[Music] From Relay FM, this is Upgrade Episode Number 81. Today's show is brought to you by Ministry of Supply, Squarespace, ITProTV, and FreshBooks. My name is Mike Hurley. Of course, today we have an episode all about the Apple event that has occurred the March 21st Apple event. But we're doing something a little bit different. Of course, we're going to talk about the event and everything that went down. But before we do, I want to hand over to our reporter in the field, Mr. Jason Snell. Good morning, Mike. Good morning, listeners. You are listening to me coming from inside my car. I am Jason Snell and this is the weirdest episode ever of Upgrade. It's 7/11, and I am making my way from my home in Marin County, Northern California, just north of San Francisco. I'm going to go across the Golden Gate Bridge, and then I'm going to end up going through the city of San Francisco and down US 101, well, let's see, through the city of San Francisco. Well, okay, so here's the Stravus San Francisco. They don't have a lot of freeways where you might expect there to be freeways like through the city. After I get off the Golden Gate Bridge, I have to go on the streets of San Francisco through the city on Parkway City Avenue and 19th Avenue, and then on to Interstate 280, and then that will take me to rest of the way, to Infinite Loop and Cupertino for the Apple event, which this episode is actually about. I'm on the freeway now, it's very exciting. So before we get to the post event part of the CarCast, which is what I'm calling this, I thought I would talk a little bit about the event atmosphere, because I know Mike likes to do that. Mike likes me to talk about it, because he's never been to one of these Apple Media events. So, this Town Hall, this is going to take place in the Town Hall Conference Center, which is in R&D 4 at Infinite Loop, and Stephen Hackett and I over the weekend compiled the list of kind of the notable Town Hall events that have happened since the iPod introduction in 2001, which I went to, and there are a few before then, but we decided that the history of that place, Internet history gets really vague before 2001, so we didn't want to make any claims. We feel like we're pretty confident that our list is everything that's been since 2001, and it's really like one year there have been these events at the Town Hall. It was designed almost certainly for internal communications, right, this new team meetings. When Steve Jobs came back to Apple, there were probably team meetings in there, you can have up to 300 people talking about what the vision for the group is or the company or whatever. As a media event area, it used to be fine, the iPod event was just fine, but over the years, as interest in Apple has grown, a 300-seat venue is ridiculously small for any event, and at the end there, they were doing like, they did a couple Mac-related events there, but in general, it's a tough ticket, and I'm fortunate to even be getting in there. Also, the way that they handled this over the years is really changed. It used to be you would show up in front of R&D 4, you'd just park in the parking lot behind number 4, and go up, and there would be a couple of fold-out tables, and PR people with little printed out lists of people, and they check you in and they give you a badge, and you go inside. Actually, you'd wait outside, and they might have some bagels on a table over in the corner, but everybody would mill around outside, and eventually they would let us in to this teeny tiny lobby on the inside, but that was super claustrophobic, and then eventually they let you in. They have changed it now. That was the way it was for a long time. There was this interim step where what they did was, I don't know what usually is upstairs from there, but I think they changed it at some point into a briefing center, or certainly it's convertible into that, so there's an upstairs right off of the lobby for R&D 4, which is the Super Narrow Lobby, and there's an upstairs with a large room, like a common room that I think was meant to be sort of like the hangout meeting place area for the employees who work there, and so then they started out fitting that with like, it has chairs, but they'd also like put some breakfast out up there. The first time we saw that, we're like, what is happening with Apple that they're giving us, like there were like egg stations, and so it was bizarre, we're like, what is happening? But I think they decided that it was a little embarrassing for them to have the folding tables and bagels in the corner, and they wanted to kind of do it up, and also there were so many people that it was unruly, so they put in that extra effort. And for the last event, and what I believe they're doing today is they're actually having us come to R&D 1, there's a special parking lot at the front that is usually like visitor parking that they're going to limit for this, which is good because another unreported story about Apple is that parking at the Apple campus is ridiculous these days, like ridiculous. They actually have hired a valet service, and they now double park cars in the Apple parking lot because there's not enough room because the campus is packed. But they, for this event, they've made this space available over by one Infinite Loop, which is where it's the main entrance, that's where the new company store is. It's all over right as you get in, and that's like what people think of as Apple headquarters is opening the door to one Infinite Loop. So just like last time I assumed today, we're going to go in through one Infinite Loop, through the main entrance, which is very impressive. It's much more impressive. You're led in by PR people, and then they take you out into the center of the loop, which is where they've got a waiting area. And last time there was a waiting area with some tents, and again, they're serving food because nothing gets journalists on your good side better than serving food. And that's where we kind of waded out, they told us to be there by nine. The event is at ten, that's to shame all of the late people into getting there on time. And so we just hang out there, and that's where you see the people, there are people I only see at Apple events these days, which is pretty funny, and I like to see them, and I admire their work, and we interact on Twitter. But a lot of times I only ever see them at Apple events, and not for very long. I see them before the Apple event, because afterward, although I see them, we're all working on our stories. So what happens is they'll usher us in, you'll get a seat, it's super tight and uncomfortable. We'll all sit there, cover the event. And then afterward, we're usually let into a hands-on area now with, it may be outside. This time now that they're sort of like setting up this area outside, it's possible it'll be outside. If it's not outside, it may be, there's a piano bar with the famous piano that has been a part of Apple for decades now. The piano bar space is right across from town hall, so it may be there. And it may be outside, it might be upstairs, but usually there's a big hands-on area where everybody in the press can go and get their paws on the latest stuff, and it needs to be capacity for 300 people, because there's 300 people that fit in the venue. So it's always a challenge for them. A lot of times the size of the venue is controlled by the size of the hands-on area, because even if you had an auditorium that's seated in 1,000, that's not enough. Like the new one will do at the new Apple campus, that'll seat 1,000. It's not enough, you also need an area large enough that you could take roughly 1,000 journalists and give them a reasonable amount of access to a hands-on area, because that's just part of the deal as far as Apple is concerned. So it'll be interesting to see how that's executed, but I have no doubt that the new Apple campus auditorium will have been designed with that need in mind, and that'll be interesting to see hopefully next year. So anyway, I'll see all those people in the hands-on area afterward, and we won't be talking because everybody's shooting video and taking pictures, and that area has become more and more intense over time, because now people are committed a lot of them to shooting a bunch of photos and instantly posting a gallery or shooting a lot of video. And that's actually a new trend that kind of bugs me as somebody who's not that invested in it, and I totally understand why people do it, but there's nothing worse than waiting around a hands-on area trying to look at a product, only to discover that the person who's got it is there with a cameraman, and they're going to shoot, "Hey guys, I'm here at the Apple event, let me walk you through everything about this new iPhone, and it's going to take forever." So you just move on, move on to another place. One of these days they should probably have a special area for people doing hands-on videos. I bet you that would be a better thing. Anyway, and then when all that is said and done, my plan right now is to hop back in the car and drive back home, and along the way do this experimental carcast, and the reason for that is largely because when they have these events in Cupertino, it takes me an hour and a half to get home, and that is prime time. I should really be working on something involving the event, but I haven't been able to do that because I've been just sitting there driving, and there's sort of like nothing else I can do with that time. It's just kind of a waste of my time, and I said to Mike, "Hey Mike, what if we did a podcast during my drive home from the event?" So I will do a Skype call with Mike and then record my end using this microphone that I'm talking to you on now, and Mike will put it together, and it will have all of the magic and majesty of a podcast where somebody's in a car. So now we're going to go into the upgrade time machine. I'm going to throw it back to Mike, and Mike is going to tell you about something really cool, and then we're going to move ahead past the Apple event to the aftermath. Take it away, Mike. Thank you to our man in the field, our man on the way to the field at that point, Mr. Jason Snow. As Jason said, when we come back from this break, we will be together talking about everything that happened in the Apple event from our very special show in which we're recording on way back from location. This week's episode is brought to you by Ministry of Supply. Everyday clothing should be smarter. We know this. It should be designed to work with our bodies, not against our bodies. It shouldn't be making us sweat and making us feel uncomfortable. This is what Ministry of Supply is out to fix. For those of us that have to wear shirts and suits and stuff frequently, that stuff can be really frustrating. Ministry of Supply was created to make this whole experience better. They are a performance professional menswear company that launched out of MIT four years ago, and they make polished business clothes that are engineered by MIT trained engineers to provide technical benefits like body temperature regulation, keeping you dry, and keeping you movable, and letting you move freely. For example, their most tech-forward dress shirt, the Apollo, is made of moisture-wicking fibers infused to temperature-regulating phase-change material, the same stuff that NASA developed to keep their astronauts cool in space. It also features a light-knit construction for breathability and a four-way stretch for mobility. Ministry of Supply as Apollo shirt is 15 times more breathable than a 100% cotton dress shirt. All of their clothes are easy to maintain and wrinkle resistant. You do not need to iron them and you can wash and dry them easily at home. You can find out more and shop online at minitioseplier.com/upgrade, and if you use the code "upgrade" you'll get 15% of your first purchase and show your support for this show. I love the clothes that Ministry of Supply make. They are comfortable, they are fantastic, and I've seen in person that they do not need to be ironed. I have them, I've seen other people wearing them, and they look great. I've had compliments from my shirts and other people have, too. I think you're going to look fantastic in them. Not only can you get 15% of your first purchase at minitioseplier.com/upgrade, if you want to go to a Ministry of Supply store, just mention this show and you will get that same 15% discount. Thank you so much to Ministry of Supply for their support of this show and relay FM. Okay, so dialing in from a road somewhere in Cupertino is our intrepid man in the field. Mr. Jason Snell, hello Mr. Jason Snell, welcome to upgrade. Hi Mike, welcome to upgrade indeed. I am coming to you live from the Interstate 280. You might know it from the maps icon. And I just have left the Apple campus where I just finished working on the Apple Media event. Its Interstate 280 is my favorite of all the interstates. It's the best number of all of them, 280. So we are trying something a little bit different today. We wanted to get the show out as quick as possible of all of the information and you are now taking this drive. So many people listen to podcasts while they drive. We figured why not do a driving podcast? So here we are. That's right. It's double the cars. Double the cars. So you're on your way back now back to Six Colors HQ and yes, so I want to do our usual. I want to talk about the event. Obviously you were there. It was a small audience, right? This is a much smaller event when they do the town hall. Yeah, it's 300 capacity. I think it's very small and it used to be sufficient for little Apple events here and there back in the day. But Apple is so popular and successful now that it's not really sufficient for anything but the kind of smallest of events. So this was one of those smaller events but still it was a tough ticket. A lot of people who usually go weren't there and it's probably as Steven Hackett and I wrote about on Six Colors this week and as Tim Cook mentioned at the end of the presentation so that was a pretty good bit of timing, probably the last event in that venue. So did you see everybody? Like was there a good crowd there today? Yeah, I mean it's a lot of the same people that I usually see, Jim Dowrymble, John Gruber, Matt Panzerino, Renee Ritchie, you know, Clayton Morris, I saw Steven Levy, you know, the people that I see at Apple events, a lot of them were there but it's a smaller crowd. So obviously there were a lot of people who I often see at these events who couldn't fit in the room. So weren't there. Yeah, of course. So I have my notes, I was watching at home, I was watching on my iMac with my iPad Prime in front of me that I was taking notes on and reading Twitter so I had a whole multi-screen setup going on. So I figured we would go through the event chronologically and kind of talk about each of them. So we started off with a video which was kind of a reminder that in a couple of weeks time when April 1st, Apple is 40 years old, so they did kind of a 42nd intro where they showed a lot of kind of the history and the buzzwords and the colors and the product names of the company's history. You know, I guess you probably recognized quite a few things from that list including the crossed-out Newton. That's how you deleted things on the Newton list writing with that way. Yeah, I recognize a lot of that stuff and I'm looking forward to going back through the video and watching it because obviously it just shot by and there's probably, I did have an idea for a few stories based on that because I want to write about the 40th anniversary too. I'm sure Mr. Steedon Hackett is already writing the complete annotated version of that video and if he isn't, he should probably get on that. Yeah, most definitely. I think he sent me a message, I believe he said I should have made this and it's like yeah, that feels like this is right up here, Ali. And then Tim, it was Tim Time, Tim came out and he said a couple of words about how many Apple devices that there are and we kind of heard about this on the last financial analyst called, there's one billion Apple devices in use right now. And he used this as a springboard to jump right into the FBI thing and me and you spoke about this last week and I think we both came to the conclusion that it was likely that this would come up in some way. And Tim went at it head on and he started talking about a, the way that our devices are personal to us and he was saying things like how much power should we give the government over our data and privacy and he carried on by saying like we did Apple as Apple, we did not expect to be at odds with our government, but we believe we have a responsibility to our customers, we owe it to them and will not shrink from this responsibility. This was very performed very well, it was considered and impassioned. How did it feel being in the room, this got quite an ovation afterwards to hear Tim so strongly talk about this FBI scenario? Well, you know, we've heard him talk about this before, so it wasn't surprising, I guess. And the people in the room get it, it's the people in the room, it's the first five rows are Apple employees or special guests and then the rest of the room is, is reporters covering Apple, but anybody who's writing about this and understands the technology industry knows, you know, knows what Apple's doing here and knows what the FBI is trying to pull and I'm pretty sure that almost everybody in that room believes that Apple isn't the right. And I was surprised and we talked about it, like you said last week, I was a little surprised that this is, that it was in as depth as it was, I sort of anticipated a nod to it, you know, like a, you know, of course, where we take your privacy seriously, you may have heard something about that, but instead he, you know, to Tim Cook's credit, he, he tackled it head on, I feel like he is an incredibly, I think one of his superpowers actually is that he's a very, he seems like a very honest and straightforward guy, I just, I don't get any artifice from Tim Cook, he feels like, like a, like a genuine person. And so when he says we care about this stuff and it matters to us and we want to, when they say that they want the, to leave the world a better place, and when they say that they care about the privacy and security of their customers, you know, I believe him. I don't think this is, I mean, it is the challenges, it is also PR, right? This is a press event. It's a media event. Yeah. It's meant to be company PR. It is company PR. It does make them look good, but I also think they believe it. And Tim Cook certainly I think believes it. Yeah, I definitely stand with you on the believing part. You can tell he does. This did feel to me like the reason that bringing this up now is because there has been some public pushback maybe from the media spinning this or people that just don't believe that this should be Apple's view. So I definitely saw this as a time where they can say this is why we're doing it. There are customers of ours that think this is the right thing to do. We wanted to give you a little bit of like background as to why we believe this is important, you know, for the people watching that maybe didn't agree. Having seen that, like, and having seen this from Apple today, I can definitely see why they did this. I think that it was the right thing for them to come out and say something on this stage, because if they didn't, you know, they would have basically just been called cowards in the press. Yeah. I agree with you, actually. And looking at it like that, I think you're right. How could you not talk about it? Like how could you not? How could you Apple today try to release a bunch of products while ignoring the huge, you know, the elephant in the room, essentially. So, you know, I'm glad he, I'm glad Cook took the time. I'm glad they took the time to talk about the other stuff that we're going to get to. I think I think it needed to be said in some form. We know that we've seen for the last few weeks, it's a back and forth dialogue between the Apple and between the Apple and the FBI in terms of who says what to whom and what odd they had to run and what newspaper or on what website. This was Apple's serve, Apple got a chance in its own event to make its pitch. And tomorrow, you know, tomorrow we're going to get it on a neutral court, theoretically, in the case between the Apple, Apple FBI case. And we'll see then. But this was there, how do you pass up an opportunity to have your swing today? And so they took it. Yeah. And I think it was the right thing to do. And then they took an interesting move on from here. And I want to get some thoughts from you in a moment as to why they did may have done this, but they went into two different areas, environment and health. So first up, they brought Lisa Jackson on stage. I believe this is her first outing on the stage for Apple. I think so. And basically, this was all about Apple's renewable energy and their recycling. They're kind of the two big things they're focusing on. 93% of Apple's facilities currently run on renewable energy. They're targeting 100. And they were giving some examples of facilities where they're building their own renewable energy sources where they can't get eco power from the grid. So that was really cool to see some of those. And also they were showing about their efforts in packaging and 99% of their packaging now comes from recycled paper or sustainably managed forests. But the really cool thing that they showed off was an R&D project called Liam. And they even created a little video about this. And Liam is a robot that is disassembling, yeah, or not, disassembling Apple's products. So they showed this little system of detecting parts with a camera, which it can remove. And then it sort of filters them so they can harvest the materials basically for use in later products. This thing is crazy. Yeah, I like the idea that what Apple's saying is that they're not just using their technical acumen to build products, they're actually using some of their technical acumen to build products that disassemble tools, that disassemble their products. So that they're in a better-- because that's one of the problems with electronics recycling is that it's this mixed up set of waste of different kinds of metals and glass and all of these different things that go into this. And so I think it's really interesting that Apple is now highlighting that they built a tool, and she said it was built in California, they built a robot or not, that it's designed to pick apart Apple products so that Apple's recycling efforts of its own products could be more efficient. And the video is really great. People should definitely check out the video. It is a really impressive, cool little bit of machinery. Yeah, I don't know where that video lives. So I will see if I can find that. I assume it's in the presentation stream. Presumably they will post all of those videos on their own at some point to Apple.com. But we're recording this like an hour after the event, so it may not be up yet. Yeah, but it will be at least in the presentation for sure. It's not on their environment page right now, but it might be there. Oh, Kyle's the gray has just sent to me in the chat room the recycling page and the Liam video is at the bottom of the recycling page. This is also a thing that Apple have either revamped or they're pushing more, which is their recycling efforts, bringing in stuff. You can send products to them now. You can print off your shipping labels for free. I'll tell you something I like on the recycling page, Jason. You can't see this. All of the images of the products, they're all dinged up every single one. They've all got scratches on them and nicks taken out of them and it's really fun to see Apple's products on their own website all dinged up like this. So that's really cool. I like that. So they're really promoting this heavily, which is good stuff, you know, to really highlight these types of things a little bit more. Also they went into health and Jeff Williams came on stage again for this. If you remember, Jeff, he introduced research kit and they had an update about research kit today, they were talking about how some of the things that come from research kit are some of the studies have become some of the largest medical studies in history. And this has happened basically overnight because of the amount of people they're able to get onto these programs by offering these apps through the phone. And they showed some really great videos of some of the apps and tools that are helping discover children with autism, highlighting data collection for Parkinson's and epilepsy. And you know, they're really heartwarming videos, but they're a good thing to show because this is stuff that Apple is helping create and they're helping provide the tools for people to go out and make these apps and experiences. And they also showed a care kit today, which is a new framework to build apps specifically to help people take an active role in their care, so that it's starting with like a Parkinson's app to try and help people understand how to take better care of themselves by logging activity and logging their feelings. And they also showed how you can share this information with a doctor and they can update what medications you should be taking and stuff like that. So again, this is just another really nice thing that Apple's doing. And you know, I saw quite a few people mention the dent in the universe line and this stuff does highlight that. I mean, it can be easy when you're talking about these things as an Apple fan to sound sycophantic, right? That you're saying that Apple is amazing because they changed the world by making it better for everyone. But if this stuff really does make a difference in medical care, this is great because you know what? They don't have to do this. Yeah, I think Apple, I mean, we're talking again, we talked about it last year too, about their core values. This is an interesting place where some Apple could just stop at selling a phone or a watch. But it's got a strategy and the strategy involves making money, but it also involves sort of like, how do we take advantage of this technology that's in all of our pockets and on our many of our risks, right? And some of that is health like health and fitness stuff. But definitely they, and I think the reason Jeff Williams is doing a lot of this is because he's so involved with the Apple Watch stuff that this is part of Apple's belief that if we've all got supercomputers in our pockets and we can start to have sensors on our bodies that are all connected, that somebody needs to put all of that together and all that data and be able to again, make the world a better place, right? And I think this is one of those areas where Apple's business motives and maybe it's altruistic motives are in their alignment that this shows off and provides a use for this technology that they're building and selling. But at the same time, I think that there's the question of like, well, who else would do this, right? It's sort of up to the platform vendors to push forward on this. And I don't know what Google's initiatives are in this area for using Android, and if they work with hardware partners on it, they may, and they may have that too. But certainly from Apple's perspective, as the platform owner, as the designer of the hardware and the software for these, so many of these devices, for certainly the iPhone and the Apple Watch, then, you know, it fits with what they're doing. And that's what, to me, that's what that whole first part of this presentation was about is never forget it's a PR event. Apple wants you to know how great they are about doing those things, but it doesn't change the fact that they're doing them. Yeah, definitely. But why do you think Apple chose to open the event in this style? Why not the usual retail updates? Why this kind of messaging, do you think? I think this is, I don't know, I mean, it feels a little bit like an example of Apple rethinking its sort of standard playbook. Like, yes, tell us about how many retail stores you opened. Yes, tell us again how many, you know, activations you've got. They did say they were a billion, you know, Apple devices currently active. But I don't know, do you have to do that every time? When do you get a chance to talk about research kit? Is it at WWDC? You know, maybe, but I, so I think, I don't know, I mean, I think they don't need to remind us how great their numbers are. Also, you know, let's not to be cynical, but the iPhone sales aren't exactly shooting through the stratosphere right now, they've kind of plateaued. So maybe they've decided this is a perfectly good time to get the focus a little bit off of raw numbers. And then I'll throw in there too, when Apple is trying to portray itself in this battle with the FBI, especially as caring about its customers, coming out, is it, is it maybe a liability that they're one of the most profitable companies in history? Does that make it problematic for them to say that they're, they're, they have altruistic motives and they care about their customers when they're incredibly profitable? And it could, it could be seen as boasting about their success. If they do that versus seeming a little more humble and giving back and, and taking that approach, maybe that's a better approach. Tone wise, while they're locked in a battle with the US government over, over these privacy issues. Yeah, it definitely doesn't hurt to, to take this kind of stance from a PR perspective. And I agree, I think as maybe some of the sales numbers get just a little bit less crazier and crazier every time and they become more flat, maybe it becomes less of an exciting story to show them off, I think. Right, well then, then it becomes, yep, we made more money, we made more billions of dollars on the iPhone, yep, which is less exciting than, look at the iPhone growth. It's amazing, we're in these new countries and, and, and you know, look at all of our retail sales, sales expansion. Maybe that's not as big a deal now. So, and you know, people are gonna be much more inclined to listen to a, a company that is talking about how it, it wants to make the world a better place than if it's like Scrooge McDuck diving in a, a giant pool of gold coins, right, which is the, it's being seen as boastful and rich and all of that. Those are not good things to put yourself out as, as being, especially when you're really relying on, on the public to get behind you. Yeah. All right. After this break, we're going to talk about some of the product updates and announcements. But first, let me take a moment to thank our friends over ITProTV for making this episode possible. Do you have a career plan set in motion? Were they all looking to start a career in IT or you're already working in the field? Certifications and credentials are key to getting a job or promotion. 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They create all of their stuff with live streams and chat rooms so you can go on just like how you might be listening to this show or any of the shows that we do. So it's go ahead and get that podcast feel and then they edit them down, polish them up, add transcripts and put them on their site. This is a fantastic way to learn and to learn in a way that you're used to learning and enjoying podcasts. ITProTV also has over 100 step by step virtual machine labs and transcender practice exams which usually cost $109. It's one low monthly subscription price of a no hassle cancellation policy. If you're a working ITPro, this is an ongoing resource that you will want and need to keep your skills current and it's much cheaper than something like a bootcamp. So you're really going to get a great value here and talking about that value. You can check out itpro.tv/upgrade to boost your brain with the most popular IT certifications. 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The watch does now start at $299 so there's been a price drop which is great. But the product is getting a bit old now so a price drop is not crazy. This will probably help shift some of the stock that they've got in advance of new hardware later in the year. So we have a few new bands. We have a woven nylon band. It's kind of like the NATO bands that people were talking about. The images that Apple showed on stage, they didn't look too great to me. The images on Apple's website from Verge hands on look nicer. So I'm assuming you've seen these bands. Jason, what's your opinion? They're not for me but they're nice. I like, you know, we had those rumors about that we're going to do the NATO watch strap style sort of thing. And instead it's more like Apple's take on that with the woven nylon. So if you want a woven fabric band, they look nice. That's not not my preference in terms of style but they look nice. And then they also did, and Tim Cook actually said I believe spring colors. These are our spring colors. So it's fascinating to see the fashion angle here where they refresh the colors. So they're like, I don't know, I have a picture of it. Like 20 new bands. If you count all the different colors of all the different styles, there's even like sport, the sport band, the orange that I've got, that's out. There's a new orange. And so see, this is what I'm saying, it's fascinating because it's all about personalization and style and fashion. And I think that's fun. I wish Apple would get beyond the four colors of the iPhone and a MacBook. I wish we would have some more fun colors in the other products they make. Well, all of the colors, the new spring colors are reflected in the in new cases for the iPhone. Yeah, you can put a case on that. That's fine. I just, you know, I would love the iPhone to get colorful again, or colorful like the Nanos got colorful at some point. I know we've talked about that before, but but yeah, they, you know, it's more styles and there was a statistic too. I forget what it was that what a third of Apple Watch users wear more than one band. I didn't catch that, but that doesn't surprise me. Yeah. And, and I'm one of those people. I have three different bands. I switched them around. I like wearing them all and it's, it's just kind of fun. It makes my watch feel more fun to wear because it's not the same old, same old all the time. You know, I wear the orange for a while. I've got the orange on now or in sport. And then I'll think, Oh, I'm going to switch to the black leather now and I'll wear that for a little while. And then I'll switch to the black sport. And just it's, it's fun to have that. I, I, you know, I am not a fashionable person. So it's, I'm not really doing it so much to be seen as I am to, to just have kind of fun and enjoy what I'm wearing and just have it not seem that like, you know, it's like you bought a new thing except you didn't, you just walked in a new band for a while. So the new sport bands that I'm personally interested in, there is a yellow, a royal blue and the product red. So I wanted to go to a store and look at those. They have the woven nylon bands, which I want to take a look at. I'm hoping that maybe I, there'll be in the Apple stores tomorrow. I'll take a look on to see if I can reserve one and go take a look at one. They have a new black Milanese loop and they, for the first time, have colors in the classic buckle. So they have a bunch of colored leather and colors in the modern buckle as well. So they're branching out of just the standard ones there. Yeah, there was a, there was like a purpley, purpley or bluey kind of I'm bad with colors. Classic buckle that I really, I thought looked really great. Yeah. And I know, I thought of you the moment I saw this, I thought of you and I thought, oh, Mike's going to be going to the Apple store and stare at the pretty new colors and come home with a new Apple watch band or two. I love them. I really, as you say, like it's about the customization thing and I like changing them up. I think it's fun that they're not massively expensive. I mean, look, if you add up how much money I will have ended up spending, you know, I could end up getting close to buying another Apple watch. But my hope would be that these will work on my next one too. So I think, you know, this is just a fun little thing. I like to do it in the same way that people would buy close. So that's all that we have on the Apple watch, which is not surprising. I think that was the way that we expected. I think maybe we got more band customization than we thought we were going to get. You know, some of those modern buckle and lever, buck, the modern buckle and the, the clasp one and the classic buckle that, you know, I think that we weren't really expecting to get all of those. So, you know, there's more there. Then we move on to the Apple TV, not really much mentioned here, just, TVOS 9.2 is now available. It has folders and dictation. Then they mentioned on stage. Was this, was this Jaws giving this part of the presentation? Yeah. Greg Jawswiak, who, who has been an Apple forever and occasionally appears in, in, in keynotes and other media events. And it was Jaws doing the, doing the, did he do, he did the iPhone? Did he do the Apple TV or was that, that, that would have been Tim Cook. Yeah. It was either Tim or Craig, I think. Basically the usual, the usual suspect weren't on stage today. It was, it was Tim, I think. Craig Federicky was on stage today. And never was Eddie. No, it said that was, that was Greg Jawswiak. So the Apple TV stuff, I mean, it's, it's the stuff that was in the beta. So people who've been following the beta know about it. But, you know, I think for me, most notable is support for iCloud photo library. The fact, and for every Apple TV update, we're gonna say the same thing, which is why was that not in there when it launched? But it's in there now. Why, that was one of the great mysteries to me. And yeah, dictation, support for dictation, support for more data sources with even more on the way. Tim Cook said that that was Tim Cook, because I remember him, he got to say, great HBO, like Game of Thrones and Veep. And of course Silicon Valley. So, so yeah, that's all, that's all good. It's just, it's funny. I'm not, I don't want to complain about it, because I think it's great that they keep iterating on Apple TV and they should keep iterating on it. It's a little bit funny that, that a lot of this stuff has taken six months to get on the device. But it's great that they're doing it. I'm very happy to see after, you know, what a couple of years of stasis with the old Apple TV that they, the shipping of the Apple TV last fall was not the end of the conversation that they're actively adding new stuff to it to this day. That's actually great to see. You know, when I, when I hear this is like, and we look at this, it's like, I think it would have maybe just been easier for them if this just wasn't called the Apple TV. It was called something else. Because this was a product that already existed. We're on the fourth generation of it and we took major steps back and eventually it will be better and much better. It already is better in some instances, but we lost some features that we were kind of clawing back over time. And it's like, well, it is kind of, it is a different product, really, but it unfortunately shares the same name. But it would be, your comparison would be to the MacBook, right, where the new MacBook is not the MacBook Air, which means that we can complain about it being slower than the MacBook Air, but it's not the MacBook Air. You can't say the MacBook Air just got slower because it's a different product with different attributes. And that with the Apple TV, it's just the Apple TV. So it, it looks like a, you know, it's progress on some fronts and regression on others and, you know, but it's good. Like I said, it's good to see this stuff. I can say that maybe some of it should have been there sooner, but you know, it's there now. And that's good. That's raining. Can you hear that comes the rain? Yeah, this is the one thing we were hoping wouldn't happen. It is coming down hard. Don't you live in California? Yeah, I guess we get all of our rain in a very short burst. It's right now, which is right, leaving, leaving Apple. I, it started to rain and I, people were scurrying and Apple PR people were like, engage rain protocol, because the event was, as I mentioned at the beginning, when I was driving down here, the event was, this is like a downpour. People were like, stopped on the freeway. This is amazing. The event was, was held in town hall, but we entered through R&D one. So they had to station people throughout the entire center of the Apple campus to show us where to go, and more specifically to have a stay away from places the public is not supposed to go. And so those people all got very wet. Some of them had umbrellas, but I think when they engage the rain protocol, that's what they were doing. It's basically trying to figure out, like, can we hand out the rain codes to the people? Or do they, do they have everybody exits some other direction or something? I don't know. In California, we don't expect the rain. And so it's always a surprise when it comes. So moving on, we have the iPhone. So iPhone is up next. And basically, this is all about the iPhone SE, which is the product name. Apple kind of did a good job here, which is something I think they've been criticized that lately. And actually, they do a good job with the iPad as well, and which we'll talk about in a bit of explaining why this product exists. This has been a criticism of previous keynotes, I think, in the tech press and other podcasts is they're not they weren't doing a good job explaining why the product exists. But they make this very clear. Well, you're going against conventional wisdom here, too, right? The conventional wisdom is the future is bigger phones. So why would you not? Why would you do something that was not a bigger phone? Why, why in the world would you go backward? And so they have to say I'll tell you why is because they sold 30 million four inch funds in 2015. Yep. And again, this comes back to perspective. We tech savvy people where we're buying the more expensive phone, we're on the cutting edge, we want the giant screen. Our priorities are not the priorities of everybody. And that's what they said is like in certain parts of the world. And in people buying their first smartphone, there are lots of scenarios where this is the this is the phone that they want is the four inch phone. And they sold a lot of them. And so it may be boring to us. It may be a small part of the market compared to the whole smartphone market. But it's still important. And I think the larger story is Apple needed a modern product to replace the five S, right? Because they still want a product in that slot. They want a product of that size. They want a product of that price. But the five S is just too old. It's too slow. It doesn't do touch ID. It's just like, or I mean, not touch ID doesn't do apple pay. It's like all of these things that it can't do. The camera isn't very good. You got to do something there. And so this is, we kind of called it a couple years ago, right? I think we talked about this a year, a year plus ago, that at some point they were going to have to decide, does the four inch phone fall off the bottom of the price list or not? And if not, what do you do? And this is the answer, which is, you know, we need to update the insides and make it a success essentially on the inside, even though it looks like a five S on the outside. Yeah. So which is essentially what they did from a cosmetic perspective. Basically, all they seem to mention on stage was matte chamfered edges and it has all the colors and, you know, they have the reflective apple logo. There was rumors of curved glass on the edges. Did you find this? I'm sure you've seen and handled this at the essay. Yes, I held it in my hand. It is, it is a five S. It is a five S through and through. You would not, other than some very subtle things, I'd say most notably very subtly that the apple on the back is different. And the fact that the chamfers are matte and not shiny. It is a, it is a five S. It, it looks no different. It isn't that it's that style. If you wanted a, if you're hoping for a four inch phone that looked like an iPhone six, you're not going to get it because it is a dead ringer for the iPhone five S. So I guess this was one of the things from the gum and rumors that didn't really pan out that way, right? Yeah, I wonder, um, we were also talking at the event about, you know, one of the challenges about not having any leaks for this product is how would you know if it, if it looks exactly like the, the five S, how would you even know that it was, um, it was not the five S, right? That you know, part leak would do a justice because all the, the, the chassis at least is exactly the same or almost exactly the same. So that's a, that's a way for apple to do things in secret is not change the case. I don't know how far that's going to work. Uh, no, probably has limited usefulness, but it worked in this case. So talking about the insides of this thing, it's a success in a small body. It has the A nine and the M nine, uh, significantly improved battery has a 12 megapixel, megapixel camera, focus pixels, true tone flash, live photos, retina flash on the front, because the phone's thicker. There's no camera bump, um, as apple pay in it as well. This is, you know, for all intents and purposes, this is an iPhone six S mini. It really is. It really is. And, uh, I think some people will be surprised that it's, it's so powerful. My gut feeling is that it's this powerful because they probably don't expect to update this product every year. Yeah. Like what happened with the mini? Exactly. Right. You, you make it, you make it the iPad air too, right? Yeah. Where you make it really powerful. And then you don't need to update it for a couple of years. And that's the, I think that's what they're doing here is that I don't, I don't think any year we're going to see a new bumped iPhone SE. I think the iPhone SE will be like this for a couple of years. And then at some point, maybe they will bump it to the iPhone seven or seven S spec. But, um, but right now it's a success to all intents and purposes. I mean, the processor may be clocked down. I don't know. Um, and I don't know about the RAM in it. Um, but it, but yeah, I mean, I asked about the, the camera and they said, well, the body is different because the phone body is different, but that the camera itself is 12 megapixel camera. I mean, it's basically a success camera does live photos, does big panoramas, it does all the stuff that the, that the iPhone six S does, uh, just in a smaller size. I think for people who really like that size and are not enamored with the bigger phone, other than the fact that it's, um, the way you get the latest greatest, uh, you know, you're essentially not going to get me compromised if you, if you get the four inch phone right now, it's, you're getting, I'll grant you, you're getting last year's phone, right? That is something to think about is it's the current phone, but it's last year's phone. It's the 2015 specs, um, in the 2016 product and maybe the 2017 product. But, um, right now it's, yeah, it's, it's on class with the iPhone success and success plus. So do you think that there's going to be, um, a significant amount of people that go back down to the smaller size now that the performance is there? Oh, it's, it's a good question. I feel like, um, I feel like it's, a lot of us are going to just be used to the, uh, to the size and not, and not go back, right? Just because it's like once you get the bigger screen size, it's awfully hard to give it up. But I do think there is a class of user who never upgraded because they, they, um, they wanted the small size. And I believe there's a class of user who upgraded to the bigger phone because they wanted the latest, greatest hot phone and doesn't love the size, but it's put up with it. So I do think that there are people from, in both of those camps, I think most people aren't. I think most people are going to be happy with the six or the six plus, or success and success plus size. Uh, but there will definitely be, um, some people who go back and some people who never left and now don't have to. What do you have any other thoughts of your own? Like, I assume looking at this device outside of the fact that you've already used a five S before and you know what, uh, iOS 9.3 looks like there probably isn't much exciting going on to talk about. I think the excitement is if, if you're using a five S, you're using a phone that's two years old, two and a half years old now. And if you update to this, the excitement is, you know, it is, if you draw the line from the five S, it's like twice as fast and has better battery life and has this much better camera and does Apple pay and all these features, every feature that has come in the last two and a half years to iPhones you haven't gotten because you're still on the five S. So from that perspective is where it's especially impressive. Uh, for the rest of us, yeah, it is if you can picture all the functionality of an iPhone six S in an iPhone five S, that's it. That's what it is. Like literally, that's what it is. It has almost nothing else about it is different. It's, it's, it's, uh, this year's model in, you know, the last two years ago model's body. So this, uh, this phone is starting at $3.99 for 16 gigabytes. Do you have any feeling about 16 gigabyte? Uh, I saw people complaining about it on the internet because that's what people do. Yeah. Um, I don't know. I, I feel like for the essentially free phone, the free with contract rock bottom prices phone, I'm kind of okay with the 16. Same. There, there is a 64 option. Yep. For $100 more. Uh, you know, when they make the case, when they make the case that this is a, a phone that sells well to people who are looking for a cheaper phone or getting their first phone, I think this goes to that, which is, um, this is the low, this is the low phone on their price list. They got to have places where they cut back. And this is not where I would complain about it being base 16. I'm going to complain more about 16 as a base in an iPhone seven, but the iPhone SE, I think it's understandable that that would start at the rock bottom, like just as low as we can possibly make it and still sell it. So, so it doesn't, it doesn't bother me. Does it bother you? Um, in this phone, no, it doesn't because it is cheaper and this is the phone that for many people, they want to be as cheap as possible. So if this keeps the price down any, uh, then it's, every, you know, every penny is, is well saved. Um, we did just have somebody else go over Twitter. Does this have, uh, 3D touch this one? I don't think it does, right? It does not know. That's the one thing that it is missing from the success done. Yes. Yes. Um, yeah. So as you said, there's a 64 gigabyte, which is 499, pre-orders on March 24th, available on March 31st and it'll be in 100 countries by the end of May. Yep. Yeah. And I think, I think, I think it'll do well for them because as they put up the stats, the 5S has been doing well for them and this is a way better phone. So I, I think it's going to do well for them. All of us, again, tech nerds are going to be bored by it, but it's not for us. So this was, again, another strange thing today. Um, and talking about the justification of this product and in the justification of the smaller iPad Pro, they gave numbers away. So they, they gave numbers away of how many, uh, 4-inch fans of sold and they gave numbers away about how many, uh, you know, 9.7 inch iPads have been sold. I know. They're teasing us. They love, they love bringing out those numbers. They know all the details, right? Yeah. And they, they don't have to release those in the financials and every now and then they do. And this is where you see the chart from Horace Day 2 where he's gotten like three times they've mentioned this figure and I can make a chart from that, right? Where, where, but it's not something we get every quarter. So you have to do some intuit, intuiting of the numbers and what they all mean. So I love it when they do that. They drop, they drop just enough data to help their case, but it's not data we've heard before and we may never hear it again. It's hilarious, but they did. They, they talked about how many of those small phones they've sold and how many of those, uh, normal sized iPads they've sold. The last thing on, on iPhone, I guess, was is it, it was in this segment. Uh, iOS nine, uh, sorry, iOS 9.3, uh, is available today. Yes. Yeah. So I, I, I've been running anything to say there that we don't already know. I've been running that data for a while. Have you, I know that there was a funny moment on, uh, for people who aren't listening to Canvas, which is a great show about iOS productivity with, with, uh, Fraser and Federico. They, they were making statements about what the iPad can do based on the 9.3 beta and somebody wrote in to say, why can't my device do that and turned out, oh, that's because you're not on the beta. Um, I have, I have nothing, but, but my highest recommendations for nine, three, I've been running the beta on that iPad pro for a while. It fixes a lot of iPad pro problems with nine, two, and, uh, has been very stable for me. Yeah. I've, you know, outside of the issue that I have, but the pencil, which is now been resolved, uh, also nothing but good things to say about nine, three, uh, night shift really is a fantastic feature and it's worth upgrading alone just for that. Um, it really will change the way that you think about using your device. It's lovely. I really like it. Like, you know, it's made me go and install flux on my Mac because I was enjoying the, the, the, I enjoyed it so much. I wish that, uh, they could have done it or could do it with the Apple watch because now I have this bright blue light on my wrist in the evenings. Ah, but it seems that I would assume they would have done that if they could have done that. Maybe the display technology is not good enough to do that. All right. Let's take our next break. Um, and then we'll start talking about the iPad. Uh, this week's episode is brought to you by fresh books. Fresh books are on a mission to help small business owners save time and avoid all of the stress and complication that comes with running your own business, small businesses is what they're out to help. And all of this stuff and a lot of the stress that comes with running a business is around invoicing and getting the money in and fresh books has created a super intuitive tool that takes this pain away by making the ability to create and send invoices really simple. It takes just 30 seconds to create and send an invoice when you use fresh books. You can add your company logo for their extra touch. And my favorite thing is they give you so many different ways for your client to give you the money that they owe you. Um, they make it super simple to add payments by card, integrate with services like PayPal. They have their own payment system. They can let you put on information for checks for bank transfers. They make it possible for you to receive payments no matter how you want. Uh, this will improve seriously how quickly you get paid. Uh, fresh books have done some studies on this and their customers get paid about five days faster on average. One of my other favorite things you can see whether somebody has looked at an invoice that you sent them. So no more excuses for lost invoices. And also it just helps you know that somebody's dealing with something. So let's say for example, somebody has missed their payment date, you know, like I said, number 30 day terms and it's day 31 or something and I'm going in and checking. I can go on to the history and see, oh, they printed this two days ago. That checks on its way. Stuff like that really helps me as a small business owner to also not put my foot in it with my customers as well, which I really like. You can also set up automatic late payment reminders as well if you want that. Um, so it's all really good stuff as well as invoicing. You can keep track of your expenses. You can scan in receipts with their mobile app. Their mobile apps also really good for sending out invoices. I do that on my iPhone. If I'm maybe out somewhere and have something that I need to take care of, they have loads of third party integration. It's super important to them. There's no phone tree. You call fresh books and someone will pick up. You don't have to be a numbers person to understand fresh books. I use it every day and I'm definitely not a numbers person. Fresh books is offering a 30 day free trial to listeners of this show. No credit card required to claim your 30 days of unrestricted use. Go to fresh books dot com slash upgrade and please enter upgrade in the how you heard about our section. This will let fresh books know that you've come from this show. Thank you so much to fresh books for their support of upgrade and relay FM. Alright, so I would say that this is probably the main event. The iPad. Oh, yeah. So basically the kind of the spiel this is Phil on stage doing this. He said many people are telling us that the iPad pro is becoming their primary computing device. They had lots of quotes from people about how the iPad pro and the pencil is really helping those who work in design. They had John Lasseter up there. They had a couple of other people whose names I can't remember but you know, I've just read creativity ink. So John Lasseter's name is in blazoned in my brain. Right. Christopher Finn, who used to be the editor at Mac format, I want to say. And they quoted him, which was which was fun to see somebody I know quoted as praising the pencil. Basically, they have introduced what Apple's referring to as the second member of the iPad pro family. It is 9.7 inches and weighs less than a pound. And Apple, again, they address why are we making this, right? They are saying that the display, the 9.7 inch display is the display that they started with because it's large, but easy enough to carry. It's portable. It's the most popular iPad size. They said they sold 200 million iPads in that size since they first started selling iPads. And so again, you can you can kind of work out how many with that number, you can now go back and work out how many iPad minis have been sold, you know, up to a certain point, you know, there's, Horace did you can run around with his harem fire with that number now. He will. He was there today too. So I'm sure he was writing all those numbers down. He probably already had the chart going. Also, this is something really interesting. They spent quite a bit of time talking about Windows here. And they basically said that the majority of people that come to Apple products from Windows go to the iPad, not the Mac. And then they gave us statistic that there are 600 million PCs in use that are over five years old and Apple want these people. So I think I've seen some people, you know, saying, Oh, that's good. They're still running. I don't think the point was the Apple was saying, look how old all these PCs are. I think their point was these people are due for an upgrade soon. And they want to make sure that they can be that upgrade with the iPad. And they referred to the iPad as the ultimate PC replacement in more than one instance here. This is a repositioning of the iPad. And I am thrilled to see this marketing message. Yeah, it's it's funny. You know, they talk about it in terms of Windows PCs because they don't want to trample on the Mac, which did the Mac, which didn't get mentioned at all. We'll get to that. I think that's good. I was talking to John Gruber afterward. He pointed out quite rightly that it's sort of a hard sell to say this makes laptops obsolete. Also, we hear some new laptops. Right? Yeah, how do you how do you do that? That's my feeling on this as well. So so you kind of leave those as separate. Um, yeah, this is seeing it as an opportunity. I know they feel that people use PCs for if you think about a five year old and older PC. These are people who bought a PC. A lot of them because they needed something to get on the internet, right? Again, we have to have the perspective here of not like a super tech enthusiast, but just as as a regular person, there was a time not too long ago where there were a whole class of things that we do that we considered computer things, right? And we don't anymore because we have iPads and smartphones. We don't consider those the computer. The personal computer is not the only way to do those things. But the people who bought these PCs, some percentage of them bought them for like email or to see the web. And I'm sure Apple's done a lot of research on this front. Those people are ripe to replace those things with iPads because they don't need anything more than an iPad to do those things. My mom is like that. My mom had a computer, had a MacBook Pro to do email and the web and some photos. And it was overkill, but that was sort of like the best way to get it. But she replaced that her, her, her MacBook with an iPad Pro, or iPad Air. And it's fine because she didn't need a computer, she didn't need a PC to do what she did. And so I think that's what Apple is looking at when they're thinking of that opportunity. You could also argue we've talked about a little bit. I know I've said that I think Microsoft Office is really great on iOS. There are people for whom the iPad is probably fine because their idea of why they have a computer is Microsoft Office, like is Excel or Word. And even for those people, there's a story for the iPad. So, you know, it's, I think it's interesting that they're going straight at old PCs, but I think it also makes sense. It goes back to the kind of initial argument about the iPad, which is for a lot of people, it's that car truck argument in a way. For a lot of people, you really don't need to buy another PC if you're in the market for a new device to replace your Windows PC. Why would you buy another PC? You don't need to use it for any of those things. The iPad will do it all and be lighter and better. So then they go on to talk about this product in a little bit more detail. So, well, they throw in 1 million iPad apps. You know, fine. Basically, we have the same display materials here. They sit as the iPad Pro, the 12.9, but they have something new called Truton, which appears to just be in the 9.7 iPad Pro for now. Yeah, there are a couple features that are only in the 9.7 iPad Pro, and we're really going to have to come up with some shorthand for these things because 9.7 inch iPad Pro is a mouthful. Yeah. Let's see where this ends up settling down. Maybe Marco can give it a name like he did MacBook 1. Yeah, I saw Michael Gartenberg and Serenity Caldwell both were calling it the Baby Pro. So we'll see. But at least for now, let's continue with 9.7 and 12.9. So there's Truton, and then really quickly, the other feature that's slightly interesting is a wider color gamut. So you know, when the 5K iMac got revved and the 4K iMac came out, they had the support for this better color gamut. They showed more colors than the old 5K iMac that I've got. That's the color gamut on the new iPad Pro, the 9.7 inch. It's got, and not on the big iPad Pro. So they're putting that wider color gamut into mobile devices now, and this is the first one to get it. So as well as the wide color gamut was this Truton, which is basically some additional sensors that measure ambient light and adjust the color temperature of the display to make the display a bit more natural looking. This sounds really great. I've got to say, I'm a little bit miffed that this is in just this version. It's interesting to me that just after a couple of months of the iPad Pro existing that the line has not only been duplicated, but bifurcated. That is an interesting decision to make on Apple's part here. Yeah, I guess gone are the days of everything moving in lockstep, right? Now things are just sort of like new features keep coming into the product line, and then keep moving out of the product line. I wonder, there's a whole thing to be considered about what this means for the iPad Pro, the big one. Like, now that there's some pencil support in the smaller device and all these other things that are great in the smaller device, the iPad Pro is now a different choice, right? It's a choice based on wanting the size more than it is wanting the features, right? Because the smaller iPad now has sort of be interesting to see how that goes. I too am kind of bummed out that my iPad Pro doesn't have a sensor, so all these devices have ambient light sensors so you can have it auto adjust the brightness, and I always hated that, and generally I've turned that off in most of my devices because I always hate sitting somewhere and the lighting slightly changes in the room and suddenly my iPhone gets dimmer, really bugs me. But this is really interesting in that now it's detecting the color temperature of the light in a room that you're in and adjusting the white point on the display, which is really cool. That's a cool idea that if you're in a room with really yellow light, what happens is your eyes adapt and your eyes do what photographers would call a white balance in a camera because a camera is not eyes. Your eyes adapt and say that this yellow light on this white piece of paper is white, but your iPad doesn't change color and their demo is really smart. The iPad is always just like whatever color temperature it's set to. In a yellowish light, it's still going to have this really blueish light. With this sensor, if you're in yellowish light, it's going to reset its white point to that and everything on the screen is going to be yellowish, which on one level you'd be like, "Well wait, hold on a second. I don't want that." But in a lot of cases you probably do want that. It probably feels a lot more natural to use the device and if you've ever flipped open your iPad or your iPhone in a dim and sort of yellowy lit room and then shocked at how bright and blue the light seems. This is the feature that prevents that and you can turn it on and off. So if you don't like it, it's system wide, you just turn it off and it doesn't do it anymore, just like the night shift setting. Then we have four stereo speakers, the A9X and the M9, like the larger iPad Pro. Then accessories. This is where it starts to get a little bit interesting. So we have a new smart keyboard to fit the size. Did you get to try this? I did. They shrunk down the keys. The only way to get a keyboard on that smaller iPad is to make all the keys smaller. So while the smart keyboard cover on the iPad Pro, big iPad Pro is a full-size keyboard, this isn't. This is a shrunken down keyboard and otherwise it feels exactly the same as the other one and they tried to make the modifier keys a little bit smaller so that they could I'm sure maximize the amount of key cap size for all the keys. But if you're used to typing on a standard size keyboard, this one is not going to do it for you because it's not that size. It's scaled down. For some people, it won't matter. It's going to really depend on your personal typing preferences. But it does not have going for it what the regular iPad Pro keyboard cover has going for it, which is it's a standard keyboard layout. This is a shrunken down keyboard layout. They then say that the greatest accessory Apple has ever made, the Apple Pencil is also enabled for this iPad Pro. I agree with that. They're not making a smaller version of the pencil, so that's good news. The little pencil mini is not happening. It's just a regular old pencil. That would be bad though. There is a new SD card reader and a new powered USB camera adapter, but this is only half the story because this thing has a USB cable on and Sheila's specifically called out on stage, you can do your podcasts right from an iPad Pro. Yeah, so he mentioned podcasts on stage from the iPad Pro. That blew me away. That was very interesting to even mention that. I know, "Oh, a podcast doesn't want to attach microphones to it." And then I thought about whether I should applaud. I didn't want to be the only one applauding, and then Renee Richie started applauding, and I immediately started applauding with him. And we got a round of applause for podcasters using microphones on the iPad Pro. Let's get real here for a moment, shall we? I mean, congratulations. We have a piece of hardware. Were we not real before? Where is the software that we need to go along? Now, this is an Apple thing, but you know, it's fantastic that you can use a good microphone. I don't know if it's going to power the setup that I would need. Who knows? We can find out. Maybe it would. But, you know, what I would want to know is that I have the software to use alongside it. And what I want to be able to do is to have a call, doesn't have, you know, in the background, and also record that call. Now, until that happens, nobody's doing. Well, there are people, but I can't, just because you've given me the ability to have a bit of microphone, that actually doesn't really help too much. I mean, it's great that you can do it, but it's one step. The next step is being able to record the call. Right. And, you know, when you announce a product like this, you're trying to come up with an example of how you use this. It's funny that they still call it the camera connector, and yet everybody knows, and it's even recognized on stage when it's announced. They're like, yeah, it's called the camera connector, and you can connect your camera, but you can connect other USB devices, too. Two, like, podcasters with microphones. So my question is... Why don't you call it the USB connector? Well, one, why not call it the USB connector? Two, why did you bring up the podcast? Did you just feel you wanted another example? Why did you bring it up on stage? And three, if you care enough to use that as an example, will you care enough to add better support for audio recording into iOS 10? I guess we'll have to wait and see for that one. But if they do, then we'll all point back to this announcement and be like, aha, see, that's where they were going. And if they don't, we'll be like, you know, said, trombone, oh, well. Because I'll say it, right? Like, people have been asking me about it, as you can imagine. I mean, the fact that you can power... This is step one. This was the first thing that I wanted. It was the ability to use, hopefully, any microphone I want, or better microphones than the ones that currently work. That is step one. Step two is the software part. And if that comes to bear, yeah, I would do it. I mean, I don't think I would change my every day podcast recording. But on location and stuff like that, 100%, I would just use the iPad then. And, you know, if Apple puts support for this sort of stuff into iOS, would I have a problem with Federico doing it then? No, I wouldn't. Like, my issue right now with, say, like someone like him doing this is purely because it just can't work elegantly. You know, there are people that do it, but they have to do it in really weird ways. Like, what we're doing today is similar. Like, I'm speaking to you over your iPhone headset. And then we have a recording at the end. But I can't hear you as clearly that affects the way that, you know, that I can interpret what you're saying. And I want to hear you as clearly as I can. My better microphone is not attached to my iPhone. It's attached to a recorder that is sitting here on my passenger seat, recording me with this clip on microphone, on my shirt. But you can't hear that right as we record this live. But in the final recording, people will be able to hear that one. And this is the, this is a case where if you can unify that so that I can attach a good microphone and record it on my end, and you can hear it live, and then I can send you my recording when I'm done, then we will have solved it. But it's not, that requires some software help from Apple, really, in order to get it to work right. So maybe we'll, maybe we'll get there. And there are a few ways Apple could do it, too. You know, Apple could do it. I don't want to spend too much time podcasters talking about podcasting, but Apple could do it by changing things in the system. Apple could also do it by supporting some of the audio controls in the web browser that my Chrome supports. And then you could actually potentially use web apps to do it. Which would be a pretty sweet solution. But I would really rather, I would really rather Apple made it possible to just sort of like record arbitrarily from an input device while other apps are running and using the same input devices. That's what I really want is I want, I want rogue amoeba to be able to make audio hijack for iOS. And let me say, okay, here's my microphone that I'm going to use on this Skype call, we'll start recording it, and then switch to Skype and make a call. And right now you can't do that. You can't have them both function simultaneously. No, and it would be lovely. Anyway, it's the other piece of the puzzle was always how do you know, I bought, I in fact bought a USB hub the other week on Amazon, specifically so that I could power a microphone attached to an iPad. And this will probably make that unnecessary, which is pretty cool. So in the usual, what happens after these events, little bits come out that you might not know about. So it's an interesting thing. The 12.9 inch iPad Pro transfers data over that adapter at USB three speeds. The 9.7 is at USB two speeds. Uh huh, take that thing, iPad Pro. You keep your display warmth. We got you there. There's also a new 29 watt USB-C power adapter that enables faster charging on these devices. Huh, that makes I mean, that makes sense, right? Because there's so much USB-C to, to lightning. Yeah. Yeah. Preparing us for the USB-C future. Yep. Yep. Then also we have the camera. So the camera on the new iPad, it's as good a camera as I believe in the iPhone, the current iPhones. But it's got a bump. Yeah, the camera bump has moved from the iPhone 6 to the iPad Pro. It's got a bump. It's got the same bump. Yep. Yeah. So did you get, I'm sure you got to handle this device. Did you get to see if that affected anything? I didn't put it flat down on the table and try to write on it. My guess is that it would probably not be a very serious little, you know, it would rock a little bit. But I didn't get a chance to try that out. I did some sketching in my hands, which is fun because, you know, on the iPad Pro you kind of need to put it down to do that. And I was able to just hold the iPad, the small iPad Pro in my hand and sketch with the other hand. That was pretty cool. That was pretty cool. But I didn't, I didn't lay it down and check what the kind of like, whether it rocks too much on a flat surface. I imagine somebody will complain about it and somebody else will say it's fine. And that's where it'll probably end up. But it definitely has the same bump. Hmm. Then how about that? That's, that's upsetting. Yeah, that the camera bump is such an upsetting thing for it to go on to another device, you know, if you use a case, it's fine. But I wouldn't use a case on an iPad, like on the back. I use a case on my iPhone, so I never noticed the bump. But I don't think I would like it so much on a device that I very frequently have flat on a desk and interact with it. And if there is a rock on that, I would notice that way more than an iPhone because you, I don't think you have an iPhone down on a desk interacting with it as much as you do an iPad. Maybe with the, with the smart cover flipped around to the back, it would be fine if you use it like that. You know, so it could be okay that way. I don't know if it would rock on the smart cover, probably not. So it might still be okay. But I know a lot of people like to use their devices completely clean, especially the iPad. So it's a shame. It's a shame. But they got to put the camera in there, but then on the other side, for most people, they don't really care about the camera. Do you want to know something exciting? I do. I'm home. So the car cost was a success, but you're now back in your office. Well, the car cast was such a rousing success that the listeners of this podcast just accompanied me on a drive from Cupertino to Mill Valley. You can do the math. You can see how it works. I went through a rainstorm, but I'm home now. Yeah, as you can tell, because there are no more car sounds. So just going back a second then, so we can pick back up. I mean, I assume that Apple are aware of how many people use cameras on these devices. So we complain that, you know, now this thing might rock on the table, depending on how you use it. They wouldn't put this camera in there unless they need it too, right? They didn't do it on the pro because maybe they're assuming people would take photos less on that because it's so big. I assume that they know that people use this camera, and that's why they've gone the link's top grading it. I assume so. I think that this comes back to Apple knowing things that we don't we may scoff at, but that everybody else knows. And we saw this. We've seen this the last couple of times that they've updated the iPad. It feels like they are embracing the fact that people use the iPad to take pictures. And so they might as well put a good good camera back there. And, you know, they took some time for them to kind of come around from the idea that it wasn't necessary, but they've come around now. Yeah, so we'll see. I don't know about that one. There are colors, like cases, and there are also colors of the device. So you can get the device in gold and rose gold, which can't get the 12.9 and the colored cases, like the smart covers and stuff, they have color versions. You also still can't get those for the 12.9. Well, this is the pro device. 12.9 is for serious business and 9.7 is for fun. Monochrome. Very peculiar. Yeah, I don't get it. It may just be that it's not worth it, that they're not enough. The sales are not big enough, that it's worth having that many variations. Yeah, I guess so, right? I guess so. But it's just strange because they're making them now. Yeah, we haven't talked about the price. I mean, this is the aspect of it that's interesting too, as the Air 2 was cheaper. Yeah, so this starts at 5.99 for the 32, right? Yep. So that's an interesting wrinkle, is that it's 5.99 and 32. That's where it begins. And it's calling it pro, all of these things, there are plenty of good reasons for it, but it is interesting that that's the case. And it goes up to a massive 256 gigabytes, which is now on the 12.9, which will take your purchase price over a thousand dollars. If you go for the big iPad Pro, I think with LTE, oh yeah, we haven't without LTE, the 256 will take you over a thousand dollars. Sure. $1,300 for the 256 with LTE. 256 though, that's pretty cool, huh? What would you do with that amount of space on an iPad? I don't even know. I don't even know either photos. How many photos is that? That's a lot of photos. That's a lot of photos. Movies, but like, do you really need, I don't know, I guess you could fill it, but I'd be surprised if many people would fill it right now. All right, but we have the product line, we have the naming. So we have iPad Mini, iPad Air 2, iPad Pro, 9.7 inch, iPad Pro, 12.9 inch. That's what the slide said. Yeah. Yep. I don't really, you know, it seems like Apple are referring to them as the 9.7 and the 12.9. I guess fine if that's how you want to do it. It's not massively complicated. They drop the numbers on the iPad Mini. I don't know why they still call it iPad Air 2 when it doesn't seem like they're selling any other iPad Airs. Well, I mean, it's the version, right? They're iPhone 6. Yeah, but they still iPad Mini 4 is still called the iPad Mini 4. It just said iPad Mini on the slide. But okay, so there you go. They used a line at the end which they used a bunch. They called the iPad Pro the future of personal computing. So yeah, I think that really wraps into why we didn't see Max today. I think so. I think it's a different conversation, different audience. The Mac is, I would be surprised if they even, I mean, I think the Mac is going to get, some people are going to get invites and get briefings and then there's going to be a press release and some Embargos will drop. And that's how we'll find out about new Max. Between now and WWDC, do you think? Yeah, probably. The rumors are that that stuff is ready to go. So that'll probably happen maybe next month. That makes sense. I really do think that this was a decision to make a statement about the iPad. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. And calling it Pro is interesting because they're saying this is a, you know, this is a professional thing. And maybe that's also saying that if you aren't thinking of this as a professional thing, then by the Air 2 instead. For less than it used to cost. Any other thoughts on the iPad from handling it? You know, it's an iPad Air, essentially. It is not that different. It doesn't seem that different. This is something that could have been released as an iPad Air 3 and we wouldn't have blinked, I think. Yeah. Other than to say, and here's the argument that I think somebody at Apple probably made, other than to say, how is the iPad Pro a Pro? If the only thing differentiating it from this is the size. I think that was the right decision. And so at that point, why would you call that Pro if there was another one that was just as good but smaller? So I can see, you know, you could argue that they needed to give the iPad Pro some kind of name, the big one. And then what do you do with this one then? Because now you kind of either walled it off from those features or you're going to have those features and then why is this not Pro? So all right, here it is. Now it's Pro. And then it gets back to what we were talking about about product lines that at that point, the non Pro ones are the kind of not as advanced, but they're cheaper. And that's what the iPad Air 2 is. And the question is, you know, what happens to the iPad Air? Do we end up with an iPad Air, you know, SE? iPad SE? At some point, that is essentially kind of a two year old tech, but cheaper instead of just selling the old model. It'll be interesting to see what happens. What's the next step in this strategy beyond this year? I'm interested to see how that plays out. So overall, how do you feel about this event? You know, it's a minor event in a lot of ways. It's a small event at Town Hall. These are not other than like a couple new features. These are not like huge groundbreaking new products. There's already, you know, there's already an iPad Air size and there's already iPad Pro features. This is just sort of bringing them together. And likewise, there's already iPhone 6s features and there's already already the iPhone 5s design and the iPhone SE just brings them together. And so it's important for Apple's business. Apple wants to set the stage for these products. These are products that actually, what's interesting about them is they are more interesting as part of an ensemble than they are on their own. I think, you know, what's interesting about the new iPad, iPad Pro is that it's an iPad Pro with a big brother. And that's how it's being pitched. What's interesting about the iPhone SE is that it's the four inch iPhone in a family with two larger phones that are similarly spec. I think those are both interesting, but they're both sort of supporting players. Now, I think that the 9.7 inch iPad Pro will be the best selling iPad of the next year, right? I mean, I think that's the sweet spot. It's the new iPad and the size that people are comfortable with. I think it'll sell really well. I think that'll be the winner of the iPad line. So it's not like it's a minor iPad. It's probably the best of the iPads and the biggest selling of the iPads. But what's interesting about it is where it fits in the family because it's stuff we've seen before with a couple exceptions, just not together in the same product. So should we move on to ask some ask upgrade questions? Sure. We have ask upgrade. Do I need to get back in the car? No, you can stay where you are. Okay. Okay. I will do that then. This edition of Ask Upgrade is brought to you by Squarespace, the simplest way for anyone to create a beautiful landing page, website or online store. Start booting your website today at squarespace.com and to offer code, upgrade it, check out to get 10% off your first purchase. We've easy to use tools and templates. Squarespace helps you capture every detail of what drives you because if it's worth the effort, it's worth sharing with the world. Squarespace puts all of the power that you need into your hands, takes away the things you don't want to have to worry about like hosting, scaling, or what to do if you get stuck with something. Squarespace has stated the art technology that they use to power your site and they will ensure security and stability and because of this they're trusted by millions of people all around the world. They have 24/7 support with live chat and email. They have their commerce platform to allow itself physical or digital goods. All of their templates feature responsive design to make your site look great on all sizes of device and they have their dev platform as well so you can dig into the code and tinker with your own site to take it even further than ever before. If you sign up for a year, you'll grab yourself a free domain name allowing you to choose exactly what you want your site to be called and Squarespace plans start at just $8 a month. You can sign up for a free trial with no credit card required. Start booting your own website today by going to squarespace.com and when you decide to sign up, make sure that you use the offer code upgrade to get 10% off your first purchase and show your support for this show. Thank you to Squarespace for their support of upgrade and relay FM. So we have some event themed ask upgrade questions. The first comes from Rob. Who does all the clapping at the Apple events? The first five rows or so are reserved for Apple employees. You get Tim Cook and Phil Schiller and Greg Jawswiak and people like that in the first couple of rows but they're also a bunch of Apple people there. They do and then they're also Apple like invited guests who are not press and those people will clap. Some press will clap occasionally, maybe perfunctarily but then the Apple employees will clap loudly and they start a lot of applause and then once you've gotten applause going everybody sort of might politely applause. Sometimes you do, sometimes you don't. I did a polite silent clap a couple of times but mostly it's the Apple employees and then that's true of any Apple event. They put VIPs and employees in the crowd and they're whooping it up and that helps make it seem like less like a dead press conference because journalists wouldn't do it generally. This comes in from Jan. About the 9.7 inch iPad price point. So before it was $4.99 for 16 gigabytes, now it's $5.99 for 32 gigabytes instead of what was 64 before. Why are they priced at this way? Now my thinking would be that Apple feels that the additional features like the ability to use the pencil, the screen stuff and the ability to take this device I mean albeit with more hundreds of dollars in accessories bolted on to another level I think is what they feel gives it that higher entry level price. Why do you think it has the higher entry level price there? I think it's that. I think they've got they've got the they've got it at 32 and they have the pro features and I think they've just decided to embrace that that it's a it's a more expensive product. It's got a better screen. It's got the pencil it's got the pencil support. It's got the smart connector. It's got all those features that were in the more expensive iPad Pro already and so this is an opportunity for them to just sort of go in on it and say the people who are buying this product are people who want the the pro features and the pro features cost more so I'm sure there's some buying psychology involved too but I'm sure some of it is the margins this is almost certainly a more expensive product to make. This comes in from Mike. For reading comics and magazines would you recommend the new 9.7 inch iPad Pro or the iPad Mini 4? Oh for reading comics and magazines I would always recommend the bigger screen. Especially now with the increased color and all that sort of stuff I guess it's even better right? Yeah yeah I had an iPad Mini for many years and you know it's small it was always it was always small even though it's got the same number of pixels they're all so small and unless you've got very good vision you know you're gonna end up zooming and panning and stuff and so I think for reading comics and magazines a bigger display is better. Mikael's wrote in to ask are we planning on selling our 12 inch iPad Pro or the 9 inch? What about you? No. No I have no plans to do that. We'll see you know how much I'll try it out and I'll see but I like the I like the big size now I look at my wife's iPad Air 2 and it looks like a toy. And split view and stuff like that it's just so much better and then you drop in a picture in picture and it's just like yeah I mean I've kind of embraced that I don't think I want to ever give that up. Yeah I'm all in on the size it's not just the fact that it's the pro like what the iPad Pro gets you it really is the size for me. Yeah yeah plus I like the keyboard I mean I've got issues with the keyboard but I was using for complicated reasons I briefly was using an iPad Air 2 this weekend and it brought its keyboard up and I had a moment of recoil I was like ooh like ooh no give me back my full sized lots of keys iPad Pro keyboard I want that. Yeah so is that that keyboard is like the original iPad keyboard then? Yeah I think so I didn't actually look but I don't see how it could couldn't be it's a 9.7 inch iPad so it's going to have the standard iPad keyboard. Take a quick sidebar about the smart keyboard cover still no international layout. Yeah and I heard from somebody that that was going to come eventually but instead they made a smaller version of it. Apple told Federico that it would come. Yeah they gave him that on the record. Maybe it will come someday but they had to build this one first? I don't know it's too bad. Or did they tell him the software keyboard would be changed? Either or the layouts? Neither of them neither of them is true today. And our final ask upgrade question this week is how noticeable is the new display on the 9.7 inch iPad Pro versus 12.9. Did you really see much of a difference from the minimal time you had with it? You're asking the wrong guy because it's about color gamut and I can't see those colors. Could you see the temperature change stuff though? Like if you used it? Yeah you'd see that. Oh yeah definitely. Similar in fact to the the night mode. It's the same thing it's changing the color temperature of the display essentially and yeah yeah you can tell. It's pretty dramatic even in a even just in a what you think of as a normally neutrally lit room and then you press the button and you go oh and everything gets a little in this case a little a little more yellow a little less blue. Something that I'd forgotten to mention until now which is kind of weird I think that the iPad Air 2 and the iPad Mini 4 are the same price now. Yes that's weird right? I guess I guess it's uh they both do the same thing so they're the same price and you just pick your poison yeah maybe the mini will go down in price at a later time who knows it may just be that the mini must be cheaper to produce surely. I don't know I mean it's got a smaller doesn't mean cheaper right? Some components are miniaturized and they're more expensive and it's a relatively recent update and that means the margins are probably higher right now but we'll get lower over time so probably it'll get its price cut in six months or a year. Good point good point. I have a couple of follow-up items before we finish today. Yeah let's do it. Pepperoni pizza pineapple pepperoni pizza sweep in the world Jason was right you had you had some I made some this week and then and then like 10 other people tweeted pictures of pepperoni pineapple pizza yeah we started a trend over the weekend some people were on board some people were being convinced some people really hated me but I did it and I loved it Jason oh my word it was so good so good I really loved it. It is pizza it maybe is not the pizza that comes from places like New York or Italy but I definitely made a pizza I put those toppings on it and I enjoyed it very much. That's all I can ask people everybody should just enjoy what they want to enjoy and and if they don't want to enjoy it that's fine but definitely it's um it was definitely uh it's one of my favorites I don't even remember how I discovered it but there there was yeah that is easily a favorite flavor pairing because I have always liked ham pineapple quite a lot it was like one of my go-tos but I pepperoni is my as of like maybe the last couple of years has been my favorite I think this might be edging it that the mix at the sweet and savory yeah fan of that and we mentioned about the upgrade merchandise all of my stuff came in I'm so happy with it the hoodies came out fantastically in so much now is that our faithful designer Frank has created an iPhone and Mac wallpaper with the special design that was inside of the hoodie so there's two things here if you want to see what that design looked like you can go and take a look at the wallpaper there'll be a link in the show notes and if you have seen it and you love it and you want to add on your devices with it you now can the upgrade and wallpaper exists and that design is what is printed on the inside of the upgrade hoodies so if you didn't get one now you can be jealous of all the people that did get one and you should have listened to us what we told you to get one because we told you you'd want it because it's also I've been wearing mine all week is so toasty and warm oh I love it and we we've been getting pictures from people showing off their upgrade hoodies and they're all members of the secret society now and those pictures have been great so thanks to all the people tweeting at us um that those have been those have been great a lot less love for the brain ball shirts but I love I think it's my favorite shirt that I've had made from a podcast now I wore the brain ball I got the raglan and I wore it this weekend and I for the first time and I love it in fact at one point I had the upgrade hoodie over the brain ball raglan and I felt like I was flying the flag it was me over the weekend too oh that was good the raglan was came out really well I'm really happy with it that was it I'm pleased that we did all of that so again and I thought I'm really pleased that we did that and I hope that everybody that has them enjoys them so I think that wraps up our apple event coverage thank you so much for tuning in I hope that you enjoyed the the carcast as it were we have a bunch of links in our show notes as always you can head on over to relay.fm/upgrade/81 to get all of those I want to take a moment to thank all of our sponsors for this week's episode Ministry of Supply Squarespace IT Pro TV and FreshBooks Jason thank you for being on the scene and for reporting in for upgrade we obviously all really appreciate that okay thank you for uh for keeping me company everyone while I was driving back from the apple event you will find a lot more of Jason's thoughts and opinions and feelings about the products from today's announcement over at sixcolors.com and I believe you'll be doing some stuff for other places but you'll link to them there you should always go to six colors first and then go to other websites from there that that's how I do all the definitive location for all of my web browsing I begin at six colors and and hopefully find a link out to google that's that's how I work uh if you want to find Jason on twitter is that Jason O J S N E double L I am at I'm like I am Y K E thank you so much for listening we'll be back next week until then oh I won't be actually you have another special guest next week you blew it I get the week off yep yes I will be back with a special guest uh hopefully it will be serenity called well to talk about perhaps uh her thoughts about this uh and what it means for pencil lovers to have a new iPad Pro in the family but we will hopefully serenity will be here next week to fill in for you mr hurley goodbye everybody goodbye bye! [ Silence ]
Myke catches up with Jason fresh from Apple’s March 21 event in Cupertino and keeps him company on his long drive home up Interstate 280. From the new smaller iPad Pro to the interesting iPhone SE, we break down everything Apple announced.
