-♪♪ -day morning show. Gunner and Daniele here with you. Blue Jays back at it tonight. Kevin Gosman on the bump. Looking to hold down the fort against the Cleveland Guardians. Quick little check-in. Where are we at on Cleveland Guardians? What? Three? Four years into it now? Does it just feel like it's part of the furniture of Major League Baseball yet to you in terms of a name? Or do you still get, like, caught a touch off guard? -A smidge. -A smidge off guard, occasionally. But you know what? I think now it's sort of, it's sort of settled in a little bit more. 'Cause I'm with you. I was listening to Blair and Barker yesterday. By the way, everybody should. They do a great job, as always, on a daily basis. They were -- They had Jason Kipnis on, who was, of course, part of, like, the World Series team for Cleveland and was it 2016 when they lost to? I think it was '16 when they lost to the cops. I don't know. The greatest game ever played. -On, on, unbelievable. -Unbelievable. -Unbelievable. And so, he was on that team. -Yep. -So, I could tell Jeff was struggling because it's like Cleveland Guardians. But no, he's not really a guardian. -I know. -So, yeah, you still have that moment. So, there's a smidge of that. -Yeah, I would certainly feel weird calling, like, Kenny Lofton, a guardian's legend or something. Yeah, that'd be odd, right? I am bad for this, traditionally. Like, I don't know. I just got used to, like, LA Rams. I finally have got over St. Louis. I will only ever refer to the Chargers as the Chargers because I'm going to forever forget where they play. So, I'm very bad for this. -How about the Raiders? -The Raiders? -Raders are just like -- -Or is that -- -They're the Raiders. They're just the Raiders. -Okay, they're just the Raiders. -They're just the Raiders. -That one, yeah. -Yeah. -That one, actually, more than others, I always associate. I'm, like, Oakland. Because it really feels like the brand fits with the fabric of what that city represents. -Don't disagree. -That's where -- I'm, like, ah, it's kind of -- -Yeah. -Yeah, you know what I mean? Like, it's weird. -Oh, and Vegas is like, "Oh, big flashy, like, jackpot, Vegas." And then I'm thinking, "But the Raiders tough for me." -So, that's what I was going to say is, they fit with old-school Vegas. Like, they were Vegas Raiders in the '80s. -Aces, yes. -Yes. Or if they were, like, the Fremont Street Raiders, like, the actual, like, gritty city of Vegas that you'd hear it more. -For sure. -I'm with you. You don't think of it as -- Well, and I will be honest, when I think of the Raiders right now, all I can think of is Mark Davis's haircut. It's like the only -- I am physically incapable of getting past any other part of that franchise. Okay. That's what we're talking about. The Blue Jays, we're talking about Mark Davis here. -Oh, that's okay. -I'm way up, people. -Yeah, it's a guardians. -Yeah, from bad head of hair to a good one, Gossman on the bump tonight. Let's just start there. It's been kind of a weird year for him completely, understandably, when you get on the -- or when you start the season on the wrong foot, he's been -- he's been open about it, probably came back from the injury a little sooner than he would have liked to. But we know the empathy for this season. We know the impetus for them to need to perform this season. We know they've needed the rotation to be great to do it. But where he had on Kevin Gossman this year, every other year of his deal, he has felt like the unquestioned ace, unless someone else was pushing him. But there was never anything about his performance that make you question where he's at. I think it's very fair to say he's not been the Jay's ace this year where he had on him. I still feel relatively good and comfortable with him. Like, I think it's fair. He's a safe -- an option as you can get around baseball in terms of a front line starter at this particular moment in time. You know, here's what's interesting. If we break it down slightly and I had briefly sort of scammed through it, it's because, you know, just to get a feel for the pitching match up tonight, which is obviously Gossman against Logan Allen, lefty for the Cleveland Guardians. And Gossman's had some really excellent outstanding outings, and then he's had some clunkers this year, which is, I think, why statistically, if you look at on balance how the numbers present themselves, can be a little bit deceiving because, by and large, he's been very good. So he's allowed one runner fewer in eight of his 13 starts. However, here's the caveat. He's allowed five or more or times. And that's where those numbers become a little bit more inflated, something that I feel like we've seen, and I think it took him a while, got to be honest, to get us back into the rhythm and routine of pitching every fifth day, being in the rotation. Because remember, you said, obviously, he started the year where he was coming off an injury. He didn't pitch really at all during spring training. Like, that injury happened right at the beginning of spring. Shut down, didn't pitch again until the very last day of the Cactus League, Grapefruit League, excuse me, schedule. And that was it. And then he was thrust immediately into the rotation. So I think it took him a while to sort of get comfortable again. But given that he's such a veteran, the J's felt confident in putting him in that position and saying, you know what, we don't need to send you down. And you get two or three rehab starts in the minors. And before we bring you up and get your season underway, they threw him right into the fire. I think velocity early on was an interesting point area to monitor. It felt like he was constantly fluctuating with the fastball velocity. And I remember attending a start, I think it was maybe a second or third outing of the season at home where he was throwing 89 miles an hour in the fastball. And then all of a sudden, cranking it up to 95, 96. It was the most bizarre thing. So I can sense that he's really been working through things. He was excellent in his previous outing, obviously, in the complete game, Shadow of the first of his career, unbelievable. I think it's trending in a very good direction. Bigger picture question, Gunnar, the thing I'm curious with you. If things don't go great between now and deadline day, do you consider trading that piece? I say that because he's 33, right? His contract is very appealing. There's going to be a lot of teams having appetite for that, looking for a front line starter who's very manageable in terms of the cost associated with that deal, a 24 million in the next couple of years. Totally. Think about the value you could get for that right now. Think about it. Yeah, no, it'd be nuts. I would be all over that. And that's not to say like, "Ah, get Kevin Gosman out of here." No, I think he's in a very important fabric of the clubhouse. He's the guy who kind of tells it like it is as well. And he kind of strikes the right tone in it. Like he doesn't have... And look, we all love Josh Donaldson for the... It's not the trial league, it's the get it done league, and it's an awesome quote. But they don't need that quote in the middle of a season that's not going well, right? That was the right time for that quote, but Goshman has done the right thing of kind of lightly ringing alarm bells about things. He's talked last year about, "You can't ask us to be perfect for seven innings "of every start and then be losing zero to negative one." Or something like it is how it feels like these games are going. He's been talking about that a lot. And I think that he is an important fabric of the clubhouse, of a guy who's just been through a lot of ups and downs. And I think he pictured a position player as always a little finicky. But if anybody can relate to what Vlad and Bo are going through of the ups and downs, you're supposed to be this guy. And he can tell them, you know, "Hey, maybe the blue just don't want to tell you this." But it's like, if you want it to work here, you got to make it work here. Or grass could be greener elsewhere. I thought I was going to be an Oreo my whole life when I signed there, you know? So I think he's such an important person to kind of the fabric of the clubhouse that you can't be cavalier about it. You'd have to get something not decent. You'd have to get a package of substance for him. But I think you absolutely have to be open to doing that. Honestly, with the exception of burrios, I don't know that there's a single, I would say starter, but I mean, believers are as finicky as they come. I don't know with the exception of burrios that there's a single player that you're not trading on this team. Not say you go out and try to move Jordan Romano or anybody like that or a Chris Bassett, but somebody comes to call him with the right price. You clean up the books. You have this reset that we think is all coming. I just don't think the front office will actually have the stomach and the appetite for that part of it if they're remotely close to a wildcard. And 'cause everybody stinks in baseball, they're gonna be close to a wildcard. - Yeah, I just thought he, he's the guy that, you know, we talk a lot about, there's a lot of oxygen being invested in the futures of Vlad and Bo right now. Obviously rental, more rental pieces like Jimmy Garcia, like Danny Jansen, you know, you say Kakuchi. But really, if you're looking for the big fish that can get you something massive in return, it sort of feels like Osman is a name that we haven't talked about enough. And I wonder, I just wonder, I'm not saying that this purely speculative look, I just wonder if those discussions, if teams would be calling to say, hey, you know what? How about that big 34 that happens to be a very, very good frontline starter that can help any team and we'll be willing to offer you two or three premier prospects to try and get something done? Maybe that entices them and if anything, as you put it, given the way that things are currently going, it feels like at the very least, if that call takes place, you got to entertain it. - Yeah, you have to entertain it. And I also think the Blue Jays are in a very advantageous position that if they decide to move on one of the bigger guys, like be it a Gosman or again, like, I don't think that's, it makes as much sense for other teams. It's not really the like playoff profile of the pitcher you'd want, but I think they're in a very enviable position to say that they can do the thing where, okay, hey, you want Gosman, well, while you're here, can I interest you in a yumigarcia? Jordan Romano, he's kind of crazy. - How much do you take George Springer with that, Kevin Gosman, please? - Jordan, do you like high-strung closures that look like they are on the verge of going insane? We have Jordan Romano right here for you. The exact opposite of someone high-strung who looks like they're going insane. Very well-mannered man who is, you know, always has his wits about him. Gord Stellick joins us now. Gordo, always good to talk to you. How are you doing today, man? - Well, I'm good. I think, like everybody, particularly when you talk all sports, in my case, you talk all hockey, you know, a three-nothing NBA you don't want, and especially a three-nothing Stanley Cup final right now, you don't want, but, hey, all is good. - Yeah, we are staring down the barrel of, and like I said, off the top of the show, we all love baseball, okay? But it's better when there's other things around it as well. So we're staring down the barrel of just baseball here. Let's hope the Oilers can extend it a little here. First question for you, Gord, is just how shocked are you to see the series at three-nothing? I don't think anybody's surprised to see the Panthers winning, but I think if you would have told people how relatively fruitless things have been for the Oilers offensively, maybe a little surprised there. What's your read bin on the first three games of the series? - Yeah, I don't know if shocked is the right word, but I am surprised, and, you know, it's funny. I don't know, I got caught up in, but how the Oilers came back to beat Dallas in finding ways to win. So, you know, I flipped and ticked the Oilers to win the Stanley Cup after I was initially gonna go with Dallas, excuse me, with Florida. But, you know, what strikes me as like, the Florida Panthers have always been a really good team. Slash, great team. I mean, there's so many similarities to the Toronto Maple Leafs about trying to get to that next level and not getting there. And then, you know, even last year, when the first 90% of the regular season was disappointing, and then they found their way, but I gotta be honest, like, I, for them, all of a sudden, to be this kind of powerhouse, but they've kicked ass every round. Every round, they've kicked ass. Like all, you know, it's not like, you know, the Chicago Blackhawks by the time they won their third Stanley Cup. You know, you're kind of, you know, recent years, you're kind of looking at them, viewing them like that, the Tampa Bay Lightning, you know? And all of a sudden, man, it's not legit, they're just the best team, like Colorado, was two years ago, or Vegas. I mean, they're just kicking butt, they're a force. - Gord, when you look at Florida, and it's obviously, as you laid out, and been an impressive run, not just this year, but a two-year run, and this has sort of felt like a redemption arc in getting back to the final, given how last year ended, on the back of what was, obviously, the historic comeback against Boston, and then the tremendous run throughout the playoffs, namely led by Sergey Brabrowski. I guess for, you know, bigger picture here, and the league at large, what's really instructive about how they play and how they're built? Like, what is it that they have that's enabled them to have this type of success in the playoffs over now, a sustained stretch here, the last couple of years? - Well, the personnel, you know, the personnel. I mean, everything else you can talk about, whatever style of play that Paul Maurice brought, whatever. And again, when I compare it, you know, I'm just so many comparables to the Leafs in that, you know, really good nucleus. They had three top three picks, and Aaron Eckblad was a one overall, Barkov's a two overall. Huberta was a three overall. Of course, they parlayed him into Kachuk. You know, in the Leafs, of course, we know Matthews, Marner, Nielander, and that, as far as guys that they grown, but now you look the last five years. And we've seen Zach Hyman hoist, excuse me, we've seen Naz and Cadrey hoist the Stanley Cup. We've seen Zach Hyman, Connor Brown playing in a Stanley Cup final. And then on the Florida Panther side, you know, you had Sam Bennett, you had Sam Reinhardt, you had Gustav Forsling. You know, Montador was for a third round pick. Carter Verhagie is a free agent. You know, guys, they got off the scrap heap. And it's just, and that's the job they've done. That's flat out what they did as far as it doesn't happen overnight, but you just keep incrementally making better and better moves. And the one thing is, you know, in all fairness and honesty, you know, Sergei Brabovsky hadn't until the last playoff, really, and then this year in the playoff, really hadn't lived up to the kind of building when they signed him in 2019. So, you know, he was able to give them that X factor goal-setting as well. So those are the two things, whatever it is, I mean, Sergei Brabovsky's part of those guys, they brought there, but him finding that particular level. And then those other, those other additions that they made, you know, in and around Barkov and Aaron Eckblatt. Brabovsky's been fantastic. I mean, it's one of the, I just saw the stat, even coming out of the game last night. I think it's like the seventh highest save percentage in the Stanley Cup final ever. He's been that darn good in this series, and even dating back to the last playoff. So he's had a, you know, 9/20 save percentage combined between the last two postseason runs for this Florida Panthers team. I did want it, and as great as he's been, the one thing I noticed, and I have, that's really stood out in this series, is the disparity in play between the two blue lines. Like Florida's blue line, and the depth that they have. Like they, you know, we're talking like, Ekman Larsen, who's not playing a ton on the bat, like Coolacob, but they're serviceable enough. And then their top four is just so consistent and solid, steady, that I feel like that might be the biggest difference in the series right now, beyond the goal 10, 'cause that's obviously been a factor. But just the overall consistency between the whistles of the blue line, compared to what Edmonton's currently trotting out there, I feel like that's been a massive, massive difference, in the overall complexion of how this series is unfolded. - Yeah, no, absolutely. What is the two goals for Edmonton in the first 11 periods? And then, and look at the brain cramps, the full pause. Like, you know, you had it, Evan Buschard last game, last night, Darnell Nurse, I mean, that was brutal. Never mind this, and on the Skinner one, you had, I think, Coolac getting caught in the blue line, he's really not covering it, like everything. You know, just like, hey, those are opportunities. Florida doesn't seem to give up as many as Edmonton does, and the other part is, when they get given up, Florida capitalizes, man, they just capitalize. Like, you know, they're just, you know, they're just around there and waiting for the least little opening, and boom. - Yeah, it's remarkable what they've been able to do. Isn't it funny how different a narrative can be surrounding a team that, again, is not the exact same, but it has very similar bones to the group that was back here? Maybe I'm misremembering it, but at the time, it felt like, and we certainly gave a goal to an incredible times, but it was, this team is in the Stanley Cup final, solely on the will of Matthew Kuchok. It seemed like that's what we were telling ourselves a lot last year, and I'm not gonna say Kuchok hasn't been a big part of this, but it feels like he has been so much less a part of the story. It's just so interesting to me how a player who can be seen as the guy who changed the culture, and maybe we were overstating it there as kind of what I'm getting at, but it was all about Kuchok last year, and again, he's been a very important part of them, and it seems like we're having so many more Babrowski conversations, or Barkov conversations than we are about Kuchok compared to last year. - Yeah, you know, Brent, I mean, last year, because it was kind of such a surprise trade in a lot of ways, and it came out because of the Johnny Gudro situation at Brad Tra living in Calgary, chose to get a handle on things a year early. So, you know, he was just a great ad for the Florida Panthers, and especially in the playoffs, but why you're on the verge of hoisting this Stanley Cup. Like Matthew Kuchok alone can't do that, just like you see on the other side, Conor McDavid and Leon Dreyseidel can't do that. You know, like it's about the team. So, the melody and the coming together, the getting to the next level as a team, it was more important, 'cause I can remember the same thing early in the season, Kuchok's offensive stats weren't that great. They picked up the latter half of the season, and the Florida people, no, no, no, he's having a great season, but he's actually having a great season. You can't just read in the statistics in that, and because there's a role he plays on the team, there's a team concept to everything, and this team concept right now is one win away from a Stanley Cup. - Gord, what would a cup mean for Paul Maurice? Like, I thought it was really interesting and insightful, and he is generally very candid and offers a lot and very insightful when he speaks to the media, but he was asked before the series, I thought it was interesting when he was, the question was posed, hey, you've been in this league for a long time, like what would it mean to win a cup? And it just, there was a lot of introspective reflection there, and I wonder just, I guess from a hockey standpoint, and legacy-wise, what would it mean to have a cup attached to his resume? - Well, and that's what you're cheering for, right? You're, I mean, he coached the Toronto Marlisa, coached the Toronto Maple Leafs. I mean, it's kind of like the brick bonus type. There's so many really beloved and respected coaches out there, so yeah, this would be the cherry on the Sunday. This would be the one thing that has been lacking, but you know what, why the hell do markets like Florida get a Stanley Cup? Are you kidding me? - Bingo, God! - Bingo! - Bingo! - They don't, I mean, you know, like the average attended 4,000 like, you know, average ticket prices, eight cents, you know. See, like, you know, are you serious? And now they're like these, oh my God, like, it was bad enough, I can't remember three years ago, I can't remember the order, I always used like kind of acronyms, so the word cat, you know, for Carolina Anaheim Tampa Bay. You know, like three non-traditional, non-hockey markets, one, the Stanley Cup, you know, three years in a row way back when, and you know, here, you gotta be, I mean, holy mackerel. Anyway, you gotta be happy for Paul Maurice, you gotta respect the job Bill Zito and his staff have done, and you gotta respect the players. But yeah, there's a sentimental thing that there's certain individuals everybody cheers for, and Paul Maurice would be one of them. - Yeah, and there's plenty of guys on the other side, right? I mean, you mentioned Hyman, I always joke that, I don't know, like, maybe there's a few guys who appreciate it as much now, but I don't know that anyone has ever appreciated being a leaf as much as Connor Brown did. Like, he clearly took a ton of pride in it, and you'd love to see him, you'd love to see him there. What do you think the mood is gonna be like in Edmonton, whether this ends in four, I mean, obviously it is a different mood, if they push it all the way to seven, but if this is a relatively quick series, be it four games, be it five games, what do you think the mood is like in Edmonton, surrounding this team? 'Cause on one hand, hey, they make great strides, they're in a cup final, but on the other hand, if McDavid has four or five points at a four or five game loss, and everybody else is pretty quiet, it's hard to sit there and be proud of your team at the end of that. What do you think the reception will be in Edmonton if it ends this weekend or in game five? - Well, yeah, I mean, you'll sort the other stuff out later on, there's always that instant reaction, and then later on, you've got to really appreciate the kind of season they've had where they were and getting to the final, but I'm trying to get my memory straight, Brent, but 2016, the Dequeven Indians have a three-nothing lead over the J's before they won that series or something. - I don't even remember, I can't remember it either, I don't think. - Hey, well, tell you why. Well, whatever it was, it first really seemed like that because I was involved coaching, you know, Justin's hockey team, so one dad said, "Hey, you can get a box for this kind." I forget, you know, it was expansive, but not so, I thought, you know, what the hell, I'm gonna get, so we got two tickets for game four, and I think the J's were down three-nothing, and we're walking there, and all we're hearing is tickets being sold for like a box, you know, and you have a new portfolio of all this money, and the J's won, but it just delayed the inevitable, you know, which would be the same kind of thing, so I think, you know, game four, oh, it's just, you know, like that vibe, and then at the end, you'll start not really believing, but saying, "Oh, wow, maybe if they can make it six or seven, "it would be super compelling." So you lose in five games, it's a bit empty, except the Tampa Bay mayor was honest a couple of years ago when she said, "Yeah, I just want you to go to Montreal, "win one of the two, so you win the cop back in Tampa Bay," right? - Yeah, I remember. - Yeah, and she got a little skewered for that, but she ended up being right in her prediction, so yeah, it's, man, I just forget, like five game series and four game series especially, like it's just a really empty way, so, you know, but so yeah, it'd be, it's just a terrible way to lose, so it's not like, you know, you get so, but you've got to, you know, appreciate the collective body of work during the regular season, and that'll, that would take a few days to get back to. - Producer Jeff Hasaparti helping me with your memory, he's also blaming you for the series loss though, because they did win game four, five, one, but where were you at the rest of the game, of course? Clearly they needed you. Clearly they needed you. - Well, did they go on the road after that, or whatever, I mean, I think. - Two gourd, he doesn't matter where the games are. If the team needs you, the team needs you, of course. - Yeah, but you know, there's, for reasons I don't want to talk about I have a cross in the board. - Okay, all right, we'll leave it there. Sounds like a summer pod when we're going to get you back on. Gordo, you know, I love you, I always love getting you on. Thanks so much, man. - Okay, take care, gentlemen. - There you go. - Thanks for Gordo. Stell, like bringing some stellar electricity there. And is it, I mean, I'm not saying it's his fault, but what, what could have been? - Yeah, who doesn't want to take her road trip to Cleveland? - Wasn't that like the, was it that like the Astrada game? I think what he shoved. - Yeah, I think so, 'cause that was the only, I think they will, they lost that series in front of it. - And now it would have been Ryan Merritt. Yeah, if they lost in five, now it would have been Ryan Merritt. Trevor Bower. - Trevor Bower. - Boot season, Trevor Bower, Joel Boy. - Yeah, I think so. - What a time. - True fun. - Yeah, Trevor Bower no longer allowed a major league baseball and the team no longer called what they once were called. So it's amazing how much has changed in one six years. - Crazy. - Wow, that's six years, eight years. - Yeah, well, it's been a while, I know. - Geez, God. - That's crazy. - That's almost, think about this. Next year will be 10 years since that flip moment. - That's insane. - Right? - 10 years. - And it was Aaron Sanchez on the bump for game four. - Oh, wow. - If you want to talk about it being truly a trillion years ago. - What was the, when was the Astrada game? Was that Kansas City? - I don't know, maybe if I think in Kansas City. That's, yeah, it was Kansas City. - Was it, it was? - Yeah, is that a game? - Yeah, I now remember it coming back. - Oh, okay. - You have it and it's Astrada on the bump and I just remember everybody talking themself into what did happen of, he's gonna just, he's gonna find a way and his changeups gonna dance. And you'll leave them alone. - 'Cause then they went on the road and they lost game six. - Yep, yep, that Amish kid lying there in Andrew's face. - Oh my goodness. - Oh my goodness. - The Amish guy. - Was it? - Anybody ever, I wonder, like, somebody's gotta get on that. Track that guy down now. - Buildin' a barn somewhere. - Right, exactly. Like, what happened, what did he make of his life? After being on national television, ruining the Blue Jays. - I mean, he's more of a World Series champ than many of us are, so yeah. A lot to get into there, man. God, fun going down memory lane. Maybe, well, we did go down positive memory lane earlier. - We did. - We talked about the Raptors, that's right. - Absolutely. - So I was about to say, maybe we'll have a fun thing to talk about, but we did the 2019 Raptors. Well, we'll always have them. We will, well, not always, but like, very soon. We'll have John Marosi. - Yes. - We're gonna talk to him. - Yes. - Next, on The Fan Morning Show, we've got to get Fred Chesky at SportsNet 5.9 of the fan. - Unrivaled insight, analysis, and opinions on all things Blue Jays. Blair and Barker, be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. (dramatic music) - The Fan Morning Show, halfway to my Friday. I don't know, I feel like the rest of you probably have like a long work day ahead of you. So, good luck. - I don't know, maybe you're on the road up to Cottage Country already. In which case, you get to flip me. - Get the Friday. Do the people work on Fridays, Gunnar? - Well, not in this building. I don't know if you've took a perusal to-- - I'm here every Friday, no, no, no, no, no, no. - This is the thing though. It's like, the more Friday it feels, it's like, guess what? Sports radio exists every Friday. It is true, will not stop. Apparently, accounting and marketing does not exist on Fridays or Mondays. I feel like the parking lot's pretty empty on Thursdays a lot of times. I'm just wondering if anybody works out there. Somebody who I know is always diligently working. - Absolutely. - Is our insider brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect X of its online and in the showroom, visit DonValleyNorthlexus.com. That's someone, John Marosi. John, how's it going today? - Brent and Danieli, good morning, my friends. I hope you're doing great. Look forward to being in Toronto next week. We've got a game there, Red Sox and Blue Jays. So, I can't wait to be at the beautifully renovated Roger Center. - That's wonderful. I'm happy to hear you're making the sojourn. And I, of course, expected you to be working regarding baseball. But I know, John, an Italian gentleman, such as yourself, coming to our fair city during Euro, not that there aren't Italian brethren, let's be honest, everywhere. But you are going to be surrounded by your people during Euro if you are in our city next week, John. - I am now, it is possible that I influenced the programming schedule of MLB networks, such that before I return home, that I can take a detour to Vaughn, because Danieli has advised me of the best places to watch the match. So, I mean this sincerely. Unless something changes in my plans, I am going to take Danieli's advice. I'm gonna find the best place that I can to watch the Italy Spain match in Vaughn with my people. And we will be there together, praying for goals together. Because that is my one concern. I look at this Italy team, I'm still reflecting on last time around Danieli. I still can't believe that we won last time. Obviously, it was very much predicated on a great midfield and tremendous defense as always. But we need some goals, my friend. We need some goals. Giaza, Raspidori, Skamaka, we need some goals. And I will say that we will be all there in it together, my friend. That's how I feel. I'll be experiencing next week's match against Spain. - 100%, John. 100%. You're gonna feel right at home. I can assure you. You'll be down there. You'll see all the flags. You'll be, you'll drive. Once you hit, you're gonna pass. You're gonna get off the highway. You're gonna get off the highway, John. Once you get off, you're gonna hit the fort, you're gonna get off the 427 at Highway 7 in Rutherford. And John, you're gonna see flags. You're gonna see cars draped in flags. You're gonna feel right at home. It's gonna be tremendous, but I'm with you. - I love it. - I'm with you. We gotta score some goals, man. That's what we gotta do. We gotta score some goals. - We do. I will tell you one quick soccer story. Let me get back to baseball. The first time I brought my wife to the soccer match in Italy, we were there and she says to me, "John, it was an Asalanta Napoli game. It was in Burnham Hall. Asalanta was losing one nil, two nil, three nil." And she said, "John, I don't feel safe. I think the fans, I don't feel safe here." And I said to him, "Sweetheart, this is just how we are. Okay, we're, this is the only place where you see people effectively praying and swearing at the same time. This is what we do." And so I said, "It's gonna be okay." She said, "No, we gotta leave. I don't feel safe." And so sure enough, so we left in maybe like the 70th minute. - No. - I pick up the paper in Bergamo the next day. Sure enough, the crowd had a demonstration after the game and the man of the resignation of manager Antonio Conte. It was the last time of Conte with Asalanta. And I said, "Look, you were right." And sure enough, so she's like, "Yeah, I've obviously never doubted her since then, but nor did I ever doubt her before." But she, but she called it, she felt that it was going to happen and she was absolutely right. - Oh, that's great. - That is, that's hilarious. I'm now just getting flashbacks to the last conversation I had with my barber when I got my haircut right after the leaf season ended and he, no North American sport. Strictly European football for him. And he, he was just dumbfounded. But why do you allow it? I'm like, "Well, we don't really have a say." He's like, "What do you mean?" Just to have a say. And he's like, "It's completely the idea that I have no control over who coaches the Leafs." Just completely foreign to this guy. And I love that about it. All right, there's no way to segue that 'cause well, actually here's the segue. If the fan base had a say, there might be some changes happening with the Blue Jays. But they're not, they're not right now. John, this is a team that is, you know, turned it around a little bit here, definitely lately. They have kind of completely changed their MO as of late. I guess just like kind of a bigger picture thought on that. How often in season do we see teams? And it's not a roster construction thing. It's not like they flipped the roster upside down, but with the moving flatty to third occasionally and the calling up of Horowitz and clearly going for more of an offensive bend than the defensive one they've been built around, how odd is it to see a team kind of do a complete 180 like the Jays are doing in season? - Well, I think it's an acknowledgement that there were some flaws in the roster construction. And I don't think it's necessarily that uncommon that teams will pivot, especially now that you're in June. And this is to me, this is the start and I was interesting, of course, I'm in Michigan that they sent offensive torquels and down to the minor leagues. He was the former number one overall pick. That's a pretty dramatic move. So I think there is enough frustration in enough different places right now because offense around the game is so abysmal, collectively obviously there's some outliers and some exceptions to that. But the offensive output is so minimal in so many places that I think that the natural inclination is to see what you've got in the minor leagues before you look to the outside. And so I think that the big deal move to me, I realized it was a familiar name to fans and in some ways it was a dramatic move. To me, it felt like the first logical step of reimagining this team on the fly because the lineup and the roster of position players just wasn't terribly efficient. You had a lot of redundancy of sort of the second base, third base multi position types and Bijio just hasn't performed as well as the likes of Schneider, Clemente and others. And I just think that if you're going to keep Vogelbach and you had to find a way to get some more offense on the roster, there weren't a whole lot of other options besides moving on for Bijio. So I think that was a sign that the J's are gonna do the internal options first. See what they've got. And then if they're still in this sort of middle ground by the time you get to early July, then you reflect and consider the more transformative changes. And that's about the timeline that they're on. And I think it was the right approach and the correct first step. I certainly huge respect for Kevin, a big fan of his, personally, and I think he's got a lot of great baseball left. I just think it was not any longer the best fit for him to be a productive player here. - John, you mentioned a word there that I think is really interesting. You said, "Re-imagine" in terms of how the roster will shape itself. - Daniel, I liked it so much. He wrote it down. I wrote it down. - I did, I wrote it down. - I didn't do it. - I did. - Thank you. - 'Cause I think it's-- - You're not familiar, you're not familiar. - I think it's, no, and I just, I think it's interesting because the way I view it right now is there's that train of thought in which you can re-imagine the roster in the sense that you can change pieces around a lot of the core parts or make subtle changes to the core parts, but not drastically make wholesale changes to the entire complexion of the roster. And I wonder if re-imagining the personnel and the way this roster's been constructed, 'cause I'm with you. I think there are a lot of redundant season and it's a flawed roster. Is it enough to just re-imagine it or does there need to be wholesale changes made in order to get it into a position again where it can have an achieve sustainable success? I think that is something that is a real thought at this particular point in time, and maybe even magnified more so by the fact that you've got, in theory, you're two best players, Bo and Vlad, or you're young cornerstone players in Bo and Vlad, that have a year and a half left of control. So are you re-imagining the roster around players like that? Or are you in a position where you need to make wholesale changes that will now impact the next wave of whatever the Blue Jays look like in the future? Well, I think that's an excellent question. And that's where they're arriving in the next couple of weeks. I don't think that they can really rule anything out at this stage. I can't say here today on the 14th of June that there is zero chance of trading Vlad or zero chance of trading Bo. I think they've gotta make, and it's really an ownership level decision, to be honest, about what direction they wanna go in. The one thing that to me points in the, from a pure baseball standpoint, there's the business side of it and the renovation of the Rogers Center and ticket sales and all those things that I think are somewhat tied and tip the scales toward Vlad and Bo staying. But if you're looking at things from a pure baseball standpoint, just the baseball side, the Jays have to ask themselves this question. Are we going to be better than Baltimore or New York at any point in time between now and the end of 2025? And if the answer to that is no, and certainly for 2024 it's almost certainly no, because they're just not as good as they are right now. They're just not. The question is next year, do you feel like if you keep Vlad and Bo, is there a reasonable expectation that you keep most of this group together, you make a few pivot type moves here and there, you trade Turner, you make some different moves that bring in maybe some talent that helps your club next season, that you can make a run at least a wild card next year. That's where they're at. Now, it's interesting, we talk about Vlad and Bo together often for obvious reasons, but you've got Vlad who's having a pretty good season and Bo who's not. And I think that when you talk about what Bo's trade value would be, I know the idea, Ken Roseville reported on the possibility of the Dodgers with Bo as well. You can certainly make that argument, but are the Jays going to get enough back for him now that would justify trading someone who still has some upside to go and understanding that fans are probably not going to be excited about that. It's a tough situation. It really is that I think you can't trade Vlad and Bo for minimal returns. And I would also those that say that it's hard to imagine Ross Atkins being the person who trades them, I think that's also correct. So it's hard to imagine him taking the team apart if he's not necessarily the guy who's going to run them for the long term. So there's just so many different layers here, but the key thesis I've got here is Bo is not playing well enough at the moment to get the type of value back that would make it worth your while to deal with the fall out from trading him. It's just, I don't see that right now. Now, Vlad may be different with the Seattle Mariners. They've got a pretty good farm system. They've got excellent pitching. They've got a, they're a bad short of being a special team. If Seattle says, hey, listen, this is our window to do it all. And we think we're one Vlad junior away from being a potential World Series team. That's worth having the conversation because Vlad's playing well enough that you could get back some significant returns from the Seattle Mariners. I just, I don't see Bo playing well enough right now for it to be worth the negative vibes that will follow a creative him. - No, that's a, that's a great point, John. Just stick him with Vladi and not from a trade perspective, but a contract one, it's a weird thing to say that the players had a better season than he's had last year. And now I think the contract negotiation is even harder to do because I think with Vladi and his camp, I can easily see a world where they go, hey, here we go. The graph is going back up. We have the season you want us to have. This is the start of something. And of course, I mean, any front office in the world is going to say, well, what about giving you less money? That would be better for us. But I think they have a leg to stand on to say, hey, man, you are not the 2021 almost MVP guy. It's odd to say that this season that he's had should make them feel better about wanting to commit to him, but may make the commitment harder to kind of come to. Can you, can you see that world come into fruition? - Yeah, it's a great point. It is a very interesting dynamic with Vlad because he, you're right. So his, his, if you look at his league, league wide production, and certainly even since a somewhat tepid start, he's been really good. Like one of the better hitters in baseball for a period of more than a month now. His OBS plus is somewhere between right now where it was in '22, where it was last year. So he certainly bounced back from what last season was. Although the power hasn't really shown up in a huge way, his slug, his slug is actually down from where it was last year, which is kind of surprising in a certain way. The overall season is better, but the slug is down. Interesting. I think with Vlad, I still go back to this. When you go to an arbitration hearing with your, with one of your biggest superstars, and he wins right before his, an ultimate year before free agency, I just, I would have to be convinced in a pretty profound way that, that either A, that he wants to stay, or B, that they're, that they're anywhere close to the range is going to take to get him signed. I am, I am highly skeptical on this one in terms of signing them long-term until I get some concrete evidence to the contrary. Just because if you couldn't come to an agreement on a one-year deal, how the heck are you going to have one on a longer-term one, when the price has only gone up? Again, is it possible? Sure it is. I just, I have been a big-time skeptic on the J signing in long-term for a variety of reasons. But the most notable one is I just, I look back to the spring and say if they couldn't get on the same page for one year, I have a hard time seeing them contemplate the more astronomical numbers that it's going to take to sign up long-term. And also the J's, there's not another flatty on this team. I would be clear about this. But, and certainly he's added to his value by playing third base. But what they do have players of in the minor leagues right now, the higher minors, are quarter infield type bats. That's their way of getting a little bit younger and a little bit cheaper while they're still trying to figure out what you can get out of Springer's contract, et cetera. I just think that there are a lot of reasons to believe that they'll be a free agent after 25 and still not a ton to believe that there's a path to signing a long-term. For more I sit right now. - Yeah, that is fascinating, John. And something tells me, I don't know if Spidey sends tingling somewhere, that that won't be the last time we have a check-in on that particular conversation. - Really, you're probably right. And it's probably the Vlad trade conversation is just as familiar as the Will Italy score any gold conversation? These are the sports radio topics to keep on giving. - The three pillars of Toronto Sports Radio now are, can the city survive Italy being back in a major competition? Will Vladi get traded? And when will Mitch Martin get traded? Those are the three pillars of Toronto Sports Radio right now. And the fourth, of course, you coming on with us, John. Appreciate it. Can't wait to see up here. - This sounds great. Chief of the ammo press. So can't wait for the zuri. I say that with hope. A little bit of a little bit of trepidation too, but I can't wait to see you guys all next week. It'll be a lot of fun. - Awesome, there you go. - Thank you, John. - John Marosi, this insider brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect excellence online and in the showroom, visit DonValleyNorthlexus.com. Also let you know, J is starting up a three game set against the Guardians tonight. First pitch set for 707 at Roger Centre. Gossman on the bump against Logan Allen. Watch it on SportsNet 1 or right here. SportsNet 590, the fan. Blue J Central, get you going at 630. And then of course, J is talk after the game on radio. I'm gonna presume, John Marosi wasn't swearing at me at the end of every time. - No, no, no. - He's talking Italian to you guys. Like, hey, 'cause if I, I gotta be honest, just my own nature, if I had a language that nobody was gonna like, I'd be slipping one in, I wouldn't just be like, you know, swearing at people on a private centre, but I'd slip one in. - I feel like, you know, especially with Italian and in Toronto, you're familiar with a lot of these vulgar languages. - This is true. - So, and it's very distinguishable. Whereas with other languages, you have no clue. - This is true. - You're absolutely right. So I feel like it's actually harder if you're Italian to get away with that. 'Cause you know, and even the body language and the mannerisms, you know what's, when it's aggression, there's aggression attached to it, there's, it's negative connotation. - Yes, this is, this is very true. And the thing is, it's like, not that I can speak German, but I feel like I go ask somebody to get some German swears. I feel like it's just such an angry language. They all sound like swears. - That's true, it's a good point. - I'm glad to make that joke. It is now tied for the wake and break. Presented by sports interaction, your homegrown sports book in 19 plus bet responsibly. All eyes on the city of Edmonton. Will we have a fifth game in the Stanley Cup final? That is the question. The Panthers are plus one of five favorites on the money line. You can also get them at the spread of plus one and a half, minus two 50 there. You also have an over, under a five and a half, over is paying plus a hundred. The Oilers minus one 25. Do you have a lead in this one? Do you think we're going to get a game five? Where are you at, Danieli? - Oh, my heart says yes. Let's get a game five. - Yeah. - My brain kind of flips the other way. I will say though, Gunner, I feel very convinced about the NBA finals and where that is currently situated. Less about this in terms of ending in a sweep. So I think Edmonton will show up with some fight and some hunger because last night they did that. They played with a lot of urgency and desperation. I think they're going to have that same mentality and approach on Saturday and I feel more buoyed by their talent level and the team that they have to not get swept in this series. - Yeah, I look at the over a five and a half there. If the Oilers are going to win, they're not going to be a two-one game. So give me the over there plus a hundred. If you feel super bullish on the Oilers coming all the way back in this thing, plus 1,300, I'm not going to go there. - Only plus 1,300, I say, literally. Only plus 1,300. - They're down, oh three. - If you're going to do that though, you might as well just bet McDavid to win the consmith 'cause you get that a plus 1,500. And there's very, I was going to say, very small world. There's just no world in which the Oilers come back and it's not solely on the strength of that guy and him being special. We love a narrative, there's no way I'd be anybody else. Sorry Leon, I hate to break it to you, but that's the breaks. That was the wake and break presented by Sports Interaction. Your homegrown Sportsbook 19 plus, that responsibly. You mentioned NBA finals there. Going to sneak in a little conversation about that on the other side. We're going to talk to Jordy Fernandez as well. Very, very excited for that. But what you're pretty confident that that's done. Mav's going to pack it in. No last stand from Luca and Kyrie. - I don't think so. As I said, I think Boston is just that much better. You know, and I did have this. I thought this was interesting. So they went 64 and 18 in the regular season to the Boston Celtics. If they win tonight to wrap up the finals, they would finish the playoffs 16 and two. Cumulatively, that would put the record at 80 and 20. That puts them among the very best. Among the very best teams ever in terms of single season wins and winning percentage all time. The last team to have 80 plus wins in a calendar season were the 2016, 2017 Warriors. - Yeah. - I looked at it. It's been that long. We're talking like, think about what the discussions were of about that Warriors team. - How special. - With Curry and Durant. Like how exactly? We're watching something pretty special here. And it just feels like the Celtics also, for whatever reason, they kind of get a little disrespected. Like, you know, the people say, oh, they cakewalk to the finals. Is it their fault that they won the games and that they played who they played? But in the end, if we look at what their records gonna be and how consistently great they were the entire way, I feel like they kind of deserve a little bit more love and respect for how good they've been. - I don't disagree with you. It's so tough to compare anybody to that Warriors team 'cause they felt like Hall of Famers from the minute they started assembling. And they kind of all hit. I mean, Curry obviously came in with all the hype and expectations, but then the- - Slash brothers. - The play. And Raymond doing his thing. And then, of course, you had Durant to the whole mix there. It's very curious to see how much the next two or three years impact the way we look back on this Celtics team. 'Cause if they just continue to be this, we're gonna sit there and say, oh, look at this. This was the start of it. Who cares that they didn't play X, Y, or Z, or who cares that they played the Mavs in the final? That'll be interesting to see. A lot to unpack there. Also, a lot to get excited about. With Canada basketball, it is entirely possible. - Yes. - No offense to the Italians or the Portuguese out there. That this is the highlight of our summer. It's Canada's men's basketball team. I don't want to throw slight at anybody else, but it's very possible. That is the crown jewel of our summer sport. The guy who's gonna be the head coach of the team, Jordy Fernandez. He'll join us on the other side. We continue to fan morning show with Gunning and Franceski on Sports Snap 5.9 of the fan.
