I Came With Fire
"Contender to Champion" with Seth Gehle
What's up everybody welcome back to I came a fire podcast we are here tonight with Seth Gail But we are gonna do a quick shout out real fast our boy and friend of the show Connor Matthews Who is debuting in UFC at the end of the month on the 30th at Atlantic City rocking the merch You can head over his page and pick some up and then make sure you check him out It's a UFC debut on TV and you can go listen to our episode with him. I didn't hear no bell But yeah, congratulations to him and yeah, so Seth man Really really appreciate you coming on and talking with us You actually hit us up on the podcast page and asked about coming on because I'm writing a book You have an amazing story as well and I highly encourage everybody You know when this comes out to obviously check out the episode, but also good at Seth's page and he has a really awesome Video that kind of details everything about him on his YouTube page So go check him out but set like to let everybody give you the opportunity to introduce themselves. So welcome to the show man Yeah, appreciate appreciate it. Thank you Yeah, I'm Seth Gale. I like you said, I'm on Instagram. I'm on YouTube. You can look me up that way And then I actually just created a website today. So it's Sethgale.com. So that's got everything on there So that yeah, but I was born and raised in Lime, Ohio, Northwest, Ohio Frickin joined the army came down south and I live in Atlanta and I work in construction and I'm You know like like you said, I'm writing a book right now. That should be done later on this year I've got a lot that's actually unpacking in that we may talk about today, but so it may actually go a little bit longer I'm not really sure but Yeah, yeah, man, and then Yeah, right in the book and then I'm working on my professional speaking career. So I just had my First I would say biggest event at the University of North Georgia Last week on Tuesday. So that was pretty cool. So that's cool. That's what I'm doing now Was it like a commencement speech or something or like, what was it? It was a teen wellness summit. So there was like a there was like a main keynote guy and He spoke for like an hour and then they broke up like these like 300 plus students into like 15 classrooms or 20 classrooms Something like that. Got you. So I got to speak to about 45 50 kids maybe and just kind of told them my life story and then my big thing was like mental health advocacy and and Resiliency and and just being strong Yeah, my story is always really really powerful. I mean, obviously you guys know a little bit about it, but Whenever I speak I've I've done like six engagements. This was my first I say big because it was paid because my first okay, so big deal. Yeah, so Yeah, well every time I speak though the room is is really quiet and it's pretty funny Because I've got a I've got a bit of a presence. I think so yeah Yeah, well, you've got a David Morse presence, right? We figured it out before we jumped on here that Seth looks like David Morse the actor So if you're like me and you had you didn't know the fuck that was go ahead and Google him because you'll see that Seth looks Just like like if he really does I think could remember Yeah, I just saw I just remember his face and I had to I'd eat help get Brandon So and I just started spitting off a plot to a movie Brandon yeah, I told me that it's highly immediately. I was like cool That's literally up all that's up here is useless movie information that has so that's it So he was and Disturbia. He's the the murderer neighbor Anyway, now that we're here with David Morse. I mean Seth Gayle. We'll talk about a but now do so I saw I saw on on the Instagram yesterday that your your race didn't go as planned But yesterday for the second time Seth attempted a 100 mile ultra run Which is insane dude. Yeah, and so tell us about it because I want to know dude. What happened? What are the deeds dude? Oh shit? So so ultra marathons they're funny because they will so what I found out like yesterday yesterday It was my first run that I've ever done with in hot weather. It's about say I got it up to about 75 during the middle of the day, okay, so that was the first time I've ever done it like an ultra in hot weather and After even after being in the army for eight years I found out that you will chafe in places that you did not know you could chafe in and Like and I'm like suffering from it now like my so I took off my shirt for a couple hours Excuse me and My whole back chest and everything shoulders are everything sunburnt. I'm chafing under both my arms. I'm chafing in other places So everything just hurts like hell my knees hurt my legs hurt. I can barely walk and Yeah, and the sunburn is just terrible. So yeah, yeah, but yeah, I guess that what happened was I'm big as hell and I'm not built like an ultra runner and You know, I'm like 205 pounds. What I was actually trying to do Was total 1200 pounds between my bench squat and deadlift and then run a hundred miles in the same week Like that was like my I think that'd be really cool to because most ultra runners Yeah, most ultra runners are like skinny little guys and they're not that strong and there's a few of them out there that are athletic and they're pretty strong sure, but I'll tell you this so I finished mile I got to mile 40. It was like 40.95 is what I ran Damn Yeah, and when I came across that line. I was the last one that was like a big dude Everybody else is pretty small. So I at least outlasted the Giants But man, it was it was tough is that so this particular race is a It's a it's a backyard ultra so they what it is. It's a loop. So sometimes are a mile sometimes a three miles or a four mile loop You just run that same loop and this one since it was a mile you get you run it 15 minutes on the minute So you get 15 minutes to run your mile and then the clock whatever it hits back to 15 minutes you start the next lap and so So that's all it is and it doesn't sound that bad like you can you can walk a mile in 15 minutes if you're kind of fast but there's some hills to it and it's there's some trails and then after you know eight hours of continuous movement it just Dude and did it was frickin brutal. It was that was the hardest race I've ever done and I've ran 60 in a 50 mile I before and that 40 miles kicked my ass. Yeah, what was your pace? So I I was actually pretty calculated the whole time I kind of figured out the course really quick and I came in every lap right at like About 13 30 so I had about a minute and a half to kind of stay in there and get some water Change up my water bottles and get you know toward us start getting hot I had my crew which was my wife and my brother They were taking a wet shirt and kind of damping me down to cool me off because I was I mean I was hot as hell like I was burning up out there, so The bigger you are especially you have a lot of muscle mass. I don't I mean I'm a pretty muscular dude. I guess pretty Yeah, and With that you burn up a lot more oxygen you use a lot more oxygen and your body will run a lot hotter So are you just you know just science? The bigger you are the how do you run? It's just all it is and yeah fucking fucking sucking out there ain't a lie Did that's off anyway, man 40 miles dude like you were close like you were close to like two marathons kind of you know I mean like yeah, I've never even run a marathon I before I went into the Air Force like a month before I went in the Air Force I did a half marathon in St. Louis and I've always been like hey, that's pretty cool You know what I mean, but like I've never had any inkling to to do even just a marathon since then so that's that's incredible Dude, that's like some David Goggins shit. Yeah ran further than a mile and a half ever in my life The Air Force made you yeah, and I do that once a year. Yeah, yeah I'm not a runner either. I mean I guess I am now, but like I fucking hate it and I Mean like I said, I've done 60 miles. I've done a 50 mile or I've done a couple 30 mile races Yeah, and that that 40 was the hardest thing I've ever done in my life that Especially the last thing because I thought I was going to stop at like 16 or 17 miles because it was so it was getting so hard And it was getting hot. Yeah, I mean, I was yeah, and then the last lap So the second the last lap I came in with like two seconds to spare on the clock Okay, and then my brother was like I was about to pass out and then my brother was like let's get one more And so we ran one more and I was just go with you. Yeah, he did Yeah, he ran with me for one more lap and then that was my last one I came in fell to my knees like a bitch and Fell sorry for myself Bro, I don't think that makes you a bit 40 fucking miles is pretty impressive. Yeah What was harder about this one versus a 60 miler the the 60 mile course was flatter and You got an hour to run four miles instead of one mile so like the longer so if you have four miles if you run each mile at like 12 minute pace like the same thing I was doing for the The one mile loop at the end of it you get an eight to ten minute break instead of a one to two minute break So yeah, you just the the longer the the longer you have to run It's easier to get a longer break between laps, you know So when you're down to one mile though, you like you have to run that mile in like nine minutes if you want a decent break And that's a fucking fast mile for that is a good pace trails and and shit like that. So yeah, so so I do At least five miles six days a week and I normally come in anywhere between like nine and ten minutes for the whole five miles You know what I mean? And because that and that is a hard pace for that that long. I mean, I'm also like two oh five You know, so like I'm sure there's somebody out there listening who's like man, let's fucking slow But for me, that's a pretty good, you know what I mean, but so yeah, I couldn't imagine keeping that up for 40 miles That's fucking nuts, man. I didn't even have it. So are you gonna do another one? Uh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I've got Yeah, well the well the the backyards are hard. They're harder like a regular ultra regular 100 mile or it's not that bad Well, it still sucks, but A regular like like when I rate my 50 mile or for example, that was a traditional ultra where it's like a point eight a point B And so when you run that you can walk as much as you want and you don't have to run a specific pace There are out there are time cutoffs But the ultra running community Especially the trails they are like super community-based friendly So like they don't really give a shit as long as you're not like dragging ass and about to die They'll they'll pretty much they like you get, you know, you have to get the point B by Three hours you have to get the point C by five hours But if you come in a little bit behind as long as you're not dying, they're like, okay, you just need to speed up a little bit so When when I ran my 50 mile or like I was fine like at the end I ran the last like five miles like at like a 10 minute pace and I mean I was yeah, I was hauling ass at the end And I was good. I came across the finish line yeah, and But but that's the thing with the with the traditional ultra is you just get more time to rest in between checkpoints and then when you get to an aid station you can sit there for 30 minutes, you know, that's what makes those nicest the rest the rest times between so But I've got my eyes on a really hard 100 miler and and I probably won't be able to do it because of my book and everything right now But I'd like to maybe next year. I would definitely next year Yeah, yeah, there was a guy who ran a hundred miles and 19 hours on this on this course last year and there's 16,000 feet of elevation on this course like the North Georgia Mountains and That means that this guy was running a sub nine minute pace for a hundred miles including All the rest and aid stations changing out of shoes all that shit Which really means he's probably run like a seven to eight minute pace for a hundred miles up and down fucking mountains and shit I mean it was fucking insane who the fuck is this Dude, no, what was that guy like the the Kenyan dude that they're at the Olympics, right? Like had to like a Four four and a half minute mile pace for the entire marathon or something. What's his fuck? I remember his name, but like that's gonna rise me up now. You think both a short distance like spreader. Yeah Yeah, that's not that's totally different. But yeah, no, that's that's that sounds like a robot dude out there That's fucking insane. Go ahead. It is what I'm like What are you what is your hope running these like is this something that you're just doing for yourself to say a fucking did it? Or is there like a deeper lesson here for you that you're trying to? To see or learn You know, I'm kind of retarded, so like I just kind of like same I just do dumb shit like I don't know man I work out a lot I do jujitsu and I run ultramarathons and like doing all three of those I think it's just cool because I can say that I do it and It's just doing hard shit like I just like do it like I Was in the army for eight years and I was never the fucking runner Like I was like I was even in the 82nd where all you do is run and I was never the fucking runner never I was decent, but Yeah, I was always the strong guy and so when I got out I saw my buddy attempt a ultramarathon a hundred-mileer the one I was telling you about Yeah, and he failed, but when I was out there I was like damn did I want to get some of this shit because it looked fucking hard and it was a big community And it was cool like everybody's like supporting everybody and I was like fuck yeah, and then the cool thing about ultramarathons is that it's like How long can you just keep going like it's just a yeah, it's just a Limited of your body. It's a limited. Yeah, and Exactly. Yeah, they like the backyards are tougher because you have it you're pushing the clock the time But on a traditional it's really just like can you just keep moving your body forward and you know it's cool and you know, I've had a pretty fucked up life, so I when I go out there and accomplish something to me. It's a bigger deal because Everything that I've gone through to get where I'm going and so whenever I do accomplish something like Running 50 miles or 60 miles I get a lot of time out there to think on those tracks and those trails and I just you know I really like it sounds kind of cliche But I really do just think about like how blessed I am and how lucky I am and even at this one this weekend or yesterday You know, we ran around this pond basically And you know, it's just it's a freaking Saturday. It's sunny and 75 and I'm running circles around this fucking pond and like that's Like I haven't gotten to complain about, you know, you know, so it's just a You know, I think when you do hardship man, it gives you perspective on life And it also just my kids were out there. My kids were out there for several hours by like five or six hours And they got to see me every lap, you know, and they're cheering me on and they get to see me coming through And you know, I'll suck in to see yeah, exactly. Yeah, man. Yeah, so um Yeah, I mean, we're just that this It's hard and I like doing a shit Yeah, like a ritual or like a routine or like something that helps you kind of like get ready for him or like while you're on it You do anything specific while running to kind of help you No, and that that's that's uh probably because I'm I'm so dumb like I It's the army talking. Are you still like okay? My brother My brother threw up the idea of getting a like 40 pack of uh, like bushlight and like yeah, like knocking one down like every hour I was like damn. I was like we should totally do that And he didn't buy it and I was convinced I was gonna run a hundred miles. I didn't know how hard she was Yeah, so yeah, we'll blame it on him for for that. But no, I don't have a I really don't have like a I know what I got to do, which is basically you got to stay up on your electrolytes and stay up on your calories That's like the two big killers. So I mean, yeah, so order a pizza I did actually yeah, but I did I couldn't fucking eat it But when the pizza got there like I was because you have such short time between laps And I was just fucking exhausted and hot as hell and so like I didn't even want it dude Yeah, I just couldn't even I mean I couldn't even do it like it didn't matter what they gave me Like nothing was like hitting the spot. Um, the bananas were about it. I mean it's eaten a lot of bananas, but Yeah, just Yeah, I mean I had plenty of like because they make all kinds of supplements now that have the sodium and the electrolyte And all that shit that she even carbs in it. So that's really what I was taking down for most of my calories Um, I was eating foods because when you have a bunch of liquid calories your stomach will get fucked up It'll get like slushy. So you want to eat like something to keep it dry up in there Okay So that so to you know answer your question the most preparation that I do is make sure I've got my body lubed up so I don't shave and Which it it's like inevitable. It still happened Yeah, after after like 40 30 40 miles that you're going to chafe. It doesn't matter Yeah, and you're right you're going to get blisters and shit. So the Vaseline ultra marathon right for chafing Yeah, yeah, that makes Right Jesus Because you're getting fucked. Yeah, yeah, yeah I know a lot of uh, I know a lot of runners I've read that they like chew gum while they run because it's like something from the deuce and to think about and then Yeah, you told me that's it. Yeah, they get into a rhythm of chewing gum Uh and running at like a pace. So it just keeps them on track. I've heard that's pretty good Yeah, um, I I should have I went through a few pieces of gum out there Um Yeah, you chew it until like the centigrates and your fucking mouth and Yeah, but after like after like three or four pieces of gum you like it gets me sick Like that's that's the bad thing about it. It's like you'll get something that that works really good It's like oh damn this drink is really good And then after like six bottles of it you're like like fucking hey, man. I just need some fucking one to have this again Yeah, yeah, so that's fucking hilarious Now your um, you're doing hard shit thing is something that um we've had Discussed on the podcast a few times as a theme And um, but it always I always like to bring up the same quote because it's one of my favorites from sineca the rum and stoke philosopher The body should be treated more rigorously so it does not disobey the mind And um, I really really like that quote because it is true when you said doing hard things Um, I experienced the same sort of thought process like when i'm running as well And there is an appreciation for being able to do the hard things as well And I you know, even when i'm sitting there sucking wind or like my knees are hurting or whatever I'm like, you know what though like at least I am able to be out here doing this and I pay more attention to the scenery And I was running the evenings after work So like sometimes the sun is going down and just kind of have that appreciation of um having that ability and then also appreciate the environment and being out in it is There's a lot to get from that and there's a lot to get from failure too, right? Um, what what would you say like you take away from these experiences where you don't check that box and you you fail at what you're doing? Um Man, it sucks honestly like it sucks pretty hard for a few minutes because like I I have very high expectations for myself um, and I just I'm not ever going to go out to do something and think that i'm going to lose You know, like, um I know if I go run a like a traditional race like i'm not going to win because i'm not fast Like i'm just and I don't train for it. I'm not prepared for like i'm barely prepared for this race So I don't know why the fuck my expectations were so high still did 40 miles bro. Hell yeah. Yeah, I mean I was truthful in my book Yeah, I mean i'm like 20 pounds heavier than what I was when I ran 60 miles and um Uh, yeah, I just I'm barely prepared for this one and but but still It's just it's just a mental thing like like I said, so When I do fail at shit like this or even like a jiu-jitsu match if I lose a jiu-jitsu match Uh, it definitely sucks like because I don't want to lose um, but on the same token um It's okay. Like it's like like that's part of life. Like you're going to fucking lose and um One thing I learned as a leader in the army And actually in the construction world was um I did so well, let's all say in construction. I did so fucking good in construction when I first got in as building homes I was crushing these leaderboards. I was at the top of all my shit was fucking perfect And it was really impressive. But my my vp construction at the time said You know, I think it's really impressive, but we'll see what happens when you fail You know like like a true leader how you bounce back exactly. Yeah, so and so You know that and that was a good point man because I did take it I finally did take an L And and construction after like a year and some change like I got a bad survey and this this customer basically said I was a piece of shit Um, yeah. Yeah, I mean he's the first one to tell the truth to be honest. I mean, how did like I was like 40 out of like 40 some customers. He's the first one to give me a real A real review not just kidding, but but no, he said that and he he said some he said some shit on there And I was kind of like you motherfucker, you know, but yeah, but like you said It's about bouncing back. Like if you get to the top, that's great. But if you take an L It's just like in the UFC man. Those guys get to the top. They they hold their belt and as soon as they lose Boom, they just start. Yeah, look at volcanovski. He's lost like three in a row now, you know, and so um I think that's an interesting Interesting thing about losing and trying to try to it's easy to get to the top. It's hard to stay up there So when you do get up there and you do win Uh, and then you start to lose a little bit. It's like, can you get back up? Can you keep biting? You know, yeah, they're lovely you said that Not to siltbox too much about the air force because sak and I do that fairly often But one of the things that uh, the air force is really bad at is not letting people bounce back from their failures And they will keep it as a cloud over your head forever, right? And you know, you know, the air force is a small place Just like the army is and you're you're gonna pcs and you'll meet somebody who knew you or knew somebody who knew you, right? And they always got a story about whoever right you relate to and so it's really hard to get away from those failures And um, you know, the like Zach just said the air force is a is a one fail, you know, air force, right? And they don't Promote people who fail, right? And they don't let people get out from that So by the time a lot of these I like to use the word leaders and quotes get to these positions where they are leading They don't have that experience of failure. They don't have the resiliency They can't talk to you about it. They can't give an act like one of my one of my favorite flight chiefs Had been a staff sergeant twice Because he lost a strike And um, you know, those guys you need those dudes to be like, hey man, this is not the end of the fucking world And um, so it's there's a lot to be said about failing and coming back from it because like you said It is hard to get back up It's hard to be truly resilient because it requires you can have people all day saying Hey, good job. You're doing all right, man Come but you're going to be okay, but the end of the day if this isn't doing the same thing Then you're not going to bounce back So there's a lot to be said for failure and and maintaining your resiliency that way I've never had a like large failures. I guess in my career and when I was the shirt for my unit I had, you know Airmen coming to me with some problems and I couldn't relate to their problems because I It never happens. No, I didn't understand it So I had to like reach out to other people And be like get advice from them before giving my advice to this airman because I Didn't have their issue. I didn't have their problem. I didn't know how to like think about it or whatever like Quote from rocky it ain't about how hard your hit is about how you can get hit and keep moving forward How much you can take and keep moving forward? That's right. Yeah, it's right. That's right So, uh, what did uh, what'd you do in the army? Uh, I was in the infantry Yeah, so I initially I joined as a mechanic in the reserves when I was uh when I was in high school Because the fucking recruiter told me that I was going to blow shit up. Got you and um, that was a fucking lie Just entrance. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we blew up the motherfuckers. He was mouth is moving. They're lying. Yeah. Yeah, so Zach was a recruiter. So yeah, well, yeah, fuck all those guys. Okay. Yeah No, uh, yeah, no, he walked in the cafeteria one day and he was like, hey man, you went to an army. I was like, yeah, fuck it I don't say I was like, man, it's gonna give me a lot of soul. So yeah, I mean, that's it. That's a that's a good reason. You know what I mean? Yeah, so all for the no key factors, so I uh, I uh, yeah, I joined there and then I when I was in College my freshman year. I was going to a community college in columbus, Ohio and I was like, this is not the fucking army because I was in the reserves and I was like showing up and I was like kind of confused And um, I was like like what the fuck is going on and then I was about to be homeless because I had no financial literacy And so I went to the recruiters again and I was like, hey, what the fuck I thought I was joining the army and then they signed me up for an 18x contract, which is the special forces candid it So I went yeah, that's and that's how I got into the infantry. I went there. I um failed that pipeline like a fucking turd and then um went into The infantry so went to force sewer It's actually kind of funny story about failing airborne school. I didn't really fail. I got curfew fucking Got me. Okay. Okay. Everyone. Yeah, airborne school's a joke and They don't ever time manage. So you That sounds worse actually Planning prevents piss poor performance Jesus, sorry God, I can hate yeah, so Yeah, yeah, that does sound bad um Yeah, man. Well, they don't ever do fucking curfew checks and Um, well, yeah, exactly. That's like the one fucking time and me and my buddy went out to get a fucking coffee And we were just like we were like hardcore like running and rucking like we were getting ready for a selection We were like fuck this we got for a coffee And I didn't even get to drink my fucking coffee because I spilled it And then whatever we we get back on base like 30 minutes later And they're like hey, they did a barracks jacket. We're like bullshit and they did man. They called us out sunday morning fucking Gail fucking ran my ass up there for position retention. Yeah, you're fucking gone. I'm like motherfucker. Oh my gosh I know right No, no recycle just fucking gone Booted my ass man. And that was that was the week before that was the weekend before jump week That's why me and my buddy went out because we were like we don't know when we're gonna get to go out again after we passed Right. So do we went out Yeah, yeah, exactly. What was it Was like star box because it dunked in or was it it was some fucking local fucking Yeah, bullshit down in columbus, Georgia Yeah, man. I was fucking mad as hell I would be too. Yeah, I went to force to her Georgia for a couple years And then I went back to airborne school and then then ended up in 82nd Pasted this time no coffee Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, fuck the proper time management the second time. It's good Yeah, well, the second time I was I almost beat the fuck out of this fucking private. So I told him he had Yeah, yeah, this fucking kid took a picture of me. I was fucking naked And this fucking kid. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's a picture of me. Yeah, it is weird And I told him I was like look man you can either You can either uh delete all that shit and you can admit it to these ncos right here that you fucking took a picture of me Or i'll beat your fucking ass and Yeah, it's like it's up to you and this kid was like fresh at a basic scared his fuck and I was a Sergeant at the time. I think it was in e5 Yeah, yeah, and so why about the like what the fuck was the point of that? Yeah, that's What I did. I don't I don't fucking know Well, the fucked up thing Yeah, yeah Well, the fucked up thing too was the reason why I really pissed me off is because he was a medic And so he was really held liable for all the hip of shit And that's what I told him i was like you're about to be a fucking medic and you're over here taking pictures of Fucking guys while they're naked and it's like you fucking piece of shit So made me wonder if he had any other pictures of other people you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, so I I told I mean I ended up telling the cadre there I was like look like this guy's got to go like he's he's a fucking medic He's taking pictures of people. I gave him the option of either Not or I'll beat his fucking ass and yeah, he chose this he chose to be reported so There it is. So anyways, I almost failed airborne school again because I about fucking killed some bastard For a bit like listen, man. I got kicked out of here last time over a fucking cup of coffee I'm not getting kicked out of here because someone took a picture of my naked ass Like we're gonna do something about this and I'm finishing For real like yeah, dude. Well, dude is fun. I came burned twice I saw him take the picture like I remember what it happened I was at my locker changing And I and I have a I have a sixth sense about I just I just know what's going on around me and I swear to god. I can read people's minds sometimes Um And this all comes from how I grew up but I was sitting there at my locker. I fucking dropped my shorts And I see a phone like angled towards me and I look over and I'm just kind of like he just took a fucking picture of me And um, dude So the next day actually I didn't say anything there because I was like I was kind of hot already So the next day he was walking past me and I don't think he saw me I was like laying on my bunk or something like that. It was him and another kid and they had made a comment and About like some something naked in a like a dick or whatever And I was like you motherfucker. And so like that kind of confirmed That he had taken the picture and so I got up and then he had he like I said he admitted it Which is kind of funny that I I put it all together and I was able to catch his ass because I was like, yeah But yeah, he admitted it all and um, yeah, because he had like sent it on a snapchat or something like that So I don't know who all got to see. I mean, I didn't get no royalties out of this shit. It's shame Yeah, but it's shame. Yeah, that's really fucking weird, man I don't understand like I mean if you like taking it for your own Personal enjoyment you're like trying to blackmail somebody you know what I mean like You either do this or I'm posting your butt on the internet, you know In Japan like go for it Interesting there's so many issues of like uh Just sickos take a pictures of like women and stuff like none of their skirts that um Here in the us you can like make your phone silent when you take a picture of stuff doesn't do anything in japan Uh, no matter what you do the phone will always do the loudest clicking like noise ever You can't throw it off. It's not it's such a problem your phone snitches on you, dude Like that's so funny. It's like you'll be like in a subway. You hear someone who can then you look me I know Some creepy dudes got a cell phone tape to a shoe. Yeah in a fucking room. It's like such a problem You should eat the Japanese government had to make it to where oh so they might say Yeah That's crazy. Your phone knows because when I went to Japan with my american phone Um, I was taking pictures and it's like what the hell and my phone knew I entered Japan and it made it loud And I couldn't turn it off. Oh, that's interesting. It worked again. I was like, what the hell? So Wow, I did not know that that's pretty crazy. That's fucking crazy. Yeah, it is Makes me wonder what other countries have stupid fucking like geofencing things like that, you know You get in a romania and then all of a sudden Whatever Can't access google You can't watch porn in Afghanistan. So that can't even watch porn in texas now Born hub anyway Yeah, yeah, born hub is no longer accessible. I think i got banned in north carolina, too There's a couple states too. Yeah, it's like i think it's both carilinas in virginia Um, azurey is another one. I know like whatever did I live in california? Unfortunately where porn will never be banned. So I had a vpn to like romania and porn when I was in afghanistan and that's like a whole nother level of shit dude vpn Yeah, I did I watched so much sports when I was either deployed or fucking stationed overseas because of vpn's Thank god for vpn's and other things, you know, yeah for sure Yeah, but um so You've you've referenced a few times, you know, like here you you develop this sex six cents grown up Because the way you were brought up. I just want to say like anybody listening like um this this episode definitely may have some like triggers for you Especially with like sexual assault Um, you know, maybe sexual assault with children and things like that. So if you are sensitive to those things Um, you can just skip this one catch us on the next one, but um Seth, you know, we let you jump in on like why you're writing this book and like where where this all started for you men Yeah, so when I was uh when I was about nine or ten years old, uh, kind of tell the story a lot I I I was going up the stairs in my house and I look in my living room and my mom is sitting there smoking some weed Which which was like pretty normal for us like she was always smoking But um she was smoking with a bunch of guys and and these guys had always been at our house But this time I think it's like the first time I saw my sisters and they're smoking Okay, and we're all one year apart So they were like 10 and 11 something like that or a 9 and 11 And uh smoking weed in a room with a bunch of grown men, uh, and this was like 20 years ago when weed was like Bad man, you know, so definitely Yes, so yeah, so um So I actually remember like around that time if not that day where I was like I knew I was going to do something special My life like I knew I was going to like this wasn't going to be it for me And a lot of people that live like that they just are stuck in that cycle and they just live it and they're it's just that's just their life forever Um they grow up and they live in that same shitty little city for the rest of their life and that's it Uh, it wouldn't go meet me and I always knew that for some reason. I'm not real sure why or how but I just did and um So around that time she had met a guy And this guy had gotten her hooked up on some cracking coke Oddly enough. He was the like pastor or something like that of a church. Um, yeah, so he was super super smooth super Slick on the stone. Yeah, exactly and uh And uh, this guy was a fucking piece of shit. Let me tell you but I knew he was the minute I met him like I I knew he was um, but you know, he was smooth And he had that little silver tongue whatever you won't call it um So anyways at that same time about like 10 years old my life basically It was already hard because I was growing up. I grew up with a single mother of three and so It was already hard. We already had like a lot of shit that was going on Um, but at that point when I was like 10 like shit really took a fucking a A bad turn and my mom just got like real violent all of a sudden Our house got broken into like three times. We were there. Me and my sisters were there alone twice Uh, I remember being that like 10 years old watching three people kick in my back door We had like a devil and a two by four going across the door And I could we're just like watching them like the door is just like inching open, you know Yeah, so that was pretty fucking scary Um, and then like the cops showed up and they like called my mom and then they like left and that was it It was like, okay, whatever go back to sleep and then that happened again like two weeks later and actually got in the house Um, but our neighbor came in about the same time I guess or something and all I remember from the second time Was my I was being carried out of my bed and my neighbor's arms and he's just like don't worry about it Like I got you and they took his next door. Um, yeah, so what are these people looking for? You know Dude no idea. That's what's scary. He's like we didn't have shit. So What's even worse is like, yeah, so they were they were um They they knew my mom's work schedule because they would come like 45 minutes after she left her work So she would work all night and then be home during the day Uh, she'd work while we were asleep at home, which is Fucking crazy to think about like leaving you like you're eight nine and ten year old at home Why you just go and work your factory job with like no cell phone no Source of communication different just left us there Yeah, I mean it's definitely times are much much different than they were 20 years ago But even now I'm like there's no fucking way. I'm leaving my five-year-old or six-year-old at home all night long Um, you know, I think the I think it's actually a legal agent. I think it's like 12 Like you can't leave like a child home alone until they're like 12 Yeah, sure Yeah, so um Yeah, but me she had been doing that for a while like even when we were younger Um, well when we were younger she would work at during the day So we'd get home from school and we'd be home alone for like two or three hours And then she'd be there at night. But once we got older, she kind of flipped it where she just left us Uh at home, um at night. So anyways Um Yeah, so she started getting crazy. She started beating the shell of us She I remember she walked in my room one time And she like hammer fist like punched my sister in the mouth Um Like banged her head against the wall beat the shell of her like hit her probably two or three more times And uh, I actually jumped on the other side of my bed And I was like sitting or crying Once again, I was like 10 years old when this happened And i'm looking up at my mom and she's like raging and yelling and she's like, uh She looks at me. She goes Why are you being a little bitch? And i'm like My bro like what? So, uh, even when I tell that story today like a lot of people don't believe me when I tell them like because they can't Imagine their mom saying that to them, but uh, that happened so Um Yeah, so that that that that was kind of getting tough. There was a time I walked home from school and she beat the hell out of me with a board Um Because I came in late and uh, it was causing all this for her I don't know man. I don't know. Um, I don't know She she just kind of like went off the deep end. Um, she had drank and smoked her whole life. Um, but she wasn't like a I just didn't look at it like an alcoholic. I think She she unfortunately had like a very victim mentality and I think the single mother kind of life was just getting too much and I mean, it sounds fucked up, but like people who Treat their kids bad for example, uh, a lot of times when you i'm like, well, I think a lot of times Um, when you look at those cases Um, it's somebody who doesn't have a support system somebody who doesn't have any kind of help and it's not that it's an excuse, but If you've had a fucked up life and um, and then you're left to take care of another life You will have some thoughts that come in your head sometimes. That's just it's just I mean, if you've had a fucked up life, you'll just have bad thoughts in general Yeah, so when you have when you have the when you have the added stressors of other things You'll have even more fucked up thoughts and if you don't have a support system, you end up being fucked up shit Um, and there are one-offs where you have this like perfect american family and the dad just kills people for somewhat reason Yeah, that does happen, but I think a lot of those cases where you say like a baby dumped in a dumpster Um that that mom was probably a single mother and had no support like I said i'm not making excuses I'm just saying like That's I think that I think it just it drives people crazy where they they just can't do it anymore And so they they like give up and they freak out and they make a bad decision And I think that's kind of what happened to my mom and she started to just freak out She has a shitty upbringing too Uh, I think so. Yeah, it wasn't great. Yeah, it definitely wasn't great And you know my father when she she met my father when she was like 17 so she had me and my sisters like 17 18 19 Yeah, and um, it's rough Yeah, so then my dad went to my my father went to prison when I was like two for stabbing her behind the ear Um, and he went to prison for a long time for that. I never really knew my father growing up So, you know, there's a lot going on there and not to mention everybody else and our family was fucked up too like Everybody every other part of my family cousins and all this shit was all fucked up. So there wasn't really any support um but anyways Right as that happened. I try to tell my story. It's almost like it's almost like Walking down the street and you have to see like two sides and I was living both sides of the street at the same time so Monday through friday or Whatever. Yeah, monday through friday during the I say the school week Um, I was living at home with my mom doing dealing with the abuse and the drugs and the violence And then I would end up meeting this guy when I was like 10. He was like 30 some 30 some years old. I met him through our best for my best friend at the time who my best friend was five years older than me He introduced me to this guy. Um Who was uh, who would end up being my sexual abuser? for the next like five and a half years and uh So yeah, this guy, um, he had actually He had uh So he invited me up to his house with my other friend we hang out And I hung out with him for about three months and then he finally started making some moves on me and um I was like 10 And uh, he touched me. He grabbed he kind of like grabs my ass Um, it starts to kind of do that kind of stuff and then The first time he did it, you know, I was just kind of like he he kind of like his hand fell and brushed my ass And I was like, oh, yes, go man Like it would be the same thing as meeting me and you bump in the hallway. I was like adding open doors And then he grabbed my ass and he said, oh, so it's okay if I put my hand here And I was just like, fuck man. I was like, here we go. I mean I knew immediately. I was just like, oh my god here we go. Yeah, and um Uh Yeah, so and this guy was like six five 380 pounds fucking big ass fucking, uh, mexican dude No way to fight him back fight. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Fuck. No This didn't end in and when I say your home life is ranked so like again go to You don't have exactly an out Someone to ask for help. Yeah Perfect storm man. I mean this guy. Well, I know when he met me and he found out that I didn't have a father and shit like that I mean, he was probably fucking hard as a rock. I mean right when that happened and uh, so yeah, um Uh Yeah, and he was very capable too. I say he's you know, six five 380 pounds Like he was not a slob of a man like he looked like he'd throw a fucking hard punch And so but he wasn't I mean truthfully he wasn't scary and the crazy thing about this whole situation with him is that he was an extremely kind and like, um Helpful guy like I was going through a lot of shit with my mom And I wanted to kill myself a lot of times And he would like coach me through life like he and that was that was what was so fucked up about the situation was that he was so Helpful and getting me through my mom's situation But on the same side he was Uh using it to his advantage as well. Yeah, he's not and um Looking back you probably you've seen now. It wasn't actually being helpful. He was it was his tactic manipulating the situation. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, man And he was fucking good. So, um Yeah, there's a whole bunch of crazy details to this like he um, he ran a haunted house in the in his hometown at his mom's house and His hometown was like 4,000 kids and I would actually help him run this haunted house And um his big ass would be sitting at the end of the line So all the kids would go through the haunted house and he would sit out there and hand gandy to all these kids in the small town There's no there's no telling how many kids he had been raping and uh To this day there's only two victims that ever came forward about it me and my best friend who actually introduced me to the guy um Which I actually just sat down with him yesterday or a couple days ago. I had sat down with him and talked with him and um How did that go? Yeah, man. So I I'd never heard his side of the story and I thought he had just this like average like life because he was so stoic like like that guy was so He was like a big brother to me. And so um, I just always looked at him like he was like super stoic just like He just like you couldn't phase him and yeah, and so um I I wanted to know kind of I never knew about him before I met him. I never knew how he grew up I never knew about like his family his brother's his life. I thought he had a very average life uh turns out it was not the case and he had a very fucked up life and um Even the guy that he introduced me to which was my sexual abuser had already been like raping him for several years Um at this point. Yeah, really really fucked up. So um anyways To go back to it. Um, yeah, so i'm hanging out with the guy and and the touching kind of thing just escalates real quick It's like a the way I think about it and i'm trying to find the best way to say this but i think the game, are you nervous? Huh Like the game like are you nervous? He's like place your hand somewhere on the girl. Are you nervous? Yeah, are you nervous? Yeah, you see how far you can get away with it until it stops bring bringmanship. Yeah. Yeah, yep Get to the line and you stay there and then you keep going to the line until the line moves and then exactly to that line Yeah, yeah And and so every weekend like the way I kind of look at it as like if like when I was dating girls You know and he was like, I'm gonna hang out with this girl's first day Like what we how far we're gonna get on first day, you know And then second day and then third day and then fourth day and then fifth day and eventually it's like oh my god like Eventually we're gonna have sex like something like we gotta do something, you know, and so that's kind of how it felt for a long time and um Man this guy was a fucking manipulator like just he's just so So strong and so powerful with it um That I even see it on myself sometimes of like me like manipulating or doing that to people um playing mind not playing mind games, but just understanding how the mind works and understanding how to get people to Influence people, uh, I guess, you know, right? So Uh, I have to like kind of turn that off sometimes, but anyways Yeah, but so by the time I was like 12 or 13. I had every every sexual experience You can have with somebody I had had with this grown man Um, so I was scared of having HIV. I was scared of having AIDS Um, you know the first orgasm I ever had was with this old man You know, he was performing oral sex with me and one of the bodies aroused that does what it does And I'm freaking I'm laying there and boom Uh, he looks at me and he's like, did you like that? You know, did you enjoy that? And I'm sitting here like what the fuck is going on with my life man? Like I was like what the fuck man like this is really fucked up Yeah, um Yeah, so so You know the monday like I said man monday through friday. I was at home with mom Dealing with that bullshit. I was on we know we were on welfare whole lives But as I got into like 11 and 12 shit got really bad at home Where every single day there was just like 10 15 20 people coming in and out of our house smoking crack and coke I don't know what all they were doing, but they were at least doing crack and coke and um I mean I was seeing like people in my couch like playing they're like a fucking zombie like so high out of their fucking mind um That you know, they couldn't even fucking function and so and I was like young and so My bedroom at that house as well. I had hardwood floors And I had a hole in the ceiling that was like four feet wide and like two three feet deep So it was like up in the corner of my ceiling Uh, and you could see into the attic like you could see straight into the attic And there was no insulation like no protection from the elements And I slept on a mattress that was like four inches thick on the floor had a thin little blanket Pissed the bed every single night. Uh, woke up freezing cold in my piss every single night and It was fucking miserable and I wanted to die like I just wanted to die and so That guy was my only reprieve from that life, you know So on the weekends. I'd go to his house every friday night and uh, it was pizza pop and video games fucking coffee energy drinks There's a lot of awesome stuff for a kid, but you had to yeah, okay. Yep. Yep. Yup. That was your island Yep, exactly man. And it I mean it was a good time like Uh, more bed and yeah, you know good food fun stuff to get but Yeah, man. It's funny to say that because yeah, man like he would cook pizza or he we'd order pizza a lot But then he would also It's funny like these like weird things I always remember But he would make stir fry all the time and stir fry was like this It was just really good. And so we were always excited to go up there and have stir fry because At my house, we did not eat meals like that. I mean we were even literally we were taking fucking noodles egg noodles and cooking it with butter So we can get some fucking flavor on the damn things and I mean there was a kid that lived behind me who had a pretty bad too And he would come over to my house to thaw out his vienna sausages The vienna sausages that sit in the fucking cabinets not even in the freezer His house was so cold. He would bring him to mind because it was just a little bit warmer Thank you so they could thaw out What just fucking insane to think about it is dude. Yeah, so So, uh, yeah when I was 12 My mom In the midst of all this like crack and coke and shit Uh, there was a show called intervention back in the day and At the end of every episode they would say if you have a family member that needs help You can contact us at this phone number of this email And so me and my sister was right in my neighbor's house and we're watching the show and we're like, hey, well We should we should call them. Yeah, let's see if we can help out mom and as we're like concocting this plan We kind of walk outside or whatever and there's a fire in my front yard my mom's boyfriend walks out and uh, he's got blood over at the front of his shirt and Then my mom comes out and she's like throwing shit freaking the fuck out panicking or you know yelling and screaming I'm immediately hysterical crying my eyes out because I know something bad's about to happen. And so yeah, she uh, she I think she stabbed her boyfriend or something like that in the bathroom or some drugs and Okay, um, the cops show up a few minutes later. They throw her in the back of the car And i'm sitting there looking at my mom. She's in the back seat and you know the glass window is up And i'm trying to talk to her and I can't talk to her Obviously doing windows up She trying to like talk back to you. She trying to like yeah Yeah, she was saying like I'll be back. I'll get you back. Don't worry about it stuff like that And I was just freaking the fuck out because i'm like you're the only thing we have like What the fuck are we gonna do? I'm like, you know And so the cops just like take her away, man Like I don't think the cops like talk to us or anybody. They were just like, okay. Boom. She's gone Then it makes you're okay or anything. I'm sure something happened, but I don't remember like Yeah, like I think the cops are like you guys got these kids like And there's some random ass people were like sure Yeah, we're good. Yeah That's hard. So yeah, exactly. So So Yeah, so they take her away and that was like probably that's one of the worst days of my life for sure. I remember that Um pretty bad and and that that day just fucking hurt really bad. So Um Pretty crazy over the next like four months. I basically bounced around and different houses lived with different people Uh, I was still going to school at that time. It was during the winter, but you know, I was still going to school Um managing throughout all this shit. I looked I was like at school. I was like this like perfect student I was like straight a student class clown Uh gotten some fights. I got quite a bit of fights, but I was still like I was very very smart. I was really really smart when I was younger So anyways Yeah Boom my mom gets locked up. I bounce around a bunch of houses. I'm still hanging out with this guy every weekend getting getting sexually abused Uh, and then my grandparents they find me when I was about to I was about, you know, I was still 12 at the time but they they find me at this uh friend's house that I had lived in living with and um My mom had called me like a week prior to this and this is the first time I talked to my mom in like three or four months I know where the hell she was at. I know what happened to her, which is crazy. Yeah and uh, I'm talking to her on the phone and Whatever, she's like where you at like i'm gonna gonna get you and I Another really hard day in my life where I was 12 years old. I was like, I don't want to live with you anymore and Oh shit Dude, it's so crazy because like looking back on that if I had just said oh, I'm at this address Just come pick me up like I don't know where I would have went with my life like I don't know where I'd be in my life if that would have happened and um I just somehow had the courage to say like I don't want to live with you And to tell your mom that is like fucking hard What happened to you say? Yeah, well, she freaked out. Yeah, she's like fuck you like I'm gonna come and pick you up Like you're my fucking son like you're my fucking responsibility blah blah blah blah And I just was crying and crying and crying and I was just like mama like I don't want to live like that anymore and um Um, so then I guess my grandparents somehow found out and they came and picked me up uh like a week later um because they wanted to try to adopt me and So I went out to my grandparents house out in the country and they asked me like do you want us to adopt you? Yes, absolutely And uh, my sisters were there as well. My sisters actually opted to go back and live with my mom Which is fucking dumb. Um, they went back and lived. Yeah, so And uh, nothing changed. Yeah, nothing changed. Yeah, so And my mom was very manipulative as well So my mom would call my older sister and tell her that she needs to talk to my younger sister And they need to come back and live with her, you know, and I even asked them before they went back I was like why the fuck would you go back and live with mom? And they were like that's our mom like where you wouldn't understand because you're a son not a you know Just like some daughter. Yeah, not a daughter. Yeah. Yeah, whatever. I was like, yeah, well And truthfully like I chose to stay with my grandparents for not the right reasons. I was like They have nice cars They have a fucking warm house. We have food every day like we kind of looked like we got money Like this what I want like we got some nice clothes in this fucking house Those are good reasons. I mean they are they are good reasons, but at the time like that's all I cared about I cared about like the status of like I'm not this fucking poor ass kid anymore. I get what you say, you know, but but you're the side of it exactly But after like a year or two of living with them. I I was like happy to like have Family I guess it's been I've had kind of had a weird dynamic my whole life because when I lived with my mom um We were just well even after I moved out of my mom's house and I lived with my grandparents I've always been like the black sheep of the family on both sides I've been too good for my mom's my mom and my sisters like they look at me Like I'm too good for them and then on the flip side on my grandparents side. I'm like That's so-and-so son So-and-so son like be careful with his ass and you know, probably I'm a little crazy Yeah, it is a weird spot. Well, I mean you run ultra marathons, you know, so yeah yeah, so So that was like a weird dynamic of like being with my grandparents and being around like all these like Normal people who I thought were just like rich and uppity assholes. They were just normal people But I was I was always just like I was because I had already been through so much shit and so much pain in my life that like every time I looked at somebody and they smiled I'd be like fuck you man Like you're fucking happy like you fucking piece of shit You know, I'm like I just had this like fucking chip man. It was really bad That's a long time to get over It did and well and see now I use it in a positive light where When I walk into a room and I know I don't look like this like typical Fucking guy or whatever. Yeah, I'm like, yeah, fuck you like I didn't have it I didn't have a father in my life and I'm still going to kick your fucking ass Like I'm still going to do better than you at this job. I'm still going to be a better father than you I'm still going to be all these I'm still going to do everything in my life better than you Because I didn't have a father. I grew up around drugs. I grew up around violence I I went through all these horrendous things. So now I use it as a weapon Um in a positive light as opposed to like, yeah, you know, become a victim. Yeah, so Um, but yeah, so when I so when I moved with my grandparents though my I told them I was like, hey I want to hang out with my friend and They were like well, who's this and I told them and they're like, yeah, fuck. No, and uh, I was like, okay. I was like, well. Yeah I was like that kind of sucks. Um, and then, uh, lost peace in the reason. Yeah, exactly, yeah so they were like, uh My grandma knew I got molested when I was like five. I was like five or six and I got molested by a babysitter And yeah, so we and we told her about that when we were really really young and so cps tried to save us and all this bullshit didn't happen So this was like, that's why my grandma was so particularly Protective, right? Right, but then I'm like, well my best friend knows him and and I've known him for a long time now and he's not like that He's not like that, right? So this fucking they're like well, we want to meet him So this fucking douchebag shows up to the house Like pulls up like it's the first date like taking me out the prom night, you know, he's got his You know, he dresses up. Well, it doesn't really dress up, but he's got his his best Five x l red t shirt on Yeah, and his his best cleanest sweatpants that he always fucking wore And um, yeah, yeah, he uh, he looks like the fucking standard fucking child rapist. That's my god Yeah, he even had like the fucking You know, like the jeffrey dommer fucking like glass. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, bro. Yeah, exactly Yes, like, yeah, I make some stufro. Yeah, exactly And uh So, yeah, so uh, I know so he shows up and um He gets up That relaxed long got me. Um, yeah Uh So yeah, he shows up and and boom like my grandparent so he makes my grandparents laugh and they're like, uh, okay So boom, this guy's part of the family now, right and and right over time Yeah, man. And so I mean I go up to this fucking guy's house and keep hanging out and and that's when he would He like right after that. It was like maybe a few months after that is when the first time he he raped me and um It sounds bad and it is bad But it wasn't like this like brutal like rape session. Um Uh, I always like make these I I like to tell the story this way because it it It helps people understand that these people who do this Are not These violent people Right, they're they really don't they don't come off as violent. They don't so So like uh, one thing he would always do is he would always trim his nails because he had this motherfucker has a big ass Hands and he has some big fucking rough knuckles big long finger nails So he would always like trim one or two of his nails so he could use his fingers And without a hurting his bad, right? Um, which is just so gentleman like of him, you know, real fucking chivalry or whatever chivalrous and uh So the you know, and he always had this like jar of Vaseline next to his bed and If there's one thing that fucking like gives me a little bit of a fucking chill at my spine It's probably thinking about Vaseline. Oh man. I made that Vaseline ultra marathon joke Yeah, that's all right. Um, no, that's not good. I don't give a fuck. Um But I open a or so whenever he would open up that Vaseline jar like I could just see the scoop Like the finger scoops, you know, right and that just like fucks with me even like looking at peanut butter. I'm just like So anyways, um, I could imagine man. Yeah, so But I had always looked at that jar Vaseline like motherfucker like one day. This is gonna happen to me, you know And sure shit man. I was like 13 and uh, yeah, man, you know, it finally happened. He You know, I remember being there naked on his bed and he he was uh Holding me there. I remember his big ass hands on my hips and and he did what he had to do And uh when he was done, I went well he cleaned me up with a towel like like I always say like a gentleman And I I go to the bathroom and I'm sitting there on his toilet getting the rest of the shit out of my body And at that point I'd hit like a all-time low like I was like my fucking life is over. I Certainly have some sort of disease Um people if anybody finds out they're gonna think I'm just fucking raging. Yeah fucking gay dude and they're gonna You know, it was and plus when you're young and you're going to school like oh my god, man fucking right so many finds out that everybody knows is what's going on even though they have no clue because you're so self-conscious Yeah, man, and it's just it's fucked up. So um So yeah, that happened and then uh One of the crazy things I actually just remembered the other day Was this guy had actually bought me a I've never told me by this before Um because I forgot about it, but this guy had bought me a uh like a leopard thong And when I was like 12 or 13 or 14 or whatever he would like make me wear it around his fucking little studio apartment which is Like fucking weird as fuck, you know, yeah And uh, I remember that now like I I forgot about it and then like it just like popped up and I was like oh my god I like fucking completely forgot about that Um, but super super weird. Yeah, and uh, so To to wrap hold that whole part of my life up when I was 15. I was about to be 16 I was a month away from being 16 Been up at this guy's house pretty much every single weekend. I had been to his family's events I knew all of his sisters. I knew his sister's kids. I knew his mom um, I never think it was weird that he is That age and his friends or the adolescence and yeah I don't fucking know. Um, maybe they do and just didn't say anything Yeah, I don't know man. Um, I don't know You know hit so when he first met my older friend He was still living with his mom and he lived in his mom's attic and he was raping my friend and his mom's attic While his sister also lived there so they both saw his little kid just hanging out with this old older guy Up in the air. Yeah, did they probably have some sort of idea or new and just didn't care I don't fucking know man. I'm gonna speak out. Yeah Yeah, I don't know, but it's fucked up and I'll kind of get into his family a little bit more But I mean I would go to like all of his family outing so and I would go to like Christmases thanks givings And his sister he is like three sisters And they're married have kids And uh, I just was like I never thought about it then but at the time now, I'm like What the fuck man like if my brother showed up to christmas with a fucking eight year old boy or yeah, I'm like Uh, who the fuck is this? Oh, I just I just started hanging out with him I'm calling the fucking cops and I'm calling his parents like somebody needs to put their fucking foot down So if anybody's listening to this and you see some weird shit put your fucking foot down because This shit is so fucking common. It is fucking absurd So what what is going through your head when you're hanging out at christmas with this guy's family and It's just almost just like nightmare and then like normal life, you know, and like what is going through your head It's a lot like being an undercover cop because When you're out there you're undercover, right? You're just you're just living this normal life And then when you go back to his apartment, you know now you're back to your other life or whatever, you know, so you It's almost like having multiple personalities. Um, you're just so you're just conditioned to it and It wasn't a big deal like it. I was fine. He was such a nice guy. He was we had so much fun together and he was a really smart like good conversation um that he did just um, yeah, I was just like I was like, yeah, whatever. It's like, you know, it is what it is. So we'd go to his outings and um I was just like part of the family. I was just like a family friend You know, and um, that was it. What did he do professionally? Oh, um He uh, he worked at pizza hut and then he worked at a factory. So yeah, that's what the pizza can't saw the pizza. Yeah. Yeah Pizza the hut It's freaking pretty Yeah There's some joke in there about I don't know butts and huts. I don't know boys, but some probably Somewhere in there. I'm trying something something funny. Yeah, there we go Yeah, so anyways, uh, yeah, there's my that's my trauma guys. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it We're just going to fucking sit here and and laugh through it and make jokes. Yeah, I don't give a fuck really um Uh, but anyways, uh, so boom we freaking Um Yeah, we uh, so yeah, so so Get to get through it all when I was 15. I was almost 16 I was up there at his house playing a video game and I had a younger friend that was with me I was hanging out with us and This was the first time that I had ever seen my younger friend go back to the guy's bed And this guy lived in like a studio a studio like apartment like one big ass room Back left corner had some curtains that were like hanging from the ceiling to make off his bed so like when I was up there getting molested and then I have friends over two like even Just like one or two other people. Uh, I'd be back there like 10 feet away Was a friend from video games or yeah, and I'm back here getting fucking fucking abused by this guy. So um Uh, at this point I had already been Probably close to like 300 400 times Um based on my my math that I that I have come up with Um over the course of five years. Yeah. Yeah, it is Uh, it was like a full-blown like teenage relationship like like if I would imagine a 15 year old like how many times he or a 16 year old Is relating with a woman of his age You know because you only get the weekends, you know, so right that's kind of how it was so right um My friend had gone back to his bed and I'm playing the video game and I'm thinking I'm sitting here thinking of myself Because this kid's like two years younger than me and I'm like fuck that man. I'm not letting this shit happen. So I hit up my other buddy who introduced me to the guy on the game and I said hey like can you come over in my house tomorrow? Boom. Yep. All right. Cool. So The guy comes out of his room right as that happens and it was really weird that he did this And he walked right up to the game and I was but we played war of warcraft. That's what we played Okay, and so in war of warcraft, there's like a little chat box You can scroll up and down, you know And so when he came out I've scrolled up in the chat to like high try to hide that I had sent my friend a message Because I knew that if he saw it, he would know something was up because he's he's smart And uh, I think he did see it because the whole like mood shifted that night. I thought he's gonna kill me I thought he's gonna kill both of us. I was fucking terrified the whole night. Yeah, I was happy It was fucking bad. So he just got quiet and he just kind of got like very just He just got very quiet. And so I was always kind of like watching him kind of like Knowing if I needed to get to the door and so yeah, he uh he We survive the night whatever he doesn't kill us thank god and we freaking Get home the next day He drops me off first and he goes to take my other friend home And when he drops me off, um My buddy who I had hit up on the game the night prior shows up like an hour later, right? And that's kind of hard to follow without me using names and I apologize but um My my older friend shows up and we're walking around my house and we're kind of bullshitting and then we get to my bedroom And i'm pacing back and forth and i'm just like hey man I've been wanting to tell you this for a long time like I don't I don't really know how to say this and blah blah blah And I couldn't say the words and I couldn't do it And um, my friend just goes he touched you didn't he And I fell apart start crying lay on the floor. I'm like fucking about to die like just sweating crying profusely Yeah And uh, the next thing he says to me after like 10 seconds is like what he did it to me too And like, you know, I don't know if you've got a brother or if you have a dad in your life But like if you just imagine that happening to them Because like your older brothers like your fucking hero, you know or like your your best friend is like your fucking hero And there's no way that shit could ever happen to him, right? And that's how you feel and so when he said that I was I like turned and looked at him and i'm like what the fuck man, yeah, and um I couldn't believe it, you know, I thought I was the only person in the world and turns out he did too He thought it's crazy that you guys were You know that close and like it just never came up. You know what I mean? That's what like just the trauma what it's doing to you, you know the signal you definitely had like I don't know like he had like a plan because Definitely your friend was a couple years older than you and the sicko's probably like well He's getting older. He's not my type anymore So then your friend brings you around you are the age that he's into And then you just said you had another friend who's younger than you that you're bringing around So like without even knowing it like you just repeating the cycle And who's like there's probably the friend before your older friend right like right? And once they got to like we'll probably like 15 ish He's around done with that. I need another 10, you know Yeah, so Well, I think what happens is Once you get to like 16 17 18 You really want to go out and hang out because you get your license You were getting ready to go to college Like that that's that's what gets him away. And that's what happened to my friend. He was he got his license He didn't need a he didn't need anybody to drive him around anymore Um, he had a job. So he didn't need somebody to like buy him shit on the weekends And then he also was going to college. So when he went to college It was like he never hung out with us anymore and I always wanted that too I was always like why the fuck is he not hanging out with us? You know, I'm like he's like 20 minutes away. You know, I was always so confused Um, he ain't going back there. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so Um, so when he said that Um, he's like, well, what do you want to do? Do you want to report him or do you want to keep it a secret? And I was like fuck that guy. I was like we're got to get his ass And so Yeah, we go tell my grandparents and um, my grandma as you can imagine is fucking destroyed because Do they let that man into your life? She had she had a yeah, she tried to do something and then he earned her trust and she probably yeah Yeah, so yourself. Yeah, so yeah, she was fucked up plus plus This is the second time that has happened to me now and so Um, yeah, she was pretty tore up. So we called 9-1 We go down to the hospital and we get there. We start to do all the the rape kit process And it's kind of cool. They the nurses I remember that I always remember this so well The nurses were kind of like Well, when was the last time This happened and I said well just happened this weekend, you know And they're like, okay You know, they're like, have you taken a shower or something like that? And I was like, no, I haven't showered and I got all my clothes on because they were wondering how they were going to find the dna Like where where are the clothes at that you wore this weekend? Because I said I've still got a morn right now and I knew Even at just 15 years old I knew to not take a shower to not change my clothes none of that shit And so they took my underwear. They took all my clothes. They swab me and they found his dna in multiple places and um Um So It's kind of crazy to cop that walked in that day. I have an interview with him. It's on youtube Um, it's on my youtube channel Uh, but I found him 13 years after the fact just a couple months ago And I haven't talked to him since you know since that day and when I when I hit him up I was like, hey, like Do you remember me? Do you remember me? He's like, fuck yeah, I remember you. I was like, holy shit Like I was so scared to talk to this guy because I like I didn't know I don't know how cops handled that stuff like if there's like Trickers in him, you know Um, and so I was like kind of scared. I didn't want to yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so I didn't want to bring it up But I I wanted to reach out to him to hear his side of the story because After it all was over with I never heard anything like what happened. So um anyways, I so that whole interview is up on youtube so I won't I won't get into all that you can go in there and watch that but Um, what's crazy is when he walked in. I noticed his name And he had the same name as my teacher who I had like a few years prior So it's like coincidentally This lady who was my teacher about the time that I started getting molested was his wife You know, so it's just like this like super weird thing. Yeah, man. So So when he walked in I was like, oh Like couples like I know that name And so we immediately he talks about it in the interview. We immediately have like a commonality like a bond and And um So he handles this case really well and what's so impressive is that it was his first ever Sexual assault case in 12 year. He'd been on the road for 12 years. This is his first sexual assault case So he was nervous, but he freaking knocks it out the park. He gets he gets the guy to admit to it Um Like not in not in custody. So it's um, you know, a really big deal and um He goes into the whole story about how he gets him down to the station and everything willingly, which is fucking crazy. Um Yeah, I guess got to go down there and I bet that usually people who Are that way they tend to think they're really really smart Yeah, so actually a lot of a lot of sexual predators Or like murderers. They think they're smarter than the cops So yeah, I'll willingly go there because I will prove my innocence easily. Yeah, and they don't realize that they're actually really stupid Yeah, they're they got got so Yeah Yeah, and well, so they they almost did lose him for a second. He was saying in the interview Um You know, and then so the cop comes in and kind of like busts his balls a little bit and so he finally admits it Um, but he only admits to a couple of like small things like nothing serious um and so whatever they arrest him and um Like a month later he goes to trial or whatever does his thing uh, he gets sentenced to 10 years in prison for uh Having almost 10 years of pleasure with at least two little boys And uh, so that's a real fun. Yeah, man. Yeah, so I'm I'm like I'm in the process of looking and navigating changing some of this shit Um, as I tell my story because it's really fucked up Well, what it's done to me what it's done to my friend Um, and what it'll continue to do to other people. You know, there's so many there's so many of these stories out there They're just fucking fucked up. Definitely so that and people don't get enough. He's out now. He's free He would be uh, he died. He died in prison. Yeah, yeah, he died and he uh in 2019. I was in afghanistan he he applied for parole or whatever made a request for parole and um He uh, he you get was denied and then he died like two butts later I didn't feel Learning that he was dead I didn't really give a fuck. I mean, I I didn't really care like I I just When it happened, so I'll go back to like when I reported him People asked me like what did you do? Well, I did I never got any therapy I never saw any doctors I never I never like had this like formal healing process I just like woke up the next day like well, fuck. I ain't got no plans this weekend So I was like, all right. I don't know what the fuck I'm gonna do. So I guess I'm just gonna play video games by myself And um, that was like the extent of the impact that I had on me at the time. Um No, I just ended I just ended. Yeah. Yeah, it wasn't a big deal to me and um My now my friend who's older at this whole time He's been fucked up like he's been worried that this guy's gonna get out and kill him Get out looking up and kill him, you know, because you can find anybody on facebook or whatever and it's just you know So he's been worried about those things. So when he died that that offered my friend a lot of reprieve and like released of stress He's still fucked up, but um For me The last like few years. I've really gone through like a healing kind of journey and it's been very helpful Especially the last like six months to a year. He's been very helpful, but um Yeah, when he died, I I didn't really care. I wasn't seeking like any kind of crazy vengeance um if you'd have gotten out I don't know how I feel about that. You know, I Yeah, I don't know how I feel about that thinking about it now. Um, but You know any status? Hey, man. I'm not gonna say anything. It's gonna like put me on a watch list, but Now is that uh Is that like famous picture or I think it's a video but there's a picture that comes from it of the For the father who just like oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah last that guys He's like walking out of his life. I wish I can remember his name. He wrote a book It's called um, like what's it? What is this dad's name? I can't why like mark or something the book's called why mark. Why? It was with the other guy yelled when he shot and killed him, but yeah, hell yeah, man Didn't uh, I'm pretty sure that the judge Like was this all he thought was good unity service. Yeah, it was like oh wow Yeah, I want to say maybe let me just look it up. Yeah. Yeah, see you find that's pretty cool. Keep talking Yeah, yeah, there was um remember the judge was all like Yeah, I get it like it. Yeah Yeah, gary plow shay Yeah, gary plow shay. Let me see I look at the sentence real quick here I see seven years suspended seven years suspended since five years probation 300 hours community service which he completed in 1989 So yeah Yeah, this is five years of probation Do you guys know about Clark Fredericks? Have you ever heard of him? Mm-hmm. I don't do fucking crazy story. Who is that? Uh, so You guys ought to look him up, but he's he's got a fucking wild-ass story But basically he he was he was raped by his by a priest Police chief and like boy scout leader like this guy was like the the fucking triple crown I was like the same person, but this is yeah, he all these things. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I don't think he might not have been a priest I think he was but he was certainly the police chief sort of aldermen or something maybe yeah Yeah, he was like in the police force and uh boy scout leader as well, but he was he had raped this dude and um Yeah, and uh, so Clark like 30 years later goes back and and fucking murders the guy in his house stabs as a death cuts his throat like fucking hardcore and um I say this and Clark will talk about it now where like it you know people say it all the time to him Like did that help you and he's like no it didn't fucking help it sent his life down a fucking even worst path and what it was Because he ended up going to prison, but when he went to prison Um, he only got I think he got five years. So he got like the bare minimum sentence, uh, right compared to a life sentence But he he has a whole story about it It's fucking insane his cousin experience. I wonder what his prison experience was like You know when people learn like why he was in there. Do you ever say that to you just out of curiosity like Yeah, what did he say a lot? Yeah, he talks about a lot. He talks about he He joined like AA groups in there or something like that But he was talking to a lot of guys about healing and trauma and things like that and and overcoming these things and um He got out of prison Uh, and now he's like a fucking motivational speaker. He's he actually just started a podcast and i'll be up on it I'll be on his podcast here in next month. It's awesome Yeah, but I it's all his stories. So I reached out to him and I was just like, hey, man like You know, I do you do you know anybody that could have kind of helped me get my story out because I've been talking to you guys, you know for an hour and 20 minutes or whatever And um, I mean words is like just like barely touched the surface, you know, I kind of like high level covered everything but if If I get into the real details of everything, I mean, it's fucking dark and it's twisted and it's but i'm a very good storyteller to I think anyways at the same time. So Very willing to get into all those details like I have no qualms about if you have no qualms about. Yeah Yeah, so um, but anyways, yeah, so clock fredrix is another great guy to look up and another awesome story. Um Found his looks like Yeah, um, that guy's fucking hardcore man that guy. Holy shit. So um anyways, uh Yeah, so so I didn't really have a big impact like I never never got any therapy nothing like that and then I I Whatever man like I moved on with my life and uh, um Everything kind of came back and hit me when I was 21 22 23 something like that getting out of the army I watched the archaeli documentary and when I was watching that um They talk archaeli kind of talks about like when he was young when he was like 10 11 12 or whatever He was having sex with all these grown women And so by the time he was like 18 or 19 or 20, however the fuck all he was He was doing the same shit that was happening to him to younger girls and and whatever once again, not defending the guy but um He he was not in the right place, you know, and and like he didn't have the right people around him and he got into that warped Yeah, man. I mean it fucks you up, dude I mean I can't say that I wouldn't have done the same thing if I was in his shoes you're a fucking millionaire and you've been having sex with women your whole life like since you were like 10 and It's crazy. You know, it's just it's really it's a really unfortunate situation for him and for the girls like that that he did everything he did to it's unfortunate on both sides and um Uh, but anyways when I watched that documentary that brought back a lot of like memories And it brought it made me realize like why I was the way I was Um, like for example, if my wife, uh wants to be intimate and she is like touching me, right? Um, and I just don't feel like because I'm tired or whatever But then she keeps like touching or she pulls my shoulder And I'm like it takes me back to like this old man. Damn. Come on You know, like come on man. Like come on. Like just just you know, so that it fucks me up and um You know or if my wife grabs my ass like I just I can't I we don't do that no more But she used to do it, you know, jokingly and I you know, we don't do that shit and like so So it's just like that that'll like fuck you up and And but it the mental things that it does to you. It's just really bad. It just you know, you have a short temper and and uh You know, like I said, I had walked around my whole life looking at people that would smile and I'd be like Like what are you so fucking happy about you fucking piece of shit? Like fucking bro Just so anger inside you. Yeah Um So yeah, so when I saw that documentary that's that kind of sent me down a bad path I was as close to killing myself as I'd ever been And uh, I mean I really wanted to die and then I got out of the army and everything kind of went away All the stress kind of went away And uh, I got into construction work for the third largest home builder in america and um I uh I got when I when I was about I was there for about a month And I told there was a guy who won the construction manager the year for two years in a row And I I sent him a text and I said hey man. I said I'm Uh, he got promoted and he became my boss And I said hey man, I'm glad you got promoted because I was coming for your spot And I've never fucking worked in construction in my life like I don't fucking know shit about nothing Yeah, but and uh, but I told him that and I kind of like figured out the game kind of quick in the residential building world And um, so within like three months of being there. I was number one on a leaderboard in the division Uh, which is like all these like major metrics. They track them and then boom. That's how they put it. Who's number one, you know And there's like 40 or 50 of us So for the first time in my life I had seen my name at the top of something and it was also in a leaderboard that everybody else had to look at every fucking week So I was like, I was like let's fucking go. I was like, yeah, you know Look at mine Exactly dude. I mean dude. It was such a big deal to me man I mean just to see my name on top of all these other names And like I said, the reason why it's such a big deal is because all these motherfuckers had mom and dad They got grandma and grandpa to help them. They got x y z Like I don't fucking yeah, man. It's just a fucking man. I loved it. So We get through the first year And uh, I was the construction manager of the year for the first year I was like number 13 in the country out of over a thousand construction managers Um the following year within three months. I was number one on the leaderboard an entire company um nationwide And uh, I held that spot for like six months And then I moved on to a different company like a dumbass I was at the top of the I was at the top of the food chain and then I left like I don't I was fucking emotional with challenge Yeah, that's Unfortunately, see that's that's the unfortunate part about like the way I grew up and then what the army does to you too Because they call it like a pcs Something yeah where permagenation when you get out of it Yeah, when you when you get out of the when you get out of the army You're so used to moving around every two or three years that like when you're in a job for two or three years You're like I gotta go, you know, so yeah I feel you man because I grew up as a military brat and then I joined the military. So like I have literally Yeah, you know, just my whole life. Yep every couple years going up So you leaving every champion used to be a contender and you you just liked Contending and you're at the top and you like I gotta go be in contender somewhere else Dude, that's that's that's really kind of how it was and when I left there I went to another home builder and um, they had been trying to recruit me for a while um and I left that company because they were fucking fucked up sideways and um Yeah, like I had my the guy who was supposed to train me told me to get the fuck out of his house one day or whatever at work and I was just like I will beat your fucking ass. So How'd they go? Well, yeah, yeah, he well the guy who was supposed to train me um, like I said, I was in one of his houses and he told me to get the fuck out one morning and so as an adult, um I won't really fight anybody because it's not worth it. Yeah Despite being able to probably whoop most people. Well, I'm not gonna say that I probably can't whoop most people's asses, but it's just not worth the fucking fight Especially your kids and yeah, man. I'm just gonna shoot you anyways like and then we're both you know, like, yeah Indian itself, you know, I've said this so it's my My younger brother Calvin always be like, why are you so hostile sometimes Zach? And it's like well, I'm not gonna fight anyone. I'm just gonna shoot him. Like I'm not yeah, I'm not here to fight you Just gonna end this immediately Yeah, I've thought about that where like if somebody presses me outside of a gas station or something like that I'm just gonna lay down and let them kick me in the face like three times to make it look like my life was in danger Yeah, yeah, then I'm gonna put like Anything too is if I ever actually dig it to like into a fight. I'm not like playing fair I'm gouching. I'm gouching immediately. Oh, yeah. Zach is like 29 Yeah, so I'm twist. I'm twisting dicks. But I like that one guy's like grab a stick I'm doing it. Oh, this is absolutely Yeah, that's the first fucking Yeah, yeah, yeah 100 percent. Actually, I have thought about it where everybody walks this Actually like fight you. I just We're done. It's over. I always tell everybody like If somebody walks into like a place to shoot the place up I'm just gonna pull my gun out and shoot myself just to like just to throw it throw it off. Yeah, definitely What the fuck have they got? Yeah, the shooter stops like You took all of his fun from him. I guess you know what I mean? Yeah, exactly. Oh shit Right Yeah, I'm not gonna let you kill me you fucking if I'm gonna die I'm going up on my own terms, all right So like forever everybody's like I don't know what happened this guy walked in and opened fire and then this other guy killed himself like Who's had a plan that they know each other? Yeah, it's gonna be one of those tiktoks for with fucking. Yeah, everybody's like What was the move? Yeah Yeah but uh Yeah, no, so anyways Yeah, so I I I did very well in construction when I first got in and that was really cool. I got I got an award from the National Association of Home Builders and the Home Builders Institute went out to Las Vegas for that and Once again, I got to get on this stage and like talked to a bunch of fucking millionaires And they gave me this award and nobody knows what the fuck this award is and like it doesn't really mean anything probably I don't know but it meant a lot to me and I had told that when I was on the stage. I was like once again You know this shit means a lot to me because you and the fuckers have no idea what I've been through Uh to be here and statistically speaking It's just insane the Yeah, but when you grow up without a father you're already at risk for a bunch of shit Um Then you uh you live in poverty that you're that's another one then you get sexually abused then you're automatically statistic for xyz drug addict all this other shit Um, you know, then you become a combat veteran. Well now you're Likely to do whatever right more layers. Yeah, so Um, it's been really cool man and and I won that award and went out there and bought out in vegas for a few days and that was pretty cool and then uh Since then I'm I'm still in construction. I work. I like an office job now for commercial companies pretty cool um And I've spent a lot of time helping veterans out Trying to help veterans get good jobs and helping them with their resumes and shit like that. Um Yeah, so um And then uh in the last like six months. I've kind of picked up on writing my book My book should be done like I said like later on this year And I've kind of kicked off my speaking career and I'm more serious manor and uh Yeah, man. So I've got a crazy passion like I've I'm very passionate about what I do what I say and and the things that I've been through And uh like I think I said it earlier on here is that when I do speak The fucking room is like dead-ass silent and it's it's a it's a testament to My presence but also my ability to capture the audience and uh, you know to get people to um Listen and and and and have that command of the room, you know, so it's pretty cool I have a I have a question kind of like about your contention, right? So I did not have the same experience you did growing up, you know, I had my dad was in the military Deployed a lot, you know, so I mean like had some You know, my mom was a single mom for a while, but nothing crazy, you know, so um, but anyway I have for a long time had that sort of same feeling. We're like if I'm gonna do this I have to be the best at it. I have to win I will do what I normally do like I do way more than everybody is going to do because I just know that they Even I think you know, you can you've all worked professionally for a while, you know the people that just actually do their job typically stand head and shoulders above a lot of other people because Just doing the bare minimum is almost more than most they're willing to do in the first place. You know what I mean but I have sort of realized that as I was nearing the end of my time in the military because I did so I did 15 years that All of this shit I was doing to win awards and you know Trying to compete with other people that I was really just throwing things into a hole and trying to feel like This void essentially to validate myself. Okay, and I got my own reasons for it but like Do you ever feel like that is kind of what you're doing or is there a certain you know, is there something else? You know what I mean? Yes, certainly I've definitely had those feelings where like um, even when I kind of came out about my story and I'll be honest with you like when I first started posting about this shit I Was like man and I told my wife because my wife is gonna help with me because I'm not very social media savvy So I've got I've got to figure it out now. I'm pretty fucking good. But anyways, she was helping me and and yeah, so At first when we first started posting some shit. I was like, this is kind of clickbaity like this is kind of like I don't know if this is answering a question or not, but I was When I won my awards and things like that those things feel really good but nobody really gives a fuck and So I was like yeah and I don't really care about it either. I mean, they're important to me But nobody really gives a fuck. It's the same thing being an army like you can start 20 fucking years 30 years like nobody really cares and People say they care about the soldiers and all this shit. It's like dude you say that and then like tomorrow you're gonna wake up You're gonna get your fucking coffee. You're not gonna think twice about anything Um, it's it's really but and I don't blame them for it. It's really hard to have that compassion For something if you've never ready. Yeah for yeah, if you've never been a part of it if you've never I think I have a very unique Compassion for people because of what I've been through that I'm I just I just want to see people be happy and like when I see somebody who's sad I think it's cool to make them happy. So the answer question about you know Throwing things in a hole even when I kind of first sort of write in my book And I first kind of came out with my story because I've always told my story But I've never told the sexual abuse part of it because that's always been just a very shameful part, right? So I just I mean I just brought that to the light three weeks ago four weeks ago and yeah, so Um, I've had a lot of people reach out to me and tell me that I've helped them that they're getting therapy or that they knew this or Or they know somebody But they always revert back to like we had no idea that you were going through that and we feel so bad for you And we know we feel sorry for you and all this stuff. Um so But when I first started writing my book and all this I'm like nobody's gonna read this shit Like nobody gives a fuck like if I write this book like it's not gonna make a difference Um, but what I have found that helps me is just if I'm helping other people Uh, if what I'm doing is inspiring somebody else to do something or making them feel better That is fucking helpful. Like when I went and spoke to those these kids last week I had like five or six kids walk up to me like crying afterwards like hugging me like They had been through the same shit or they knew their friends were going through it and they didn't know what to do Or xyz and so, um You know, I could see myself. I mean one of the kids made me cry. I was like god. Damn it, dude Um, what happened like just what he had to say about like what was going on actually it's the he didn't he couldn't talk That's what made me cry. Um Because I know what that feels like Um, I could see the tears in his eyes and if he would have started talking he would have just broken down You know So he he was standing there like nice and tall And this is kind of what you do sometimes Because when you're trying not to cry you sometimes you'll stiffen up, you know Yeah, and then you you know, you're just like nope because as soon as you Come down. It's like a it's like a bodily natural thing as soon as you come down And you relax like yeah, yeah those emotions start flowing right squeezing the rag and the water. Yeah. Yeah, man Yeah, and so he was standing there like nice and tall and I could see the tears in his eyes And he said hey, thank you And I said hey, man. No problem, brother, you know, and he's like thank you, sir And I said hey, it's so good man. He said and all you could say was thank you, sir He kept saying it and I was like you good dog and like kind of kind of and you know I think I was just so personable when I come when I come to these kids Like I don't ever try to be like somebody that I'm not and so I like I dapped him up Gave him a hug and I was like you good dog And um, and then I was like you're gonna make me cry, bro And I did man. I freaking had to like clear my eyes because uh I could see myself in him and I and it was so Impressive that He wasn't crying, you know, he was fighting back those feelings and I don't know if the impressive is the right word, but he was fighting back those feelings uh those of those emotions and You know, I just I felt fucking bad for the kid because I could see He he kind of disclosed a couple things to me nothing too crazy But I could see myself in him and I know what I knew what it was like to be that age And that's what I told the kids when I went in there and I spoke to them. I told those kids Um when I was your age people come and talk to me too But nobody had been through what I've been through, you know Like you like these people that would come and talk to me would tell me If we pray about it everything will go away. Yeah, um And it's like look man like you motherfuckers must not have ever had a fucking bad day in your life Because this shit ain't fucking working And uh, you know, I go home every fucking night and I try this shit and it don't fucking work So so that's why I told the kids, you know, I didn't tell that part, but I did tell him that Um I come from where you come from, you know, yeah, if you come from where I come from I'm talking to you today If you don't I'm still talking to your ass because you need to help these the fucking kids And that's why I said that kid who is being quiet because it it resonates with what you told earlier when you finally like talk to your Your uh, yeah your older friend. You couldn't say the words. You were just quiet and he had to say it for you That kid is probably in the same spot couldn't say it and he was has exactly right for him That that's why that's what that's exactly right. That's why I was like so like ah shit, man So, you know, but that that's so to answer your question about kind of you feel like you're throwing filling up a void or whatever I've had a few people reach out. Well, I've had I've had a ton of them now But everybody always says this and it's kind of cliche, but it's so true if it's just one or two people that you help out Dude, that's good enough man. That's one or two lives that you saved Or that you might have changed and I don't know man in 10 years from now 15 years from now One of these fucking kids might reach out to me and be like, hey, man. You changed my fucking life that day. Yeah, or you know That's definitely No, I mean like in and the helping people aspect is is definitely going to give you that sense of um I don't know Accomplishment doesn't feel like the right word, but I think you know what I'm trying to say but like yeah I think I just realized that all of these things that I was doing Since the purpose for sure, but all these things that I was doing I was throwing them into a hole. They weren't making me feel better. Like I didn't I won something or I did something good I didn't feel good about myself afterwards. There was nothing like and so it was almost like okay Well, now I'm gonna do this and I'll feel good after it and it didn't work right and so like I think that Doing it for self validation because I had You know all these things going on my head telling me I'm not good enough And if I just do this then I'll feel good enough if I just do this I'll feel good enough But whereas you know now you're what you're doing in helping people I think that's part of what we as humans have to figure out is For this journey, right is helping people is where that Um since the purpose like you said Zach comes from and it's not doing all this shit It's not you're not you know seeking out self validation It is throwing things into a void and helping out other people like what you're doing You know and I and I realized you know I guess near the end of my career that none of this this shit I'm doing is making me feel any better and I should just focus on the people in my small circle more than anything And I don't mean like people at work. I met like my family You know what I mean? And I was little is where that that purpose comes from. Sorry. Is that good? No, you're fine when I was little Um and I'd be like real frustrated or angry or whatever my dad would always tell me go help someone it'll make you feel better Yeah, it would Yeah, I'm like going brother. What are you doing? We can help with or I you know I'm moving along for my dad or I just do some small task to help someone And I was a kid so I can't like do a lot. I guess at that time, but It always makes me feel better and it's something I still do to this day So I think like brain you're talking about like You're always like chasing this new thing or getting that award trying to fill that void, but um You didn't realize that Those awards that you were chasing or the stuff you're doing to fill the void was probably still helping people around you Like I know like when you and I were deployed There's a ton of airmen there who are so much better off you being there Than if you weren't there and when you left because you know, you're forced to leave It definitely changed like there was a lot of people who are affected by it. So I know you were thinking you're just trying to fill a void and you got to focus on that But there's a lot of people who are very thankful for having you around and having them You being there taking care of them, so Why don't you know what to say to that uh that you know Yeah, it feels good, you know, yeah, but it's just Anyway, you know, I I felt like I recognized, you know that in You Seth like you were saying like you're doing all this stuff and like That the sense of accomplishment I got from it was a very superficial level and it was always outward It was never an inward reflection of like how I actually felt, you know what I mean? So Yeah, you know, I I guess now I'll listen to you kind of reiterate it Yeah, for me it's probably a lot different for me because of not ever having anything. So I just anytime I went like like when I wake up I win like I I just that's just I want like I just That's how I feel Yeah, like I just You know, like I I don't know man. It's weird like I just everything that comes to me in my life um Especially the things that I know I really worked hard for I always feel really good about them. I know that that's not like the buck doesn't stop there Like I know that definitely you have to keep going And I always keep myself in that mindset, but when I get a win I'm freaking dude. I'm like ready to go like i'm fired up and And you definitely have your low points where you're just like like oh, this is not working or um, you know, I don't know if you guys know who Nick labor he is, but Um, so I went watching yeah, I went watching speak up a few weeks ago And I got to talk to him afterwards and he got to got he signed my he signed my book and well He signed his book for me. Right. Um, and I got to yeah I got to talk to him for a few minutes and it's funny. I've told the story on several podcasts now, but I'll tell it again when I when I got to talk to him I I told him I was like, hey, man. I'm about to kick off my speaking career and I'm writing a book right now like Do you have any advice? Like what can I do? And um, he was like uh He kind of looks at me for a second and I think he was about to give me like the typical like oh, that's awesome. Yeah, yeah But he was like it's fucking hard, man. He's like, I'm going to tell you right now. It's a fucking grind and I was just like Let's fucking go. I was like dude. I was like, I'm fucking and that's my back to be the contender. Dude. Yeah, because i'm a champion Bro, like what he's because it he wasn't doubting me. I don't think at all, but he was just keeping it real Right. He was just like it's fucking hard. Like if you want to do it, it's hard And and I was just like because so when you say that There is a chance that it, you know, could not happen or there's like a there's a struggle to be taken, right? There's a fight. There's a fucking battle and so When I see that I'm like, let's go man. Like I want even if I lose I want to get in there and fucking fight because it's about the man in the arena, you know Love it when you when you walk when you make that walk into the arena Everybody is going to be chirping everybody's saying You know, you're not ready or they're going to kick your ass or you're going to fail And I even just heard this the other day um Especially when you start something new like i'm writing a book i just built my website last night or today actually um And it's not popular. My youtube channel has a thousand views so Everybody who's out there who's looking at my youtube saying this shit sucks Well, they're right And they're going to be right for the next three months And they're going to be right for the next six months and they're probably going to be right for the next fucking year Or two years or three years, right and they're always going to be right that that i'm not I'm not popular enough. I'm not famous enough. I'm not I'm not selling enough books. I'm not getting enough views. I'm not getting enough clicks And the hardest part about being successful is that the doubters They only have to say at one time and they're right for a long fucking time. They can say You're never going to be you're never going to be successful. You're never going to be famous You're never going to make money off of this and they're going to be right for like I said a year two years five years And then one day they're wrong. Yep, right and then they're never to be fucking heard of again and so It's just like that man of their arena kind of mentality. It's like Get out there and getting that motherfucker and fight and and deal with the consequences But i'll be damned if i'm going to sit in the fucking sidelines and watch somebody else go out there every day and fight And lose and fucking or eventually win and i'm sitting over here Talking about what fucking shoes he should have wore, you know, like absolutely man That fucking mentality of watching somebody do something and thinking to yourself like I can do this. I can do it better You know, I know I resonate with that completely And you know this this and work by no means a big podcast at all, you know, but like This is a grind every fucking day. It literally is a grind. There's always something to do to keep it moving It's not what I thought it was and i've learned a lot along the way You know zach and i have been doing this for over a year now And uh, you know, it's just The way it's morphed in my effort level and what I know I have to do and like getting better Because if you scroll all the way back, you know, I mean the shit i was posting like some of our early episodes Like what is this janky ass shit? You know what I mean? And it is janky as fuck and I hate like when someone asks, you know, and I make a reference like all this one conversation We have with this one person. I'm like, yeah, but the episode is super fucking weird So if you watch it, it might be kind of shitty quality Yeah, horrible quality. So don't fucking you know, don't fucking judge you too hard. You know, 12 Yeah, exactly, you know started at the bottom now. We're here sort of thing, you know, even though we're not there but yeah You know what's great about that though is uh, so i'll i'll fucking get them I'll fucking give you another little fucking thing that I love to talk about Because my jiu-jitsu coach just dropped us on me Um, where it's like share your progress, you know Like share your progress while you're Going through it, right? So Everybody wants to like get six back six packs six pack abs, right? Everyone wants to get shredded and then they won't take no fucking pictures until they're fucking shredded They won't show you how fucking fat they were No progress picks Yeah, no progress picks during the time They may take all those pictures and post them all at the end But they're not going to show you in week six when they're fucking They're tired and they're hungry and they're they want to give up And they're not going to show you week eight when when well they relapse and and they they put on a pound with the donkeys Yeah, you know, they're not going to show you that ship. They're going to show you in fucking 12 weeks when they're fucking shredded You see a broker a few. Yeah when the donkeys. Oh my god. Yeah Yeah, exactly. Don't yeah, so so dude. You know what even better I'm glad you said that because in my book I I talk about the shit in my book where I'm like, man Like this shit is it's fucking funny but I even have like my my my pretty much Special forces story, you know, where everybody is pretty much infantry Yeah, I have my like pretty much special forces story where We graduated basic and me and me and like ten guys took a picture together And I put them on instagram and i'm like, you know, future special forces candidates And I tag like for and I tag for bending like a fucking dumbass Waiting out Yeah, so young down the full of cum is out there fucking stun Oh, oh my god. So staff of the army. Yeah, you know tag. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so The the guys at the student company for special forces saw it. Oh, yeah, and they printed it off They put it all over the barracks and they're like when this guy gets here We're gonna fucking kill him bro And uh, somebody messes me on facebook and they're like they're like, hey, just so you know You need to get everything. Yeah Yeah, so so that's my like but but that stories in my book too, but it's fun. It's hilarious Dude, it is fucking good But people are ashamed to talk about those things or to talk about like the bad shit I talk about it now and i've already been through it But the other day I made a post And I put it on Instagram and I said, you know what? Fuck it, man I'm just going to give a book update and a life update because it's just not going real good right now Yeah Like right now I I just found out that I got basically fucking scammed by my previous editor for like $5,000 Um, how the fuck yeah Yeah, it's a fucking long-ass story, but I can yeah So and then I so I got on with a new editor, which is going to cost me close to $10,000 to finish my book Um, me and my wife. Oh taxes this year, which is a few grand Then she backed up out of the out of the garage and ripped the ripped the garage door down Yeah, right. That's like four or five right. Yeah, there's a third one multiples of threes editor editor issues taxes Broken garage that's three you're good. He's like, well, let me finish Yeah, exactly. Yeah Well, we're going in six today boys. Uh, there's another set of three Yeah, exactly Yeah, but anyways all this shit kind of was like kind of coming down And so you know what to say when it rains up pours And I talk about this in my little fucking my little fucking soapbox that I posted And it's like I have a couple options here, right? I can give up and quit I could stop writing my book and that'll get rid of all those expenses like $10,000 or so That's going to take a market and all this bullshit um I could fucking I could not get my garage door fixed. I could just you know, I could just give up and quit, right? I could get rid of all these other things, but I have a book. I have a powerful message So the right thing to do is the fucking hard thing to do which is put my fucking boots on Go to fucking work and do what the fuck needs get done And and that's it, you know, that's it. So, um You know, but I shared that video because Shit is not fucking sweet right now. And it might always look like that but I you know, I'm not always good at that exactly and I'm not like struggling but You know, there are some stressors that I've certainly hit in the last few weeks Um, and I've got some big plans and I've got to like really kind of Count my fucking pennies to make them all happen Over the next six months and yeah, and I will you know, that's that's the thing with me is like My resolve has already been tested like I'm fucking good. Like I'm There ain't no fucking I always say like there ain't no bitch in this blood. Like I'm good. You know, so yeah Yeah, uh Joe Rogan's podcast I listened to but he said something you every day you got to fight your inner bitch And I was like that's some true shit right there, bro Every you know That's I feel like isn't it funny how all of these things we grew up maybe hearing people who were older say Like oh, this sounds that sounds so trite or like yeah, okay. So cheesy. It's so fucking true Right all you do is not quit right or you could just give up but no you don't you know what I mean? It's like all these things but they are they're the fucking truth And you grow up and you think you know better and you fucking don't my dad used to make this joke all the time He's like, why don't you just move out now while you know everything and you'll be good to go Yeah, not at all. So yeah, I was just talking to some of the day about this shit again and There's a another thing I saw worse like talking about you're just every every Decision that you make every opportunity That comes up is a is a chance to Or an opportunity to condition your mind, right? So If you come up to the fork on the road and there's a fucking bad road and there's an easy road You're going to if you take the fucking easy road every single time you're just conditioning your mind Um, it's just like being in Afghanistan, you know, if you take that fucking route that just looks fucking perfect that nobody's on for some fucking reason Uh, you're probably gonna get fucking smart reason there. Yeah, exactly, you know So take that fucking shitty route and and condition your mind to take those hard routes When the clock goes off at 430 Condition your mind to like to take the hard route. Um This is you know, this is kind of something super minimal, but My wife walked in a couple weeks ago She had like left and I don't know what the fuck she was doing, but she came home And I was with my daughter and I had my I was braiding my daughter's hair And um, my wife walked in and said what the fuck she's like how the fuck I didn't know you know, I had a braider hair And I was like, well, I fucking didn't that's where and then like three minutes ago. Yeah, youtube Yeah, dude. Yeah, I said three minutes ago. She walked up and asked me so I fucking pulled it up on youtube I was like everything. Yeah, I rebuilt my carburetor on youtube. Yeah, I mean, it's like People people people would give up on that It's my one story, bro. Yeah I'm proud of that shit too. I tried to rebuild a carburetor and I fucking fucked it all up But because for context, it was a lawnmower carburetor, you know, so we'll Same. Yeah, whatever bro. It was on youtube Yeah Lawnmower carburetor service I spent fucking eight hours on youtube fucking trying to fix my fucking lawnmower And then I just sold it for ten bucks. Yeah, right? Some of you'll do some with it I found a better youtube link But uh, but no like that's the thing is like nowadays people are so quick to give up on on everything And it's like or just to say I don't know like I don't know how to do that And it's like especially around my house. You know, uh, I almost paid somebody to build my website I almost paid somebody like fucking fifteen hundred dollars to build my website And I got on there today and I did it for a hundred and fifty fucking dollars Dude, I was like hours on google and did it myself. Yeah, google pages. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah, dude. I would have been fucking Furious because People see that right people and I mean I respect the hustle where they see a need then people need websites and different things And so the reason well, yeah, I'll get on here and do it for you can't bag Yeah, I'm not yeah, I'm not knocking them But how do I fucking if I if I would have paid for that shit and then found out what the fuck they did to do it I'd have been like you motherfucker. Yeah, it's just one of those things where it's like Anything that you can pay somebody to do you can probably do yourself now there is a point Where the efficiency and things like that do come and play like yeah, I'm not going to rewire my house You know, I'm gonna have an electrician for sure. Yeah, or yeah Or uh, well, there's my youtube video for that, but How did you die? Yeah, like when I was trying to fucking fix my lawnmower. I probably should just fucking pay somebody Fifteen fucking dollars to fix the goddamn carburetor, but I said I did it for fucking eight hours and then I broke it anyway, so I do the lessons learned as brain knows. I'm always working on like something I'm like truck on a car on whatever. He's got a ratter and I'm pretty proficient in most things There's certain things I don't mess with one of those is breaks and brake lines That's a very like crucial part to the vehicle if I mess that up. I'm not stopping So I just yeah, I pay someone to do that like you can do that for me But everything else I can do but breaks nuts. That's you Yeah, fair enough Yeah, well I was gonna ask you mentioned that you would talk to your your friend again the other day. What Has there been a long Period of time between when you guys talked Like since you were kids and then now again as adults or you guys actually like keep in touch Uh, we kept in touch for a little while, but we're we're both married with kids now. So, you know, like life kind of Staying Um, but as I came out about my story. I reached out to him to let him know that Um, hey, man, I'm going to I'm going to talk about this and I was going to put him in my book I was going to put his name in my book. He is in my book, but just not his real name. Yeah Um, I think I can call him Jacob in my book And so, um I reached out to him just to let him know like hey and then I also because when this happens a lot of times Uh, for example, like Clark Fredericks that guy I was telling you about Um, so Clark's brother was also raped by the same guy and he had no idea And when Clark came back in prison Clark's brother killed himself Uh, I believe it's what the story is. I think he yeah, I think he Like drunk or uh took a bunch of pills I think something like that. I can't remember what Clark says, but it's uh, it's uh, it's on youtube and all that he talks about it But anyways So that so so Clark came back in prison and then that happens, right? And what because Clark is like held as his hero, you know And so I what I don't want to happen is for me to be called a hero. I'm not a hero I'm not a fucking it's the same thing that happens when a guy wins the middle of honor, right? Anytime a guy wins a middle of honor, it's on the worst fucking day of his life Right, uh, you know, you don't ever get a middle of honor for fucking fucking pulling up all the fucking weeds Like you get a middle of honor for for doing some fucking hardcore shit. Yeah. Yeah, I'm a really bad day And um, so i'm gonna have survivor skill too Yeah, exactly. So So that that's the same so it's the same thing that that kind of happens with, um, this situation uh, where when You know, if I say something, I'm called this hero and so it's like i'm not the hero. I'm really not I'm just trying to help others. Um, it's a it's a little different, but it's the same and um um So that's why I called him for and I just said hey man, you know And then and then I like I said, I've never heard his side of the story I never knew how bad it was for him and um It was significantly worse than what it was for me which which was fucking crazy to hear Because if you think I have a bad story, holy fucking hell Um, I mean, mine says with the same the same guy Yeah, it was worse. Yeah. Yeah, so Um, you might what made it worse if you don't like it If you're my man, yeah Yeah, so the the biggest thing that I would say is um I was I think I was probably raped like Maybe five times or so You know, which wasn't that bad. Um, I say that but you know, whatever uh in comparison to him Like every fucking weekend he was so like he and I asked him I because I got I was like so how many times like do you think because that's how I kind of like I'm trying to put the math together on how how often these things happen to me Yeah, exactly quantifying and so he was like, you know, probably at least 50 times and so You know, you imagine being 14 13 14 15 years old And you know that happening that many times um And it'll fuck you up man And uh, if it just fucks up your whole fucking life And so that's what I talked to him about and after we got done talking I told him I said You know, so this is part of the reason why I want to have a conversation too is because when I talked to him previously He would say things like, um, you know, hey man, you're a lot tougher than me You reported the guy. You're a lot stronger than me. You're a lot braver than me. Um, You know, all these different things which If you don't if you never talked to anybody who's been through some shit Um, you may not pick up on it, but like, um, even when I was in the army I had a friend who called me one night and said You know, you're just a really good guy, man And they're getting all these like things off their chest because they're about to fucking kill themselves. Yeah and um It's why I called him. I said look man. Yeah, I was like Let's go to the beach tomorrow, right? And that's what I did in the army. Um, but Uh, the other day when I was talking to my other friend I I he was saying all these things, you know, like, hey man, you're much tougher than I am And i'm a bitch and i'm a pussy. I could never say this shit I could never write this down. I could never write a book All these different things. Um, and I was like bro I'm gonna say this one time and then it's kind of fucked up, but I'm gonna say this one time and You just need to shut up and let me let me hear let me say it And then you can say whatever you want to say after that because you kept cutting me off previously But I said you need to go get some fucking therapy I said go fucking find somebody. I don't give a fuck if you got to take medicine If you I don't want to take medicine and I don't need medicine right now But if you're so fucked up that you can't function get some medicine so you can function so you can get some therapy done Um, and then once you get to the therapy part, then you get off the medicine if that's what you can do But if you need the medicine then fucking take it. That's okay Yeah, man And so that's what I kind of told him the other day And I you know, I'll check up on him And see if he's going to do anything But the unfortunate part About people like me and him who are fucked up Or anybody else is that the world still does not owe you and the world doesn't stop turning and That was like a big thing for me waking up about it all was like The world does not have to walk around on eggshells because i'm fucked up If i'm not going to fucking take care of my own problems Then i'm just as fucked up as as somebody else you know because I acknowledge my problems. I know I have them there are resources out there if i'm going to be so ignorant to them And then blame my problems. That's just a victim fucking mentality man like For me I'm like fuck this man like this shouldn't hold me back Like i'm going to use this shit to be better and stronger and do cool things And and every time I do something it's just that much better. That's how I look at it. And so For a long time. I didn't want to talk about the sexual abuse stuff because that's obviously very embarrassing or shameful Personal. Yeah Yeah, you know, I mean fuck when I did the interview with the cop he brought up A story I told him where the where the dude fucking I was basically performing oral sex on the guy and He ejaculates like into my face and um You know as a fucking 13 year old boy, you know or 12 year old however the fuck old I wasn't I mean that wasn't the only time And Yeah, that happened, but I told that cop that story Um and he brought that up and I forgot about that shit and dude when he said that in that fucking interview room And I told him I was like, I want you to be as graphic as possible because I want to get through this I want to heal through this And um he said that shit and I was I almost stopped the fucking interview. I was like, I was like, yo I was like, hold on. I'm goddamn Memory he just brought full Yeah, dude. I mean, it's just like the the other I told you about the the thong thing. I forgot about that until the other day um, that's crazy man. Yeah, so Yeah, he's great, but anyways, um Yeah, so I just I just told my my we we we don't really talk as much anymore because of family And it's hard and he's he's like five hours away, but um but uh Yeah, man. We know I wanted to hear his side of the story, which really opened up a lot to me Um, and I respect the hell out of him for saying what he said because he said something fucked up shit um And uh, but yeah, the therapy thing is just it's real man. If you're fucked up You just got it. You got to take care of yourself. Definitely. No Yeah, I mean uh about a year ago, I guess now I started going through um EMDR And some other things before that, you know, just kind of leading to EMDR And um, I uh for the longest time was really averse to going even though my wife pushed me pushed me to go And I just I even like I made appointments and then just wouldn't go, you know, and um But it for the longest time I just thought this isn't going to make a difference like how many this is stupid. I don't want to do this and like You know, it's that's totally wrong. I was wrong Absolutely, I was wrong and there are concepts now that like I even will catch myself walking myself through About like okay. Well, I'm feeling this I need to recognize this so I can do this, you know And it just it's there was a misconception for me that I'm not going to go through this and walk out healed and Perfect and that's not it at all and you know, you're you're learning how to manage and cope So when this shit does start happening or bothering you you can manage it and get back to life is regularly scheduled as quickly as possible essentially And um, that's basically what I need is to understand I guess to be able to switch into a mode to be receptive to Going to therapy and EMDR and that process because that is definitely a process either like categorize all the shit you want to fucking deal with and But um, yeah, I mean, you know therapy is a really really big deal and I encourage You know, as many people You know who want to go or think they may need to go to go because there'll be stuff you'll realize or learn about yourself That you didn't even fucking realize And uh, you're like, oh man like how are those two connected but they are in some really weird way And um, it will make it make a difference for you, but um Now I wanted to ask about When you were going through this, you know with your with your abuser Was it always just like mental manipulation or was there ever so any sort of like violence or was it just like the existence of the possibility of violence that sort of like pushed it further Um, I don't think I ever felt Violence or like physically scared ever As as fucked up as it sounds. He was like very gentleman like Raping when it came to raping and molesting he was as gentleman like as you could be Uh for lack of better terms. I don't know how you Yeah, yeah Yeah, so there was never there are some times you hear in stories where they say if you say anything i'll kill you Um, sure the clock Frederick story Um, the guy who rapes him beats the fuck actually kills a dog in front of him It says if you say anything Scared tactical. Okay, exactly that never he never did that with us. Um, he just was very Cool calm collected very nice. Um, it was just all mental He would tell me he loved me. I was the only thing I mattered to him He would sing Uh, not sing but he dedicated like a lot of like 70s and 80s rock albums and songs to me like fucking meatloaf and like hairspray type shit Like fucking like just playing in the house Uh in the car whenever we'd be because it was like a 30-minute drive Um, so we'd listen to a lot of that and you know, he would always say like, oh, this is what I think about you Whenever I hear this song, you know, and this is like 80s fucking it's like kind of fucking corn Yeah, you know, I was like dude like What the fuck like Richard Marks, you know Yeah, i'm like i'm like like yeah It's like something you see like cornball ass movie where like they played outside the girl's house before prom night or something, you know Yeah, yeah, i'm like Bro, that's weird That is crazy Yeah How how would you say that like as you Came into like getting into serious relationship and then getting married and having kids and like How is that been navigating relationships and and then you know, I mean, this is a big question, right? But like navigating that relationship Getting into a marriage and then navigating being a father like that has to be just a totally different experience Yeah, so the the The navigated so being a father apart Um, a lot of people give me a lot of credit for it and I didn't really realize this Until recently that a lot of people who go through what i've gone through don't ever want to have kids They don't want to they don't ever want to bring kids into the world because of because of these situations they're fucking terrified um And i'm telling man if you if you hear more of these stories It's just fucking disturbing. Oh my god. It's so disturbing. So, um Uh, now as far as relationships go as soon as I reported the guy I eventually, you know, I started to kind of see girls more often because I was free on the weekends And I was very sexually motivated so part of my mission too is to teach young men to Just be smart about what they're doing with women because I think that in this society Now, especially You know, I don't know man for some when I was a kid it was all about getting pussy It's like how like when are you gonna fuck like when are you gonna get a girl like hey? Have you fingered a girl yet or have you gotten head? I mean, have you done this basically with high school and college was like for sure. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, and I yeah exactly so I think like my part of my mission is to let guys know that You got to be careful because you could ruin somebody's life and you can ruin your own by one fucking stupid ass mistake and and i'm I almost did it like multiple times like I you know, I was so sexually motivated Thankfully, I never did anything crazy, but I was very like like come on come on come on like very pushy like to have sex, you know um I mean I'd take a girl out or we would even go out. We just hang out for the first time and I'm like, okay It's time to have sex, but I had been so conditioned to it that that it was just like This is what we do, you know, and um, so it really fucked me up And I didn't realize it fucked me up at the time because I didn't realize any of this until I was like 20 20 something I was getting out of the army and it all came back at the same time because I realized like how big of a piece of Shit I was for doing that for all those years for trying to you know, just manipulate these girls Um, and I was just it was just fucked up and I shouldn't have done that um You know, like I said, I I never did anything serious, but it was just very pushy and just Uncalled for stuff and sure um Anyways, uh, so that that was the early part of it Um, my wife is actually the first girl. I've ever dated so, uh, yeah, so uh, a lot of Well, not a lot but but a fair amount of relationships before her um And then uh, she was the first girl I had ever dated so, um, yeah, we dated for like three months and It was pretty cool. Uh, I was at four steward and uh, it was pretty hard Yeah Yeah She's just outside the door like not bad Yeah Um So yeah, we dated for like Three months and then I basically I think I told her I was like, I'm thinking we're gonna marry you And, um, six months or three months after that so six months into dating we were married Um, and because of my fucked up ass life I didn't really give a fuck about anybody else And so we got married. We didn't tell anybody And we were married for like six, seven months And uh, then we put it on facebook We went and got like a photo shoot done that said that we eloped And we put it on facebook and we were like super proud of being this like rebellious young couple that didn't have a traditional wedding But truthfully at the time I didn't really give a fuck about weddings and to this day Some of these things like these like, um, formalities that we form As a society like birthdays and and thanksgiving and valentine's day and, um We get so caught up in the formalities of it that we just forget that like you can tell your Child that you love them Outside of their birthday, you know that right like you can you can just be nice to people outside of the holidays That's how my wife and I are with valentine's day. It's like every day is an opportunity to be in a valentine's day My biggest one is like, um, we're just with families in general because I never had a family And so one thing I wanted for my kids was I wanted my kids to be around their cousins I wanted my kids to be around their grandparents A lot and uh when I was in high school I had some my best friends were in foster care and I hung out with them every weekend and every fucking sunday The whole family would go to church and then the whole family would go back to their house Like 20 30 people and it'd be a bunch of fucking food kids And it was just like this big thing every and so I was there every sunday I was part of that, you know, it's part of that. That's awesome. And so Um, that was my that was my uh That's kind of how I am like I just I don't really care about holidays or birthdays and I I having kids now I do get a little bit more excited for christmas and stuff because They're starting to understand that stuff. Well, actually they do understand it now. Enjoy seeing them happy and Yeah, yeah, and that that's cool. Um And I would say to kind of wrap up the question Um Between me and my wife we we've had a She's you know, she's tough as hell for sticking with me Because when you have to I talk about it in my book when you when you when you have to love somebody who's Damage products are like damaged goods people who are fucked up They're hard to love because we're fucked up and like we got some shit in our heads that sometimes Don't sound right. Um, so I appreciate her for that. Uh, she knows that and um And then uh, my kids You know, I'm thankful for her family because the one thing that always gets me really emotional is when I see her her dad Um or her grandpa like hugging on the kids and loving on the kids because uh, I never had it, you know, and Uh, every time I put my kids to bed. I'm very intentional about it I'm I go in there and I hug them. I kiss them. I tell them I love them And I tell them I'm proud of them and every night like my son, especially he's always like why are you proud of me? And he's three. Why are you proud of me? Or uh, if I haven't gotten to it yet, he'll say are you proud of me? Because he knows it's coming, you know, yeah, yeah, I'm like fuck. Yeah, I'm proud of you. Yeah, yeah, and I'm just like man I fucking love you dog and you know, I'm like, you know, so that that that part of intentional being a father I could talk about being a father forever. Um, I think so many fucking people Have kids to put them on instagram with our cute little onesies. So then like sit them off in the corner Like I like as a parent man like I don't want to have anymore kids. Yeah, I'll do it. Yeah, I've only been in down two months And I didn't think I could love an entity or a thing so much And I just like I just like I play with her. I like it just happens. Yeah, I like just happens. It's It's it's crazy. I think like my dad joke. She's like Uh, because I posted a thing saying like how obsessed she is with me because like she You're giving her a bath And the way she just looking at me while I'm giving her a bath was just nothing but love And like like appreciation for like me caring for her and stuff like you can just see it in her face Yeah, yeah, and I sent to my dad. I was like, look how obsessed she is with me. Like she just won't stop like googling me You know like she's just like whoo, you know all the time with me and I mean when you send me selfies. I'm the same way. So it makes sense And my dad's like I think you're obsessed with her and I was like, oh, I'll Like kill I'll kill everyone To make sure you see that video. There's like they're asking these parents and they're like Oh, would you kill a kid and they're like well, I don't we don't think I'd kill and I'm like fuck you Hell, yeah, I'd kill for my fucking kid. Are you serious? Yeah, so that that's like man being a parent is such a fucking important thing in this world That's that the family is the root of all the problems. I think that we have Um, when you don't have a strong family Environment in the country it shows because you have all these fucked up ass kids like just like me Um, you know, so so like I'm a I'm a disciplinarian as a father Like I what my kids my kids are three and five and they've gotten many many ass weapons over the years and Um, you know, that's one thing I can say about my kids I can pretty much take them wherever the fuck I want and they shut the fuck up because they know That like you're not in a bad way like shut the fuck up. I'm like they know not to act like a fucking asshole They know exactly they know when it's serious I can't remember if I've told this story before but I'll never forget this ass whooping and it didn't happen to me Having my brother if we were on base and we went to one of these like bazaars We were in the in Japan So like all these like Japanese vendors came on base and they set up like a hanger for them to showcase all their stuff And so there's all these like expensive ass like porcelain vases and shit You know and my dad had told my brother we went with another family Stop fucking digging around stuff running around so I have to pay $500 for an umbrella base I'm gonna fucking kick your ass, you know, like and you know, they they didn't stop dude And I'm like I'm standing like near them and this is my I'm the oldest This is my little brother and him and this other kid just come cruising Do they just run through this like line of kimonos and my dad just Stand there undoes his belt takes it off and waits for him to get within arms reach And the second he does he's fucking got him and just bends him over in the middle of this fucking hanger full of people It just whips his ass. I just was like, oh my god You know and of course everybody's like looking and everybody stops looking And but I will never forget that but uh, yeah, yeah, no, we got it too for sure Dude, we'll see that that's like You know, people uh, they'll talk about like, oh, like how do you get this toddler or stop? Stop screaming and stop biting and stop doing all this dumb shit. I'm like, have you tried whooping his ass? Well, you know, they don't understand they don't deserve that. It's like dude, look and I I'm not fucking kidding when I say this when my kids were old enough to When I said no and they turned and looked at me and they could and I could see it and I'm talking You're talking like dad look Yeah, when they can start crawling and like grabbing shit And the reason and I'll get into a fucking tangent here. God. Damn it Um This is why i tell my wife is so this is why i tell my wife is so fucking important to teach fucking discipline And like to listen on the first command. It's just like being in the fucking military Uh for a long time I did not understand what blind faith was I didn't understand why you need to have blind faith But if I go into a fucking room and my fucking team leader tells me to go to go left instead of right I can't just stop and be like why why am I going left? Why? Because i'm going to get my fucking ass killed. Yeah, so when I tell my fucking kids Um go to the fucking bathroom before we go to bed Get your ass in there and go to the fucking bathroom like It's because you're conditioning the fucking mind, right? So when we're in walmart and somebody walks in with a fucking Fuckin ar and they start shooting the fucking place up and I tell you to fucking run You fucking run or If you're going out into the street And there's a fucking car coming and I say stop you don't fucking turn and look at me and say ha ha ha That he's fucking yeah, why? Yeah, what the fucker you fucking stop and so so so that's why i am the way i'm with my kids about like that kind of shit Um, but it's conditioning. It's all it is and so when they're young And they start getting into shit. They start grabbing shit and they're grabbing something not supposed to You know, you don't beat the fuck out of them, but you can walk up to them you start fucking fucking Three-piece in your fucking toddler, but um, you know, you just walk up and you fucking hate no and then to do again No, okay. Okay, you should do it again Then you smack them on the ass or the hand whatever And like it does hurt man. It does suck that fucking hurt their feelings But this fucking part of life dude. Yeah, and then you and then But but we did that so quick and so early and so often That I mean no shit by the time they were like one one and a half We just say no and they'd go away from it And when you have your kids lined up and disciplined that well That um my five-year-old I can tell her to go upstairs and clean all three of the rooms and she does it I mean it's fucking to me. It's amazing. They're they're fucking rarity now. That's for sure. Oh, yeah Well, that's the parents man. It's it's it's parents. Unfortunately, there's too much of that. I agree man They've done they whoever they have done a lot to uh destroy the the nuclear family and the That's again like again not to like tangent or soapbox too hard That's why I think it's so important that those roles are identified because they have a purpose You have a purpose as as a male You know women have purposes as females there are things you don't have to be you know, uh A dude as a chick to be good or better, you know, like you say these things like You know, you have things as a woman that you're good at and better at than a man like and then a man So do those things and be those things. It's okay that we're different You don't have to prove that you're better than a guy by doing x y and z or whatever You know, so but those I do very much think that those roles are there This isn't that whole all of these roles are is a or a construct is bullshit You know because when when shit falls apart And you know goes back to if if it ever went back to caveman days, right? It's caveman days For a reason because there's cavemen out there fucking not going to save her too tired or over the head with a rock And then bring it home You know what I mean, but for real and then it goes right back to those specific gender roles Because it's just the way we're built man. That's just the way it is. Yeah, that's why those exist It's not a construct. It's your fucking brain Thousands and thousands of years of evolution grinding those in and now it's second nature See that's part of the the thing with like how do when you People just don't have no fucking perspective man. That's that's the whole cycle of like Hard times great strong men strong men create easy times. Easy times great weekman weekman You said that hour in that weekman, you know, yeah, you know, so we're now in the hard times my friends We're yeah, we're if we aren't now we're about to be but yeah, it's it's it's from Like it's so fucking crazy man. Like we live in america and if you've never been outside of america You wouldn't understand yeah, but we live in a fucking country where we have the right to be upset about Something dumb shit dumb shit, right? We are so fucking free Not even though we're oppressed. We are so fucking free in this country that uh We don't even know what to fucking be mad about. Yeah, so we're just creating shit to be fucking upset to be upset about Literally, we don't like have a turmoil or conflict So we create our own conflict dude That's like the whole the whole impetus behind Sebastian younger's book tribe is that whole idea Is that we're not a tribe. There's no community anymore. There's not a common unifying theme anymore at all And that's why everything is falling apart Yeah, absolutely The people that like oh my god, man It's just it's just a starving man the people that complain and and want to come up with all these fucking reasons of why their life sucks or like um And most of the time they do to themselves. It's like you're 18 And then you decided that you're fucking some sort of whatever the fuck you are You did that to yourself. Yeah, yeah, like so I mean if you go do that in another country if that's how you feel I know it's like a super cliche answer But like if that's how you feel go to another place and live And then you'll find out why america is the fucking land of fucking the american dream Yes, no one's for this dream. No one's to leave me in america. You'll be in dream max. No mass exodus to escape it it's not yeah And you know like I said man, the people know the those other countries man Those motherfuckers get tied up strung up on a bridge and burned alive for the shit that Risking their life jumping on to like a barely inflatable raft Exactly and trying to go over the pacifica the Atlantic to get away from america listen the the the reason why the modern american male uh Strays away from doing hard things like you were talking about And doesn't apply himself is because we live in a society that he doesn't have to anymore Yeah And all of these things you enjoy these things that you think don't matter We're a part of some greater global community that thinks the same way that's all a farce. It's not true at all You live this way and enjoy these niceties and this this uh creature converts because of the united states And the reason why we got there is because people before you did not shirk duties that were hard They did not walk away from responsibilities and you are and you're creating a bad pattern And that's what's going to make all of this go downhill And again that whole thing you just said we spend create hard times What's insane is we live in a time where literally any question or any problem you have you can solve it like instantly On this supercomputer in your hand like you can answer it. You can solve it. You're an android You can figure anything out like you are easily yet. We are Probably the dumbest We've ever been Becoming in a sea of knowledge. Yep. Hmm. Fucking retard all the answers and you can't you can't throw things out Yeah, man. Yeah, I yeah, it's uh I think I think one thing that's helped me is Is like listening to a lot of podcasts listening to a lot of reading books and shit Um Because it does help you give that it does help you understand people understand the world and and things like that I mean fuck as of recently I've thought about getting more into like the I don't know what do they call like bushcraft or whatever the fuck like just survival and all that you know, yep Because I'm like, you know what? I might fucking start putting some goddamn gallons of water my fucking garage or something Yeah, cuz Yeah in drums Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so um But yeah, I mean, you know And that's kind of some of the reason why like I like I said to do hard shit twos because uh One when the shit hits the fan like I want to be able to protect and defend and things like that But um, I just don't want to fold up man like I don't Yeah, I don't want to I can't I can't imagine being that guy that When something bad happens like I can't defend my family or I can't I can't just or if I lose my job Like I can't like make something happen like, you know, I don't know and doing that is like a muscle man You know because you can't lose it real fast and uh I actually had the same thought last night I watched a video some 60 plus year old dude who works out and he does sprints I was like when was the last fucking time you saw something there's 60s do a sprint You know, I was like that's that's definitely something that he's kept up with you don't just fucking get up And through your fucking new balancers on at 65 You know, we just head out in the yard do some sprints like that'd be it grandpa broke his head today guys. Sorry You know, that's he's dead Yeah, it was the last time you saw somebody who's even just passed high school 25 years old do a sprint Yeah, like you don't ever like when's the last time I can't remember the last time I ran full capacity speed to be honest I run a lot but like to run like full out sprint There's a spot near my house with a sidewalk is short enough to do that and I will do it every once in a while Just dead ass sprint just for your fucking shit. So yeah, I always just joked in the beginning. It's podcast Hi, lily. I run once a year. Yeah. Yeah, I have my PT test Do you sprint? I don't Feel like a sprint for them on half because I don't run Yeah, all that'll do it Well, Seth You said your book coming out sometime the end of this year We would definitely want to get it and I would love to know when it's coming out and help you, uh You know promote it and and all of that very interested in and reading it. So, but is there anything Um, you know to close out. I wanted to ask you that somebody who Maybe can look out things that maybe somebody could look out for and somebody else that's going through what you went through as like a tell You know to maybe try and get somebody some help or intervene Man, it's hard, uh Because whenever somebody says something it's like a complete shock Like I said, it's it's almost never like a oh, yeah, we figured something was happening It's always like we had no fucking idea. Um, but I would just say man. You have to trust your gut And if you think something is wrong, just say something if you think somebody's saying weird things or doing weird things Then say something Because at a minimum you're wrong or the worst thing what happens is you're is you're wrong, right? Like the fuck like no Um Best case scenario is that you at least put it in that person's mind that they can come and talk to you Uh, so if you know somebody who's going through it Um, I know everybody always talks about this stuff like I would kill somebody if they did that to my daughter Well, uh, when you say that I'm just for reference It puts that person, um at unease or make some nervous about it because Uh, if I report It's my abuser at 15 and then my grandpa goes and murders the guy Well, now my grandpa's on the news for murder. He's going for murder and then not only that but um Now the whole fucking town knows what happened to me So now I also came out with the biggest thing that's ever happened to me My grandpa's gone and the whole fucking world knows Now I got the media showing up at my house because of this crazy fucking case Yeah, and then I gotta go go back to school and get bullied for the situation worse Yeah, so I know a lot of people talk about that and even if they are saying it jokingly it You know, you just have to know your audience and this is something that people just don't know. I didn't know this either Um, but you just got to understand that Those little like comments Well kind of fuck you up because you you just get scared It's not a comforting thing You know, even if you said Well, I would kill for my daughter or if I would kill if somebody right my my son or my daughter It's not a comforting thought a comforting thought is like you can talk to me about anything and I will not react like I will not Act any kind of certain way. I will I always have Your interest Um, and so even when I when I tell that story about when I reported and my friend said, um, what do you want to do? He didn't even realize it at the time, but that's the best thing he could have said Whereas most people would say fuck this. We got to go get him. This is what I'm gonna do Well, he said he said yeah, he's like, you know, what do you want to do? He's like I'll follow your lead whatever you want to do because you're the one making the report and so Um, that's the right thing to do is to say so if somebody does confide in you or if you do think something's going on You you need to gain that person's trust so that they can talk to you um And trust that you're not going to react and if they do tell you they're business You the right thing to do be worthy of trust Yeah, exactly, but be worthy of the trust right listen to them Uh and asking what they want to do, you know, and then Um, they need to report right so just like in the military with the sharpshit I don't know how you do in the civilian world But there's like confidential and then there's Unconfidential reporting like you showed it on restricted. Yeah. Yeah. So what I would do is report. I always tell everybody Don't seek like vengeance or whatever Just report for yourself because when you report you get it off your chest, which is extremely helpful And then also you get the therapy for free right all that therapy the crime victim services They take care of you for free. Okay, so don't eat so don't think about trying it Like if you can put the guy away or if you can take care of the abuser or whatever Then great, but if you get raped by somebody that you don't know And they run away and you don't ever identify them You still got to say something because you need to take care of yourself Don't get so caught up on That I put this guy away for long enough like don't don't worry about that like what's it fucking matter? Truthfully, what's it matter if you report he gets five years or 15 years? What's it matter? Uh, you did it's out of your control. So you might as well control what you can which is Taking care of yourself and getting help right? I like that Where can people find you man? Yep. So, uh, I just created a website today sethgale.com. That's as simple as that Uh last name is g-e-h-l-e Um, but yeah sethgale.com Um, i'm on instagram go beyond the shadows is my handle there um YouTube, uh Yeah, youtube is sethgale go beyond the handle and there's like go beyond the shadows something like that But if you look up sethgale, you'll find me um Facebook linkedin all that all that shit sethgale So if you go to my website, it's all linked in there as well. Um, and it shows kind of a preview of what i'm doing and It's actually a pretty fucking cool website. I'm pretty proud of that shit So i'm gonna lie check it out. So yeah, yeah, and then if you go to the website, there is a place to subscribe I'm not going to flood your shit. Like I won't email you at all. Um, But I will start giving updates later this year when the book will come out and then when the book does come out I'll send out a, you know a reminder like i have book is coming out. Yep. Awesome So that's that's the best way to keep track of the book is just to get on that So I have a mailing list of who I can shoot it all out to Cool. But once the book comes out, I will certainly fucking blow your shit up until you fucking buy it Uh, we're gonna get it for sure just kidding All right, man. Well, thank you very much for coming on and sharing sharing that with us Um, I really appreciate it And I like having these conversations because there's a difficult ones because again Somebody might be listening and it could just give them that sort of strength to go out and say something and And seek the help that they need to so and um be everybody go go and check out Seth, sethgale.com be on the lookout for his book Obviously and um, yeah, man. I just want to say thank you again for coming on and uh, thank you very much Hope you guys have a good night Appreciate it. Okay