where the bills go to the office, it's one of those things I think he's probably got that, I'm sure. Also, his wife seems ever real, don't ask, don't tell policy going on about what goes on at home. - She might be jacked about the situation. - He might be a pain in the ass, she's happy to have him out of the house. I'm not sure, but she's got a real kind of Carmella Soprano, like I don't know, he works very hard, I don't know, as long as the bills are paid and I don't care what he does out there type of deal. So, or maybe not, but also there's cash he would give her, why, he would come, he'd come over to her apartment with expensive gifts and expensive wine and they'd sit on her apartment sofa and drink expensive wine and all that kind of thing. Her brother Mark said the fact that he had money, I hate to say it, but she probably looked at his financial status as a security thing. - Yeah, and there's that dead dad thing, so you, - Yeah, the gone dad thing also, there's a lot of psychological reasons for her to like an older guy that has money and is secure, but you know, this might not be the right guy, like find one that's not married is the problem. - Yeah, but regardless of who it hurts because this is not just detrimental to his family, it's clearly detrimental to her too. She just doesn't care because there's the security and the comfort in, yeah. - And I think there's a possibility, she thinks that this might be something, who knows what he's telling her. He could be telling her me and my wife, you know. - Change the fucking politician. - We're not together really, we, yeah, I have a career, so we have to like stay together for the pictures and all that, but you know, we have to fuck. - We haven't fucked since the fourth daughter was born, like who knows what he's telling her, so. - Apple Card is the perfect cash back rewards credit card. You earn up to 3% daily cash on every purchase every day. That's 3% on your favorite products at Apple, 2% on all other Apple Card with Apple Pay purchases, and 1% on anything you buy with your titanium Apple Card or virtual card number. Visit apple.co/cardcalculator to see how much you can earn. Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch subject to credit approval, terms apply. - Introducing the new Blink Mini 2, the tiny but mighty plug-in smart security camera. Mini 2 works inside or outside with the Blink weather resistant power adapter, starting at just $49.98. 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That's Audible.com/Thrill or text Thrill to 500-500. - There's a lot of, her friend Kim said he treated her like a princess. He cared about every detail of her day of her life. - Okay. - So he really has a lot of time in his day. - He's certainly invested in this. - Four kids and a wife and you have time to manage the details of someone else's life. - Treat a, oh, 28 year old as a princess? How did it house? - Wow, he got five of them at home. - That's what I mean, I don't know how you're doing it. There's a lot of email messages that go back and forth between the governor's office and the law firm between the two of them and he would keep copies of the notes in his briefcase. He would print out the emails and keep them in his briefcase. - Yeah, very personal. There were times where they'd sneak away for long lunches and you know, not go come back after lunches and after noon times where they'd go to her apartment where at the time she had two roommates as well. I don't know if they were at work or listening or what, but the problem is, I don't know, this guy must not sleep because not only is there this relationship and he's married and he has four kids and he's a lawyer, which seems like that's a lot of work, probably too. He's got another girlfriend as well. - What? - This girlfriend, he's been carrying on an affair with since 1981, 15 years of this affair, now as a lawyer. - He's really Tony. - He is, that's what I mean. This is his umar because all the guys have a umar and this guy, he's a mob guy, like I feel great about this episode because I know a lot about what's going on here. It's very familiar in all the, he's a mob guy, he's got a gomara on the side and now he's looking for another one. He's, you know, he's got other ones that come in and out of his life but a lot of these old mob guys would have, the real old school thing to do was have like a second wife, basically a gomara ones. That was, she's got an apartment. Some of these guys had kids with them and everything. They had a whole separate life they'd go to like, you know, like Vincent de Cinciagante did that and all these guys, it was a big deal. So he's doing that and even non-monsters do that. It's a weird Italian thing that I don't understand it of the older generations that it was accepted to. My grandmother once told my mother, "Mom, what man doesn't fuck around?" That's what she said. "Mom, why do these women care?" She'd say, "Why do you have a nice house this dad?" "But what do you care what he does?" That was what she said out loud and we were all like, "What is wrong with you? "Are you kidding me?" - She came around before AIDS James. - Yeah, what do you care what he does? - That is wild. - I don't know. I don't want my pussy to rot out. - Yeah. - I mean, your pussy would rot out in the 50s and 60s. They didn't even have shit to fix it. No, it's just rot right out. It was worse than Christ Almighty. It's weird. So the other woman, her name is Deborah McIntyre and McIntyre and Capano have been having this affair since '81. This is how she is described by Jim Nolan here. Quote, "She was independently wealthy and attractive "without being beautiful. "A short, well-built woman, "she swam to stay in shape, "but lacked Fehe's striking features." So she lacked, she's not 5'10" and statue-esque like Anne Marie. - She's also older. - That's the other thing. They've been together since Anne Marie was a fucking, you know, literally in the fucking ninth grade. That's when they were in the other sense. She also dresses more conservatively because she's a school administrator. She works at a school. - Fuck. - So she's pretty buttoned down. Don't think she's not a freak at night though, 'cause we'll talk about that. Debbie will get into some shit. - Here's the thing, James. He's finding all these chicks that dress real nice during the day that it's a mystery what's under there and he figures it out. - Those are the ones he meets, 'cause those are who he's around. I mean, he's around professional situations. Plus, like Tony Soprano wanted to fuck Dr. Melphy. - Yeah, 'cause it's hot. - Yeah. - Yeah, well someone who's-- - You want to know what you look like under there? - Yeah, six plus success and confidence is attractive to people. It's just attractive. Now, Tom said about her, about McIntyre, he would boast to his friends that she had as strong a sex drive as any woman I ever met. She enjoyed sex very, very, very much as much as I did. He told a friend. Into it, and we know he's horny as fuck as we've realized. - Yeah. - He said that she introduced him to porn to really getting into porn. - They really dirty shit. - Yeah, 'cause if you came up beforehand, porn wasn't accessible to the public at home and shit until like the late '70s, early '80s when you could get videotapes. Before that, it was good to go jerk off in a theater around other people, like a lunatic. - It'd be a special kind of fucking horn dog to do that shit. - And you had to really have some blinders to like block up the guy next to you. - Other people whacking it? That is crazy. - Yeah, it's not just you, Jerk and all. It's another guy right there doing the same thing. - You know, either that or you had to get like a 16 millimeter film and hang a sheet on your wall and who the hell is gonna jerk off that the film fucking go, and that's not helping. - That's another real shit. - That's not helping. Ah fuck, that second real is really gets going. I'll tell you what. So also introduced him as he said, he claims she introduced him to three-way sex as well. - Meaning she would bring people? - That's what he says, but she will later dispute that. She doesn't dispute that they watched porno and had sex with other people, but she wasn't the one who brought all this in. She's acting like I was just innocent babe in the woods and she came in with her fucking, with a porn in one hand and a whip in the other and was like, let's get it on, bitch. - It's dirty principle and nothing but high heels and a whip. - High heels, a whip and a one of those suit jackets that they wear, but no underwear. - Dragon two friends with her. - Yeah, come on now. She talked about their first time alone together was in the bathroom of a friend's house on New Year's Eve when both her husband at the time and his wife were both also in the house. - Oh my. - So these two both get off on the sleaze and let's not get caught of it. - It's the danger. - It's the fucking danger. - That's what they're into. - This could ruin my entire life and yours. Let's do it. - It's a, yeah. - It's high wire act sex. That's what this is. That's saying, wow. Yeah, that makes it hotter. If we can, our lives can be destroyed over it. That's great. - It's kind of hot. - Well, every people are, it's exciting. People don't want to get caught, yeah. She also said, talked about the first time they had sex, it was on the floor of his den in his house during a Memorial Day weekend when his wife was away visiting relatives. - Jesus. - So he had her over to the crib there. - Just showed her his den and his dick. - Yeah, his dick. He had a bear skin rug, I'm sure. - There's something on the floor. - Yeah. Eventually they would hook up on a weekly basis, sometimes even more at the Motel 6 on Route 9 near the Delaware Memorial Bridge. - Good Lord. - Oh yeah. He also had-- - The danger has just, they don't even care about that. - Well, they're just stopping at the shit motel that none of those people would go to. Nobody they know would go there. - It's not dangerous at all. - No, no, it's just an affair after a while. It's just good fucking pretty soon. - Yeah, this is guaranteed sex. - It's just crazy, you know, we're watching porn with two other people in the room sex at that point. So he had the keys to her house. He had the code to her alarm. He could come by anytime he wanted unannounced and just, you know, like he lived there basically. - Wow. - He was like Tony stopped by his girlfriend's houses all the time. Or Don Draper would stop by Midge's house and first season there. Well, she'd do an artwork and shit. Same thing. She of course didn't have a key to his house and couldn't go there unless his wife was out of town and he invited her and she was absolutely not allowed to leave messages on his answering machine, which is just common sense if you're gonna have an affair. - Yeah, you wanna fuck this up or what? - Yeah, this is pre, you know, everybody having cell phones here. - Yeah, I thought you liked sex very, very, very, very much. - Very, very much, yeah, fucking don't leave a message. - Yeah. - So apparently one time he ended the affair at one point and she ended up getting them back together. She said I would have loved to have him leave his wife for me but I became satisfied with what we had. I figured the relationship we had made me feel so good that I could live with what we had. She was happy being a Gomar, that was all there was to it. She was like, this is nice. He buys me shit, comes over, fucks me in leaves. We go out to dinner, he fucks me. And then him and whoever else was here leaves, you know. - Then him and everybody else gets out. - And him and all the other naked people put their clothes on and go home. - And I get to sleep. - Yeah, so by summer of '94 and Marie had moved into her own apartment, kind of a rundown apartment on the second floor of a building. He helps her though by buying her a 32 inch TV which in 1994 was a big screen basically in '94. Outside of a projection, that's about as big as you're gonna get. That's like expensive. That was like probably $800 in 1994. - We had a 27, the whole living room could see it. It's crazy. - I remember when my dad got a 27, I was like, whoa. - Look at this motherfucker. - He bought it on a Sunday and I was like, football's gonna be insane today. Like I was jacked for 27 inch CRT. And I was in like 92. - On the Lord's Day, he brought that to you. - Doing the Lord's work is what he's doing. Also bought her like an espresso machine and a fancy mixer and, you know, all the fancy shit that she wasn't gonna be able to afford herself. People started to, there's rumors though. I mean, you can only go so long without people that's getting out that both, you know, people know them. - I get to behave around people. People pick up on shit like that. - But everybody, they swear all their friends to secrecy, please don't say anything. Please don't say anything. - Are you fucking, shut up. - Some of her siblings would be like, all of a sudden she had this expensive wardrobe and all this shit, but they just figured that she was trying to up her look for her job. You know what I mean? She works in the governor's office now. Her sister said, there's this big TV in her living room. 32 inch by the way, this big TV. Huge. - Yeah. - But that was like-- - I can't believe it. - When you walked into someone's house and all of a sudden they had that, you go, damn, where'd you get that thing? That's fucking gorgeous. - Yeah. - She said I asked her where she got it. She said she won it. - Yes, she did. - It's raffles. - Yeah, she won it, all right. She said later on, she said, now things do make sense. She knew I wouldn't approve, as wouldn't her sister said once she found out later. Now by the beginning of 1995, she's having a tough time with him because he's starting to be very demanding now. - Yeah, he doesn't-- - And Marie is? - Yeah, on the sopranos, when he had the original Russian girlfriend, she said something about some other guy and he said, what you do on your own time is none of my concern, and I'll fucking care. When you're with me, I don't give, that's the one thing. This isn't how his attitude is at all. - Really? - His attitude is, I own you because I bought you shit. - I'm the one. - And I'm the one here. So, he started to be very jealous. He didn't want her to go to the shore with her friends. You know, he wanted her to stay out of this pub where all of her family used to go and hang out and a bunch of her friends went. Whenever he, she would dress in anything like low cut or anything, he would say, you look like a whore. Very nice. - Yeah. - It's pretty silly. He also got-- - Defined whore, sir. - You son of a bitch. - Cleavage is showing in his case. - Yeah, but it's just like, dude, you're literally giving me things and money and in exchange for sex. Like, what are you trying to call me here? - He wants to own her. That's it. He thinks in his mind he's buying her, you know? - Okay. - He got pissed off when he repeatedly asked her to come work for the family business. His first, for her brother, for his brother, and she said no, and he got pissed off at that too. Now, there's another problem. In the middle of 1995, he starts another affair as well. - How? - How much gins do you have? - People usually only juggle with three balls. He's already got four going on now. This is crazy. This is insanity. Yeah, he's got a wife and three girlfriends now. So this is Susan Louth. She's a secretary at the construction firm, his family's construction firm, who started having an affair with him in middle of 1995. Then, this is all going on. Then, in late 1995, Tom leaves his wife. - Good. - Okay. Now around this time, Tom and Ann Marie are starting to kind of drift the part a little bit because he's got other girlfriends, and you know, his time can only be spread so thin. She starts dating another man. - Okay. - A single man, an unmarried man named Michael Scanlan, who's a banker with MB and A, who had been introduced to her by her boss, the governor. The governor said, "Here's a nice young man for you." - Yeah. - You should talk to him. So that's what they do. So she never tells this Scanlan about Tom though, because she didn't want to mess that relationship up here. But her sister said she told me she hoped to marry him that he was it, meaning this other guy, Scanlan. - Uh-huh, MB and A, yeah. - Yeah, yeah, the banker guy. So the problem is Tom isn't quite ready to let her go completely yet, obviously. - Yeah. - He tells her friends that she ruined his life and that he left his wife for her and now she was rejecting him. He has two other girlfriends, at least. These are the ones we know about. Who knows what else he's got going on cooking? You know what I mean? - You didn't leave your wife for her. - She wouldn't answer his emails. He offered to buy her a new Lexus and she said no. He offered her a free apartment in one of the complexes, his family owns. She said no. He bought her plane tickets to Europe. She said no. - Yeah. - Guess what? - Those are hints. - No. - You know? - Those are the biggest hints you can get. She's saying no to you a lot. - To a luxury car, no. So she, at one point talked to her friends saying, I wonder if I'm gonna have to get out of town to get away from this fucking guy 'cause he won't leave me alone. And he's always in the office because he's the governor's, you know? So it works. He would tell her that's my TV in your apartment. I bought you those dresses. I'm the only one who's allowed to see you in those dresses 'cause I paid for them. He said, even the groceries I bought you in your fridge are mine. Everything's mine that I bought you. - I ate and shot those three months ago. - The ones you have right now that I dropped off. Mine. - Yeah, I have an Instacartan every day. - Hey, don't touch those grapes. - These are mine. Stop it. - Those cotton candies, don't you dare. - The provolone is mine. Leave it alone. I'm gonna weigh it. It better be a half pound when I pick it up again. So one day he barged into her apartment and started taking things. This is mine. I think this is the one I bought for you and I take that. - He's got the paddle ball. - He said, quote, no man is going to watch the TV that I gave you or see you in the dresses I gave you. - Jesus. - No other man's eyes will watch this TV as a ridiculous thing about saying that. How dumb would you feel saying that? With a straight face, could you say that? - No man's eyes show watch a football game on this TV. - He eventually brought it all back though. - Okay. - Because he said he felt that. - He felt the shame. - What was he got in his car? - That's not gonna help. She's not coming back because you stole all her shit. She's not gonna come back to you to get her TV back. That's probably not gonna happen. So he told all of her friends that he loves her and all of this shit, it's a lot, it's a lot. So Anne-Marie, by now, some time goes by when we're in 1996, everybody says like she became a little more gaunt. Her eating disorder had kicked in a little bit more. Possibly from the stress, she lost a lot of weight, looked pretty skinny, her therapist gives her prozac for her depression around this time as well. And also he, Tom claims she spoke of suicide around this time too, nobody else knows said that. She told, she would tell all her friends that he was crazy. So he'd say, she said she wants to kill herself and she would say he's insane. - Okay. - She doesn't know he's crazy. One time he drove Anne-Marie to his house against her will. That's called kidnapping. - It is. - That's called, well you learned it from his brother, which is, he's been great at it. - Taking a person from one location to another against their will is the definition of kidnapping. - It's exactly what kidnapping is and pulled into the garage and locked the doors of the car, refusing her to let her get out until she heard him out. - That's called false imprisonment. - Like this is-- - Inside. - That's terrifying. - Yeah. - And he's like, the car's running too. You better hope I get to the end of it before we pass out. Not not saying that actually happened, but that's what it would seem like. He might as well take it that far here. So he would did that. He listened to him, he eventually let her go. He would hang out outside her apartment, just saying please let me in and she wouldn't let him in. So into 1996, into the spring, he starts calling her less and less often, kind of goes away a little bit, kind of fades away, and she starts to think she's good now, okay? In her diary on April 7th, 1996, she wrote, "I have finally brought closure to Tom Capano. "What a controlling manipulative, insecure, jealous maniac." She says, "Not a ringing endorsement." - I wouldn't, yeah, that's not-- - You don't wanna put that like on your website at the top. - Yeah. - I'm Tom Capano. - If you called another employer and said, "Why did he leave?" And they read that to you. You're not hiring that guy. - Probably not. He's obviously still dating, you know, Deb McIntyre, he's got Susan, the secretary and the school teacher he's got here. There's a lot going on here. He, even at one point, re-established contact with the lady who he tried to pay somebody to run over with a car. - Okay, yeah. - Also, there's a lot here. Now, February, 1996, he told his brother, Gerard, he had a problem. Told Jerry, there was an issue. - He's got another brother. - He's got a, yeah, he's got a bunch of brothers here. There's Jerry, there's Louie, there's Robert Gellum, Junior, yeah, Joey. He said, "A man and a woman were trying to extort him." So he's trying, he said, "Can I borrow a handgun "for protection? "I'm afraid they're gonna try to do something to me." So, Tom also asked Gerard here. Now Gerard is the one, he's kind of considered the craziest of the group, of the brother group here. He said, "Do you know anyone I could hire "to break someone's legs as well? "I'm looking for a handgun and also a leg breaker, "if you can point me in the right direction." - Everything else in my life is going great, those are the two things I need. - That's it. And he also said, "If I have to say, "kill these extortionists to protect my family, "they come to my house and I have to shoot them, "could I possibly use your boat if I need to?" At that point. And Jerry, I was like, "Yeah, I mean, whatever, "you know what I mean, it's cool." - Brothers or brother? - Brothers or brother, yeah, you have to do that. And it's just an Italian thing, if someone comes up to you that you're related to and says, "I need your boat," and you have to let them do it. Just one of those things, it's the law of the old country. - I may never get this boat back, but okay. No way to stop it, you just have to do it. - It may be confiscated by law enforcement someday. All right, enjoy. - If I had a boat, my brother came to me, I'd be like, "Fine, you know what I mean? "Like, I have to." - Fill it up when you bring it back. - Great, thanks. Yeah, don't fuck it up, please. Come on, man. - Don't run it around. - Well, you have to. So in April, 1996, Anne-Marie agrees to see Tom here, agrees to see him in May at one point. She said goodbye to him in April, so that was the end of it. Then, she starts talking to him again and agrees to see him in May for one day. One day, she sent an email to him and signed it. I signed it, "Love you." So that's odd during this time. - But if you do, you do. - Yeah, I guess, but that's probably the wrong signal to send a stalker. - Yes. - You've just gotten to stop stalking him. - Perhaps to get a tongue in cheek. - That's weird. If you want the cats to stop coming to your back door, stop putting out cat food. - Yeah. - You know? I'm not saying that she was putting out cat food to begin with, but then all the cats went away and she said, "Oh no, I kind of missed the cats." (laughs) - She should have put out a rat feed. - Yeah, it's weird. So another day, then she told him it was over another day. So this, they were just having a, I don't know, she might have said a cat, maybe she signs all of her fucking stuff with all of her friends like that. I don't know, you know what I mean? That's the other thing. Another day, she told him it was over and he responded by calling her a slut and a bitch and grabbing her throat before she jumped out of the car. - Yeah, I mean, that's over. - It's over at that point, right? - It's done. - Yeah. Then in April, he went to the sports authority on Concord Pike and paid $180 for a five foot long white igloo cooler. - Oh. - It's a fishing model. It's used to store a big fish for deep sea fishing. Now, June 12th, 1996, she's still dating Michael Scanlan. She faints in her office that day. She faints and has a bit of an issue medically. Faints, the first person she called isn't Michael Scanlan. It's Tom. - Why? - She calls Tom first, I don't know. That's what's weird. I don't know why she felt safe calling him at that point. I don't know if he'd been sweet talking or what, but that's what happened. June 27th, 1996, he invited her to dinner that night at the Ristorante Panorama site at their first kiss. - That's all time safe, yep. - Anne-Marie, they ate at seven. They started eating at seven. She had a Laura Ashley flower print dress on and she had swordfish and that's what we know. There's something going on though. There's recent emails and phone calls that shows like they've been talking more and being more friendly, but we don't know what's going on here. So she takes her leftovers here about 9 p.m. Tom says they drove back to his house to pick up groceries for her house, which was rice, bananas, spinach, strawberries and soup. She was picking, I don't know, he had extra food at the house, I don't know what's going on. He also gave her, had a gift for her, a $400 outfit that she had tried on a few days earlier but said was too expensive to buy. So she bought it. - Just went back and picked it up, had a bowl. - He said they drove five minutes to her apartment where he placed the groceries on the kitchen counter. He gave her the gift. He said he went into her bedroom to check on the air conditioner and 'cause she said there's something was going on with it and to use the bathroom and he was gone by 10 p.m. Now, the next day he has his home here, his main home, he removes the wall-to-wall beige carpet and these large sleeper sofa with pillows in the great room of his house the next day. He's busy. Yeah, with help from his brother Gerard, he went to his now soon-to-be ex-wife's house 'cause they're apart and borrowed her 93 Chevy Suburban so he could take it to a dumpster on a property owned by the construction company, his family's construction company, and then another brother ordered that the dumpsters be emptied several days ahead of schedule. Not shifty at all here. - Not at all, yeah. - Now, later that day, Tom went to air-based carpets in Newcastle where he purchased an eight-by-eleven $249 multicolored oriental rug and two chairs. To replace it with. The housekeeper said super weird because she said the carpet and the sofa were in very good condition, for no reason to throw them out and not stained at all when she had cleaned the house on June 24th, which was just days before this. So really weird. Now, the day of the carpets, by the way, he had a busy day 'cause that's what he was doing later, the carpets. Earlier in the day, he was waking up his brother Jerry at 6 a.m. - Oh? - Woke up Jerry at 6 a.m. knocking on the door. It's Tom. And Jerry's like, what do you need? And, you know, they said it was, Jerry thought it was weird because he's the last brother you expect to be banging on your door to not hour. - Yeah, he's always-- - He's the most-- - Well, put together. - Yeah. - Exactly, he's well sewn up here. They said he's the good son, you know what I mean? He's a level-headed attorney. He's all that kind of shit and everything. Now, what he says is I need help. And you, Jerry-- - He's to a sea ray. - He said, can you get a hold of the boat? And Jerry said, okay, I mean, yeah, I can get a hold of the boat. He had asked him about the boat in February, wondering if he would lend it to him, if he had to kill two people who were extorting him. And this was also around the time he borrowed a gun and said, can you find someone to break anybody's legs? He had returned the gun a while ago. Nothing ever came of the other thing, of the leg-breaking. But now it's 6 a.m. on June 28th. And he's saying, hey, I need that boat again. So Jerry said, did you do it? And he said, yes. So they hop in, it's a 25-foot hydro sports fishing boat. - Oh. - Cool boat. Nice fishing boat. Yeah, 25 foot, that's a nice boat. 25's a good-sized boat, but unless you're-- Yeah, it's a nice boat I got, but it's a fishing boat. It's certainly a lake boat. That's not a fucking ocean boat. Well, that's where they use it for the ocean, for the sea. Yeah, that's frightening. That's a small boat. Oh, you know what, it might be a center console, 25 footer. Those could, those can come up. It's a fishing boat. It's not a speed boat. You're thinking of like the little speed boats, I think. Yeah, I'm just thinking of any kind of boat that's 25 feet long is generally not big enough for the fucking ocean, unless it's a center console with a couple of big outboards. That's a pretty damn good fishing boat. Yeah, that's where he keeps it. It's Smuggler's Cove Marina is where he keeps it. I'll bet that's what it is, about the center console. Gotta be one of those deals there. And it's called the Summer Wind. You bet it is. Because the one thing I'm gonna, here's something for people out there. I don't know how many Italian listeners we have, but I assume 99% of you aren't. So I'm gonna fill you in on something. Every Italian guy, maybe not if they're under like 30 now, but everybody else has something named after something Frank Sinatra. It's just a thing. What's my oldest dog's name? Jimmy? That is Frankie. Yeah, it is Frankie. Yeah. I thought Franklin Doggano Roosevelt was funny, a funny thing to call her. But still, it just happens. We can't help it. And Summer Wind is a popular Frank Sinatra song. And that's why, yeah. And Stu Gats was already taken by Tony Soprano. So he couldn't use that. So they take it, it's filled up with fuel. They go out to see the Marina attendance. He's two people pulling off him and his brother, and they're a big giant cooler. Okay, yeah. And which a lot of people take a cooler out there. Fuck yeah, you're gonna need it. You're gonna catch a giant fish. Jerry's captaining, and he's also got a deer rifle with him too. Where are you fishing? Don't worry about that. We're gonna get him this way. There's sturgeon, there's deer, there's all sorts of shit out there. I don't know what I'm gonna run into. You might get a ten pointer. I don't know. Sometimes the steelhead ain't so cane to bite. Shoot it, shoot it. That's so weird. So yeah, they said that Tom stayed in the company of the five foot long cooler. The cooler, by the way, had a lock and a chain on top of it, holding it close, which is not, that's not normal now for going out on the boat usually. Sometimes the bud lights jump in more than the fish. You know what I mean? That's when they threw big pussy off the side of the boat. You know what I'm saying? Like that's with chains and locks and shit. So they were heading about 60 miles offshore, I think 77 miles is where they end up going. Jeez. This is where you go for big, you know. Big fish. Big fish in here, yeah. This is where basically it's 190 feet to the bottom of the sea. You throw something off here, it's never getting faster. You're never finding that. No, no. You're gonna have to get in a little exploding fucking capsule that'll take you down below the sea at that point. The things that fold. Yeah, yeah. So he at that point, Tom grabs a hold of the giant padlock cooler that he had loaded into his brother's jeep and drags it onto the ramp of the back of the boat and pushes it off. Yeah. And it floats. Yeah, 'cause it's full of foam. 'Cause it's a fucking cooler. It's a cooler, it's the flow. The insulation floats, guys. So now, he's got a cooler just floating away from them in the open ocean and then trying frantically to catch up to and sidle up next to the cooler because they can't just let it float around the ocean, Matt. Right, like a fucking murder iceberg. It's a, that's it. It's a little murder bird. Holy, it's a murder buoy. That's all it is. Jesus Christ. Wow. Gerard is losing his mind at the helm of the boat. He's like, what the fuck are you doing? Jesus Christ. He said, quote, I can't believe you got, let me get involved in this. What the fuck is wrong with you? And he's Tom's trying to fish the fucking cough, this fucking giant cooler out of the goddamn ocean while he's trying to sidle up next to it on the thing. He spat it as brother. He was so mad. If you son of a bitch, then they're trying to figure out. Tom's going, I can't get it. I can't get it out. And then also to extract it from the water is gonna be hard 'cause there's that destruction with the water that's-- It's so heavy, too. It's gonna be so heavy. So Jerry now, this is a, we've turned it into a Cohen Brothers movie now. Now it's fucking Fargo because the brother then takes his deer rifle and fires a shot at it. Yeah. But water in it. Yeah. At the cooler. Yeah. Maybe that'll do it. It'll suck in and go. That would really only work with two holes probably is the problem due to the way-- Hopefully it goes all the way through, yeah. Yeah. So he shoots it into the side of the cooler and some blood comes out of the side of the cooler. Oh, Jesus. That's not great. Finally, Tom pulls it on board. So they tried throwing it out. They tried picking it out up. It wouldn't come out. They tried shooting it. It was still floating around. So now Tom drags this back onto the boat. He opens up the chains, opens up all this and it pops the lid off. This is the first time Jerry has seen what's in the cooler. Oh, God. He's here. He will say later that he didn't see the body in the cooler. But we think he did. It's-- and Marie, he's gotten the cooler, obviously. Just one. Not two bodies. Not two bodies. And a young woman's body. She really looks like an extortionist. Yeah, I don't know how you-- Jesus, yeah. You couldn't offended her off on any other-- by any other means I could see. That's a nice dress on that extortionist. A flowery Laura Ashley dress. What all extortionists wear, usually. That's a extortionist uniform. Organized crime, they love flowery Laura Ashley stuff. It's weird. I've noticed it growing up. Lots of guys wearing that shit. So this is what's weird. He would later say Gerard would say he just thought it was one of the two people his brother told him about in February that were extorting him. So Jerry said his last memory of this was the sound of something hitting the water, which he said he turned around Jerry after he heard the noise, looked, and he saw an ankle and a foot sinking into the water. That's what he saw. So he saw the last little part of a body sinking into the water. By the way, he used the anchor from Summerwind's anchor to fucking to weigh down the body. Wow. And just tossed the cooler. Don't need this anymore. That's how fishermen end up finding it bobbing around in the sea a few days later. So Tom, it took eight hours to do this, by the way. Jesus eight hours. So he did all of that. Then he did the carpeting thing. Then he got home and had a pizza and watch TV with his daughters and fell asleep. That's a cold son of a bitch, man. That is a hardcore at least, you know, Tony after a murder soprano would go have a big steak with the guys first to decompress and then go home. You couldn't just go home and be like, hi kids, let's have some ice cream. That's fucking weird. So he wakes up though about 10 30 p.m. from falling asleep with his daughters. He leaves the daughters there, tells them, you know, he'll pick them up the next day and heads out the door. He drives two blocks to a place on Delaware Avenue, pulls into the driveway, opens up the back door with his key and heads on up into Debbie McIntyre's place. Wow. She's already. That's your gal. Yep, she's already in bed. She's been expecting him. They start, you know, kissing and all that sort of thing. The next morning they have sex and go downstairs and have breakfast and all that kind of shit. That's how that goes. So that's, that's his 24 hours following that. Jesus. Pizza with the kids and sex with your fucking other, with your Gumbar. So that's what's going on. June 30th, 1996, which is a couple days later. Anne Marie's supposed to show up to have dinner with her brother and her boyfriend, her brother and yeah, her brother boyfriend and somebody and her sister as well and her, her sister. So Robert Fahey, your brother is like, why didn't her and her boyfriend show up for dinner? What's going on? So he, so the sister and a few friends go to her apartment to see if everything was okay. And they saw groceries, the gift box, the wallet, the lights were off, the air conditioning was on. They's found Anne Marie's Volkswagen Jetta sitting in the same spot that it had been before, but she's not there. So a bunch of messages are on her machine piling up on her, you know, her voicemail and all that kind of thing. Michael Scanlon's calling her, going, where the fuck are you? Well, how come you haven't called me? Her brothers and her sisters and everything else. So there's nothing missing from her apartment except the, except the car keys and car keys aren't there. And her obviously, everything else seemed, you know, things seemed out of place, which is the weird thing though. There's groceries still on the counter. Shoe boxes had been pulled from the closet and were left on the floor. She keeps them stacked in the back of the closet. The bedspread had been pulled back, but it didn't look like anyone had slept there. So they got to like, you know, turn down service on it. The rectangular gift box containing the suit from Talbotz, which is what he bought at that $400 outfit was partially opened and tossed on the floor. So people are like, this isn't what she would do. She folds her dirty laundry. - Right. - So three days after all of this, the cops knock on Tom's door at 3.39 AM. They're trying to rouse him. He's a day guy and they know it. So they're trying to rouse him and see if they can catch him off guard. They said that we were looking for a missing person. He said she mentioned something about going to the shore with her sister maybe or her friend. I don't know, she's going somewhere. He told them he did go to her apartment Thursday night, but he left after that and he stopped at the Getty gas station on Lovering Avenue for cigarettes. So the cops follow up, go to that gas station and find out that night the station had to close early so that he couldn't have stopped there for cigarettes. - Why lie? - Why lie about something like that that you don't know. That's how you catch somebody and doing something stupid. So Debbie McIntyre, they go talk to her and she says, "Annmarie, who?" She had no fucking idea this girl existed. - Oh no. - None. Except for when Tom came and told her about the whole thing a few days later. Even then she still stayed with him. Even though he was married, he left his wife still doesn't stay with her, finds other women to go out with. She said at that point she began to worry because she bought a 22 caliber Beretta for Tom a couple months ago. So when she asked him to give it back to her, she said he told her he got rid of it. - Oh no. - That's not good. At a later point-- - Why would you get rid of it? - At a later point he told her, she said, "Well, where'd you get rid of it? "Where'd you get rid of a gun?" And he said, "I threw it deep in the water." And that's all he said. (laughing) Okay. So investigators questioned her about the gun when that started happening. He made up a big elaborate tale for her to tell them. He said, "Okay, tell them you bought the gun "for self-defense, but threw it away in the trash "because you feared your children would get their hands on it." Didn't wanna, you changed your mind. It was more dangerous to have it in the house than it would be to face the wilds of the outside. Doesn't matter. So July 4th-ish, that's when the fishermen from Harrisburg find a giant empty cooler floating at sea. And they're like, "Sweet, we could use this for fish." And they pull it on board. It's a coffin. - Yeah, it was a makeshift igloo coffin. - Fucking, there's been a dead bot and they're just putting their fish on it. - Yikes. - Yeah, the top was missing. There's a hole in the side, but they said, "I mean, fuck, it's still a fucking cooler." So over the July 4th time here, more than 300 people joined the Fehe family in a massive search of the park and creek near her apartment. She's got a park and a creek that'd be a good place for something bad to happen, you know what I mean? $10,000 reward is issued by the family and offered and a few days later, even President Clinton at that time would offer federal aid to the investigation if they needed it. And police, though, can't find anything. They can't find a body, they can't find anything. So in their investigation here, they had interviewed Anne-Marie's closest friends who all described this affair she had with Tom and her desire to break it off and him coming over and taking the fucking TV and all that kind of shit. They questioned the waiters at the Panorama restaurant, restaurant the Panorama, where the staff recalled her being solemn, quote unquote, during the dinner that she had in June, that last dinner that they had, she was solemn while eating a $154 dinner. That's what they came to, the dinner. - It's tough to be solemn with a dinner like that. - That's a 96, that's fucking-- - That's a great dinner. - That's a great dinner, yeah. - High dollar dinner. So a FBI special agent, Eric Alpert, interviewed Anne-Marie's therapist as well, because now she's dead and the families are saying, okay, talk, so. Now the therapist had seen her the day before her date with Tom, she told the, this therapist told the investigator that Anne-Marie had been, that the therapist had been trying to convince Anne-Marie to get up the nerve to tell Tom to just go away for good. - Yeah. - Anne-Marie said she was frightened of Tom and that he had threatened to expose their relationship if she didn't stay with them. That would be worse for him than for her. So I'd go, go ahead, motherfucker, I don't care. You're the one with four fucking kids to explain it to, not me. - Yeah. - You got a wife and two other girlfriends to explain this to, and all your law partners and the fucking governor of why your tagging is fucking-- - Your whole wife, yeah. - Yeah, guess what, if you go in and your fucking the governor's scheduling chick, who's the governor gonna be mad at, not her, him? Don't come in my office and try to bang my staff, you fucking scumbag. - Sure, yeah. - So yeah, a little bit different, but she took that as a threat, she didn't wanna lose her job. She said it would leak, this would, she didn't want her boyfriend to find out about it either. Her new boyfriend that she'd been going out with this married guy 'cause she thought that he would dump her. - Sure. - So the therapist told the investigator that she thought that that was the only reason she would have gone to dinner with Tom was to try to let him down easy so he would not, he's just trying to ease off him so he doesn't freak out and tell everybody. - Slo-bring. - Yeah. - Yeah. Now, two days after this FBI agents and local detectives, this is later on in July, they go to his house, to Tom's house, they see the cheap new carpet and they find blood stains on the woodwork and radiator of the great room, the same room that the cataclysmic carpeting had to take him. - Yeah. - Yeah. - So that's interesting, they also found, find a stain on the laundry room closet door near the container, right near the container of carbona blood remover that, I didn't even know that was a product that existed. That sounds like something made up for our story, doesn't it? - Why would you ever have that in your house? - Got this blood remover, very specific. Oh, I got that for, no, no, this is for blood, it says so. (laughing) - I keep it next to the paint thinner and the rat poison and the antifreeze. - Oh my God, and the antifreeze, and a shitload of sleeping pills, like even while in the same place. They also found out that this carbona blood remover had been purchased by Tom at Happy Harry's drugstore on June 30th, but a day and a half after Annmarie disappear. They also, so the officers dig up his whole yard, oh yeah, this is, it's go time, now they dig up his yard, they remove a toilet, they search his 1993 black Jeep Grand Cherokee and his 93 Chevy Suburban, but he wouldn't talk at all, he's got a lawyer who's the former Delaware Attorney General, Charles Oberle III, that's his lawyer. Nah, fucking around, his lawyer says publicly, quote, "They have Zilch to connect my client to this." Zilch, blood remover, man. - That's it, he told his friend, while this is all going on, but this would all blow over, as we tell, he said, quote, "Once Labor Day is over, this is going to go away. The fates are nothing but white trash." - Jesus. - I don't know what difference that would make in the disappearance of a woman. It doesn't matter if her family's white trash or not, whether they are or not, are pretty irrelevant here. - They still deserve to be alive. - They still get looked for, they don't just go, I don't know, we look for her for a month, I don't know, her family's white trash, moving on. - That fucking FBI's involved. The president said, "We've got anything you need." I think they're going to look into this further, probably. - Their family wears NASCAR shirts, I don't know what to tell you. - I don't know, it's over, man, I'm sorry. No, they watch sports in the front yard. It's really weird, that's their family. - Big Dick Trickle fans, it's about a sign. - Big Dick Trickle, just drinking beer and watching sports in the front yard. They plug a fan in and have a fan blowing on them in the yard, it's really weird. That's a weird one I've seen, with an indoor stand-up oscillating fan outside. - Those people do that, I'm like, "That is white trash." - It's not doing anything for you. - No. - What makes a life a good one? Is it the adventure you have? Or the friends you find along the way? Maybe it's pursuing your passion while striving to protect, defend, and save what you believe in every single day. So what makes a life a good one? In the Coast Guard, we think it's all of the above and more. You'll have to find out for yourself. Visit gocoastguard.com to learn more. - Hey, it's Kaylee Cuoco for Priceline. Ready to go to your happy place for a happy price? Well, why didn't you say so? Just download the Priceline app right now and save up to 60% on hotels. So whether it's Cousin Kevin's Kazoo concert in Kansas City, go Kevin or Becky's Bachelorette Bash in Bermuda. You never have to miss a trip ever again. So download the Priceline app today. Your savings are waiting. ♪ Go to your happy place for a happy price ♪ ♪ Got your happy price, Priceline ♪ - So September of 1996 comes around after Labor Day. They're still interested. The Assistant US Attorney, Calm Connolly, convenes a grand jury, as a matter of fact. So not only are they still interested, they're convening grand juries to investigate this. In October, investigators talk with two more people that Tom Capano knows here. I guess Tom had moved in with his brother Louis and continues to keep a low profile here. So they talk about how now he has moved to his mother's house after that. So he ends up going from his brother's house to his mother's house after his house is essentially a fucking possible crime scene. They even intercept. The FBI intercepts a cargo ship with blood that was headed to Europe that contained a pint of blood donated by Anne Marie Fahey so they could get her DNA 'cause they don't have her body. - Oh, she donated it. - She donated blood. - And they were shipping it elsewhere and they're like, stop that ship. - Stop that ship, you gotta get on and get that one out of a whole cargo ship. - One pint. - A pint of blood. They had to pull it out. - And then you guys could go. - This is back then, it wasn't like the hairs had to have a big attached room. Like you couldn't get DNA from people unless you had their body really. So this is the only way. Now they have blood so they can try to match it. - Doesn't she have a fucking hairbrush though? - It would have, the hairs had to be perfectly intact with all of those intact. - One of them had to have come out that way, right? - She's pretty anal though. I don't think she would need that. - Great point, she may clean that motherfucker analani every time. - Yeah, yeah. - She's like Seinfeld when Newman goes, not even a hair in his brush. So clean, trying to get a hair. So they do all of that and DNA tests confirm that her blood matches the blood taken from the apartment. - The radiator. - Oh, the apartment, I guess, meaning his place, I assume, since he rents it. So now they bring in different, but he said they had an affair. So there's, you know, it's not enough yet. So they bring in members of his family. They ask his older brother, Louis, or Louis, about the dumpsters that he had emptied early. And even question Tom's oldest daughter as well. See if she knew anything. So the one year anniversary comes and they still don't have enough, they don't think to prosecute or to arrest him. 'Cause they don't have her body, they want her body. That's what they really want. They twice more call Louis up, who ran the family business. He ordered that four dumpsters be emptied ahead of schedule, the weekend after the disappearance, obviously. Louis second wife, pro golfer, Laurie Merton. Okay. - What? - Didn't expect that, a pro lady, pro golfer to enter the fucking equation, but there she is. - In the mix with a guy who was accused of rape and kidnapping. - Yeah, no shit. - She'd been called even before the grand jury to talk about secret taps she placed on the family phone to catch Lou with his mistress, Christi Pepper, who is the most, that is the most mistress name you'll ever get. If your name is Christi Pepper, no one will marry you. You are forever going to be someone's mistress. - Yeah, you will always be Christi Pepper. You're never getting a new last name. - You're Christi Pepper, I can't marry you, I'm sorry. This is not in the cards. They even subpoenaed her, they subpoenaed Lou's son, they subpoenaed everybody. Nobody's saying shit though. - No. - They got a real, yeah, it's a thing, they know not to talk, so that's good, well good for the family, but not good in this situation. - No, not good for justice. - No, not good for yeah, for things to be right. Summer 1997 comes now, so it's been a year. And they're thinking about all of this, they're thinking about everything, and they're thinking, who's the weak link? Who can we fucking get to, they need a domino to fall here, okay? So October 1997, they know what happened here, but they have, they need to prove it, they need to get somebody to talk about, because by getting rid of the body, it did throw a big wrench into the thing. Nobody, no crime. - Right. - People say that for a reason, because it's been a year of, he obviously fucking did something with her, there's blood in his apartment, but-- - Can't prove it. - No body, no crime. - I'll take. - Hey, Bob Marley, see, he comes up all the time, holy shit. - Yeah, no body, no crime. - So they talked to his old friend, they talked to his bald boss, the former governor, they talked to his golfing buddies, is everybody that you can imagine here, and they can't find anything here. Secretary Susan Luth said she knew of the fae he affair, and Debbie McIntyre said she didn't know until he told her. So they said, no, no, no, he's not gonna go to them, he's not gonna go to the women in his life, because he doesn't tell them enough, he doesn't want to be beholden to them, he wants to control them, he would go to his family, his brothers, that's where he'd go, Guinea's go to their family, that's what they said. So Jerry, who was a landscaper who made his living off the family construction company, they wanna talk to him, he's a big game hunter with a big gun collection at home, and a fishing boat. So they're like, he'd be the guy that could help, he's also got two kids, so he's got a lot to lose, so he's a guy they can put the fucking screws to. So they end up pulling into his driveway 830 at night with 25 federal agents and swarm his house. - Oh shit. - To let him know it was serious and scare the shit out of him, they had search warrants and all that kind of thing, all this shit. They seized his arsenal of hunting rifles, shotguns, revolvers, that were left in an unlocked closet in the bedroom of his three-year-old son, by the way. - He doesn't care about those kids. - Very nice, he's like, maybe one will shoot the other. That's ridiculous, 'cause when the kid was a baby, they're like, well, we can keep him in there, he's an infant, he's not gonna get the guns, but now he's three, so put the guns in a safe. In his truck, they found about two grams of cocaine as well. So they're like, oh good, now we even have a charge on him, this is terrific. - Your parties. - Yep, his friend was there, he had some weed as well, and in the laundry room, more coke. - Uh-oh. - So he likes to party, here. - This isn't powdered tide. - Yep, so they didn't arrest him or file charges at the time, 'cause it wasn't on his person and they were like, it was plausible, plus they're trying to scare him. They did come back a week later, though, with a state child welfare agency worker to investigate whether Gerard and his wife Michelle were fit to raise their two children in a house full of loose guns and cocaine. - Yeah, wildly loose guns. - This is, yeah, it's like Pablo Escobar's house over here. This is insane. - If this house was on the water, these guns would be rattling all over the place. - Oh, everywhere, just all over the place. Yeah, if you had them all in a car going on a bumpy road, they're like, wow, there's a lot of guns in here. - They'd be bouncing. - So November 2nd, 1997, Jerry would tell the cops that, yes, he and Tom left Wilmington early Friday morning on June 28th, 1996, in Tom's Jeep. And this is his brother, he brought his lawyer in and everything, so his lawyer said, you better fucking talk to them, 'cause you're in deep shit, otherwise. - This thing goes-- - They're just gonna put it on you then, it's your boat. So he walked into the US Attorney's office and tells the story and he told them that it was locked and loaded with a lock. The cooler was, the five foot long cooler, they took it out, they dumped it, it wouldn't fucking sink, so he told that whole story and I'm sure they got a good laugh out of that when fucking idiot he was. So he said that all he knew is it contained the body of someone who tried to hurt his big brother, so that's all he knew, that's it. So they said, okay, if you tell us everything, they're gonna plea bargain him for a lesser charge than accessory after the fact of murder. And so he also tells how he helped his brother dispose of a blood-stained, rotten sofa at the Family Construction Firm. Uh-oh, how Tom gave him a cover story if anyone started asking questions and how he had one other thing to add also. He told his older brother Lou the whole story a year ago, so he can go fuck with him too. - Oh, damn it. - Lou is the dumpster and deer there. So November 10th, 97, Lou comes in and talks too. - I wanna get back to my golf lady. - He said he begged his brother to turn himself in, but he knew nothing about Anne-Marie or that he even had a relationship with her. He, his lawyer later announced that he would plead guilty to harassing a grand jury witness, which is a misdemeanor. So, they, he, Tom's living with his mom at this point, and he wakes up in her house and yeah. - Oh God, it's all gone downhill already anyway. - Oh yeah, he's fucked. I mean, they tore up his whole backyard, his house is a crime scene. So, the, his lawyer was trying to arrange some kind of, you know, all hand them in if you wanna arrest him or whatever, but they said, oh no, they just pulled him over on the I-95 on the way to the airport with his brother Joseph and his brother's wife. - Where are you going? - Where are you going chief? Hey, what you got there? What you got in that suitcase? - Yeah. - Whoa, so they arrest him then for that 'cause they're like, oh, we gotta get him, he's fucking taken off. Outside the lawyer, his lawyer says that Jerry, his brother Jerry made up the whole story and that Tom's pleading not guilty. Yeah, he said that Tom, who's now facing a potential death penalty here, just doesn't understand his brother's betrayal. He said, quote, how could he do this to me? Look at he lie. - Okay. - Now, two days after he was arrested, the fisherman who fucking fished out that cooler said, oh shit, that's right. - This might be this. - That's not good. - Yeah. - With a bullet hole on the side, fuck. How many giant coolers with bullet holes are floating around the ocean? Not as many as you'd imagine. We should turn this in so they turn it over to the FBI. - Yeah. - As well. So the fisherman's name is Ken Chubb. And he realized it's the one, yeah. Now, Debra McIntyre, old Debbie Mack here. - Oh boy, yeah. - They've been talking to her. Oh, she's a horny one. They've been talking to her for a while and she's been denying everything. She ends up cutting an immunity deal for herself all of a sudden. - Why? What does she know? - All of a sudden, she's like, hey, I need an immunity deal. - Did he come tell her everything? - Well, not quite, but she now says that she bought a 22 caliber Beretta pistol on May 13th, 96 and tells them that she gave it to Tom, who now she's telling the cops that, who accompanied her to Miller's gun center on US 13 near Newcastle and waited outside in his jeep. So that's not good. Now she told the prosecutors that and that's bad. So during the case here, his defense is trying to lay the groundwork right away, like in the public. They want the public to think he's a poor innocent man here. So his lawyer is saying that, listen, jurors like to play detective, he says. He says, circumstantial evidence can be more devastating than eyewitness testimony because jurors like to play detective. They like to kind of-- - Speculation. - Strapelate their own thing on there. So yeah, a little speculation. There's that, her blood is in his house. He's the last person to be seen with her. This is the defense attorney saying he's innocent. He's like, listen, his brother's saying he helped him dump a body. There's blood in his house. You know, also the other brothers talking about dumping fucking dumpsters and shit like that. You know, this could be bad in a train. - Some sort of fish, we get it. - Yeah, we get it. He said, quote, if the brother testifies that he did certain things that the jury can view in any way as being a cover up for homicide, even if he doesn't know for a fact that he killed Anne-Marie, that's deadly evidence. The jury will take that and run with it. Gee, if she disappears on one day and that guy's the last person to be seen with them and then a day later he's dumping a body in the ocean, they might put those two things together. I would fucking hope they would. - That's a fucking wall shot, James. - Yeah, they're not gonna, they're acting like, now we're fucked, this isn't fair legal stuff. It's no, this is how the cases work, idiot. So they said without a body turning up, it's difficult, but not impossible, this is the prosecutor. Nobody, no crime, no problem, is what they say. Another, this is Robert Fahey again. He said, I think you have a guy who grew up in a very privileged environment and got everything he wanted all his life and he couldn't have her. I think he probably hit her across the face, knocked her half out, kept beating her and killed her. Jesus. - I mean, I think it was-- - You don't even have a body. - Yeah, I think he didn't. He threw a gun into the ocean, I think he shot her. - I think he shot her, that's what I'm gonna think. And that'd be so much easier, too. - Yeah, but you, I think he had a really minor argument, dispute, and then just beat her to death. What? - Yeah, it seems-- - What kind of-- - I love him beyond. - You made the man sound way worse than what I think. - That's wild. - Beat her to death, Jesus. - Beat her to death, kept beating her and beating her. That's the brother I get what he's feeling, but Jesus Christ, don't, let's not speculate too much. - Yeah. - Anne-Marie's friend, Kim, said this is somebody who was not completely in control of his emotions. I don't think she ever thought he could do harm to her. I would hope not, otherwise, you wouldn't go. - Right, how would you spend any time with somebody? - Yeah, FBI Special Agent Eric Alpert wrote in the search warrant affidavit, quote, "I believe there is probable cause to believe that Thomas Capano took Anne-Marie Fehe without her consent from the Panorama restaurant in Philadelphia to his home at 2302 Grant Avenue in Wilmington, Delaware, and that he killed her at his residence." All right, one of Tom Capano's friends said, "I don't think people can go through 47 years of life caring for other people, and then, all of a sudden, turn on a dime and do something so utterly contrary to the principle they've had for so long." Susan Louth, his girlfriend, one of his real, girlfriend like 2B, we'll call her, I don't know, how do you rank them? She said, "Knowing Tom, there's no way he would have done something like that. He's one of the sweetest men I know." - Or she was just the hottest thing he could possibly get and he didn't wanna lose it. - Wow, his lawyer though, Tom's lawyer, Charles M. Oberle, the third, the former Attorney General of Delaware, said he's got the best one. You might as well not even have a trial, honestly, at this point. He said, quote, "He looked me in the eye and he told me he hadn't done anything." - Oh, well, let's all go home then. What are we talking about? - Thank you very much, everybody. That's been "Smalltown Murder." We'll see you next week. - Well, thank God he's been innocent. - Man, I was really worried about this. So the fates, though, are still having problems, obviously, they're really, they're having an issue. The brother Roberts really pissed off at Tom and he keeps coming back to the white trash comment because that became public. - Really? - He's real pissed. He said, "Tom made a comment to a friend that he was not concerned by all the publicity back then because once Labor Day rolled around, this would all go away." Then he said, "The fates are nothing but white trash." So there you go. He said, "So that's what he thinks," and blah, blah, blah. So they're trying to get through it, I guess. The brother Brian said, "We don't admire them for it for arresting him." They said, "Aren't you happy they arrested him?" He said, "We don't admire them for it. We wish they have done it a lot sooner." They could've saved everybody, including our own family, a lot of heartache. The sister, well, they need evidence first before they can arrest people. That's just how life is. I understand you want it immediately, but you know, you want them to be convicted, actually. - Sure. - That would help. 'Cause if they arrested him too early and didn't have enough evidence and he got let go and all that, then everybody be mad at that. So her sister said, "I'm still numb. I think we all had a theory of how Anne Marie was disposed, but once you hear the facts, it's gruesome to think your own sister had to that happen. It's just pretty disturbing. A weird way of putting it. - Had to have that happen. - I have to have that happen. So another thing here is Brian said, to find out that Anne Marie's murder may have been premeditated is pretty troubling. Talking about the gun and the cooler. He allegedly planned and carried this out in cold blood. So everybody's a little bit pissed off. They said that the Fehe family said they haven't discussed whether they'd like to see him face the death penalty, but the brothers at Robert said, "The harshest penalty brought we'd support." And they said, "We don't believe Tom Capano will walk." And they also said, "Hey, what if Jerry Capano, who helped dispose of this body, avoids prosecution due to cooperation?" And they said, "If that's the price of doing business, we'll be happy." In other words, we don't think he killed our sister. So that's fine, fuck him. We're concerned about this other assault. Now 1998 is the trial. So three, two years after the murder of the trial. In the openings, the prosecutor, Ferris W. Wharton. - Yeah. - Wow, that is some kind of name there. - I've never heard of anybody named Ferris other than Bure. - Well, he sounds like he's gonna replace Willy Wonka if he ever retires and it's gonna become the Ferris W. Wharton fucking chocolate factory at that point. Really weird. Now, the defense, they got a lot to explain here. - You're not kidding. - They got a lot of explaining to do here. So the lead attorney, Joseph S. Oteri, said that only one other person who was inside Capano's house that night knows what happened when she died. He's saying there's another person. There was three people there that night. - Really? - He said, "You're going to hear testimony that Tom did not murder her." She died as a result of an outrageous, horrible, tragic accident. Yeah. He asked the jurors not to be revolted by the sea burial. How are you not gonna be revolted by that? - Right. - Don't be revolted by the two dumbest people in the world doing a dumb, horrible, disgusting thing. - Horrible thing, yeah. - But instead, accept his explanation that he later deceived friends and authorities to protect himself. He said, "Tom lied to everyone except one person who knows the horrible truth." He said, "But nothing about just taking her out to the ocean and dumping her proves that he killed her." Nothing. That doesn't prove anything. 'Cause you dump people you find, you know, all the time. We hear that. You stumble across a body in the woods, you take it out to the ocean, you dump it. That's just how it works. - Nothing except dumping her proves he did it. Okay, I mean, yeah. - Wow. And he said, "The cooler wasn't a coffin. The cooler was intended as a gift for Jerry, for his boat, for fishing." - Yeah. - You know, that's how it goes. - Let me borrow your boat, I bought you a cooler. - Then he says this, I love when they try the defense of, he's a smart guy, there's no way he'd be that stupid. That's a terrible defense. And the lawyers use it all the time. He said, "If Tom Capano wanted to put Fehe in a cooler, he wouldn't have bought it at the Wilmington area store using his credit card." He said, "Tom Capano's a bright guy, that's insanity." - He's too smart for that. What are we thinking? - I don't know, Tom Capano didn't think that you'd understand that this was big enough to fit a body in it. - No, fucking shit. He also attacks Jerry, you know, Tom's brother, Debbie McIntyre, his mistress. The lawyer said that Jerry, the youngest of the brothers here, developed, he said that his family called him a booze hound with a brain like a fried egg from cocaine, marijuana, and LSD use. - Oh, yeah. - Brain like a fried egg, that's in the record forever. He said he's a typical screwed up rich kid who's never earned anything in his life. He's a poster boy for the me generation. - This is your brain hound drugs, Jerry. - If that was the me generation, what the fuck would this one be? 'Cause the me generation didn't make videos and take pictures of themselves every five fucking seconds. - This one is the me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me. - Generation. - Generation. So they also focused on Jerry's account saying that, you know, it's all bullshit, that he didn't plan this. This is crazy. What are you talking about? He said he actually only talked to Gerard about these two extortionists and that's what they'll tell you, but he said that whole thing was a figment of Jerry's imagination. - Oh? - That never even happened. They said Thomas borrowed $8,000 from Jerry one month. Jerry, the one who asked if someone was shaking him down 'cause he needed $8,000. Tom agreed to appease Jerry who fancied himself a gangster. He said he thought, Jerry thought of himself as a tough guy. So he said, yeah, yeah, yeah, that'll make him feel good if I tell him about extortionists. - Yeah. - He also said that Jerry suffers from confabulation. - Oh, there's no word again. - There it is, where he fills in gaps in his memory with fictitious events. - Yeah, he just makes it up. - Make shit up to make it funnier. - To make it work. - Make it work for him. Yeah, so Jerry here, because they're saying he had to, he was threatened with gun and drug charges. That's the only reason he, you know, he's testifying so he can get leniency on his disgusting ways. They also said that they described Tom as Fehe's confidant, a gentleman who helped her deal with anorexia, gave her money when she was broke, and took her out on friendly dinners almost every week until she died. Just a mentor, like a little sweet coach, pretty much. Yeah, we have no intention of besmirching Ann Marie Fehe, but she was not an 18-year-old kid just out of high school. That is true. He described her as a worldly woman who had traveled to Spain, worked in Washington, D.C., quote, that cesspool. Washington, D.C. - That's a shit. - For then Congressman Thomas R. Carper, then he said about Deborah McIntyre, she lied five times to investigators before striking an immunity deal. You can't trust her. He concluded his remarks by urging the jury to give his client the presumption of innocence, calling it one of the foundations of American democracy. He said, "Please, I beg of you. "Don't forget that." A lot of begging here. Fehe's family, her brother, said of the lawyer, quote, "He's in the gutter." The lawyer's in the gutter. Now witnesses here, they call Brian. They call a couple of female aides from the governor's office, and they call the waitress at Panorama, who served them dinner that night. - Talking about the sullen swordfish. - That's it, sullen swordfish. Now, Brian, a fifth grade teacher, that's her brother, described his sister as a neat freak, who despite emotional problems and an eating disorder, made great strides from her troubled childhood. He said he saw his sister with a new boyfriend, the MBNA corporation executive, Michael Scanlon, six days before she disappeared, and they were happy in holding hands. Now defense attorney asked Fehe if he recalled his sister having a bad temper. He said no, but then after being asked by Oteri, if he had heard stories about his sister, once hitting their father with a hockey stick. - And what does that prove? - That, well, they're trying to build a thing of this is what actually happened at night. - Maybe, yeah, maybe she whacked him with a hockey stick. - Yes, well, they're trying to say that the prosecution's saying she's this innocent, young, helpless girl, and in reality, she's worldly, and she went to Spain and worked for a guy in Washington for a year, and hit her drunken fucking Irish father with a hockey stick. So that means that she's perfectly fair to murder at that point. - She may have instigated it. She had a somber swordfish. She may have smacked him with it. You don't know. - You never know. - We weren't there. - We never know. We have no idea how it went down. We can't know. - So the brother also said he knew his sister ate lunch with Tom twice, but the rest of everybody in the family didn't know about the affair until after she disappeared. And was asked about it by the cops. The governor's secretary in 1996 testifies a couple of them, actually a secretary and the governor's office manager. Both said that Fehe was in an upbeat mood on June 27th, preparing for a Friday off where she was gonna get a massage, a pedicure, a manicure, and then read in the park. That was her plan for the next day. Under cross-examination, both said they were unaware Fehe and Tom were going to dinner that night, and that they didn't know whether that was why she seemed happy, maybe that's why. They also said, the waitress, the server said that they didn't, Capano and Fehe didn't speak throughout dinner, which she described as somber and quiet. - That is a weird dinner. - That's a weird dinner, and that Tom ordered her meal and drink without consulting her. Well, unless you were there the whole time, you don't know if she said, "I want the sword." We don't know that, that's crazy. So the waitress also said that she boxed up there in her entire main courses, which were barely touched. They just sat there in uncomfort until they, in discomfort, till they said, "Do you want us to wrap that?" - Staring at their food. - Staring at a 90% full piece of swordfish. - Right, pushing capers around your plate, disgusting. So the Fehe, they said, was dressed up in a flower print dress, and the waitress noticed this because most of the women in there wore more of the black and stuff like that. The server said she looked haggard, gaunt, her hair was unkempt, she looked tired. - What a thing to say about somebody. - Sounds like they sent her through the spin cycle once and got her out and sat her down at fucking dinner. That's bad. Tom, the lady said, was wearing tinted eyeglasses that were, "Not something I would have chosen for myself." This waitress is just a bitch. He's giving some really vicious visual reviews. - She looked like shit. Her dress was ugly in those tints. I mean, dude, seriously, like, "Fuck you. "You're a fucking server. "I've been a server, plenty. "You don't think you're at the top of the fucking food chain, "so I don't know who you think you are." - His tints, I'm down. - I'm down. - But, you know, get out, not for me. Now, under cross-examination here, the waitress had a little bit less to say. She said that of the two hours that they were in the restaurant, they were there for two hours, by the way. She observed them for only about 15 minutes out of two hours and could, you know, obviously, as she said, they could have spoken and anything could have happened when she wasn't watching, obviously. She also said she'd never seen them before and didn't know what their normal appearance was. Either to say-- - That may have just been what they look like all the time. - That's the thing. - But she did add her hair wasn't kept by any standards, is what she said, so no matter what, her hair was fucked up, so fucked up. - Maybe she had a long day. She lived 40 minutes from here. Maybe she drove here. - Maybe get her dude done. - With the window down. - I was just gonna say, maybe the window is down. It's a June night. - Right. - You drive with the window down sometimes, so they get Jerry to testify, the brother. - Uh-huh. - And, whoof, he has to tell about how he watched a foot sink into the sea. - Yikes. - That's not good, after a corpse was weighed down with anchors. Jerry said, quote, "I was telling him this isn't right. "This is wrong." That's what he testified. So, his brother, Lou, cries on the stand here. Breaks down on the stand. He's testifying for the prosecution. He began crying as he recalled two occasions in which he had tried to get his brother, Tom, to tell the authorities the truth for the sake of family. - Yeah. - The sake of family, Tom, but Christ's sake. - You're gonna ruin our construction business. - The sake of family. At the second meeting, he said both he and another brother, Jerry, told Tom to go to the police, or they would. Okay, now Lou did not go to the police then because he said, "Tom convinced us not to," and told us if the situation was reversed, he'd do the same for us, which, that's the thing. Hey, I'd help you bury a fucking body, help me. This is your responsibility now. - What, you never fucked up before? Help me out here, with the help. So, a lawyer for Capano, one of the lawyers, attacked different versions of events that Louis gave to prosecutors, including lies he admitted telling to the grand jury before reaching a deal to testify. So, they're trying to put his pre-deal. - Yeah. - You know, I don't know anything lies to the test here. Lou said his brother, Tom, called him on June 30th and told him that Anne-Marie was missing. He said, "Tom told him that she would probably "return to work on Monday, "but that she tried to cut her wrists on his sofa "on the previous Thursday "and he wanted to get rid of the sofa." - Oh, okay, so she was suicidal in that room. - That's what he's saying, yeah. They say that's where the blood came from. - But the house cleaner said two days before it was fine. - Five days before it was fine. - Five days, okay. - The Thursday of the actual murder he's saying that she tried to cut his wrists on his couch. - Yeah, so Lou said that Tom also told him that the cuts were superficial and that after bandaging them, Tom had taken her home and never seen her again. So, Debbie McIntyre comes up on the stand and they get right into all their weird sex stuff. They're like, "You'd do anything for Tom, wouldn't you?" - I need your sex life in public records, so... - They said, "Even perform oral sex "on one of his friends while he watches." - Oh, God, shit, what'd she say? - Yes, yeah, I did that, yeah, shit that happened. Yeah, that's rough. She said that, yeah, Delaware's his friend and Delaware's chief deputy attorney general, Keith Brady, - Oh, God. - Admitted they had a sexual encounter in her house while Tom sat naked in the living room watching. - He's a cock. - He's a cock, he likes that. - Holy shit. - His friend, the chief deputy attorney general of Delaware, plow his girlfriend. - What the fuck? - Holy shit. - Put it on public record, this is forever our information. - If we're putting it out, this will be out there for the rest of eternity. So, even if you don't find the court document, this is here. - This is a 70-year-old woman today. - This, yeah, she's like, "Yeah, I sucked him. "Molly gave it to me from the back. "What do you want from me?" Well, she takes Jericho. - Oh, shit. - Well, she reads Modern Maturity Magazine. - Oh, shit, it's written in readers digest and taking a poop. - I've traded in my threesome days for my fucking, for that yogurt that makes Jamie Lee Curtis poop. That's what I have. Now, get out of here. - I mean, like, Jimmy. There's a nice article in the digest. - Ah, shit. - Just poorly. - Both McIntyre and Brady said it did take place about five years ago, but it was all Tom's idea. - Yeah, we were held at gunpoint. - To fuck each other. You two fuck each other now. - Well, he said to do it, shit. - Suck his dick. Enjoy that dick to enjoy your blowjob. That's right. It's his idea. - He's very bossy. That's how it goes. She said she didn't want to perform oral sex on Brady, but she did it because of Tom. She said, quote, he wanted me to. I was afraid if I didn't do it, he would get angry and leave me. This poor woman has very insecure, holy shit. - He's not even with you. - During all this, she kept looking at him and smiling too. Like, I love him smiling. He's a great guy. Wow, and 10 years ago, she had sex with another man, so Tom could watch through a window of her house. - Jeez. - That's even weirder than being in the living room. I'm gonna pretend I'm a peeping Tom now. - Right. - What the fuck is that? She said, I loved him. He cared for me, listened to me, enjoyed my company, and made me feel good about myself. I did what he wanted, oftentimes compromising what was best for me. Now, as Kipano was led away from the courthouse after that day's testimony, he turned to a TV camera and they asked him about, what do you think about Debbie McIntyre's testimony and said, quote, she broke my heart. (laughing) - She told everybody. - You broke my heart, Fredo, and then they go out in a boat and shoot Fredo. It's all too fucking intertwined. - It's too much, man. - It's too much. You can't say it. That is fucking wild. And as the first time he said anything to the press, by the way, she broke my heart. Prosecutors are painting him as a master manipulator, control freak, plays on the weak and insecure, obviously. A former administrator at a school in Wilmington testified that she brought that to McIntyre, brought a gun and gave it to him in May a month before. She said she never saw the gun again, and she said that she bought the gun because she was afraid Tom would leave her if she didn't. So anything that she does, it's not again, exactly what he wants, he'll leave her. Meanwhile, they've been together for 15 years. - Right, where's he going? - Where's he going? I think he's kind of locked in here. She said she only did that because of that, and even though she knew it was illegal to buy a gun in her name and then give it to somebody else. As a matter of fact, she actually went to one place, and during the purchase of the gun told the guy, I'm just buying it for somebody else, and they refused to sell it to her. - You can't do it. - So she had to go to another gun store and buy it and say, "You know, it's for me." - Let's say it, yeah. - Let's not say it, yeah, she fucked up. So Keith Brady, the blowjob guy, he's, by the way, the number two person in charge of Delaware's criminal prosecutions at the time. - And that's the guy you're getting blowjobs for. - Yeah, he said, "How did this day start?" You might wonder, "How does the day start "when you take a friend home "and have your girlfriend blow 'em?" Well, it starts by playing golf together. - Okay, yeah. - They played golf, and they've been friends since 1990 when Capano was head legal counsel for the governor, and Brady was his assistant. So they used to work together, he used to be his boss, Tom. So they said after the game, Brady says, they went to Debbie McIntyre's house and had some drinks, and then McIntyre and Tom started graphically talking about sex in front of him. This was a planned thing they have. - That's what they like. - Yeah, I'm gonna bring this guy here later and we're gonna get, this is a whole plan if they just started talking about sex. McIntyre said, "Tom left Brady "and went into the living room. "Mac and Tyre and Tom left Brady "and went into the living room "to have sex and watch porn movies." - Well, he's in the house. - Well, he's in the house. - I'm gonna go in the living room and fuck with porn on. - By the way, the reporter describes Brady on the stand, quote, "Brady spoke in a monotone, "but he stuttered and squirmed in his share "as he detailed the sex-capade." Yeah, he holds public office. It's like, fuck. - Ah, ah. - So. - Here's another line from an article, "During a brutal cross-examination "by defense-layer Joseph Oteri, "Brady said when he followed the twosome into the room, "Mac and Tyre stopped what she was doing with Capano "and turned her attentions to him. "If you not only heard porn playing "with then people fucking, you don't walk into that room "unless you wanna see people fucking and maybe join them." - I wonder if I fucking there. - Yeah, you stay in the living room and turn the TV up to like 55, that's what you do. I don't wanna hear this. - Or you put your shoes on and get the fuck out. - Yeah, now this cannot get more embarrassing for Brady, get it? - Not much more, no. - Well, let's put the cherry on top. She turns her attentions toward him and he says on the stand, quote, "Debra Mac and Tyre attempted to arouse me "by performing oral sex on me, "but I could not achieve an erection." - No! - So this cannot get worse for him. The only thing it would get worse is that I finally didn't, I came in four seconds. It would be the only way this could get more embarrassing. - What the fuck? - And that's him trying to save his marriage, right? Saying like-- - I have no idea. I only have eyes for one woman and they're my wife. - All right, golf makes his dick limp, I don't know. Either way. They asked him, "Were you fully clothed?" And he said, "This is great." My recollection is unclear. What are you in the mafia? - My zipper was down, my penis was out of my zipper. - Then he said, "I may not have been." - No, you were not. - You came in, he's acting like he wandered in there, like, "Hey guys, what you doing?" And then she just grabbed, unzipped him and started sucking on him. Meanwhile, they're like, "You went in there "with your pants off, didn't you?" 'Cause you all planned this. You know what I mean? - Yeah. - He insisted he didn't wanna be there and wasn't turned on by any of this. - Yeah. - He said, "I'm ashamed I was there. "I'm extremely remorseful for the anguish "I've caused my wife, my children, and my parents." - Wow, I mean, more shame than I'm here. - Oh, and then the article goes on to say, "Brady didn't meet anyone's eyes "as he quickly strode out of the courtroom "with his back straight and his dick limp, absolutely." - The only thing straight on him was his back. - Back stiff and dick limp. (both laughing) It's at that point when his boss, the Delaware Attorney General, Jane Brady, with whom he's not related, by the way, just happens to be a coincidence, said in the statement, "That Keith's taken an undetermined amount of time off." - Yeah, in that way. - So next day, Keith is taking some time off to be with his family at this most difficult time. That is and should be his first priority. Our thoughts are with him and his family. I will discuss any matters related to the office with him after he's satisfied. Don't use the word satisfied. - Yeah, I don't think that's ever happening. - No, after he gets his stuff straightened out. She might as well say that, too. Does really make it bad. Satisfied, he has done what he needs to do. He addresses personal life. Yeah, once he gets an affairs and honor, straightens out his life and is satisfied with everything. God damn it. So now it's the defense's turn. What could your fucking defense be? Your brother said he watched a foot go into the fucking water that you brought there. It's not good. - And you've just ruined a man's career. - You move, to stride her, embarrass the school administrator later. It's all a mess, man. So the defense, their thing is, Debbie did it. - Debbie killed himself. - That's what happened. - No, Debbie killed Henry. - Debbie killed Henry, right. - Okay. - Okay. - Yeah, she's jealous, yeah. - Yep, McIntyre, when they asked her on the stand, denied her role in it when asked by the defense there. But then when it's the defense's turn, they said, "You deny you discharge that firearm," meaning the one that she gave to him. She said, "I don't know what happened to that firearm. "I'm absolutely certain about that. "I'm certain I don't know." So the defense said that one other person was in the resident that was home that night and knows the whole story. - And it's her. - Oh. - So, yep, they said, "So you admitted you had lied "in front of a grand jury. "You did all this stuff. "You gave him a gun that God knows where that is. "That's what you claim. "You bought the gun that's possibly the murder weapon "and, quote, and now you're scot free, huh?" And she said, "I'm fortunate." (laughing) I sucked a lot of dick to be in this chair. So, listen, I don't know if Scott Free is really the words I'd use, but- - I don't know if I'd be using that word either because I had to suck dicks to be here. - Yeah, I had to suck a lot of dicks. - In front of people. - No, yeah. They said they say that she didn't tell investigators about the sports authority visit until March, a month after she became a prosecution witness and says she told the prosecutors the truth. They said, "Well, why didn't you tell them about the gun?" She said, "I wasn't asked," which is really- - That's on you, me. - That sounds pretty bad to say that. Many things evolved in this case. I was very nervous. I answered the questions that were asked. I was not thinking about the sports authority. I was thinking about Miller's gun shop. Oh, because that was sports authority was where she was rejected. - Okay, yeah. Wow, he goes there a lot. He's a hell of a shopper at Sports Authority. - He loves it. Oh, yeah, coolers and guns, they got it all. - He's fine at all. - She did say that she suppressed many of the details about the case until this year. Didn't lie, suppressed. - I just didn't want to talk about it. I didn't want to remember holding it down a little bit. The lawyer said, "You're not trying to make the story better "by embellishing it." And she said, "No, that's an incorrect statement "on your part." - Oh. - She's a snotty one. So, (laughs) McIntyre insisted that it wasn't until January she realized the gun she bought could be linked to the death, even though she says Tom asked her to lie about it. She said, "I was so focused on telling the story for Tom, "I never thought of the ramifications of a murder weapon. "You never thought of that." - What the fuck? - Get the fuck out of here. They also grilled her about letters she wrote to Tom in prison earlier this year before she came a witness, before that all happened. On February 1st, as Tom was asking her to testify at his bail hearing, she wrote that she didn't want to. She said, "By going, it exposes me in our relationship "and who knows what else?" She wanted to keep shit private. She had no idea how not private all the shit was going to be. - This is gonna be so public. - Two comedians are gonna be laughing at your blowjob soon, that sucks. - I wish you didn't even think about this ever being on court documents while she was balls deep. (laughs) - No, never. Who thinks about that? Never, ever, you can't. So they said, yeah, it exposes our relationship and who knows what else. They asked her, "What did you mean by what else?" Asking if that could be the gun because prosecutors already knew about her lies and she said, "Nothing specific." So-- - It's Brady's dick. - Yeah, none of that's no dicks and balls and limp cocks in her face. He asked her about her actions on the day that Anne-Marie died implying they showed guilt. That included a 645 AM phone call to Tom's house. How would she know to call his house? - Yeah. - It's a 645 AM. A conversation with him at Tower Hills, Tower Hills Schools track about an hour later and a one minute phone call he made to her at 1031 AM from Stone Harbor, New Jersey as he prepared to dump the body with his brother that morning. - Oh. - McIntyre said she made the 645 phone call because Tom asked her for unspecified help that morning. - Uh-huh. - She said that Tom routinely called her at mid morning for a short chat and that she did not know about Anne-Marie, her death or where he was. They suggested that the phone call was to tell her everything was going fine with what he was doing and she said no. Then she admitted she was extremely upset when she learned about Fehe, but, you know, she said she didn't know about it till later and they said you knew about it the night she died, didn't you? And she said no, Mr. Moore. I never learned about Anne-Marie Fehe until July 2nd. - Okay. - And they said didn't you have your firearm at Tom Capano's house on June 28th, 1996 when you first learned about him and Anne-Marie and she said no, I did not. And they said you deny you discharge that firearm. She said I deny that I discharge that firearm. - Uh-huh. - He pressed her and pressed her about why didn't she tell investigators until the summer that Tom yelled at her for leaving a message on his voicemail at 1030 PM on June 27. And they said, quote, is that one of these visions that came to you? And she said that is correct. So now, if she didn't want to be embarrassed was the whole point. So now her entire sex life and the fact that she believes in her visions is all out there in public. She, he also asked her why she waited until after she became a witness to tell police that he told her late night he needed help in the morning and they said another vision that came to you from nowhere, huh? And she said correct. - Yep, you got it. This is, you're not embarrassed at all. Right at that point, Tom, who has colitis, asked for a recess to use the bathroom. - Good day, Maria. - He was in there for an hour. - Yeah, that's all right. - He was shitting for an hour. - Oh, god damn it. - This is maybe the worst day of a human's life other than being murdered, I would say. - His colitis diagnosis is now public record. - Yeah, he's a cookie colitis asshole. A cookie colitis cooke is where he is. So, an hour late, a cookie colitis cooke, that's a good title for him. An hour later, he comes back in, they said, quote, "With a pained and ashen look on his face." - Yeah. - Yeah, as he sat down at the table, his lawyer went in here back into the Debbie McIntyre cross-examination about a letter she had written explaining why she wasn't testifying at the bail hearing. And reading from the letter, McIntyre said, "I had to back out to avoid getting in a terrible position." Jesus Christ, all the sexual innuendo. So, the lawyer for McIntyre said that his client was prepared, quote, "It was certainly expected "and her testimony speaks for itself." That's her lawyer, said that. Now, prison psychiatrist testifies about Capano, who she treated in prison. And she said she knew, Capano, whom she treated in prison, and Feihy, whom she only knew through what she called a psychological autopsy, the reading of her writings. He can't diagnose someone, you know, treat. - It's a psychological eye, I can't do that. - That's weird. She characterized, yeah, she can give fun speculation on shit like that, but that's about it. She characterized their relationship as warm and nurturing the exact opposite of the prosecutor's picture of Tom as a manipulator. This psychiatrist also said, she's a neuropsychiatrist, also testified that the brother Jerry might suffer from drug-induced dementia, and that Jerry, a long time drug user, testified that he helped his brother dispose of the body. She said that she never examined him, Jerry, of course. - Only to diagnose it from sitting here. - You know, but said that his testimony indicates he has long and short-term memory loss and a tendency to confabulate as well. She also spoke of what she called Capano's deteriorating physical and mental condition since he was arrested and imprisoned. He's now on multiple antidepressants, having a hard time sleeping. Oh, poor guy, he's in a cot with prison. Yeah, that's what prison is. And coping with the near isolation of his confinement. And she said she was considering having him sent to a psychiatric hospital. That's right. They said Capano was fighting with his attorneys over the fact that he continued to write Debbie McIntyre, who eventually agreed to testify against him. They're like, she's gonna testify against you, stop writing to her, and he kept doing it. He was beside himself over the prospect of seeing her in court and said he couldn't stand it if she wanted nothing more to do with him. She said it was compulsion. He could not let go of that relationship. He felt very emotionally tied to her. - Right. - Okay, Tom testifies. - Attaboy. - He has to, he has to. He has no choice. - This is awesome. - He said that Ann Marie was dead lying on the floor in his house with a bullet in his winter head. And it was Debbie who shot her in a jealous rage. - Oh, really? - Covering for Debbie the whole time. Yep. He says that Debbie was threatening suicide with a gun. She had a gun up and was threatening suicide when he reached for her gun. And at that point, a shot was fired and it went into her head from across her. - It was an accident. - Total, just what the lawyer said, a crazy, horrible accident. That's what she says. They said, "Well, did you call the paramedics or police?" And he said, "No, I couldn't do it." You know, he said, "I'd have to get rid of the body 'cause otherwise this is gonna be terrible for everyone involved on the governor's attorney and blah, blah, blah, the former." Listen to that, my family and... - She's an administrator. - He said, "Also, I was protecting my lover." - Yeah. - Debbie McIntyre, who I've been with for 15 years. - He is literally trying to get away with murder and maintain the sexual relationship. (laughing) - While blaming her, he wants to blame her for murder and still fuck her. That's what he's hoping to pull out of this. - That's good sex, man. - Wow, this guy, oof. Yikes. He said, "I was going to attempt to keep this hidden and I was going to bury the cooler with Ann Marie in it." So he said, "To selfishly protect myself and to unselfishly protect Debbie." Just goes with the goodness of my heart. He said he wrapped her body in a blanket, put her in a large cooler from his basement. Later, he said that Debbie returned to his home and helped him roll up the blood-stained rug and take the cooler to the garage. Then early the next day, he said he drove to his brother Gerard's home, asking for the keys to the boat. He said his brother refused, knowing that Tom didn't know how to do anything with boats. He said, "He asked me if I was in trouble and I said yes, but I'll handle it." But Jerry still wouldn't give him the keys and insisted on helping because he said, "I'll drive the boat." So obviously a way different story than his brother told or that she told or anything like that. So Tom said that he and Jerry took the cooler to New Jersey, Stone Harbor, New Jersey, put it on the boat. They motored out to sea for hours before throwing the cooler overboard. They thought it would sink. It didn't. He said, "That's when Jerry shot it." But even after Jerry shot it, it still wouldn't sink. - Yeah. - So that's when Jerry gave his brother the anchors to weigh down the body and then went to another part of the boat. He said on the drive back, they discussed alibis saying he had only gone to Stone Harbor that day to discuss business. So yeah, he also testified as Debbie had dropped the 22 caliber Beretta pistol on the floor of his home after the shooting. But then late now in his testimony, he says Debbie either gave him the gun or took it away, but he doesn't remember. So yeah, he said that he needed Debbie to help carry the cooler, holding the body down a flight of stairs because he couldn't handle the load by himself. But later on in the testimony, he said before Jerry agreed to help with the sea burial, he planned to load the cooler into his car and later into the boat by himself. - Oh. - And also, he only borrowed $8,000 from his brother Jerry in February because he had withdrawn $8,000 and $9,000 days earlier and thought the teller might be suspicious. But they ended up producing cancel checks showing Tom got money from Jerry before the second withdrawal and Tom said he used $25,000 in a failed attempt to shock Fehe into entering treatment for eggs anorexia. Trying to give her money to go to treatment. He ended his direct testimony there by answering the question, "Did you murder Ann Marie Fehe?" And he said, "No, a thousand times no. "I loved Ann Marie Fehe." - Okay. - Yeah. On Cross, they weren't that nice. Now, first of all, for Cross, he's got a thick stubble on his face because the prison ran out of razors. So he could shave. - Oh shit. - How about give them to the people who have court that day first? And then everybody else gets them after that. Yeah, because that doesn't look good for Jerry, honestly. That's something you could bring up in an appeal even. They made me look like a fucking, like a swarthy asshole. - Like a lunatic. - Especially, they made me look like a typical shadow. - Right, right. - Fucking, you know. - There's a half beard on my face. - There's a way to have a. - Right, there's a way to have a classy stubble where you look good. The neck beard does not look good. - That wasn't good for him. So, yeah, they asked him since June 28th, 1996, how many crimes have you committed? - Oh God. - He didn't know what to reply. So they asked him how many lies he told to cover up the disappearance. He said he didn't know and agreed there were too many to count. So, they also bring up a gun. Okay, they bring up a case that he, they said you got the idea to throw Fehe's body into the ocean and dispose of the gun from Robert Squeaky Sanders. Sanders and accomplices dumped Joseph Spoon Johnson in a creek near Delaware city, but floodgates kept the corpse from reaching the river. Johnson was shot behind the ear, just as Tom claims Fehe was accidentally shot by the gun. The gun that killed Johnson in that louder case was taken apart, disposed of in pieces and never found. Tom testified he put the gun in a cooler with the body and then dumped it in the ocean. They said this case has striking similarities to that case. He denied the, he said no, there's no connection, but then the guy said, didn't you make the closing arguments in that case? - Oh no. - 'Cause the time said I'm unfamiliar with that case and he said, actually you made the closing arguments in that case and showed him the transcript. (laughing) - So they read excerpts from the transcript and Capano said he couldn't recall what he had said a day ago, never mind 22 years ago, I don't fucking know what he said. - Oh Jesus. - Wow, that is wild. That is fucking interesting. So they said also, Capano was agitated when Connolly talked about a phone call Tom made to the Secretary of Chief Deputy Attorney General, Keith Brady at 8 a.m. the morning following the death. he's real close with that guy. Tom left a message for Brady checking his availability for drinks that night. He's on his way to dump a body. Hey, what are we doing tonight? Wow. Do you want to come over and meet me over at fucking McIntyre's house? What do you think? Yeah. She come on to Debbie's. The prosecutor said this is less than 10 hours after the death of Anne Rifei, whom you deeply loved. So you say he said, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Seven knows. Tom said, I will play your games, but not this one. I did deeply love Anne Rifei. You didn't even know her. Okay, killer either. Yeah. So you definitely fuck Debbie the next night. That's what they keep saying. And you called Brady to have drinks that night while you're just Wow. Incredibly callous here. He said that she just burst in Debbie burst into the room 11 p.m. June 27th. And just fucking burst into the great room of his house where they were him and Anne Marie were watching television. At first they were startled. He said, but Anne Marie stayed seated. They said she didn't jump up or flee or anything like that. Instead, she just put on her pantyhose, which she had removed earlier and her shoes. And they said, Anne Marie's not frightened. And he said, no, you don't know Anne Marie. The gun wasn't pointed at her anyway. A crazy lady burst in waving a gun around everybody's uncomfortable. She's not just like, Oh, that's cool. And starts eating Doritos. So it's putting on her fucking legs. Nobody's doing that. Oh my God. And he also says, you're asking me about something that happened so long ago and that I've tried not to think about you better fucking think about it. You've tried you've somehow suppressed one of the fucking craziest nights you've ever had. It's crazy. They go over a lot of stuff with the money and all that stuff. And it's a lot. So the verdict comes in, you've heard it from everybody. Yeah, verdict is, what do you think here, Jimmy? There's no fucking way he's found innocent. There's no way guilty of first three murder for for Mr. Tom. Now the sentencing, yeah, he can get the death penalty for this or life in prison. Yeah. So the sentence of death is recommended by a by a 10 to two vote of the jury here. Oh, but under Delaware state law, the jury's recommendation can carry weight, but the decision is on the judge at the end of the day. His other option is life without parole. The judge said this. This is a good use, sir, may fuck off. The defendant fully expected to get away with murder and were it not for his own arrogance and controlling nature? Well, may may well have succeeded. He said he's a malignant force, an angry sinister controlling malignant force, which dominated this courtroom for months. He then picked apart his demeanor. He said he criticized him for attempting to use his family as a shield against prosecution, belittled him for his constant attempts to ship blame to others, mocked him for the way he would rant and raged about prosecutorial tactics, chided him for berating and bullying his own defense attorneys, whose advice and counsel he continually ignored. He said no one except the defendant will ever know exactly how or why Henry Feighy died. By all accounts, she had ceased to be the defendant's lover, but had never escaped his sphere of his sphere of influence control and manipulation. The defendant has no one to blame for the circumstances he finds himself in today, except himself. Then then called him a ruthless murderer and said his only remorse is for himself. You saw may fuck off death penalty. Holy eat all the dicks. Nobody death penalty death penalty. The family's happy. The they said the sentence is not something that should be celebrated because it's not going to bring the sister back. So they're just happy he's not going to be able to do it to anyone else. They're very reasonable as family. They're not like, hang him in the public square. They're like in jail forever or death. Just long as you can't hurt anybody. That's fine. I'm not going to bring my sister back, which is the correct way. 2001. So 99 was the case was the trial. 2001, a movie comes out TV mini series starring Mark Harmon and Olivia Dukakis really? Mark Harmon plays Tom. Who do Olivia play? I don't want to know ladies. Maybe his wife possibly. I hope she played McIntyre. She might have played his mom. Oh, you're probably right. Yeah. Yeah, probably his mom. I want her to live in Chicago just to be a dirty fucking I want I want the scene where Mark Harmon waxed it while somebody blows his friend. That's the scene I want to see that is blows another guy. They cut that part out of summer school. You know what I mean? I didn't get to set. You don't see that on NCIS very rarely. Is that the one he's on? He's tugging while he's throwing a ball into the ocean for a dog. Oh shit. 2006 is an appeal. The Delaware court holds at the death penalty sentence based on a non unanimous finding violates the US Supreme Court ruling from 2002 and said a new death penalty sentencing hearing would be difficult. The prosecutor said because two key witnesses, his brothers extended so in exchange for plea agreements. And this time the prosecutors would have no leverage over the men. They wouldn't have to testify again. Okay. So they announced that they will not seek the death penalty for Tom. And instead he will be a life in prison without parole. At least there's that. Yep. The Fehe family said they supported the state's decision to seek that as well. They said when Anne Marie was murdered, we maintain that the most important thing for us was that her murder would be her murderer would be convicted and sent to prison. We are satisfying. We're a healthy attitude. 2011 at 1234 here PM on a day at the James T. Vaughn Correctional Center, Tom is found unresponsive in his cell and is found to be dead of natural causes at 61. And probably the full give the family the last word here, the Fehe family Tom Capano's death does not change the fact that Anne Marie was taken from us far too soon. Sadly, nothing will ever bring her back to the family and to those of us who knew her and deeply admired her. She was one of the loveliest kindest persons I've ever had the privilege of serving with. We miss her still and will never forget her. My thoughts and prayers are with her and her family during this difficult time. That is the office of the prosecutors there. So there you go. That is Wilmington, Delaware and one fucking hell of a weird case. That kind of he got the death penalty anyway because if they had given him the death they wouldn't have murdered him by now by now anyway. You know what I mean? Probably not. Either way died. He died. Same. We'll take it. I'm so young. Yeah. There you go. There's as much attention die in that way. That's so good for him. He's fucking dead. If you like the episode and are happy, he's dead. Tell us about it. Get on whatever app you're listening on. Give us five stars. It helps so much. Tell us what your favorite flavor of jelly is. Yeah. I'm your peanut butter jelly sandwich strawberry grape and tell us your preference barry. Your spouse's best friend that you want to sleep with. Do you would you rather they came in with no pants on or just dick hanging out the zipper? Which one? No. Follow us on social media. 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We've never released to the public and of course new ones every other week. One crime in sports. One small town murder. You get it all this week. Crime in sports in ring box or deaths. People beat in the death in front of an audience. That's horrible. That for small town murder. The guy they called the East Coast Charles Manson. Mel Lyman. Mel Lyman in his cult. It sounds like a fifties group. Mel Lyman and his crooners or something. But Mel Lyman cult will talk about and all the weird shit that went on there that is patreon.com slash crime in sports and you get a shout out of the show which is when right. Right now. Fucking now Jimmy hit me with those names like a limp dick in the face. Let's do it. This week's executive producers are Bobby evil Bobby. Borsich. Borsich. Wow. Evil Bobby. All right. Margaret Spuchupka. Spuchupa. They're kind of army names this week. Kyle Norweg. Pat McGrawing. Also I imagine their uncle and an aunt rub and tug. Yeah. Jillian Fryer. Maybe Gillian. It's Jillian right. It's got to be Jillian. I don't. More than likely but to get everyone out. Isaac Bechivitz singer. Dr. Reverend Alex Rieger. A private eye. Mel satem. Is it what is it? Alex Rieger is a judge on taxi. Right. Yeah. Liz Vasquez. Randy Ironwood. Happy birthday. Tiffany's husband drew. It's her mouth's favorite dick. Happy birth. Well then terrific. Last year I told her she could do better. This year I think she did. Rebecca Sorensen. Janice Hill. Martha Gilreath. Maybe it's Gilreath. Martha Gilreath is in the award. Yes. I think that I'm not sure. Maybe. Dotson's mom is. It might be a reference. Rau Rauvaric from Club Platinum. What's Club Platinum? What is that? That's something. That's a reference to something I think. Unless Rauvaric just loves their business and they want us to know it's got a bit. I assume. Gold Club. This one's something. Yeah. Kane Porter. Kenny. Maybe Kenny. No last name. Summer with no last name. Sage Marie. Gabrielle Proul. I think that's Ricky's kid. Emily Baca. He was great. That was awesome. He was a great player. Certainly went away so fast with zero. He's not a Hall of Fame. He's so fun though. So good. He was good. Yeah. Rams and teams. All right. Ashley Wyckoff. Scott Newton. Stephanie Crockett. Kelsey Gibson. Took a look. Tracy Daley. Maggie Stillman. Liz Cortese. Cortez. Me. All right. Chris Clayton. Tawny Martha. Peggy Shaw. Michael Ambrose. Or ambrosie. Ashley McLaughlin. Michael Garcia. Emily with no last name. Nicholas Krupa. Krupa. Sarah Nielsen. Brittany Green. Tyler Blevins. Silla. Silla York. Maybe Chilla York. Heidi Harlow. Jean. Bechtel. Rianna. Rianna Montgomery. Susan your Godi. You're a Godi. Corbin Smith. Steve Rowan. Lee Louise Smith. Jen. Hi. Sydney Johnson. Sydney Johnson. Hi. Sydney. All right. Amanda Johnson. Also Amanda. So there's Jen and Amanda Johnson. Gia D. Maria. Corinne with no last name. Mary Jo Bullock. Allie Cat. Steve with no last name. Lauren Brettamire. 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I'm Darcy Carden and I'm inviting you to listen to my new podcast, Wickeyhole, from Smart List Media. Discover the craziest rabbit holes on Wikipedia with me and my funny friends, as we bring the cyber frontier directly to your tympanic membrane. And if you listen to my podcast, you learn that that's the sciencey term for eardrum. We embark on a hyperlink rollercoaster as we start out on a Wikipedia page and go from link to link to link to link to link, careening through trivia, oddities and unexpected connections until we collectively shout, "How the hell did we get here?" Follow Wickeyhole on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Wickeyhole ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple podcasts. [BLANK_AUDIO]
