[MUSIC] >> Good morning, Joe Sportsnet 5.9 of the fan band. And it's Brent Gunning, 82 preseason games in the regular season starts on Saturday. Game one, Leafs, Bruins, 8 o'clock on Sportsnet. Stocked to Nick Kiprios of Real, Kipper and Born. How's it going, Kipper? >> Good, you guys. Is the sun up? I haven't checked yet. >> I have no idea. >> Looks like a little soggy outside. >> Just a bit, it has been a lousy week. >> Isn't it rain cold? >> I'm going to force it with golf today. I'm going to, it's going to be soggy out there, but I'm going to play it today. I'm going to make it- >> You're not. >> Why? >> Why? >> It's just not a chance. Listen, I love golf as much as you do. I could say that, I believe that. >> Okay. >> You cannot play in this. >> What? Why? It's not raining, is it? It's not supposed to rain. It's supposed to be like 12 degrees and partly cloudy. >> Looks like there's threatening rain. >> No, no, no, no, no. Guys, look at a forecast. Come on. Take it easy. And also, I haven't been in the play for a week. >> Yeah. And the Leafs have lost, what, four in a row and Matthews didn't get 70. You can't golf today. >> I go to- >> I go in morning. >> I go the other way on that. >> The last two things being, you absolutely need to golf today. >> All right, to that point, Kipper. What have you thought of the last four games of the regular season and the seeming importance put on what I was told explicitly by the head coach was not going to be a focus of this team, getting Austin Matthews goal number 70? >> Yeah. Well, listen, prior to the four games, it was actually looking pretty good where he was getting his goals and it didn't seem like they were trying to feed them every single shift. So it had a good feel up until a week ago and then everything fell off the rails. So it's unfortunate that you're going into a series now on a bit of a downer here and that's going to be key here, is that it's not a good feeling right now for Austin or any one of them when you take a look at the big picture here on how you're set and ready to go here outside of sitting on 69, I wouldn't have a good feeling right now. The vibes aren't there right now to go in and against a team that historically has been your worst nightmare. So there's a lot to clean up with the Toronto Maple Leafs physically, mentally, emotionally here in the next few days to get the proper mindset to go in and try to win a series that right now, who's saying that the Leafs can win right now based on what you've seen in the last four games? >> Yeah, it's been tough to see. And I want to be clear before I ask this question, I'm not a believer in this, but I'll see if you are. Do you think there's a version where we get a, like a pissed off and angry Austin Matthews, he didn't get his 70 goals, he hasn't scored in a couple, everyone's talking about how the team was force feeding him, like it's, you know, I'm sure he's sitting there going, I didn't tell him to force feed me, I mean, I kind of did by scoring 69 goals, but I do wonder if there's a version of this where we get a, you know, I don't think more motivation is a thing going into the playoffs, at least it better not be, but is there a version where you get a slightly angry or maybe more ticked off Austin Matthews and that kind of helps this team. >> Define what pissed off or angry Austin Matthews looks like because I can't do it, I've never seen it. >> Yeah, well, that's kind of my point here is that there's a bit of a cap here and, you know, Austin's strengths as a player is shooting the puck in the net, and he finds ways to do it, we've seen it better than anybody else over the last six years. But as far as that emotion that you're talking about and that edge, that's not him. I don't believe for one second, then that equates into his ability to do what he does. And, you know, and that's the one thing that you kind of question again going in is that, you know, in meaningless games, you know, for Florida or Tampa Bay, they can find a lot more emotion. They can look a little pissed off and angry and the Leafs can't. And when they do, it's great. I mean, it's noticeable and we've seen signs of it where they do look a little pissed off and angry. And the best example I had all season was the Edmonton Oilers and getting in the faces of McDavid and and Dreycidal and, you know, McCabe has shown that type of stuff. But as far as Austin's concern, that's not him pissed off and angry is not Austin Matthews. And, you know, it certainly hasn't been Willie Nielander lately, and I didn't like the look of Tavares getting ragged all the little bit in the last two games either. So they're going to have to, they're going to, they're going to go in with what brought them to the dance over the last few years and that skill, skill, skill, and they're just going to have to find a way to put the puck in the net between Matthews, Nielander, Marner, and Tavares to a certain extent. They're just going to have to carry the freight here and I don't think they're going to do it pissed off and angry. They're going to do it with what brought them to the dance and that's the skill. Yeah. And you know what? All of this, this late game or late season stuff can become irrelevant. Of course, if they look amazing and they beat the Bruins in the first round of the postseason, but I just, I wonder how real a carry over effect is or how important these meaningless games were in getting prepared for the postseason. I'm looking at your 94 Rangers team, the one the president's trophy, and obviously one Stanley Cup and how you guys finished that season. I'm sure that these were all meaningless games, but you guys rattled off a bunch of wins at the end of the regular season. Like, how do you, how do you view these meaningless games as far as getting prepared for the postseason? Well, I don't believe for one second that it's a light switch that you turn on and off. I believe that, you know, you have to have a certain mindset during the regular season and you got to stay with it and be consistent with it and drag it into a playoff scenario. 82 games is a, is a dress rehearsal for the playoffs and I hope you're right. I hope there is a bit of a switch here because that's the only thing you have your, you know, you can hang on right now if you're a Leaf fan is that it weren't motivated enough in the last four games other than you get Austin's 70th goal and, but that's not the way it works for me. And I think, I think there are signs that, you know, maybe trouble may lie ahead if, if that switch doesn't get turned on, but I don't like it. I don't like the way they played the last four games and the mindset that they have. You got to, you got to, you got to come in feeling like, like the way Florida and Tampa looked last night that they don't care, that they only know how to play one way and that's, that's hard. So, you know, are the Leafs capable of, of, of giving Boston a good series? Absolutely. But, you know, will they be able to check off and throw away the last four games and come in emotionally, physically and mentally ready? That's, that's a huge question mark for me starting Saturday. How much of that is on the head coach who said, yeah, all we care about the postseason is about the postseason, not the 70 goal stuff. And then we saw what happened the last four games. They played him 24 minutes in a home game, including a three and a half minute shift in a meaningless game. Like, how much of this is on the head coach, if in fact it is important to, to, to, to look not as horrible as they have in these meaningless four final regular season games. Well, there's no question that, uh, whatever happens in the first round, uh, he's going to get a ton of credit or he's going to take a, he's going to carry a lot of weight of it. There's no doubt, uh, it's, it's built up and this has been a buildup over years, right? That this, this roster, the core guys, all of it, you know, it's, it's a serious fork in the road here for the Toronto Maple Leafs and for Sheldon and, and the core four here. So yeah, there's no question that, uh, there's going to be a look back here and either you're going to shrug it off and, and Sheldon's going to look like a genius here for getting them prepared for when it mattered most or, uh, all of this will come back. Uh, and, uh, we'll just have to wait and see how it plays out. Yeah. So you, you mentioned it there. You have your new piece. I'm not sure if it's, uh, it's up yet, but, uh, we were lucky enough to, to peruse it. But the sneak peek. Yeah, at the, uh, at your piece in the start today that who, who kind of has the most on the line? I mean, Keith is the obvious example there. I think tri-living, having just got here, he has, you know, plausible deniability to a certain extent. But the guy at the top of this all, Brendan Shanahan, is there possibility there's heat on him, depending on how this goes with the new Chief at, uh, MLSC? Yeah, there's, there's no question that there's a new set of eyes here to, to, to come in and, and, and watch, watch all this from 60,000 feet. And that is, uh, Keith Pelly, uh, and I do remind, uh, everybody, uh, today in my article in the Toronto Star that, uh, the stakes have never been higher, I think, for the Toronto Maple Leafs. And it has everything to do with a new sheriff in town in, in Keith Pelly. And you know, this is, this is a guy that, uh, we know through the, the likes of the majority of his career in broadcasting, either with, uh, running the show at TSN or, or for us here at, uh, Rogers Sportsnet. And he's a bold guy. And to sit here and think that he's going to quietly come in and, and get his feet wet over the next few years, I don't think, uh, that's the case at all here. So yeah, I, I think there's, there's a lot here, uh, at stake, including, you know, Brendan Shanahan, uh, the whole management staff. I think there's going to be a complete overlook of, of, of not just this season, but, you know, where it started and what the moves were made and, uh, all of it comes into play here. So listen, the basis of the article is, you know, the, the look back if, uh, is, is clearly going to be there, uh, if, if it's a short playoff run for the Toronto Maple Leafs, but if it's not, um, then it's, uh, you know, move on and, uh, and, uh, keep building here. But that, that's, to me, is what it's, is what is at stake here is, uh, is, is definitely a situation where Keith Pelly's going to come in here and, and, and now be that, that set of eyes that, uh, necessarily wasn't there on a consistent basis with, uh, just, uh, you know, Larry Tanabam is, uh, as, uh, the director of the board and, uh, and then a bunch of other people, uh, that, uh, you know, aren't paying as, as much of attention as a guy like Keith Pelly will be. So you mentioned explicitly Mitch Marner and what, what could happen to him this, this offseason with, with one year remaining on his deal. He has a full no trade though as well, Nick. I just, I, I, I, he's the guy that could obviously be the, the pivot point. How, how would that happen if the Leafs were, we're going to move off of Mitch Marner, just like just, you know, nuts and bolts of it. Well, again, um, you know, are we talking about a long playoff stretch here where, where Mitch is the, is as important as anyone here. It's a different look again. This is again to my point in, in the article is on what's at stake here. So if the Leafs end up in a conference final or a Stanley Cup final, you're, you're looking at ways to try to resign Mitch Marner's. And if that doesn't happen, then you're in a situation of, uh, if we, if we're not committed to a long term deal, then this is the guy that we have to trade. So you mentioned that he's got a no move clause, but it's kind of irrelevant at this point because, uh, you know, Mitch Marner is looking at, uh, signing a long term deal. Uh, as early as this July, uh, because he's eligible for renegotiation, uh, a year out of unrestricted free agency and who's going to, what teams out there that's going to give me the best chance to sign that deal and maybe be in a position to, to still win a Stanley Cup. So that's what he's looking at and, uh, if, if the feel and the vibe is that the Leafs aren't going to be that team for him, then he's has to open up to, to, to lifting his no move so he can get it so he can meet his objectives of signing a long term deal. So that, that, that comes into play for me on a, on a short, on a short run, uh, for the Toronto Maple Leafs, uh, this spring, but again, uh, all bets are off if the Leafs can go deep here and give the fans what they want. And that's, uh, a lot of meaningful games this spring. Yeah. I mean, we'll, we'll say it all leading up to this series that it's like, yeah, uh, they win the series and then win one more. All these conversations we're having are, are parked for at least, uh, a calendar year. I do wonder about, you know, Marner and, you know, success he's had here, the weird year. I mean, still statistically 85 points in 69 games, you know, the counting stats aren't there because he missed a bunch, but another really, really solid year for him. But he also hasn't played with the guy. I think he quite honestly wants to play with the most for the bulk of this year. And in Austin Matthews, like how important do you think it is for, for those guys or for Sheldon Keefe to get them back together? Or do you think he will kind of stay away from it once Domie is, is back because I think that that is, I think if they were talking about one team success, I mean, where Marner plays is obviously a huge part of it, but personal enjoyment, I mean, I, I think those guys have been on record to say and they like playing together. Well, base, what I, what I witnessed in the last four games, I can't write those two names together fast enough for, for game one in Boston. So we'll have to see this is a, this, this will be interesting on, on what those lines look like come Saturday. And then there's also the fact that, you know, you went into this, this last week, you know, thinking that you weren't going to have them together and that you were going to spread out to kneelander, Marner and Matthews over, over three lines. Of course, Max Domie gets hurt and you're chasing 70. So you put them together and listen, I, I can't count the number of times that Mitch Marner, you know, put a puck on Austin Matthews stick to try to get 70 goals. And that is a familiar look that we've had over the last few years. So for me, they're together to start game one. The other concern too is, you know, willing, kneelander, goalless and what 12 or 13 and, you know, for, for a guy that, you know, halfway through the season was running toe to toe with cootra of in points, very disappointing to watch him, you know, in, in the last couple of weeks here. And he's another guy that you're going to have to find a way to get going here. So lots, lots to think about, lots of concerns for the Toronto Maple Leafs and Sheldon Keefe and not much time to make so those hard decisions. No, no goals, four points in the final 11 games of the regular season for William Kneelander as he sits stuck on not 99 points, 98 for him. So I think that the biggest decision or the one that people are the least certain about as far as who's going to be into the game one lineup is on the blue line there, Kipper, how do you see it? I mean, do you see it, like a Riley Labushkin thing as you try and replicate what you had with Luke Shen last year? It does feel like you got the Benoit McCabe second pairing, the shutdown pairing and the third one's going to involve Joel Edmondson on the left side, but who plays on the right side with him? Yeah, that's also a million-dollar question here and everybody thinks that Brody may be a lok, but for me, he's just not physically engaged right now and that to me is a huge concern and are there question marks on Labushkin and Lillegrine, yeah, absolutely they are but they are, they give the Leafs something that I think is an important look and that's a right-handed shot here and you got to just hope that Lillegrine can find his way. It seems like every time he comes off an injury, it's a week, two weeks before he can really settle in and you just hope that is happening. But to your point, Benoit for me and Edmondson, I need that physicality, Labushkin to me has to still come in. This is the Boston Bruins here, so they have to have that physicality there and you just hope that Morgan can kind of be that guy that he was in the first round against Tampa where he played the best hockey of his career and he can carry the freight a little bit. But as far as Giordano and Timmons, those guys are on the outside looking in and to me, I got to think that Brody may be the odd man out here. Yeah, I think it's very, very possible. We'll see. On Saturday, Game 1 from Boston, Leafs Bruins after 8 o'clock on Sportsnet. Nick, always a pleasure, man, thanks. OK, you guys have a great day. You too, Nick Kipryos, really Kipryos, who will not be playing golf today, partly because he has to work, but partly because he says it's no good out there. It is a little bit fine. It is a wild move and I would only say this now that Kipryos is off the line. It is a wild move to be like, I love golf just as much as you, you're insane for playing today, you can't play today as you're going to go play golf. It's just like, but that's what happens when you're Nick Kipryos. Well, no, but he gets to be like scoreboard and then do my Tyson pose and it's like, who really won? Who really won? Yeah, right. Probably not you. I got to be honest. Not you, Nick's right. Mitch Marner. Yeah. Yeah, that is the hinge point. Listen, this Leafs team is going to look different next year, especially on the Blue Line, just factually. No, TJ Brody is an unrestricted free agent. Mark Gordano may have played his final NHL game too, which is like, man, yeah, yeah. I mean, we'll always have that shin pad they framed up when he set the block shots right. And God knows, you don't need six defense, but especially if the Leafs won't want to go on the run that they won. Do your thing. Yeah. 145 defense men and Mark Gordano. Why don't they make the whole team out of defense? Yeah. Anyways, but yeah, Mitch Marner being extension eligible, having one year left on his deal, but having a full no move clause where, boy, you want to talk about the potential pivot? Such a tough spot for Brad's living to jump into a situation where it's like the countdown is on for Matthew's extension, but also the window if you want to have the biggest shaker in this generation of Leafsdom and then go talk to Matthews about his contract. Yeah, it was just like an impossible situation. Now, I understand what Nick's saying in that like the new no move clause becomes less relevant if you tell Mitch Marner explicitly it ain't happening here. Yeah. Like the whatever 20% of the cap that you want, obviously it's not going to happen here. And so we'll try and find the best landing spot for you. But if you're trading somebody of Mitch Marner's caliber, I mean, what does that do to your negotiating power? Yeah, nukes it. I mean, it's not this, but we saw what happened with Terrace Anko at the deadline. Like there are other teams that would have pwnied up more for him, but he said, I'm just going to go to Florida, which again, by the way, it'd be really nice to have a guy at the deadline say I'm only going to the Leafs. You have to like, we've had Jason Spetsa do the like, if you claim me, I'll retire move. That was nice. But anyways, I think that that's what you see what happens now. That's a very tight window. It's at a deadline. It's a player who's a rental and you're not looking to extend him potentially in Terrace Anko. But we see it all the time. When a guy says I'm going to go, no, I don't think Mitch Marner, if he was open to waving his no move clause would say it's only to go here. But it's not going to be to go to 20 different teams. It's going to be a pretty particular set of circumstances you would think that would make him want to move on. I also am pretty hesitant to believe the Leafs would just be adamant saying it's not going to happen here. That's what a negotiation windows for I also just think that unless Mitch Marner wins the cons might this year, there's no way he's open to negotiating contract this summer given the contract, given the year he had heading into his contract season and given the way he just saw the knee lander negotiation play out in season where he got everything he wanted once he went and performed. So I think that it's most likely that the contract conversations are completely moot. I don't think you can overstate though how much the playing with Matthews of it all. I don't think it'd be the deciding factor in this. But if the writing is on the wall that, you know, and obviously a lot would have to happen with this again, team success would have to come for this. But let's say Max Domi reups on a team friendly ish termy deal and the writing's on the wall that you're not going to play with Matthews all the time. Like how much would that enter into the conversation? I don't think it's the be all and end all, but I think it would factor in. Yeah, it's a really weird situation to think about. So like the Bo Horvat trade for comparison sake, Kanak's got a first round pick, Anthony Bovillier and Attu Ratu, who like who knows, they got a first round pick. It's not exactly a haul. It's not like, it's not like franchise changing for the captain. No. Yeah. He's signed an extension who's worse than Mitch Marner, we got to say that as well. It's true. But no, but like the cap, but the cap fit was easier than whatever it'll be, even for one year at 11 million, and then signing him to an extension worth more than that. No, no, the point I'm making is not to say that, oh, they can obviously get more because Marner's a better player. It's that that's the kind of deal you're looking at. Like maybe it's a little better, maybe a throw in another pick because Lord knows the Leafs need some of those to do business at the deadline as we found out. But that is the blueprint. And Marner, like Bo Horvat's a great player, you know, leader, captain, center, yadda, yadda, yadda. It's not even close who you're taking to start your team or just in a trade who you would rather take in a vacuum. So yeah. Yeah. It's just, if you're making that decision, you're already deciding that it's an addition by subtraction thing. You're not getting. No, you're getting cap space. You're getting cap space and it's like spreading the dollars and what you're, at that point, just admitting that the idea of being top heavy with your forwards and paying them all the money, even though only one more year factually exists of John Tavares' contract and we all expect him to do the Jason Spencer. Not quite. But like. You imagine. Yeah. It's going to be the most interesting off-season sub-plot. Well, and the other part of this that's all tied, part and parcel together, like if it doesn't go well, and I know it's saying it's happening, but you hear, Kipper, it's very much in the cards, like, and there's complete sea change and Brad should living as the last man standing and there's a new president of hockey ops and there's a new head coach. Why would anybody be tied to the idea that you got a, we can and we will. You know, I know Kyle Dubas is gone. It's like, I bet Brandon Shanahan thought a little bit of we can and we will as well. And if he's gone, how much does that change the math and all this? And again, go in two rounds and we will not even think about these conversations. Went around. Mm. Still in the air. To me, the, the die was cast with the, the knee lander extension and the no move clause. It's like you're, you're in it for the duration, even if we bow out meekly in the first round of the Bruins that, yeah, losing a player of that caliber for nothing, which would be like the case factually, if he just departs in free agency, which would be his right given the no more move clause or slightly more than nothing, that's not tenable. And at worst, you know, you just hope and hope and hope that one more year of campaign and then the John Tavares goes away and then the cap goes up and it allows you to do more things. But you're in it. Like to me, that was the last stand, William knee lander, you paid him, you gave him all the trade protection in the world. Austin Matthews doesn't have the long term date, but like pretty clearly he's bought into everything that goes with being a Toronto Maple Leaf going to be the eventual captain. He would think also maybe when John Tavares is either departing or retiring or even there could be a natural point where you do that at the conclusion of this 11 million per seven year deal. >> Very possible. >> That to me, when you sign William knee lander to the extension you did and gave him the no move protection that that was it, the dye was cast and that this for better and it's been for worse. This is the Maple Leafs team you're going to live with in this generation. I'll go one step further. It wasn't signing knee lander. It was firing to this once you fired Cal doobas and you made the decision that you're going to change your GM with that little runtime into the window that you had to trade. And we talk about it be a martyr could have been knee lander could have been that you had your window there and it was never remotely possible quite honestly to have expected or even thought for one second the Brad shall living would come in here in his first move as GM at the Toronto Maple Leafs is trading one of those guys. It's never going to happen. >> Cal doobas stepped into Pittsburgh is like traded for the Norris trophy winner. >> Yeah. But that was never going to happen. So I think that that's when the die was kind of cast on this. I mean, I think ultimately when it's all said and done and I don't mean like, you know, when we're all dead. I just mean like two or three years down the line. >> Thank you for clarifying. >> Yeah. Well, you know, I always got death on the brain. But I think that all these guys are still here, like far as is still playing here on a relatively team friendly deal and Marner's got his money and is no move. And it's actually like a, like they have super max prisons, it'll be like a super max no move like they're not even allowed to move them off a map. Use line. It's like that's how that's how stride in the no move will be. It's like that's what's going to happen because there is no to the point you made. There's no Mitch Marner trade or we can stop making this about Marner. It doesn't matter for any of them. There's no knee lander trade. There's no obviously Matthews trade that makes you better until you are able to reset and recalibrate and maybe a couple of years after the fact you're better. But this team does not have a couple of years after the fact to be wasting right now. >> Okay. Projecting ahead. Let's just do a little thought experiment. I have no idea where you're going. I'm so excited. Leaf's losing the first round and whatever fast. >> Sure. It really doesn't matter. First, yeah, Mitch Marner puts pen to paper on an eight year extension. The exact same cap hit as William knee lander. >> Yep. >> 11 and a half. >> Yeah. >> How do how do Lee fans take that because that's like I guess a discount. >> That is seen as a team friendly deal. >> It's a team friendly deal. But it's also like I can't believe we're doubling down again on this. You better like we don't this isn't a pie in the sky or like who knows that's what's going to happen. We would actually take that deal right now that Mitch Marner would sign out. Like I don't think that deal is going to happen. But the idea that they're just going to give him his money. Whether it comes now, whether it comes in the middle of the next season, well, I guess I can't come now. But whether it comes July 1, middle of the next season, well, won't come after that because they're not going to let him walk for nothing. It's just he's going to get his money. I think the only path to it being not a, oh my God, we're doing this again. And again, this is a very different conversation if they beat Boston and who knows what happens. But is for Marner to take something that's considered team friendly. That's the only path. That is. Yeah. I mean, that's team friendly. 11 and a half. Yeah. And what are we talking about? Because he's not making. Obviously it's somewhere between 11 and a half and Matthew's 13.25. Exactly. So what were you going to quibble over a couple hundred grand, which I guess everybody does. Yeah. That's literally the, that's like our whole job is quibbling over a couple hundred grand and nobody. Not our job. No, no, no, no. That's like their job is quibbling over a couple hundred grand. And I was like, yeah, because we talked to friends outside and he talked about our salaries. He was like, he's like, who's your agent? I should have. I think we live in different worlds than my friends. The most mad was that I could have like, I had a new career sitting right in front of me. I could have been like, Mike, there's this guy. He is smart as a whip, young guy, bright gunning, elite media agent. And like, maybe he would have just been like, I'm going to get in touch with this guy. Like maybe I had it sitting right there. But no, no, we're not quibbling. But I, I look at it as nobody, nobody of that caliber. They're Bobby McMahon's who like, yeah, that Bobby McMahon deal with possible it's seen as really team friendly. But if the superstar ilk, that is what team friendly means. It's like, all right, I'll do the Conor McDavid thing. You all bullied me and I'll take 12 and a half instead of 13. That's what team friendly means now. And team friendly means term too. If you get the term on Marner, I think you're happy about that as well. Sure. How happy will they be? Oh, no. Nobody's going to be happy. Well, I mean, again, unless they win. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. If you win signing, it's on everybody day, everything. Yeah. Obviously. Including us. Yeah. You're obviously a huge part of it. Sure. We'll be there along for the ride. I do want to sneak in one more hockey thing because we've got to get to this Jante Porter business. Jeff Carter, calling it a career. I am just such a sucker for a guy like that who was just so respected to get. That's the only time I ever want to hear again about respect in the handshake line because there was a ton of it yesterday. Jeff Carter is just like a guy who hits me in my vintage. So perfectly. He was part of that loaded, loaded, whatever 2004 Grand Forks World Junior team is part of the '03 draft. Just a guy who had an awesome NHL career. He took those pitchers in LA after the Flyers jettisoned him out with him and Mike Richards. And they said, yeah, he didn't laugh. He led. It was great. He wouldn't join dry island. That's right. He's a grown man. And guess what? Guess what? He didn't need to be on dry island to go win a cup. So I just have all the respect in the world for Jeff Carter. I he was just one of my like one of my favorite players that you would never sit around talking about like, Oh, I love Jeff Carter, but he is man like what a stud legend amazing career just pulled up the stats here over 1300 games played few less points than you think, like 851. But yeah, awesome, awesome career perennial 25ish goal man. Good center. God, what a stud. Well, we're waving goodbye. Let's wave goodbye to the Arizona Coyotes. And emotional. Okay, good. No, you do that. You go ahead. I just did. Okay. I have nothing left to say. That's nice. So yeah. Yeah. There is some tears. I did see a tweet that was like the owners not in the building yet. And it's like, obviously, you think that guy's going to show up to get booed? Come on. Why would you? He's a rich guy. I think God, if somebody's going to was about to hand me, I don't know what he's getting a billy hundreds of millet while it's like, but he spent money. So net, whatever, someone's handing me all that money. I'm not getting booed. Okay. I'm not going somewhere where I'm getting booed. Only adulation if I'm a billionaire. Yeah. So just before warned, when I, when I, one day I'll get my billions and me and Francesco will be hanging out. There'll be nothing but adulation from you. Well, that's why the John Fisher Oakland A zone or thing is so confusing. It's like, what are you, what are you doing? I just, what? Say less. Yeah. Just go hide in your money hole. I guess. Scrooge McDuck, you can be that insulated from the popular opinion. To be completely unaware of how anything would be perceived. All right. Yeah, that's fun. All right. I, I think I know the perception of John Tae Porter. I agree. And it's right now not a basketball player band for life. We'll talk about it next is the fan morning show continues. Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, sports net 590, the fan. Unrivaled insight, analysis and opinions on all things, blue jays, Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Fan morning show, sports net 590, the fan band, Brent Gunning, we'll talk to Michael Grange after eight o'clock later today as Messiah Jiri doing a well timed media availability right before the news dropped, mostly an insight into when that might be happening. He was asked about John Tae Porter during his season ending media availability. And said, you know, we believe in whatever the league decides to do, league decided to ban him for life. Which is, yeah, the thing that makes the most sense, the thing that I think was the most likely to happen, they just needed some definitive proof as to what seemed pretty clear that this guy was one, manipulating his own playing time. And two, it turns out actually physically betting on NBA games. So how do you cut and drive case? And whenever there's an incident like this, it behooves you as an organization to be as transparent as possible. And the NBA did that in their release, like talking about explicit dollars and cents that the bets range from $15 to $22,000, total wagered $54,094 pay out of $76,059 net winnings F21 that like it's like to the dollar, we're talking about the $80,000 bet that was placed on him to hit the unders in a game, a known better, that he gave that information to in a bet that would have paid out over a million bucks if in fact, you know, the betting company wasn't like, that's curious. What's up with that and froze the account? Good by the way, just like good job by you betting company. Yeah, but yeah, I mean, the most, I don't know what the most damning is. It's all so damning, but the fact that he was within the Raptors organization, bet on NBA games either as a G League player or as a Raptor player. And one of the parlays was to have the Raptors lose a game. Now it should be said that it was said in this release that he didn't play in any of the games where he had the results, but that he did bet on the Raptors to lose. And that also he lost all of his NBA parlay bets, which is that's a tough one for for all John day. Yeah, it's, I don't know that you could have done a worse job of this from his perspective. It's like he made a net of $21,000. The guy he was trying to help out had his bets squashed. He's banned for life. And he lost all the NBA bets he placed on his team losing. Did he get anything out of this? Like, I'm sure there is more to the story here because look, there's either like a personal problem at play here or there is. I want to get to that. Yeah. So I think there's an element there. Like, no part of this was a win for him. Like that. And it was obviously going to be a loss. I think also from an NBA's perspective, this is obviously best case scenario is no one ever gets caught. You never have an issue like this. But to have it be a story, an absolute nobody that you can throw the hammer at and never think twice about worked out perfectly for them in that instance of it all. I would implore people to read Eric Carinesby's on the athletic today, taking not the other side of it. But like, yeah, something that we're not quick to think about, right? This was a guy with the drug problem. Yeah. I mean, obviously it's a different deal because guy with the drug problem is not impacting the integrity of an NBA game. So like, this is not an apples to apples comparison. It was a great 30 for 30 on a Celtics like point guard. I'm trying to remember the particulars of it and he was like buying drugs on his way to playoff game. Sure. Go check that out. I would be talking in sympathetic tones about such a player, right? If they were arrested for drugs or blah, blah, blah, we'd be talking about how they needed support. And this is what a sad story. What a sad story in there as well. But I don't know, I don't pretend to know exactly what is happening to John T. Porter. But here's, I feel pretty certain that like this isn't a guy that needed the money despite the fact that he hadn't carved out an NBA career, his brother is right down the street and like he has a job. I mean, it's a pretty good chance that John T. Porter has serious, serious issues here. Like he has a gambling addiction that he has, like it seems everybody's and I've been guilty of it too. Yeah. Loving to, pardon the pun, like dunk on him, right? Like this is a guy. What an idiot. Yeah. What an idiot. And no doubt there's a part of that, right? And we're all responsible for our own actions. But there is a sickness involved to people that have addictions. Like I think it's probable that a guy isn't probably so flippant with his entire career that he would just do this on a whim because he thought he could make a couple extra bucks. Probably because he has a compulsion and has no choice. I mean, we all have choices, but you know what I mean? Like if you are sick and you are addicted to gambling, it's not as easy as you do. He is saying, well, just don't gamble anymore. Listen, we all have people in our lives that have addictions. Maybe it isn't this specific vice, but that part of the equation is not even considered that it wasn't even a part of the NBA's release, that, hey, the person, like he did a horrible thing and he's gone for life, but we're going to try and help get him some help. And like obviously you can, I'm not saying that the punishment shouldn't have been as severe as it was. Talking about like, yeah, the human element of it is forgotten in all of this. Yeah, I think that I think you're wise to bring that up. I'm not going to criticize the NBA for not putting, and I want to be clear. I think, well, it's such a tricky situation because I don't think the NBA should, you know, like turn the cold shoulder. But like, how does it work with being a part of the players association? If you have a lifetime ban from the league, like, I think these are all questions that I have about this, and, but I think there is an element of the NBA of not wanting to put a PS, we feel bad for them. Why, though? I mean, because I think they want to be seen to, this is the first instance of it. And like we still talk about Pete Rose and the Black Sox scandal. And from an NBA's perspective, they are, and like, honestly, I'm more times than not on the other side of this one, but the NBA, their objective and their goal in this, the thing that they need to care about the most in this is not sorry, Jarté Porter's well-being or getting them help. No, the PR game is make sure that the game looks like it's on the up and up. And so any little inkling of, and we understand what is at play here with Jonté and we hope he gets help, blah, blah, blah, I think it is just seen as anything less than 1000% iron fist, pardon the pun, stern punishment for this. So I don't have a problem with the NBA not including it. Now, I think we all should be including it into our thinking. I mean, you nailed the family situation. The brother's contract is worth whatever it's worth. If it was simply, and you know, everyone's family dynamics are different, but you would think of it was simply a money issue. Michael is like, he seems to love his brother. They seem to have a good relationship. Right. I can understand like older brothers so much more successful, there's a hesitancy. But if the point is lose my livelihood or ask my brother for a loan or whatever, like it's just that part, I keeps entering my mind as well. And that's why I go to what Corinne is talking about there, that it is a compulsion. Yeah. It has to be. Of course, because, yeah, is Jonté Porter like did he make a stupid mistake? Of course. But yeah, he, you don't think he maybe not as much as he should have, certainly not as much as he should have understood the consequences of his actions. And despite that, well, one, I'm sure he thought he could get away with it. But two, whatever compelled him to do the things that he was doing superseded the losing of a livelihood and the immersion as like a potential NBA player, it was no guarantee that he was, I mean, people are talking about how he could have been an NBA player next season and standard player contract would have been north of $2 million. That's not 100% guaranteed on that, yeah, not likely. So it's not, I don't think we're throwing away somebody's, you know, potential $20 million career earnings here, but yeah, he understood had to have, like being in that gambling world had to have understood the consequences and not is like probably part of it is just an idiot, but we can't discount the possibility that part of it is also like just sick. This is a way bigger conversation, but like, why do you think it is that we, because I think, I think most people when you, you know, like, okay, if you're having the conversation about John Tae Porter and you say to them, like, okay, you got your jokes out, you're good. It's like, you understand this is the same as any other addiction like you're talking about it. I think there's a lot of people who go, yeah, yeah, no, I understand that, but it's not. It is different. And it's not like gambling addiction, the chemical in your brain, it all works pretty much exactly the same. But I do think there is just such a, I don't know if it's the idea that like we've had this like caricature of somebody rotting at a slot machine forever in our minds or whatever it is, but it's not like we don't have caricatures for other types of addiction. It is weird that we do seem to think of it in such a, such a different light. Because we put, you know, the rosy, the rosy glow on it, right? Yeah. Yeah, because it's, it's, it's, it's such a part of the way we talk about sports and we're going to do our gambling segment on the show, because that's the way we talk about sports now that, yeah, you don't think about the other side of it. And clearly, hey, listen, there are plenty of caveats and disclaimers around gambling. And if you've done it off, you should know the potential downside exists. But I'd be interested to hear from the person, John T. Porter, when this is all said and done. And I don't think there's going to be any legal implications here. So I think he should be writing and just let us know what happened here. The other question I had about this. I thought that his brother has, maybe, I don't think that's the form for it though. Yeah, probably not. The other thing I was thinking about is like, and this was part of the questioning around Messiah Jerry, hey, what kind of background checks did you do on John T. Porter? What kind of background checks do you do on these players? Should the Raptors have known better? And secondarily to that, John T. Porter's name will be in the history books as like the Pete Rose. Yep. And we're talking about a fringe NBA player, but he's banned for life forever from the NBA. So that'll be a historic moment in the history of this league. Can't ever happen to another Raptors player. Like the Raptors have to be the one franchise that is the most stringent in whatever background checks or whatever guardrails are around gambling. Like it can't be another Raptors player. Yeah, honestly, not something I thought about, you're not wrong to bring it up. But I just, I think from, like, I'm just thinking from my perspective, if I'm Messiah Jerry, I think when I'm doing background checks on these guys, it's like, yeah, you're doing all the NFL draft stuff where it's like, what's this guy's character? You know, what do his ex-girlfriends have to say about him? Well, what's his mother got to say about him? You're doing all that stuff. I just think that it is such a red line that we hadn't seen cross that I wouldn't have even, I wouldn't have thought, did you do a background check that this guy's not been illegally gambling? Yeah. But like if you had done just like a cursory social media check, you would have seen what people immediately after the early channels and the crypto, but it's like, okay, so the guy likes crypto and likes to talk about sports gambling. Now somebody. Yeah, the sports gambling part of it. Okay. But did you raise my price? Okay. So like to show Hay Otani world, it's like, so if a guy, I mean, man, Shane Pinto, like, we still don't know what, but he was gambling on something. It's like, we find out that Austin Matthews loves to gamble on the NBA playoffs. We've like, if I like, again, it's like, I probably shouldn't leap anybody in with this, but it's like superstar X is just like, Hey, I got a ton of thoughts on the NFL playoffs and who you should bet on who you should gamble on. I don't think that for me, I'd be like, this guy's awesome. I wouldn't think that's a red flag that this person's going to throw games or try to tank them or even just gamble on them if he's not playing. I think, listen, the NBA has its own rules, but as an individual team, you can make up your own rules as well. As an employer, I mean, if I were the Raptors, I would say despite it being legal within the CBA parameters, I'd say, Hey, guess what? We're the franchise now that has the stank of John Tae Porter. No sports gambling in any form or fashion, like that's just not a thing we're all going to do. And you have to sign on the dotted line if you're going to be a member of the Toronto Raptors. Yeah, that feels, I got to be honest, that feels too far for me. This is a team that has trouble enough, like getting free agents and it's the one team that's not in America. And I just think that it's such a red line that has been crossed that that's a bridge too far for me, honestly. Yeah. Yeah. Do the thing. Go ahead. You're going to have like a witty. I can't. Yeah. No, there's absolutely zero way. So. Wake and Rake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet responsibly. Now we mentioned the series odds for the Leafs and Bruins. It's pretty close to coin flip, but the, the Bruins slightly favored at minus 120. May beliefs plus a hundred game one starting on Saturday in Boston. We now have series top goal scores where surprise, surprise, the guy with not quite 70 goals, leads the pack at plus 165 is Austin Matthews second, David Pasternak plus 250 William Neelander plus 750 Brad Marsh and plus 1400 John Tavares plus 1800. He finished the season strong goal scoring wise and Mitch Marner also tied with Tavares at plus 1800. Anything stand out to you there? Yeah. It's the, it's the middle two guys in there, Neelander at plus 750 or Marsh on at plus 1400. Those are far and away the best odds. I maybe could squint and see a Tavares world there, but I think the Leafs power plate have to be good for that to happen. And I don't think that's going to happen. So yeah, I'd look at Neelander or armor or marsh on sprinkle on either of them. And I think it's pretty likely one of them hits. So those are the ones I'm looking at. What are we talking about here? This is a Scotty Scheffler situation where it's like, I mean, you don't, you go into a golf tournament and you're like almost even odds to win it. And then guess what happens? He wins it because he's the best. Austin Matthews is, you're, you're getting better than one to one odds on him to be the leading goal scorer in this series. Come on, don't overthink this. It's Austin Matthews, Scotty Scheffler. That was the Wakenrake presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, talk to the man who called yesterday's Game 82 of the Toronto Maple Leaf season and we'll call game one of the postseason. Craig Simpson of Hockey Night in Canada Nexus, the fan morning show continues, Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, Sports Night 5 Night of the Fan.
