Whatcha Got
The Bear Season 1
- This has been the fastest year in my life there, Charlie. How's it been for you? We're almost to October now, which is crazy, right? - Yeah, it's pretty wild. I can't believe it's almost October. I think the end of this year is going to get here way faster. And I swear to God, time only flies more the older you get. - Yup, absolutely. It's crazy when you think as a kid, like if you're five or six. Okay, you've been around for, I can do a quick math, like 72 months. And so the summer is like three of those 72. So it feels like a huge portion of your life, but in reality for someone like ourselves who have been around for a little longer, it's just kind of like an insignificant stretch. But are you looking forward to anything at the end of the year or in the coming days, weeks? - No, I mean, I guess we could tell the podcast listeners I did get engaged recently. But you know, I'm sure most of the people I was in Disney that though, at least for now. But now for the rest of the year, don't have too much kind of really planned. I mean, I have two weeks of vacation to still use in my company 'cause my company gives me a lot actually 'cause I've been there for a decent amount of time. I get almost like a little over, I think four and a half, or maybe, yeah, just over four weeks. So I've only used like two of them so far. And I have two more. And I don't really have any trips coming up. Rowan does not again as many days off as I do. So part of me is just like, I might literally just take two weeks off to be at home in middle of October or something. I don't know, we're going to Chicago actually in October, almost had forgotten that. - Nice. - Because Rowan's parents are just in Chicago for a little bit 'cause her dad is covering somebody there, I think is how I understood it. So they got like the companies like providing them in like an apartment in Chicago. So we have an excuse to go to Chicago for just like a weekend. So we're doing that in October. But I still might just like take two weeks off in that period of time. I also, you have visited some point this year, so. - Yes, okay, come through, dude. The people are waiting. The people are waiting. They've heard the tale of Charlie Budd, but they need to put a face to a name. - Yeah, it's absolutely. And we'll definitely make that happen this fall. I guess it is like fall. My God, we were just talking about how fast this year is kind of going by. But fall is just started. And it is its own season. We saw how long summer is. - Come on, come on. - We did see how long summer is. So yeah, yeah, I mean, I'm excited for the fall. I actually really love fall weather, so. - It's my favorite time of the year, favorite kind of weather. Warm days so you can like run outside and do other things. - Yeah, it's like sweater weather. Like it's kind of getting cooler here. It's also been strangely really warm still. - Yeah, it's like it was solidly like 80 degrees on Saturday, maybe a little warmer than that. And yeah, I'm hoping that it kind of, and like we're almost in October and it's still thinking. - It's freezing outside, you know? - Global warming. - I was gonna say it if you weren't. (laughing) - Oh my gosh. - Yeah, dude, it's wonderful. - So I, yeah, I hope that then we get some nice like fall weather. Like October, I feel like, is that month like, October is like that month that you, everybody kind of like pictures like fall weather. Once you get into November, like I feel like the first half of November is like, I don't know, maybe it'll still be like that. But at least in New York, you know, November can get a little cold. - Yeah, yeah, what a month. It's so weird, 'cause yeah, November can be like warm in the beginning and then it's like, by the end, you're pretty much into winter. Like here we are, a little snow, Thanksgiving and then we're already on Christmas vibes. But in so funny, you say you have time off because I have literally like negative one days. - I just took everything in quick success. - Yeah, my company was very kind in letting me take an extra day that I do not have time for it. So I'm the opposite end of that problem. So I envy you right now, just being able to take some time and chill out. - Well, I mean, if you use them, then you've had some nice time. And I like just have just been working, you know, like that is like my last real like days off vacation, I think was like Florida. I mean, there's been a couple of days where I just like take one off days. But that's mostly just been to like travel for something. You know, it hasn't really been like an actual just like day off to like have a day off or anything. Like it's been to travel for like a weekend and then you come back Sunday night and you're back to work Monday. Like it's just, that's kind of been the case for me recently. I haven't had like a proper just like vacation since like May. Like I guess July 4th weekend was a vacation, but I didn't use any days off for it. - Yeah, I thought the same kind of you. - I just had it off, you know. - Yeah. - As long as you weren't using your days for like an electrician or a plumber to come because my parents used to do that and it would make me so sad. I was like, I become an adult. - Ooh, I had a plumber come today actually. But luckily 'cause I worked from home, I could just be here for it while I worked. But yeah, we have a little bit of a leaky pipe in the ceiling so they had to come and fix it. Hey. - Doubt. - So yeah, I had to do that. - Well, I mean, I am thankful that I don't have to take a day off to stick with the plumber and then my company allows me to be flexible and be able to work from home. That is a good thing. - Blessings. - That is definitely a good thing. - Blessings, man, blessings. And it's so funny that we're talking a lot about work and like time off, being in an intensive environment because. - You were just in Peru. Let's not, let's not gloss over it. - Okay, okay. - You know, before we jump and do it. - All right. I was, for those listening, Justin Peru, I took a week there. I wanted to definitely check out Machu Picchu, my sister and I went. Awesome, awesome time. So scenic. Top like meals of my life were consumed there. I will also say, if you were ever planning on going to Peru, like maybe spring for like the more expensive light that's a direct flight because we didn't exactly do that. And fun facts, fun stories. We had like three planes to get to Lima and our second plane got delayed, which prevented us from getting to our third plane. So we spent the night in the Miami airport and then we got out the next day, earliest we get out was 5 p.m. So we took that one to Lima, but we still needed to fly one more time for our fourth flight to Cusco. And then the earliest flight we'd get there was 5 a.m. So we spent the night again in an airport. So not super fun. Not super. Just like right at the beginning, you're so excited. And then you're just so tired. It broke me a little bit, but honestly, everything afterwards was so worth it. So great, great trip. Like I said, I see Machu Picchu. I went to Paracas, which is kind of like a little beach town. And then Huacacina, which is like kind of Mad Max territory. I don't know if you saw my IG story, but I definitely recreated the sand walking from Dune. So I was living my best life out there. - Yeah, good times, good times. - I love that. I actually did see that video. That was funny. I was like, I don't know if anybody's gonna know what I'm talking about, but the real ones will know. So I was like surprised that it was actually that there were sand dunes like that out in Peru. I guess it makes sort of, I guess, no. Is it like a desert? Is that what's there? - There was like a desert portion. - And there is like the Huacacina is literally like an oasis. So it's like all desert with the exception of this tiny town. So yeah, there are those stretches there. And then you have like the obviously tropical rainforest kind of deals and then just like foresty too. - Wow, that, I mean, honestly sounds pretty incredible. - Yeah, breathtaking views, breathtaking views. And great picks, great picks too. - Oh, I can imagine. I saw, you know, I was following the story a little bit, you know, there was some- - Okay, okay. - There was some excellent things to be had, for sure. - Yeah, no, totally. I would recommend it if you're ever thinking about coming to South America, then check it out. And also, if we have any listeners in South America, y'all got a great place out there. So keep doing what you're doing. Oh man, but yeah, I was, that was how I spent my time away from the office. It was a blessing. - Yeah. - Wish I had a little bit more, but- - Don't we all? - That's the fact of the ground. (laughing) - There's never enough time away from work. - No, no, I've never been like, man, I wish I could get back to work right now. - Nope. - Sorry. - I don't think those words could ever be spoken from my mouth. - Yeah. - Since nearly. (laughing) - It's like, I love this. I love being here. - Wow, I just spent three weeks in Peru. Can't wait to go back to work. - Exactly. - I've had my fill, I've had my fill of just, you know, tropical rainforests, great food, good people. Yeah, I need to get back to work. - Absolutely not. - Yeah, I can't wait to get, those spreadsheets won't spread. (laughing) - I'll kill you, I'll spread. - We'll spread themselves. (laughing) - Yeah, no, it's like cried a little bit on Monday. - Cried a little bit on Monday, but- - It's always tough coming back from a vacation, you know. - It's a tough one. - That's what I'm saying. But I mean, it's good. That means that you enjoyed yourself. You got a chance to go out there and do something new and exciting. So the grind has to continue, unfortunately. - Yes it does, yes it does. And using that as our segue to the grind, we changed it up a little bit. We were gonna talk about kinds of kindness, but ultimately decided to take a slight left. Just this actually kind of follows the Emmys and the, you know, not surprising kind of series of wins by The Bear. So we figured we'd go through season one of The Bear and with that, we're gonna get into it. What is going on, everyone? And welcome to the What You Got podcast where we talk topics, A to Z and everything in between, though mostly movies. I'm Jordan Palmer, joined as always by the Fantastic Charlie Bud. And today we're talking about season one of the critically acclaimed FX show The Bear. There is a lot about season one, a lot of content to get through. And with that, we're gonna kind of throw up the spoiler alert right off the bat and dive into it. We're going to keep it broad and then kind of go into more detail gradually to begin. So Charlie, I gotta know. How familiar were you with the restaurant industry before watching this show? Take us off there, my friend, What You Got. - Oh. I would have to think close to nothing. What I did know was that it was demanding work that it was described as hell, that it's also the margins are so thin at the pace, not great. And that it was really other than, yeah, we're really demanding that people kind of treat restaurant workers, service workers kind of like poorly when they shouldn't because they have much, much more difficult jobs than you sitting in the cubicle at your investment bank. Much, much more difficult job. A thankless job, I think. - Truly. - But man, the bear was eye-opening, especially when I started hearing that how accurate it was to some of these maybe top kitchens or maybe just kitchens in general. And I don't know if I could ever work in an environment that stressful. I don't know about you, Palmer, but did you have any idea of the restaurant culture? Find the question right back at you. - Yeah, no, I appreciate each other. I had no idea. And it's funny because I guess there's this one episode where everybody gets in to start kind of preparing the food and whatnot. And it's like pretty early in the morning. And me being naive in my head, I was like, oh, I thought they just got there like an hour before and kind of just prep. But no, they have to get there. Like it's like a night on the nineties. - Yeah, they have to like prep for like dinner. Like sometimes, you know, some of these dishes could take like six, seven hours and funny enough, John Oliver just did a piece on school lunch and how like those were like, you know, they basically behave like restaurants because they have to serve like 1,200 kids, you know, - That's true. - Sometimes more. Like my school, I don't know how they did it. Watch after watching that piece and like watching the bear and like relating it to it because my school was like 1,800 students or something like that. - Wow, what the heck. - And lunch was all at one time, junior and senior year. Like it was just one lunch at once. Now granted not everybody buys lunch, but you have to kind of expect everyone to buy lunch because that could happen, you know. - Jeez, and freaking crackers. That's crazy, bro. Oh my God, yeah. So wait, you all like freshmen, sophomores, junior, senior, senior. - Yeah, everyone. It wasn't like that our freshman and sophomore year when I was there. But that was because we used to have like period scheduling and then they swapped to a block. And when they swapped a block scheduling, lunch was just one block that everyone had at the same time. They were like, we had a like cafeteria, commons is what they called it, that where we all would usually sit for lunch, if freshman and sophomore year. But because lunch was everybody in school at the same time, they had to prop up tables all throughout the hallways of our high school to seat everybody. I used to eat lunch junior and senior year at a table near the gym. (laughing) - You were the gym guy. - You were by the gym. Like the auditorium, really. Like I don't know, like not like our like weight room, but like the like, you know, like the basketball court, like the indoor basketball court. That's where we would eat lunch, so. - Oh my gosh. Honestly, the tracks, I remember you said that you were the kind of a basketballer back in the high school days, you're the gang. I was going to ask, like honestly, it's funny. Like science class and lunch, where we're all the comedians like emerged or all the like funny kids. And because like ours was a period kind of thing. So you were either in the first, second, third or fourth. And so I, you missed out on like half the class, but even everybody there at the same time, I'm sure you had some legendary lunches behind that. - Oh, absolutely. Lunch was my favorite part of the day. I mean, like it was an hour long. And like, I think it might have been a little longer than that actually, like. 'Cause it was block scheduling. Every class was like an hour and a half. So I think lunch was also sort of that long, which was fun because you could sit with all your friends. - Yes. - And you know, and just have the most ridiculous lunch conversation. I don't remember them really, but I just kind of remember how I felt during these times. - Exactly. - Some people that I used to hang out with in high school were some of the funniest people I've ever met. And absolutely ridiculous goofs. So yeah, lunch was really entertaining. That's all I gotta say. - On Instagram, there was this thing. It said the only Bible verse that got me through school and it was lunch 11.35. (laughing) I was like, I felt that though. 'Cause some days you're just fighting to get there. Oh my gosh, but yeah, no. So high, you know, I guess I didn't appreciate that, but it is true. The pace at which you have to work in a school lunch definitely resembles that of a fancy restaurant. So that's, I mean, great perspective to have. And pretty early on in the series, obviously, we're following mainly Karmie, who is played by Jeremy Allen White. You get kind of a taste for his background. He's someone who comes from humble beginnings who has trained up at some of the finest eating establishments and is pretty well renowned for his skill. And he finds himself returning home to Chicago to take over the beef his brother's restaurant and his brother played by John Bernthal, I guess more or less recently had unfortunately committed suicide there. So what did you think of Karmie right off the bat? 'Cause they kind of give you historian pieces, but did you understand from the beginning that he was someone who had like a lot of skill or did you need that to be proven? - I think it was implied. I think I kind of, well, I actually didn't really know what the premise, I mean, I sort of knew a little bit of the premise of the show going into it. So I think I kind of inferred that he was like a really good like chef. And also, I think it was pretty soon into the first episode when Sid comes up to him and says like, he's reading through her resume 'cause he's like trying to hire somebody. He's like, yeah, what are you doing here? He's like, I could ask you the same thing. You are the best CDC, you work that like Noma, which is one of the top restaurants in the world and all that stuff. So you kind of just know that he is next level. I don't really know much about the culinary world, but you all you got to really say is like those two lines that he's just like one of the most talented people in this field and he's just like here. And like you kind of, I think you've learned also pretty quickly that he's taking over Mikey's shop because his brother died, right? So it's kind of like a whirlwind and it sets up immediately like this really interesting premise of a guy who is way better than the beef. In like a lot of different ways. And his skills are like, he's way overqualified basically. And he's just going there for like whatever reason. And also you juxtapose that against like almost like a tragic character in a way. Like, you know, and that becomes more apparent as you learn more about Karmian, his family and that relationship, so. - Absolutely, absolutely. And I was going to say, I mean, just first off, Sydney's introduction, I think came, it was so innocuous at the beginning, which are like, oh, I think this is going to be the start of something great there. But in terms of just taking over his family, his restaurant, Mikey's restaurant, you know, he has the skill and this is somebody who is clearly on a trajectory to great things. And yet that his heart, his feelings, you know, the sadness and creep that he has to overcome have pulled him back home to do this. I wanted to understand, I guess, from your perspective, when it comes to just someone who is attached or grieving, I should say, I guess, to something that's screaming for, something that's gone. Like, do you think it warrants possibly putting your life on hold? Do you think there's a place for that? Or do you think he should have just kind of done that, not to say on the side, but continued on his trajectory and then just kind of grieving his own way? 'Cause that's honestly him taking it over is, seems to be his form of grieving. - Yeah, I think in a way, it's like grieving, maybe like a coping process, but also at the same time, like we learn that Karmy basically did what he did and like became one of the best in the world at like, you know, like a chef, because his brother wouldn't let him work at the restaurant. - Yeah. - And so like, I think, and he, I think he wanted to, that was the only thing that he wanted to do was to work with his brother. And like, he clearly loved his brother in a way. And I think he wanted to make, he wants to go back to make the beef into something. He would have been proud of and probably what his brother would have been proud of, because I think one of the dynamics I was kind of gleaned from them and like the flashbacks between Mikey and Karmy is that his brother doesn't really, like his brother's really proud of him, but doesn't really like maybe show it. I don't know, like he kind of seems to hide it. And there's like a scene, I remember, I think it's in the season two, but he like Karmy like shows him, I forget what it was, like maybe like an idea for a restaurant that he wanted to open up with Mikey and Mikey, I don't think he was a little bit, maybe like reluctant with it, but when Karmy walked away, he like starts crying. - Mm-hmm. Yeah, dude, I freaking, I just loved Jon Bernthal. So like, you know, I'm gonna love him in that. But just like the subtlety, because you honestly don't see the character of Michael for the, you just hear about him, you get him in like the quickest of like flashbacks. I think he was in like season one, maybe once or twice, season two, same kind of deal, and same kind of deal with season three. So keeping it to this season, it's like you're only hearing about the character, you aren't really seeing him. So I think that was impressive from the writing perspective that they were able to really just kind of concoct this individual who you knew, but you didn't exactly knew. And by virtue of Michael being there, it kind of introduces the character Richie, who they call cousin. It's just basically like his best friend. - Yeah. - Who also happens to work at the beef. And he's a little bit rough around the edges. Give me your first impression of Richie there. - Definitely like, he just seems like kind of a no nonsense type of dude and wants to keep everything kind of as like the same. Like he's just like, we're not doing this, we're not doing that. Like he loves the grossness of the beef. He doesn't like change and he doesn't really seem to care. Like, 'cause I think interestingly enough, I think the bear where it really succeeds is its characters. And like, you know, what we learned about Richie is that like, you know, the family life isn't, the at-home life isn't great. Like his wife wants to divorce him is kind of, they're kind of like separated, but I don't think they're like divorced when we first meet them. They like, they have a daughter together. And, you know, I think he doesn't feel like he has purpose. So like the beef is like only a real purpose in life. Or at least that's what he kind of thinks of himself. And like he doesn't like that. It's like, and it's also what he had with his best friend, Michael, excuse me. So like when Michael passes, it's like he doesn't want anything to change because I think that also like affects the last thing he really kind of has. And, you know, when he's also going through a really hard time with like his family, Michael's passing. And so like he just seems to be like, you know, the beef is everything to him. And he's hyper aggressive about keeping it that way. - Yes. - So he's really rough and in your face. - Yeah. And I love it. It's like, if you need something to get done, like even if it's a little bit more questionable and like what you do to do it, like he'll do it. He'll do whatever he has to do. 'Cause him and like Michael, like they were like, only scheming to come up with like, I think it was mostly like Mikey, but Richie always went along with it too. - Yup. Exactly. Exactly. And I just, apparently like in real life, everybody just refers to him as cousin and he's like, please, please, your God stop doing that. Like I can't anymore. But I just love it like the dynamic that they have on and by that, I mean, both Michael and Carmi as well because everybody dresses him as cousin. They basically treat him as family. Like, you go on to see subsequent seasons, flashbacks where he's literally there at family gatherings. And it also increases that tension because they are more or less brothers and they will just yell at each other all the time and like they don't care. And it's kind of interesting when Carmi comes in because Michael actually left the restaurant to him and not to Richie, so that again creates tension because Richie's kind of basically trying to keep it going one way and Carmi's trying to introduce his own, like, I guess. - System and like doing it like a professional kitchen at like Noma and even like pretty sure Richie Moxham is like, well, this isn't, you know, African Noma, you know, this is the beef in Chicago. Like, yo. - Oh man, I didn't teach you at, you know, wherever you went, like school. (laughing) - It's, dude, I like know like 30 Richie's in real life. Like, those are the guys. I was like, hey, look, look who it is. Hollywood coming in here and everything. But, and it's crazy too, because obviously they have a staff that's already on hand and everybody kind of starts hazing Carmi as he gets in there. It's just like, oh, they're like kind of busting. - Yeah, no one respects him either. Like Tina or T doesn't respect him. Like she like almost like hates him. It calls him Jeff, almost kind of like. - Yes, yeah. - I think the only person who like respects him is Sydney 'cause like she's kind of on board with the plan that, you know, Carmi has. And Marcus, I think also has a little respect for him. - Yes, Marcus. - Although I think he does play a little bit of a role in like the early hazing. - I would agree with, yeah. - Yeah, yeah. I mean, it just, this show more than most of the ones I've seen in recent years, I think perfectly captures A, the stress of just being in a kitchen and that environment, but also just the, the like interconnectedness between the characters and that tension there. Because they perfectly play it. I just see like even small things like, oh, we got an issue with the plumbing and we can't afford it or seems like the lights are and like we need to pay $5,000 and then we're gonna, how are we gonna get the money? - Yeah. - And you come to find out that, you know, Richie, to get through COVID, it's one of the things that they had to do is kind of start dealing some cocaine. And so like again, I told you Richie's the guy. And so Richie had to step up and do that. - It's always, it's always places like that. It's always like your local dominoes sells the weed, your local sandwich shop sells the cocaine, okay? - Yeah, it's like-- - It's just the way the world works. - I don't know what it is. Yeah, they go hand in hand. It's just, you know, it's beautiful. It's like being up butter and jelly with beef and cocaine. There you go. But it's, I mean, it's, again, it creates this level of tension. And I try to put my finger on it. I try to explain like what it is that makes this show so much more successful than others. And I truly could not tell you. I mean, I do know, but I also kind of don't know how to verbalize it. Any thoughts on that? Like, what do you think-- - Yeah, I think-- - People are so enamored by this. I think it's a combination of a lot of things that really makes this show stand out as like just one of the best shows on television right now. So like, what I think it is is like, A, you have a really good writing. It's very well written. The show has excellent characters. Pretty much all of them are really deep, unique. They have backstories. They have lives outside of the restaurant. And like the show does a pretty good job of kind of exploring a lot of these characters, especially season three, almost to a fault, I'd say. And 'cause you definitely could go one way too far. And I think, you know, not talking season three, this episode, but, you know, just a tease it a little bit. But I do think season three leans a little too much into character stories and one little like one off stories, a little too, too much. But regardless of that, the show does a very, very good job of fleshing out its characters. It's well acted. Everybody in this show does a phenomenal job. The dialogue is written so naturally and it's not even like, moving on from the writing, the way that the show is shot as well. It's a lot of like these close up shots, medium shots, quick edits to make you, you know, feel like you're in the kitchen. Feel the chaos, feel the tension. And the premise is just so fascinating. It's like hard to not look away. Like people love shows where, you know, you have someone extremely talented trying to like turn a ragtag bunch of people around into becoming like a top restaurant, which is like almost unbelievable. But because we get to see these people's like, you know, their character development from season one, all the way to season three and like kind of had their mood and how it shifts from, you know, like disrespecting Karmy to respecting him, to wanting to succeed, to wanting and to, you know, buying into the vision. It's just like, it has done in such a phenomenal way that I think makes the show so, so good. - Okay. Oh, good verbalization there. Good verbalization. And like you said, honestly, when it comes to just the pure actors, I feel like everybody perfectly embodies their character. Like a hundred percent. Even just the, what do they fact? Like the two brothers who are working there kind of like late and later seasons, but also the start of season one. It's just like their chaos and they're so funny too, because they have clearly no idea what's going on, but they again want the restaurant to succeed. So it comes from an honest place. So I just, I love that part of it too. And yeah, we'll have some thoughts on season three, probably on a later episode there. - But you mentioned Sydney early on. And I think honestly, I'll say for me, I feel like she's more or less the heart of the show. Like she knows where the north star is. And she tries to reign Karmie in, even when he kind of goes off the rails. But like early on, he hires her. And just like him, she's undergoing hazing and nobody seems to like her or respect her. But one point that Karmie made to just everybody and Sid obviously like follows it is to refer to them as chef. He says it's like a sign of respect. What did that mean? I remember during New Year's of what was it like 22 to 23? I was saying chef, but it wasn't for the show, but just because like cooking shows and we were cooking. And then you picked up one. And so I guess what does chef, what does that mean to you in the context of the show? But now also what does chef mean to you outside of that as well? - I'm gonna say it's probably the same for both in and out of the show. For in the show, it's a sign of respect for their industry, for like the culture of working in kitchens like that. But like outside of the show, I use it as a sign of respect now just because it has like that like metaphoric kind of meaning if like you're kind of in the know on like what that reference is. Because you know, I haven't really heard of that before, unless maybe, you know, if you're constantly watching, you know, cooking shows or things like on the food network, but you know, mad respect, love that. I had a friend or have a friend who is, you know, super into that stuff, loves the food. He probably knows about like, you know, the yes chef. Thank you, chef references, you know, way before the bear made it incredibly popular. But because the show has become popular, you know, when I use it, eh, definitely, you know, for the respect that I give to that person, oh. - Yeah, okay, I love that, I love that, I love that. And gradually, I would say that Sydney and Carm, you're able to win over the kitchen. And there's honestly like a pretty fun cast of characters who work behind the scenes there. You have Marcus, you have Neil Fack, you have also, and I will just say sugar, who kind of works there in season one. - Yeah, she's not. - She, her character definitely steps up in season two, I would say more. Like, I remember when I read and watched season one, I wanna say like back in like May or June or whatever. I remember that her character was not like, I realized like, oh, her character's not that involved in season one. Not to mention that she's like basically pregnant for the entire Lee of this show, which is hilarious because that just shows you that this show's only been taking place over the course of like a couple of months. - True, true, true, you need that. It's like kind of your natural. She's probably sick and tired as an actress, like, oh, put the belly in me. All right, let's go, let's get this done. - I know. - But no, so yeah, she comes, I guess a little bit later, but you definitely have Tina who's working there, Abraham, and then Sweeps as well. Then these are all, I mean, it's just like, do you have a favorite like outside of Sydney and Karmy who worked there? - I really like Cousin and I really like Marcus. I feel like I haven't finished season three of the Marriott. We're almost done with it, but I feel like Marcus didn't have as much screen time on me. Oh, maybe that changes a little bit. But what I really love about, I mean, he was great in season two and I loved his arc in season two. And I just love the whole cast. Like, what an ensemble that this is. - Truly. - It is like, they are all just so good to go. I can see why like, pretty much everyone on this cast is getting nominated for acting nods. They all just work so well with each other. It's honestly incredible. - Yeah, it truly feels like kind of like what happened in the, like was real. Like, just like I was gonna say, I think that so the actress for Tina, Liza Cole and Zeyas, I think she just won an Emmy for that performance. And I give it to her because season one, Tina, is on my list. I was like, she sucks. She's so mean for no reason. They're playing jokes on people, hiding Karmy's knife randomly and then just like waiting to get his reaction. And you can tell like Karmy is under a considerable amount of stress in the season. He is stepping into the role. He's not respected. He's trying to figure out how they're going to get out of debt. It appears also that he finds out his brother was like $300,000 in debt to their uncle. So he doesn't know what to do about that. And it's just everything is going wrong. And I respect Tina and the acting performance of that because she just kind of adds to it. But I love just, I think of the people working behind the scenes, like the staff. She probably for me at least has the top like character arc and character growth. I would definitely put Marcus up there as well. Like he's pretty consistent. - Her season two growth is actually really good. Like I actually really like her character by the end of season two. And was, were the Emmys for season two? Like the show or were they three? - I don't know if it was, I couldn't tell you. - Sounds like-- - I feel like the Bears are like a weird spot where it's either at the very end of the awards show year or the very beginning. - Exactly. So I was like trying to figure that one. I mean either way, like she did had a, there was a great episode in season three with her. But yeah, no, I'm not sure if it was for the season two or season three portrayals. - Mm hmm. Okay. Yeah, I'm gonna just quickly look it up. - For the listeners, for the listeners. - Hello listeners. Also need to take a quick break because someone's about to be at my door. So we'll be back in literally in a second. - A second. And thinking about season one again. So I guess gradually Karmie realizes that, you know, things aren't great at the beef. But he starts to, as he said, implement some kind of protocols to get it to be something more closely resembling a fine dining establishment. From your perspective, do you think that was a good call? Do you think he should have just maybe tried to kind of find a better way to do what they were already doing? Just because it seemed like such a swing to the other way for basically everybody was working there. Um, yeah, it is interesting to me. So like, when you kind of think about it, it's wild that that's the direction you kind of like takes the restaurant on it. However, I think it was a gradual rise towards that because all he initially was there to do was turn the beef around from like being just like this sloppy, you know, kind of gross sandwich place and turning it into like a reputable establishment. And when he was trying to implement all these new systems, changing the menu a little bit around, he was getting a lot of friction from like, you know, Tina, Richie, other people there. And, you know, slowly winning over a couple of other individuals like Marcus. And when he realized that that just wasn't going to work, you know, like all these systems were going to work. And I think there was like a breaking point with like the takeout order stuff. I think he just decided like, I don't know how, I kind of forget, I almost kind of wish I'd like re-washed it briefly. But like at the very end of the season, they just decide, you know what, screw it, we're going to close this down and build something new. And I don't really know how everybody kind of agreed with that. Do you like? - Recall. - Do you recall? - I remember that basically the idea of the bear had, I mean, I think the show opens up with Kermit approaching a bear in a cage on like a bridge. - Yeah. - Super random. So, you know what's like there? You know, like out of the show was called the bear, but he's actually talking to Claire, 'cause she's a female blast from the past who kind of had a thing for him, he kind of had a thing for her and never really ended up materializing. And she said that she remembered that, you know, if he ever started a restaurant, what he would have called it. And she was like, you said you would have called it the bear. And so I think that kind of starts the wheels going. Ultimately, what we come to find out is that after taking out this $300,000 loan from his uncle, Michael oddly enough decided to seal away all of the money into these small tomato sauces and just leave them in the restaurant. So basically things are reaching ahead for carmy, stress, everything. As you said, he basically created, or Sydney had decided to implement this mobile order system. And she didn't realize she had to turn off the pre-orders. So they go in, they turn it on, and they're just inundated with orders. And that was probably one of the single most stressful episodes of a television show. - It was all shot in one take. - Are you serious? - It was a one shot show, you gotta re-watch it. Just like notice it when the camera cuts it never does, it's all one shot. - I literally was, it stresses me out so much I was like, I can never watch this again. So all right, I'll go back and I will, you know, I'll subject myself to that. But, so all that's going down, basically, things are like really, and carmy's that is like lowest, but he realizes like, hey, like I can maybe do something. And he sees, he's gonna just kind of throw in the towel. He sees the recipe from Michael and it's like, use the small cans and tomato first, like they're better. And he goes, finds the money. And I guess he just puts two and two together that his brother was ultimately going to try and do this thing, like do something that was better than the beef. And that's kind of what gave him the strength. I think he clears it with his uncle and then sugar starts kind of coming into the picture a little bit more. But he tells everybody like, hey, like this is kind of dead, like Michael is gone, this is his thing, and we're gonna go in this new direction. And by that point in time, he'd gotten enough buy-in from the staff, they were referring to him as chef, that finally they were just like, all right, we're gonna jump into the unknown with you. And it literally, the season ends with just like the beef's closed, the bear is coming like outside of the window there. - Yeah, I remember. And what's crazy is like, yeah, everybody did kind of like start getting on board with it. And in addition to that, I think when you go into the second season, which we won't talk about too much, but like, you know, I think that's when Richie is like, well, what is my purpose? Because this is affecting like how, you know, the beef was his life and that's gone away, so. - Again, great, great character arc for that, great character arc for that. But I was gonna say, so there's basically a lot of head-butting or heads-butting in season one, you have obviously Richie and Karmy, you have Sid and Karmy, you have Sid and Tina. - Sid and Richie. - You said, who was that? - Sydney and Richie. - Oh, yeah, let's talk about that one for a second. Okay, so a lot kind of goes down between them in season one. Did any particular moment stand out as like the, like, oh wow, they went way too far on that? - I feel like they're a lot of moments, maybe like the, the stab, I mean, like, not that she did it on purpose, but like, things got really heated, you know? They were like shouting at each other during that moment. Like, it was unbelievable how like crazy it was getting, it was during like that takeout order episode, right? And like, and they were just like, that's when she like quits too. As at the end of that episode, and like, she and Richie were going at it. And I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that like, she is kind of on Karmy's side, and Richie doesn't like what Karmy was doing, but Richie knows Karmy, doesn't know Sydney. So like, she's coming in here, you know, messing up what, as we've already talked about, like basically his, his temple. And that we watched it. Yeah, just get completely like flipped upside down and changed. And you have that, like you said, some new girl, some rando coming in. There was also this moment when she said like, you're worthless, she said you're worthless. She said something to him, and it was like. - Yeah, like what, like what are you doing here? Like, you know, she was like really leaning into him. Like, I think even like brought out some of the family stuff. I guess. - Yes. Yes. - It was. - She cut deep, you know? - I was like, oh, I was like, whoa. - Hold her back. - Hold her back. - Hold her back. Hold her back. - Holly. - That was, that was it for me. Because she said, and you could tell, like, I mean, respect to the acting performance there, but he was shook. Like, he felt that because that was kind of a blow. You don't, you don't dish. Like, you can't come back from that. And she did it, she did it. And then ultimately ended up like quitting. So, that's so awkward. So awkward. But, no, during that kind of time, when Karmie's having his come to Jesus moment, figuring out what's gonna happen with the beef, basically, Sydney had been studying under him, been learning, but she hadn't been getting a lot of like, feedback, hadn't been getting a lot of, you know, praise, not that she was looking for her, but she just wanted basically to feel like she was valued. And she created this risotto dish that he didn't even try. And she ended up just giving to a customer randomly for me. And that person was like a critic, and they gave them a good review on that. And so, after her blow up with Richie and with Karmie and her departure, Karmie realizes what's going on. And he reaches out to her and he actually gives her some feedback for the risotto dish. So, she comes back and they welcome her with open arms. And I was scared because I thought that, you know, maybe not everybody would do that, but everybody kind of seeing more or less on board and she and Richie were obviously able to patch things. If you were to describe season one, and then I guess just that the relationship between the characters, do you think overall it was more contentious or it was more kind of kumbaya? - Definitely contentious, I think. It wasn't terribly kumbaya. I mean, I feel like tensions were high across the board, you know, like even with people on the same team. (laughs) - Yeah, it was, it's a mad house in there. And I think that's kind of really of what highlights this industry is that like, even when going into season two, when they are all kind of on the same page, tensions are still really high because these are high stress environments. And I don't really think it's kind of a good matter of like them, like maybe disliking each other. I think it's just a matter of the environment that they've kind of put themselves in. - True. - You know, it takes a certain type of person to work in an industry like that. And these characters are all those types of people. - Fair, fair. And it's also interesting too, when you take a step back and think about, because I was just obviously reviewing before we did this, all that happened in season one, and obviously there's a lot that goes on, but more or less it's not like anything too crazy. It's not like, you know, people are constantly dying. It's like a game of thrones where they have a battle or somebody betrays somebody. It's just like, we're in a restaurant. This episode like, oh, you know, things were a little bit harder that day and we just created a new dish or like, oh, we just looked at Carmen's backstory and then just kind of brought it to the present. Like it's not like too, too crazy in terms of the plot. Like it doesn't just jump around, but at the same time, I mean, it's clearly a character driven story and they just knocks that in the park season one. - Yeah. - Do you think that like it had like the, the stakes were high for season one? Like you think if they had just kind of an alright season they would have been renewed? Or do you think that they were kind of, not as like, guaranteed, but? - Like stakes for like the show. - I mean, like it's just a cooking show. Yeah, it's just a show about cooking. Like it could have gone completely sideways. - Yeah, I think like, I think that is definitely, it could have gone anywhere. And I think, I think FX like probably thought, you know, maybe this might not be a show people would initially get into, but were confident in the product. And that is like, all we got to do is get one person to watch it because if they do, then they're gonna be hooked. And then they'll tell their friends. And I think that's exactly kind of what happened. So I don't think maybe, I don't know, I'm not on the, I feel like it was probably a pretty safe bet from them. I'm glad the show was made. Thought season one was really good. And I heard it from a friend, it was, I'm pretty sure it was like my buddy Nick. And he just kind of was like- - It's blue too. - You should watch the bear. And I didn't know much anything about it. And he didn't really tell me. I just thought it was like something about like a chef coming back to, you know, reclaim his brother, like take over his brother's restaurant. I'm like, it could be interesting. I saw it was a comedy. And I was like, okay, maybe that could just be like a fun little show. I wasn't sure. I didn't realize how good it was going to be and how much of that it's more of like a dramedy than a straight up like, I thought it was going to be like a sitcom. Like I literally thought it was going to be like that. Maybe a sitcom, but like a little bit like leaned heavier into the comedy rather than the drama with comedy, you know? - Totally. And you were actually the person who recommended it to me. So I appreciate you. You and Bron were like, you got to check out the bear. - It was like, it was very good. Yeah, I mean, it doesn't, like when you see comedy and then the premise of the show, you're like, how good could this be? Like genuinely, I thought the same thing. And then you washed and you're like, okay, now I get it. - Oh, I see, I see, it is interesting though, because when you think about like the Emmys specifically, they like lump like comedy and musical into like one category and that like drama. And like, yes, the bear is, I guess could be considered a comedy, but I feel like it's more like kind of a drama. How do you feel about that? Just kind of like as a whole thing that should create some new categories. - Yeah, I think it's like a weird line that the Emmys always try to blur a little bit to kind of like give shows like the bear, you know? Better, I don't know, it's weird because I don't, yeah, I wouldn't consider the bear a comedy. I don't consider it a comedy. I guess it's like, I consider it a dramedy. Like it's certainly, it has a lot of dramatic moments. These characters are going like, you know, facing really tough things, really interesting and broken relationships and like really deep and rich character development. That just happens to have like some comedic moments in that like, almost like it's funny because it's just like, I don't know what to do other than laugh kind of thing, you know? - Yes. - It's just like, I don't consider it a comedy. It's a stress, I don't know, is that a genre? It's a stress show. Like it's a show that just gives you anxiety. - So yeah, what's the genre, a stress? Oh, okay, I could go. I tried to show my mom the first episode and she was in for like the first five minutes. Like, I'm sorry, I can't like concentrate right now. I was like, oh, okay, cool. - Cool, cool. - It's a really good show. It's a really good show, it's a really good show, but cool. - It's excellent, it's excellent show. - Yeah, exactly. - It's like probably the top like three best shows on TV right now. - Okay, I would agree, I would agree. - Maybe top five. - Definitely one of the tops out of FX, although I've heard Sons of Anarchy is also like-- - I've heard very good things about Sons of Anarchy. I've had a few friends love that show. I've not yet given it a watch, but-- - Me neither, I've heard. - It's on my list. It's on my list. Yeah, I'm just like thinking like, what's really good right now and like, I will look forward to any season of the bear. - Yes. - Yeah. - And finish season three and we'll-- - Yeah, I need to finish season three. It's just mostly because Ronald's been really into the boys, so we finally finished that. - Yeah, buddy. - We're also like bit of on a sci-fi kick, but we're kind of finishing up all of our science fiction. Like, I think we've finished up foundation. Season two, so we're waiting for season three. We were clearly waiting for Silo and Severance. Oh my God, these are all Apple TV shows I'm realizing. And-- - You guys in your Apple TV? - Yeah, and then like our guilty pleasure show, which is Only Murders in the Building, is on right now. So, oh. - Wait, do they start the new season? - Yeah, we started the new season. We haven't watched the people that came out yesterday, but we've, we're caught up other than the one from yesterday. - How many do they have? I haven't, I didn't realize that it was out now. - I think it's like four or five episodes, so. - Really? Okay, I might just have to wait then till like, you know, like finish it. - I love it at this time of year, 'cause it kind of gives me like the spooky season vibes. So, I watched season one in like September last year, and I was like, "Oh, perfect, perfect." - So, after I think, we'll probably finish up the bear this weekend, then I don't know what show we're gonna watch, to be honest, because like, I feel like there isn't too much coming out. Oh, well, there's some limited TV series that like we're into, or that I'm really looking forward to, although I watched the trailer, and I'm like, "I have no idea what's going on." It's called "Disclaimer" on Apple TV. - Again, Apple TV. - Well, I'm telling you, dude, Apple TV is the new HBO. You definitely, I've said this before. I've said this before. It is where the best television is right now. It's on Apple TV. - My, so when it comes to my family, I pay for our Disney, I pay for our Max, I pay for Spotify. - Oh, my. - My father pays for, what does he do? - But anyways, before we get to off the rails, is there anything else that you wanna talk about for the bear before we end this whole, the whole episode here? - I would say overall, season one, freaking fantastic. Honestly, only to be eclipsed by season two in my opinion, so. - Yeah, season two truly might be one of the best seasons of television, just like, yeah. - I just remember that is insane praise. I got that, but like, it is so unbelievably good. - Yup, yup, I would watch every episode. Like, I would make it like an event. I would be like, "I can't watch next." Like, I'd be like, "Wait, you gotta see me these," because it was so good, so good. So, honestly, if you're just starting out with the bear, enjoy, seriously. If you're not, and you're accustomed to the characters, then you're already in the process of enjoying. And now that I've reviewed season one, I gotta go back and watch it again. But, overall, just one of the top, as you said, shows out currently, and I'm so excited to see where they go with the next season. - Yeah, me too. I just need to finish season three, hoping to finish that this weekend. Been a little busy lately. Haven't really had an opportunity to watch too much. But, yeah, I'm hoping, you know, we finished season three. That official is strong, looking forward to season four. I'm sure, you know, I think our goal here, we'll be trying to review the next two seasons before the fourth season's out, so we can review that for you all when that comes. And then, yeah, I think it's kind of getting into, you know, we're getting into like, some golden televisions coming out. Also, potentially some big movies, or, you know, big as in the sense of like, we're gonna get the award movies coming soon. So keep your eye on the podcast for that. We'll be talking about everything that's gonna come out this fall and winter as much as we can get to. - Yes. - But, yeah, I'm excited. This is the time of year for good entertainment. - 100%, 100%. So, yeah, stay tuned, people, stay tuned. - Yes, so there's nothing else there, Palmer. I think we're all gonna wrap up here. So thank you all so much for listening. This has been the What You Got podcast. I know we were on basically a summer vacation, but we're back now, we're going into the fall. We have new episodes every Wednesday evening. So be sure to follow us on wherever you get your podcast, and also hit us up on social media. We'll try to post there more frequently. I swear that is going to be my New Year's resolution, as opposed to every episode. So, yeah, be sure to follow us. Palmer, you can let them know where we're at. - You can follow us on Instagram at What You Got podcast, What You Spilled W-H-A-T-C-H-A, or on Twitter/X at What You Got Cast, What You Spilled the Same Way. - And next week, I think we're gonna try to get you to kinds of kindness. So stay tuned, we'll review Norgos Lanthamos' latest film and try to compare that against his incredible repertoire up until now. So until next time, catch you all later. [BLANK_AUDIO]