Interview with Bo & Bill Winiker!
WBCA Podcasts
City Talk with Ken Meyer (Bo & Bill Winiker)
(upbeat music) - WBCA radio is proud to present CityTalk, where fascinating conversation is alive and well, with your host, Boston radio veteran, Ken Meyer. - Well hello again everybody, welcome to what I think is a very special edition of CityTalk. I have never seen and witnessed two people more loved and respected, because of their talent and their personality than we have this afternoon, or this evening rather, and I am talking about Bill and Bo Whitaker of the Whitaker Orchestra. And gentlemen, it's really an honor to be able to talk to you again and have you on this program. - Well it's an honor to talk to you Ken, we go back a long way. - Oh yeah, yeah we go back to the days when Larry Glick was a boy. - We go a long time, and we're honored to be with the Hall of Famer. We don't know too many Hall of Famer's, but we can count you as one of our favorites. - Well I appreciate that if there were a Hall of Famer's from musicians, I'm sure you two guys would be in it. But if I can-- - Well, thanks. - Thank you. - Let's talk about the early days. Were you guys drawn to music, or was your dad a musician? Or what turned you on to music? - Well, our father was a professional musician long before we were born. Bo really tells the story well. So Bo, I'm gonna let you talk about it. - Well, my dad had his first orchestra in 1939. First of all, I'll tell all of you listeners today that we came from a lovely town called Millis, Massachusetts, Bucola community, 5,000 people growing up. We lived on the banks of the Charles River. My dad was a gentleman farmer, but he was also a fine musician. And he graduated from Millis High School. Nobody could be prouder in 1939. He had his own orchestra, and he continued his own orchestra for many years until he formed the Winnaker Family Band in 1962. I was all of 10 years of age. My brother was 13, my mother was 32. And that's really how it all began for us. My dad had a phenomenal band of musicians, but he had a dream that he was going to one day replace his regular season musicians with the family members. And so I started, I had a lot of hot air back then, Ken. And so my dad thought it would be perfect that I played the trumpet, and Bill was banging on pots and pans. And so he became the drummer. And we didn't have a bass player in the band. We had the piano, which my father played, and the drums and the trumpet. And so my dad said, "We gotta have a bass." So mama got him for the next Mother's Day. Mother got a string bass fiddle. She was a little disappointed, thought she was gonna get something for the kitchen, but ended up with the bass. And so that's how we started, playing in our living room, making music together every night. - Oh, wow. And when did you start getting, what was your, do you remember your first engagement as the Winnaker family band with your dad? - I sure do. We were playing right in Millis, Massachusetts. We were playing at the Finfur and Feather Club. It was a social club. It was a fishing club. And it was a game club right in Millis, Mass. I still drive by it. I actually drove by it today. I happened to be in Millis earlier today. And I drove right by it. It's still there after all these years. And so the members of that club were a little surprised when my father showed up and he had a new band with them. And they were expecting the old Ed Winnaker band, but it turned out to be me playing the trumpet. I think I was 10 or 11 at the time and Bill, as I said, my mother. And so the manager rushed up to my dad and said, "Mr. Winnaker, where's your band?" And so he said, "Well, this is my new band." And he said, "Don't worry at all." He said, "If there are any complaints "and your members aren't happy, "there will be no charge for the entertainment at all." And so at the end of the night, all the guests rushed up to the band and they congratulated my father and they hovered around us and they told us how great we were. And after that first performance, Ken, we never looked back. We just kept performing together for years. And then one thing led to another. We never had a master plan in our family. One good thing just seemed to happen after another. And we'll tell you some of those stories today, if you like. - Oh, absolutely. Did you guys have an agent or did your dad do it all? Did he arrange the bookings? - My dad arranged the bookings. Do you know what's interesting? We kept everything right in-house. We took care of the publicity. Bill's become a publicity man over the years. And my dad did the bookings, I remember. Early on, I used to listen to my father talking to his clients. And after the year was over, he'd call them up and say, "I'm sending out the contract for next year's booking." And that's how he did it. He was a terrific businessman. And fortunately, Bill and I picked up some of that, not all of it, but some. - And tell me about the music that you guys all played back then. - Well, my father had a system. Kenny, you know, my father did something very unique. We all had private lessons. My mother had a private-based teacher and Beau had a private trumpet teacher. And I had a drum teacher and we would take lessons from these professionals and practice after school in our rooms all alone. But what made it really fun for us was that every night, when supper was over, we would all head to the music room in our house. One house had nothing. One room had nothing in it, but musical instruments. That was our music room. It was like a little nightclub in there. They had the drum set and the piano and the bass and Bose horns and we had a set of vibes, a vibraphone. And for three hours, every night, my father would teach us songs. And he had a system. He'd start with a jazz song. So he taught us how to play one classic jazz song. It could have been a Dizzy Gillespie or Miles Davis or something that I love. It's Gerald, might have sung. And he would teach us to play the song and then he would teach us how to improvise. So that was step one every night. Then step two, as he said, we have to not only learn the great music of the past, but we have to always know what's happening now. And to this day, we adhere to that policy. So this is back in the '60s. So we'd be learning a Beatle tune or a Rolling Stone tune or a tune by the Monkeys, whatever was hot on the radio, my father would teach us. And then after learning one new tune and one old tune, he'd teach us how to play different styles of music, ballroom dance music and walses and foxtrods and Latin American music. So we'd learn a tune a night in all these different genres. So after a year went by, Bo had memorized a thousand songs on his trumpet. And my father said, we are ready to go to work. So that was-- - I love to hear about that family togetherness every night. I think that's great. I mean, I love music all my life. I learned it from my mom. I learned about sports and the gentleness of people from my father, but my mother was the one that really got me interested in music. And I joined the choirs that we had in school and I played the accordion in our high school dance band. But listening to old broadcasts of big band music, I kind of lean toward that. Do you guys have a preference as to which you like better? - Well, because of my father's attitude, we fell in love with all the different styles of music, but we started with jazz the first song of the night. So we got addicted to jazz, but we also loved the music we grew up with that we heard on the radio, whether it was earth wind and fire when they came out or blood sweat and tears or other Beatles. So we really love all kinds of music as long as it's played on a high quality. But those big band broadcasts, those were thrilling for us even now to hear those, they're available. You could find them on YouTube, but our love is for many, many styles of music. And that's the career that we ended up with playing at people's parties and events. And with my father's training, we were able to successfully play any kind of music. We would look out at the crowd and study the crowd and see who was there and check the demographic, see how old everyone was and if there was a mixture of people there, we'd make sure we played music for the 20 year olds and music for the 30 year olds, music for the 40 and 50 year olds. And if there were grandparents here, we would play that big band music or the classics that Ella Fitzgerald sang or Frank Sinatra. So we always went to a party equipped to play a potpourri of music and make sure that everyone at the event would get the music that they grew up with. - And you know what Ken, just to chime in a tiny bit, what Bill and I really live for is the authenticity of the music. Whatever style of music we play, we play it, we believe the way it's supposed to sound. And for me personally, what I live for is for taking these little notes on a piece of paper but making the music come alive, putting all your spirit and energy into making that music come alive. And when people look up and see us performing, they see musicians that are happy, that are having fun, that are just so engaged and so thrilled to be doing what they're doing. And that's the legacy that our dad instilled in us, which is the thrill of making music. And one more step about my dad, he shared his love of music with us, which I would have to tell you Ken is the best gift that I've received so far. - Yep, now I don't know about your preferences for the big bands myself. I loved Glenn Miller and I think one of the classic recordings is a 1938 concert that Benny Goodman did at Carnegie Hall in New York. So I kind of like Benny Goodman and Glenn Miller. - Well, you know guys, we love those bands too. Those are two great bands, they were two different bands. Glenn Miller had the most beautiful sound. He came up with a clarinet lead and the ballads they played would feature a clarinet leading the saxophone section. It was just the easiest sound on the years. And Benny Goodman's band was a hot band. Boy, they drove hard, they swung hard. They were under the influence of Louis Armstrong, the guys in the band, when they took solos, they were hot. - Do you know, Ken, in recent history, for five New Year's Eve's, I was conducting the Boston Pops at Symphony Hall. And for those five years, my first number, every one of those years was the Moonlight Serenade. And once we started playing the Moonlight Serenade, people would come from the second, first balcony that'd come from all over Symphony Hall to be dancing. And they never stopped for the whole evening, but Gun Miller's music is magic. - Now tell me about those years. How did you wind up getting a gig, being able to conduct the Boston Pops? I think that's wonderful. - Well, I'll tell you, when they called me, I told them I had worked on the, I had been a conductor on the B&O Railroad for four years. And they said, "Mr. Winnicker, that's perfect. "For conducting the Pops, you'll be fine." - No. - "I'm teasing you. "I'm teasing you." Do you know, I went to school at the New England Conservatory of Music. I was very privileged to study at New England Conservatory. And it's diagonally across from Symphony Hall. And I have to tell you, listen to this, and you, this story, that I had a dream. And my dream was, one day in my lifetime, I would have to stand up on stage at Symphony Hall with that fantastic Boston Pops Orchestra playing with the beautiful stringing section and just play a solo with the orchestra. So I went to Symphony Hall for 20 years. And I would talk to the artistic director, thank you. I would talk to the artistic director. And every year, he was very kind to me. And he said, you know, Bo, we'll try to get it done one of the years, one of these years. And I can't, he said, "Keep coming back." And finally, after more than 20 years of going over there and asking if I could do a solo with the orchestra, I get a call one day from the artistic director, Dennis Alves. And Dennis says, "Bo, how would you like "to conduct the orchestra?" And I said, "Dennis, no. "I just want a solo with the orchestra." He says, "Think it over very carefully. "This would be a great opportunity for you. "We know you can do it." So it was the opening fundraising event of the year. And this goes back seven years now. And so I decided I would do it. It was a great opportunity. I sequestered myself in my room for several months. I had all the scores of the music that I had picked to conduct with the orchestra. And I was studying them religiously and then I did it. And it went extremely well. And Dennis called me a couple of weeks later and he said, "Bo, how would you like to conduct "on New Year's Eve?" So I did that and then I did another one of the fundraising events and then as I said, five New Year's Eve's. So how did I get to do it? The first time I walked out on stage at Symphony Hall, I looked up at the heavens and I thanked my father. I said, "Dad, thank you so much for preparing me "for this opportunity of a lifetime "to stand on the stage at Symphony Hall "and not only play in sing, "but to conduct the orchestra as well." So for me, it was getting to the top of the mountain. And even though I had performed at the White House in two presidential inaugurations and recorded with Billy Joel and many other wonderful opportunities, that opportunity of being a hometown person here and conducting the Boston pop set, that's the thrill of the lifetime. And that for me was making it to the top of the mountain. - And the regular, I'm drawing a blank, the regular conductor. - Oh, Keith, Keith, Keith Lockhart. - Keith's 25 plus years, maybe more now. He's had an illustrious career here in Boston and around the world. And the opportunity came across my door that they wanted me to take his place for those five years and so I did it in, boy, what a thrill. What a thrill to be standing on that stage, working with the finest musicians in the world. - Well, I will tell you a story. I was very friendly with a gentleman who was Bob Hope's New England representatives. Bob Hope was coming to Boston to do a reading of the carnival of the animals at the Boston pop's orchestra. And his New England representative called me up on a Sunday morning and he said, "Are you doing anything this afternoon?" And I said, "No." And he said, "Well, how would you like to come out to a symphony hall and see Bob Hope rehearse with Arthur Feidler?" And I said, "Yeah, I think I could make myself available. My calendar is pretty clear." So I did it. I went out and met Arthur Feidler and of course I had met Bob Hope a couple more a couple of times before that. So that was my big thrill of the Boston pop's is getting to meet as Bob Hope referred to him, the Godfather of music. - Well, I'd like to share one Bob Hope story with you, maybe more than one, but we performed at the Parker House Hotel from 1977 to 1991, 14 years playing in the last era. We had a band playing down there six nights a week plus Sunday afternoon brunch. At the time we were playing there, the Dunphy family owned the hotel. My parents were living in the hotel and they were the dearest friends of the Dunphy family. And one day Roy Dunphy called up my father who was upstairs in his room and said, "Ed, Bob Hope is in the hotel and he's in the lobby right now. Please come right down." And so my mother and father came down into the lobby and there was a piano in Parker's bar and my dad sat at the piano and played thanks for the memory for Bob Hope. And it was really terrific. And then one time my dad was doing a big fundraising event for Boston College and Bob Hope was the headliner that night and another time in Andover Mass, I was conducting a 16-piece band and Bob was the headliner for a big hospital gala. So we've worked with them before. One of the most talented and gracious men known to mankind, Bob Hope. - Yup, the first time I had a chance to meet Bob Hope was in 1974 at the National Hope for the Blind Golf Tournament in Framingham. And he performed at the Chateau de Ville that night and I had a chance to meet him. I gave him a tape as a matter of fact of a radio show with himself and Clark Gable. And he told me that day he said, if you want to talk about somebody who had Mike Fright, it was Clark Gable. They practically had to hold him up to get him to go out of the microphone. - Amazing. - Yeah, oh yeah, he had plenty, he had great stories and it was a great time for him to perform because that was the same day that Richard Nixon resigned as the president. - Wow. - And everybody needed a catharsis, they needed to laugh. - Bob Hope told a funny joke that night, he said, "Richard Nixon is probably the only man "who could call dial-up prayer and have them hang up on him." (laughing) - All right, that's a funny joke. - Well, Bob Hope was one, he and Louis Armstrong were two of the greatest American ambassadors for the world. How many USO trips did he make entertaining all across the world? One of the great humanitarian's, Bob Hope. Yup, gave up a lot of his Christmases. Now you mentioned two inaugurations. Don't gloss over that. Let's talk about that, what was that? - Well, we can go back. We played at Bill Clinton's first inaugural ball and we actually got a big bus and we had 21 musicians leaving Boston for Washington DC. And we played at the Clinton inaugural. It's a pretty good story. We played at Hillary Clinton's 15th college reunion. She was a Wellesley college graduate. And we were performing that night and we had a couple of saxophone players in our band. And there's this tall, distinguished gentleman standing off to our left who at the time, that was Bill Clinton and he was sort of like watching us so closely. And on an intermission, he came right over. Before we knew it, he had picked up one of our tenor saxophone players, tenor saxes and was playing with us and boy, what a thrill that was. So of course he was the governor at the time, but when it became time for him to run for president and when he actually did one of the fundraising events for him. And I did give our card to one of the people working with him at the time. And then we also sent him a letter when he did become president, telling him of how we had met first at Wellesley college. And lo and behold, one thing led to another. So our 21-piece Winnick or Swingle Orchestra was invited to Washington play at the Northeastern inaugural ball. There were 3,000 people at that gala and it was quite amazing to even make it a little more exciting. Aretha Franklin sang with our band that night? She put on an hour show and boy, I'll never forget how exciting that was. - Oh, bet. Now there was a second inauguration with that. Clinton as well or was that? - Well, I played a Jimmy Carter's inaugural as well. That was a little before the Clinton one. So those are the two that I performed at. And I also performed at the White House in '74. I played- - Presently old? - No, no, well, it was a dinner for president Leon. But the president Ford was the president at that time and then we played at the State House dinner. So those are my brushes with fame or whatever you would call it, my three minutes of fame. - Political fame. - Yeah. - Yep, now you guys also mentioned it again, very casually. - You mentioned Billy Joel. - Well, you know, my father and brother and I, we spent a whole day with Billy Joel back in the 90s. It was, we were recording some music for a motion picture called "The League of Their Own". - Oh yeah, so Billy's manager had called John Williams at Symphony Hall. There's that Symphony Hall connection again. And John Williams recommended, he was looking for a jazz trumpet player to record some music for the soundtrack and my name was given. So Billy Joel's manager called me and said, "Well, we want you to come out to the studio and record some music with Billy Joel." And so I was playing, but my brother and father came and we all worked on the arrangements. We all talked to Billy and he was, he couldn't have been nicer. Billy, you got something to say? - Well, it took about three or four hours for the studio to wire everything up and get it set up. So we just sat in the control room with Billy Joel for three or four hours talking and talking and we got to really know him. He's such a down to earth, wonderful guy. We all laughed and he told stories and jokes. And so that was a really great day for us. We all bonded with Billy. And we did discuss the arrangements and how to go about doing, he had to record an Ellington classic, a Duke Ellington classic. And we helped him out with that and Bo played a beautiful solo on that. It's on the soundtrack of "League of Their Own." What a wonderful movie about women's baseball. Well, Tom Hanks and Madonna, that was really great. A fun day for us. - What other band leaders, what other band leaders? You mentioned Duke Ellington. What other band leaders did you guys ever have a chance to rub elbows with if you will? - Well, I traveled around the world with Stan Kenton Orchestra. I joined that orchestra in '72 and '73. I was on that band from '72 to '73 and we traveled, maybe we hit 40 states within the United States, it was a traveling band, on the marquee of the bus, it said nowhere. But we traveled around the United States. We played at a lot of festivals. We played at a lot of clinics. We went to Europe. There's a very famous jazz club in London, England called Ronnie Scott's. And we performed with the big orchestra, 19-piece orchestra. We performed there for two weeks. And that was, it's real. When you're on tour, it's like one night here, one night there, you could be in the state one day, and then you don't even know what state you're gonna be in the next day. And you just travel, get on that bus, and sometimes we go all night long until the next destination. But to be at a location for two weeks in London, that was a real pleasure. And we did a lot of other countries on that tour as well. So I've done a lot of traveling a month in the Soviet Union, on a State Department tour, the Bergen Festival in Norway. All kinds of interesting musical experiences. I will tell you this, Ken. What music has done for me and our family, it's opened up a lot of doors. There's just something special about playing music and interacting with people. And we are the kind of musicians that we are outgoing. We've played at thousands of weddings. Let me say that again. Not hundreds of weddings. We've played at thousands of weddings. Think of, from 1962 to the present day, we're still playing at weddings. And we have quite a few of them coming up later this year and into next year as well. So weddings were really the way that we were able to survive in corporate events and private parties. But not only did we play at these weddings, but these bride and groom's and their family members, at the end of the wedding, they became extended family members of ours. So just think of the math. In every place we've played, whether it's the Parker House or 26 years on Sunday branches at Skipjacks, all these brides and their family members would come in to see us with their newborn children. And it was just so wonderful to keep in contact with them. And it still happens to this day. It's the most gratifying feeling in the world to still keep in touch with people we've played for 30 or 40 years ago. I remember one day I was playing at a golf tournament. You talked about golf. I was playing at a golf tournament. There were eight gentlemen sitting around this table. In seven of them, I had played at their weddings. And the eighth one said, "Well, you played at my second wedding too." - Two. - So it was quite a thing, you know? I mean, I couldn't believe it. I just couldn't absolutely believe that, that I played all of their weddings. There are some people that say, "Well, you are an institution in this town." And my quick answer is, depending on what day of the week it is, Ken, I am either an institution or I belong in one. (laughs) - Wow, I think you're both an institution. As I said, I don't know two more people that are more loved and respected than you two guys. Now you guys played when I was, and you mentioned it earlier, lucky enough to be inducted into the Broadcasters Hall of Fame. We had a little celebration that day. Now you guys played at it, you were terrific. - Oh boy, we remember it like it was yesterday. - Oh, that was right in your backyard and there was a little tent and all kinds of wonderful people were there and we just played outside in the fresh air. That was a great day to celebrate with you. - Well, I know it was a great day, it was a good day all around us, to use an overworked phrase, a date which will live in infamy. - Yeah. (laughs) - All right, so just tell me, I'm sure you're loaded with stories. What other, I mean, are there any other celebrities for you guys that come to mind that you look back on and just say, "Wow, and we get paid for this?" - You know, I've got to tell you this story. I alluded to it earlier and it happened a long time ago, but I went on the State Department tour with Gunther Schuller and New England Conservatory Ragtime ensemble. We spent a month in the Soviet Union, six different cities. It happened in '78 and so we started off in Moscow and then we went to, as I said, six different cities, but we were in Tashkent in Southeast Asia and rumor had it that Mohammed Ali was staying in the same hotel that we were staying in. So most of us just about lost our minds. We couldn't believe that when we got to the hotel, we looked across the dining room and there was Mohammed sitting with his entourage, there must have been 40 people there. He had a whole group of people from boards. It turned out he was doing an exhibition fight in Moscow the following week, but he was in Tashkent and he was going to Samakan the following morning. He was going... Hello. He's in your eating? Go ahead. Go ahead. You've felt that you've cut out for a second. Oh, I don't know why. Oh, it says something. Okay, I don't know what happened. I don't know whether if I touched anything or not, but so we're in this hotel dining room and there's Mohammed Ali and where they are on the other side. And so after our meal was over, most of the members of the ragtime ensemble, we went downstairs where there was a bar downstairs. And so we're sitting there just talking and then about 20 minutes later, Mohammed Ali walks in by himself and there's one seat open right next to me. And so he sits down next to me. I almost jumped out of my skin at that point. And so he heard that we were a musical group from the States and so he was interested in us and he sat down with us. So I said to him, "Muhammad, would you tell us a few poems? "Would you recite a few of your poems?" So he started reciting the poems and then he started telling us about going to Harvard and speaking to the students and he just went on talking about some of his fights. And then he told us that when he was in Moscow, he had stopped in Moscow on the way before he got to Tashkent. And he said he walked across the Kremlin and out of nowhere, thousands of people, they just rushed everywhere with babies and everything and he was holding babies and he was engulfed. But I mean, he was at that particular time and he was the most famous athlete in the world. And so he said Robert Redford was the most famous actor at the time. He said if Robert Redford had walked across the Kremlin, probably nobody would have recognized him but Muhammad was an international figure and he was amazing. So I was, as I said, I was jumping out of my skin and Muhammad turned to me and he said, boy, there's just something very, very special about you. He said, I like your enthusiasm and I like your attitude. So Muhammad was getting up from the table and he was going to the elevator. And so I went with him and Muhammad said to me, you know, I am fighting this exhibition. I'm going on to Samai Khan and then I'm going to Novosibirsk. I'm stopping at two other states. But then in a week's time, I will be back in Moscow and I will be staying at the Rocia Hotel. And if you are back in Moscow at the same time, I want to take you as my guest to this fight. He's going to, it's not a real fight. He's just doing three rounds with three of Moscow's in the Soviet Union's best boxers. Muhammad is doing an exhibition. So I am at the Rocia Hotel and I drive over with Muhammad to the sports palace and I'm in his dressing room before the fight and after the fight is over, I was standing ringside with, you know, Muhammad's up there fighting the three different boxers. But he goes back into his dressing room and takes a shower and when he comes out, he says to me, I want you to give me your name and number. Again, he said, there's something special about you Bo and I want to keep in touch with you. So on a piece of paper, I didn't even have a business card. On a piece of paper, I wrote down Bo Winaker in my phone number. I can remember it like it was yesterday, 617-277-6673. And so a number of months later, the phone rings about six o'clock in the morning. I'm living with my brother at that time and Billions has a phone and he comes to my room and he's shaking me and he said, I have Muhammad Ali on the phone. And so I'm talking to Muhammad and he said, Bo, the first thing he said is, I don't forget my friends. And I remember you from our meeting in the Soviet Union. And so it was quite remarkable that that happened. And then one other time he was fighting an exhibition in Providence, Rhode Island. And he called again and said, please come down to see me. And I haven't forgotten you. And I mean, I can hardly believe that I've taken so many people's business cards over the years. And usually within a couple of hours, I've lost their card. I don't know how he would have remembered or how he would have kept my phone number to call me so many months later. To me, it's one of the most miraculous stories of my life. If I had ever run into Muhammad Ali in the United States with his entourage and bodyguards, there would have been no way that I could have gotten close to him. But I was sitting right next to him and he liked my enthusiasm and that's the end of that story, Ken. - I met him once. I was coming to work one night and I walked in the busy lobby and he was standing. I don't know why he was there, but he was standing there big as life. And I shook hands with him and he wanted to know who I was and what I was doing there. I never, my hand had never felt so small in my life as I did when I shook his. I mean, it was like, yeah, it was incredible. I just couldn't believe it. And I mean, the stories that we can tell because when I worked at busy, all the television stations had their own talk shows. And celebrities came in live. They didn't have the satellite connections and all that kind of stuff that they have today like we're doing. So when people wanted to promote something, they came to Boston and I would walk in and Vincent Price would be in the lobby or Red Skeleton or Jane Fonda. And one night I was leaving busy and I met this lady and she wanted to know what I did. And you know, all that stuff and where I was going. And I said to her, I said, you know, I should know who you are. I know the voice, but I can't place it. So to save me from staying awake till two in the morning, please tell me who you are. And she very calmly said, I'm Marlowe Thomas. - Oh. - So you never know who you're gonna run into. You know, I mean, I could just sit here and mention names, singers. What other famous singers or big band musicians can you guys talk about? - We could probably talk about any one of them. - Like a, I mean, like a Frank Sinatra or a Pericomo. - I've got a good Sinatra story for you. - Francis. - Would you like a good Sinatra story? - I would love a good Sinatra story. - All right, coming your way. So this was on one, another one of my tours to Europe and we were in London. And when I was there in '72, when I was there in '73 with the St. Canton Orchestra, the gentleman that promoted our European tour was based in London. And so I was on another tour. And so I called him when I was there and he said, by the way, if you're free, Frank Sinatra's performing at Royal Albert Hall, the next two nights. And it turned out that I had those two nights off. And so I got tickets, just one ticket each. I was in the second row for the first night and I was in the sound booth the second night. And so after, well, first, I should tell you that Sinatra was just unbelievable. The crowd, they rushed the stage. The women rushed the stage all night long, bringing big bouquets of flowers. At the end of the night, there must have been 30 or 40 bouquets of flowers on the stage. And Frank just had everybody in the palm of his hand. He sang incredibly well and the orchestra was amazing. So because of my credentials, I got right backstage just after the show finished the first night. And when I got backstage, I saw eight bodyguards surrounding Frank Sinatra, taking him out of the building and into a white Rolls Royce. And I didn't get to meet Frank, but I went into his dressing room and there were seven or eight turkey sandwiches that were left uneaten and I finished off most of them. - Wow. - So that's the story. What a thrill for me to hear him sing two nights in a row. The crowd, they absolutely adored him and rightfully so. So that's my Sinatra story and I'm sticking with it, Ken. - Yeah, I, when I was working at BZ, they had a contest for people to win tickets to a concert that Sinatra was going to perform at Boston Garden. And they had about 10 or 12 pair tickets left over. So they said, you know, you employees, the employees can register for a drawing and you'd be lucky enough to win tickets. Well, I had never won anything in my life, but I registered and I said, well, you know, maybe. And I won a pair of tickets and I went and saw Frank Sinatra at Boston Garden and he was magnificent. He was wonderful. It was great. It was just fabulous to see him perform. I saw, I saw Liberace. I don't know. Did you guys ever have any contact with him? - No, no, we. - No, he was a consummate performer and he dressed to the nines for sure. But no, we had no contact with him. But how were travel restrictions back in those days? Like to try to get to Russia, was it difficult? Did it take long? - You know, it was so interesting. On the State Department tour, I remember we couldn't disgrace us. I forget which city it was now 'cause I told you we went to six of them. But we arrived in this one city. We got to our hotel and some musicians showed up to greet us and they didn't even speak English at all. But I remember I took off with them and we went to this jazz club where this great Russian bass player was playing. His name was Tulk. And so, I mean, it was amazing. I couldn't even believe that here I was so far away from home and these musicians that we were communicating but I couldn't really speak their language. And so we went off and I heard this great bass player playing and we were hanging out. So the thing (indistinct) - We're watching this. - We're coming out again. - But I'm sure they were but I couldn't cut out. I don't know what's going on. Are we back? - Yep. - Okay, sorry. I don't know what is going on with our internet connection today. - It's the first thing. - Sure, it can happen. - Sorry about that. - Now tell me, you guys must have a bunch of CDs out. - We have a couple. You know, people can go to winnakermusic.com. Like Spinnaker, think of Winnaker. Winnakermusic.com and you can get some of our music online. You can also find out more about us. And then usually you can find out where we're performing but since we're not performing these days, there's nothing really up there to see. But we hope to be back sometime this year. Do you know Ken? - Do you still have a big 21 piece orchestra? - We don't really have it anymore. We've downsized over the years because of economics. We have much smaller ensembles now, Ken. I suppose if someone were looking for us to recreate that sound again when you could do it, but most of our performances are smaller. - Has it been harder in the last few years to obtain bookings than it was when you first started? - That's a great question. I'm gonna defer to Bill on that. - Yeah, I think that as the years go by, it's definitely harder because we're competing against disjockeys and, you know, so all the live bands, you know, half the work at weddings now goes to disjockeys and half of it goes to live bands and there are so many bands. So there's a lot of competitions. So it is definitely harder to get work, but we've been around for so long that we have a lot of people that just remember us from different weddings and parties over the years. So I mean, we get calls for weddings that people heard us at 20 years ago and 25 years ago and we do second generation weddings. A lot of the parents, when their children's get married you know, they recommend us and they'll come and meet us and we play a lot of those weddings too and it becomes a family tradition. - You know, Ken, it's interesting because I've always thought of Boston as a big piece of pie and, you know, all we've ever really wanted was just a few slices of the pie. We just wanna have enough so that we can keep performing and keep our musicians going. And you know, something for most of the years, I mean, I hate, I mean, it's quite amazing, but next year it'll be our 60th anniversary of performing together. I mean, that seems like several lifetimes really. It's been such a long time. And the most amazing thing is I would say we love it more now because maybe, you know, we're rounding the bend and maybe we're, you know, who knows how much longer we'll be doing it probably as a musician. I don't think any musician ever stops performing. I think musicians, they keep going right to the end. I know my father did. And we still love it. And we're grateful for every performance. What I wanna tell you also on the same line of conversation is I've always felt that we're only as good as our last performance. We could have played thousands and thousands of successful events, but the only one that really matters is the next one. All right, here's another question. What, if you've gone to see live performances of other bands, and I have, I saw the Glenn Miller Orchestra under the direction of Buddy Defranco. Oh yeah. The one that I will always, always remember is going to see Lawrence Welk. If you guys have to pick somebody that you enjoyed seeing, who would it be? Well, there's so many on us to goodness. I'm gonna pick one and Bill's gonna pick one. When I was 10 years of age, my mother and father took me to the totem pole ballroom at Norm Biga Park with a Newton Marriott Hotel that is right now. I sat on the stage all night long, right under the belt of Maynard Ferguson. At the time, I thought was the greatest trumpet player that ever lived. I found out that there are others just as great and maybe even greater, but I sat there that night and then we went backstage. My mother and father and myself, Bill didn't make that one. He was busy that night, but what a thrill. And Maynard had a big blister on his lip that night but he, you would have never known it. So that was a thrill for me. I also wanna mention Buddy Rich. I saw Buddy Rich in his audition. - Yep, great drum. - And there was not a more ferocious, can we could spend the next two or three hours talking about him? Bill, do you wanna mention one or two? - Well, you know, we like so many styles of music. So over the years, but when I've caught some James Taylor concerts and love to see Carol King, I always love to hear the Count Basie band and lots of small jazz groups. You know, I always love to see Stan Getz and, you know, - Bill Evans and Molly Davis. - Bill Evans and Molly Davis. - Dizzy Gillespie and it's just so where our tastes are eclectic. There's just nothing like live music. And if it's good, I wanna see it. And it doesn't matter what the genre is. I just don't like, you know, like heavy metal. It's too loud on the ears, but there's just so many great concerts to see. And, you know, it's a thrill to see live music. It's just, it's a, you get a real high and it's real charge from it. - Well, I'll tell you, you guys, you guys are one of the best. I can remember a lot of times, you know, running into you and listening to you at the Parker house. I can remember when a fellow named Glick would know where you were playing and we'd call you there and you guys would play on the radio and you represent not only a great era of time and music, but a part of Boston and Massachusetts history. And I can't tell you how much I've enjoyed sitting here talking to guys that are two legends as far as Boston and everything is concerned. And I can't thank you enough for sharing your time. - Well, we can't thank you enough for inviting us on your show today. - All right, that will do it. Thank you again, gentlemen. That will do it for this edition of City Talk. - Thanks for listening to another great conversation with Ken Meyer and friends. You can contact Ken by email. He addresses KJ Meyer7@gmail.com. That's KJ M-E-Y-E-R7@gmail.com. Tune in next time for more conversation with Ken Meyer on City Talk. (upbeat music)