[MUSIC PLAYING] Welcome to In the Booth on Sportsnet 650 with myself Brendan Batchelor and Randy Janda. We call the Canucks games for you right here on the radio. And we come to you every week with this show/podcast. It is in the booth, and Randy, the Canucks have had a pretty good week coming off back-to-back wins against the Buffalo Sabres on Tuesday and the Montreal Canadiens on Thursday. And on Friday, they were back on the practice ice. There were a couple of notable storylines out of practice. And I'm going to let you take the lead on this, because you were the one actually at practice. I wasn't there. So what were the big storylines coming out of Friday practice for the Canucks as they get set to return to action on Saturday night against the Calgary Flames? Yeah, first and foremost, Batchelor was a nice Lindholm not at practice going through a maintenance day. And remember, this is something that shouldn't be too unexpected based on the fact that Lindholm is dealing with some potential, a little banged up, as Rick Talkett had said at the game day skate. So Lindholm was not there. Tae Blueger went up into that spot between Ilya McKayev and Sam Lafferty, but as Talkett mentioned in the availability after that, Lindholm's expected to play just given a bit of a rest in that spot, as he has been a player that has struggled offensively. But that line really started to get going here in the last two games. Yeah, and I'm sort of torn on how we should analyze this. We talked about this on the pre-game show before Thursday's game against the Canadians. And my take then was, if he's good enough to play, then that's not an excuse for his poor play and for some of the struggles he's been through. And look, I think he's been a lot better this week in particular. He started trending back in the right direction. That line he's been on with McKayev and Lafferty has played pretty well, generated some momentum. They had a good night in terms of production against the Canadians. But that said, do we take this into account at all when we're trying to analyze Elias Lindholm and what he's been for the Vancouver Canucks since coming over in the trade with Calgary at the All-Star break? Because he certainly hasn't met expectations, especially when it comes to offensive production. No, he hasn't. But one area that he has been rock solid is the defensive side of things, where playing that center position on a third line, I know that's not what a lot of folks originally thought he'd be. And even talking to Rick Talkett immediately after that trade happened in Toronto at the All-Star game. He was excited by the fact that Lindholm would provide a hybrid option. You can play alongside Elias Patterson, but he can also play down the middle. We haven't seen that wing aspect yet. We haven't seen that offensive production. But one area that he has been playing quite well is still down the middle. And he's that third-man high. He's responsible, playing with a couple aggressive forecheckers. We're starting to see some chemistry. Overall, though, that's an area that I look at and say, this is a player that is still working his way through probably some chemistry issues, potentially an injury here. And is able to still provide you some very, very good things. In the playoffs, you need him to ramp up his game? Sure. But you've got a little bit of time here to hopefully for him to get healthy. And that's the other thing I look at, even though the last little bit here, his face off percentage is through the roof. And I know the last game, it wasn't a good one for him, where he ended up going three for 10 and a rare night where he ends up taking a loss against Montreal in the face off circle and 13 draws, only winning three. But near 70% prior to that game. So there's room for improvement. But this is where days like Friday, where you're able to take a maintenance day, hopefully get a little bit healthier, and eventually build off some of that chemistry that him and McCabe and Lafferty are creating here. Yeah, and that is the luxury that Canucks have at this point in the season with where they are sitting. They could clinch a playoff spot officially as soon as Monday. They're really in the driver's seat in terms of the Pacific Division. I know people keep looking at the Oilers and the games in hand and everything like that. But if the Canucks take care of their business, if they play anywhere near close to the level of hockey that they've played for most of this season, it's going to be next to impossible for the Oilers to catch them. So that is the benefit you have at this time of the year, giving Elias Lindholb a practice off. Giving Ian Cole a game off if he's a little bit banged up and we'll get more into that decision and how things may carry forward with Ian Cole in a moment. But Lindholb, I think to a certain extent, fairly has come under a lot of criticism here. And anytime you give up the assets that the Canucks gave up to acquire a player like him, you're expecting bottom line production. And we get so focused on that, especially in season, you gave away all these assets, you're bringing in a guy, you want him to produce, you've seen him be a high point producer in the past. And I would be lying if I said that I wasn't surprised and maybe a little bit disappointed that Lindholb hasn't produced more offensively as a Canucks. But at the same time, the role that he is filling now, if he can play that role as well as we've seen him play it in the last couple of games in particular, as the third line center on a line that helps drive play further down the lineup. So it's not the top six, but it helps you continue to tilt the ice, which is really what the third line with Blueger, Joshua, and Garland did for much of this year. They helped continue momentum when the top six wasn't on the ice. If Lindholb can fill that sort of a role late in the season and heading into the playoffs, then yeah, you're not gonna get the bottom line production, you're not gonna get the goals, you may not get the assist either. But can you tilt the ice? Can you control play in a tight checking playoff series? Can the line that Lindholm anchors end up being a big difference maker for you? I think that's certainly possible on top of the fact that he can win you key draws and kill key penalties for you. So yes, would you like to see more production? Sure, would you like to see him fit in in a top six role and fill the net? Absolutely, but when it comes down to winning games at the most important time of the year, it wouldn't surprise me at all if we look back on this season and say the role that he filled, even if it didn't produce a ton of offense, might have actually been more important than if he just filled the net. Well, one area that this team, I think, has done an exceptional job is developing that third line when they've been healthy, when it was Blueger, Garland, and Joshua, now you have an additional player there who's high skill and traditionally has been able to put up points in this league. How can you really maximize that? And any really strong team in the playoffs, and dare I say cup contender has to have top three lines. Fourth line is a contributor in certain roles in certain moments, some big moments in the playoffs, but you have to have nine forwards that you can rely on, you can trust, and Elias Lindholm gives them another forward that potentially, if he can build some chemistry with whether it's a McCabe, whether it's a Lafferty, and I started looking at, you know, when Dakota Joshua comes back, you've got a player that's already developed some serious chemistry with Connor Garland, and of course Teddy Blueger, but if you've got Lindholm in a third line center role, and you've got two players that have so much chemistry, and more than anything, Teddy Blueger is a heck of a defensive player, he's a heck of a 200 foot player, but Lindholm can play that game, and he can give you a little bit more offense when he's right. That third line could be a difference maker, even more so in the playoffs, because you've got maybe a higher offensive end, and that allows Teddy Blueger to play a role where he's maybe 12, 13 minutes a game, potentially in the fourth line, he on the penalty kill, you know, it's a war of attrition in the playoffs, you want your specialty team guys to be fresh as well, because they play a certain style. So I look at that and say, whether, you know, when Joshua gets back, and Lindholm, if he gets healthy and he's ready to go, it does give you a line that could turn into something special, but the reality is, and the necessity is that you have to have three lines that are going, so on the first line, depending on how you label it, you've got Patterson and Hoaglander right now as a duo, you've got J.T. Miller and Brock Besser as a duo, and ideally you've got a trio that, you know, has some chemistry in the third line, and I think the duo there right now is Dakota Joshua and Connor Garland, when, you know, eventually in my opinion, I think bringing Connor Garland down to the third line is still gonna be a natural fit, but with Lindholm batch, you have options where you're saying, all right, can you really, can you push it in terms of offense, if he starts to get healthy, that third line's got a much higher ceiling in my opinion, even though they've been one of the best, if not the best third line in hockey. - Or how about this? And, you know, I'm not normally someone that wants to get into drawing up lines and speculating on how they might deploy things, but let's say that the McKayev Lindholm Lafferty line continues to play well, and I think they've had a couple of really good games, they produced a ton of offense in the Montreal game, you know, essentially contributing to both of Zadorov's goals. So let's say Joshua comes back and you put Blueger back between Joshua and Garland, you keep McKayev Lindholm and Lafferty together, you keep Souter Miller better together, you give Pod Colson, or maybe D. Giuseppe, a chance with Pedersen and Hoaglander, 'cause you talked about that duo, and suddenly you're not just talking about having three lines that could help you control play, if Lindholm, McKayev, and Lafferty can play consistently like they did on Thursday night, you're talking about maybe having four lines that can do that, and that's not something that we've really seen from this Canucks team this year, and again, everything would have to break for you perfectly, no more injuries, everybody comes back, the chemistry on all these lines continues to trend in the right direction, but even though you might call that a quote, unquote, fourth line on paper, being able to roll four lines and being confident that you can throw Lindholm and McKayev and Lafferty out over the boards, and they can help you control play and can potentially carve out a pretty good match up win for you down the lineup, might actually be more beneficial than giving Lindholm a chance with Joshua and Garland if you trust Podkolsen enough, or D. Giuseppe or Oman, whoever you wanna use, to move that mop into that spot on the Patterson line if you're gonna take Garland off it. - The player that I'd be looking at is Visily Podkolsen because through his cameo at this point in time, it looks like he might get an extended stay here as well based on the fact that he has played a certain style, it's been aggressive, it's been physical, where he's been throwing those hits, being aggressive on the forecheck, but also making really smart plays in the neutral zone, in the offensive zone where that Neil's Oman goal against Montreal, just a good play right off the face off to corral the puck, make that play on the puck, and sets up for Neil's Oman tip-in and a deflection, and I think a lot of this is gonna come down to Visily Podkolsen as the heat gets hotter, as Rick Tockett says, can he handle the pressure and the fact that he's been able to work on his game before practice, he's really zeroed in on the extra coaching and taking in information. It's a great step, but Batch, once you start playing those teams like a Vegas, you're gonna have other matchups for the Canucks here that are gonna be very playoff style. Are you making mistakes? Are you thriving in those situations? I think with Visily Podkolsen, we're gonna see real quick here of, is that ceiling for him in the top six? The one area that I look at with a Hoaglander, Peterson and Podkolsen line is, is that too much too soon? I think Hoaglander has taken his game up to the next level, but is he capable of making mistakes still puck management, why is he is? And there was one against Montreal that led to a transition attack that you still say, okay, I still would like a winger that's a little bit more defensively responsible with Elias Peterson on that line, just to add a little bit of balance, but I think with Visily Podkolsen, having a guy that can forecheck, having that, you know, that brawn on that line with some, you know, with brains as well, he's making smart plays, it intrigues you because my expectations were quite low for him when he was called up because it hadn't really known how much his game had developed and it's been a very, very pleasant surprise. So I like the sound of that, but Visily Podkolsen's gotta, he's gotta show that he can deal with the pressures of playoff hockey or near playoff hockey. Yeah, and the thing I think I was most impressed by with Podkolsen in particular, in the Montreal game was the physicality. He finished tied for the team lead with six hits on the night, the same as Noah Julesen. And if he can find a way to play that way consistently where you're right, he's making good decisions with the puck, he's, you know, got a better understanding of what he needs to do in terms of two-way play. He doesn't look like he's thinking too hard out there, he's making good reads holding onto the puck when he needs to. If he can pair all of those things with an aggressive forecheck and a physicality that he can bring with that, then that's an element that puts him above other guys that might fit in in the bottom six, like D. Giuseppe and like Oman and not to take anything away from those guys 'cause I think when Phil D. Giuseppe is on his game, it's a very similar conversation about what he does well and how he has success. He just hasn't been able to do it with consistency all year long. If Pod Colson can prove that he can be a consistent player in that regard and bring that kind of element on a nightly basis, whether they give him a try on a hypothetical Patterson line like I'm throwing out there or whether he stays in a similar spot in the lineup that he is right now, he's gonna be hard to take out of the lineup because that's something that they haven't really had in that depth role, especially with Dakota Joshua out of the lineup. - His play on the ice is one thing, but batch being in the room, being, you know, watching these guys as they, you know, kind of operate off the ice as well. He's comfortable in his skin this year. I think last year, it was kind of the new kid on the block. There is still a lot of deer and headlights on and off the ice to a certain extent. This year, he just looks like he's ready for the role. He's a part of that locker room and that goes a long way. The locker room is very different as well, where you've got a lot of veterans there. It certainly helps when you have an Ilya McCabe, you've got, you know, players like Teddy Blueger who can also speak Russian and Nikita Zadorov and just being around other players that now know you and they're welcoming you into the locker room. And even going back to last year, J.T. Miller was talking about how great of a shot Vasili Podkolsen has, but there's just so much more, you know, confidence in the way he carries himself on and off the ice. So it's a good step for him. Now, one thing that Rick talked, it does have his options, right? As long as his team is healthy, you can tinker with the units. You can tinker with the 12 forwards. You've got an extra forward, you know, really working their way to be in the lineup and forcing decisions to be made. So it's a good situation to be in, but you do have, you know, your star player and Ilya's Patterson really jiving with Niels Hoaglander right now. So as of right now, Connor Garland in that line is looking strong, but as we know, lineups get stale, right? So what's that next option? And Vasili Podkolsen very well could be one, but a part of that is also the Dakota Joshua conversation. When he gets healthy and that's a big win, you've got potential line options here for Rick Taco, which I'm sure he'll love to have Dakota Joshua back as he was one of the more consistent performers on this team. - And that's going to be a hard choice potentially for Tockett if we assume that that Patterson Garland Hoaglander line keeps rolling and Joshua comes back. If you've got the Patterson line going, I would be loath to pull Garland off that line, but at the same time, you know how important the line with Joshua and Blueger and Garland was all year long that you almost hope, and like you never hope for your players to struggle, but you almost hope that that Patterson line goes stale so that that choice is easy for you. That great, we're going to put Joshua and Garland back together and they're going to recreate the magic, but then again, at the same time, it's been so long since they played together with Joshua out now for multiple weeks that they may not be able to recreate that magic right away. So you're kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't if you're Rick Tockett in that scenario and no matter what you do, there will be some people in the fan base that wanted you to do the other thing where if you put him with Joshua and Blueger, some people will say, why'd you take him away from Patterson? They were playing so well. And conversely, if you leave him with Patterson, people will go, that Joshua and Blueger line was so good. Why isn't he playing there? But at the end of the day, when we're talking about games in late March and early April and trending in the right direction towards the playoffs, that's a good problem for a head coach to have. If he's got too many players playing well in different spots in his lineup. - For sure, in Dakota, Joshua, I think one good thing about the injury, obviously it's kept a moat of the lineup for some time now, but it's not a knee, it's not a groin or something. He can skate. So when we talk about getting back on the ice and being in shape, like Dakota, Joshua has been skating. Rick Tockett mentioned that a couple of weeks ago to say he's been able to stay in shape. It's not something that is keeping him off the ice. It's a hand injury. Of course, there's challenges with a hand injury, but in terms of being ready to go when he's ready from a skating perspective, it seems like he should be fine. We'll just have to wait and see. So one of the issues that, of course, you'd like to see the third line back together, but if Connor, Garland, Patterson and Hoaglander are still going well, it gives Rick Tockett a little bit of experimentation time where he can tinker with the lineup and say, all right, let me see what else we have. And I'm going to reference this a couple of times. I said it a few weeks ago, batch, but this is where Rick Tockett can put on his lab coat and start taking out the beakers and the petri dishes and all of these things and experiment a little bit because there will be a moment in the playoffs, whether it's a first round, whether it's later on, if the Canucks get there, that there's going to be injuries, there's going to be situations where your lines go stale and you're going to need to try some new things. It helps when maybe you've got a little bit of experience. Maybe you've got some chemistry because later on in the season, you were able to experiment. So if Garland, Patterson, Hoaglander continues to crank up points and confidence, that's all right. Dakota Joshua comes back and he's playing with a couple of different line mates that might set up well for the playoffs where you never know who you're going to play with. - The other big talking point coming out of practice on Friday was Ian Cole, who didn't play in the win against Montreal on Thursday. Rick Tockett kind of alluded to the fact that he's a bit banged up. If it was a super important game, he probably could have played, but they're getting into, I don't know if they would like us calling it maintenance or load management, but that's kind of what I'm going to go with here in terms of Ian Cole not playing in the game on Thursday and Tockett also wouldn't be tied down to committing whether Cole is going to be in or out of the lineup on Saturday against the flame. So, I'm sure Ian Cole is a bit banged up. At the same time, he's still been practicing, so it's not like it's an injury severe enough to keep him off the ice. And this is the benefit of the development that Noah Julesen has made in his game that you now have the luxury of where you sit in the standings that Ian Cole can sit out a couple if he needs to rest as a player that's later in his career, shall we say. They have the option of pulling other guys out of the lineup. Once they start clenching things like playoff spots or division titles or even conference titles, potentially, then they could look at sitting even more important players in their lineup, but I thought it was interesting, Randy, and you can maybe give us a bit more insight because you were there at practice on Friday that Tockett wouldn't commit one way or the other as to whether Cole's going to play on Saturday against the flames. - Yeah, I asked him the question directly saying, you know, this is a situation where you had Noah Julesen and Ian Cole sat out. Will Ian be playing in the game against Calgary? And he said, that's a decision he's going to make on Saturday. He hasn't made that decision, but at practice on Friday, it was Ian Cole alongside Mark Friedman. And as you know, when you have those pairings in practice that generally sends you a bit of a hint where Julesen was practicing on the third pairing. So if we're, you know, reading between the lines, quite literally, when it comes to defensive pairs, it seems like, as of right now, the way that they practice, Ian Cole would be the man, yet again, sitting out, but that's a situation where, hey, you've got a, a defenseman in his mid 30s, got a lot of hard miles and, you know, from a load management perspective or bad, you know, battling maybe a bit of an injury, you still have that luxury, as you mentioned. And Noah Julesen, to his credit against the Montreal Canadiens, had a solid game. You mentioned the six hits, some key blocks on the power play as well. This is a guy that generally, when he sits out of game, he's coming in and he's playing a solid game. And this was 14 minutes of ice time playing a physical brand of hockey. So if I were to guess batch at this point in time, based on the pairings at practice, I think Noah Julesen gets back in again. And Ian Cole was there, he was, had a big smile on his face what you'd expect from a veteran, but as of right now, talk it not nailing down the defenseman that will be playing, but we can all make our guess on, on whether to Noah Julesen's on that right hand side on the third pair. He also said something post game after the win on Thursday, where he kind of hinted that we, meaning the media might be surprised by who he sits out on Saturday. And I don't know if that was just a throwaway comment or if it was a hint about what he may be thinking about doing and sitting out someone that maybe plays a little bit further up the lineup. But I'm really interested in how Rick Talkett manages this time of the season, because this has been one of the best teams in the league all season long. They've had a great year. These guys that are being sat out of the lineup, whether it's Ian Cole or whether he chooses to sit another veteran, have all been really important parts of that success and their pro athletes, their competitive guys. They want to be in there every night. So I'm sure that's not an easy conversation for Rick Talkett to have with these guys. And, you know, I think it probably speaks to how well he communicates with his players and how much respect they have for him that he feels comfortable taking a veteran player like Ian Cole out of the lineup, potentially for two games in a row, we'll see on Saturday if that's indeed what happens. But that's something I'm sure he has to tread lightly on in terms of who he pulls out of the lineup and how long he sits them. - For sure. And you're also a couple of things here, right? It's about balancing those relationships, balancing, you know, feelings as well, emotions. Every player doesn't matter whether in year one of your contract or year 10 or 15 or whatever it may be. You want to be on the ice, especially at this point of the season, they've all got aches and pains, but they want to be on the ice. So you have to be able to manage all of that. But I also look at the game sheet and the box score is a little bit later on as the season goes on. How are you managing ice time? You know, heroic and Hughes are in that 22, 23 minute range. We might be seeing a shift in game as you're trying to keep your guys, of course, you want to win games. You want to make sure that you're able to take maximum points, but when a game is, you know, you've got a comfortable lead. When you're in a situation where some of the players can be given a rest, even in game, just to keep them fresher. So a couple of things to watch there, but you know, that's the one of the things about Rick Talkett where he's pretty clear in his communication with the media, but you know, he's that much more clear with the players. So anything he's saying, anything he's doing, he's communicating to the guys. And the players love that about him where it's a very direct conversation. It's a two way street. He's said multiple times about that. He learns a lot from the players. It's not just one way conversation. So, you know, this is where I think veteran players like an Ian Cole, like a Noah Jewelsen can understand to say I have a role to play on this team. And also it creates a bit of a chip on the shoulder to say, all right, there's internal competition. I got to bring my best game. And that's what, you know, we saw from Noah Jewelsen against Montreal. He hadn't played in a little bit March 13th against the Colorado Avalanche. And what happens? It comes out, he's lining up Montreal, Canadians. He's really invested in playing that game and has a decent one. So it just raises the bar internally, which Rick Talkett, he's keen on doing that because everybody at this time of the year, like he said, you got to break that seal and it feels like Noah Jewelsen did last game. - You're listening to In the Booth on Sportsnet 650 with myself branded bachelor and Randeep Janda still planning to come on the show on the other side. We'll answer some of your questions and we'll do the rose ceremony as well. It's all still to come on In the Booth on your official home of the Canucks Sportsnet 650. (upbeat music) Welcome back to In the Booth on Sportsnet 650. We are your official home of the Canucks branded bachelor alongside Randeep Janda. If you're listening on the radio and you've missed any part of the show, it lives as a podcast as well on the Canucks Central podcast feed. Okay, Randeep, let's get into the mail bag as we do every week. Let's start with a question from Austin in Langley and Austin's been writing us every week on this asking what is the Canucks record since hashtag the apology? And for people that haven't tuned into the show over the last couple of weeks, Austin wrote in and was joking that I missed a couple of games for the birth of my son and that's when the Canucks started losing again. And then he demanded an apology on this show. So I gave a tongue in cheek apology. And ever since then, the Canucks have been winning. I think their record and don't quote me on this, but I believe it's six one and one since the apology. So maybe it was all my fault that things weren't working, Randeep. - Look at that, the power of saying sorry and how strong of a response, you know, the universe can respond with. Batch, it's all you, man, it's all you. And not only you, it's also Rory. - Yeah, absolutely. He's bounced back well after the Canucks struggling in the first couple of games of his lifetime to be sure. Another question from infokid on Twitter. What is the most you pay heroic? And do you move on from him to sign Joshua, to Smith and Big Z? And this is very typical Vancouver hockey market. The Canucks are first in their division. They're leading the Western Conference. They're gearing up for a playoff run. And don't worry, I'm not dunking on you infokid. I think this is the great thing about this market is how invested people are in the Canucks. But we're already looking ahead to the summer and what's gonna happen for next year and who's gonna resign. And the Phillip Herronet conversation is an interesting one because he's had a great year, a career year offensively playing alongside Quinn Hughes on one of the best pairings in the NHL. He's proved that he's a very important part of this team. But at the same time, with the salary cap structure that the Canucks have, with the contract that they just gave out to Elias Peterson, I don't think they can afford to pay Herronik a lot. Certainly not more than Quinn Hughes. And I know we always talk about you have to look at the contract when it's signed in terms of percentage of the salary cap and everything like that. But you know, regardless of how good Herronik has played, I think his number has to come in 7 million at the most, maybe even less than that, or maybe a hair more than that in terms of average annual value. And you know, the implication here from InfoKit is would you walk away from him or would you move him if that number is looking too high and then use that money to bring back some of your other depth pieces. And I think the Canucks are gonna prioritize some of those depth pieces like Joshua. Anyway, I'm not so sure about guys like Desmith and Zadorov. But the Herronik conversation is one that as soon as the Canucks playoff run is over, whether that be in April or May or hopefully June, is going to be a front of mind for the Canucks fans because that's gonna sort of define the cap space the Canucks have heading into the off season and what direction they're going to go in terms of how they build the blue line for the seasons going forward, not just in the short term. - Well, this is a situation that's really intriguing based on the fact that the duo has been so strong. Philip Herronik has been a player that's picking up points. He's projected for his first 50-point season, projected for about 53 points as of right now. So he's backing it up with a career year and playing next to Queen Hughes helps with that. But it's also been, you know, stepping out and playing a game that maybe we didn't see to the same level in Detroit. So here's the thing with Philip Herronik. I like him as a player. I think he's shown his value to the Canucks, but the internal cap does matter. I agree with you there. The other thing is when I look at comparisons across the league and batch, the one I look at is very close to home for you. Devon Tapes, so the guy that you covered and you called his games with the Suri Eagles and 17 years old. I've known him since he was a young pup for sure. And his deal in Colorado, it's a $7.25 million long-term deal. This is a guy that some were saying took less to stay in Colorado where he plays next to Kilmercar. And for a couple of years straight, had the best duo, very similar to Philip Herronik. For 7.25, and remember, this is a Devon Tapes that had two 50-point seasons, had 57 in his career high. So he's reached that level before he's a cup champion. There's a formula that worked. I don't see a world for me anyways, where Philip Herronik's making more than that. That's a player that probably could have made more like Philip Herronik on the open market. But if you're wanting to stay playing alongside a special player like a queen, he was like a Kilmercar, that number to me is probably, even though, you know, Herronik's, of course, is a right shot defenseman, I'm with you. I think it's around, you know, if I were to just throw a number out there, I think to me it's a 6.75 to probably seven in that range, which is the sweet spot. You get your long-term money, but at the same time, it's something that is affordable, and really something that fits as a number two defense balance team, which is what you will be with Quinn Hughes around. So, you know, if I was signing the checks and if I was somebody that was okaying that, that's a number that I would be okay with. But once you start getting into seven and a half, you know, potentially $8 million range, that's a slippery slope in the long-term. - And this is all going to depend on what Herronik wants and his agent, Alan Walsh, and what they're looking to pursue in this contract and this negotiation. If the priority is similar to TAVES, that you like where you're playing, you like the fit, you like the opportunity, you have to play with a top-level, Norris-caliber defenseman like Quinn Hughes, then are you willing to take a hometown discount? Or maybe you sign, you know, not a max-term deal, but a shorter-term deal or something like that, so that you free yourself up to maybe go make more money on another contract in two or three years, or are you all about that money? Are you just chasing the bag and saying, I wanna get paid on this contract and I don't care where I'm gonna play, even if it means that I get moved away from Vancouver and I end up on a team that doesn't have as good of a chance to win a Stanley Cup, this is about getting paid, that's gonna define this entire negotiation because if it's the latter and if Herronik does want to prioritize making money, and I wouldn't blame him for that, first of all, I think sometimes people put a negative connotation on that, this guy and any other player that gets to this point in their career has worked their whole life to get to a spot where they can make big money and set their family up going forward potentially for multiple generations depending on how much money you're looking at in terms of earning. You know, I think a guy is fully within his right to go out and get the most money he can, but there are some players who will prioritize winning over the extra few million dollars or will prioritize staying in a situation that they like over absolutely maximizing their value and it would not surprise me at all if the scenario is that Herronik and his priority is to maximize his value, that the Canucks would say, okay, we're not willing to pay that, we'll have to, you know, move your rights or move on from you or figure out another solution here because, you know, they've got their core group of players, they've got their pillars in Demko and Patterson and Miller and Hughes and for the long-term benefit of this team, trying to extend their contention window, they can't afford to be paying guys outside of that core group, big money. - No, but, you know, the alternative is if that's a move you have to make based on the market and what the player wants, we don't know if that's the case, but hypothetically speaking here, then you have to start looking in free agency for short-term solutions potentially on that right-hand side of defense because what do we know about that right-hand side of defense? We know that Tyler Myers is a free agent after this year. We know that Tom Belander is not ready for that job just yet. There are some, you know, other individuals that you'd probably be looking at saying, okay, maybe you can take a flyer in the top four, but, Batch, if you're looking at a top four defenseman or a top pairing defenseman, you're probably gonna have to try to address that if there are options in free agency or make a trade, but right-shot defenseman do not come cheap, right? So that's a situation where if they get there, we'll see, but with Phillip Ronik, one thing is for sure, you know, this is a guy to your point, you get to this age, it's your money contract, right? It's one that you've worked your whole life at, and Phillip Ronik is, I can say this, I think pretty confidently, when we're talking about guys that put in the work, he is absolutely ripped, like it. I remember at Halloween, he was dressed up as what Connor McGregor, and he was playing that role for the Christmas party. This guy's, puts in the work, he's definitely somebody that has worked very hard to get to this point, and you can tell physically he's one of those players that is a gym rat, so, you know, he's put in the work, it's his money contract, but what is that sweet spot of, hey, I wanna stay, I wanna get mine, but at the same time, are you able to potentially find a Devon Taves type of deal, where you feel like you've given the team a little bit of a haircut to say, hey, or yourself a bit of a haircut to say, I'm gonna take slightly less, but I wanna make sure that I stay here, and we win a cup, or, you know, I wanna continue to play with Quinn Hughes, 'cause that would be a dream scenario for Vancouver, you're pairing, you know, that's played so well, is a part of your future as well. - And for teams to be successful and extend cup contention windows, they need players to do that, and that might not be, you know, something that player agents or people around the league want to hear, but you look at teams that are Stanley Cup contenders, and almost every single team you can look at and find on their roster one of the best value deals in the NHL, you know, for the Canucks this year, I would point to someone like Dakota Joshua, who isn't making very much, but has become a very important part of the team, you know, even Connor Garland, who, you know, I think coming into the season, people thought that he was not meeting the expectations of his contract, and even in terms of his production, I would say he's not meeting those expectations, but we've talked about it a lot in the past, his importance to this team has leveled up to a point that is quite surprising, and that, you know, he's become a very important play driver for them, regardless of where he's playing in the lineup. Canucks have a guy like Neil's Hoaglander, who's produced 20 goals now on a value contract, you know, look at another team. - Even on another team batch. - Yeah. - Like J.T. Miller, right? Like right now with the amount of points he's producing at 8 million, that's a value deal as well. - And we're just talking about the Canucks, we could pick any cup contender around the league, and we could find value contracts, or you could look back historically at teams that have had success, you know, the Canucks had Alex Burrows on a pretty good value contract when they were a very good hockey club contending to win Stanley Cup. So, that's something that you need, and the question around this conversation is going to be, is Philip Haronek that guy, or is he not, and if he isn't, how do you solve that issue on the right side going forward? Another listener question here, and I wanted to pinpoint this question mostly because I completely disagree with it, and this comes from Jay Cog on Twitter, who says, why is Rogers Arena so quiet during home games? Like zero life, watching it on TV, and getting out cheered by opposing teams? My reaction is that things have been the exact opposite lately, and the Montreal game is always an outlier because legitimately half of the fans inside Rogers Arena last night, we're wearing red, white, and blue, and you can look down in the lower bowl from our perch in the booth, and you can see just how many Canadians, jerseys there are, so that's maybe a once a season occurrence, or a twice a season occurrence when the Maple Leafs come into town, but I think with some of the wins the Canucks have had lately in particular, that Rogers Arena is really jumping, and it's getting me really excited for what that atmosphere is going to be like when we finally get to call a playoff game inside that building again in the coming weeks. - Yeah, we're both wrestling fans, and a good pop of the crowd is something that we're used to hearing, whether the rock comes out, or Stone Cold, or John Cena, or whoever it may be, the Canucks are starting to develop a bit of a pop again when this team is clicking when it's a Canucks fan base because you're right, the Montreal game was a little different, right? It felt like it was maybe 60, 40 Vancouver, or potentially 50, 50 for both teams. There's two things going on in that game where you've got an opposition's fan base, but also the way that that third period played out, Batch, was also just a perfectly managed game by the Canucks where it was low event hockey, so there might not be pop in the building because the way that the games played, but most other nights, and I think Saturday night against Calgary is gonna be a classic example. Two teams that have some recent history, there's been some trades, there's always some animosity between these teams. Both teams play hard, and even though Calgary is out of the playoff picture at this point, they've got some players that can kind of ratchet up the physicality and the griminess of their style of play. I think there's gonna be a pop, so I'm with you, I think that Montreal game is a weird one, being in the building. There's definitely a pop in the crowd right now, and there's an excitement. Batch, you and I are close to the team we covered the team. There's a real excitement in this city. I'm getting probably five to 10 ticket requests, even though I don't have any hookups for tickets right now. I'm getting that request coming in via text messages and all of that. That tells me people are excited, and that is translating in Rogers Arena. We're seeing it every single game. And that is only going to continue to ramp up as we get closer and closer to the postseason. So. - That was just my way of letting people know I don't have free tickets. - Yeah, exactly. So stop asking, okay. - Yeah, stop gaming. - Yeah, exactly. Kind of on that trend as we start to look forward and talk about the atmosphere in the building, JWU writes in. What should be the team's intro song for the playoffs? Why is the only right answer the streets have no name? And look, I love the streets have no name. It reminds me of an era in Canucks history that is arguably the best in this franchise's time in the National Hockey League, certainly in my lifetime watching this team. But I would like to see them define this current group in this current era with a different song that they skate out to or that they're introed to before a game. And why not start a new trend, start a new era, get a new song that the team can skate out to. And I don't have a great answer off the top of my head as to what that song should be. Maybe you have one Randeep, I'm not sure. - Oh, I got one. - I would like to see them stay away from where the streets have no name, especially with YouTube's connection to the Nashville Predators and the run that they've been on this year. I don't know if you want to be playing YouTube because that might get the Predators fired up if you end up facing them in the first round. But why not have a new era, a new sound, a new feel around a new team that you can be proud of with the way they've played this year? - I got a suggestion. And the reason I'm going to come with this name, which I'll tell you in a second, it's when the playoffs come by, like you want an intimidating atmosphere. You want an intimidating venue where the opposition, opposition fans come in. Of course, it's a great time, but in that intro, you're saying, oh man, this is going to be tough. This crowd has pumped up, this team has pumped up, and that music just elevated to next level. And I'm going to come with this. You know I'm a hip hop guy. And there's one beat that is notorious for setting the mood in an intimidation factor. And I'm going to go and batch, look this up. If you don't know the beat, you might, because it's been a commonly used beat in hip hop, but I've never actually seen it at a sporting venue in hockey anyways. It's called Shook Ones Part Two by Mob Deep. And the baseline, the weight ramps up, and just sets an intimidating atmosphere. Imagine the lights dropping, and you're getting ready for the Canucks to come out, and they're skating out, and there's a heavy baseline coming in. It's intimidating. Canucks fans can get riled up as well. You've got your game based on when you're hearing that. So for me, Mob Deep, Shook Ones Part Two, it was also featured in Eight Mile, of course the M&M movie. And to me, that's the one, because what do you want from an intro? You want the players ready to go, you want the crowd ready to go, and you want the opposition to say, uh-oh, we're in trouble. That song does it for me. - And let me say for the record, we would play a clip from that song right now if not for copyright situations and the fact that we can't. So everybody go look it up, find it on YouTube or wherever, and let us know if you agree with Rand Deep's take about Shook Ones Part Two. This also kind of dovetails into another conversation, and we're tight on time, so we'll just talk about it briefly here, Rand Deep. But I've been hearing the debate in the market. There's been a couple of articles written about it this week about how the Canucks should wear the black skate jersey in the playoffs. And I don't think they will in the end because you have to think about it almost from a branding perspective, which I know isn't the way that fanbases want to talk about things, but let's assume you win the Stanley Cup. You win it on home ice. You're gonna have an iconic photo of Quinn Hughes lifting the Stanley Cup that will be available for generations, will be something that will be revered and remembered and put on walls and on bus stops and everywhere across the city. Do you want your primary logo and your primary branding to be on that or do you want your third jersey to be on that? And so I don't think it's going to happen, but let's put that part of the conversation aside and just talk about would you like to see it individually? And because I have a special place in my heart for the 94 team, I think it would be really cool to see that jersey in the playoffs. Again, I don't think it's going to happen, but I think it would be cool if they were able to do it or if they were able to wear it for select playoff games, which I know isn't allowed by league rules if I'm not mistaken, but it's a conversation that's gained a bit of steam in the market this week. - Yeah, I'd love to see it. I'm with you. I think the black jersey, especially is one where, what was I saying about intimidation? That brings the intimidation, especially if you're on the home ice with my dream scenario of shook ones part two playing, but batch, that's one where I look at it and say, yeah, like from a branding exercise as well, the Canucks use the skate logo almost as much as their primary logo. So in name, the primary logo is still there and it's very prominent, but the skate logo is still, you know, it's there. It's not that far behind. One area that I do wonder though, especially in the playoffs is the goalie equipment, right? Because they generally switched pads when they were that jersey going back and forth with all of the equipment. The players maybe don't mind the skaters, but goalies, they are a very specific breed. They like to have things set a certain way, especially when they're traveling and all of that. So going back and forth, going back and forth, does that make you comfortable from an equipment perspective? And that's one area that from a realistic point of view, I'll say, yeah, I could understand why a team might not do that, but from my dream scenario, 100%, the black flying skate jersey, a part of my playoff hopes and dreams, I got my fingers crossed over here that they somehow figure out a way to make it happen. I'm skeptical, but I'm still hoping. - All right, we're almost out of time on the show, but let's get to the Rose ceremony as we do every week. Randy, you can go first, who are you giving your Rose to this week? - I'm giving my Rose to the guy that has been, you know, talking point in the city for not great reasons, based on the fact that just hasn't looked right, but Ilya McKay of two primary assists against Montreal. He's playing with speed with Lafferty and Lindholm. This is a guy that has had a tough year and a bit, having a knee injury, coming back, hasn't found his stride fully yet, but he's trending in the right direction, he's playing fast, he's creating takeaways, he's in a situation right now, it seems like he's building confidence in his game. And a batch, if he figures it out, this is a guy that you can use on any three of your top lines as that forechecker, as a guy that can play with speed and pose problems for the opposition. So when he's going, he's a problem to deal with. So Ilya McKay, it's been a rough couple of months, but happy to see him trending in the right direction, he gets my Rose. - I'm going to give mine to Elias Patterson, who I think got back to playing the kind of hockey that the Canucks need him to play in the last couple of games, certainly had a great performance against Buffalo. And even though he didn't hit the score sheet against Montreal, he was 80% in the face off circle in that game and, you know, is a big part of the Canucks success this week. So Patterson, he got that reminder to start moving his feet again, and he's been playing very well on that line with Niels Hoaglander and having Connor Garland compliment them as well. So I think Patterson, a lot of the time, is unfairly criticized in this market. So I want to give him a little bit of love. I'm going to give him my Rose this week because I think he's been playing better of late. Okay, before we get out of here, Randy, if it's going to be a busy Saturday for you, because you're on Hockey Night in Canada, Punjabi, but you're also calling the Canucks Flames game alongside me and you're on after hours with Scott Oak. So take us through what your Saturday is going to look like in Tia Hockey Night in Canada, Punjabi for us as well. - Yeah, game one of our double-header is going to be Edmunds in Toronto. It's a national game on our broadcast. So I'll be doing that. I'll be hosting that. And then right after that batch, I'm going to get my car and drive down to the arena. So we'll see if I make it in time for puck drop. Please, if you see me on the roads, move to the right-hand side so I can get to Roger's arena in time. And then on top of that, you mentioned it. I get the honour of sitting alongside Scott Oak, the legend. We're going to be chatting with Connor Garland. And looking forward to that conversation as well. Garland's been a great story. The season started off in a rough way with the trade speculation, but has he ever figured it out? Hasn't, you know, he's really been able to focus on his game. So looking forward to that conversation, but I'll be seeing you on Saturday night. You can watch me in Hockey Night in Canada, Punjabi. Listen to us on Sports Night 650. And also I'll be speaking some English on TV as well on Saturday night and after hours. Multiple languages, multiple mediums, TV, radio, English, Punjabi, and we got to get you a police escort on top of all of that to get you down to the ring. So it'll be a great night for you. Yeah, exactly. That's it for us on In the Booth this week though. Again, if you missed any part of the show, catch it as a podcast on the Canucks Central podcast feed. And we'll talk to you again next week right here on Sportsnet 650.
