Radio Miraya
2857: NW. Insights and Goals for the 8th Governors Forum in South Sudan
(upbeat music) - Nationwide, we bring you latest current issues, discussions and information. (upbeat music) Nationwide on Radio Miraya. - Hello and good evening. Welcome to Nationwide Discussion Hour. Today, my name is Lucy Kiden. Now, today, we are discussion will focus on the upcoming governance forum. The eighth governance forum is set to kick off tomorrow, and this year's theme is forging sustainable peace, committed action in the extended RX transition. And so our axis is actually the current peace agreement. And so to discuss the main objectives of this year's forum, as well as understand the major areas of focus, joining me today is Mr. Michael Majock, director general for decentralization and inter-governmental relations. You are welcome, sir. - Thank you very much. I'll read you. - This is Radio Miraya. - Yeah, sorry. - Yes. - Let me pass, first of all, let me pass my... - Just a moment. And then we also have Katherine O'Allaola, a governance advisor at UNDP. - Thank you, Lucy, and good evening to our listeners. - Good evening. Well, thank you guests for coming. Before we dive into the discussion, if you are tuned in and you would like to comment on what we'll be discussing about today, which is the upcoming governance forum, you're welcome to send a text message on 0-9-1-2-1-7-7-1-4-1. Also later on, we will have an opportunity for you to call in and ask questions. And you'll be able to use the following numbers, so please note them, 0-9-1-2-0-6-7-8-7-9, 0-9-1-2-0-6-8-1-0-1, or 0-9-1-2-0-6-7-9-2-9. Those are numbers you'll be able to call on later on during the discussion. So right now, as we move forward to talk about this upcoming governance forum, it is set to start tomorrow. And when we look at the current time, this is a time when South Sudan is navigating critical challenges such as economic instability, inter-communal violence, and the ongoing implementation of the revitalized agreement. Now we know that there is an extension as well of the interim period, which has gone up to 2026, so clearly there's no elections at the end of this year, which should have been in December 2024. - Coming to you, Mr. Michael Magiok, as a director in intergovernmental relations, what are some of the concrete outcomes that we hope to achieve during this year's forum to address some of these pressing issues? - Thank you very much, Miraya. I would like, first of all, to extend my thanks and a position to his extensive president of the public, Carlos Habakimayalit, for being committed to carry out this program for a wide-run time through assistance of UNDP and Elemis. The S-Governor's forum, as you already projected, we have some other challenges, like economic crisis, the economic difficulties that the country is facing, and also we have the instability in the country, and also the elections by R-axis, the ascension of it. The economic situation in the country is, the nation is already aware of it, and the government has made a very big progress in trying to approach the economic policies that are already on the line. And I think that is the objective of the government. - Oh, what are some of these progresses? What actions are we talking about here? - Yeah, the progress that is made, especially in Elemis, is trying to establish a very concrete approach in terms of taxes collection, and in terms of production of revenues, in terms of oil, the fibre of oil line, which has already been achieved, meaning only maybe some few days or a week, that maybe you will be having, again, oil as a petition, or as oil as a petition where the country is always in the resources. And we also have the mining, that is, the Minister of Mining is already dealing, trying to establish an industry of mining, so that we also manage our resources in a spot. So, these are some of the steps that the government is already taking now, which we hope, this will reduce the economic difficulties that the country is already facing. - All right, I'll be coming back to you, honourable Michael Majock, Catherine. First off, I would like to understand the role of UNDP in this governance forum. - Thank you, Lucy. UNDP has been a partner of the Government of South Sudan, even before independence, and has been a very key partner in the organisation and convening of the governance forum. This is the eighth governance forum. We have been working along with the Office of the President and the Minister of Presidential Affairs, all the way from the first governance forum, which started even before independence. And so, we have, every year, when we have had them, there was a break in between because of the crisis of 2013, 2016, but after that, we picked it up. UNDP supports this process as a key governance platform, because then we are able to bring together the national government and the state governments to speak about what they are doing together, to really encourage their look, to see what is being done and what can be done better, so that everybody can feel the benefits of peace, but everybody can walk along and see what each part of their government is doing. So, we have been supporting, and we continue to support this process, to see that the governors are able to come, to discuss, but also beyond that, to support those of the President in following up on the implementation of the resolutions that are normally agreed by the delegates, the governors and the delegates who come to this forum, so that together we can see, we don't just pass the resolutions, but we really go ahead and check which state is able to, how far they go, because the resolutions affect certain states, or all states, or the states and the national government, which part is assigned towards implementation, and what are they doing. So, we work and work with the government, to ensure that we monitor these resolutions, and see what progress is being made, so that when we come back, like we are doing tomorrow, the first thing we are doing is to really review the progress of the seventh governors forum, and what progress has been done. And so, very briefly, could you maybe outline some of your analysis, like the result of your review and follow up, to ensure that some of these resolutions are done, what has been achieved from the last governors forum, and what has yet to be achieved, that may be still discussed in this current one, that's starting tomorrow. I would say that in the last governors forum, we were working under three main themes, under which we discussed issues and following that resolutions were passed, one of the most intergovernmental relations, really to enhance the dialogue, the cooperation, the coordination between the national and state government, and these included issues that include, for example, the transfer of block grants from the Minister of Finance with the state ministries, the support of the national government in the increment of 400% salary for the employees, supporting peace-building initiatives at the state level, from the national level. We also had the other theme was under elections, and under that, what the forum agreed was that, there should be training of election workers, there should be establishment of the infrastructure required for elections. At that time, like you said, we were expecting to have elections in 2024, and so a lot has been done to support that, and I can say that while the elections are going to be extended, UNDP unmissed and other partners like UN Women and UNESCO have been working and continue to work in that space. So we've supported the establishment of the NEC, the state high committees for elections, we are training staff, we are supporting the procurement of items. So those achievements have been done in preparation for the elections, and the third theme that we were looking at last year was humanitarian and other challenges, including things like floods, including things like food insecurity, including things like ensuring that farmers and passports are able to work together, but also their products actually are well prepared and sold. So our assessment analysis on the ground has seen that in partnership with many partners, development partners, like FAO, like I see some of the NGOs, NRC, DRC, have supported the government, for example, in the vaccination of livestock, almost a million livestock were vaccinated. There's been a lot of support by the state governments to the various humanitarian organizations so that they can support people affected by floods, and this program continues. So a number of things have been done. Of course, after saying that, I must be also very clear to say that there have been a lot of challenges that we have also seen in the assessment, and one of the biggest challenges in security at the sub-national level, but also resources. A lot of things that were supposed to be done require money, and so much hasn't been done as was expected because of the lack of resources. - Okay, yeah. I thank you for giving that highlight, and coming to you now, I'm Honorable Michael. Given what took place in the seventh governance firm, the different resolutions on humanitarian challenges, elections, as well as inter-government relations, where would you see that the government has actually made the most progress, and also what is now being carried forward to this year's governance firm? - Yeah, as to already being pointed out by... - Yes, aside from what? - Yeah, we... - How's already been pointed out? - Yeah, there are so many achievements that the government has done especially during the seventh governance firm. One of it is a resolution of inter-communal violence that has been reduced, because there's so many conferences that have been made to encourage the coexistence among the tribes, and especially among the farmers and cattle hairders. That was another, that was one of the achievement. Number two, being a humanitarian, especially, when we had an influx, as a result of Sudan conflict we had. We had so many refugees, and writtenies that are coming from Khartoum, that have at least been having a problem in terms of food, access to food and access to the resident. So the government have really tried even to give... to give access, especially providing the lands for those retainees of which the government is able to allot the plots, and given the registration, with the commissioners, and that was a very big achievement, also for election. The government has made this trial by forming the National Election Committee. That is already existing now, and also established the overseas in the states for the committee for elections, which is a very encouraging step forward for election. - Thank you very much for highlighting those. So what are some of the things that have been carried forward? What is now the main focus? Aside from what is clear in the theme, and that is action in the extended transition, what is being carried forward from last year? - Now, what we have seen, especially, what is going to be more effective in the S governance forum, is the election formation of the concrete steps of implementing the elections committee, and also trying to establish a committee that can move all around the country in order to be enlightened people, that the elections are really coming, and that would be a problem that we have. Number two is 20 to 26 is just a great debt of election for all the parties, including the government. So, we are moving towards for that target now. That's why they established the election commission, election committee, and they wish we would make it possible that this year the S government forum is embarking on it to encourage that this thing should be met timely, everybody have to be informed, rather than extend it anymore, because people are really tired, and of course, there are a whole lot of problems that needs to be solved, challenges are there. There's hunger, fraud, and economic problems. So, this thing is the pressure to encourage the politicians and the parties, so that they can speed up the issue of election, and also bring peace, which is the most important thing as long as, no stability, that we know, there will be no election, because the main action, the main aim of the democracy is to establish peace, peace, stability, and coexistence of the people. - All right, thank you very much. If you're just tuning in, this is Radio Miraya, nationwide discussion, and here we are looking at the upcoming Governance Forum, which is actually going to take, start tomorrow, and we'll run for at least three days, all through two, right, six days. - Okay. - May I give the time? - Yes, for up to six days, and after the break, we'll be coming back to get to know more about this years. We've looked at a recap on what was achieved from last year's Governance Forum, touching on some of the resolutions on humanitarian challenges, elections, intergovernmental relations, and there are some progresses that have been achieved, but there's more that is yet to be accomplished. And so after the break, we'll be able to touch on what exactly is the main focus this year's stay tuned. - You're listening to Radio Miraya. - Nationwide, we bring you latest current issues, discussions, and information. Nationwide on Radio Miraya. - Yes. All right, welcome back. This is a nationwide discussion. We are back, and here we're looking at the upcoming Governance Forum. Now, it's gonna run for six days. And so can we clarify on the exact dates, and what are the main, main areas of focus last year? The areas of focus were humanitarian, the three main areas, as Catherine from UNDP earlier stated. You had elections, intergovernmental relations, as well as humanitarian and other challenges. So what are the main objectives this year, Catherine? - Thank you, Lucy. I think just to build on what the DJ was saying, and I think you alluded to that, in looking at what has been done so far from last year, there are definitely issues that were not done. Either they were only initiated, they were not completed or not initiated at all. So these are some of the issues we are going to carry forward and bring to this year's Governance Forum. So this year, I think I want to mention the dates to clearly that we are starting the Governance Forum tomorrow, Tuesday 26th, up to Monday 2nd of December. During that period, we'll have sessions from this Tuesday, tomorrow, until Saturday. On Sunday, we will not have a session, but then we'll have a session on Monday, which will be just winding up looking at the resolutions and the official closing of the forum. So just to repeat again, we have the Governance Forum from Tuesday 26th tomorrow, until Monday 2nd of December next week. And these forums will be looking again at three key issues, just to make sure that we have better discussions by very focused and clear outcomes of what we're talking about. And based on the fact that a lot of things were not done, a number of things were not achieved, we have the first area of discussion remains intergovernmental relations. Why do we do that? Because as you will see, this is a dialogue between the national and state governments. So anytime we have this session, the first thing you're doing is to look at what is happening between those two levels of government? How are they cooperating? How are they dialoguing? What are the channels of communication? What do we need to improve? What is better? And what should be done, could be done even more in a better way. So the first item remains intergovernmental relations. And under there, I expect discussions about items that were not concluded on it implemented in last year. For example, the issue of delayed salaries and the issue of the 400%. The issue of block grants, the issue of resources required from the national ministries to state ministry to support whatever happens at those levels. But also, not just demanding from the national government, also checking the state governments, while they have received these resources, what have they done with it? Because one of the key issues they do is actually report in the last one year, what have you received from the national government? And how have you spent these resources? How is the person on the ground feeling that support that come from the national government? So that would be the first area. The second area relating to last year is a constitution making. As you said, we have an extension of the transition period. So key items that have been identified by government under this time to implement, is constitution making as a key element that is required for elections. We have the election themselves and the implication of forces and other issues. So we are looking at two governance key issues that are important. One is constitution making. And here we'll be looking at what is required to be done. We have a national constitutional review commission that has been set up by government and we have commissioners there. They are yet to start working, you know, substantively they are still setting up offices which is partly supported by UNDP and other partners. So what we'll be discussing is what do we see and the commission will be telling us what do they plan as their activity and the rollout of their plans? How do states support this process? How do we ensure awareness but also inclusion of everybody across the country so that we have a document that is actually contributed to and understood and agreed by all the people? That would be the second point. And the third item we'll look at are the third areas elections. It's very related to constitution making. As you can see, this was part of what we discussed last year. And last year we didn't have very much to say because at the time the commission had just been put in office, they had not been sworn in, they had not really done much. So this year we see, we want to see, look back and see, in the last one year with the commission in office, what have they been able to do? So we're also looking forward to hear from the commission, what is their plan in preparing the country in issues of voter registration, voter awareness and those kinds of things. So these key issues we are looking at, intergovernmental relations, constitution making and election process are the three items you're looking at this year. All right, thank you, Catherine. Now coming back to you. Honorable Michael Majok. When we look at these three main areas of focus, I know Catherine has broken it down for us, but what are some of the actions that are going to be taken? Who is being engaged on these three different issues that will be the focus of the governor's forum? - Now, to point out in addition to what Catherine has already said, we have very important issues to be discussed in the US governance forum, especially the extension of the period of the period. - So what exactly is being discussed now, or regarding the extension? - The extension must be committed. Now if it is, it must be committed to the time to democratize the system of governance. This is the most important thing. Once the extension is made, it's agreed, all the parties, including for Mila, discussion that is going on now in Kenya, then the government will be prepared to make sure that they are committed to implement the period of election. So this is the most important thing. Number two, we have to have security and efforts to resolve intergovernmental conflict. That is very important because as long the country, still in chaos, we must make sure that stability is restored. In all the states, especially the areas that are affected by inter-communal violence. The other one should be promoting the economic development. Because our economy, as long the country is not stable, our economy will never stabilize, unless the security of democratic government is elected to organize the system of delivering the economy in the country. Now the country is going almost about 11 months because of that, which is very, very challenging. And this issue should be resolved. And so my question here is how are we going to resolve these issues? Who is going to be asked questions and held accountable? Because there was a whole governance firm that took place last year that relayed these same issues. Aside from the extension, of course, we just took place a few months ago. What is the criteria here? That is what I am asking. What exactly is going to take place? The public needs to know who's being held accountable for what has not been achieved. Now, what happened, the person that is accountable for, what has transpired, is not the area to the government. But we have so many challenges. For instance, the climate change is broad. Let's talk about issues like economic development and maybe salaries, yes. Yeah, these issues could not be resolved. But the government is already on the way of solving it. Because once we are able to support the oil, then the issue of improvement in our economic capabilities will surely be resolved. So the issue of economic problems could be solved once we have resumed our expectation of the oil. Because there's the only resource that had been backing up our economy, because 95% of our budget is based on oil exploitation. And because we had this problem in the Sudan, that affected the exploitation of oil, then the solution is almost about to be solved now. Through the Ministry of Petroleum, that has already secured the maintenance of the part that had been that was spoiled in oil pipes to consider. So that is another way of solving the economic problem. All right. Thank you very much for stating some of the things that will be focused on especially during this six-day governance forum that will be taking place this year. Some of the things have been carried-- actually, most of the things have been carried forward, because then you cannot take just one year to solve big issues like the ones we have here in South Sudan. Now, you have the opportunity to call in or text in your question if you have one right here on the radio, and you'll be speaking, joining us live. Go ahead and call in. We have our first caller. Radio, Mirai, hello. [INAUDIBLE] Good evening. Good evening. Yes, good evening. What's your name? This is Dyeong Dyeong in Wao. Yes, Dyeong Dyeong. Yeah, thank you. My greetings with the guests with you. Go ahead. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually, as a citizen, sometimes we are frustrated when we have another governance forum. We are not actually coming. The solution will not give us the solution to our programs. All the guests will use in the city, what they say that they think they are going to discuss. I think some of them have been tried for the last six governance forum that they have gone to Dubai. And it seems that the governance forum has been used as it is a political forum for the governance in the state to Uber, to stay in the hotel and enjoy. But actually, with the resolution, they don't actually come out. When we talk of the economic development, my question to the DG, actually, economic development. I think we leave a sometimes question government. Why are you reluctant, actually, to look at the issue of the economy? When you talk of the oil, what happens to the taxes? Your government are collecting from us, the citizen. That PIT taxes, and you are collecting the road taxes. You're collecting the taxes in the market on daily basis. What happens with that money? Where are they going? Are they not enough to pay the civil servant? That's my first question. Another second question is that civil servants are not getting salaries. And your government is running with a youth convoy and the bid of moving people are enjoying. Where are you getting the money? Is that from the office of the president, with the office of the governance? Where are you getting the money? And you talk that the economy is not there. There's no money. And the way we see you, you are enjoying the act and that even you have more money. Where does money come from? That is my second question. - Thank you very much, Diang. - Another question is that-- - Diang Diang, another opportunity for other coalers. Thank you for your two questions. And the DG will be answering that. Let's hear from other coalers. You ready, Mr. Hilo? - Yes, I'm all right, I'm all right. - Yes. - You are speaking with an attack from a will. - That is not the matter. - Yes, attack, go ahead. - Thank you, my question is this, my question is also that we're talking on the studio right now. So perhaps South Sudan is a young country. So my question is this, you know, people of South Sudan, we need to make everything, but we want to put what is called implementation. Our leaders can do everything by now, Governor Forum, we want it last year, but now we didn't see any implementation. So my question is that, why not our leaders not make what is called implementation? Anybody, so that's my question. - All right, thank you very much. That is an attack from a will asking that one question. Let's hear from a third caller, and then we'll hear the responses. Radio, Mr. Hilo? - Good evening. - Good evening. Your name, please. - They will move up from WOW. - Yes, David, go ahead. - I have two questions. Number one is going to UNDC. This is number eight, that you have already accommodated the Governor's forum, but they don't copy and comment, face it in their state. What is the reason, why do you fund this forum? Why is it benefiting the citizen? Or are you only benefiting the citizen? Because we know very well that UNDC, it is a development program. There is no development in the country when people are dying of hunger, when people are dying in security and so forth. Now the governors are doing nothing in the country. All the politicians of this nation are doing nothing. So what is the reason, why they really accommodate it for the country and which is not benefiting the citizen? Number two, let me go to DG. DG is the president, say that there is money in the country, and the Minister of Finance says that there is no money. Now we do it. You people, you are now giving money for the community agreement, you are giving money for our office, you are accommodating the politicians, and citizens are giving nothing for 11 months. You politicians of this country, are you working for yourself or are you working for the nation? - Thank you very much, David Magok. Well, let's try and answer these questions first before we can hear from more of you. DG, go ahead and answer Diane Deng's question on what happens to taxes. Yes, you're looking at oil, but what about the taxes? What about the revenue that is being collected? Where is that money going? But also he poses a question about priorities of this money. Why is there money for some politicians to enjoy a lavish way of living, and yet there are people who are not being paid civil servants? Go ahead. - Thank you very much. Your question is very understandable. And first of all, let me come to the conversation of the sorrows of Diane. We have taxes, collection of taxes is divided into two. There's state taxes, which is P.I.T. that state is responsible to collect and meet the economic activities in the various states, and the taxes that are collected by the national government. Now, if the taxes that are collected in the states, they are independent. You have to use it in either meeting the salaries. What the government does is only assist states on either a conditional grant or a broad grant. And this one here, it is very clear in the Constitution, and after all, it is coming in the Constitution. We had a discussion very well on this thing. Number two, the issue of having the money. Where is the money? You say that there is money, and people are dying. Well, this is David McGonke, the president says there is money. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the issue of taxes, it is divided between the national government and the state government. What the national government does is, just like lying ministries, education and health. Education and health includes playing the salaries. Yeah. Which means that this money is sent by the national government. So what you're saying is that the money is always sent. The question should go to the government. Yeah, the question, I mean, money is already sent. It is the management of the state government in paying off all what they have collected. Is this one of the things that will be addressed in the government? Yes, sure. All right. But it is now coming up in the constitution. OK. That means the constitution. Thank you. Thank you for stating that. Well, we shall hear the resolutions in this regard after the forum is ended, as the state government will be held accountable to ask them where is the money going, yet it's supposed to go to pay the civil servants in the states. Now, the question on implementation by a kick in a wheel. Just why this is going to, I think, this will go to UNDP because you monitor and also assess on implementation. Why is it that there's a lot of talk? There's paper, everything is put on paper. But rarely is the results seen or even communicated. Thank you, Lucy. And thank you, David, and I talk for these questions. I think I will relate that to also the question that was asked by David about-- this is the eighth and why we're going on. I think I'll start by saying that when things are not right, you don't walk out. You don't walk out and say it's not working, so we don't do it. For me, and as UNDP, the governance forum is a point of accountability. It's a point of accountability. It is by these kinds of discussions to actually know what is really wrong, who can be asked what question and who can answer what question. So when you're talking about, for example, civil governments have not been paid, where would you get-- we can have all the conversations, but where would you get this kind of forum where we can sit together? And by the way, this is not just the governance setting. We have the national ministers coming here. We'll have the minister of finance. They actually have a slot to discuss. And I can bet you that one of the issues the minister will discuss is the issue of the salaries and other economic issues. We have various ministries stalking and addressing these issues. So we continue to do this because this is a forum that brings everybody together. And then we can distill what is right, what is not right, how do we do it? So the call has to say, UNDP sees this as a critical engagement that we can sit down together and call to account everybody. And you know what they are saying? If money is received, why is the money received for the governor and not this and that and that? These are the kind of questions we ask. And so we don't have this forum. We will not have anybody asking. So for us, it's important as a governance approach that we sit together as leaders and ask who received what, who doesn't have what, who can be helped, and that kind of stuff. But also in terms of implementation, it's the reason why we're monitored. And I think when we started, I explained some of the things that have been done, others are not being done. Again, there are many reasons to this. We will be sharing, the DJ will be sharing the report tomorrow. But our analysis has shown that a lot of reasons, a lot of achievements haven't been done purely because of the lack of resources. So if you're asking and you said, if they're going to be schools and hospitals, it needs money. It needs you pay teachers and the nurses and the doctors. It needs you by books. It needs that if you're talking about the security that you're paying the police and that kind of stuff. So all these things, implementation is slow. I will say that it is slow. But again, if because it is slow, we will not talk about it, then I'm sure it will get to us. So it's a point for us, it's a point of accountability. It's a policy platform. We said we would do this. Why are we not doing it? It's why what we discussed last year has to come again because it hasn't happened. So we have to find a way to talk about it. So it's not our west. It's really a push, if you ask me. And what I would ask to follow up on this specific question is, but is it sustainable? This is now the eighth one from your view and analysis. Is the format sustainable? Or are there better ways to actually hold they have this accountability mechanism become more effective? At this point, this is the avenue we find. And I want to start by saying that UNDP is a partner to the government who we work together in terms of providing resources to do all that, as partners, just resources and technical. But it is an avenue that can be modified and worked around as we go forward. So as we are now, this is what we have. But we are open to discussions and see how to make it better. I think I had one of the callers saying, why don't we have it on the ground? I want to say, for example, we had-- this year, we've not been able to do it because we don't have the resources. But we've had state consultations. We've had forums on the ground where we bring local communities together. And their discussions actually fed into the governance forum, where then we asked, we have a report on the people in this community. They are asking this and that and that, so that we have everybody speaking. So for now, it's the one avenue we have to have everybody speaking. But also, our leaders actually say what they have to do. And going forward, as we grow, as we improve, we'll definitely find ways of making it better as we all agree to go forward. All right. Thank you very much. Looking at our text messages, innocent Abdullah, your question about the governance forum being conducted last year and not seeing any implementation has already been answered. And then there's another question here that you've asked about food security and why you're saying-- this was talked about and was one of the resolutions. But it is estimated that, more than half of the population will be food insecure. What is going to be done about that? And then there's one other question here. This is Ghatwak Makwe saying, do you think the intergovernmental relationship has been achieved, or maybe progress has been made? If so, why is there still killing and abductions and kidnapping? We are approaching the end of the discussion, unfortunately. And so I would like you to answer these questions in your final remarks. And so, Digi, in about a minute, why do you think some of these things continue to happen, even though they are being discussed and addressed? Well, the first and foremost, I would try to look at the issues of food security. As we are aware that our country had been under pressure of various insecurities, where even the farmers themselves, where they used to have a better food production. What is the way forward? The way forward is, first of all, if we can establish a permanent peace and security in the country, where everybody is free to go and cultivate anywhere, that would be the only alternative. Number two is the intergovernmental relationship that has been going on for these many years. We have a very challenging, why intergovernmental relations is not functioning well. What is that kind of challenge? This challenge is, once the coordination between the national government and the state government is not being put into practice, it's not being implemented properly. Say that whatever the national government is doing, the state government is not applying exactly. They do their own thing. And I know one of the reasons why they're doing that, because of the election, that's why everybody is very particularly elected government. It's all right, let me cut you off the director. We will visit this another time. So what I've understood is the main issue is lack of proper coordination between the government, the main government body here in Juba and in the state. Unfortunately, we don't have any more time. And so we will definitely revisit this discussion as this is ongoing for the next six days. Thank you so much for coming. Up next, we have the news in English. Keep your questions there. We'll definitely have another discussion on this. So stay tuned to Radio Miraya, the voice of peace.