(upbeat music) - Hey there. I wanna talk to you about our show sponsors. First, let's highlight polite but dangerous tools. I've personally purchased three knives from Sam Curtis at polite but dangerous tools and later had them on the podcast. I use one of their super sharp nest mucks that's getting out of bear just a few weeks back with ease. Use the discount code all caps bowyer. That's B-O-W-Y-E-R in all caps to save 10% on your orders from polite but dangerous tools. If you wanna learn more about Sam and has created a process, check out polite but dangerous tools anywhere on the interwebs. Next up, we have Vuni Gear. We've officially partnered with the great folks at Vuni. A few months ago, I purchased the vertical tee from Vuni for a pig hunt in Florida. After the hunt I wrote Brian, the founder of Vuni, had proved to provide some positive feedback. And later, that led to a three hour long phone conversation. Then I tested the altitude pant and Helios hoodie during my Manitoba bear hunt. I wore the Helios hoodie for three days straight and was super impressed by the way the fabric maintained its form and lacked the tail tail odor of most synthetic materials. I'll be using the altitude pant and Helios hoodie for all of my early season hunts here in North Carolina. And I'm very excited to try out the insulation and rain gear during my Kodiak hunt in late October. Use the discount code, bowyear15 at checkout to say 15% off all Vuni gear. Check them out at vunigear.com. That's V-U-N-I-G-E-A-R dot com. (upbeat music) - Good evening and welcome to the Boer's podcast where we explore the ancient art of bow making, traditional archery and the age old pursuit of wild game. Together, we're gonna chat with masters of the craft to uncover the deeper why behind reviving the old ways in a modern world. Today's episode is brought to you by polite but dangerous tools, handmade purpose driven tools meant for practical use combined with primitive styling. Tonight, I've got the honor of speaking with our first ever Canadian guests, Mr. Ron, Noter Angelou. (laughing) (laughing) - Yeah, that was so bad. I lived nearly for three years and I was even getting a new band. I was actually in a time. - That's the story of my life, that's the story of my life. (laughing) - Ron, Noter Angelou, Ron, you're gonna introduce yourself here in a second from Standing Wolf Archery and the Standing Wolf podcast, man. Ron, how do you say that without my wife? If she was on the earth, she speaks food Italian. She would be yelling at me right now. She's probably shooting laser beams to the door. - To make it easy and to like break it down phonetically. Like noter Angelou, so noter Angelou. Yeah, I always go by Angelou just to keep it super easy. Just obviously from kindergarten till this point in my life, it's been, it's been that. So- - Man, I read it in my brain and I said it just fine. And then when I said it out loud and then I started laughing at myself like internally, which then became externally and I know just what you're different there. - No fault of yours is, you know, every single purpose, maybe even like two people have actually been able to pronounce it, but it's one of those twister last themes that you're just kind of born into. - It is a lot. I like the Angelo piece. My Elvis, he goes by Waylon, which is middle name. But his first name is actually George Angelo. So he's named after two of our grandfathers. So my grandfather was George and my wife's grandfather. Great grandfather was Angelo. And we just kind of like hyphenated, but yeah, he was born in Italy. We lived there for a few years. So you'd think that I'd be able to say somebody's last name, but I mean, I, yeah. I need, it should have been in pictures or crayons or something and I would have figured it out. - That's pretty cool. So Angelo, so he's an angel, right? Angelo would mean you. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a, you know, people of Vicentino. You see, he was born in Vicenza in the Veneto and man, he just had his 11th birthday and we just were reminiscing at how we went back to the States for a handful of years now. And our kids have now at this point lived in the States, I think longer than Europe. So we've also lived in Belgium for a few years, so. - Right. - Yep, little, little, little Italian kids. The wife and the kids are both dual citizens too. So, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, if so, you know, the crap hits a fan here in the States, I'll just get stranded here, I guess. - I don't know if you want to be in Italy. It only seems like as close to the heat of the action than here. - Yeah, I know, I think Italians are much better at just turning their back and they're like, "Ow, like, Damani, like, we'll do with this tomorrow, right? Like, it's a tomorrow problem." - It's a month of my problem. - Yeah. (laughs) Oh man, well, I'm glad you're here. Again, Standing Wolf Archery, Standing Wolf Archery podcast, something that I listened to very regularly. And I feel like I'm getting into the varsity league now. You know, I've got folks like you on here, Ron, that can talk to me and have, you know, good solid conversations. You've also, you know, despite being an avid hunter, you're, you know, a traditional archer, but you're an artisan and a maker and you've been able to turn your side hustle into a career and your passion is demonstrated, you know, and your pieces. So I love to just really figure out the origin story, man. Like, where'd you, you know-- - Oh man, well, I mean, there was the quick and easy version of this that nitty gritty, hard, hard-ass struggle version. I mean-- - And it's whatever story you wanna tell. I'm here to listen to you. - Well, I mean, kind of, well, I would have to say, let's start from the beginning where I guess the origin is kind of like we're talking about the notary angel thing, I got a weird upbringing. My mom is Native, Native American, and my dad's Italian. So obviously I get the last name from him, but my mom's the Native American. So, you know, just to kind of summarize things, being Native American, probably whether you're in Canada or US probably isn't the best. And my mom was the product of what's called like the 60s scoop, which here in Canada was basically just taking kids from their parents and putting them in the foster home. So, you know, she's got some horror stories that she'll never tell us, and rightfully so. But, you know, for a long time, you know, I grew up in the city of Toronto, as far as born. And so half my life was being a city kid. And then when I was 12, we moved to the country and made an hour and a half as a child or the city. So I got a little bit of a good perspective of both worlds, right, what it's like to live in a city and what it's like to grow up in the country and an appreciation of both that, you know, maybe one who grew up in one only would not really understand. So, just to kind of get to it. So, you know, my mom, because she was taken and she never really was taught anything Native. And, you know, I only got back into it probably around 2018. I mean, I spent a lot of time in the bush when I was like in my 20s and, you know, tracking, learning tracking, and, you know, I spent a lot of time in the bush and that's a whole different story altogether. But, you know, I moved back to the city when I was like in my 30s and, you know, got back into traditional. My friend, you know, showed us my buddy Pat, who actually his dad is a bow hunter and was a moose hunter. They got me into archery when I was 14, 'cause, you know, while living in the country, I had all my country bodies and that's a country, you know. The country life, you know, got to live it. So, yeah, he introduced me to shooting a bow and it was actually more compound to begin with, 'cause his dad was like a hardcore hort guy. So, I'm not even sure the compound he had, but I was shooting a compound and his dad was like, "You gotta shoot whatever stick bow." It's not kind of white bow. So, he got me into shooting a compound, which is my introduction into archery. And then, you know, later on, I got really fascinated with like going traditional, 'cause I was kind of, you know, I'm not saying that it's like a native thing, but I wanted to do something where I knew that I didn't want to rely on something mechanical. Like, I always thought, you know, if I need to live somewhere, I don't want anything to go, at least things to go wrong. So, tradition was always kind of like, with there. I wanted to do something traditional. So, you know, you said not a native thing, but I also think that, you know, one, as people, we have, it's in our DNA to want to make and fabricate things, right? Whether it's woodworking or leathersmithing or being a bow, you're a fletcher or a gardener or an animal husbandry and things of that nature, right? And you, you know, certainly being a lot closer to the line of lineage of, you know, indigenous culture, like I think leather work in their hands and maybe breaking out the system a little bit is a little bit more near and dear, even if it's almost like subconscious. I don't want to speak for you. I'm just, you know, this is my super white guy, you know, looking at you from the outside, I guess. - Well, you know, we're all creators, man. I think there's no culture, no race who's not a creator. And everyone started probably with a string and a stick and a sharpened, you know, branch to make a shoot something. So, you know, I can't say it's like a native thing. I mean, that's a cliche thing, but, you know, I just wanted to use a weapon that would, like, require the least amount of maintenance, you know, was like the, you know, it just, it felt wild and rugged. It just felt right, so. - Did you think that when you were like shooting a compound that like, and I asked this because it's a sanity check for myself. So like, I shot a compound for like 15 years or so before I started shooting traditional. I still have a compound and I like it. It's mostly collecting dust right now, but it's still fun to get out. But for some reason, I feel like with a compound, you're like, whether it's societal pressure or whatever, you feel like you got to upgrade every couple of years. You're just like an iPhone. And with a stick though, I'm like, man, like I'm shooting typically a self bow or a recurve. Like, I'm not really upgrading anything. I'm down here at the bottom for a reason. - Yeah, that's the thing. Yeah, it's kind of like you get that expiration date on the gear, right? - Sure. - Whereas like a bow, whatever, a glass bow or a self bow, you know, it's just like a, it's like a work of art that you could keep for a generational, right? I mean, you could get your grandpa's bow and it's still, this is effective tool, minus, you know, a couple feet per second, but it's still gonna be a deadly tool that, you know, it's just you grabbing a hand and you start trying it out. So. - Yeah, I appreciate that. - Yeah, but I mean, kind of where this all started is, it's kind of even more crazy. But so anyways, I got my native spear name. So I was kind of getting back into like, you know, that type of a culture. My mom was kind of getting into it and she went to university for, you know, like the history stuff. And, you know, I was like, damn, this was 2018. So I'm 43. So I was like in my 30s, late 30s, when I actually even got my spear name and the spear name was Staniwulf. So that's what it trained. - So your mother was, you know, ganked out of traditional society as a baby. - Yeah. - So to speak, right, or not so much literally. And so she was brought up outside of, you know, indigenous or first people's culture. - Oh yeah. - But she's felt that calling later in life to go pursue that, you know, with your academic institution or community or what have you. And that kind of compelled you to follow suit. - It wasn't necessarily her, to be perfectly honest, just at this, at that point in time, at that crossroads in life. I mean, I had at that point, you know, I was married, I'm married now, but I had like my third kid and it's just whatever reason, just that intersected with what I was going through. 'Cause at the time, I mean, I wasn't even doing anything, traditional art, she has a business. I was doing like digital marketing. I was into like some pretty technical, tech-oriented businesses. And I was trying to start a separate, totally separate business, non-related. And I was having a ton of trouble, you know. So I actually went to this guy, an elder, like a helper for help. So I thought maybe there's some sort of energetic block that you could help me with making this work, or what, I didn't know what, I just tried it out. My mom recommended go into this guy. So I went to him and he gave me the spirit name. And then this is kind of where the whole standing-wool stuff happened, is that maybe about a couple months after that, I went back to my gang. So I was like, still having troubles. I was trying to raise money for this business and all this other stuff. And you say, you know what, Ron, you're going to know what you're going to do. He goes, you're going to go on a traditional fast. He goes, you're going to go for three days and three nights. And he goes, I don't have a problem. I don't think you're going to have an issue with actually doing it physically. He says, I think there's going to be something that's going to come up that he's going to, you're going to have an issue with. And he kind of is very cryptic. When you go to an elder, you know, I'm just trying to like make the nutshell story with this part, but you know, the kind of cryptic, 'cause they don't want to give you the answers. A lot of this for you to find out for yourself. Yeah, self-discovery is exactly it. So I went to this fast and, you know, it was maybe about five, you know, maybe nine other fasters. And to give you an idea, anyone who's listening has no idea what this is about. So what this means is that we went super north like Ontario. Like we're going to like the serious bush. This is the middle of nowhere fasting and it's very traditional. So yet they set up a sweat lodge in that. And I went personally with the intention of, you know, asking for, you know, asking for help with this business or whatever it could be to help move me along. So I didn't even think anything of like archery. This was not even in like the realm of, you know, like you had nothing, I had no intentions of it even coming together in my life. So anyway, so now mind you, like I'm doing archery just not thinking of it as like a business, right? So anyway, so I do the fast and it was, I don't know how much I can actually go into this 'cause it's pretty nuts. Like in all honesty with the hardest thing I've ever done, I had basically you spend, you know, three nights, I was supposed to spend three nights alone in the bush and you're alone, like alone alone. Like deep bush, you get only, I made a lean two and you bring like a sleeping bag 'cause it's late October or late September, early October. So it's getting pretty cold. It's hovering around like, I mean, I don't know the conversion, maybe 18 degrees Fahrenheit, closer to zero cells, he has kind of thing. And so it's getting cold at night. So the first time I'm out there, it's like, you know, you're just alone in the bush and you're just, you know, if whoever can go out there alone in the bush, good on you. But you know, it's just, it's an intense art on the psyche. Like, yeah, I mean, you get, you get nothing. You have like no means to protect yourself. So that's a different story, right? If you had like a shotgun or, you know, it's something that you give yourself confidence that you're not gonna get killed. And I mean, you know, Northern Canada, we don't have just like foxes, we get some animals and kill you, right? So, yeah. So it's just my first time I'm out there, I'm listening to all the sounds. And you know, you hear stuff creaking in the woods and you're like, oh, okay. Well, you hear like packs of coyotes or maybe coy wolves in the distance. You're like, okay, you know, if they could kill it, you're pretty fast. You know, kill me too, no problem. Like I'm pretty vulnerable. So the second they comes around and, you know, I'm feeling pretty good. Like I'm doing like some ceremonial stuff while I'm out there, but, you know, they have helpers come check on you 'cause it's not just, you know, they don't want to make sure you're okay and everything at that. You know, I just throw into the wolves, like figuratively, obviously, but or literally, you never know. So the second night comes and they chuk-kon-chink, chuk-kon-yen, the guy's like, hey, you know, you're checking the weather, like the storm's coming. So I end up making my lean tool a little bit longer 'cause I brought two tarps. And I just figured that I'd kind of protect my legs a bit better. So they leave and the sun's going down and don't worry. I'm gonna get to how this leads to standing wolf archery, but it's like, man, I love this. I am glued to my seat. Yeah, so the sun's going down on like self-reflecting on what's important in life. And I'm like, you know, my family, I'm thinking all about my family and my wife. And I'm just like realizing like, you know, really what matters in life 'cause I, you know, all the superficial life thought, all the stuff that thought I would be there for really didn't matter, like it didn't matter whatsoever. I was like, okay, I'm just super grateful. I got my kids, like I got a great family, my wife, I love with all my art and all these things are coming. And this is what the sun's kind of dipping down now. It's kind of getting like dusk. So it's not dark yet, but it's getting there. And all of this is done on a new moon. So it's like, when it's dark, it's dark, it's real dark. And so it goes down and I fall asleep and then I wake up and I hear the craziest sound. - This is gonna get like supernatural. I don't wanna go too, you know, lean too far one way 'cause I don't know. - You can be as primitive or as woo as you want. - And I don't wanna sound like nuts, but this is all like stuff that actually happened. And this is the truth of how everything led to standing wolf starting. So, so, you know, I wake up and I hear this crazy howl in the woods and it was just insane. Like the best way to describe it would be hearing the howl from like American werewolf on London mixed with like a gigantic burnt squawking. So I hear this and I wake up. I'm like, holy shit, what the hell was that? And I'm just super still. I'm just listening like alter, alter closely. And I hear it again. Then, you know, I'm like shitting my pants right now. I'm like, what the hell? Like this is, I've never heard anything like this. And like I said, I grew up like, I've logged serious time in the bush. Like, I should know what most sounds you would hear. You know what, you know, most people if you look into or spend time, you know what's what I know tracking and stuff. So, but this was nothing like anything I've ever heard. And I hear it again for the third time. And I'm just, I'm shooting my pants. I'm like, I don't know what to do. No, I'm, everyone's space camp is super far away. I'm totally isolated because everyone's like a good almost 10 minute drive from dropping off the next person. So you're real far. So I'm just kind of just freaking out. And then I kind of forced myself to go to sleep. I don't know how. I was just like out of just pure fear. And then I wake up and I'm, you know, just not to kind of go into too much supernatural stuff. But there's something there that scared the shit out of me because it started growling at me. And it was like a big figure, a big thing. And yeah, long story short of this, I mean, there was literally like some kind of like war with something going like like shit smashing all around me, like something, two things running around, smashing, crashing things. And it was insane, like totally nuts. And, you know, I basically passed out from fear. Like I couldn't take it. I've never had anything like this. It's just the most intense thing that posse could happen. - And what is this? Like almost 48 hours or so into your, your turtle farm. - Yeah, yeah. And that's no drink, no food or water too. So it's like it's fasting, fasting, like real fasting. It's hard fasting. So, you know, like, so I basically like I have this tobacco in my hand and for anyone who doesn't know about natives and tobacco, tobacco is like something that you would use like to kind of like for a prayer, like you'd use it to like make a prayer with. So I have the tobacco in my hand. I said, okay, this is like why I'm here. I need help with what I, my business and stuff. And I drop the tobacco and I hear something come sniff it right by my head. And anyways, I kind of black out again. And I wake up in the morning and then I was just like, holy shit, what the hell happened? I see trees smash. I see stuff like shouldn't be broken broken. Like it's nuts. And, you know, after a while of relaxing and kind of like, just kind of like getting my wits together, you know, maybe around 11 o'clock in the morning, like the elder comes with two of his helpers and they're like, hey Ron, how you doing? I'm like, he goes, anything happened last night? Cause I mean, to kind of say it in a nutshell, this guy's kind of like the best way to put it would be almost on the verge of being psychic or like he is psychic in a way. Like he knew everything that happened. And he told me afterwards and I went to go see him a number of times and we talked about it. So anyways, you know, we ended the fast and he told me all the stuff that happened. And it's pretty like, you know, again, it's spiritual and a lot of stuff happened. But the point of the story is that because of all that stuff happened, a number of the months went by and everything that I want to do with this digital business and I mean, that just fizzled out. Like it could, no matter what I did, it just came to a complete stop. So more or less I was, I was really counting on that to really get going and get seed funding and get started and that didn't happen. So I was doing my wife's an accountant and at the time, I was, I just needed to do a part-time job. So I was just doing like Uber Eats driving in the city. And it wasn't the best thing, but, you know, made box especially at the beginning of the COVID stuff. It just was the transition to that. At the time, my brother, my younger brother was, he's into e-commerce. And so he helped me out big time by introducing me to selling on Amazon. He was, do you have anything you can sell? 'Cause he wanted me to get out of this, I guess, I wasn't a right. I wasn't a big right. I was, you know, no matter what I did, nothing works. So it was pretty frustrating. And, you know, if anyone's out there's been trying to do an idea or whatever, it's not working, I completely understand it. Sometimes it sucks. You've all been broken toys at some point, right? - Oh, yeah, it's hard. - And that's why we have a good nuclear, you know, group of people that we can trust to help pull us out of those moments. - Yeah, yeah. My brother, you know, my wife's been a huge supporter, but, you know, just this whole fasting and everything about the getting the spirit name, you know, it really kind of, maybe that was what was needed. And I'm not coming to any conclusion, but that's what happened prior to this. And then my brother, I kind of had to know where it kind of brought up this idea. It goes, "Hey, do you have anything you can sell?" 'Cause he was doing really good selling on like Amazon and whatever he was doing. So he's doing really well. So he's like, "Is there anything you know you can sell?" And I was like, "Well, like I'm doing traditional artistry and I don't know if to sell, I don't know." He was like, "Anything?" I was like, "Well, if I could sell something, I guess I would sell like accessories that I would want to buy. Like I would buy stuff, I'd buy stuff all the time. I might as well just try to make them my own." So I bought a bag of beaver fur scraps. And with my son at the time, he was like 10 years old. We were sanding down the high 'cause it was pretty thick where the place I bought it, they just, the scraps were pretty, it was pretty much scraps. They were definitely the, but I got the best like 12 pieces that I could. I made some beaver fur silencers. And he coached me to kind of getting it setting up as a product on Amazon. And, you know, I don't want a bad amount of them, but they definitely helped me when I needed it too. And, you know, as a platform. So, but, you know, he helped coach me get through it and I sent some in and they sold it right away. And I was like, "Oh shit, awesome." Like, cool. So I saw the potential, he was shocked. He told me later, he goes, "I thought in all honesty would take you six months to maybe, maybe sell them all." So he kind of coached me again. He said, "Well, is there another thing you'd make?" I'm like, "Yeah, I could make like, you know, wool silencers." And I was really into using like Navajo wool, 'cause I love Navajo wool. I think it's personally the best quality wool for a lot of different reasons. So I got, I designed a color scheme that I thought would work really well in the woods. Like a different variety of woods, not just like where I live. I was like, "Okay, I got to think if someone was in like, I don't know, the Pacific forest, what kind of colors worked best?" So I had like a gray color scheme that came off with. - Man, I haven't ordered any, but I need to. The like autumn color, I don't know what the color is. The autumn leave, you know. - Yeah, the autumn ambush. - Autumn ambush. - Yeah, like it's like the, the, the deciduous, we, you know, autumn leave color is, not only is it so fitting for the fall, right? In most places, but it's beautiful. And it can match like any bow. - It, it works well. Like it, but as a color, like I, I'm really into camel. Like I, I love the idea of like using, you know, with the trap boy, you're, you're pretty concealed. Like in a tree stand or in a ground blind, but I think every little aspect goes a long way. And you know, it depends on the animal. But, but yeah, I'm into that kind of stuff. I really love it. - Yeah, the autumn ambush is the one I was referring to. - Yeah, yeah. - All right. - I've got noted in my tiny little brain. - Look, look, yeah. - Yeah. And so we, we sent it another product and it worked well too. So that kind of just kept happening and happening. And you know, long story short, it got to a point where it's like, it was feasible to cut the cord on the Uber E stuff and say goodbye, which I was very happy to do because it sucked. But yeah, I went all in on it. I was like, okay, this, it financially I could reinvest and financially we can actually like live on it. Like we could do something with my wife's income too. Cause obviously it'd just be suicide to count on, make a big long shot bed and, you know, whatever, but so yeah, it worked out really well and we kind of just kept going and I wanted to keep it. You know, I was like, where are we going to call it? And when we first came up with that Beaver thing and I was like, you know what, it's called standing wolf. It seems right. And it seems like the thing to do standing wolf, this is, this is it. So I was like, you know what, let's just go with it. So I kind of just wanted to keep it just like products that personally I would want to buy it first and everything I've done, I've just kind of made it the point to be stuff that I was like, I personally would want or, you know, knew that I could like make really well. And, you know, I can't say that everything is made really well right off the bat the first time, but stuff that I want that for sure use myself, so. - My wife has trial and error, right. - It's so crazy. - I think it's, it can be relationships. It can be jobs and education. It can be your own business endeavors. It can be things you're trying to build, right? Like, look, the first six or eight months I was trying to build stuff. But I was only batting about 500. I was, I was breaking crap all the time. And it isn't infuriating, to say at least. And some people are, like, oh, like, you know, they're very stoked about it. They're like, yeah, I get all those broken ones and I set them in a corner and they're kind of like on a mantle to remind me. See, I'm like one of those people that act, wracked out in rage and I just grab them, take them straight to the, the fire pit out here and line them on fire and sit down and have a beer instead and sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit, sit. Who knows the people that are more level headed than I am. I don't know if that happens. Yeah, man, life is crazy. You just never know what's around the corner. It's so nice. So what compelled you to like add now to your repertoire of goods? So now it's not just string silencers, right? Oh, yeah, we've got into, I mean, tasked with the next logical thing to make, you know, at the time I didn't have like a lot of like sophisticated cutting gear and, you know, it is literally scissors and mostly scissors. And even to this day, it's pretty much just scissors. I mean, it's just, it's pretty handy. It's literally handmade. So it's not fake in it. So it's just, you know, I just, I don't know, it would just look at stuff that a person would need and say, "Yeah, I would like, if I'm going to a shooting range or in the backyard, like, oh, I don't necessarily want to have like my boat quiver on my boat all the time." I was like, yeah, a pocket quiver, that makes sense. I want to bring some arrows easily and not have to shuffle around 'cause I had, you know, back quiver and not to say I would do it back quiver in the future, but just stuff that I would practically want to use. I started shooting with the, yeah, shooting with the glove myself. I can't say I'm not a glove guy. I started with a glove and I would love to make a glove, but using what I've learned with tabs 'cause I think what we've done with the tabs is probably different than what most people are used to. And, but we just, I just like to use the materials that, you know, are like North American animals, like really try to emphasize like not to go native, but you used stuff that would be kind of like, at least honoring some aspects of it. But, you know, with a-- - Traditional, right? Very traditional. - Yeah, exactly. - In this region. - Totally. - Can you, can you explain it? So you've got at least two different types of tabs, right? So can you explain some of the function and the aesthetics with them? Again, we talked about this offline, right? That I use the glove. I think it's right, not a tab, right? No week walks around with one tab or one glove, right? - Yeah, yeah. - It's always in the backup, just like a compound. You got to have more than one release on you 'cause somebody's not into the tree stand and they forgot a release. So I think it's great, you know, from a business strategy standpoint. But yeah, like, explain to me some of these products and what makes them special. And I'm not asking you to go, ours is the best thing on the planet and everybody else. Right? - Well, I got a script here. Let me see here, ours is the best that there is. - Yeah. - Yeah. - What is, what makes them you, right? - Okay, so let's, I guess, I mean, you can't do too much with the strip of beaver. I mean, I try my best to get the best possible can beavers. I mean, you know, stuff like, obviously stuff that's harvested in like early spring with the most loft. I mean, in terms of a fur animal, if we're talking just silencers, we have to do it. I mean, the difference is night and day. And you know, we take the time to actually like, I mean, this is just my process to give it away, I guess. Or I'll just give it away, give it away a secret. But yeah, you got to like really, with a very sharp razor blade, take your time and like meticulously cut it. 'Cause if you're cutting too hard, you're chopping off a lot of fur that gets the loft. I mean, from like a technical point of view, as simple as it is like a string silencer, whether it's wool or this, it's the loft that gives the dampening, the whole point to make it silent. Or, you know, if it's just a decoration, that's fine. But if you wanted to use it functionally to be, to make your boat more quiet, then the dampening effect is everything. So the loft is what soaks up all the vibration from your string, all the same with the wool. So it's like the type of wool. I mean, all of these little things I've experimented with and I found like doing it in a particular way and like kidding of the most loft and using a particular animal that's as far as at a particular time, it makes a difference, it actually does. So, you know, it's just that Nick Picky stuff that, you know, I personally would, I'm just like, I'm really hyper picky if they're like really making the, I know, I'm not trying to be an asshole, but like, I want the best for whoever uses it to decide, whoever's gonna decide to get it should be getting something that they're gonna love. And, you know, obviously we want people to succeed. Like, I want someone to do really well if they're using it for hunting and to have the success. And if the gear sucks and screws up and blows their opportunity or whatever, I mean, that sucks. I don't want to be that guy who gave them that. So. - I think as a maker or an artisan, your strongest currency is the success of the end user. - Yeah, totally. - Yeah, totally. - And, I mean. - You're obviously putting that in mind. - Oh, yeah, like that's, that's everything. I have feedback. I mean, I, it sucks getting bad feedback, 100%. And that's kind of what led to like making tabs the way they are now. It's just, or everything to that matter. I mean, everything's an ongoing evolution. Like what you're gonna buy today on standing wolf is, as best as I possibly know how to make it, but I know through feedback. And someone's saying, hey, this, this totally did whatever. And I hate this shit 'cause it did this to me. And I'll listen to that. I listened to everything. And that's how you make something better. 'Cause if someone say you made the body, I don't know nothing about making silk bows, but I can imagine if I were to make a bow and someone tried it and said, this grip is tight and too small. You know, I would listen to everything and, you know, implement it. And then, you know, you do it enough times and you feel, okay, I think I've addressed that problem. I'll send it out again. And, you know, you're sending it with the best intentions that you've addressed it. And if there is any more negative feedback, then, you know, make it better again. Like always making it better. - And always refining, evaluating, adjusting fire. Yeah. - Yeah, yeah. So that's kind of like what led to like the tab stuff. I mean, I think one of the fun things of the tabs is that I think there's like a, I would break it down to three sections. I mean, this is just tabs specifically. You asked me before, like you just said, you know, I'm shooting a glove and I want to shoot a tab what's the difference between glove and tab. I mean, I think gloves are naturally probably a bit thinner. You know, usually getting a piece of deer leather, which is like two to three ounces. I mean, everyone knows leather weight and like you're getting a thin piece of leather with a little bit thinner, a thicker piece of leather. And, you know, I shot a glove, like I said, a lot, I shot a lot with a glove. And you're basically relying on your cowls as to build up before you stop really kind of feeling some like, - Yeah, that's true. - Yeah, especially when you're going up with higher weight but the glove, I feel it way more. And I do like a glove because you're not losing it or fiddling around with it. It's always there when you go out, but you know, you can't wear a glove with no two fingers cut out when you're hunting in the late fog. It's pretty cool. So you got to like put a, - And that's actually what what compelled me to ask you online, like, hey, man, like I shoot with a glove. - I like it. I love, you know, but I see there's application for a tab and I don't want to just like change to using a tab 'cause everybody that's cool that's on so be is using a tab. But it's what's, you know, what's the function of that? 'Cause I think about just that, right? Like when I want to put on some, now I live in Eastern North Carolina. So it's not crazy cool here, but we definitely get cold days in winter time. So I usually wear like a thin wool gloves from early November on. And well, I can't use my archery glove in conjunction with those, right? But I could use a tab in theory, yeah? Or am I? - Yeah, no, 100% yeah, for sure. I mean, it gives you like, like you just said, right there is a good reason for tab is that it gives you like, especially in like, you know, depends on this where you live in the seasons, but it gives you more flexibility with, you know, just staying warm. I mean, that's the huge thing. You're just sitting out for hours. I mean, warmth and keeping a hand from not like getting too tight. - Yeah. - It makes a big difference. I mean, yeah, they're just so convenient. I mean, I just personally like them 'cause they're just convenient for me. You know, I don't have to like, with the gloves I use like, I don't know, I would have to personally try and make it one myself, but I finally get a little floppy. I've never had a glove that was actually just like a glove that stayed with the glove tight and didn't get floppy anywhere in particular. So that's what kind of like a tab 'cause it's like right there on my hand, exactly where I want it. And I know it's, it personally works well for me. I don't know. I think with tabs too, it's just like kind of like broken from myself. I look at it like three different factors. One is kind of like the materials. Materials make a big difference 'cause you can get like some cheap china crap and you know, they'll use like plastic and they'll pretend it's leather and they'll just crack and I'm sure in the cold they'll just chip up and crack and that's what you mean. - Yeah, and it's longevity and everything else, right? - Oh yeah, and you know, that and then-- - And from an environmental standpoint, all that stuff is just those practice, those are those practices of manufacturing, all that stuff is open for two, right? - Yeah, and you want obviously smooth release. That's a big thing. You don't wanna like catching or sticking or you know, causing any sort of interference with like your form what you've developed. So I don't know, all these factors, I think about how does this material work? I do a lot of experimenting, layering stuff. You know, different layers work well because you want like a protection yet on the other side, you want a smooth release. So like what gives you that combination of those factors, right? So it's all just to give the end user like we're talking about just the best result, the most comfortable result. So they can, I think we cater to more like heavier draw weights, nothing really that, you know, you could use them for any draw weight, but if you're pulling something like hunt, like big game hunt weight, then you want something that's gonna like not make your fingers hurt, so. - Sure, yeah, man, you've sold me on it just by being so genuine about it. And again, like, you know, I know a lot of guys are shooting like three under, oh, you used to have this guy with my split finger guy and you know, you've got a split finger tab. So, you know, all of those things fall into that category. How did you transition or not transition, but how did you take on the additional role and responsibility of going from standing wolf archery to the podcast as well? - That's not man. - Like a different punishment and you're just like, my life wasn't busy enough. - It's hard, honestly, like I gave anyone credit who's trying to even just do a podcast. Like, a podcast, like I've had a big slump, like I haven't had done a podcast in a bit as of this recording with you. And you know, I just kind of personally feel guilty for myself or not like kind of falling off the wagon a bit. I'm kind of like beating myself up a bit. And like, but like, how, I don't know. - Yeah, he's getting amped up for hunting season, man. You got to start getting them in there. - Yeah, I know, I know, exactly. Or in contrast, like during and post hunting season, you got all these good hunting stories you can record. - It's, yeah, it's, you know, you don't want to eat up people's time too much. I kind of feel everyone's focused right now to getting their getting dialed in, so. - Well, right when we got on, you're in for those that obviously can't see it 'cause they're listening with their ear balls right now, but you're in your, you know, mossy oat camo right now 'cause you were doing just that. You were out scouting or something like that. - Yeah, yeah, it's time. - Yeah. - It's time, yeah. - I'm doing the same thing, walking out in the swamp, scouting, setting up some cameras, hanging a few stands, mostly just getting eaten alive by yellow, yellow flies and mosquitoes out here, but. - Yeah, I love it though, it's just, it gets you so, I don't know, just, as soon as you get like a PC couple of good game trails, like, oh, it's like a pretty good conversion point. - So I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be a bad host. I'm gonna say like before we get into the podcast piece, let's talk about some of the hunting stuff because. Okay, and we started and that's, there we go. So like, what, you know, you live up in Ontario, right? What are you typically hunting throughout, you know, the past years? - Honestly man, I'm like addicted to hunting turkey. I'm like, with a stick. - Oh yeah, man, like I absolutely nothing presive. - It's like my favorite, all-time favorite thing. I think it's just the most, I've had success spot in stock. I've had a success with like ground blinds and like this past spring. I went up early, 'cause like I said, the native thing, I got, I'm pretty blessed is here specifically, there's a thing called native status. And I got this, there was a big huge lawsuit. And you know, on long story short, we got a lot of rights that were allowed to hunt pretty much any day of the week. And it's pretty open season for a big area. Like we got a big, big area. I could just, you know, with permission if it's like a private property. - Yeah, like you're in turn times a year or like you have a most near year round. - All year long, all year long. Like I don't think there's a limitation. Now mind you, where are wildlife offices? Hey, like what are you doing here? Maybe they don't know. There's a lot of ignorant people. So I'm not counting on someone to know, but I mean. - I would take advantage of any opportunity I had. Like I absolutely, I remember like, I got to get some landowner tags when I lived in Virginia and not because it was a landowner because the landowner can sponsor a hunter to come and get like depredation tags. 'Cause the deer were just devastating. He, I mean, he, this is like a homestead and garden all this stuff. And he had like three or four acres. So I was like out there hunting in the late summertime because it's helping, you know, preserve his food source which is, - Yeah, yeah. - Gardening crops and all that stuff. So yeah, I'm glad you had that opportunity to like. - Yeah, man. So it's just, it's given me like some early season stuff on birds and late season. I mean, I'm still like actively like going after them. Like it's, I love it. Like it's just, if I see them and I know there's like, like a field or a somewhere I could set up. I'm like, I'm thinking Thanksgiving right now, like getting it ready. Like I just, it's just so fun. I just love it. I'm saying I love birds. - I love, I loved her again. I've not taken one with a trad bow. I've taken a couple with compound in years past. But I, I've lived a lot of places where, I moved around a lot 'cause I worked for Uncle Sam for so many years. A lot of places I lived there was a spring and a fall season. And a lot of times fall season was like in conjunction with just like fall archery season. So we had a deer turkey season at the same time. - Right. - In North Carolina where I live now, unfortunately, do not have a fall turkey season. And I'm just, I'm seeing all these hens and, you know, several month old pulse running around. I'm like, I mean, that would be a delicious meal. - Yeah, yeah. - You know, like, so I would, my, my tag doing the fall is usually run out and I would scatter the flock. And then when I wasn't too cold, if it was real cold, I wouldn't because just, they don't need to burn those excess calories, but early fall and fall season. Scadrome. And then I'll just start calling and doing a lot of, you know, hen calling and usually get those desperate eight pound pulse to come in and I've got, I've got a good meal for the weekend, you know, but unfortunately here in North Kacalaki, we don't get to participate in the fall. So I hope you get a couple or two and I'll live vicariously through you. - I figure it's cross, I mean, there are tough to still, I mean, bottom stock is like ridiculously hard and you know, it's just, I've been fortunate enough to get pretty darn close and, you know, just decoys and, you know, I just love the, the child, the strategy behind whether it's this or whatever, but like Turkey specifically if we're gonna talk of them, just the, it's almost like a game of chess. Like, like what, okay, what's coming out here? Where am I, I mean, it's not a guarantee. We set up decoys forever, but I mean, you got a good idea of like, if you kind of scout the area and you kind of look at, I mean, I, I hunt a lot of fields. So it's, it's a big advantage. Where like, you get like a good like far with treeline, you got, so I really like natural ground blinds. I'm not too big on like bringing in some sort of like blind and setting up. - Pop up or something, right? - Yeah, yeah, I've never done that. So it's just using like a, we've got a lot of seat, then cedar force and stuff here. Having like a little pocket of cedar was perfect. You just, you know, just break up, you know, get a really good blind going and, you know, call them in you with like a single hand and get some jigs or, you know, just the strategies or analysts for what you're going for. I just, I just love it. I think, I think it's so interesting to see how, how we can trick something and like use our intelligence to plan out a game plan and when it actually works. Even if you get close to it working and it, they didn't necessarily spring the trap that we have thought then, but it kind of showed some success. I just, it's just the most biggest thrill. I think it's so cool. - I think creatures that are vocal too are really fun, you know, like, and I, you know, it should be a lot of that to Turkey on me, like, 'cause even in the fall and things of that nature, everybody's still vocal, right? They make a lot of noise coming off the roost. They make a lot of noise going on the roost. - Yeah. - If they get separated, they wanna call each other and get back together, you know, and then there's oftentimes at this point that homes are hanging out in big groups together too, right? So you might get a, homes that are starting to act more like curious jakes because they're just like hanging out with their group and their buddies in the fall. You know, sometimes handy. But it is like that strategic mindset of a game of chess is very much like a lot of times they don't wanna cross the fence. They don't wanna cross a little, even if it's a small creek of water, a lot of times they don't wanna hassle themselves with flying the four feet over it. You know, it's stuff like that too, right? Like small obstacles, sometimes they don't want to cross where, you know, a whitetail would have no problem. It would take it's eighth of a second to hop over that fence or to cross the creek, right? And there's a lot of things I think to do. - Yeah, yeah. I think, you know, I was telling myself, and this is kind of where the whole boy like getting into making a bow would come to play. I was like, I would, my dream home would be to make a bow like a 55, 57 pound bow. And, you know, I glassed bow. I think, I don't even care what it is, something I made myself. - I love the London moves with the bow. I think it's just, I've never done it. You know, like I said, my body's dad's loose hunter. I mean, I was talking to my friend who got me into this and we're like, come on man, we gotta do this. We gotta do a loose on it 'cause his dad's getting up there in age. And I'm sure he was able to pour his wisdom in. And I just think it'd be the coolest thing ever. And, you know, my respect to everyone out there who's actually gone loose hunting successfully. I think it's- - I'm reading Monty Browning's DIY, Alaskan Moose Hunting book right now. And I'm just super dog-on-inspired. And I'm just like, what am I doing with my life? Why have I not been moose hunting this whole time? - Yeah, it's just sounds so badass. Like it just, that's a dream hunt. Like if I could make a bow, take down an animal with a bow. Now I have no idea how the hell I would get it out 'cause I don't even know anyone. Like I, you know, all my buddies live way the hell out of the summer. So I have no idea how I'm gonna actually process the animal and get it out. But, you know, that is the dream. I would love to do it. I think it's so much fun. - Oh man, it would be. Do you chase like, do you have white tails up there? - We got tons of white tail. That's what I've been like scouting right now. I'm just getting a good white tail stand going. - Right on, right on. And do you have, are there any elk or kiraboo or anything like that around? - Don't have elk here. Now, mind you, I think someone like reintroduced elk somewhere and it was like a species that really shouldn't be here, I think. I don't really know too much, but I don't think this was supposed to be here. But someone was crazy enough to reintroduce a small population and they're just getting picked off like crazy. So, but kiraboo, that might be like real north. That's like kind of like sub, sub time. - Yeah, I mean, I think there was what? I think there was what was it? Woodland kiraboo that used to cross from southern Ontario and Manitoba and to like Minnesota and the Dakotas or something. - Maybe, I think within the recent years, they've been dedicated or like nominated as extirpated from the continental United States. And there's still not very many, I think in southern Canada. I think it's Woodland kiraboo. There's some smart wildlife biologists that will correct me. - Yeah, that sounds about right. I think Woodland kiraboo makes sense. Like you said, in that area, I don't know. That's like a, from where I am, that's like a good 14 hour drive. So if you want to like consider it, that's a hell of a drive. Like, but like regionally where I am at, I mean, moose is actually a possibility. That's not tip. I wouldn't have to drive far to really take a shot. And I wouldn't say like a monster, but just so, you know, like a bull that's a decent sized bull. I mean, I think it's probably a QR drive. I mean, I'm in a good spot to find them. - I mean, like a small bull is like the size of a horse with paddles on its head. - I think that's still pretty dog unimpressive. - I have no plan of action to actually get a bull out of the bush. - Yeah. - It's just a team, but yeah, I'm sure, you know, dreams always come together at some point in time. - When I've been all cutting and stuff out and like Wyoming and Montana and Wyoming, Wyoming and Montana and Idaho. Like I've seen, you know, young paddle horns. And I'm just like, you guys are still so freaking huge. I couldn't imagine, like I've never seen a bull that was like 50 or 60 inches. You know, like, and I'm just like, these things are so gosh darn big. - So huge. - I mean, just like, if you look at a big whitetail buck track, it's like probably five times the size of that. Like if you look at a loose track, they're huge. Like they're, I just couldn't really like, to get that just to get with a bull range. - The track or a pile of scat, you're like, this is a big critter. - Oh yeah, it's big. Big guy saying like it's to be in bull range, it would be a hell of a rush, man. Like that would be just be wild. - Do you a predator, you bear hunt at all up there? - I've never bear hunt. I've considered it. I really was actually thinking about it, but good, there's a couple places that are not even far where I know there is some. I saw some tracks this spring, but never set up a bait trap, bait to a base station and kind of like-- - Are they basically going Ontario and Ontario? - Yeah, yeah, 'cause my buddy, you know, a lot of people around here go with the old donut technique or, you know, beaver tails and beaver, you know, beaver donuts and stuff like that, so. - Yeah, I think Ontario and Manitoba baiting is legal. I don't think baiting is legal in BC. I think you guys spawned stock there or use hounds, I believe. But yeah, man, it's awesome. Here in North Carolina, it has to be all natural bait sources. So we're using like corn and peanuts, oats, stuff like that. So the ease of going back behind the local bakery and saying, "Hey, can I get all your three-day old donuts?" Doesn't work. - Yeah. - But I guess we wouldn't have less bearers with the beatas too, but yeah, they do really enjoy peanuts, that's for sure, but it gets expensive. - Yeah, the donut thing, I don't think they do the donut giveaway anymore. I don't know why, but a couple of people I know say they had to pull back on using donuts and going with, I'm not sure what they said to use. Like, I have to ask a couple of my buddies who still do it, but yeah, donuts seem to be a tough thing to get even by old. - Old Fryer grease and like all sorts of things. - Yeah, yeah, stuff like that. What do they load it up with? I can't even remember it now, but I know Beaver is probably one that I think it would be successful with. - Yeah, I could see that. I'm using Beaver and I think folks have even used like the stuff they use for trapping, what's it, it comes out of the glands of like skunks and beavers and muskrats and stuff like that. I can't remember the name of it, but is it the, what's it called? Is it Castro? - Yeah, like it's like Caster. Yeah. - Yeah, I guess it's supposed to be pretty good too, but man, I wouldn't want to accidentally spill that on myself. And I'm clumsy, so I probably would. - Yeah, the one time I tried fleshing a Beaver tail and man, I was like, I just totally underestimated how much it stinks like fish. You just like this deep green stink and I was like, why didn't I wear gloves? This was just so stupid. (laughing) - That for sure. I've got a buddy that sent me some Beaver tails. He's up in Idaho to use for handle riser wraps on some of the self bows. So I'm looking forward to using those pretty neat. Do you do any trapping up there? - Not really, personally, I don't. I mean, I've got people that I know like reserves, like native reserves who still do that stuff and a couple of people I know further north who would do it. But I don't know, I just try to support like trappers that I know personally who actually do like do the grind and cause it's, I mean, I love the knowledge. I would love to learn how to do it, to do it well. I've never tried setting up, I would have seen some trail like Beaver trails that I could do it and I would want to do it. I think it'd be kind of cool, but I've never personally made a staff, took a staff at it. - Man, this is the first year I'm gonna try to take a step. I don't think trapping season starts here till 15 October, but not necessarily for like muskrat and Beaver, but for like coyotes and raccoons and foxes and stuff like that. Just to help with some predator management out here. But also I want to start, I want to see if I can start making some quivers with like the animal hides. - Yeah. - Just like for my kids and stuff. Like imagine how adorable it would be to see a kid like running around with like a coon skin quiver with like the little tail flopping around when they're running around with their arrows in there. So that's really all I'm, I'm kind of like, I'm gonna trap enough to do something like this, but that's bad to extend out of it. But I've got some, you know, virtual mentors and some of the trapping stuff I want to dive into. - Yeah, no, I think that's a really valuable skill. Like I would love to learn to trap, but like I think that would be a huge, especially when you watch like shows like a loan and like if you like think, but try to think like, you know, it should has the fan, like what would I need to know? Like, I mean, these are things I always constantly try to like, you know, I think about, but I do try it some point in time when I have free time to like try something. So, you know, it's, I think a skill like trapping is a big thing to learn how to trap to amplify your success with gathering some sort of protein. Like, you know, it's basically like working while you're away. I like tools like that. I think you're big. - It's like a hundred version of passive income, right? - Yeah, that's it. It's like passive is exactly, I think that's awesome. That's exactly it. - Oh man, but the grind is real and it's not so passive. All I got to say, you know, all right. So, you know, you're hunting and all that good stuff. You're going to get some big whitetails and turkeys. Standing wolf archery to the Standing Wolf podcast. How did that occur? - Oh, that was, I guess it's a two part question. I guess for one, I really want to learn more and connect more with the community. I think that's like the best way to connect to people. Like yourself, like we get a chance. Like people that you don't normally just would like, 'cause, you know, being in Canada, I don't get to like trade shows and stuff that often or at all, really, I can't say I've made the drive and I would love to. It's just some stuffs difficult to actually meet people in person. But like stuff like this, to actually have a virtual conversation is awesome. You get to connect with people and learn about them. You obviously hear great stories and the relationship building is so important, especially with like traditional 'cause it's such a small community, it's everything. It means everything, you know, it's just, you just never know where it even goes. I mean, you meet people and you just keep talking to them and sure enough, everyone's like buddies. And, you know, I would like to like transcend just talking online to like actually meeting you in person. And, you know, as that stuff grows and grows, it's just so cool. So that's kind of like- - I share your sentiment, man. - I share it, yeah. - That was the first thing. And then I was like, okay, well, how can like, I guess in some ways, it was kind of also like a business idea, but that kind of faded away pretty quickly. I mean, the second I started actually talking to someone, who was it? I think it was either like a Blaine Prez, you know, some soccer archery and Vince Smith from "Lonesome Win Bose" or the two first guys I talked to, but the Blaine, Blaine actually, I talked to first. And just the second we started talking to them, I, okay, all of that shit that thought would work for like, I don't give a shit. It's like, that's kind of irrelevant. Now it's just having conversations, talking about archery, making some stories 'cause everyone loves listen to stories. That's like the heart of like human society is a story, a good story and learning something. So it's such a great mechanism to do that. So the honest answer was, I thought it could be good for like getting like Samuel's name out, but then the reality is that change, that change pretty quickly. Then it's just like, I really like learning from people. And I think the meeting people and like connecting with people is like, is the value. That is the value. Is talking to people, figuring out, you know, how could I help this guy? How can, you know, does he make something? 'Cause I want to support small businesses and that's a big thing that my wife and I try to do with like when we buy stuff to make our own stuff, I want to buy something on someone who's also like trying to feed their family. I don't want to like buy off a corporation. 'Cause I mean, I'm like, yeah. I mean, and I've also done like a lot of bartering with people. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, so exactly. - And that can be the way that stuff like in lunch is like, 'cause it doesn't- - That's fantastic. - That is how communities work, right? - Yeah, man. - That's all common. - I got a buddy, I want to say his name, but we talk about, it's like money is fake. It's stupid. It's been invented by like authoritarian governments. Yeah, I did, yeah. Yes, we get it, it's necessary, but it's generally made up, right? Like, I mean, it's an ordering and trade is pretty cool. And sometimes it's just, sometimes I'll get something from small business, not always, 'cause I need it. I don't try to just like consume because it's there, but I'm like, I'll need at some point, but this guy's like, this is a really good dude or gal. And I want to support him, right? And I think once you're in the hustle, whether it's a full-time hustle or a side hustle, so you really have a stronger appreciation for how much effort and time goes into making something by hand or in a small scale with high quality, you know, heirloom quality of goods and there's story and heart behind it, right? And yeah, that's it, man. Like, you hit the nail in the head with that. It's just, that's what our casting does. I mean, it lets you connect. It lets you build a community. It lets you support a community. It's especially with like what we're doing with traditional. Like it, or whatever, it doesn't matter, but because we're all in this for traditional and you know, everything that kind of stems from that kind of culture, it's just the only way to go about it. It's just, it's so awesome. It's, community is everything, especially with this and, you know, here we are talking, we're on like two different countries and it's just, it doesn't matter. What does that matter? We're just, it bridges everything. It ties everything together so seamlessly. And like I said, like what I thought I would do for, just immediately became irrelevant. Like I thought, okay, you know, this would be, this would be a smart idea. It's like, that would be retarded. It's just, when I started talking to people, it's almost addictive, you want to have like more and more conversations and like, you're like, this is so cool. Like I'm learning stuff too. Like, I want to learn too. Like when I listen to someone tell a story like, let's say like a Monty, Monty Brownie, he'll talk about this. Like, oh, well, shit, maybe I don't want to try any daredevil shit that you know, that he's either harm or die. - The fact that his wife still lets him even leave the house as a miracle. - Yeah. (laughs) - But everyone has great advice. It's advice that you could use. I mean, everyone's got like something they could share and it's just, whether it's for me to personally use, which I try to, I do try to implement people's advice that make my own game better, but maybe there's someone who hears it that I have no idea about, who just hears it and like, oh, that worked really well for me. That's awesome. That's super cool. - Yeah, man. Like I told somebody, it was like, hey, it's not altruistic. It's also a selfish reason for me. People talk to people that are way cooler than I am. - Yeah. (laughs) - I dig it. And how long, how many episodes, do you have any rough idea how many episodes? - Oh, man. - When you question about whether the podcast is going to help your business, I actually came across the podcast before I came across the business. So there we go. You got one data set right there. Boom. - Cool. - Okay. - I'm going to go, I'm going to revamp my whole business strategy. - Yep, you're going to make tens of dollars that way. (laughs) - But yeah, roughly how many episodes you have. - Oh, man, we're a newbie. We're fresh out of the oven with this podcast. Really, I think like 20 in or 21 in. - Oh, man, that's really good though. I mean, that's-- - I guess it's not bad, but it's just like, I'm like, I just look at it as like, that's first of all, yeah. I got, I'm going to look at it positively. That's 20 conversations I just had that are awesome. - Yeah, yeah, it's really good. And we were talking about this for beforehand, but I was like, man, I love like the Bush for Stories variety. I mean, everybody loves a good story. And man, I can feel like because we're attached to our phones and everybody's sitting text messages or whatever. We're sometimes disconnected from like our grandads or the gray beards and whatever female variety of that is to hear these cool old stories from people. They're way more seasoned than we are. - Oh, yeah. - And I think it's important to record some of these stories so that they can be carried on in the future too, right? - Oh, yeah, it's like, it's just like, you know, if Fred Baird didn't film himself doing all the stuff, I mean, how many people wouldn't be inspired? Like, so many generations that just came are grabbing both because of that. He took the time to film it and then, you know, that's just that meeting he chose them. But it's like, podcasting is the new medium, like... - It really is, man. And I loved, I'm a voracious reader and, you know, but I also like audiobooks. I consume a lot of podcasts, you know, if I'm on a drive or I'm at the gym or I'm on my lawn or whatever, right? Like, I'm trying to get information in my ear holes during that timeframe. And because like, let's face it, a lot of media or social media shoves so much garbage into your face, at least with some of your podcasts and your books or audiobooks, you're picking the content that is coming and feeding your brain and your psyche and your soul. And there's not enough good things out there. So I do like this platform, as much as I get irritated at technology, it is a great platform to consume good, if you choose to. - Yeah, I think what you just said, I mean, we could kind of deep dive in that too. I mean, it makes a lot of sense. Like you said, voluntarily decide what you want to consume. 'Cause as things are kind of going with algorithms, suggesting things, I mean, you could go, you know, you may want to start with finding podcasts or YouTube, podcast, whatever about a subject, whether it's like trapping or, you know, how to make a stick bow and do enough. Over time, it'll just inch you further and further in a totally different direction. And, you know, I'm not down with, you know, the inevitability of like machine learning, AI and all this stuff. Okay, I get it. It's kind of not going anywhere. It's a hard pill to swallow in some ways, but it's, it's dangerous. - Have these guys not ever watched the Terminator movies? It's the same. - You know how this is. (laughs) - No, it's just that the whole aspect of saying this machine should decide how you navigate your life is very dangerous. Like, I mean, don't let anyone try to, whoever's listening, don't let anyone suggest that this is the way like the world government should be made. I mean, no, at no time should humans ever be governed by a machine who's only going on an algorithm or a program designed to buy someone's bad intentions. - Also has its own biases. - Yes, yes, exactly. I mean, it's-- - In modeling, machine learning modeling, it learns through biases, right? Through repetitive data sets, which are that bias, which it's not, that means it's no longer like objective. It's subjective. - Exactly. - I mean, Zach Hansen of the OKS Trapper podcast, and buddy of mine, he is like an AI super ninja smart guy. And he'll, if he listens to this, he can tell me that I'm wrong if I am, but I'm pretty sure that, you know, I'm at least 50% right. (laughing) - I don't know, what do I know? I'm just a crayon eater. It's fine. (laughing) - Well, man, like what do you see as kind of the future? So like if you had like a whiteboard and you were projecting kind of like the next six to 12 months for standing wolf archery and/or the podcast, where does that, where do you envision that going? Without, you know, divulging trade secrets and stuff. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - We've got tens of people that are listening to this that might take advantage of it. So don't divulge any secrets. - I'm really excited about everything. I mean, with what we're going with say, okay, let's say the podcast. Obviously, we're going to have more discussions. There's really only one bro with podcasting and that's just to keep it going. So we got more conversations. I believe you're on deck. We're going to do another podcast with yourself. So we got-- - Man, go away. I'm excited. We got stories waiting for your bear hunt. So we'll pick it up. We'll lift off with the bear hunt. - I can say I was on an international podcast at that point. - Oh, there you go. - Yeah. - Broadcast and internationally. - I'm going to put it on my resume. - Yeah, man, we're going to just grind it out. It's all but just never quitting. Can't quit. Just got to keep on going with just guests because it's so fun. It's really fun. So I just want to have great people to have, obviously, things to teach, fun conversations to talk about. And that's the goal with that. It's not too complicated. Anyone can use that roadmap. But Daniel Wolf, I mean-- - But you got to have a certain level of perseverance to do that too, right? - Oh, shit. Oh, I have learned the hard way that, you know, their life finds a way, like running a business and doing that, even though that could be considered like marketing. I mean, it's so, man, like it's just my wife and myself doing the work. So it's like, it's a lot to take on. And we have three kids that we have to take care of and, you know, manage their lives too in some ways to perform. And it's a lot to juggle. So, I mean, I'm never going to say I wish I didn't have those responsibilities, but, you know, it's just-- - Sometimes you get better with more free time. I get it. - Yeah, yeah. Everyone wants to do what they love to do. And, you know, in a lot of ways, I actually am doing it. I really enjoy making stuff like this the best. Like the community, the customers that we got, I mean, I just love it. I think everyone's so supportive. I couldn't have fallen into a better industry 'cause it's just so cool. I mean, I would have never known it was this awesome. I mean, I was shooting ranges and 3D ranges and stuff. And everyone's cool there too. But when you start to get into the business and how supportive people are, it's awesome. I can't imagine maybe like a homesteading industry or something. I don't know, sure. There's not too many communities that are this cool. Like, it's traditional archery or maybe archery too. Like bow hunting is awesome. - I agree, man. I'm just happy to be the new kid on the block that gets to hang out with all the cool people, you know? (laughs) So yeah. - Yeah, we got some redesigns for some quivers and always prototyping. I mean, I got some customers are giving us ideas too, what to make. And that's really, how could I not listen to them? They, it's for them. So, you know. - Like a repeat business, right? - Yeah, man. It's just always making, always prototyping. I guess with trad, the final frontier is both. I mean, that is the final frontier. There's nothing more that I could possibly achieve than trying to make one for myself and taking it out there. Like I said, if I could get that loose or whatever I use it for. And then if that is successful for whatever, if I don't blow it up on my face and hate it, then I'll try it again. And if so that works again too and I could repeat it, then that's a possibility. I'm sure it's a lot of work, you know better than I do. I mean, I could only imagine. - The level of diligence and fortitude that you put into your own craft, there's zero doubt that you could fabricate your own bow and harvest an animal with it. - Yeah, that's the immediate plan, at least for personal enjoyment. I mean, whether that becomes something a standing wolf brought, I don't know. That's just-- - Yeah, I think, I think Corey Hawke is getting ready to come up to ol' Canada Ray in the next couple of months. Organic Archer, if you're looking up on Instagram, I feel like they had a slot left, but I get it, Canada's huge. I have no idea where he's going to be. I just remember he's going-- - We're going up to Canada, where it goes, I don't know, Canada. - Yeah, yeah, Canada. You're probably going to your neighbor's house. (laughing) So yeah, man, a cool opportunity. I think it's no more-- - Now, there are some projects that are in the works that are traditional archery, but not necessarily standing wolf that I'm gonna be talking about more. And you probably already are aware of it, but you just don't know it. - Man, that's awesome, I'm excited for it. I just, I love to see good people grow, and I think it's exciting. And it's, it gives the rest of, you know, the community hope, right? Rise and Tides, raise all ships. - That's it. - Yeah, man. Brother Man, we are about an hour in. I would love to start tapering and can conclude with like a call to action and be in a man that has hit what you, you know, you kind of self-identified as like a low point, right? Whether it was profession or in life or questioning your kind of your purpose. And you went through this spiritual transformation and then a real life, you know, professional transformation. Do you have any words of encouragement or a call to action for people that might be experiencing a bit of a rut that are trying to figure out what they want to do when they grow up? And look, I feel like when I'm 60, I'm still gonna wonder what I'm gonna be when I grow up. So it's age agnostic. - What they wanna do when they grow up? Well, I mean, it's a good question. I think I know I wanted to be a Disney animator when I was gonna grow up. I went to, I was in some pretty serious courses to do that. My trajectory completely changed. And I would like to know, I wish I could know of what it would have been like to be that. I would say, you know, you're gonna get tested without a question with whatever you choose. It doesn't matter what it is. If it's something you wanna make like a bow, whatever it is, I mean, it doesn't matter what you're deciding. You're gonna get tested and there's gonna be multiple, multiple tests of your faith. First of all, if it's possible, you're gonna get tested, you're determined that your will to succeed. You're gonna be, if the higher level you go, you're gonna be exposed to competition. I mean, business is cut throat sometimes. I mean, the ruthlessness of competition is real. I mean, you know, like I was saying about the platform that we were selling on it, you know, shadow banning is a real thing. I mean, giving bad reviews. I mean, it could be in any industry. There's people who would wanna see you lose. So you gotta be up against that. I think the best thing I could ever say to anyone is that visualization is a real thing. Manifesting is a real thing. Sometimes it doesn't come right away when you want it. Sometimes you'll get pushed in a particular direction that is actually in alignment with like your ultimate destiny and you won't even realize it and you won't even understand why it's happening. But you're gonna face walls, everything, you know, everything will, you're gonna face hurdles that might even seem impossible and like, might even break you. You might just, you might collapse from the pressure. But, you know, there's nothing that can't stop you from getting back up and going again. I mean, I don't know if I'm ranting anything and it's kind of like a philosophical question that can be complicated and easy at the same time. - It's not a black and white question with a black and white. - Yeah, it's kind of complicated, right? If it was easy, everybody be doing it. - Yeah, I mean, just start with whatever you wanna do. Practice all the time, I mean, all the time. Learn from everyone else. Don't ever think you're the best. Try to be helpful and like help other people around you be good to, 'cause you never know, like if by doing that, down the road, someone might come back and help you up again here, it's just, but be just visualize where you wanna go and just like just trust that in the end, you're gonna navigate your way through it and just the faith is the ultimate most important thing. The thing I learned from that fast and, you know, when all that stuff is happening and believe me, it was, there's a whole podcast that I could talk about just about that. But when the worst part, like I thought something legitimately wanted to kill me and then I'm not making it up that something was like that feeling. There was something there that gave me that feeling and it was gonna kill me. The only thing that got through me and when everything was whittled down was that the faith, Bow, I'll be okay. I had nothing left. There was nothing that I could do to protect myself. I mean, nothing, everything that was taken from me, like the essence of being what I was was just faith that I'll be okay. So ultimately, everything will be okay. The faith, a human's ability to have faith in something and believe no matter what's going on around is the ultimate weapon. It's the ultimate thing that everything yields to. Nothing, everything moves out of the way when you unconditionally believe that something will happen or something you want will happen or somewhere you wanna go or something you wanna achieve. The faith part is the ultimate tool. Everything gives way. As long as you stay consistent in believing it, no matter all the storm that could happen around you, it will subside the faith of what the point that you have the faith in will be the one, the thing that's less standing. I love it. It's very organic and genuine, man. I appreciate you sharing that 'cause I know it's heartfelt but also heavy subject. And I think you shared a lot of intimate reflection that you didn't, you were in a no obligation to share, but I think, I know I gained value out of it and I'm very confident that our listeners will too. So I appreciate that. I appreciate you for sharing that. Like, Ben, I think we're, it's about time to start getting the tiny humans to bed and get in there so I don't get hollowed out by the boss lady. - Yeah, it's all good, my friend. - But man, this is tremendous. I hope that we maintain communications outside the old Instagrams now that we already had our first video date and we'll keep it up, dude. And I'm legit, I'm gonna order one of those split figure tabs I'm very interested in learning it and applying it and testing it out. Just the tab concept, I'm not gonna take it first thing out to go try to hunt with. I wanna get familiar with it, but I appreciate your dialogue that you've had behind the scenes on, you know, the pros and cons and all that good stuff too. And, you know, also, wait, yeah, where can people find you? I gotta do that real quick. We'll put this in a little bit. - Obviously, without question, all you gotta do is go to, I mean, you wanna buy something and, you know, support standing with our trees, go to standingwolfartgree.com, that's the main spot. You know, that's where, you know, we're trying to move away from everything else that we could be selling on and just like our own platform, our own website, you know, that's just the goal is to make sure that, you know, we could phase out everything and just move specifically to what, you know, standingwolfartgree.com. And, obviously, Instagram, YouTube, whatever, it's all standing with our tree, you'll find it. - Right on, brother. I'll put links to it in all the show notes. I appreciate it. - Yeah, I appreciate everything you do. - All right, Ron, man, we're gonna conclude this episode. I appreciate you and I know everything you stand for. All right, on, man, we'll appreciate it. (upbeat music) (upbeat music)
Ron is a Native American/ Italian traditional bowhunter and craftsman from Ontario Canada. He was given the spirit name Standing Wolf by a Native Elder prior to the creation of Standing Wolf Archery. He started by making accessories that he personally wanted (beaver silencers being the first) and decided to give selling them online a try with some ecommerce help from his brother and feedback from friends at the local archery range. One thing led to another, now Standing Wolf is making many badass accessories for traditional archers all over the world.
Find Ron at:
Instagram: @standingwolfarchery
Website: www.standingwolfarchery.com
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