[MUSIC] A little more interesting in the third that they need it. What they have most of the win, the one hundredth. >> [INAUDIBLE] >> I didn't think it was all that physical game. But honestly, I didn't think it was, it wasn't as anticipated. It was probably more of what you should expect on Monday night. In the middle of the regular season versus what you're gonna get in the playoff series. Or what we've come to expect, what we've had some other games. But that said, I thought we were engaged in the game. I didn't think it was an overly physical affair by any means. But I liked how we stood in there, even in eyes response. You like those kind of things. It was going to be required for us to get another level ourselves. And I thought we did, so that was really encouraging. [MUSIC] >> Good morning, Joe Sports at 5.9 in the van, bed, and it's bread gunning. Good morning, Brent. >> Good morning to you. >> Good morning to Leaf fans who perhaps view yesterday's 6-4 win by the Toronto Maple Leafs' reason why. >> This year's potential first round playoff series will go differently than the five game series. They played against the Panthers last year. Here's the one thing. >> Sure. >> Awesome, Matthew scoring two more goals in that game yesterday. Then he scored in the entirety of the five game series against the Panthers. The last we saw. >> Yes, this is true. It was nice to see him pot a pair, including, although I guess once you've already broke the dam on empty netters, like, get them home at this point in time. But I did like, I really did like that fleeting moment. And by that, I mean the first like 60 some odd games of the season when there were no empty netters. >> I kind of thought, hey, when he scored the empty netter, to make it a 6-4 game. And boy, everybody took a big sigh of relief as it was like, oh yeah, you thought it was 4-1 was bad. It was 5-1 against the Panthers team that just beat you in the postseason. Anyways, to salt it away, I did kind of think, 40 seconds though, they win the draw and then get it over the line. Maybe another empty net. >> You can. >> Yeah, 62 now for Austin Matthews. The pace is 69, so it's possible 70 is right there anyways. The victory more important. The two points in regulation against the Florida Panthers is the Leafs now four points back of Florida with a game in hand, catching the Panthers also very much in play. And remember like that horrible home record we were talking about this Leafs team? It's almost identical now, their home record to what the Panthers have at home. Leafs now 21, 13 and 3, Panthers 22, 13 and 2. >> Well, and these things are weird because they care like this stat in about to reference carries over for, you know, a multitude of seasons, but they flashed it up on the broadcast now. This is regular season as well. 10-1-1 at home against the Panthers in their last 12 games, their last night into it. It's 11-1-1 in their last what 14 games against or 13 games against the Panthers there. It is remarkable how strong a record that is. And I don't put a ton of stock into that because that's going back three, four seasons now. But it is remarkable to run a success they've had at home in their regular season against this team. >> Yeah, everybody kind of downplaying the whole deal, right? Especially Paul Murray's before the game was like, I don't know. This doesn't mean much of anything and then out you just heard the comments from Sheldon Kiefa. >> Yeah, it's regular season game, didn't have the physicality that you see in the post season. Ryan Reeves was trying to bring some physicality to the game. He mentioned the Matthew Nye's attempted fight with Michela and I mean, wrestling around. >> I mean, he took a glove off. One glove. >> Yeah. >> But yeah, I don't know. Did that feel more than a regular season game for the Leafs? >> I think there was a little something there and that they wanted to, they didn't want to capitulate in any pushback. But I also think they realized the track record to them or the path forward to them being successful in this team and it's not to say, or against that team. It's not to say it can't be a physical game. But I don't think they want to turn it into a brawl or a street fight. They can apparently handle themselves better this year than they could have last year in some element of that. But I still don't think that's who this team is to their core. Just look at the core of this team. That's not what they want to do. So I think it's nice that you were able to see some of that. I thought Revo was excellent last night. I thought he looked like a guy who's like, you think I might be on the outside looking in for games? >> Not against them? >> Yeah. No, honestly, I know there's another regular season game to go against the Panthers and we'll see whether that has any meaning in what kind of lineup Leafs ice for that game. But to me, yeah, you won me over, Brian. You win. The fourth line was great, scored a goal yesterday and you were all over the place and restrained yourself once where you're like, Oh, is that going to be a boarding penalty? Like didn't do the thing. And then Simone Benoit seconds later does take the penalty, but for like, Dosey dough, he was like line dancing. >> I thought Ryan Reeves was out freaking standing yesterday. >> Yeah, that was as good as you've, that was as good a night as you've seen him. And it wasn't just the fact that he was being physical. He's getting in on the forecheck and actually impacting the way the Panthers were able to break out. It was that one great sequence where he gets it on the forecheck, the Panthers eventually get it out, but then he comes charge him back the other way, it takes it to a two on one, gives himself a bit of a look. It's just really nice what you see. And I think the most important thing, and this isn't important for him, but it's important for the coach. It's important for us to see is that he did it in a night where he didn't fight. Is that maybe the second time this year we were sitting here having a conversation about how good he was, where there wasn't a fight. There have been a lot of nights where you knew, okay, probably his night tonight, and the fight is part of what made his night good. He didn't need it last night. If it was there, would have happily taken it, I'm sure, but he didn't need to force the issue. The other thing is, and I don't disagree with you, but the fact that they have two forwards coming back into the lineup, and it seems like Ryan Reeves deserves a spot, that's even more, more telling. >> Yeah, well, and it is interesting that Sheldon Keefe put that third line, the interesting third line that's got a great goal, and Nick Robertson, apparently, according to the Prizkout, knew how to beat Sir Gabe Abrovsky, which would have been helpful to have during the five games series. >> You tell the guys, or he was just holding that, he's like, no, if you want it, you gotta put me in. >> Well, I mean, and he plays fewer than ten minutes in the hockey game, right? And they get benched in the third period. As things get a little hairy there, and they're trying to lock down a lead. Sheldon Keefe did talk about putting them in situations to test them, but let's hear it. >> Let's just hear it. >> Yeah, let's hear it. >> Sure. >> Huge goal. Huge goal. Love day. He's got that game breaking ability, but you love to see. You know, we talked as coaches before the game here today, I was going to put that line in some tough spots tonight on purpose, and see how they can handle it. And some of it really good. That's a great moment in the game. They had a couple other really good moments, they obviously scored another goal in the second period. They're on the ice for the two goals in the third, you know, and again, I'm kind of purposely putting them in some tough spots and having them work their way through it. That's part of the growing pains, so you got three first-year players essentially on the same line. It's a tough opponent over there, but they'll be better having gone through it tonight. >> Okay, just a disappointed dad, like he's like building them up, building them up. They're out there for two goals, so it's like, he's got a D in math. I don't know. Like, yeah, great. >> Yeah. >> Social studies are killing it. >> Chilling it. Crashing it. It was all about... >> Fizzed! >> Eight plus. >> Stop describing my report cards from the age of zero to whatever they stopped giving them. >> Okay, some of two minds here, because like, yeah, Leafs don't have an X next to their name, but they're obviously getting, and there was a scenario in which they could have clinched yesterday if... >> I didn't even know. >> I saw the email of like, clinching scenarios, I was like, "Clients at it?" >> I'm like, eh. >> That's right. >> I visibly... >> You mentioned it on the broadcast. >> I visibly, when I saw that email that went out to us. >> You physically did that? >> Yeah, I went, eh. >> And then like pushed it away. >> Pushed it away. >> Asked you what you were doing? Like, why are you looking at your computer and making a noise? >> No. >> Okay. >> No. >> Yeah, they needed the Islanders and the Flyers not to go to overtime, but they did. That's the Tampa Bay Lightning. So you get another potential playoff opponent upcoming. But yeah, so I love two minds here. We know the regular season has limited value and little predictive value also for this Leafs team. It's like, little value as far as like, "Hey, have a great season. That pretends good things in the postseason." The regular season basically exists so often, Matthews can score 60 goals and Mitch Marner can feel like it, but not get 100 points, is basically why the regular season sees it. Exactly. And like, it's the majority of the season, so you should enjoy it. And it is, it's the most enjoyable part of being a Leaf fan in the last eight years. >> Preaching the choir right here on the guy who's like, "Yeah, regular season, love it." >> Yeah. >> Make the whole thing out of the regular season. >> That's too far. So that's, yeah, regular season, we get it. So yeah, experiment. It's eight games left. >> Mm-hmm. >> Like, what, and to my understanding, like, we don't hear this from Sheldon Keith very often, right? Well, that'll benefit him. >> Enough. What are we doing? Like, I do, so, like, I'm of two minds, again, like, that's not a playoff game. >> Yeah. >> And it is a game for experimenting. >> Yeah. >> A lot of it's gonna look totally different. Like, you got no Morgan Ryan. You got no Timothy Lilligrain. You got no Joel Edmondson. You got no Calli Yarnkra. You got no Mitch Marner. Like, I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. >> So what? >> I just, what are we doing here now in April with that? >> I'd feel so much differently about this if, let's say, all the same defensemen were hurt, but you had Marner and Yarnkrak in the lineup. I would think this is, I would be following you down this path of what are we doing here. But those guys aren't in the lineup. So the lines are not resembling anything close to what we're seeing in a playoff game. They weren't up by a goal. They're up 5-1. >> Yeah. >> And you put them in that spot. Then, most importantly, when you get out of there, and then when you go full John Gibbons and it's not cutting time at the end, then you put out the guys you trust and it's Austin Matthews out there. >> Who, by the way, almost had a William Newlander moment turning up the, turning over the puck at the blue line right before his 60-second goal of the season, but that's okay because it's Austin Matthews. >> You mean clearing the zone? >> Yeah, but like it's like he, he, he wins the puck battle in the, he wins the puck battle right in the inner slot. That's a smart, great play. And then he does try to tow drag the defender to set up a break out pass. >> Even before that, I forget who it was. >> When the Leafs were in the offensive zone before the first six on five, he was looking for offense instead of being on the right side of the puck too. >> Which, I'm not, like it's game 74. He's chasing, I'm not gonna kill him for it. >> Yeah, I know, but what, yeah, so what are we doing here? >> I'm not, I'm not saying like, that sounds disparaging, but I'm like, what are we doing here? >> The problem. >> Answer my question. They are trying to, they're trying to walk and chew gum at the same time. It can be done, believe it or not. I think that it is important. If this team, we say this about the blue line all the time. If this team is gonna go to, let's just, let's dream to like the ultimate scenario, a conference final, okay? This team's gonna go all the way there. Nick Robertson's gonna play for this team in games that matter. >> Yeah, probably. >> Probably. Like, you know, if they have their druthers, they'd have their same 12 forwards and that would be that. But that's not what's gonna happen. You're gonna need that guy at some point in time. So I like the idea of putting him in a spot, well, you have room to breathe in a game that ultimately doesn't matter. And then you put your big dogs out there to actually kind of seal it. I loved that from Sheldon Keefe. I'd feel differently about it if you had all your forwards and you could have, if you had your full complement of forwards and I would have said, no, no, no, no, no, choke the life out of this game, give me a test run of what a 4-1 lead should look like in the playoffs. But they didn't have those guys. >> You know what I would have loved to have seen that a couple months ago and like, oh, let's challenge you guys, let's have these learning lessons and then let's do it again next week. And then maybe, you know, there's like, we can see growth. So what are we gonna keep doing that? Like the remaining eight games? If that's the plan, like to keep that line together. And every time we have a lead, okay, here we go. Another kick of the can. Can you guys do it? Can you be on the right side of the puck? Can you get the way lead? But it does feel like that was your chance and, you know, I don't get some people back for Wednesday's game. >> I don't think that was their chance, but I do think that it's not gonna be, those guys aren't getting a chance to salt out a game when it's a one goal lead or a 3-1 lead in the third period. But when you have the cushion that they had there, and again, I think I think it's a really different conversation once, even Marner's back and you have a line with Marner. I mean, who knows, honestly, who knows what the lines are gonna look like when Marner comes back. That is one of the biggest questions going. But I'd feel differently about it if even you had him. But you don't. And might have him tomorrow. Maybe it's a different question. But I would bet from Keith, especially once they clench, like it's gonna happen at some point in time, that you're going to see that from those guys, them getting opportunities to grow, to learn, whatever. I don't think them doing that there takes away Austin Matthews ability to be at 100% sharpness for the playoffs or even Max Dometes, quite honestly. Do you grow and learn still? Like, do you do a lot of growing and a lot of learning? I think it was tall as I'm gonna get. I think I'm probably, I mean, expanding, yes, but, mentally. I would like to think there's still, like, I am that guy who's like, you know, when you're like a kid, you have this like idealized version of your adult self. I'm still that guy. I'm like, you know, when I grow up, I'll go to the gym every day and years old. Yeah. But I'm actually, no, but I'm so young compared to all of the us. It's like young old guys at the fan now. It's like, I'm still the baby of all you guys, but I do have that moment where I'm like, yeah, you know, when I grow up, I'll eat my vegetables. I'll do it at the Hulkster said, I'm 40 years old and like, I only recently started going to the LCBO and at the cash, not feeling like I'm like doing something wrong and like, I'm using a fake ID or something. Oh, my wife and I like, well, Cruz, yeah, we'll like grab some, like bottles of wine in there. And it's like, we're still like, giggling like school kids. Yeah. Yeah. They're like, yeah, the model oldies. Anyway, senior discount. We do a lot of naval gazing when it comes to this Leafs team. And hey, I mentioned it, like, do you want to protect your goalie? The projected starter, because you don't want the Panthers to see it. How about this? Sir Gabe Abrofsky had a 943 save percentage in those five games against the Leafs. Yeah. How about that? Like seeing some pucks go beyond him and chasing him from the game through 40 minutes of play. It's not like he was bad or anything. No. Leafs played a pretty perfect first 40 minutes on a hockey game. The third period looked a lot like the Oilers game except the Oilers goals were all on the power play. And we can talk about special teams. I'm like, boy, they really did take my Faustian bargain. They heard me and they're like, we're going to try that whole thing. Like we're going to do that for real. Not allow any goals on the penalty kill, but also not score any goals on the power play. Yeah. Again, like, I don't know how much you take away from one regular season game, the ninth last game of the regular season and projected towards a postseason series between these two teams. It's not like, so the five game series, yeah, it stands out, they lost the series in five games. Those are not blowouts, right? We do view these teams, I think, because they're the Leafs and because the Panthers went all the way to the cup final, we're like, oh, world's apart. And the Panthers are this most perfect, God's most perfect hockey team. Yeah. But yeah, clearly not the case. And there's really not a ton to separate these two teams. No, it's, Sergey Barrowski was superhuman in that series. And it's not that the Leafs got goalie, that's not that they deserve to win otherwise. But he was. He was an exceptional part of that, much like if, you know, some teams going to go up against Conor McDavid in the playoffs and maybe they didn't deserve to win. But guess what? Conor McDavid's going to be superhuman and on the other side of that thing, you run up against players like that, sometimes you see it. But yeah, I mean, just go up and down the lineup, like put your, whatever you dream is your healthy 12 leaf forwards and six defense men for the playoffs, just go stack up the lines. You feel about those two groups against the Panthers and at worst, out worst, you think it's a push from the Leafs perspective. You can't overstate what it means to, you know, I think this Leafs team one day will get away from it. But the, you can't overstate the idea of the Leafs playing with pressure and having all of this weight on their shoulders and the Panthers, I mean, part of it's because they've done it, part of it's because they're the Panthers that they just flip flop. Exactly. The literal, they literally built a new practice rink with designated golf cart parking for all the players. Okay. Yeah. Got SN. Got to have it. But I, I look at it and I say that there's some element to that. But when you just look at the two, when you look at the two rosters side by side, outside of goal tending and, you know, flip a coin, depending on the day, I don't know that it's for sure obvious Florida advantage. Yeah. I think you could easily talk yourself into the Leafs being at least, at least a push against the Panthers. All right. Should we talk about Samson off in that game? Yeah, at least we should. Yeah. Getting the start in it, which was, yeah, had to happen after Saturday's game. It really stood out if he didn't get the start. Yeah. I thought he was just like everybody else pretty outstanding through 40 minutes of play. He did enough. And boy, I do think like, I test wise, the PK looks a whole lot better. Yes. But also he had to be good. There's also a post in there. But what, that's the game. Yeah. I, I also, okay, I don't mean this to be disparaging Samson off and this is a classic like we've all seen. I think it was Bunk who tweeted out the other day of like the, the meme of like the attractive coworker being like, hey, and they're like, and then the, the fat slide that everybody's making excuses for Joe wall where they're trying to poke holes in the Elia Samson off thing. Well, you're going to talk about how he keeps reaching behind him like three times. Why weren't so many pucks getting through whatever score or not over the whole line? I know. I just, I'm putting myself in picturing that a month from now and I might not make it to give opinions on that, on that exact moment in the morning. He does the same thing where he's like, he knows exactly where the goal line is. I'm like, okay, how exciting will this be? That was the only part of it. I thought, I agree with you. I thought he was tremendous last night. And it was a little bit of grant fearing of like, hey, just don't want to allow five and six. Yeah. But man, I'd be lying to you if that wasn't extremely jarring to me. How many times he was fishing a puck out from behind him that didn't end up counting his goal. A couple other things for me. I love when Matthew nice does that. Well, hold on. I want to, I want to. Yeah, okay. Sorry. Go ahead. Do your nice thing. No, no, we're good. I'm not moving off the game. Did you have another Samson off thing? No, there was just a key comment on it that I was wondering, maybe we should hear, but maybe we'll do it at seven o'clock. So, okay. All right. I love when Matthew nice does this thing, fortunately for him, he didn't actually get in a fight. So can't have the Gordy Howe hat trick as the goal has the assist. But yeah, it's nice to know that that's in him and maybe it's more in him because he's like, I'm going to 11 goals. So I'm like, I'm implying all of that. Awesome math. I only have 11 goals. I better bring something. Here I am like moving down the lineup and there's a possibility non-zero that I'm either on the fourth line or not on the lineup at all during post season. So I better show my work to some degree and yeah, I get it like in this day and age with like clean hats. Yeah. You don't always have to fight a guy and I mean, you can debate the cleanliness of the hit on Pontus Holmberg, but yeah, he saw his buddy get slammed to the boards. What he thought was a dirty head head first. I love that that exists within the player because he's also an Arizona guy, like the upbringing is similar to Oz Matthews. They're wired a little bit differently in that regard. Yeah, you do see it. I think I think you really hit the nail on the head that if Austin Matthews wasn't capable of scoring 60 goals and he was looking to and like, this is not that that Matthew Knives is sitting there staring at his NHL career slipping away if he doesn't fight. It's nothing along those lines, but I also think there's some element to, and hey, like, you know, I bring up Dubas trilliving all the time. Let me do it one more. I really do wonder what element there is of him looking around and maybe he doesn't think about this at all, but him just looking around at who the GM is now and saying, okay, what's he value here? Right. Is it skill? I mean, it would like some of it, but he would have like, here's my guess like Brad's for living to be like score 40 goals and I never hit anyone. Of course he would have. And guess what? He was trying to do that for a big chunk of the season. It didn't exactly come to fruition, but I do think there, I don't think you can overlook past what Bertuzzi and Domi have brought to the table. Now part of it is the production has come along with it, but look at the advanced spot in the lineup there and now you see the players that he goes out and gets at the deadline. You just hear the way he talks about building a team. And if you're a guy like Matthew Knives, how can you not see that that's got to be part of the path? And yeah, just to see it happen. And I also am such a big believer in players having different experiences early on in their career. And he's still in a point where you can kind of change the die on what he is as a player. He's not going to become your prototypical, you know, rat running around and getting in guys faces. You don't want him to do that. You just, you'd take like Chris Crider, just be big and heavy and go pot 40 goals. But if that's not going to be the case, you have to find a different way. And I think he's still young enough where he's not going to get stuck into habits of avoiding those types of things. You're kind of seeing it go the other way. So yeah, I mean, it was no, it was no Penguins game on Saturday night back in November, whatever that was. Game of his life. Oh, but I mean, I don't know. So this is the second best one. Yeah, it was pretty good. You mentioned what are the lines look like when Mitch Marner returns, which maybe as early as tomorrow, he's going to practice in full today, but honestly, why are you talking about it? Yeah, I know. He's heard us all. He's heard it. He watched all the games. He didn't say he listened to all the radio shows today. So that was assumed though. So that just means like he just can't stay in Coughbert and simmer being like and Marner not on the power play. Yeah, notoriously critical of Miss Marner or Chris Coughbert and Craig Simpson. Yes. 100%. Yeah. So he'll, here's my guess. We're going to see him tomorrow? I would think. I guess the lightning seems eligible to return. Yeah, it seems like he's been ramping up with this date. Not that he cares that they come back against the lightning, but I think I think there is some element of coming back in a game with some stakes or some juice. I don't, if you're Mitch Marner, you don't want to, I haven't even looked at the schedule. I don't know if one of these exists, but you don't want to come back against the jackets, you know? And maybe there is, you know, hey, we're just easing him into the lineup. So there is a built in excuse to throw him down the lineup and throw him on the third line. But I do think and we'll get to the Elliott Friedman report later on in the program about them. You know, Hardy having preliminary discussions about an extension which he's eligible to sign after July 1st this year and he's not like leaves to trade him because he has full no trade. So yeah, you'll be locked in for the duration as everybody is. But yeah, you want to make nice, I guess, because you've got to have all the money and you've got to play wherever you want. So everything you want and ice cream. And he'll be playing next to awesome athletes, you would think at some point. And I think like the prevailing conventional wisdom is like, oh, well, Max Domi, like he's really, there's another distributor and that's maybe a natural spot. For him. Yeah. But the season did start with Tyler Batuzzi up there. And like the chemistry between Bertuzzi and Matthews, you know, like sudden become undeniable. I think the line as a whole is kind of undeniable to I think it's I would be very tempting to just leave sleeping dogs as they lie right now. And I know got to make everybody happy, but you don't really, you just got to win hockey games. But you can't have Mitch Marner on your third line. I suppose in game script does change deployment and yadda, yadda, yadda, maybe they're protecting a lead. Maybe you do switch it up a little bit, but my goodness, another plus two for that line again yesterday. Yeah. Here's what I'm rolling with until until proven that this isn't the right move. And yeah, I don't know, like is sorry to the Marner family when you hear the lines that I'm about to roll out here. Paul, yeah. Every year, every year. Your muffs, your muffs, okay, I can say anything I want. I said it. Let's try. Let's try. No. You just keep the top line together. Don't be Matthews producing. They've been nails. There's no way you could break that up. I like Willie with JT and McMahon. I've liked what you've got out of them. And then if this team is going to be at its ultimate best spot, whatever, I think you got to go Mitch Holmberg and nice. I don't disagree. If you think there's more there in Matthew Nice, and I don't know, like just picture your eyes, a big power forward, driving to the net with, I don't know, like a skilled distributor. And then I can Mitch Marner be upset if he's playing with his favorite player on the team. You can't call a guy. You can't tell us he's the favorite player and then go to the coach and complain about it. He's going to get his minutes anyways, right? On all special teams, like he's going to be over 20 minutes. And again, like deployment, you don't think he's going to play with awesome after your special late game, let McMahon with him. And then you got Willie, JT and Mitch going, I, if we are in a position and then just for the record, fourth line, when Sharon Crock is back on Yarn Croke camp, and I did have doer in that spot. But Ryan Reeves, God bless you after the last night. Connor Dewar is a part of the PK. I know you like to do it out of the camp, him and camp, you know, at that top forward. David camp. He's good for like two or three goals a year. David camp. Yeah. He's good for a couple of those. They're all usually against the Chicago Blackhawks for some reason. But nice to see him do that against somebody else. But I think you at least have to, until that line proves otherwise, and I don't know, it's like maybe Matthew's takes a dive because he needs to get a sweet boy with him. But until that line proves otherwise, you have to keep it together. And I understand the idea that you could move Domi off it and then you go back to what you wanted to start the year with. That is what I think they'll ultimately end up doing. I do think that's what will happen. It's not the way I would go. But then where does Domi go? And then like Domi, so Domi is on the wing on that line centered by Pontus Homburg. Haven't we seen this before? Yes, we have. And I don't like it. This is why I set up the line up the way I did Ben. I think the messaging is a lot easier in the first game back for Martin. Because you're like, hey, we're not going to put him in this pressurize bot and we're going to like limit it as minutes and like, yeah, he's going to be down the line up. But then like proof of concept, if it's like, oh, here we go. Here's the depth scoring again. Here's three lines. You can throw over the boards that have a chance to score and like look good. And this is what the Leafs have had to deal with on the opposite end throughout the entirety of this generation from their opposition in the postseason. The potential exists for that to be undeniable. Yeah. And I would think that at this point in the season with the things that were at stake for Mitch Marner, you're not going to hear too much of a hue and a cry. Andy, like ultimately he's, I think he's going to get his minutes. Like, yeah, John, the line up in the obviously different players and different stages of their career. But my goodness. Yeah. If that's the best lineup, the Leafs can throw at an opposition in the postseason. How do you argue with it? When I know people are going to say, well, why does it have to be Marner? Why can't you put me? I just like the idea of the playmaker that Marner is on that line. Drive a line. It will end it's a favorite player again. So even driving it, if his favorite player is on it, like co-pilots. Anything else from that game? No. No, I just like, I didn't try to think we hit on it all defense pair. Sorry. Blue line as a whole, now I know Florida packed it on late, but there's a little score effects at play there. God Brody and McCabe, when they're together, it doesn't make me feel good. No, it's not. It's not an idealized version. It's funny that TJ Brody now needs his fixture named Timothy Llegren, apparently like that's what you need. But everybody's like, no, I want Timothy, bring him over here. The fact that the blue line missing as many bodies as they are, like no mo, no Edmondson, you could look that way against that team, I think you're happy with it. But as far as things like we're so focused on the forward lines, I feel like you can kind of just shake them up like dice and you're going to have some compliment aligns you like. The deep air I still think is very, very much in flux and they have very little that they can put down in pen and that is super concerned to me. I know, like naturally, like, you look at the best formation maybe is Brody and McCabe, but I just can't shake, well, one, the way those two looked in last year's postseason. And two, like the last thing you made from that game is like the two of them like around the net, like, on either post, like, you got it. I got it. Who was it? I punk back on that. Like the argument would be that if you do like that pair, you play them more together and you get less of that because they're more used to one another, the feeding off of each other. They're not like they played with each other. I'm not, I'm not telling you that. I'm just telling you what the argument would be. If it were me, if it were me, I would put like, it's really tough. Make your pairings now. You already made your forward lines. I did. Sorry. Let me pull up the text I sent to my buddy. Okay. Well, the Bushkin Riley. We can all agree. Yes. That's the Bushkin Riley and then I was going to say that's the best. So TJ Brody on the outside looking in. Yeah. One tell him to tell Joel Ovenson. Ben Wong McCabe has been the best shutdown pairing that we've seen. It's been the best thing all year. You brought in a guy who I think is better. Like I do think Joel Ovenson is a better player than Simone Benoit and not that the contract should play into this. But if there was any question or like, tie goes to the guy you just extended for three years maybe and maybe it's not a tie and that's why they traded for Edmondson. But I also think Edmond since back is going to allow this thing not to be much of a question and when he's there he'll play and when he's not TJ Brody, well, yeah, that's what I'd be rolling with as well. All right. Grammy award-winning band Cole Lorne will be performing a Budweiser stage on Wednesday, September 25th, along with special guests, Gojira in spirit box. Celebrate. We're giving away one last pair of tickets and all you have to do is tune into episodes of the Fan Morning Show. Listen for the code word and then what you do is you text that code word to 59590. Today's code words are got the life. I know that one. Text got the life to 59590 right now for your chance to win today. Last day, giving away tickets for this event. But if you don't win with us, make sure to go to ticketmaster.ca to secure your tickets because they are now on sale. When we come back, Blue Jays, oh, yeah, they're up and down, very down yesterday to the tune of getting no hit by the Astros 5th starter. That and Mournax is the Fan Morning Show, continues. Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, Sports Set 590, the Fan. Hey, it's Ailish Forafar. And I'm Justin Cussard. Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. It's the Fan Pregame. It's 6 p.m. weekdays on Sportsnet, Sports Set 590, the Fan, and wherever you get your podcasts. [MUSIC] Onto, well, still useful. Fan Morning Show Sports Set 590, Ben Anis, Brent Gunning. Onto the Crawford boxes. Yeah. There's a lot of that yesterday. I sure was. Nice little debut for Bowdoin Francis. Astros destroyed Blue Jays 10-0, it should be mentioned yesterday that the Astros were swept in four games by the Yankees. Eventually, we're bound to win a game. You do? Yeah. And so a lot of things conspiring against the Blue Jays in that game. But yeah, there's losing a game, then there's losing a game. Nothing getting no hit by the Astros fifth starter, Ronald Blanco. He's been good, but like a single digit starts in his entire major league career. Just saw a lot of tweeting about winter league stuff like this guy's dominant in winter. I'm like, okay, I feel like I've heard this before. Yeah, there's not, you can't take grand sweeping takeaways from one game, the fifth game of a season of 162 games. But if I told you, Brent, that after the Blue Jays underwhelmed offensively season, then go went into an off season where they made no notable additions, like the guy they added Justin Turner, even last year was worse than the guy he's replacing, Brandon Belt. You swapped out Matt Chapman and yeah, his bad final five months for a guy who like would have killed to have the counting stats that Matt Chapman hadn't even in a down year as your third baseman. Wet noodle, swinger. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So you made no notable offensive additions. In fact, like you can argue, and I think it's the only argument you can make that just on paper, Blue Jays offense is worse than a season ago. And then in game five, you're no hit by the Astros fifth starter. Would that be a narrative that you'd be interested in pursuing? When you put it like that, it's certainly not what you want. Yeah, I think all of the, I mean, this is stuff we've talked about for two months leading into the season. All of the improvement that was supposed to come was internal jumps from Boba shed, or well, less so from Boba from flatty from Dalton Varshow from George Springer. And I mean, yeah, Springer's got off to a nice start. He's had two out of the yard, but other than that, the hitting of a buck six, well, that's what I was getting at. It's like, yeah, he's run into a couple. Whatever. No, I mean, he took the two walks yesterday. Yes. Hey, he's like, I'm the best player yesterday, which is scoreboard. Yes. And it's just that is an extremely jarring result. Again, you can't take, you can't take the fifth game of the season and have it be an overarching press the panic button, but because of all the stuff you laid out heading into the year, it's certainly cause for concern, like it's just, it is jarring, a team that was supposed to make its improvements based on approach being no hit in the fifth game of the season, not to say that you can't be no hit with a good approach. You can, but it's certainly harder to do that when the team is sticking to the play. And there are two wins in the season. They've scored eight and nine runs. Okay. Yeah, they, they scored a bunch of runs and they're without Boboshette, who missed his second consecutive game. You would hope that he'd be back for tonight's game, middle game of this three game series in Houston against the Astros. But listen to the, the murderers role of not like the bottom three, like here's the top three. George Springer, Vlad Jr. Justin Turner. Sounds okay. That's good. You got Dalton Varsho, who God, God bless like the traveling crew of hitting coaches that traveled to Wisconsin to, to turn them into a good hitter. I hadn't seen it yet. Apparently they're just working on buns. They're like, got to get that hit out. Here's the wrist. Yeah. Alejandro Kirk had some big RBI base hits in the Tampa series. But yeah, underwhelming start yet again for a guy that has had one, or one all star level offensive season and he's going to have to catch time because Janos hurts. So it's only going to hamper him there. Yeah. So that's, that's the four and it's hilarious that we're already back to Varsho hit and clean up when I was like, Oh, well, that's what threw him off. He started the season hit and clean up last year. Too much pressure. It's the, it's the inverse William Newlander at center. They're like, we're not going to do it. And they've immediately already capitulated back. Yeah. So here he is in game five, hit and clean up yet again. Kirk. Yeah. Again, underwhelming. Ultimate hitting six Kevin Kiermaier hitting seven like we still got like worse hitters to go. Isaiah kind of 11 hitting eight and like having B.G.O. They like his potential on base ability, hitting nine lead off man again. It's run. This is not a one game takeaway here. It is hard to not overreact after that type of offensive performance and kudos to run out Blanco just like listen to the names that I said. And yeah, one of those guys isn't going to be in the line because Boba shed's going to be back at some point as one guy. Yes. Okay. So I just rattled off six. So now there's five guys that are potential zeros, not zeros, but like not guys that you think, Oh yeah, for sure, we're getting great offensive results out of this guy. That's more than half the lineup, Brent. Yeah. And I mean, maybe you're someone out there pounding your steering wheel going, but what about Justin Turner? But what about him? He was in the top three that said, no, this is the point is that he is the guy that you're like, Oh, well, we'll just remove him from the equation because it's such an obvious one. 40 year old Justin Turner, who as you pointed out was a downgrade from the guy he is replacing. The approach flat out has to be better. We're going to spend an entire season talking about hitting coaches again, because there is not going to be show me the road map to much like I said, but the starting rotation at the beginning of the year that and thank God this hasn't come to fruition. If Kevin Gossman was going to stub his toe, where was the room for internal improvement? There is none with this group, like not say that the bloody can't have a better season than he's showing or var she'll can't, but there's no one coming that is going to change the complexion of this lineup. Like, I don't care how bullish you are on a relevance Martinez or even Joey Votto for that matter. They're not changing the way teams look at this. You just don't have enough competent bats. And I think the part that's concerning to me is that it's supposed to be the pitching and defense team. If you don't have this and the defense has looked far from elite to begin the year again, like it's five games. You don't want to have wide sweeping takeaways. But even that has been, you know, far from a certainty with this group approach can only take you so far. Yes, Mario Mendoza, like I don't I don't think like his he was on approach away from not being the guy who we named the Mendoza Mario. Yeah, by the way, not a 200 hitter is a 215 hitter, a career OBS of 507 still with us as Mario Mendoza, 73 years old born in Chihuahua, Mexico. Anyways, that's that is an elite fact. I'm going to I'm putting that one away. So yeah, it's not approach. It's like names in the back of the jerseys, like I maybe we're like on the verge of this Dalton Bar Show breakout, but again, like I've seen a lot of what I've seen in the first five games from Dalton Bar Show as a guy last year. Yep. Same guy. Uh, I don't care. Okay. Like he's catchers. The bar is lower. It's getting a lot of these guys who are like Varsho. Okay. He's hitting fourth yesterday, but he's being asked to hit fifth. Yep. Anyways, I want to get back to the point about the call ups and in a second, but we've got to talk about Bowdoin, France's first start of the season, which didn't go so great. There was a moment there where like he's going on the fifth and he's giving up five runs. I'm like, that's bad, but he's your fifth starter and like a competent op offense against the other team's fifth starter. You're like, that's, you know, it's not like at least he's given you depth and then like seven runs is like, it's unacceptable. No, it's just that's not even for a fifth starter. Like there's a bunch strikeouts and maybe approach for him changes like he did, like Alex Bragman wasn't a fan of facing him. So yeah, that's and Alex Bragman's a good hitter. So maybe there's like something build off here, but I will say what that start did as, as bad as it was. It did. Yeah, he's making his next start when his rotation spot comes up, but it is like he's on notice now for sure, right? Like if this is what he got, he's getting a couple more, four more starts this month. Blue Jays have options. Alec Manoa is throwing a simulated game today where I think he's going to be asked to throw like 50-ish pitches and then beyond that, maybe stretch himself out to 70 some odd and maybe a starter or two in the minor leagues, but you've also got Yariel Rodriguez. You've also got Ricky Tiedemann, who's already made a triple A start. And I understand like there's an innings restriction, but you got off days coming up as well. Yeah. Okay. Nobody owes Bowden Francis anything. So while I'm not throwing him away after one start, just yeah, he and I'm sure he understands this that yeah, he's there's a real possibility that one, maybe only one more like if it's not bad the second time around, maybe it's Mitch White. Like Mitch White is already here. Yeah, like looked okay and like, okay, would I take 50-60 pitches of Mitch White getting you through three or four innings as opposed to seven runs and a million 10 hits three home runs from Bowden Francis, I would just say that he's on my radar as a guy that might not last. Yeah, I would imagine it's on his radar as well. What this does is it opens the door for Manoa to force the issue a little bit. I would like to think with Tiedemann, I wouldn't like to think this. I'm almost certain of this that with Tiedemann, they've got a date kind of circled that, okay, if he checks all these boxes before, whatever the date is, we'd like to have them up here because there's only so many bullets you're going to use on that guy this year. If you feel like you're a team that can compete, why would you not use one of your best 12 pitchers and use those bullets at the major league level, especially if you don't think it's going to hamper development? So I don't think that Francis struggling kind of puts the clock ahead on Tiedemann a little bit in terms of when they wanted to have them up here. The guy that I keep being intrigued by at all this is Rodriguez. When you're a team that has kept the books so clean into the distance outside of guys that you had to go out and give a lot of term and a lot of money to to Springer, to Gossman, to burrios, guys like that, when you give five years and over 30 million to a guy like Rodriguez, it's not because they don't have some type of plans for him. So he's the one I'm most intrigued by of all those names, but obviously the person who should be, you know, no one's excited by this, but the person should be most excited by this is Manoa because I think that he was always going to be able to force the issue if he truly, truly showed it. Yeah. But now this allows it to be maybe less him forcing the issue and more there being an obvious landing spot. Well, and if like I said, like a normal team operates where it's like your fifth starter or five and dive like just just keep us in the ball game. You're the fifth starter. That's normal teams, right? And maybe, maybe Blue Jays are normal team now with normal offense and like a good offense because in the American League East, you to be a normal team, you have to have a good offense. Yes. But if you're not that and we're getting more and more evidence and again, you could have guessed this considering what they were last year and considering the off season they had. Okay. They still won 89 games last year on the strength of some good starting pitching, some great defense and some good bullpen work. So maybe that's what you are again. And it means that you got to go with the high upside. Like you got to have five starters that are above average. And if Alec Manoa and all reports are, and I guess like what else are you going to say, but also you can be truthful. Like don't set us up for disappointment when Alec Manoa arrives and he's only thrown 89. Like they're saying he's throwing mid 90s and the slider is exploding through the zone and yada yada yada. I mean, I at a certain point you just lean into who you are, which is the pitching and defense team and hope to get a home run or two out of the top of your order and hope against hope that's, you know, you have the one or two good games a week that the bottom of the order is going to provide or you roll the dice and like you hope to get the hot streak of Davis Schneider is another thing like you. If you're, if you're the pitching and defense team, but you do, you're not scoring enough runs like we're going to see whoever is capable of swinging the bag, get into the line up at some point. But yeah, if you're the pitching and defense team, go with the higher upside pitcher as your fifth starter. And yeah, Alec Manoa, if he shows well in one triple A start could be here sooner than we imagined. Yeah. And I think I think for a team that would be searching for a good story, potentially if that happens, it would go a long way. I hear something. And I think that as you is how much do you think the record, if at all affects when we see Tiedemann up here, like he has to take care of his business. Again, they're not going to rush him just because the team's performing. But do you think we go the other way with it? Where if they get off to a slow start, they go, well, yes, I agree, if this is a team in the thick of a division race or a playoff race, then you got to have your best 12. But if it's not, then we can hold service time. We can allow him to develop as a starter without the pressures of the big leagues. Like, do you think the team's record at some point in time ultimately affects when Tiedemann should come up? Yeah. I think you operate not in panic mode, but in desperation mode, you're desperate to once again make the playoffs, you're desperate to show something for once in this era, because if it doesn't happen this year, it's over, it is over if it doesn't happen this year. So it means, hey, you're not performing, you're out of line up. Hey, Ravels Martinez gets off to a good start and we got no offense. Guess who's coming up? I'd like to see it. And guess who's in the lineup? Addison Barger, same deal. John Schneider were below 500, the deadline at the All Star Breaker fired. Like I think everything's on the table. You have to act, not like irrationally. But there's no messing around here, man, like, and it's game five. You win today. You're back to 500. You got a chance to take series. Because a five and five start to the season is not just exceptional, like your hand, yeah? That's pretty good considering the teams that they're playing to start the season. Just saying that this is the year where it's not like, well, we're keeping our prospects, you know, let 'em bake and a little extra longer. No. Well, one, those guys are now have enough experience and maybe less so a teeter man who is only sparingly spent time in Triple A, and he only threw 65 pitches in his first start with the Bisons. And I'm not exactly sure how they want to deploy him this year. So I kind of maybe put him aside because there's other options outside of him and Yariel Rodriguez and Alec Manova would probably be higher up the pecking order than Teetaman. But no, like the Arelvis Martinez thing, those guys, yeah, I guess that question is really just about Teetaman. Like, yeah, because I'm with you, like the idea of, well, we better, we don't want to, we don't want to put Arelvis Martinez in a bad spot where there's all this pressure on them. No, I think that's fine. I think that's totally fine. If you can hit a home run, you should be in the lineup for this Blue Jays team because why you feel like you're going insane regarding doing it for sure. For sure. No, for sure. I'm going insane. And I get it. I get it. Like the positional versatility that he has and like the defense that he plays is not ideal and it's not like Kevin Beijo is off to a horrible start. Like we've seen him actually hit a home run. So it's David Schneider, but I think David Schneider is pretty clearly one of your nine best offensive players and I know Dalton Varsho, you know, okay, you can't just give up on the Dalton Varsho thing. And certainly against lefties, we might like to against lefties one of him or Kevin Kiermaier is not going to be in the lineup and that allows David Schneider to play left field. And I got a tough writing on the Hill yesterday, but you also have like a pretty good ballpark for right handed hitters in Houston is just one game and like David Schneider's not scoring ten runs on his own yesterday, so it was Fenway maybe it's not a he wasn't the difference between a win and a loss, but at some point you have to air on the side of offense with your roster decisions when you're not scoring runs. And again, they twice almost scored double digits in the two wins that they have put up big offensive numbers. The losses are all very familiar. God, I do remember at all the combine no hitter that the Tigers threw against the Blue Jays last season because I know I don't remember that. I know I don't. The other thing with David Schneider as well is just you're not asking him to play short or center field. Like the idea of his defense, maybe you don't love it. It's okay. You can afford to have, you know, it's not even a black hole. It's just a less than defender in that spot. And also, you know, I'm not so good a consistency in my life, but I'd like to commend you on yours because, and like I want to be clear this, I'm not like accusing you of like recycling a take or anything along those lines. But these are just all the same conversations we've had all year long about Nick Robertson. The difference is the Leafs actually do have good players to put him a line up as opposed to him. But you, you've, this is very similar of you go, okay, I'm help me out. This guy scores every time he plays. This guy goes yard every time he plays and we can't find a spot for them. So just remarkable consistency from you. Good job. Shake your hand. Thanks. I'll just say that. Yeah. Theoretical handshake. Verbal handshake. Anyways. Yeah. Hard not to have an overreaction to a game as stark in performance as yesterday's was. But that's the beauty of baseball, right, is that they play every single day, all the Thursday. All the time. Except for Thursday. And when it rains. But they have a roof in Houston. And they got a roof here. Yeah. Good news. All right. Baseball tonight. They'll be practicing today. Another Florida team. That's good at hockey. My kid asked me yesterday. He's like, how come all the Florida teams are good at hockey? It's like, wasn't always this way. But yeah. Now all the flip-flop people like invite me over for dinner and I'll spend a yard for your kid. Anyways, another one coming up tomorrow back in the Leafs next is the fan. Morning Show continues. Ben Anis, Brad Gunning, Sportstime 590, the fan.
