(upbeat music) - Fan Morning Show, Sportsnet 5.9 is the fan. Ben Ed is spread gunning. What a good morning, Brent. - Yeah, good morning to you. We love stuff to talk about. We certainly got that in spades last night. - Yeah. - Good morning. - Good morning, Toronto Sports Mass. I guess the wants to hear more about the bloodbath that was Toronto sports yesterday. - I love Canadian blood services. Like, get me to blood.ca, I need more of that. - Nightmare'sville across the three Toronto teams that played yesterday. Raptors, you may not have noticed because, you know, irrelevant right now. They had a guy that was cut from his G League team playing. He was one of the eight available players for the Raptors. They had franchise worst defeat in Minnesota to the Timberwolves, almost 50 points, 48 points. So that's bad. Also, Malekai Flynn went off for 50. The Blue Jays? - Sorry, that's somehow worse. - Yeah, the Blue Jays. And shout out to Sportsnet's stats who I was emailing back and forth with yesterday, trying to dig into the gory details of how bad this start is offensively for the Blue Jays. It's like the worst three game series hitting wise that they've ever had in franchise history. And they're the only team in major league history to have, well, they know hitter and a one hitter thrown against them in the first seven games of the season. Oh, yeah, then the Leafs. I mean, honestly, they come up third, they get the bronze medal here because they're home and cooled out. - Oh, it's just like a whole home loss. - Yeah, like grand scheme of things. - Like, I can't win them all. - No, but yeah, Joe Walden looks so good. - And a four one home loss to the Tampa Bay Lightning. How are you feeling about Toronto sports? Should we burn it all to the ground? - That's more Vancouver's thing. I'll leave that to them. They only have the one team out there and they still want to burn it all to the ground. And that was after like a good thing. I mean, I know loss in the Cup Final, but like they made it there. - Yeah. - Could you dream? - No, I actually can't. - Yeah, this is bad at night as it gets. I thought it was bad enough. And then again, somehow the Malachi Flynn thing was the cruelest twist of it all on a night where the Raptors have eight available bodies to play. Yeah, Malachi Flynn just put up a 50 piece for the sad sack distance. - History, history. - Cade Cunningham's like losing his mind on the bench. Well, it's always a bad sign when a guy is getting 50 and the reaction video of his teammates looked like those videos from high school where it's like, - We let the team manager play and he went in and made a couple threes. - My favorite tweet was from Tim Reynolds of the AP who tweeted this out and by the way, Malachi Flynn with the lowest career field goal percentage going into a game in which a player has scored 50 in the history of the NBA, okay? That's just a fact. - Malachi Flynn now has as many 50 point games in his career as Tim Duncan, Charles Barkley and Reggie Miller. - And Terrence Ross. - Yeah, so there you go. I mean, different generations, but yeah, makes no sense. - Yeah, 50's the new 35 though, as we've seen the guys getting like 70 or whatever. It's just, it's remarkable. - That could have happened on any night, but it had to happen last night to twist the knife in just such an incredible way. And honestly, it wouldn't have been any fun to talk about if it was just like just the Raptors bad loss. - No, no. - So throw the Malachi Flynn in, you throw the J's, you throw the J's. - And you're right. Listen. - It's exponential. - What I love to be here talking about how the Blue Jays put up 25 runs. - Well, you, you would be a little, you would be a little twisted on that because if it was with the lineup configuration, we saw the start yesterday's game, that wouldn't have like fed exactly into your name. - God forbid, the high fastball problem for Dave Schnot. - Anyways, we'll get to that in just saying, but there's lots to talk about after a bloodbath day like that across three. - Just series of throttle sports. - I think everyone specifically J's, it's like that was bloodbath series, but yes, day in general. I mean, a swing away from three straight shutouts. - Woof. - And a series sweep. Anyways, let's start with the Leafs, okay? It was 4-1. Like I said, Ho-hum, awesome Matthews goal number 63, Joseph Wall, he's done. It's over. I mean, I have to allow some wiggle room for Ilya Samsonov to just forget how to play hockey. So it's at 95. Actually, it really should be 99.9, yup. Because for the third time in four games, Joseph Wall has allowed the first shot of the game to get behind him. Ilya actually had a pretty good start in that game, I thought. - Yeah, that was a really nice start. They didn't allow a shot until halfway through, basically the first period. And then it went on the net. And that's just no way to live life. The Leafs weren't, you know, this wasn't a case of the Leafs being far and away, head and shoulders, the better team, and they got completely undone by their goal-tending. But that is kind of what happened, at least to start that game. And then they were chasing it, and that game just started to feel eerily familiar to a lot of playoff games against Tampa, where you look at that shot counter and you go, hold on, shouldn't the 3-1 be the other way? And Vashaleski, looking like playoff Vashaleski, that was- - He seems back. - It was looking a little terrifying as well. So that was the thing that, like, for Joe Wall's perspective, yeah, I always thought, I mean, it's a way I laid it out yesterday, that he basically had to be perfect. And Samsonov had to stub his toe, not the other way around, where he stubs his toe. And now Samsonov is gonna get a chance against Montreal, where, again, like, you never know what happens with those two teams, but where you should have an opportunity to look pretty good, yeah, this is it. Like, and that's, it doesn't mean this is it for Joe Wall playing a game that matters for the Leafs. - Doesn't mean he's not gonna play a playoff game. - Exactly, but it does mean there's no way anyone on God's green earth other than Ilya Samsonov. - Yeah. - You know, health aside is starting game one of the playoffs now. - But his technique, Brad, he technically sound. - And I will say, shout out- - I don't know, technique up on the first one. I gotta be honest, just like, or the fourth one for that matter, the Nick Poggle. I don't know, he does. - I don't know what the technique I'm supposed to be looking for is, but having that guy shoot it clean past you from there is not it. - I mean, shout out to Joe Wall on the first goal. I mean, first of all, that was Irelia. Irelia familiar of a couple of goals, the Leafs scored against Andre Vasilevsky in the whole season. - All the high shot of the point. - Yep. - Ah, two Contango. - I don't like it. - But yeah, shout out to Joseph Wall for allowing that goal on the delayed penalty. So the Leafs can continue to have this incredible penalty killing record in which they've killed off 17 straight. So good job, well done. Like, come on, it's overlining. - No, I'm not gonna sit here and poo poo that part of it at all. And I think the thing that you, I think the thing in terms of the penalty kill, like, I know you're being facetious. I'm just gonna take that as like, - Joe, you're right. That's correct, yes, well done. - No, that's true. That is a good job. They did lock down the penalty kill. - No, I thought, no, but not allowing for their not to be penalty killing that situation. - Yeah, it's fine. Like, it's good that it, I suppose, like it's fine that he allowed them to have that statistical anomaly. But from the penalty kill perspective, I actually do just like, I like what I'm seeing there. - Yeah, for sure. - And I think it's different in that, sometimes you see it with a penalty kill where guys are getting clean looks and goalies making big saves and you can go, I don't know how sustainable this is. Leafs are doing what they've done at the best versions of this group in years past. And it's just snuffing out before anything gets going. Like, they're just not allowing zone entries. They're pouncing on bubbles. So, yeah, that is an encouraging thing for sure. - Yeah, the penalty kill looks good. It's an eye test thing. It's also a results thing. The power play still doesn't look good. - Despite the fact that it scored once 'cause Austin Matthews smashed one timer to the back of the net, but on the replay, the puck was fluttering in a weird way, but whatever. - Yeah, scored. I knew you were gonna say that. - I think that, I think that with the power play, like, I'm not gonna sit here and say that it's a 0% concerning that it looks the way it does, but Mitch Barners coming back on Saturday, we think he's definitely coming back before the playoffs. - Yeah. - We think. - I don't know. Until I see otherwise, I'm still gonna go with what we think on that, but I just don't know how you can have an actual conversation about the Leafs' power play without that guy as part of it. So, I think it does kind of bode well for them that you just get to throw that part of the game away. - I will say there was a niceness for me to see Morgan Riley return to the lineup. And so much of the conversation this year has been about the weird and incredibly good record that Leafs have had without him in the lineup and the winning streak that they had when he was suspended for five games. By the way, Tom Wilson spoke on his suspension. He's like, how come everybody like, started caring about like a nothing play? And why was it such a big discussion in the meat? Leafs, you played the Leafs, sorry, buddy. - Anyways, but yeah. - Just agree with that. I have to follow the beyond record as well as, yeah, sometimes say less, Tom. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, dude, you didn't miss a shift. Yeah, no, Ridley Greg, he was like a Death's Door when Morgan Riley was suspended for five games. - He did it in the defense of Tom Wilson. It's like Ridley Greg did at least feign and he was like, - Yeah, Riley's not going to practice maybe or at least left the game or yeah, I don't know, something. - Yeah, anyways, I digress. Morgan Riley, so much of the narrative has been negative towards him and it's been mostly just a statistical anomaly. It's nice to see him like for the Leafs power play to be in such a downturn for him to finally return and be back on the quarterback role of that power play and for it to finally break through. It was nice, nice to see him. And also Matthew 63 and now on pace for close to 70 once again. - Yeah, you know what? Actually, that is a good thing that you break up there. You know, season where we've had to talk so kindly about Morgan Riley for how well the team has played without him, it was nice not to have to explain the way the power play up. Well, you know, you can't really judge it because Martin is not, you just can because he scored, they scored with him on it. Important for this team to have success with him being a part of it because, I mean, contract stuff for sure, but also go rewind the calendar, you know, a year to this time or I guess, you know, 13 months when we're actually into the playoffs and it's Morgan Riley's time like this. He was the best player on the team on many, many nights during that game one or that round one series victory that they had and they need that guy to be a version of him and so such a big part of that is him feeling confident. And I think much like a lot, I mean, this goes to a bigger conversation about the blue line. It's like, he doesn't have anything, he's certain enough. Right now he doesn't know who he's playing with. He doesn't know the way he's going to be used in terms of ice time distribution and just understanding, okay, you're a part of PP1, you're going to be a part of that unit, allows him to go out there and just kind of play a little more freely. And honestly, like, we worry so much about the spots other guys are being put in want Morgan Riley in a good spot heading into playoffs 'cause he's so, so him being at the best version of himself is the closest thing the Leafs have and the only thing they have that's going to be anything remotely close to like a game breaker back there. So you need Riley kind of feeling his best heading in playoffs. Yeah, I will say the Jake McCabe play that allows for the two on one that Stephen Stamp goes, does a good job of looking off Joe Wall and firing at five hole. Like I've seen that before. That's the thing in the postseason that I'm terrified about with Jake McCabe. Like I love the physicality. I love that he's looking for hits. But that part of his, that was a much bigger bug in the early run of Jake McCabe as a Leaf. I don't think you've seen it as much this year. I feel like he's done a much, much better job of picking his spots and looking for the big hit. And I think that that was a guy who in that moment, you just see the game score and it's like, you should do the exact opposite. But what does he have in his toolkit to kind of change the momentum of the game one way or another? It's like step up, snuff that out, big hit, you're going back the other way. You can understand the thought process, but I think the thing with McCabe is that he's eliminated so much of that from his game and that is what is allowed. 'Cause I've been someone who's been pretty bullish on him from the jump, but I think the reason more people have kind of come around to what he is is because there's been much less of that this year. So yeah, it's a bad spot for it, can't happen. Certainly second half of the season. We saw a little bit more of it early this season. We've seen it in the postseason as well, but yeah, that was jarring. Didn't like that too much. So yeah, he has certain things in his tool belt. Ryan Reeves has a couple of things in his tool belt. He broke out the whole arsenal yesterday. I mean, the play within the confines of the actual game has been really good for Ryan Reeves recently, making really smart decisions, laying thunderous hits and that fourth line is creating chances, they're wreaking havoc. And then he's filling in Tanner Geno and the thousand draft picks that the Lightning gave up to go get him. - I still, they mentioned on the broadcast and like, I'll just agree, what's Geno doing? They're looking for that fight. 'Cause it seems pretty apparent. - He's gotta do something. - He wanted it. I mean, there is an element to that, is that they gave up an entire draft for him and it doesn't do-- - I mean, he scored six goals. - Okay, great, it's one for every draft pick they gave up for him almost. And then, I mean, I can't remember the last time I saw a guy get punched. Like, we've seen guys eat shots and go down. I can't remember the last time a guy got stunned through his helmet in that way. Revo just clobbered him. And I mean, the fight is a, it's a nice to have and it's more, it's more than that. Like, especially on a night where our Lord and Savior, Matthew Rempeze is doing what he's doing. And we'll talk about that, I know. It's like, I'm not gonna diminish what that does, but for the first time this season, it's been the cherry on top of the Ryan Reeves Sunday. He's giving you actual real hockey things. Like, you mentioned it, it's his ability to get in there on the forecheck. That line with him and Camp and kind of whoever it's been on the other side there, they've been generating stuff on the cycle and not generating in the sense of they're gonna get a goal. I mean, they have scored in the past couple of games, but it's not even about that. It's just about keeping the play down in that area of the ice. If you're able to hem a line in. I mean, on one hit, he pops. I forgot who the other defense one was and Hedman behind the net. It's like, especially in a playoff series. If you're talking about taxing guys and hitting game one, paying dividends by the time game five, six, seven rolls around, he feels like the, maybe the person who in a time of the year where we've talked about what is there to play for, what is really going on? Well, it's clearly been something to play for him because before this stretch ever long, you want to make it the last five games, 10 games or so, he's seen pretty clearly out. And now kind of a pawn in the side, I can't see a world where he's not in. - No, I asked Ben. - Yeah. - Yeah, it's a higher percentage than Ilya Sampson. I'm getting the starting game one. He's 100% playing as long as he's healthy in game one. - And he wants, yeah. - Of a postseason series. He has, if we are looking at these final 20 games as a postseason audition, and hey, who's in, who's out? And it's tough because there are so many guys that are factually out and Morgan Riley out and Timothy Lillegrine's still out. - Mm-hmm. - Kelly Young, Krog out and Mitch Marner out and yada yada yada yada yada down the line. Yeah, there was a very real possibility that we were looking at game one of a postseason series with no Ryan Reeves and like he's the nuclear deterrent and he's in the press box and, hey, things get out of hand, you need that boost, you can activate him at any point during a postseason series. But no, you gotta start that way. You know, the way he's playing. - No, he has to be. And I think that, you know, just not that, not that these guys are a ones in, one out, but the fact that in a series, and look, you don't want it to come to this. You don't want to have to be pulling, you know, roster moves to get your team to where you want it to be. But in a world where, okay, Reeves plays and he's giving you some of it, but not all of it, or the series just doesn't call for that. You've got Nick Robertson, like waiting in the wings. If the offense is what dries up, like you have different options. I'm not, the reason they're options and not certainties to be in the lineup is because they're not perfect players. But yeah, I do think they certainly have some options there. In terms of the game last night, like I already kind of mentioned this, but and I guess kudos to you yesterday. I still don't wholly agree with you that the Lightning or the Leafs chief rival, but it's amazing, just given how long it's been since the two teams have played, how quickly I was all the way back. Brandon Hagel has never, there's never been a person, and I say this to someone who loves to complain about everything. He is the world's most perpetually aggrieved person. Just constantly, whiny face feels like he's never finished a game without going to the room. It was all the way back into being annoyed by him. And then Vashalevsky just look in the way he does. Stamped coast, vintage, ripping it right through Joel Wall and that 2-on-0, man, it is eerly scary. And I mean, it's not gonna be the least problem, but if you're whatever team has that waiting for them in round one, good luck. - No, that's not great. The special teams have been good for them. They, what are they, 11, 0-1, since the trade deadline? No, they are a certified killing machine. Four points back in the Leafs now. No games in hand for either team with seven games to go and still one more matchup between them. - Joel and Keith didn't seem to care though. All that much about winning the hockey game. And there's not a criticism. - Actually, sorry, before we move on to Keith, just with the lightning and we'll could potentially be waiting for them there. There's a lightning Bruins game and they're chanting like, Leafs suck or we hate the Leafs or something along those lines. Like good, the two you go enjoy one another in the first round of time. - Like that is embarrassing for two teams that have been to Stanley Cup finals. And I mean, if you go back to Brad Marchands, rookie or one one, but like, yeah, have real playoff pedigree, you're thinking about the Leafs. - Yeah, because the whole NHL is just made out of hate by the Leafs, it's like the thing that powers it all. But good, the two you enjoy one another. Absolutely murder one another to the death in round one. Have fun with that. - Joel and Keith, I think that's important. - Yeah, honestly, I felt it was a pretty sleepy game. Save for the Ryan Reeves face punching stuff. That was cool. This, it didn't feel like playoff game at all to me. And again, like that to standings wise, that's the only game that should theoretically matter to the Leafs down the stretch. Unless, I guess there's something to play for in the final two, but you are certainly prioritizing rest. Sheldon Keith will get to his comments a pregame about how he's going to treat the chase for 70 for Austin Matthews. And we'll talk to Nick Kipperos about it after seven o'clock. But it is, okay, the Nick Paul goal is the dagger, right? But there's still plenty of time left. And we never see a goalie pull. We see the fourth line out there with two minutes to go. It just, it really didn't feel like, and again, not a criticism. I'm just evaluating the mentality of the head coach and how much they must care or not care about their place as either the third place finisher in the Atlantic or challenging the Panthers for second place or falling into a wild card spot. Got to say, seemed pretty apparent to me. Sheldon Keith was like, yeah, wherever. It doesn't matter to me. I don't know. I can understand how you come to that conclusion. I don't know that I'm quite there. I think that a big part of this, which we're kind of papering over, and the reason we are is because we've talked about it ad nauseam since it's happened, but it cannot be overstated what not having Mitch Marner and Callie Arenkra, like both of them, not just the one guy. What not having both of them does to the forward lines. And I genuinely think if this is Sheldon Keith with his full compliment, forgot about the D for a sec, just with the forwards, I think he probably goes about running his check-in line or his shutdown line a little differently than throwing his kid line or his fourth line to the wolves. I just do think he would go about that in a different way. I think he looks at it as going, okay, dream scenario. Everybody's healthy. I can really do a little iron sharpens iron, see what my team's got against a real challenger that still has the time to play for. But that's not the case. Look at the guys playing on the blue line. If you're a believer in Samsonov, which, hey, Sheldon Keith, if we're gonna take him at his word now, he is. He's looking at that game going, I'm missing two of my best nine forwards. I got my backup goalie and I'm missing a bunch of blue liners. Why should I treat this like it is do or die? And I think there's an element to that. If you care about, you know, the two points, if you really care about it, like a lot, and they didn't care. But okay, so what do you think is like, I'll just pose it to you? Like, let's say, and I'm not sitting here saying don't try to win the game, but I also think the idea of pulling, like them not pulling the goalie to me is not this capitulation that I look at for everyone else. It's like, yeah, the fourth line being out there at that point in time, the kid line being thrown into the wolves in the last game they played. That stuff I look at much more pointedly than the not pulling the goal. Yeah, but I mean, you said it though. Yeah, they played the fourth line with two minutes ago and a three goal hockey game. Because they don't have the complement of forwards that they want to put out there to test. Like, do you think he has his shutdown line that he wants or conversely, his loaded up gold nuclear line? 'Cause I guarantee you the Mitch Marner is a part of that. And I guarantee you, Kelly Yarnkrucks, a part of the other side of that equation. So I look at last night's game as, yeah, like it was there. Is there as much stakes as there will be? I just, honestly, I go insane every time at this time of year, we go, oh my God, just start the playoffs, just start the playoffs. Just start the playoffs for the Blue Jays right now. It's like they got 150 meaningless regular season games coming up. I know we're going to get there. No, I mean, but like the Blue Jays have to win enough games to get into the playoffs. No, no, I am. The point I'm making is that we, especially on Sad Sack Toronto Sports Night, we sit here and we go, yeah, look at this, just three losers, all of them made of the same. And it goes, no, no, one of these teams has actually got themselves to the point where they can take their foot off the gas a little bit. They are allowed to do that. Now you're arguing against the straw man. Well, I think the argument I keep hearing is, oh, this regular season is too long. This regular season is too long. I am about, I'm staring down the barrel. And again, we'll talk about the Jays in a second here, where they could have been shut out for three straight games and there's still 150 something more of those things. So yes, the regular season is long, but I'm watching a hockey team that actually can go and accomplish things and Matthews is chasing 70. Like, the idea that there is nothing left in this regular season, would it be better if the Leafs enlightening had a like, knock it out, drag them out, game like Tampa? Would we feel better about that? You're muddying the waters, comparing it to the Blue Jays regular season, 'cause what are you talking about? Like the Blue Jays played 162 games and they made the playoffs on like the second last day of the regular season last year. And despite how poor the game looked at the season. So we would prefer the Leafs, like it'd be better for the Leafs, it'd be better for the product if they were the Flyers and absolutely dying, scraping to get into the playoffs. - I don't think it would be better for the team. It's nice that the team doesn't have to rush people back. I'm just saying from my perspective, and I'm surprised not yours, but like I watched all the games. It's like would've been cool if like there was more on the line and that the head coach was deploying his team in a way that felt like they were urgent. They were urgently trying to pick up the two points. So that's just not what I'm seeing, it's fine. It's still hockey. And like, awesome, Matthews scored 63. That game didn't matter. Saturday does not matter. - I mean, that's where I wholeheartedly disagree. - It doesn't matter. Like the coach is telling us it does not matter that the two points don't matter. Like it's not like they're not gonna actively try and win the game, but yeah, that this stuff we're playing out the string. That it's not, they're home and cooled out and good for them, they've earned that right. - I just can't, I can't live in a world where Leafs have on a Saturday night does not matter. - I can't, like I'm sorry, I do not say myself there. - Okay, I say literally said Saturday night does not matter. - Okay. - Yes. - Okay, you're right. You're taking me very literally. - Of course it matters. - Of course it matters. - How dare I. - The words you say. - Yeah, I mean, do you think that I think like a hockey game on hockey night in Canada between the two historic rivals that are the Leafs and the Habs and with awesome Matthews with a realistic chance at 70, does not matter? No, of course it like matters. There's gonna be millions of people watching the Toronto Maple Leafs Montreal Canadiens on Saturday. The standings does matter. It doesn't matter. Just like, there are no stakes. There are no standing stakes. - That's all. - There's no standing stakes. But like, there's only seven games left though. That's fine. - And there's 70 goals to be chased for and believe Neil Andrew's still gotta get his 100 points by the way as well. It's like not quite done there. We talked about Marner needing that milestone. Neil Andrew needs that as well. The Leafs still, and this is the part that I think has to be said as part of all of this, you know, these games don't have stakes in no matter. Okay, will they matter? Like, I'm just trying to understand the stakes of it all. When Mitch Marner, I'm not even gonna, let's presume he's back tomorrow. When the Leafs have their, if they're healthy, do the games matter then? Or will there be so little time left in the season? - I mean, it seems to me that, I mean, once you start telling me that the points don't matter, especially against, again, the one team that you're gonna play, they play 'em again and we'll see if those last two games is hard to imagine them really giving it their all. I mean, before the game, again, Sheldon Keefe said, prioritizing rest and making sure Austin Matthews is ready for the playoffs, which is already an indication that that's where their head's at, right? Like for the whole team, they can talk about Austin Matthews, they need one more point to clinch the playoff spot. Once that happens, like, I wouldn't be surprised. The next day, like, maybe Austin Matthews does sit. We'll see how much he puts the words into practice here when it comes to keeping a guy away from maybe a historic milestone. But, yeah, I mean, you wanna see Mitch Marner play well. But again, like just some of the in-game decision-making, I mean, they tested the Robertson, Matthew Nye's line in a third period against that hard-pressing Panthers team and they gave up two goals. They're playing the fourth line in the final two minutes of a three-goal hockey game. - But it's like, I think all that stuff matters. Like, I think if you think that this Leafs team has a run, are they doing it like, okay, well, I mean, this is, I guess, comparing apples to horseshoes or something, but again, a playoff game. That's not the way that's being deployed. - No, 'cause you try and win a hockey game. Like, if the Leafs were in the postseason position that the Capitals are in, we're not seeing that game play out anywhere close to the way it played out yesterday. - No, you're not, but I think if, and I don't know, I keep talking about it like it can happen. I realize it's a complete impossibility. But if heaven forbid, one day the Leafs do go on, like a lengthy playoff run to the conference final or something along those lines. - Pontus Holmberg and Matthew Nies and Nick Robertson, TBD on that one. They're going to have their roles expanded, not just because of what they do, but likely because of injury. Your guys get banged up or a match up to the medal. - Yeah, exactly. - I think it's a good idea, and you've earned the right to get to put those guys in spots. - But then don't you want to see how they look in those spots like the idea of like, how I want to see preseason. Like, well, I want to see spring training. Hey, how do the rookies look? And like, hey, oh, look, he's throwing 100. Yeah, it's not quite that, but yeah. It's different than a hockey game where I'm like, oh, you want to win that? It's like, yeah, no, cool. Like, again, I'm going to be watching all the games. I know you are. And it's a different feeling though, watching a game in which the end result were being told by the head coach in the organization doesn't matter. It's about the process. And how do guys look in different circumstances? And then, oh yeah, what was the score at the end of the game? Did we win? Did we lose? No, we lost. Okay, that's fine. It's just different. - Okay. - All right. Not the same deal for the Blue Jays. They need wins. - Yes, they do. - Yeah. And they got one in Houston somehow, despite the fact that they had seven total hits, sorry. They had nine total hits in the three game series. - Great job. - And David Schneider, he only played in one of those games. - That and Mornax is the fan morning show continues. And his brain gunning Sportsnet 590, the fan. - Hey, it's Aylish for a Fire. - And I'm Justin Cuthreth. - Join us as we discuss the most important sports stories of the day and tee up the biggest games of the night. - It's the fan pregame, 6 p.m. weekdays on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590, the fan and wherever you get your podcasts. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) - Fan morning show Sportsnet 590, the fan man, and his brain gunning on the one hand. - Blue Jays are just three and four. And for the Astros, that was just their second win of the season. - That's so close to 500. - Yeah. And the goal out of these first 10 games to start the season, going through Tampa, Houston and the Bronx. Blue Jays with an off day today, by the way. Before they go to the Bronx for the Yankees home opener tomorrow afternoon. The goal, like five and five again, spectacular. Well within reach, it's baseball, even two out of three against the Yankees mission accomplished. But my goodness, my goodness gracious even. - Wow, gee well occurs if you will. - Golly considering the problem with the 2023 Blue Jays was a lack of offense. There was an off season in which we thought, well something will be done to address that issue, right? - Yeah, I mean, I might have even heard that there was going to be something big. - Yeah. - Thought someone was on a plane, well along the plane. But they're like, okay, well we'll get over that 'cause there's guys there. The guy they got, Justin Turner, who's been one of the lone bright spots offensively for the Blue Jays. - Well, him and another guy who barely plays. - It's not hard to play. - Like if cut to Justin Turner being like, well what did I do? - Yeah. - Just your job, man, actually. - Yeah. - Good job. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. Blue Jays for the season now, seven games. They play 155 more of these things. Hitting a robust 176, it will surprise no one to learn that that is dead last in Major League Baseball. - I'm not overly surprised by that. - That is a franchise record for fewest hits, nine in batting average, 106 in a three game series. The previous lows were 10 hits and a 112 average and a three game set against the Red Sox in 1978. By the way, that was the second year of the Blue Jays existence and they were an expansion team. - So like that's a small sample, three games is a small sample, but we are talking about history here. We're also talking about no team ever has been no hit and been one hit in the first seven games of a regular season before. So yeah, do I expect the Blue Jays to go through the entirety of this season with even George Springer? Okay, he's regressing. That's one thing. He's not gonna hit 120. That's what he's hitting right now. - Probably not. - Vlad, okay, whoo. Do we think he's gonna hit 208? - Maybe 260. - Like not 208. Boba Shett certainly is not gonna hit 150 this season. - How dare you? - The other guys into it to be determined. So yeah, it's not great. Do you want me to talk about David Schneider now? Or do you have anything to say off of what I just said? - No, I would just like to wholeheartedly agree that, yeah boy, color me shocked that the team whose offense we had some question marks about that made very limited additions in that and was banking on internal improvement has not seen it come to fruition. Just color me shocked. So go ahead. - Okay, so we're 39 minutes into the program and I actually don't think until just now you uttered his name. - Yeah, good job by you. - So yeah, before I talk explicitly about David Schneider, I will say boy, like I was afraid of and like has now come to pass, like the narrative online and the discourse online about this team didn't take long for it to get toxic. - Oh no. - And it can change quickly. It is early. And yeah, you win two out of three or God forbid, sweep the New York Yankees and whoa, what a different fun little time it'll be down at the ballpark I'm on. It's gonna be fun at Rogers Center on Monday, either way, for the home opener. We'll be there well before the game. - I actually would, I'm an adventure that will be among the first people working in that building. - Yeah. - Is there gonna be anybody there to lessen? We'll find out. Also we're going to Rogers Center today to get our first look at the new renovations this year and they're gonna feed us some of that food. - Sites, bells and sounds. - Yeah, we'll have some reporting on that for tomorrow show and basically-- - Basically Jeff Rohoman going to the X is basically us. - You mean Jeff Rohoman? - Yeah. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. So check out our social media feeds later on today. We'll have lots of stuff about what is new at Rogers Center this year. All right. So, Bluejays get one hit. - By the way, just good company man. You sounded so good doing that. - Yeah. So Bluejays, they got a hit. So kudos, even as an extra base hit. - Wow. - I mean-- - Man, in these trying times. - Dalton Varshow did think he hit it foul. Like he was like slow out of the box. He's like, "Where'd that go?" Oh! - Probably not. - Probably not anywhere useful. Touch and green. And off he went to second base and they took a bunch of walks, seven of them. So that's good. They had base runners, which is nice. They scored no runs yet again. The two runs they scored in the series off one swing of the bat. By a man who can't buy himself a start. He has home runs in both of his starts this season. That of course, the man is David Schneider, the babe. And the way this was positioned to us pregame is, "Hey, I talk to him. He knows his role. He's gonna get plenty of playing time." But he also knows his flaws, his weaknesses, his, the holes in his swing, the things that he struggles with. - Yeah. High fastball. Christian Javier throws him high fastballs. So this isn't David Schneider's day to play, despite the fact that going into yesterday before they were one hit. This has been, I mean, boomer bust. Like the wins, they had registered a bunch of runs in the, the two wins that they had in Tampa. But outside of that, even the losses in Tampa. And you can look at the offense and you're like, that's gonna, that's gonna need a boost this season. That, hey, he has a flaw that is so fatal. And this matchup is so detrimental to what he tries to do, can't possibly, we can't possibly imagine starting him in second base over Kevin Beijo. Well, I am, this is not to denigrate Kevin Beijo. Can't possibly consider moving Kevin Beijo in third base or David Schneider playing third base for Isaiah Kinerfilefe. It couldn't possibly, because as we all know, Isaiah Kinerfilefe is the world's greatest high fastball hitter, right? Like that, that's been well established. - You don't know that that. - Dalton Varshow is the world's, and God, I would never denigrate the man who had the lone hit of the baseball game in Dalton Varshow. By the way, they didn't, it seems, at this point, early days, they didn't send enough hitting coaches to Wisconsin to take care of Dalton Varshow. - Did he send less? - Yeah, I don't know, that's the early returns. - Maybe Josh Schulman would have been the answer, just have them have a Packers summit up there. - Yeah, early returns, that's a great, on all the incredible strides that he's made, not so great on all the incredible offensive strides, Alejandro Kirk has made. He hit a double last night, okay. - Yeah, Kirk is in a tough spot because he has to start every day, and as we've seen in the times that he's had to do that, like the workload can wear on his offense, but my God, what are we doing here? And John Schneider in his post-game, and Ben Nicholson Smith references in his story on sports and thoughts, yeah. By the way, we'll talk to BNS later today. In referencing his decision to not start with David Schneider in that game, he's like, it's an analytical decision, and like, oh, I've learned the hard way that, like, sometimes you gotta just do this, and he, like, closed the laptop? - Close the laptop right now! He hit a two-run home run to win you the baseball game against one of the best relievers in the sport. He's hit a home run in both of the starts. He's had this season. - Yeah. - Okay, he likes high-fast balls, struggles with him. You know, he knows that too. Like, he's gonna go, well, like, his game plan going into a start against Christian Javier is to try and either lay off it, or maybe try and ambush it, if that's part of Christian Javier's game plan against him. And again, look at the guys he's competing with. Look at what your offense has at its disposal. This season, it's not the difference between the win and the loss yesterday, obviously. I mean, Chris Bassett didn't have his best stuff. He threw 10 million pitches and didn't get through five innings and yada, yada, yada. And Blue Jays, I mean, David Schneider can't hit an eight-run home run. So like-- - I'm gonna stop banana ball playing in Savannah. - Yeah, but like, what are we doing here? Especially considering the manager's history with, hey, no, sometimes I go with my gut. And my gut tells me, listen to my bosses and my laptop. - Yeah, I mean, I echo everything you're saying about Schneider, obviously, like in no world, can you make the case that the team struggling with offense has the one guy who's run into a couple this year and you say, no, we don't need that. That doesn't interest me. I will admit, I'm a little surprised that it seems like more of your ire is with Schneider regarding Schneider than with the nine guys who are in the-- - Yeah, but those guys stink. Like, I just tell you guys. - Okay, but I guess-- - There's only so much I can say about the guys that were obviously not good enough offensively and obviously haven't been good enough offensively. - Yeah, like, I think, I think two-- - What am I supposed to say? Oh, hey, Dalton Varshal, this is on you. Well, of course, like, he can't hit. Hey, Kevin Kuremeyer, maybe there's a reason why, you know, people weren't exactly banking on one of your best offensive seasons being replicated at the age of 35. Like, yeah, no, like, there's only, Isaiah kind of fell up with a career OBS plus of 85. Like, it's not his fault. He's like, I actually outperformed my career numbers. - So far this season, what do you want from me? - Yeah, not BIKF is kind of what I've been asking for, but he's here and he's getting paid. So he's gonna be, you're right to point that out that there's no real reason to expect more from those guys, but if we're just gonna apply those same rules to the manager, there's no reason to expect different from that guy, yeah, he'll play a hunch here or there, but it was the most stark decision of the playoffs last year. And we all had the referendum on who actually made the call and we never really got an answer on that, which was kind of our answer on that. I think that it is so proof positive. And again, this isn't to say that John Schneider can't, like no one's gonna come wrestle the pen out of his hand as he submits the lineup to the home plate umpire. And at a certain point you have to make the decisions that you think are right, but I have to believe, I have to believe that John Schneider is not completely blind to everything you said. He's not blind to a lifetime in baseball of playing the hot hands. That's what's hilarious about this. And it has to be coming, the call has to be coming from inside the house. I'm not saying that this is John Schneider being, look, here is one from nine and this is exactly how you will put them in, but it is clearly a guy managing to protect his job than managing to do the right thing for the team. That's what, that's gonna backfire in a big way. 'Cause guess what happens if the Blue Jays don't have the record they're supposed to have and it gets deeper into the season? I'm not saying this is imminent. No, of course, it's insane, like all-star break, they're like under 500 and still can't score and it's not all John Schneider. It doesn't matter, it won't matter. It will not matter. It will not matter. Whose fault it is, you're gonna wear it. So like Sheldon Keefe this season being maybe a little more pointed in his criticism, a little more unabashed in some of his decision-making, like you better, very think about the possibilities that await you, John Schneider, and yeah, to your point about, hey, he knows what it's like to, you know, play in a professional baseball environment and sometimes guys are hot and sometimes guys are not and sometimes there's just like Mojo, 'cause like sports, Brian, and I know you know this. I am aware, yeah. They don't play it in a computer. I mean, that's a different thing and I'm not disparaging the computer people that play like simulation baseball. That's cool, like I can actually understand how that's interesting this sport. I'll hold my fire on those people. But that's like a different thing than the thing that I like more, which is the real sports, where the real people gets a play in it. And when you're dealing with real people, there are real people things that you have to consider, including some stuff that there is no, there's no gauge for. I mean, there is kind of in that like, David Schneider has two home runs. Those are like the most important thing you can do offensively in a baseball game. It's very true. So like, yeah, I guess he's probably not gonna hit a home run and hit a home run in every start this season. But let's let him do the, let's let him start a game where he doesn't hit a home run before we say, all right, let's set him down. Like even the first time around, when he, you know, came out of the shoot with that insane series at Fenway Park and then cooled down for like a game, two games. He at least had two games where like he didn't hit a home run, right? And then he sat for a week and then came back and started hitting home runs again and forced our hand. Like at least let that happen. What do you think your, the only problem with this conversation is there's only one side to be had. Like there is no, there is no defense to be made of John Schneider other than the one I've already laid out of. He's probably doing what he would like his bosses to do. - The defense is that it's a small sample and that I'm making a knee jerk reaction on the basis of even like the small sample of David Schneider's career being less than 40 major league games. - But the problem with that is, is the people he's competing with. It's like they have long track records of not being good. It's like David Schneider, it's like it's the mystery box. It could even be anything as bad as the career that's been laid out in front of you by the guys. He's competing with the question I have about this. And obviously, you know, depending on who you ask on the roster, it's a very different answer. But the players know, players know who should be playing. What do the guys on the team think about this? Like again, it's early days. Boba Shet is hitting sub 200. So he's not going to sit here overly worried about who's playing second base on any given day, right this very moment. But what do you think is going through the heads of the guys in that lineup? Again, if it's Gavin Bezio and IKF, it's great. I'm playing. But if it's the other six, five guys that are not impacted by this decision one way or another, what are they thinking? - Yeah, I know-- - I imagine it's pretty similar to you, just for the record. - I know what Justin Turner was thinking when David Schneider hit the home run in the second game because he tweeted it out. He was like, babe bleeping Schneider. Like he tweeted that out. Like I think people generally are excited for like a 700th round pick who's just forced his way to the major leagues and having great success. Like I think that's generally something people can get behind. We haven't even mentioned that this is the first foray into like offensive coordinator, Bill. For the Blue Jays, right? Like this is, hey, Don Mattingly, we're in the headset. That's, I mean, early returns on that. Again, I don't know necessarily what he's doing, but that's, obviously the Blue Jays, part of the reason they thought there would be a positive regression this season offensively is because they're changing the workflow when it comes to the way the coaches approach offense. And again, it's seven games. But we're not talking about, hey, the Blue Jays just like, you know, they scored one or two runs and like the offense doesn't quite look as explosive and like not hitting enough home runs. They have been no hit and one hit and they have the lowest batting average in all of Major League Baseball. Like it's not, it's a small sample, but the sample we have is extreme. So I'm not saying that there's nothing to take away from the extreme sample of a week of baseball that we have considering the pressure or the attention that that part of the game is getting. And if you're gonna tell me, oh, well, that's impacting actually the offensive out, but that's a problem. - Yes. - So that's not going away. In fact, it's only gonna ramp up when they return home on Monday and they don't score any runs in the Bronx. - Yeah, they better find a way to score a few down there. That's the thing about where they're at in this season. And again, you go take two or three, you sweep the Yankees kind of regardless of how it looks, we're having a very different conversation. - Yes, it does matter. - But you, especially in that ballpark, you do need to find a way to get some offense to find some good stories. The other thing that I think is, and again, it's just like, how are we gonna look at this retroactively that they go into that offseason and the chase for show, hey, okay, whatever happened there happens there. But then the idea that the biggest acquisition made is Justin Turner and the switching of the deck chairs on the Titanic of who the hitting coaches versus the offensive coordinator versus, oh, this guy is no longer on the bench. He now has a more organizational philosophical bent to it. Why did we think that was gonna change the world? I don't care if Barry Bonds, and you know, I actually know he's like, try to be a hitting coach. But you understand what I'm saying? It's like, I don't care if the greatest hitters of all time come to give each guy their own individual hitting coach. At a certain point in time, it does become about the player and not about the approach. And again, like I think there are plenty of players or maybe plenty of stretching. But there are enough players on this team where you can say, yes, I believe in the talent. Even a guy like Vlad, who you're down on, it's like, okay, you can believe in a baseline of where he's at. But there's so many guys on this team where the baseline is just, it's not even close to good enough for where they're asked to be. So a bunch of guys, it could be ninth hitters on teams, okay? You just can't have four or five of them. - Yeah, and I wanna be more vocal about how, hey, you know, yesterday finally, John Schneider gets them going on the base pass with the hit and run and then the stolen base. But the Blue Jays don't even have base runners, right? Like, eventually when- - But I'm making heart contact either, that's the thing. - Yeah, well, eventually when this thing does normalize and it doesn't look like this, again, the top four guys outside of Justin Turner aren't gonna hit under the Mendoza line for the season pretty clearly. I mean, we do have a guy in Boboshette playing in the city that has led the American League and hits two in the last three years and he only didn't do it three consecutive years 'cause he got hurt down the stretch. Like, when he was fourth, he's gonna be fine. And yeah, being a slightly above average offense, player at first base and playing bad defense or at least average defense at first base makes you actually a bad player. But if Vlad was an above average offensive player last season, it was a bad season. I gave 26 home runs, that was bad. But like, yeah, that was an OPS like in the 7.30, 7.40, 7.50 range, right? So he doesn't have that now. So those guys will be better. But when those guys are better, it better be enough. And if it's not, like the guys below them aren't that. Like the optimistic projection on Isaiah Kiner-Felefe is being what, himself, which is below the average offensive player, Ernie Clemente. Okay, if he takes over, I know people love Ernie Clemente and maybe he can hit for a high average. I'm not gonna walk, I'm not gonna hit home runs. Kevin Bijio, we've done this before. And I got time for Kevin Bijio on your Major League roster. You're asking him to play every day. Dalton Varsho, I mean, could go down and the Annals is one of the worst trades in the history of this franchise? - That was possible. - Yeah, you got to force the issue because it's just the bottom of this order, especially if there's no Tavis Schneider in it. - Yeah. - I mean, it just honestly looks hopeless. - Yeah, honestly, and like Chanson is gonna feel like a man from heaven when he eventually comes back. And part of that is that he'll be able to spell Kirk a little bit. Maybe you get a better version of Kirk. Again, I'm not overly bullish on that. I was not somebody who was like even a huge believer in the big, big breakout season. So I'm not holding my breath on that. But you could certainly get a better version of it. So yeah, just man, all time frustrating. - Good data, good data, exhale, reset. Although we like, we needed you tonight, no Leafs. We needed you tonight, Chase, that's okay. Enjoy your day off. - Yeah, tomorrow afternoon, one o'clock on Sportsnet 590, the fan and Sportsnet Yankees home opener who are having the opposite conversation. They're off to a great start just where you wanna be. - But it honestly, it may not matter at the end of the season. - Of course. - Listen, all of this conversation goes to the caveat of it's early. But again, it's different when it's early for this team where so much of the team that we're talking about is carried over from a season ago. And the same issue is rearing its ugly head through the first seven games. - Yeah, and this is like a way bigger conversation that we don't have time for now, but it's the regression from the pitching. The result hasn't necessarily resulted in it, but you've had to see burrios getting by with less than as bad as you saw it at a Basset last night. Again, I'm not sitting here going, how dare you, Chris Bassett, it's the opposite. I commend him for battling through with less than his best stuff. But if that's an indicator of what's to come, of Bassett with less than his best, that's the thing that's gonna have to boo you this season. Even if you are the biggest believer in the offense and the turnaround, it's gonna have to be the starting staff that carries this team the way. - We'll talk about Nicholson Smith later on in the program. Coming up next, Nick Kiprios of Real Kipper and Born. The fan morning show continues. Ben and his Brent Gunning Sports at 590 the fan.
