[MUSIC] >> Man, morning shows, 4.5, 9 of the fan. >> Man, it's Frank Gunning, by the way, through that poll out there. I mean, the Maple Leafs had more success. I like, it was everything I could do to not put it in quotation marks. Cuz I don't even know if you said this, but like, have the Maple Leafs of the Austin Matthews era had way more success than the Toronto Blue Jays. >> Was it way more? >> The Blad and Bo, but I just put it as, hey, have they had more success than the Blue Jays? >> I mean, so if we're doing factual, then yeah. >> No, but okay, but that's, okay, well, factual, 16 teams get into the- >> Yeah, but like a playhouse. >> But like winning a series, again, like it's like the low, like scraping the floor, trying to get under the bar, I know, or over the bar, but like literally one ass series, literally sword. >> But that's, but that's, okay, so that if you're just gonna do that, then yeah, okay, they've had more success. >> More success. >> The more success. >> The more successful. >> You see, I disagree. >> Okay. >> Okay, but I actually think it's like very part and parcel. It's like, it's like the Blue Jays have almost had an MVP. The Leafs have had an MVP, like I think it's like, that's the demarcation point there. >> It's close. >> Yeah, like the Jays have had some success, but I think it's, to me, they've both been pretty disappointed. >> Like that, if the question is, have they both been disappointing, then yes. >> Obviously. >> No, but obviously the answer. >> I think it's equal. >> Yeah, I know. But it's like, it's because it's been happening so long for the Leafs that it feels that way, but it's not, it's just, it's not equal. >> No, I'd say, I'd say, okay, good. No, I'm glad I'm, because I thought maybe you would back off of it. But no, you're like, you just, you think definitively that the Maple Leafs have had more success than the Blue Jays of this era. So I mean, to your point, they've had more kicks of the can at the postseason. Like, maybe if we let this play out as long as it has, the Maple Leafs- >> Yeah, maybe two runs. >> Or win a series. Like it took until last season for them to win a series. >> Have they, have they been going against like Stanley Cup champions? Or, well, I guess it'd be hard for the Blue Jays to play a Stanley Cup champion, but. >> Yeah, I mean, like the Mariners are clearly world beaters and obviously- >> I think they won one, game one of their series against the Astros. >> Obviously the twins were just juggernauts, the likes of which we haven't seen. >> Man, it just opened the door, a crack for you to make excuses for the Maple Leafs. And you are just like, you're breaking down the door. >> No, you know what it is, it's because, it's because everyone and their mother does the exact opposite of like, oh, you know, I'm just here, minding my business. Come on, let me just get in this crack at the Leafs that occasionally, occasionally, especially if you're gonna compare it to this era of the Blue Jays. >> I do have to remind people of like, what's actually happened. >> Yeah, I know what's happened, and I know both have been big disappointments. >> I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't even, I wouldn't hazard to say like, who's been the bigger, like it's just like six and one half dozen the other. Like, I don't, like, again, your take is like pretty definitively, the Maple Leafs have had more success than the Blue Jays. >> It has been a better era of Leafs hockey than it has been of Blue Jays baseball. Yes. >> Okay, so that's the question, good. >> All right, so the PGA Championship is underway-ish in nine minutes, really. First tee time. >> No, it's officially underway. You and I have it on screens here. >> Yeah, there was this guy in like a red coat. >> I didn't know they did this. >> I think this has got to be a Kentucky thing. >> It's the Kentucky Derby guy. It has to be the guy. It has to be the guy. >> I didn't even put two and two. >> It has to be the guy that does call to post who had the big, long horn. >> Yeah. >> Who was, I guess, we didn't have sound up, but I mean, I guarantee it sounded. >> In the morning mist. >> Oh, it looked like I don't, I'm not on a panel for this. I probably shouldn't give these things out, but go give somebody an Emmy for that. >> Yeah, beautiful show. >> Beautiful show. >> Beautiful. >> Anyways, it's a Valhalla in Kentucky. And we got Scotty Scheffler trying to win the first two slams of the season after picking up a second master's victory in April. You got Rory McElroy looking for his first major championship in 10 years coming off a victory. You got lots of storylines, but let's just focus on those two in particular. >> Yeah. >> What's the more interesting win? So Scotty Scheffler with a chance to win the season slam, winning the first two of the year or Rory McElroy at 35 years of age, adding to his total and getting back in the win column at a major. >> Unlike with our Blue Jays and Leafs debate, I think this is a very tough question. I have gone back and forth many times. I think it's Rory though. I think Rory with the win, you throw in the TMZ of it all with the divorce. And then you know that that stat will be bandied about of the run. He went on after calling off the engagement with Wozniak Key, as you pointed out to me yesterday. So yeah, I think it is Rory. I also think that he, a win by him at a major immediately gets him back in public consciousness to right where he once was. I still think with Scheffler, which it's not to say about a guy who could easily, maybe not easily, but could very well be halfway to the single season grand slam that I still think there's just this element of unsexiness with Scheffler that the public at large, like you and I, even me, I'm the biggest golf sticko going and it took me a while to get sucked in and pulled into Scheffler. Maybe the baby angle allows people to get there, but yeah, I still, I know, shocking to everybody listening, but I still think Rory winning is a bigger story. Yeah, I think it's Scheffler, because this isn't the Masters. Like if it was the Masters and then it's the career slam. Yeah, and that's the one bugaboo. It's like we've seen him. Okay. Does anyone think that Rory McElroy's got the same thing, the same shambles in his brain at the other three majors? I think a lot of people think he is broken in majors going back to the cam Smith at the Open and all of that. I think the shambles existed, I guess. I don't disagree, but I think a lot of people think they just exist. They're just, yeah, they're just four times a year shambles who put them there though. That's the question. Maybe it was our next guest. No, never. He's testified at the church of Rory all the time. He would never. Hard of golf media. It is Adam Stanley, sports, that's golf reporter in Kentucky. Did you hear that guy playing the horn just seconds ago? I did not. Was it like a little bugle thing like you're off to the right? Yeah, yeah. It's fine. There's a post I imagine. There was nothing little about the bugle. It was arguably as tall as the guy playing it. So, yeah, no, it was they looked electric, I gotta say. Yeah, you enjoying Kentucky? I am actually a little bit sticky underrated kind of town. I actually went here when I was when I was 30 with a couple of buddies for a little birthday slash bourbon adventure a couple of years ago and a little bit less bourbon being drunk this week, but not not no bourbon being drunk. Yeah, buddy. Yeah, you got it. You got to mix in like at least a little bourbon. Is there like a is there like a regional regional delicacy? I seem to remember something about like a garbage can plate being happening? Like, is there like is just bourbon on the menu or is there some other delicacy that's happening in Kentucky that I'm supposed to know. So, so a garbage plate is that was last year's PGA champion. Yeah, that's what I thought. Yeah. That was a Rochester specialty. So, it's basically, it's basically fries with like anything you can imagine. But since Louisville is so close to Ohio and Cincinnati and et cetera, like the regional delicacy that is Skyline Chile. Yeah, I've heard it today, Louisville and Skyline Chile, like it's very hard to explain, but it's like a base and then there's chili and then there's cheese and it's all like in a bowl and it's very and I mean this in the nicest possible way, but it's incredibly American. Like, it's just so, I've never had it. I have no like interest in having it. My good friend, Luke Kurtanine, who works for Golf Digest, he is he's British through and through. And one of his colleagues got him, got him having a Skyline Chile on Monday and I saw him yesterday Wednesday and I was like, how are you feeling? He's like, I think I'm still processing the truth. Right. So there you go. Yeah, I got no blood sausage. That guy's aggressively English. I have talked to him on on the golf show pod. And yeah, he's aggressively English. And I do feel like it's like if the English are throwing stones at your you're coming in that feels extra. That feels extra mean. I got to be honest. Like I said, it's no blood sausage. Yeah, I also have been to to Louisville. I did. I did. I think the most Kentucky thing you can do. I went there for bachelor part. I went to a NASCAR race. So yeah, like, come on, like, come on. I also went to Louisville Slugger, a manufacturing plant. Come on, very unbrand. I went there to the minor league team here. It's called the Louisville bats. Yes, the bats. There we go. Yeah. Yeah, nice. All right. To the golf, I guess, like, let's let's ask you the same question. We were just banding back back and forth. Like, what's the more interesting story for you? If you can just pick one of the two major ones, Rory winning and getting back in a major win column for the first time in 10 years or Scottie winning his third major, but second straight to start the season. I think the bigger story, because because it's going to transcend golf, if it happens, is Rory winning. Like it's, excuse me, it's divorce data energy versus new data energy, to Gunner's point about the TMZ side of things, just more and more people just know who Rory Mackerelle is. And, you know, the fact that he was able to win Sunday on the PJ Tour in very, very dominating fashion and then, you know, hit up the courts in South Florida and file for divorce 24 hours later, you know, did show some, you know, did show some mental fortitude. So, you know, I'm curious about how Scottie is going to do this week just from an endurance perspective. As we all know on this conversation, becoming a dad for the first time is a lot. And regardless, if you're a radio host or the number one golfer in the world, you know, you are going to be distracted by things at home. Now, Scottie is far away from home and that may allow him to have the greatest night sweep that he's ever had, you know, with a six day old at home and him here in a king sized bed in a hotel room by himself. But I think the curious thing about this particular major championship season is if you, I have no, I've, there's no doubt in my mind that Scottie's going to be part of the conversation as we get to the weekend. I mean, he'll probably finish, he doesn't win, he'll probably finish in the top five. But I do think that it's more likely to come down to a Rory and Brooks chapter kind of showdown just because of how this golf course is built. Now, when it comes to Pioneer's number two in the US Open in a couple weeks, you know, Scottie, number one, 100%, I think just that golf course fits Scottie and a little bit more than Valhalla. Just because bombers paradise, it's wet. You got to hit it super far, super straight. Rory's the number one guy in total driving on tour. He's the best driver of the golf ball on the planet. So I do think that just the fit for Valhalla is better for Rory. It's better for Brooks. Scottie's going to be in the mix because he's number one in every key statistical category. There is, whether it be just at the majors or on the PGA tour over the last 12 months, the last 24, pick your, pick your length of time. But I just think, again, course fit, it's better for Rory and given the culture nature of the Rory McElroy. I think if he wins, that'll be the bigger story. Yeah, it will be. I mean, you mentioned the Quel Hollow and how kind of similar the Valhalla sets up. I mean, it's the serendipity of it all is so real. How do you think Rory's going to handle the circus that is this week? I mean, I think the golf media, by and large, will be pretty respectful of the personal element of it. But, you know, I liked Rory's chances heading into Augusta and I know how it went for him there. But I liked his chances this year because it felt like he was kind of able to fly in as under the radar as he is possibly able to there. And this is going to be the exact opposite. It's back-to-back wins. It's all the storylines of his last major being a 2014. You throw in the divorce of it all. Like, how do you think Rory will handle how loud this week is going to be for even for this is a loud week, even for Rory, the guy who seemingly every week is loud for. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think that there's been a person in professional golf. And, like, honestly, you could say in professional sports that has had kind of more of a spotlight on them as it relates to, you know, their chosen sport over the last, you know, two, three years or whatever it is, other than Rory McElroy. So the fact that, you know, the first year that lived lunch, the guy won the FedEx Cup, you know, the next year that lived lunch, he still, I'm pretty sure he got the number one in the world. And now here we are with all the other stuff that's been going on. He still won his last two starts on the PGA Tour, won in a playoff. And then the other one, obviously, in dominating fashion like I mentioned a few minutes ago. So, you know, Rory's strategy as it relates to demands as far as this week goes, as compared to the other couple major weeks, you know, the players' championship, zipped in, you know, 8 a.m. presser on Monday. Everyone was still trying to get their bearings, and he just did, you know, it's 10 minutes and then he peeled. Masters, again, we talked about this a couple of weeks ago, you know, again, zipped in, didn't really do all that much, peeled on out of it like it was nothing. We were all like, well, that was odd. And then, yeah, same deal yesterday. He had funny thing. He had more people in his press conference waiting for him yesterday than Tiger Woods did the day prior. And I don't know, I don't know if there's been a time, maybe ever that somebody else has outgrown Tiger Woods at pre-tournament media. So, you know, again, no tight, 10 minutes. It was announced beforehand. We got 10 minutes. A statement from the PGA of America PR person, Rory will not be answering any questions about his personal life. You know, tried to slow play the answers a bit about, you know, his return to Valhalla and kind of his form and stuff like that. So, you could tell, and then right afterwards, I kind of watched him with his, with his agent and his buddy, and they walked right to the parking lot, right to the rental car, and then just bounced. So, you know, interesting kind of strategy. He handled it as well as it could. One question, which I thought certainly could have been worded better, Rory was, you know, like, it's been, it's been a tough couple of years. Like, I think more importantly, like, how are you doing personally? And then it was like, okay, well, alarm bells, they told you not to ask any personal questions. I think, honestly, if the question was just like, Rory, how are you? We may have gotten better. We may have gotten a better answer. So, yeah, I mean, the golf starts today. And I think he's going to get a warm reception. He certainly has the last, the last few. And we'll just have to see where the chips fall. God, we got to wait another seven minutes. So, the first round has been delayed by 10 minutes because of fog. Honestly, normally, I hate it worth it. The camera shot of buddy in the fog and the mist. And there's like, waterfalls that don't seem natural, but I would never say they aren't. It just, it was worth it. Normally fog delay can't have it. I'm allowing this. I hit my ball into the fog and just hit it in the middle of fairway, buddy. Like, come on, you know where the ball goes. If you hit it down the middle, it's just an easy solution. No, come on. Let's get to going. Yeah. So this if Rory wins, it'll be a legitimate major victory because Taylor Gucci is there. Okay. So the defending individual champion of the lift were the only guy that is a lift to her player who did not automatically qualify for this thing was invited though by the PGA championship. Do you think it's a good thing that he's there? Do you think this is an indication of where we're going to be at with the major championships when all the automatic invites run out for some of these live guys? Yeah. I mean, if you, if you zoom out from just all the back and forth and whatever, and you kind of just look at, you know, pure, whether they be names or global performance, I guess, on the golf course, I know it's kind of hard to measure apples to apples when it comes to live victories versus PGA. Tour victories, but at the same time, yeah, he is one of the 150 guys in the world who deserves a shot at playing major championships. I just think, you know, he's handled it so poorly and he's been such a dweeb about everything that it's like, you kind of roll your eyes and just personally think he doesn't deserve to be there. But, you know, when you separate yourself from any of those feelings, just think about how, you know, he's been efforting actually on the golf course, like, okay, fine. It's fine. Whatever. You know, the curious thing about the PGA hand, or kind of owning this major championship is that, you know, I wrote about this a couple days ago. They were certainly searching for an identity a few years ago to move to May. You know, you can look at all the other majors over the last couple of years. And honestly, I think, you know, average, if you take the last five of each of them, the PGA championship, I think, has had the best finishes of all of the major championships over the last little while. Like, love them or hate them. You know, Phil winning a 51 was incredible theater, you know, Brooks dominating, you know, becoming this guy who's not chasing Rory and Scotty, but chasing, you know, Arnold Palmer, like, in major championships. These are, these are, these are aggressive, impressive storylines. And I think that the PGA has realized, like, hey, if we're not, we're not the masters, we're not the open, what are we going to be? We're going to be the, you know, the golf professionals major, and we're going to try together the biggest collection of professional golfers and biggest and best regardless of where they play. And this is the approach that they're taking. And, you know, Valhalla, the golf course really sets up for drama. And I think the fact that the field is filled with, you know, love them or hate them again. The best golfers on the planet is going to make for good theater for this week, for sure. The best field and the biggest trophy in golf, that should be the tagline. Like they've leaned into the best field part. You have to lean into the biggest trophy every single time this thing ends other than when kept go wins, because he's just so huge. It doesn't feel as big. But every time this thing ends, they go, God, the Wanamaker is a unit. That is so it's so big that they should, like, every year, they should slightly increase the size. Yeah, anyone know anything? And then, like, in five years, the winner, like, steps inside of it, pops out of it, like, going out of a candle. Yeah. Would you like to? Well, true or false, you will be pitching that to someone at the PGA media table today. False, right? False? Unfortunately, the PGA of America's senior brass had their press conference and availability yesterday. So just missed it. Yeah, 12 months. Quail Hollow. Next year, I'll be, I'll be back. I'll, I'll file it. And we'll see what we do. Yeah. What, what last one? We talk a lot about Rory and the career grand slam every time a gusta rolls around. We talk about Scotty Scheffler and just winning every major from here until he decides to stop playing golf one day. How telling is it about Jordan Speed's forum that we're just not talking about him needing this one for the career grand slam? Like, it's right there for him. We're going to talk about it until it ends. But it just seems very, very telling of the form that speed Scott going on that it just feels like a super back burner conversation to put it lightly. Yeah, he's offended by that. Wow. He really didn't like that. Well, I'm a big fan. I was going to say like, I didn't say anything bad about Rory. No, you didn't call him a queen. Oh, God, no. I'm just strong language from Stanley. Wow. Cheese. All right. Well, it was good. Like, conversation. We don't need to call Adam Verbal. Verbal handshake. Love you, Adam. Thank for coming on. Yeah, I was going to ask him about the Canadians record. You want to ask me? Yeah, six Mackenzie Hughes, Taylor Pendreth, Nick Taylor, Adam Spenceham, Adam Hadwin, and Corey Connors. Not only are there six, which ties the record for this tournament, those guys are all PGA tour winners, man. So here's the question. I feel like I've asked him before. And I, it's almost too obvious to ask him because he is Mr. Canada golf. Yeah. I'm going to ask you. Yeah. Because you're a little more unbiased. Sure. Even though you're biased, obviously. Okay. I was like crying when Nick Taylor made the button, but I'm a turtle. This is awesome. If I give you an over and under of a half a major win over the next five years from a Canadian, you taking the over? No, I'm not. Oh, you're wow. I guarantee you. Adam is taking the. Okay. No, wow. You surprised me. Here's what he would say. Here's what he would say. Adam would like have the longest winding road to very nicely taken the under on that. You think? I do. I think that winning majors is so, so hard, duh. You have to strike lightning when you have that form. And, you know, this isn't, say like, Taylor's not going to have a run of good play again, but you can only like Rory McElroy can only keep it going at the peak of his powers for maybe 18 months. He's only one guy. We got more than a half dozen right. And I think that, you know, not to say Corey Connors has definitively played the best golf that he's played in his life, but Corey Connors played some really good golf over the last half a decade. He's had his looks. He's had his chances. He was, he had to share the lead at the PGA championship. I think last year, if not two years ago, you know, Nick Taylor, this is the peak of his powers. We saw how it went last year at the majors for him after the Canadian open. And I don't, I don't say that as a knock on him. Winning majors is just so, so hard. If you include Brooke Henderson and I'm slamming the over. But yeah, I know that doesn't count. I got one. I know. She is. Yeah. She's the best. Yeah. The other thing that I'm very intrigued by and like, I can't wait to have this overreaction take, but like Ludwig Oberg, if he wins in his second major start, like after finishing second and his first major start at Augusta, well, it's like, oh, you know, but like your first gig of the can't even, you're great. Like, you got to have the local knowledge of where to hit it on the greens. He's like, that's not a problem. Honestly, it's not. It just didn't hit it in the water on 11. We're having a different conversation. Dude, well, I mean, to that point, the way he bounced back after that, and just looked unfazed by the moment entirely. I mean, if he wins, yeah, he goes to one and his first two major starts and what, 21 years old? He's, he, I think he might be sneaky a little older than that, but he's like, he's 22, if anything. But yeah, he's right. Like, he's a pup. He's a baby. I, yeah, I can't. And we, you got to be careful because we, I mean, to the Jordan speech of it all, we were having a 24. Okay, I was going to say I thought he was like kind of sneaky, older. Yeah. We had conversations about Jordan's speech when he was rattling on off. Yeah, some, you know, green jackets about him being on a tiger pace. But my God, like to have a debut in major championships like that, how are we not having? And everybody is going to be compared to the thing that is probably never going to happen again. Like most likely tiger woods and the most dominant version of him. But be it hard argument against a guy if he goes to one and his first two major starts, Karl Markau won his third major start. And then he won his four or five, six, seven, eighth major start. And he hasn't won a major since, like he's had a solo five, he's had a T three, he's had a T five, he's been in the mix, but Karl Markau will forever be the guy I point to with this. And this do not take this as a criticism of Karl Markau. It's proof of positive. But what I was just saying about the Canadians, how hard it is to win majors. If I tell you a guy in his first eight starts, wins two majors, you're going, well, the floor is Phil Mickelson. And hey, Karl Markau is a young man. He's kind of his whole life ahead of him. It could easily, he could easily win two more majors in his career. But we do this in this sport. We do it more often than any other. And it's because it's an individual sport. You don't have to think about, Oh, is the coach going to school? What about one of the cap space? And unlike every other sport, the refs are always on these guys' sides. The refs come over and they're like, I'm sorry, this is happening to you, sir. So that's the reason why you do have this ability to dream and envision it. But Mora Cowell will forever be the guy because we sat here saying, and we weren't wrong to say it, that that guy's the best iron player since Tiger Woods. And won a major since. And again, he said, he's had a T three, a T five and a solo fifth in major since. That's pretty good. A lot of guys would love that. But it's just he will forever be the person I point to to say, I'll pump the brakes on young player, the exceptional thing. Now one of those majors was fake. Yeah, the first one was fake. The PGA championship, no crowd in his hometown. So that is very different. But then he won the open championship and called the British Open right to their face. You know, call it the open. The example for me is going to be 21 year old Jordan Smith in 2015, going win at the Masters, win at the US Open, T four open. Solo second PGA at 21. Yeah, at 21. Yeah. And then T two at the following season's Masters, that was obviously the 12th hole dunking in the water, which like, I mean, he has a championship since or no, sorry, was that 2018? Yeah, the will it. Yeah, Danny Willett. Yeah. By the way, and then Danny Willett's brother was like, Oi Cockney, general Britishness. Anyways, yeah, for me, at 21 years old, Jordan Spieth rattling off two majors and two other top fives in the majors. That was when I was legitimately on Tiger Watch. As you should have been, I think the difference with Spieth and I'm trying not to like, feel free to correct me if you think this is revisionist history. But with Spieth so much of it was, Oh, this guy feels magic because you couldn't. He just drained everything. But that putting is obviously a skill and good putters make putts. We see it with my McKenzie Hughes has been like dropping 50 foot bombs every two weeks for his entire PGA to her career field. So it's not to say that it's not a skill, but unlike with Maura Cowell, where you could sit there and go, it's the iron play. This is going to play everywhere with Spieth. It was maybe it was just my feeling, but it was so much more about, Oh, he's just like, he's the Scotty Scheffler, like he's touched by God. He's the chosen one. But unlike with Scheffler, where you can point to all the stats that say Scheffler is the best guy, that was never really the case with Spieth. Like he just felt best putter in the world. Very much very much so. But I guess I'd say putting just feels like such a finicky thing, not that you can't have it be consistent, but it just it feels like it can come and go. And yeah, I don't know. It is a skill. And those guys that maintain it over time, I'm not saying like that. I just feel like when you have the ball strike in that you can point to with even a Maura Cowell or a Scheffler, that just seems so much more sustainable to me than putting. Okay. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know if that's right as I say it. Okay, but like if I were to tell you, okay, you can I don't even know how you would know, like comparison, like if you could make every 20 footer, not every 20 footer, but like you make three 20 footers in a round, which is like, that's a game saver. Like how many like 20 footer you're looking to two, but like you might occasionally three put that thing. Yeah, you're saving, you make three of them. Yeah, that's minimum three strokes, but maybe as many as four or five. Yeah, but it's like the best iron player in the world, and you just stick it to five feet every year time. Yeah, but then, but then, you know, you're what 50% on like those five footers. I think people who've played the sport understand that putting is hard and rightly viewed as an important part of the game, of course. All right, let's take a break. And when we come back, let's get back into the Blue Jays. And we'll revisit this question, which you know what, you may be right about. Informal poll on Twitter sounds so shocked that I could be right. No, no, no, no, I'm not chocked. And again, it's like you're comparing, I don't know, trash left out in the hot July sun to like, yeah, trash was left on my, trash was left on my deck in the winter. It's like, you know, it's more powerful. I guess they're all they're both very smelly. But yeah, have the Austin Matthews Leafs had more success than the Bovlad Blue Jays will revisit that, will also revisit the managerial change of 2022 and whether the Blue Jays have gotten what they expected out of John Schneider. And while we're in like the land of negativity, what was the worst off season move that the Blue Jays had? That more next, the fan morning show continues, Ben and his Brent Gunning Sportsnet 590 the fan. Unrivaled insight, analysis and opinions on all things Blue Jays, Blair and Barker, be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Fan Morning Show Sportsnet 590 the fan man and his Brent Gunning. So I will remind people that when I raised this question, despite the fact that I disagreed with it, I was open to the possibility that I was in my silo, right? That I was, and this isn't also scientific proof that this is the answer. But I'm letting the masses decide here, have the Austin Matthews Leafs had more success than the Bovlad Blue Jays. Again, like I, I'm not even going to, I wouldn't argue that the Blue Jays have had more success. I'd be like, you know what, that's what I should have done. I should have just added a third category and no one has had success. Everybody sucks. I would have, I would have accepted that if you would have offered, if you would have offered that to me as an offer, an offer. Yeah. 80% of respondents saying yes, the Leafs have had more success. Because I guess everyone's focused very much on the like, the numbers part of it, nerds. So all of your nerds, okay? You're like scoreboard. Leafs won a series, okay? statistic of like series one to run scored in the last postseason series. Okay, that was one series. They scored a bunch of runs in Blue Elite because the manager decided to take out Kevin Gossman in the second game in the Mariners. Anyway, 21 was an incredible season. They missed the playoffs by a single game because Marcus Sammy and threw away out number 27 in Detroit. Is that part of the season? Like, yeah, yeah, they still won 91 games. When he like hoofed all those pucks over the glass against Montreal, that was like an unfortunate thing that happened, but that's, but that's, you know, but that's the thing. It's like, well, okay, that's what a failure 2021 was for the Blue Jess because they didn't make the playoffs. And the Leafs made the play, but it's different sports entirely. Like the Blue Jays, let's see, let's bring up the 2021 standings. Where were they in the American League with 91 wins? Well, they were obviously not. So this was- You just can't let it go. You created your Twitter poll. No, no. Hoping that you'd have like some semblance of a leg to stand on. And then it didn't. And then you're like, you know what, I'm just going to tell you all how wrong you are. Yeah. Blue Jays had the third best run differential, by the way, in the American League in 2021, okay? With their 91 wins. They also played in three separate home ballparks that year. And honestly, I thought Charlie Montoya deserved manager of the year consideration, considering the way he kept that team together, playing all over the place, the ball just to clarify this. The ballparks that we now like point to when we look at that season for Vlad and be like, oh, do we feel like the same way? No, yeah, but that's like Vlad, like the opposition still got to hit in those ballparks and they're not one of those games, right? Like that ended was they had a winning home record. They were 47 and 33 at home, but it's like, oh, well, that was obviously bigger failure than the Leafs in which, which game was that? You're the guy who spends the entire Leafs regular season being like, say what you all about the Leafs. They're not the Oilers who have missed the playoffs. It can't be- Yeah, but again, that's the sport. I'm comparing them to another team in that sport. Doing a cross sport comparison when we're talking about making the playoffs or missing it is, I think, missing the point of it. Yeah, I, I, but I'm not even putting it just as simply as make the playoffs, miss the playoffs. I am looking at it as one around, didn't one around. I don't think that's the be all and end all either. I also just think, and maybe this is a more wishy, washy, nebulous thing that I'm pointing to, the Leafs of this era have felt if we're just doing a, like, power rankings of teams from the era, they feel like they would be a, I don't know, put a number on it, like, the sixth best team over that time. Something on those lines. I don't think you would put the Blue Jays in the same kind of stratosphere across all of Major League Baseball if you're looking at it as the bow and flat era. Okay, so let's take it. So they made the playoffs. And so you think the Leafs are the six best team of the Austin Matthews aris. So from 2015, don't get bogged down in six, but I think they are a for, from, from a regular season perspective, you're like, factually correct. Okay, well, all the Blue Jays have to point to is regular season. Yes. Okay. Well, hey, man, I know you want to keep it guys on the other side of the glass. So again, part of this is we don't have the same length of time, right? For sure. Because we both agree that the 15 16 Blue Jays shouldn't be a part of this is a different deal. We agree. So that's very different conversation if they are. Let's start it with 20. Sure, because the young players arrived in 19, but they made the playoffs in the weirdo season of 20. So let's start it. Like, Jeff Asabardi, can you add up the Blue Jays record from 20 to, I guess this season, maybe include this season, maybe not, but like, give me where they rank as far as the American League leaders in wins since 2020. Yeah, I'd be very curious to hear. I cannot, I can guarantee that they're top six. Okay. But that's in the American League. Yeah. And there's no ties and loser points. And if we're doing, like this, this, the tough thing about a exact comparison like this, you can't even do like a points percentage because there's no percentage. You win or you lose. Yeah. I mean, there's winning percentage. But yeah, right. But it's not apples to apples. No, it's not apples to apples. I think what we can both like the the meme of the hand shaking is everybody sucks. I don't disagree, but I just because of my nature, I would like to do the meme of the guys flipping each other off. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. That's good. All right. And just to be just to clarify, there's an invisible version of the Leafs and Blue Jays in the middle of us and we're just flipping the opposite team off in that meme. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I hope I painted the picture for you all. Okay. So good job. We stumbled upon this. Well done. 20, I think. Yeah, maybe 20, 22. Blue Jays did factually make the playoffs and look pretty good to win a playoff game. That was when they scored runs like not as many as 2021, but they were pretty good. Do they get credit for blowing a game? They should have won? Is that what's happening here? No. Okay. I'm thinking of the different conversation. Oh, okay. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. I just like once I get in and argue, I'm bad for being like, let me just go back to that or not. Okay. All right. Verbal meme of handshakes and door guys being flipping each other off in the streets. Moving on, the point you were making. 2022. Okay. Blue Jays were actually above 500 when Charlotte Montoya was fired, but they were like, well, only four games over 500 when they right blew that series in Seattle, in came John Schneider and they won a bunch of games against the Royal Steam that was bad and they went into the all star break and they were pretty good. So I can have the season ended up with one more win in 22 with 92 than they did in the previous season 21 where they had 91 wins. And while 91 wins in 2021 was one game short of the playoffs, 92 was, they made the playoffs with room to spare in 22. But then they lost that second game in one of the more boy, short less like depressing postseason games in the history of the franchise where like the city. Yeah, George Springer had to be like, you can cart it off the field, John. It's just OK. It's just two of your three best players colliding into one another in the center field that one of them needed to be carted off. It's fine. Do people remember what a tasker Hernandez had two home runs in that game? He at least had one anyways, whatever. But John Schneider had to wear that one and he did a good job and he put on a happy face and was Oh, you know, this is a different era of Blue Jays baseball. This is a serious guy. Because remember at the time that Charlotte Montoya was fired that season, it wasn't just that they were floundering. The record was what it was was like, man, Bovishet didn't come out and explicitly say it. But like he was asked, he's like, yeah, I don't know. Maybe sometimes you need like he was like coming as close as anyone's ever come to throwing the outgoing manager under the bus. And being like, yeah, it was me that was kind of like the leader of this. This guy's got to go because he was again, according to all reporting, not professional enough, not keeping these players accountable enough just wasn't professional enough. It should be noted that under John Schneider's watch, they've become like somehow a worse base running team, like make worse base running mistakes, but no fun to be had in the dugout. Right. They got rid of it. Professional. Yeah, they got no fruit cocktails. Teoska Hernandez and Lourdes Gouriel Jr. And the jacket. Yeah. Okay. Gun to your head. Like if you had so this again, like we're talking about a couple of guys, I feel like we're making a lot of arguments. We're splitting hairs between two guys that have not been very good. Can we just go back to the Leafs? So Charlie Montoya got the Blue Jays into the playoffs in 2020. Yeah. Take from that, whatever you will. They played 60 games that season. Yeah. He got them within a game of the playoffs in 2021. Had them above 500 in 2022. John Schneider got them into the playoffs in 2022. He got them into the playoffs last season with 89 wins, which is too fewer than 91. If you know your math, which Charlie Montoya got them to in 2021. And he's got this team four games under 500. I mean, not that they shouldn't have fired Charlie Montoya, but the idea that that John Schneider, and it's not all his fault, right? Like it's different rosters and everything. But everything we were sold on with this guy and his in game strategy and holding people accountable. Here we are, George Springer leading off for the 7,000th day in a row. I mean, how different is it? No, you're, you're right to bring it up. I, I guarantee you, I was about to say, if you're a Schneider stand, but I don't know that there's, you know, there's like just his family, I think, and like the guys we're cheering for the meat shield, you can put, you can connect the dots as to who that is. I think they're the biggest John Schneider fans going. But yeah, I think he would say, I don't know, you give me a lineup with like Lord's Girl Junior and Tiosker Hernandez and a better version of Vlad. And you know, maybe my team looks a little different, but you cannot overstate. It is impossible to overstate how jarring it is that the guy who was brought in to give guys a kick in the butt, not a pat on the back. And it's going to be more serious. And it's about winning. And the first thing I'm going to do is bump a shutdown. It's jarring. But what it feels like to me in this conversation is it's a classic thing you do with teams that are just not good enough to win is that you look at the easiest thing to fix and go, oh, this guy's too serious. So we need a little more bongos in love in the in the clubhouse. And then guess what, when a team that's not good has a manager that's like that ego, you need a disciplinarian. I think ultimately, I mean, your mileage on a baseball manager may may vary. It's like, I don't think that's six of one half dozen of the other. They're very different in the way they go about it. But I don't think either of them has a material impact. But I think this is what happens when you have a middling team is that you do this constant, you know, teeter totter seesaw of okay, we need the disciplinary and we need the players coach. We need the disciplinary and we need the players coach. And I think it's just goes back to the problems here. And it ain't the manager. It's the lineup. Yeah. But to answer your question, if I have to do it, I'm sick and tired of hearing about having a beer post game. So what the hell bring back? Honestly, Jon Schneider might have taken some cues from Rick Tockett's media availability yesterday and after game four, where he's like, yeah, I know we're not supposed to be here, but you never know when you're going to be here again. And maybe think about that when you have a big lead in game two against the Mariners with Tay Oscar Hernandez, with Lorde Shuriel Jr. And with of Vladimir Guerrero Jr. That wasn't the 2021 version, but a guy that was pretty damn good, especially in retrospect, like 2022 version of Vladimir Guerrero Jr. Yeah, give me that. Yeah. And oh, maybe, maybe that was as good a time as any to capitalize. The problem is if you're doing the Rick Tockett of it all is, and I know you were making a different point to talk it made. But if he goes, there's a lot of passengers here, the team would go, yeah, including the guy who keeps putting George Springer in the lead off spot every day. That looks mighty passenger-ish. Yeah. All right. Last one before the wake and write. It's all bad. You had your one fleeting moment of like, here's three numbers that the Blue Jays about the Blue Jays that should make you feel not terrible yesterday. And we're all the way back today. Where did it all go wrong in the off season? Obviously not landing Joe Hill, Tony. Ah, you should have offered him a trillion dollars. I was going to say that. I wrote it down. It was the first note of my dog. He can't take that one. He can't take that one. You're off the back up? No, that's all I'm trying to say. I'll tell you what. Sign the guy. I was reading the song. I do have other. But please tell me yours. Okay, the worst move. It's kind of a dual fold thing. And it's honestly like it's a addition by subtraction here. Like signing Kevin Kiermeyer and Isaiah Kiner-Folefa, even if you don't get adequate, like you don't get different dudes that are like more offense. Like obviously you should have targeted players that have more of an offensive slant than the defense of slant that those two guys have. But with those guys on the roster, you're stuck. There's one like all the moves I talked about, like Daddison Barger, Relavus Martinez, Spencer Horowitz. It's for one roster spot because there's only one moveable one. That's Daniel Volgobock. And he will be DFA like eventually and that will be a spot that will be opened up and there'll be injuries again. I mean, that's how Addison Barger got here in the first place. But it's a lot easier if you have, I mean, the better version, honestly, of Isaiah Kiner-Folefa in Ernie Clement, although he hasn't been covering himself in glory defensively. He's a good defender. You don't need two Ernie Clement's on this team. You don't need a worse version offensively, a Dalton Varsho on this team. Those guys, and now that you've signed them and, you know, IKF is a multi-year deal as opposed to Kiermeyer, who's a one year deal, but you're not like, you're just factually nobody in baseball is waving goodbye to those guys at this point in the season or demoting them even if they have options, but like, you're not doing any of that stuff, right? And they're just like stuck there, providing defensive value. And boy, Isaiah Kiner-Folefa has been kind of what you expected offensively, which is not that good. But yeah, he's been fine. Like, he's had some hits. Kevin Kiermeyer had the best offensive season of his entire career in his 30s last year. The idea that you would bounce, you would bank on that in a second consecutive season. I understand you need a Dalton Varsho protection, but no, those guys are just clogging up the works. Like if you had two extra roster spots where you could just throw some more offensive players in the mix and play worse defense, no question. Boy, do you defend fly balls with Dalton Varsho, Kevin Kiermeyer, and George Springer in the outfield? Yeah, it's no good if you only score one or two runs a game. Yeah, no, I, you nailed it there. I think a lot of people would have expected you or I to come here and say, well, this free agent X would have been the guy that makes the difference, but you're right. It's just about opening up opportunities to the other guys who ultimately probably aren't changing things all that much, but at least and you have some clarity one way or another that you don't sit here and go, yeah, you got this magic bean down there. No, let's see what the magic bean is. And you have the ability to pivot as well. So yeah, I think over over commitment to players that aren't helping shocker, not great, not great. All right, time now for the Wakenryk presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown Sportsbook 19 plus bet responsibly. All right, are the Carolina Hurricanes going to become the 15 in NHL history to come back from down three. Oh, they have a chance to force a game seven at home against the Rangers tonight, seven o'clock on Sportsnet. And they are favored to do so minus 167, the Rangers plus 140 total five and a half in this one, Brian. Let's go over. I think these are two teams that are, that are going to be a little ornery. They want to kind of push things in here. I know Shostirken's been good for any interest in poking around on the other side of the series as well. So yeah, let's go with the over five and a half low number. You get over it plus 100. I'm feeling good about that there. I like the Rangers to end this right right now at plus 140. We're not that far removed from them being unbeaten in the postseason. And I know they have the capitals of for France. It's hard to even take anything from that. But like them looking like the best team in the Stanley Cup playoffs after they were up three on the hurricanes. I think they get back to that tonight. And like game, obviously in Vancouver, the pivotal game five between the Canucks and Oilers with the series tied up at two games a piece. Moneyline has the Canucks underdogs at home plus 125 Oilers minus 149, the total six and a half over again, Calvin Pickard. I know. Nice story. Not going to happen again. Spheloff's he's due for one six and a half is the total, but you get it a plus 100. So give me the over in that one. I like the Canucks and Elias Patterson bouncing back ever being called out by their head coach at plus money at home, not getting the respect against Calvin Pickard. Yeah, Rodney Dangerfield. Yeah, plus 125. Give me the Canucks in that game. That was the Wakenrike presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, we'll talk to your friend of mine, Luke Gastic, as the fan morning show continues, Ben and his Brent Gunning Sportsnet 590, the fan.
