Radio Miraya
2759: USG and ASG Joint Visit to South Sudan
The UN special coordinator on improving the UN response to sexual exploitation and abuse, Christian Shondars and victims rights advocate, Nezla Nacib Palma are visiting Saasudan, the accompanied by a delegation of judges of the UN internal justice system, who are responsible for ensuring justice and accountability for UN staff for disciplinary issues, including sexual exploitation and abuse. Mr. Shondars and Ms. Palma are joining us now to tell us more about the purpose and outcomes of their visit. I can start with asking you each of you to explain a little about your respective roles, starting with Mr. Shondars first and then Ms. Nezla Palma. Thank you, Lachary, and I'm very happy to be back in Saasudan and we've received a very warm welcome wherever we have been. My role as the special coordinator for improving the UN's response to sexual exploitation and abuse is to ensure that the UN system, so it's a system-wide mandate, the UN system and our implementing partners and by implementing partners, I mean international NGOs, national NGOs, the government, commercial contractors, that they ensure that they have the necessary measures in place to prevent and respond to sexual exploitation and abuse. And this is the second time I have been in Saasudan. I was here about a year ago. Ms. Palma. Thank you very much for this opportunity. I am the new victims' right advocate. I'm new at the UN and I'm very happy because this is my first mission. I am working in close collaboration with the USDA Saasudan and it's a great opportunity to assess the situation on the ground in my very first mission and my role is to elevate the rights and the dignity of the victims of sexual exploitation and abuse and to ensure that they will have a voice, a justice and justice and be here, it's a singular opportunity to know more about their needs and how can we work to protect them and to ensure that the rights will be respected. Thank you very much and we come to Mr. Sander. This is your second time to Saasudan, a special coordinator. What were the main goals for this visit? Thank you for the question, Lockery. The goals were really threefold. The first goal was to, the problem with sexual exploitation and abuse is until society fixes the underlying issues, gender equality, poverty, rule of law, ensuring that women have economic independence, ensuring that women are in meaningful decision-making roles and the like. The likelihood is that sexual exploitation and abuse will continue. Sexual violence has existed for thousands of years. It is present in every country in the world and therefore, as the United Nations is a microcosm of society, it's likely that you will find it in the United Nations. It has no business in our society, it has no business in the United Nations and we need to do everything that we can to eliminate it and where we do have instances of sexual exploitation and abuse, that we respond robustly and that we understand that we have an accountability to the victims and survivors and that we meet, as ASG Naseef Palmer said, that we meet their needs for assistance and ensure that their rights are protected. So, I came back to Salasudan to see how we were doing because we don't yet have a sustainable way of addressing sexual exploitation and abuse and the gains, and I would say there's been limited gains that we have had in this area and that those gains are fragile, are in most instances being driven by individuals, individual leaders who are committed to this issue and PSCA coordinators, which are interagency coordinators and the senior victims' rights officers in different countries. So, it was an opportunity for me to come and see how we're doing in Salasudan. Second reason was to introduce the new victims' rights advocate, Ms. Naseef Palmer, and the third reason was to accompany the UN dispute tribunal judges to a complex field mission where there are many challenges because here you have conflict, you have IDPs and refugees, you have more than 650,000 returnees and refugees since the war in Sudan began, you have internally displaced people in IDB camps and POCs and you have difficulties in terms of climate and, for example, the flooding around Unity State makes it very, very challenging. It's essential in this day and age in this modern world to have an effective and independent justice system and that includes the UN and to have an effective and independent justice system and to make the best possible decisions on behalf of staff members, the judges need to be informed and it's very important that they understand the context of people working and living in a complex situation like Salasudan. So, it was really to give them a better understanding of the United Nations work and how our staff live and work. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, Shondars, for that response. Ms. Palmer, during this visit, what were your impressions of the general situation relating to sexual violence and sexual exploitation and abuse in Salasudan? Thank you for this important question. Well, I see vulnerability and sexual exploitation and abuse is in the context of gender-based violence and what I see here, this vulnerability is also taking place because there is conflict, poverty, lack of education, economic crisis, displacement, climate change, and we have a higher risk of these situations that these wrongs can occur. But I would like to say that I also could realize the strength and the courage of these victims and we are here to support them. Okay. During your previous visit, you mentioned one of the main challenges is the lack of reporting sexual exploitation and abuse in Salasudan due to stigma, cultural and other reasons. Have you seen any improvement in the situation and what more can be done in this regard? I think the same issues exist today. These are cultural issues. These are cultural issues that are not unique to Salasudan. We need to work very, very closely with the local community to gain their trust, to explain their rights in terms of assistance. After all, we're here to assist them and to ensure that they report they will need to be convinced that we're going to do something about it, that we're going to keep their complaints confidential and that they will be protected, that victims will get the assistance they need and if they wish to proceed through a legal channel, that we will support them in this. I think part of the problem is that the UN's legal process takes quite a long time. The investigations take a long time. The post investigation process takes a long time and they can get much quicker justice through the customary courts. So most often they revert to the customary courts in order to settle these issues. But unfortunately, when they go through the customary courts because of tradition, often it's not the victim or the survivor who benefits. It's the father, it's the family and that's not right. We have an obligation to an accountability to the victim and survivor to try and make them whole as a result of what they've experienced. But we need to gain that trust from the community. We work very closely with the community. Different UN agencies and the implementing partners work very closely with the community. The conduct and discipline team works very closely with the community to try and build that trust and to put in place the necessary mechanisms to enable community to report these types of incidents. Thank you very much for that. In your opinion, what kind of support is most needed for victims and what could we do in South Sudan to make sure survivors get the help they need to rebuild their lives as Palma? Thank you. Needs of the victims must be assessed in individual bases. But they have immediate needs like food, medical support, psychological support, closes, safe shelter. But victims of sexual exploitation and abuse also have specific needs, especially when there is a children born of these wrongs. So the legal assistance is we need a legal specialized assistance because the perpetrator sometimes is not in the country anymore. And so to address paternity claims or even to have documents a birth certificate for this child is an additional challenge for these victims. And I think that also they have because of the children born of a sexual exploitation and abuse sometimes the period, the time of the assistance will be much more longer and it is a challenge too. But what I think that it's most important is that they can sustain themselves. So they could be, they could feel stronger to sustain themselves and their kids and that's maybe the most important challenge and we should invest more in projects like this. To add to what ASG, as Steve Palma said, I think two points. We rely very heavily on existing services being provided, the gender-based violence services around the country. And there are never enough resources to provide the appropriate level and the types of gender-based violence services around the country. So in some areas these services frankly are just not available. So we need to work to increase gender-based violence services to ensure that services, that funding is there so that services can be provided all over the country. Secondly, we provide support, livelihood support, to enable the victims to be able to help rebuild their lives after they've had this experience. As I said in response to the opening question, I think economic independence for women is an important part of the solution and we, through projects funded through the UN's trust fund, we teach them skills and these skills in consultation with the victims, we teach them skills and these skills hopefully will help them to support themselves and their families going forward. I think we need to do, having observed the projects, I think we need to, or we could improve the way we do these projects, including giving the victims training in financial management. We could look at the supply chain, we could look for better avenues where they can sell, the things that they make in order to help with their economic independence. So I think this is something that we're relatively new at and I think we have learned a lot, we've learned a lot from South Sudan and I think we will go away knowing that we need to be better in this area. Thank you and turning back to you, Mr Sandra again. You visited BenQ along with Ms Naseep Palma and delegation of judges of the UN internal justice system. Can you describe the situation there and what are the main challenges for victims of sexual exploitation and abuse? Thank you. BenQ is a challenging place because even though we've had the dry season, there is still a lot of water on the ground and it has not seeped away. We have the rainy season coming up and also the level of Lake Victoria is very, very high and some of the gates have been opened. So water is now starting to rise in unity state, particularly in the southern part of unity state, but it will reach BenQ, particularly when the rains come. The UN, both the Pakistan engineering company from UNMIS and IOM through commercial contractors, has built dikes surrounding areas of population, including the IDP camp, including the UNMIS camp, but also to protect those who moved, the IDPs that moved last year because of the flooding and settled around the town of BenQ and there are about 40,000 people there. The challenge will be how much rain is received and whether or not the dikes will be able to keep back the water. So while we were there, we visited the IDP camp. We visited the UNMIS camp. We visited or we were graciously received by the acting governor. We saw the displaced people in BenQ from last year's flooding. We were able to visit a UNFPA sponsored one stop shop and the one stop shop is where victims of sexual violence can go to receive psychosocial support, medical support and legal advice and legal assistance. We went to a women and girl center where we saw women and girls making different items, including robes, including necklaces, cooking stoves and the like and yes, I think within the day that we were there, we were able to see a lot. I think the significant poverty in BenQ, I think it's difficult for the aid agencies because there is less money. There are increasing demands around the world for that money. From our perspective, when the level of assistance goes down, the level of risk of sexual exploitation and abuse goes up because particularly women and girls resort to unsafe practices in order to feed themselves and feed their families. So we have to be extra vigilant and we have to pay much more attention to sexual exploitation and abuse in these instances, to prevent it in the first instance, but then if it happens, to ensure that we address it robustly. Thank you. Thank you. Miss Najib Palma, you also spent time in BenQ, what were your impressions on the ground? Thank you. I think that USG Sanders gave us a comprehensive overview. I would just like to add some thoughts. So of course, I saw addition of vulnerability because of the displacement, because of the environment, the flooding, lack of resources to cook. And this also have a specific impact because we have in the same place the aggressor or the perpetrator, it's more close to the victims because of these circumstances. And we realize that less services are available for victims too. And this is so additional vulnerability, but on the other hand, I saw an engagement of the community. So it was very, I was impressed to see how the community-based its complaint mechanisms are working very hard with additional challenges, but collaborating. It's a very important work to encourage victims to bring these cases, to report these cases in another very positive impression was the safe space for women and girls. When confidence can be built and that our trust fund, the UN Trust Fund, supported this building with training, with material. So it's an example of a good practices that must be, that we must have more cases like this in other places too. Thank you once again. It's still staying with you for a moment. One of the UN's priorities is to put the rights and dignity of victims of sexual violence, exploitation and abuse at the forefront of its prevention and response efforts. Is this happening in South Sudan and what more could be done? We have been talking about these now. We have a senior victims rights officer here and she is fully dedicated to work on this and she has the support of the mission and other partners too. So it's happening, we need to improve, but we need more resources too. But I would like just to highlight how important it is to have a person fully dedicated to this and with this specialized excuse to address. They are the first to have sometimes, to have the contact with the victims. They can campaign them, they can hear what are the specific needs. So in, I think that we have a long way to go, but we are trying to do our best here and I am here to support the senior victims right officer and do my best to fulfill that the rights and the dignity of the victims will be respected. Thank you again. Mr. Saunders, can you tell us why internal justice is also crucial for the UN for both staff and victims of sexual exploitation and abuse? I'll answer the first part of the question in terms of staff members and then I'll ask ASG Naseef Palmer to answer the second part about victims. I think not just in the UN, but I think we live in a very complex and challenging world and I think access to justice, access to independent, effective justice is crucially important for everybody and I think UN staff are no exception. I think it's important that UN staff have access to an internal justice system that is informed, that is effective, that is timely so that any grievances they may have or any misunderstandings they may have with management can be reviewed and a decision can be made. I think the importance of the judges visit here cannot be underestimated because I think if you're informed and you understand the context, you can make better decisions. That doesn't just go for judges, that goes for all of us and I think it really was this week, I think in South Sudan was very much an eye-opener for the judges. This is the first time this has happened since the establishment of the internal justice system, the new internal justice system, which is nearly 15 years old and I think we've learned from this visit that this should become part of the induction for all new judges. We chose South Sudan for many different reasons, the context. It's a very challenging context as I mentioned earlier. We have a peacekeeping operation, a large complex peacekeeping operation here, we have UN country team, sexual exploitation and abuse is prevalent everywhere in peacekeeping environments, in humanitarian environments, in development environments and we have all of those here in South Sudan. But we also have a committed leadership here to this particular issue. We have a strong PSCA task force, we have an NGO community also who are committed to this issue. So I think it was certainly from my perspective, I think it was time well spent. Okay, Ms Palma, what are your views? Thank you for this opportunity to say that justice is a right that the victim has. Victims has right to justice and accountability and it's very important because sometimes to translate a victim in a survivor, we need this strong response, we need the sense of justice, we need this human right value. But more than this, I think that justice can impact in prevention too. So it's essential that the victims can see this one case of sexual exploitation and abuse be translated into justice and related to our internal justice system, I would like to say that we are working to institutionalize the victim centered approach in our internal justice system and what is this is to taking consideration the needs, the dignity and to protect the victims against new trauma during a proceeding in the justice system. So to avoid additional victimization, so that's the essence of the victim centered approach in the UN justice system. And we have been working with the judges and we are very happy to say that the judges are supportive to this approach and they are working on need to keep in mind that if a victim has to testify, to come before the court, they need to be protected against new trauma and new victimization.