[MUSIC] >> Fan, Morning Show Sports at 5.9 of the fan band, Ben and his brain gunning, was I 100% confident the Blue Jays were gonna be the worst team in the league when they had a 7.3 lead. And Genesis Cabrera was putting two on and Eric Swanson was warming. And then Jordan Romano was warming, maybe not. But Genesis Cabrera got himself out of it. And the Blue Jays hacked on two more on the bottom of the eighth inning as they beat the White Sox 9-3 in the series opener against the worst team in baseball. The only team in Major League Baseball that has scored fewer runs this season than the Toronto Blue Jays, game two goes tonight at Rogers Center. And the Blue Jays did the thing, not scoring nine runs. They did that thing too. But they did the thing where you did something. You didn't just sit back and hey, watch the number one power play unit that was won for 20, do the same thing without a single tweak. And you know what, same process, expecting different results. Maybe this is the time, like they finally. >> You love to bring the Leafs up and make me not, like, 'cause you know, you give me that window and I'm like, I don't know if it's the same comparing apples to apples. Do your J's right. But it's like every time the Leafs center I'm like, I don't know that it's fair to compare these two teams. Go ahead. Maybe that you're doing the same thing, expecting different results is where the connective tissue lies with the Maple Leafs process and the Blue Jays process. It's the most frustrating thing in sports as a sports fan, I think, where you see the thing and not it's, you need a level of patience that fans don't have, right? I get that. Totally 100%. If it were up to the fans, you'd be sending guys down to AAA in the middle of April which is AAA. Yeah. So you'd be, you'd be done eating. Bootyfield. Yeah. Thank you. You'd be, you'd be like, oh, you're getting paid anyways, making them serve concessions, whatever. You'd be, yeah, you'd be doing outrageous things if you were a fan in charge of, especially a major league baseball team where the runway is so long and it's a large sample sport, I get it. You can't operate that way. You can't. But at a certain point, and especially considering the sample of 162 games last year, and in the case of George Springer, like almost all of the 162 games where he was the most healthy he's ever been as a member of the Toronto Blue Jays, providing the lowest amount of offense he's ever produced in his entire career in the bat looking especially slow. Mm-hmm. Finally. Yes. The rock has, no, finally, the Blue Jays have decided that enough's enough and it's not everything and line of construction isn't going to take you from the second worst offense in baseball. So the, but it's not like that's the linchpin, right? Like, oh my God, now George Springer is in offending our sensibilities with his elite office. He's 28 years old. All of a sudden. No, but like it's not like all of a sudden they're going to turn into this great offense, but that they're doing something to address the issue or acknowledging that the sample is now grown to a size that it's undeniable is at least heartening. Yeah. No, I, I'm sorry. I just didn't, I wanted to make sure you got to hammer your point on there. Yeah. I agree. It is heartening to see it. It's something we've been clamoring for here. You do want accountability. You also, baseball is the sport that it is the hardest to have the patience in. Could you have to watch it and when it's not going well every single day. So you want to bang your head against the wall if it's not working. It is nice to see. I do wonder how, I wonder how internally they would view this. Is this a experiment? Is this the way forward for them? Is this a, let's reshuffle the deck chairs and see what happens. I think that's the most interesting question I would have about all this. I agree. From a fan perspective, you're thrilled to see it. I wonder what, and obviously, you know, they're going to react to the situation. I don't think they go into this with a set way of this is how we're going to do it 10 games from now. But I do wonder what they thought this would be if they thought it be a reset, if this is the way forward or just something that needed to happen because it could not continue the way things were going. Public comments, they seem to indicate and I'm going to defer to the people who operate and have conversations with major league baseball players on the regular that these guys love to know where they're hitting. They love this level of consistency. Now you don't get to have it when you don't perform and like how much could you love it when you're Boba Shedd and you've got an OBS of like 430 like that just seems like you can love hitting somewhere else just as much if you're going to perform to that level. But yeah, I do think that if, I mean, especially if you're riding on the success of a thing happening that this is going to be the lineup for the foreseeable future and you don't want to go. You don't want to go from the team that was like the most consistent and the most low to move off of a plan to the team that's like, all right, now all of a sudden we're every day is a new lineup and a new lead off hitter today and we just draw the lineup out of a hat. I don't necessarily think that's the right way to go about things. But yeah, it seems clear that that was the right moment for a change and they made it. The next thing that's coming and who knows maybe all of a sudden the offense is unlocked and you're not in a level of frustration. And one of the major topics of conversation that Ross Atkins addressed over the weekend was some of the incredible performances the Blue Jays are getting a triple A, which continue. Now, the fit is not obvious and Daniel Volgobock hit his first home run as a Blue Jays finally mercifully and he was the most obvious guy where you could create roster flexibility by no offense to Daniel Volgobock, sending him off into the wilderness, which he's been sent off into. He knows all the places to hang out in the woods because he's been sent there by a myriad of teams, including this very same one. So like he and boy, if you were running down the lock cabin out there, if you were looking at the list of probable outcomes for Daniel Volgobock, like somewhere there was like best hitter in baseball, but it was like, I think it was more likely his Blue Jays tenure this time around ended the same way as the previous one where he's DFA'd. So like that's still a roster spot, but like, where does a Relvis Martinez fit in? If he's committing 12 errors in like 30 games at second base and you've got Davis Schneider playing that position. And if you want Kevin Kiermeyer playing alongside Dalton Varshow on occasion in the outfield, there's not an obvious fit, but if we get back to the thing, if this is, and we've seen one game blips like this, if this, if yesterday's nine run output against the worst human baseball in the Chicago White Sox is a blip and not something that's a little bit more sustainable over the long haul and you're still getting these great starting pitching performances, but the offense is sinking you again. The second thing outside of the lineup construction and taking George Springer out of the leadoff spot, which again is not the cure all, you know, it's actually more effective than like changing the lineup up and where guys are hitting and reorganizing the deck chairs on that Titanic is getting better chairs. So you're saying it might not be the X's nose could be the Jimmy's and Joe's could be Jimmy's and Joe's. Yeah, that's that's the great special that Jimmy. And you know what? That's the harder conversation. You think it was hard to go to George Springer and say, Hey, man, I know you're you're trying to set the record for most leadoff home runs in major league baseball history. And you're a proud veteran, but we're removing you from the leadoff spot. That's one conversation, but the next one is way more difficult. And he's not going to be part of it because his contract, yeah, like you're you're never going to say, Hey, George, for your not an everyday player anymore. No, no, I don't think now, and even the defense that he provides. But what you might have to get to is a point where, okay, where is the like roster flexor or where's the lineup flexibility here? And it might be Kevin Kermier is more of a part time player. Isaiah Kiner, Filefa, who was always supposed to be my knowledge of a part time player. Maybe you're getting less playing time. Well, this is where the crossbar comparisons do make sense because once you have that conversation with George Springer, who makes whatever it is, 26 sheets a year, whatever, it's it's kind of hard for Kevin Kermier to feel a type of way about that conversation being had with him. So that is why I think there is there is potentially a like, you know, a more of a positive kind of web out of that Springer conversation than just what happens with Springer. But it's all good now because the Blue Jays score nine runs in a game against the worst team in baseball to pull themselves to within four guy, four games of 500. Their first set of back-to-back victories this month. Let's talk to our insider brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect excellence online and in the showroom, visit Don Valley, North Lexus.com today's insider Chai Davidi of sportsnet and sportsnet.ca, how's it going, Chai? All right. How are you? I'm doing all right. The Danny Janssen two hole experiment seems to be paying off nicely. Was that an act of desperation and is it good to be desperate at this time of year? There is. I mean, I don't want to call it desperation, but I think there's an element of just not a way that is cluster, their most productive hitters together. And Danny Janssen right now is without a doubt one of their most productive hitters. And you want to pair him with David Schneider and bottom of your arrow and Boba shut. And obviously the dividends were immediate yesterday. But it's also that you're in this spot is an ideal that you're experimenting with your lineup as John Schneider put it quite aptly, they don't live in an ideal world right now. And they made it work. So I wouldn't be surprised to see it again. And you know, Danny Janssen has been the one guy who right from when he returned from the injured list has been hitting and you want to just keep riding that as long as you can. Yeah, you want to you want to give Jano as many of bats as you can right now. I feels to me, you know, and this isn't a knock on, you know, bow heating up a bit, Vlad finding it. But it's like, that's the guy I have the most confidence in at the dish right this very second. It's not lost on me that they make these changes right as the schedule softens up a little bit. Do you read anything into that? Do you think it just got to a point where you couldn't go forward anymore? Cause I can kind of make both cases. I can sit here and say, well, if you were going to, if you were always or you wanted to be a believer in spring or in the lead off spot or things like that, this would be the stretch that you would say, okay, this is your last chance. If you can't do it against these guys, we have to make the move. But I can also see a world where if you are going to shake the lineup up, you want to put your team in a position to be successful and, you know, nothing is ever easy and majorly baseball and you can't assume anything. But if there was ever going to be a chance for a new look lineup to work, it would be against this kind of run of teams. Do you read anything into the timing and how that kind of sets up with the softer schedule? I don't think it's tied to the softer schedule. It's really just tied to the schedule in general and some of the math that's right now not looking particularly promising for the blue cheese. They are even like you take an objective projection like Fangrabs. It has them finishing the season at 81 and 81. And if you're going to make up the ground, that's about four games back of the projection for the third wildcard right now. And if you're going to make up some ground, it's sort of now or never. And it had been seven and a half weeks. This lineup hadn't clicked. That's a pretty good amount of runway. We're creeping a little out of small, sample size randomness and we're creeping into going to do something about this sample size. And that's where the blue cheese at. So it's not tied so much to the opponent as to just some of the realities of falling six games below 500, which they were on the weekend and needing to dig themselves out of that before it became an insurmountable hold of climb from. I'll miss the George Springer lead off conversations we had routinely. I'll have to move on to something else, I guess, but I wonder how different it was this time around because this isn't the first time it's happened to George Springer happened last year, but it was an established veteran and an all star and a guy that had plenty of lead off experience usurping him there for a time in Whitmerryfield. This time it's David Schneider, who's performed well in his brief time as a major leaguer, but doesn't have the same track record. Was there a difference in the way George Springer took this round of being demoted out of the lead off spot? I mean, when I had a conversation with him about it, he basically said, you know, I haven't lived up to my end of the bargain. And there was an understanding of the realities for himself, the team. And when talking about David Schneider, he said, look, he deserves it, right? He's performing, he's done well for the team, so where the blue cheese are at right now, a lot of that stuff just has to get pushed aside, right? It's early and it's worth kind of knowing that, but it's not early for where they are with their record. I think if they were like one game over, one game under, they were sort of floating around there, you can say, oh, it's early, there's still time, but you know, once you fall, six games under 500, I mean, that's a lot of work just to get yourself back level. And so I just think that was, that was a factor. And look, the guys got a five, five something OPS into seven and a half weeks in the season. I mean, what are you going to say? No, there's nothing to say. It's really, yeah, I mean, that's what the money's for as well. So David Schneider does take over the lead off responsibilities. He's been on base a ton this season. The numbers are still pretty spectacular. He is 25 years old and just turned 25 in January and we understand the windows closing on bow and Vlad, whether they extend them or not. Those guys only have one more year of team control, but David Schneider, like nobody calling him an MVP, but seems pretty clearly an above average offensive player and less like there's still a level of disbelief within the organization of what they've seen. At the major league level. Like what is his emergence as maybe like a core piece done to the timeline of this generation of Blue Jays teams? That's a good question. I haven't really considered it yet. I do still think it's early to say, okay, here's a core piece and is it timeline changing? But look, I've pointed this out a number of times I feel like it's a bit of a broken record, but they've got 17 players or 65% of the roster. It's eligible for free agency over the next two falls. They've got to start replenishing from within and they haven't done that from the position player side very much. David Schneider's emergence is critical in that aspect and it really can't stop at him if you're going to talk about changing the timeline or extending the window or whatever you know, it's got to be one of or a couple of, you know, Elvis Martinez and Addison Barger and Nathan Lucas and Spencer Horowitz and Will Roberts and Leo Jimenez and a couple guys from that group needs to emerge and be a factor too. And at that point, we can have a realistic conversation about, you know, extension of the window or replenishing of the core because really, you know, one guy, one guy helps obviously, but again, you're talking about 65% of the roster that's coming due over the next two off seasons. That's a massive amount of turnover and something that's a real challenge to manage your games if you're in the front office. And so it's a really important development, no doubt and, you know, full credit to David Schneider for just refusing to settle in his career and forcing his way into more and more playing time at every level he's been at throughout his career. But, you know, I think in terms of altering the timeline and things of that nature, we're not quite necessarily there just yet. For sure, full credit to David Schneider for everything he's done, but we should also give full credit to Ben Ennis for his unwavering commitment to the babe, except he doesn't like calling him the babe. So I just like if we're going to give credit around Ben has just truly been drive driving it off. I can look at a baseball reference page and I can see a guy's minor league stats and I could see him perform pretty similarly to what he's done throughout the course of his major league or his professional career and said, yeah, like I'd like to see that play out over a longer period of time. Okay. So with the exception of Ben, no one thought this was coming from from David Schneider. At a certain point in time, when does the, when does the kind of like, I know we're kind of dancing around this, but it's like irrelevant Martinez. The guy is hitting the fact that the J's could use that. I guess they were comes a point where you, I don't know if it's seen as a capitulation on the season, but you know, you mentioned those guys, it's like you'd like to know if you have another David Schneider kind of poking around and I just wonder at what point we, we get there in the season. I know they're not ready to do that yet and, you know, Atkins wasn't coming out on Saturday to say that, but you know, I, I'd be lying if I said what you've got at a Schneider doesn't make me want to see and not that I think you're going to be able to replicate it with a Luke's or a Martinez or any of the guys we've talked about, but I do think you get to a certain point in time where you just have to kind of pull the trigger and see what you've gotten those guys know they did that a little bit with Barger, but it was such a kind of short run. Yeah. I mean, that was also tied to an injury. For sure. Eight percent. They had a roster spot open with, with Kevin Keermeyer and so that led to, to that move. But yeah, I mean, it's a great question. And I think that's one that's being debated in the Blue Jays front office right now. Like when is the right time and you got to be careful, right? Because there is a lot of Fools gold in Triple A numbers and the transition isn't always easy. And Addison Barger was hitting about as well as you could possibly hit at Triple A when he came up and you saw what a struggle it is for him. And I was actually talking to someone about this yesterday and they said, you know, it's, it's not a great situation to call someone up to debut in the major leagues when you're not hitting and your desk really hoping that that person comes up and starts hitting. And so ideally, you know, the lineup's in a bit of a better spot and, you know, Martinez or whoever it is comes up and they just have to contribute. They don't have to sort of provide that, that jolt of energy. And that that's what makes the Davis Schneider so unique, right, the Davis Schneider story so unique. You remember like last year they were grinding too, right? They've just gotten, I think swept by Baltimore or lost two or three Baltimore at home and kind of looks good at all during it. And then up comes Davis Schneider and he just like sparks them to a really important series win in Boston that helped them recover and then he just kept on hitting for the next few weeks before tapering off. And so the Martinez, then the Martinez or whoever it's going to be, you got to be careful that you're not putting too much on that player. Martinez does have work to do defensively. That's pretty unanimous from all the people that I've spoken to. The person I spoke to yesterday believed that he could come up and be an effective major league hitter right now, but he said, you know, where does he play? And that is the ongoing question about about Rob is like where, where can he settle in defensively and can the J's get him comfortable enough between second and third that he can get enough reps or is there an injury that creates another pathway? Well, how is he committing so many errors in second base? Do you have any idea how those are happening? Is that like, I imagine they're throwing errors and that's the shortest throw in the infield. What's happening there? Yeah, I mean, I don't, I don't have a breakdown or anything like that. His arm is not the issue as from what I've heard, like that he's got ample arm, he's got ample arm to play on the left side of the diamond, but I have heard conversations about his footwork and just getting himself steady there. And again, I don't have enough information to say whether it's a bit of a hands or whatever the case may be, but suffice to say that there are enough discussions about his defense and where it fits that that an area of focus for him and an area that he needs to shore up to, you know, to really force a pathway. Yeah, I mean, we've come a long way in evaluating defense. It's not, it's not all about fielding percentage or errors, but like when you have double digits and it's like middle of May, like that's, you can't ignore that no matter what the scoring is like in triple A. All right, before we let you go, Ross Hacking speaks on the weekend. And I think says the thing that we all expected him to say and gets people upset. But again, naturally, like, I don't know what, what else he is supposed to say. How different are the conversations you think behind closed doors with this executive team, by which I mean, like, are they having an honest assessment of this offense and wondering legitimately whether like as Buck Martinez eloquently asked them, like, do you think they are asking the same questions? Are these guys good enough to score enough runs? I mean, yes, but the, the primary question, I think that it is being asked, like, what can we do to get these guys going at the plate? Because whether or not you're like, right guys, wrong guys, at this point, these are your guys, right? So you're, you've got to write or die. And yeah, you can augment from triple A and Ross mentioned the triple A team enough times that it made it sound like, yeah, okay, they're getting to the point that they might consider forcing the issue with some of these players, but beyond sort of maxing out what they have internally, there isn't a ton of, there aren't a ton of options for them, like, you can make a trade, but it's super hard. And, you know, the, the, the Arise deal is a bit of a unicorn and the Padres are willing to force the issue, and they have the prospect depth with which to force the issue, and something that the Blue Jays can't do in quite the same way. And so you're, you're almost stuck. And I hesitate to say sort of surrendering the fate, you know, I used that earlier with the lineup, but I do think there is a degree of surrendering the fate right now, because this is your team. This is the team you built. These are the decisions you made in the off season, and you sound like you can go back into into late December, early January and say, you know what, we'll, we'll overpay for Jock Peterson, or, you know, whatever the case may be, whatever move, maybe we'll, we'll try to force Cody Ballinger's hand or debate, whatever move you want to debate. So they, they, everything has to be about figuring out some, figuring out how to get their players back to their projections, because a lot of the majority of the players on this roster from an offensive perspective aren't performing to projections, and, and that's a major issue. So if they can correct that, then this team will have a chance to fight for a wildcard spot. And if they can't, then we're going to be looking at a vastly different trade deadline. No, I don't put it on them that, that some of these players have been performed to their career averages, but yeah, you're right. There is a level of accepting their fate that there's only so much you can do, but like do the little things that you can do. And they started to do it with the lineup, and yeah, the next one will be, sorry, like somebody's got to be DFA'd and Daniel Volgobock would be the obvious candidate to free up a roster spot. Somebody needs to be called up from Triple A. Somebody needs to start losing playing time. Like, that's the next thing that needs, that gets not a ton, it's, it's no obvious fix all, but like, yeah, the idea that you wouldn't explore that possibility is not so considering how poor this lineup is performed offensively, not yesterday though. So all is fixed. I will see if it goes the same way tonight against the White Sox shy. It's a pleasure, buddy. Yeah, you guys got it during the week. You too. Jada Vidi, our insider, brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect excellence online and in the showroom, visit Don Valley, North Lexus dot com. That's the thing. Like you can, you can accept your fate and you can say this is the roster and it's like, did we make a mistake this offseason? Yeah, maybe, but we can't go back and correct that. That's all probably true. But there are like little things and it's, it's not just like window dressing, right? Like it's, there is a marginal impact having George Springer not take the most played appearances on the team at the lead off spot can have. Hey, is it a guarantee that a Ralphus Martinez can hit Major League pitching? Absolutely not. But here's what I know. Like this lineup say for yesterday, you can't agree. So let's roll the dice on somebody else. Yeah, I wholeheartedly agree. I've seen enough. I've been on record you and I have this debate and you were on the other side of it. But seeing this, maybe your bill come a little more to me. If you're going to suck, suck scoring runs, like I am done watching just a fruitless offense and Alec Manoa coming rising like a Phoenix to be great. And I don't know the one that came, but like it not mattering. I am done, done, done with that. I need to see guys that can hit if Martinez can do it, give him a look. Maybe he can't. Probably he can't. I'd even go as far to say with the way prospect percentages work out in this sport. But I'd like to see it, obviously the defense is what's holding him back. I feel like that goes without saying. But I think that that is much more a like organizational philosophical thing that they are the if you can't break, you got to be the pitching and defense team. And Martinez is it's no matter how much he's going to hit, he isn't going to fix it with his bat alone. And I think that that's why they're so hesitant is that, you know, they'd be fine if he struggled defensively. But with the amount of errors, it's like black hole-ish. Yeah. And then committed 11 as a second baseman and like, do you took one away? I feel like it's that 12 last week and like, do you want your 22-year-old as a DH now? But like, would you live with it if he's like one of the best power hitter in the minor league? Yeah. She's been over the last two years. Yes. Yes. You would. And like, is Justin Turner like all his bones going to turn to dust if he plays third base too many times? Maybe. But let's see it. That's what the money's for. All right. That's what we mean. But man, it is. Yeah. Luke Fox is going to earn his money this afternoon when he asks Craig Barouba all the tough questions. We've got a preview of what he's going to ask. Coming up next is the Fan Morning Show continues. Ben Ennis, Brent Gunning. Sports at 590 the Fan. Breaking down the top stories in the NHL every day, The Jazz Marriage Show. Subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Good morning, show sports at 590 the Fan Ben Ennis, Brent Gunning. Hey, 32 thoughts is good. Yeah. It's pretty good. You know, you know what's almost twice as good? Um, spitballing like 57 of them, 57 straight thoughts on the Toronto Maple Leafs, one of Luke Fox's most recent some great, great stuff coming out of that thing, including his verbal abuse at the hands of Bruins fans. The great Luke Fox of Sportsnet and Sportsnet.ca joins us online right now. Well done with 57 straight thoughts. I think I'm going to get a note from Elliott. I think he's going to be angry. Yeah, I think the note is just going to be like the emoji with like the like thumb scratch in the chin. Like what are we doing here? What are we doing here? I like it. I like it. You got to be an agitator in this business. Yeah. You don't get an Elliott's kitchen. Yeah. He's just fridge and he always will be, but let him know like you're here and you're poking around. Yeah, you should do what he does to be like 147 thoughts and do like five thoughts, like don't do the number that you claim to do, you know, I like that. I like that for you. Anyways, you don't have to weigh in on that. You don't have to start a blood feud with Elliott Fran. Unless you want. Yeah, floor shorts. No? Other people love to think, right? Yeah. There we go. Latipoy. All right, so 11 o'clock today, Sportsnet, 590 the fans, Sportsnet, Ontario, Craig Baroube introduced to the assembled masses, including our very own Luke Fox. What are you expecting today? Oh, I don't know. I don't know what. Yeah. I don't know. I feel it's so anti-climatic because the news came out Friday evening and we're not going to meet with them until until Tuesday. Are we sure it didn't come out like two weeks ago when Bissonnette named on a TNT panel? Yeah, it felt like the worst kept secret. You know, it felt a lot actually like the trade living hiring. You know, it was like, this is the front runner and it's just a matter of time and there you go. But I guess I want to hear from Baroube, his vision for how he's going to deal with star players in particular. I think that's what I'm curious what he has to say about that. And maybe the plans for the assistant coaches, I think we're all assuming. Maybe that Mike Van Ryan is safe because he was on the St. Louis Blues bench when Baroube got his ring. So that's what kind of what we're assuming, but that hasn't been made official yet. And then what sort of changes are they going to make? It feels like a, it feels like a mistake, quite honestly, which is hard, hard, harsh to say to bring Guy Boucher back just because he oversaw a power play that was an absolute disaster when they needed it most. And it showed signs that it needed fixing in the last month of the season, I'd say, like it was struggling going into the playoffs. So it shouldn't have been a big surprise that the least power play went one for 21. And you know, anyone who's watching the Oilers punch their ticket to the conference final, they're well over 30%. And I think they're 33 something. And it just shows how important special teams are and special teams were a big undoing of the Leafs. Now there's rumors that maybe Mark Subard is that guy, but right now he's, you know, still under contract with Calgary. And we know Trey Living's history with the Flames hasn't made it easy to pry people from the Flames to the Leafs organization. So I guess that's some curiosity of mine is what shakes out with the assistants. But I think everyone kind of knows, you know, Buru-based MO. We know what kind of guy he is, what kind of coach he is. Okay. There's a million things to pick out from this. And this is not the most important of it, but I can't get it out of my mind. So I have to talk to you about it. We talk a lot about whether the Leafs job is a good job, a great job. Like, how was it viewed? Are we sure you want to be the coach that's coming in here as an assistant to be the guy to fix the power play? Because it's certainly not going to be Craig Buru-based fault. Like whatever we think about him, I don't think anybody thinks of him as somebody who is just going to have that power play humming. I mean, we'd like it to be, but I don't think we're ready to put that all on his shoulders. And the players have been here and they've worn it to a certain extent. But then we've also looked around and said somebody should be able to figure this thing out. Like, do you want to be, obviously, yes, like anything, if it works, of course you want to be that guy. But are we sure that's like a plum job, being a Leafs assistant, I'm sure it's great. But do you want to be the guy that gets brought in to task with the job of, hey, fix this power play? Sure. But I would disagree with you that it doesn't fall on the head coach. The head coach is responsible for special teams. That's something he can fix. If the assistant isn't doing a good enough job, and yes, Sheldon Keith said, okay, Gee Boucher, this is your job, this is your sole job, you run with it. But ultimately, if it's not working, it falls on the head coach. Oh, no, I think it ultimately does fall on the head coach. I just think that if in January we're having this conversation, I think there were a lot of people who were going to be sitting here going like the job we view Craig or the task we look at Craig Brube with doing, obviously, it's like winning a cup. But there's going to be so many other markers for him. It's accountability. It's how tough is this team? It's our guys being held accountable with their ice time. And I just think that the power play is not that it's not going to fall under his purview eventually. I just think early on there are going to be many other ways we look at Brube to kind of put his imprint on this team, then the power play, but I don't know, maybe that's just me. I don't know, I agree with you. From anyone you talk to, we're not bringing in some guy that's a mastermind at Exis and O's. He's not a master tactician. He's more of a motivator. And I actually think these guys, the core players have reached that point where that's what they need. I agree with Trey Living when he said we needed a new voice. I do think they need a new voice. I think they need someone to rattle the cage a little bit and see if they can push a better performance, particularly in games that matter out of these guys. I mean, I don't know how much you guys have watched, watched the second round, but I felt like that so many star players elevated their game or just the will that was my favorite of the 57 because the 57 thoughts, because I can't help but think it every time I watch one of these second round. And then these conference championship games is like how different it looks than the leaf games that we saw, even in the seven games against the Bruins. Yeah. And the Bruins, you know, did anyone at any point think, yeah, they probably are going to beat the Panthers? No. You know, so no. So I just feel like there's another level these guys have to get. And I do think a lot of it is roster construction. I do think you have to find better defense, but you have to go out and get a better goal. I do think there's simple things like that that aren't falling on the coach, but I do think the coach needs to see if he can milk a little more juice out of these guys when it when the chips are down. So a lot of that will happen behind closed doors, but Craig Barouba has shown he's not adverse to coaching through the media. It's different in St. Louis than it is in Toronto. How much of part of his arsenal do you think, you know, being Kurt or direct or honest when assessing his team through the media, will he be? Yes. Well, he's definitely going to give shorter answers than Sheldon Keith did. You know, he's I covered him during the 19 cup run. And you know, he's pretty brief and to the point he doesn't elaborate too much. You know, he gets his message across pretty quickly. He's going to be a different style of coach through the media than Sheldon Keith. He's less chatty, put it that way. I would be shocked if he ever criticized someone. And then the next day, you know, softened his previous day's criticism that I think he tells it like it is. But you know what? He doesn't single out guys, you know, he'll get his point across, but I would be also surprised if he said, you know, William Neelander was horrible tonight. I don't think he's going to name guys, but I don't think he's going to hide from the truth. You know, you talk to guys who played for him and they talk about his honesty. And a lot of players like that. They want to know where they stand with the coach, but some were kind of surprised just how honest he was or how to the point he was. And you know, I think he's going to be savvy enough, you know, even after he was fired, he was doing some some media, you know, part of that's PR to get your name out there and say, Hey, I'm available. But he understands that side of the game. So I don't think he's going to be throwing guys under the bus. I think he's going to manage it quite well, but I also think he's not going to shy from the truth. Is it fair to say that whatever Rick Talkett did in the Euler series is kind of like the blueprint there of making it very apparent to all of us. We know who he's talking about, but he doesn't say the name like I kept going back to that that it wasn't lost on me that we all know like, sure, you can throw a couple of other guys in there. But that was always about Elias Petterson. And by not saying his name, it did allow it to kind of, well, it's a Canadian market and a guy's not performing in the playoffs. So, you know, as quiet as it could possibly be. But yeah, I thought that was kind of a masterclass by Talkett. And I can imagine we do see, see kind of a lot of that from from Barouba. A lot of other things in your, in your piece, you mentioned, I don't know, I'm trying to remember if you worded it as you've changed your mind or just kind of maybe come more to the realization. But it seems like John Tavares is going to be on this team next year. I don't know that that should be surprising to people. But man, we were talking about waving no moves. And it was two years ago that he got asked to point blank at the end. Why do you think it is? Is it just how hard it is to do that deal? Is it that maybe the change comes from elsewhere? What or maybe how is your thinking of all done on Tavares since the seasons ended? Well, there's two sides to this. One, I think that John really loves it here is since he's assigned here as a free agent. You know, as three kids, he got, he lives right in the city. I think he loves being a maple leaf. He loves being the captain. I don't think he's too phased by the noise. I think he just goes out there and does this thing. So on his part, I don't see him wanting to wave it. Secondly, go look at what sentiment are available and then compare that to what Tavares is. And I know he's not worth 11 million anymore. And I think he knows that. But to get rid of him, I already think they need to go out and find another center. I don't think even if they bring back Max Dombi, I like his flexibility to play wing and center. But I don't love David Camp as your number three. He's fine as number four. He's overpaid as number four, but he's fine as number four. So they need more center depth. I think that was a need that they ignored at the trade deadline. So if you try to talk Tavares into waving, then you need to replace Tavares plus you need to find another one. So from the team perspective, I think it's just, he's going to be difficult to replace. And I think he would be missed more than people think just because they're just thinking of the cap hit. But he's still a decent player. Look at the world. He's one of the best guys on a pretty good team Canada squad over there. He can still play. And he's so, and he's so dedicated to fighting father time here that he's going to do everything in his power to be a relevant player again next year. Can he eat less sugar? Fewer fat? I thought he kind of maxed that out, but okay. More sleep. I guess. More sleep. No, he has young children. No more sleep. Back to the coach thing for a second here at Luke because yeah, the announcement comes Friday of a long weekend. It's just fun. Fun little stuff. You love that I just got off the golf course and I had to go find my laptop. Oh, I thought I was mad at your living for that. Let me talk about it. Oh, God. That's so much worse. Anyway, so yeah, that happens. I mean, the timing was interesting with the Carolina Hurricanes being eliminated right before that that announcement was made. You know, we didn't hear any reporting on Joel Quenville, like how many other intimations, like those are the two guys that and and and Brindomore doesn't have the same Stanley Cup like bona fides. These only one second round series once and they won no games in the conference final, but yeah, clearly if he was available would have been at the top of anybody's heap. Like do you have any ideas to whether they did inquire about either Brindomore or Quenville? I don't know for sure about Brindomore. I do know that, you know, Brindomore would have been coveted by the Leafs and other teams looking for to fill the coaching vacancy, but he really didn't entertain it at all. Like he he only had had eyes for for Carolina. So and the owner Tom Dunton used that to his advantage and got him at a reasonable rate. He got a race. I don't know exactly what it is, but it wasn't as much as the upper upper echelon of of current coaches. And for Quenville, I do think there was some level of interest there. And the NHL was like, no, and a good question to ask yourself is, how would it look league wide if all of a sudden this this ban or, you know, this indefinite, you know, suspension of Quenville and Bowman was suddenly lifted the week the Leafs were hunting for a head coach. How would that look? It's just as bad as if the second the Leafs hire their head coach, the ban is lifted and he can go be a head coach in a market that's literally any other market would be quieter. Like that is the thing I have long wondered about this is that if the NHL had their, like I see the way you're looking at it is the league doesn't want to be seen to do favors for Toronto. But I don't know if that happens, there's a first time for everything. I don't think this league is in the business of doing favors for the Maple Leafs. It kind of seems to go the other way from my perspective anyways, that my read on it is the exact, not the exact opposite because I agree with you, there would be people who kind of get the antennas up. But do they not, does it not look just as bad the other way if six weeks from now the ban is lifted and he's coaching elsewhere? I'd be stunned if it happened this summer. I don't, I don't think it's happened this year. But you're right. It would, it would look, it would look odd if it happened later this summer, but I don't think it's happening. Cause I, my, like, I obviously this will shock you, I have not done reporting on this. But my spidey sense on this thing all along has been like, yeah Joel Quenville can coach once there's no way he's going to coach in the Leafs or like even think like a Rangers market they wouldn't necessarily want him in. Like I think he's going to be able to go coach when it's somewhere quiet, but you know, that's, that's just kind of my read on it. I don't know. Last one from me, do you think the players were consulted at all, like not that you want the inmates running the asylum, but you got the, the best goal score in the National Hockey League under your employee. He's not going anywhere. Do you think Austin Matthews was not part of the decision making or whether the, he was part of it at all. Like whether he was consulted before Craig Barube was hired. Yeah. I don't know. That's a good question. Ben, I mean, for sure they would have asked about the coaching staff during their exit meetings and what they thought of Keith, what they thought of the assistance. And then it was pretty clear after those meetings that they wanted to move on. Was he asked about, I don't know the answer to that. My response would be, I hope not, you know, I think they've had a lot of things made easy for them. You know, I think specifically about Brendan Shanahan calling the core players after they got rid of Dubas, the man who, who made them all multi-millionaires and said, hey, don't worry, you're not going anywhere just because we're, we're getting rid of the GM. You know, I think it's worth asking the players what they think of the coaching staff. But I think this decision should be made without them, whether it was, I can't tell you for sure. No, I wholeheartedly agree. We do have to be quick. So I'll actually be tight here, Luke. But should we, do we know who's going to be up there with Craig Barube today? And should we read anything into that? I'm not saying Keith Pelley is going to be there, but like, do we think this is a Shanahan and for living and Barube? Is it just Barube and should we read into whoever's up there with him? I would expect just trade living. I mean, this was his hire, this was, this was, yeah, Shanahan left this up to him. So I would expect just those two guys. Well, it'll be super interesting. Can't wait. Can't wait to see you grill him. Just absolutely just. You're going to be a tough one, Craig, but I know he's going to be all those players. I have to catch a flight to New York. I'm covering, panters, so I don't know if I'm going to be able to squeeze it in. I got to, I got to look at my time. He'll be there. In spirit. I'll be there in spirit. See you, buddy. Okay. Take care of you guys. All right, Luke Fox sports that sports that that's a author of the newest sensation 57 thoughts. Mm hmm. So wrote like a rap book. Go check it out. It's on this Twitter. Yeah. It's hilarious. I love that Luke has that passion. He does. Um, yeah, it's so I get what he's saying about Austin Matthews and the players not being you know, a decision maker. You can't have that and God, no, yeah, I do wonder though, when you have a star player of Austin Matthews, ilk, yeah, and I'd maybe Austin Matthews would be the same thing as the Connor McDavid thing where it's like, I don't want anything to do with this. Like that's your deal. Mm hmm. But yeah, it's an interesting thing that has already happened here in that Mike Babcock and him didn't seem to get along. Yes. I think is it fair to say? I think so. But right out of the get go safe to say Mike Babcock didn't get along with a lot of people on this stage. Sure. But that guy specifically in the relationship he had with Austin Matthews is reason number one that the team gave up on him and that he departed that that. And not that Austin Matthews knows exactly what Craig Baroube would be bringing to the Toronto Maple Leafs as the head coach. But yeah, I don't know. Do you give him a heads up? It's a great point Luke brings up about, hey, these guys have already been too close to the decision making process. I think there's one way. And there's one way you listen to Austin Matthews in this. If he was in lockstep with how you felt about it and he's like, hey, we do need to change. I love Keith, but there's time for a new voice. Then I think you go, agreed. We're in lockstep. Otherwise, I think you'd take it and you listen to what he says. But no, I mean, if Austin Matthews is a pick of the head coach, this team will probably be like Shane Done or something. So I'm not going to say it is. Shane Dope. I'm pretty capable. Yeah. Yeah. Craig Baroube. I don't think Matthew should have made the decision. But I think if there's one person who's opinion taken to account and that's because you believe in what he can be at the new place of this, it has to be that guy. But he shouldn't have been picking. Shouldn't have even been given a list or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. I think Mitch Marner found out the same time we did when the press released. Would need to shock about that. All right. 11 o'clock today, Sportsnet 5.9 in the fans, Sportsnet Ontario. You can listen and watch Craig Baroube's introductory news availability. All right. It's been the fan morning show, Ben Anis, Brian Gunning, Sportsnet 5.9 in the fan. Good morning. All right.
