(upbeat music) - Fan, Morning Show, Sportstime Five Night as a fan, man at a spring gunning. Those were the adults and tones of Jeff Merrick and Elliot Friedman. - Mm-hmm. - On 32 thoughts as we head towards tonight's NHL draft on Sportsnet. - Mm-hmm. - Mm-hmm. - Mm-hmm. - Okay. Some of you can maybe talk about Max Fome and Tyler after. - Yes. - We will, we'll jump into the scalding hot pot of Mitch Marner. - Yeah. - Goodness. - Get a hot plate of bait in it. - Oh my God, yeah. - Jacuzzi. - We burn our faces off. - Yeah, be like a jacuzzi. - What is that movie? Is it, you know, Scanners is the head exploding. What's the movie with the guy's face melting off? - Could not be asking a worst guy. - It's an old. - Did it happen in Goodfellows or the Godfellers? - Have not seen it then, almighty ducks. Those are the ones I got. - It wasn't a mighty duck. - Okay. - That's me right now. - For the hot scalding hot of Mitch Marner goodness on my head and on my face melt off. - Walking around the streets, just scratching myself going up to strangers, just like, hey, do you have any of that Marner, do you? - It's Raiders of the Lost Ark. Of course it is when they open the Ark. - Right. - Okay, I've seen that one. - Yeah, the Nazis get their faces melted off. - Well, I mean, deserved, quite frankly. - Yeah, good take, solid take. Never let it be said that Brent Gunning was an anti-Nazi. - Whoa. (laughing) - All right. Anyways, back to Mitch Marner. - You threw a negative in there and now I'm just like terrified of what people think about me. I'm gonna be like, dragged to the hag and a break here. - Yeah, anyways. - Yeah, Mitch Marner, right. Face melting. - Anyways, okay, so yet, again, we'll melt our faces off. So I later freedman saying that they're preparing an offer which I take to believe, and he's been on record 'cause less certain than that, saying that, hey, Leafs are at least thinking about an extension. - Yep. - It's one thing to be thinking about an extension. - Uh-huh. - And also, like, as you rightly pointed out the other day that you can extend them and still, like, you're in the same, even if you give them a full no move clause, like, so what? - Literally exact same position just with more control that the team's gonna get. - Right, and better off, like, more valuable asset. - Yes. - I mean, they would probably structure bonuses different. That's the one thing is that if you do a deal with the Leafs, you're able to just say, like, give me all my money on July 1st every year, and I think there's a lot of teams that don't particularly want to do that. - Yeah, I don't know. Is there a stipulation in the CBA that you can't just, like, have all the money in the contract? Just front loaded, so they can't-- - I mean, you can't-- - 80 million dollars. - You can severely front load deals. Like, I mean, Matthew's on his new one. He's, I think it's, like, a 20-something-million-dollar or something, but he's right off the hob. - There's probably a limit. I probably can't get paid all of it up front. - I disagree. You can't be so little. - I haven't forbid they give the Leafs an advantage in the CBA, I know. Sorry, I just-- - Anyways. - I know I know we're trying to do Marner and just turn to whining. - Is it, okay, it's one thing to, like, be preparing an extension. It's quite another to be presenting an extension, and it's even another for the player to sign the extension. - Those are three very different things. - And I think the third part is worth reminding people that, again, like, Mitch Marner not coming off his best season. - New, and depending on what the number is on the extension, probably more than willing to play it into the season, Hala, William Knee Lander, and then, hey, do you remember how good I am when I'm at the peak of my powers? - Very good. 99-point guy. - Give me more. - Yup. - Okay. What if Brad's for living presents an extension to Mitch Marner after all the discourse, after all the disappointment in the postseason? Again, not all of it at the feet of Mitch Marner. Nobody, this is, don't get caught up in the straw man of all of it, that it's all Mitch Marner's fault this team hasn't done anything in the postseason. Not the case. - No. - Has he underwhelmed during this? - Yes. - Yeah! Same with other guys. - Most points of all the guys in the playoffs as well. I know. - Whatever. - It's funny, I know. - But, like, also circumstance, like, he's the guy who's deals up. - Yeah. - Anyways, Brad's for living, it is revealed if this is the case that he is presenting Mitch Marner with an extension, and, again, we have no details on length. I would imagine it'd be an eight-year date. Like, you're not presenting him with an extension, unless you want the full amount of team control. How would you react? How do you think the fan base would react? - Well, honestly, my very first blush reaction is, is this actually the first opening salvo when you have to leave? It's one thing to say, it's one thing to, like, talk at the end of the season, like, "Hey, you know, I don't know that the dollars "are gonna be there." It's another thing to put a, like, quasi, and I don't think they're gonna suit, like, they wouldn't, they wouldn't be super offensive. They're not gonna offer him, like, eight times eight or something like that, but it's another thing to put a deal on the table that he's not going to want to sign and say, "Hey, this is what it's gonna look like." Maybe your camp thinks they can squeeze a couple more pennies out of us here, but this is the framework we're operating from. And I just think that that could just as much be the opening salvo of it there. So that was actually my first kind of blush is, and maybe the way I expect or want this thing to play out is coloring my perception of it. But honestly, when I heard that, I said, "Hmm, maybe we didn't get the first opening salvo "at his media appearance the other day from triliving, "because this is gonna be it when he presents Ferris "with whatever this offer is if they're prepared, "that they're potentially preparing." - Yeah, it's not gonna be eight times. - No, of course not. - 'Cause then it's like, "Oh, well, that's, "we know what's happening here." Like, if you do that, it's obvious. - Mm-hmm. - I have to have, like, some plausible deniability. If part of this is, you know, listen, we tried. - Yeah. - And again, like, feeding into making it harder for Mitch Marner to not wave the move. - Yep. - Because the fan base is like, "Whoa, what? "You didn't want to sign the extension "and you're holding them hostage for this season?" - You know what I want to hear. From their perspective, I do wonder if the simple, like, and again, we have no idea. I'm just spitballing here. But does it not feel like the perfect offer to put to them that they would not want is just the Neelander deal? - So that's exactly what I thought. - You can have the exact way of Neelander. - It's like the same thing. - How dare you say that's offensive? Look at the season he just had. Look at the player he's been. Look at how important he's been to this club. If you want to be part of this, you want to play ball. How can you be insulted by that? And it's pretty easy for him to get the caps going up and he's not due for a whole 'nother year. So I think it is easy for that, but that was my immediate reaction. - 100%. - What if he signs it? - What if he, and so he would be under that deal for one more year than Neelander 'cause he just signed the eight year extension, which kicks in this year. His would kick in next year and he would be, so part of the idea behind trading benchmarker this season is that you free up whatever portion of the $11 million of this season. Because next year, the cap situation is much less dire. - Tomorrow's and everything. - Obviously and the cap going up yet again. And so you'd be in that same cap hell for this season that you were always going to be in, that you might be in anyways, because again, Mitch Marner controls all the cards in this and might just say screw you, plan out the year, I'm hitting free agency. But there's just no debate that you're getting at discount on a very good player. - For sure. - For the next decade. Like what if he says yes? And like, can you discount the possibility of him saying yes? - Yeah, I can. I think that I think that I'm less, and I want to be clear, I don't think this is a 0% chance. But unless he sees that as his only chance of salvaging his future in Toronto, that's the only way. Like if he is of the, and I don't know why he would believe that because he still holds all the cards. The ultimate hammer that he has, and I'm sure he believes this in his heart of hearts is that he can go and they can win three rounds next year and he can be great. And then he gets to ask for whatever and he gets to stay. I still think that's the ultimate dream. So I don't think there's a chance he signs it, especially 'cause I mean, like that's what your agent is therefore, quite frankly, is to talk you out of doing the team-friendly thing or the thing for your PR, right? It's like, do it for your bank account. That's what the agent is there for. So I just don't see a world where he'd sign it. I would die to see the mind pretzel that this put, 'cause all of us, I think, myself included. I cannot sit here in good conscience and tell you that it would not be excellent business for the Leafs. - Yeah, it would. Get that thing. - And it would feel, like all of a sudden, the Leafs have this great deal, starting in a minute next year. - What? - And it's the team-friendly guy now. What's happening? - And it's quite one thing to be like, Brad Marshall, and on the $6 million team-friendly deal, to 11 and a half, right? But you could live in that world. Now he's getting 12 plus in the open market, like pretty clearly. - Well, and I think the other interesting thing is that I think the other reason why that doesn't happen quickly. And we hear much less about the fraternity of NHL players than we do with the baseball union, for example. I'd be shocked if, let's say, Marner just wants to sign that deal. Let's say he gets that deal and he goes, "Oh my God, I need to do this." I think that his agent is gonna say like, "Can we get Ranson in?" Not that his agent rep Ranson in or anything on those lines, but it's like, this was the baseball world they're all trying to kind of help each other up and prop the numbers up. If Mitch Marner signs that eight times 11, five, I don't think that affects Lee on Triocidal at all, 'cause as we said yesterday, he's kind of a different kettle of fish, but Ranson in, what does that do to his number? And I do wonder how much that kind of affects Ranson. - Yeah, but like, what if Ranson in signs for 12 and a half? - Mm. (laughing) - Then you got Mitch Marner making a million dollars less and like all of a sudden, all the narrative things about, hey, the least thought they would. Yeah, we can and we will. - It's where this team that thought they were president sending it, everybody's gonna sign those deals and nobody did. And then all of a sudden, those guys were making less than the other people that were of similar quality and had similar contractual timelines. I mean, that would be a mind bender. It would, we got, it'd be the biggest 180 in Toronto sport since the Raptor's traded for Kwanlander, honestly. - Yeah, again, it's like one thing to be like, here's the veteran minimum extension 'cause it's like-- - You get your lifetime of indentured servitude. You get to change the narrative and be, I don't know, do you do a 180 as far as public perception in the city? Making 11 and a half million dollars for a decade. - Right, pretty good. Pretty good place to be at if you could be seen as the guy to take less. The other thing that I could, I do wonder, is if it's the offer and I think if you're the leaf, you want to go full term or whatever. But, and I've talked about this, the idea of the Leafs being able to, like there's no world where they sign him to a contractor and they're in a worse spot to trade him. They're just not, like it's a day, it can't get any more difficult than it does right now. Is that what if he does a like four year 'cause this cap going up or a three year or something like that with the understanding of then-tra-living is kind of in a spot where I can kick this can down the road. You're gonna be able to kick the can again in terms of going to market is hopefully a player who's had playoff success. You're still gonna be in your 20, as I'll be at 29 as opposed to like, or 30 or like it'll be kind of right around that. Okay, one more time for a big deal. I can also see a world where maybe that happens where it kind of is a deal seen to help both parties because I think we have all got ourselves in the position that Brad's your living has already kicked Mitch Marner off the team and I don't know that that's necessarily true. I think we all are the most star and he did. Didn't like talk about him being on the Leafs that much, but he did talk about him as a star. I think it was kind of informative and we're gonna talk to Anthony Petreli coming up in a second him re-earthing the comments that Brad's your living had surrounding William Kneelander. Yeah, right before the extension was done. Was like, it's pretty explicit that we're gonna get this thing done. Yeah, very different, very different. Then what we've heard around Mitch Marner, that's, I mean, that's where I ultimately land on this thing that it's either not gonna happen or if the offer is made, it's in a mode that the understanding is it won't be accepted and that'll be part of the public messaging around, hey, this guy's gots to go because he doesn't wanna be here. We gave him a fair quote offer that he didn't accept. The twists and turns we're gonna get in this in the next 24-ish, 48 hours. I mean, even just like all the inside, like Bertuzzi and Domi, we don't talk about him in depth here, but they have both been absolutely zero chance and at least are feverishly working with them. I think about four times in just the last day alone, so I can't wait. Yep, yep, yep, good stuff. All right, I wanna talk about Boboshette. Agreed, ever so quickly here. I thought you were gonna say I ever heard of him. I have. Yeah, he's having a horrible year. Yes, that's true. Worse here than George Springer all of a sudden. George Springer Passman OBS. Boboshette, good teammate, trying to make him look good. It's four home runs, insane. Anyways, Hazel May spoke to Boboshette and exclusive, said, here's the tweet from 14 hours ago, spoke to Boboshette about trade rumors and deadline talk. I asked him whether he'd be surprised if he were moved at the trade deadline, quote, no, period, not surprised at all, period, end quotation marks. Not surprised at all. Now this is a fella that's shooting from the hip quite often. Ask my question, I'll give you an answer. I don't know if I've ever heard this before from a player in a similar circumstance. We're like part of trade rumors, but it would be mind bending to see, like it would be a franchise changer to see him moved for that player to be asked an explicit question like that and not equivocate or say, like, I all I'm thinking about is being a bluejay, whatever, I can't control any of that. To say, no, I wouldn't be surprised if I'm traded. - Yeah, what was the, like, what was the Kevin Gosman? I mean, he wasn't explicitly asked, or do you think you're gonna be traded, but it was like, I want to be a bluejay. We want to turn these things around. You don't hear that. I could even go back, you know what I was thinking about this with the Machek comments was, and I suppose it's a little different, but all of the coming from his chest comments about Charlie Montoya, they came like after the change was made, not pre-change. This was just jarring to me to see it's so nakedly open of like, again, no equivocation, no, I mean, I think he likes it here, but no, none of that. - Well, so that's it. It's like, what does that mean? - Does it mean that he's like, yeah, like-- - I don't think it means get me out of here, but I think it means I'm very welcome to it. The idea that, like, again, like-- - He thinks it's more than a 50/50 chance he's traded the deadline, 'cause if you're surprised, that means that you're like, don't think it's like-- - Well, he thinks it's likely he's traded. - Okay, that's what I'm parsing from that. - Well, I think to, I don't disagree that that is what he said, but I think if we're going to like, Rorschach test this with Bixette, I look at that and I just think, he looks at it and goes, the team's been bad this year. Me and Vlad are at the end of our team control years. Like, something's got to give here. Like, I think that's just him being pragmatic as opposed to him thinking, like, looking at, like, is anyone coming for me? Where's the trade offer? I don't think that's the case. I think it's more just like, he's always kind of struck me as the most pragmatic of all the guys. Like, there's not so much pie in the sky with him. It's very much like, we are what our record says we are. We're performing the way we are. And I just think he looks at it honestly. Again, like, son of a big league or dad been around, it probably talks to him about all these things. You know what his dad's probably telling him? You guys don't get this straightened out soon. I don't know, maybe he wants it, maybe he doesn't. One of you is going to go and it could very well be you. So that's just my read on it. - So, I don't necessarily think it behooves a general manager or is smart for a general manager to keep a player or prize of every conversation he's had about that player in trade. But here's what I do think. Is that a player, while they also ingest maybe the publicly available information, they're more informed on their own status as a trade piece and how many conversations are being had about them than we are. - Yeah, they have agents. - Right, like the agent is like, yeah, trying to get as much information as he can. Agent also knows other agents, maybe has players within their own agency that could be headed back, say it's for the, in trade by the Dodgers and like, it's one thing not to have it leaked to journalists, but like the internal knowledge that players and agents have about this thing, is it possible that Boba Shedd is more informed than say me or Ken Rosenthal or Jeff Blair or Shida Vidi or Ben Nichols and Samantha Arden's Welling Hazelman, like, I think it's quite possible that Boba Shedd has at least heard a thing or two. The other possibility, and I would love some clarification on this, like, maybe this is kind of a self-deprecating thing, it's like, oh yeah, I've been so bad, like it's on me, like it's my fault. I wouldn't be surprised that this team that has been so disappointing and doesn't see a future with me because I'm not holding up my end of the bargain that they could trade me away. - Yeah. - So there's a couple of different ways I could view it, but I think like, it's hard not to think about the guy who very much is interested in his own future where he plays, wanting to get as much information about that as possible and saying, oh, yeah, no, I see the Dodgers don't have mookie bets for months and months. And even when they had him, he wasn't a capable shortstop. - No. - They could use me. - He can literally do everything but not that. - Yeah, and I've made some calls to some friends I have. Hey, Cam Bijo's over there. Maybe I'm like texting him on, hey, have you heard anything? - I look good in blue. Tell him. - I could very easily see that conversation happening. - Yeah, totally, totally couldn't. He is the, he's also the classic guy that if you're, not that he needs this, like he is, he's not a guy that I think needs to be poked and prodded, but it's like, if you're the agent, it's like, hey, a couple of hot weeks here. There are teams that are buzzing around, like what could that do? You just mentioned him being self-deprecating and I don't, I don't say that. I think there are some people who can't be self-deprecating and I do consider it a flaw. I don't really consider it with Bo. I just have a hard time envisioning that. Like he is just so hyper-serious all the time. Just like, I genuinely, like there are a lot of people you can see, like I can see Vlad doing the like, oh, I've been no good, da, da, da. I have a hard time seeing it from Beshette. Not that he thinks he's been performing amazingly. I just think he'd be mad about it as opposed to like, oh, I'm no good right now, like you understand? - Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, he's an eminently confident fella. - So serious. - Yeah, and I do think he thinks he's going to turn it around and he's done it once. Not to the degree he'd have to this season, considering he was at this point in the season in '22 with an OPS over 700. He was just passed by the guy that we were talking about being the worst hitter in baseball in OPS yesterday. Anyways, all right, before we take the break. Let's talk about the United States presidential debate yesterday, but in this one specific way and keeping it to this one specific way. - That's right. - Sports entered the sphere yesterday. The sport that we enjoy talking about. - And let's be honest, like every president here is talking about the most too. - Golf. Okay, Joe Biden, Donald Trump, talking about golf. That's all the preface it needs. - Towards me before I'm happy to play golf if you carry your own bag. Think you can do it? - That's the biggest lie that he's a six-handed cap of all. - I was an eight-handed cap, yeah. - Eight, but I have, you know how many good? - I've seen this one. I know you swing. - Okay, let's jump on the ground. Let's not act like children. - All right, so, again, keeping it just a golf. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. - Here is my thought off of that, please. Okay, like, yeah, seeing some testosterone flowing between some fellas talking about their sporting achievements and, hey man, like, yeah, I beat you in a 100-yard dash, like, you smoke you. - Of course. - Yeah. - If you haven't argued about some sporting prowess or another, like, but I would say like, golf, I don't know if I've ever, like, do you see two fellas saying, like, yeah, man, I'm a scratch, but, like, and you say you're a one or a plus one. - Let's just go figure it out. - Like, 18 holes? I'm dusting you. - Yeah. - It's usually the opposite. - Right. - We're a sandbag, yeah. - Yeah, it's like, I don't know. My cap is this and, like, yeah, any given day. It's like, I had a couple of lucky rounds. - Yep, it is the one sport that I don't think you do brag about your prowess in. - No, I mean, Jenna, I mean, you do see this with, like, you know, like, guys who, like, played at a level, but don't ever make it. You ask them about their sport. They're like, I'm the worst. I'm so, I'm terrible. Like, some guy who plays pro hockey in Germany, he asks him, it's like, are you any good? He's like, yeah, I can get around out there, but not real. Like, it's just, they're all to that extent. And golf is the sport that exists of that with everybody. Like, there is nobody and what? Because why on God's Green Earth would you do that to yourself? Like, talking yourself up, like, you're some great golfer. It's been never proved positive. Those guys are never going to play golf against each other. That's actually all that that tells me there is that it's like, this is never going to get sent. - Oh, my God. Oh, my God. There would be nothing. Yeah. Well, I shouldn't say nothing. It would be a bad look for Joe Biden to get out there on the golf course. And we've seen, I've seen more Donald Trump swing. - Yeah, he's out there. - Yeah. I haven't seen Biden's. - I haven't seen Biden's. - I haven't seen it. - Yeah, it's single digits. It's pretty good. - Yeah, well, it's stiff. Like, it's a very stiff, rigid, and to his point, this was vice president Joe. And again, we'll keep it there. It's hilarious, honestly. This is just another one. I know this is just another one for the history books. Like, we're going to look back on this era, calling people little Marco, the intimating side of just, it's my favorite. I loathe what it says about our world, but if you can't laugh at this, you just take everything a little too seriously. And it also helps to like, you know, golf, not my country. - Golf is the gentleman sport. - It is? - Yes. - Okay. We'll settle it on the golf course, but anything, you know, any rivalry or any belief that I'm better than you is implied. - Yeah. - Hey, we'll figure it out. - We don't talk about it. - No. - Let's just do it. Oh, you think you're better golf than me? - Yeah, let's go play it. - Again, like, my mentality would be, I would never... - Maybe you probably are better than me. - Especially when the chips are down. - Oh, my God. - Definitely better. Definitely. It's the best. Now, I'm just wondering, like, who is JFK's handicap? I'm sure somebody, I'm sure it's him. - Yeah, of course. You think, like, richest man in the world? Do you think you might have had a decent gal handicap? I think you might have. - All right. Okay. - I think we did very well. Good job. - All right. - So, how are you going to make the joke? - You be the pro. - All right, we'll break then. And when we come back, we'll talk to Anthony Petrelli. A maybe leaves hot stove next as the fan morning show continues. Ben Anis, Brent Gunning, Sportsnet 590, the fan. Unrivaled insight, analysis and opinions on all things Blue Jays. Blair and Barker. Be sure to subscribe and download the show on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. - Thank you. - Ben, morning show, Sportsnet 590, the fan, Ben Anis, Brent Gunning. So, perhaps we see a Mitch Marner trade before tonight's draft. Perhaps we see it after Monday, because on Monday, Mitch Marner's bank account, we'll read $7,250,000 more. I was going to say, you know the number already to do that math? - Yeah, more. - Okay. - Yeah. - More. Because that's his signing bonus that he's owed after July 1st. - Again, July 1st. I don't know how it works because the banks aren't open. - I was going to say, I don't know how it works. Don't ask John Tavares in terms of if that money gets taxed or not. That's what I was going to say. I don't know how that part works. I don't think it's exactly the, you know, I don't know what we call him up here. Probably like Uncle Gord instead of Uncle Sam. - Yeah. He's taking his cut. - Yeah. Yeah. Well, John Tavares on Monday is going to get a little direct deposit for $7 million as well. $7 million, $40,000. Austin Matthews is going to get a direct deposit for $15,925,000. - God, that'd be nice. Just like one time. Give it to me. - Yeah. - You'll never see me again. - Mitch Marner's cap hit is going to remain the same, but if there is a trade a foot, the acquiring team will only be on the hook for a dollar figure this season of $770,000. Good deal. - Good deal. I guess. Let's talk to Anthony Petrielli of Maple Leafs Hotstove. How's it going, Anthony? - I'm good, guys. How about you? - Doing all right. Let's start with this because Elliot Friedman on the most recent edition of 32 Thoughts said, you know, it's quite possible and what he was hearing is that the Maple Leafs might be cooking up an extension offer for Mitch Marner. Is there a number that you think becomes palatable and changes the conversation this year? And reading your latest on Maple Leafs Hotstove, understanding obviously that the $11 million is probably better spent elsewhere in $20 million, not enough for the Maple Leafs to make the changes they need to make going forward to this season, but beyond this year, like, is there a number on a Mitch Marner extension where you just, it makes it easier to swallow this one season of $11 million for Mitch Marner. - I guess it would depend who you ask. I think if you ask most fans, they would just say no. I think it's just kind of hit that point for a lot of people. But in terms of, is there a number, of course, you know, he's still a really good player. I think he's probably getting treated slightly unfairly in terms of how he seems to be in particular wearing their playoff struggles when he has been technically more productive than both Austin Matthews and William Nylander to this point, even though that hasn't necessarily been the case in Game 6 and 7, but over the body of work. I mean, he did lead them in scoring just last year in the playoffs. But I think when you look at it, if, you know, if you're talking just realistically being ideal, you'd like to see the number align with William Nylander's extension about to kick in as well, speaking of, you know, money about to be sent out the door because he'd kind of look at it and say you have two top line wingers. Ideally, they're money matches. But I think when you, you know, to be honest, when you look at the two players, William Nylander, by and large, gets outproduced by Mitch Marner every single season, you know, even a season like last year, Nylander gets 98 points. But at five on five, he was actually on for more goals against and more goals for it. So, you know, that's not something that ever really happens to Marner. He's always pushing play. He's always outscoring opponents. He's always among the top 10 in scores. Like that's an every year thing for Marner. This is more of a newer thing for Nylander. And still there's, you know, hesitation as to whether he can continue to do that year in year out. So, you know, long winded, if you were saying like what's fair to me, it's probably slightly slightly more than Nylander. If you were saying what's more palatable, you'd probably say aligned with Nylander. Yeah, that's the, it's funny. That's the number I immediately jumped to when we again heard the report from Fridge in the latest 32 thoughts of them preparing to potentially offer a Marner an extension there is that does seem like the perfect kind of way for traveling to kind of walk a line, right? Where he could say, hey, we tried. It's not like we just dragged our feet and didn't want to extend the player at all. But it also does give him the room because I don't, I'm not saying there's no world where Marner accepts that. I just can't see a world where he accepts that today or, I mean, I guess he couldn't until until July 1st. The other question about that is let's say they are of the belief that a Marner extension as possible is does that kind of gum up the cap sheet to the point where we're looking at an off season that's a lot like last year's where it's okay, John Klingberg, and it's a big money deal for one year because we don't know what's going on beyond that. Max Domie and I don't think it'd be Max Domie again. It seems like he could potentially get some term, but that's the other thing. I think you have to question with all this. And I guess that's, that's a question whether you're thinking about extending him or even just trading him because then it gives you the dollars for, for this off season as well. I honestly, I think they're pretty good this off season, no matter what happens because it's not like that money is applied to this year's cap. Like they've got roughly 20 million cap space. I mean, they technically have 10 forward sign. They could basically, you know, they could basically do very little forward. And that would, you know, I know it would look the same. So I think that would bother a lot of people, but they were, they were second in the league and goals last year, Marner missed like, you know, 15 games or so. Nick Mann got hurt, like NICE had a 35 point rookie season like there, there's a reasonable amount of just internal improvement from that side of things just essentially coming back and, you know, Yarn Crock, you know, what did he miss 30 some odd games? Like just honestly, some better health and those guys, you know, some level of internal improvement of like your Nick Robertson's and Pontus Holmberg's and their solid group. I think the money this time and the difference really will be they have a little bit more to spend just given how many roster spots they already have taking care of and how many like young players and cheap contracts they have in the fold now. And then two, the guys they signed last year, you know, even on the ideal side were probably more like seconds, third line type players here, Tyler Batusi's or Max Stomi, or even if everything went well with John Klingberg, it'd be at best a second pairing defenseman. But they have legitimately enough money to sign like an actual top pairing defenseman, which would make it a significant difference. I just, I don't think we're used to it in Toronto. They really just have not had a good defense by and large for the past like 20 years. So at this point, we're not even sure what it looks like, but they have enough money to actually do it this year. And there's enough quality defenseman on the market that it would pretty drastically change their team, I think. Yeah. The defense is obviously going to be a point of, I mean, just from a team building perspective, it's clearly tri-living's preference to kind of build things out that way obviously has to operate a little differently just given the pieces he has in Toronto. You mentioned the forward group and they have have the 10 capable bodies there. How important is getting another center here because I mean, David Camp, he's not going anywhere I'd imagine with that no move and it's not like his deal is going to kill you, but it's probably, you know, a hair too expensive for what you get out of him. And there's been so much talk about Tavares and can he be the two seed? Do you need him to be the three seed? Should he be a seed at all? Do you boot him to the wing? If you have questions about that, it feels like you kind of have to go and get another center. How much of a priority should that be along with the blue line there? To me, at forward, that should be the only priority. You can kind of get away with, if you look at the left side right now, I mean, you're hoping for Matthew Neis to take a step, but he's a good player, no doubt. And Bobby McMahon was showing flashes of being a good player and Nick Robertson was productive. I know he's in RFA and he used to get signed, but, you know, he's under their control unless they don't want him to be, you know, Pontus Holmberg again, kind of similar-ish, the key showed some ability to move up the lineup, but by and large can take shifts in the league and be a contributor, Connor Dewar, same thing. So you know, the reasonable left side, on the right side, you're fairly, you're solid. It's, you know, you have William Newlander, Mitch Marner, and Calla Yarn-Croc, and then I guess Ryan Reeves, but, you know, the top three there is very solid. The center is where it gets interesting because I don't think John Tavares is going to be, you know, an Albatross next year, he had 29 goals and 65 points, and he had like a career, low shooting percentage. It'll be reasonable to some degree, but it's going to be a drop-off, like this is the first time where they're really going into it where you're saying, you know, first time in what, six years, you're like, maybe they don't have two 80-plus point centers. So they need to prepare for that, but they need to have some sort of hedge that balances it out, and someone who can also just take shift, I think that's probably, there's two different kinds of seasons, or there's the regular season and the playoffs. Is John Tavares a productive second-line center in the regular season? Yes. But do you want him going up every night, every other night against Sam Bennett? Probably not, right? And you just, when you look at those top end teams and who they're running out, you know, if they're, as their second-line center, even their third-line center, you don't want that to necessarily be John Tavares going up against some shift in, shift out, and you don't want it to be David Camp. So they really do need some sort of in-between center, if you want to call it that, that is good enough to move up the lineup, is comfortable as a 3C, someone who can, you know, drive, play and be effective. John Tavares season a year ago is weird to put into context, because he had more even strength goals than he did in 22-23 and more even strength assists than he did in 22-23. Like so much of the ramp down in production, the 15 points fewer that he scored was all on the power play. It was very, very bizarre to talk about his season a year ago. All right. So let's get back to Marner and the potential trades that you outlined on MapleLiftHotStove.com. I appreciate you doing that, Anthony, because one thing to talk about, theoretical Marner trade, it's quite another to put names to potential candidates to come to Toronto in return. All right, in doing this thought exercise, do you think the Leafs can get back enough to make it worthwhile to trade Mitch Marner? I mean, if you were to boil it down, I would ultimately say no. I think that's why we're hearing discussion about extensions. I think it's kind of been floated in and out the past month, many of your various things. You know, at the end of the day, what I think is probably going to happen is they're clearly trying. And at no point, Brad Tree Living could have, you know, kibosh the entire conversation at any point, and he has elected not to. So, you know, he's some sort of poker player, or, you know, he's just being honest about the situation. Last year with William Neelander, he was honest. It was strictly, we want him back. Like, he left no room for ambiguity. He was crystal clear. He has not said that at any point when it comes to Marner, he has not said, you know, he said he's a really good player, he called him a superstar, he called him a star a number of times. At no point has he folded on that, but at no point has he sat there and explicitly said, we want him back, we want to sign him, he is going to be a Maple Leafs next year, it has not happened. But what the problem is, is trading him is extremely complicated, because, you know, right now the reputation in the league and what the Leafs is not the best, I think that's kind of sullying his value. I think that's why we constantly see Brad Tree Living out there saying he's a star, because he is a star. He's been a top 10 score by and large for the past five years in a row. So that's, you know, it's not a fluke at this point, he's a high end producing player. There's a ton of teams that aren't even sniffing a playoffs that would love to have a guy like that in their lineup and get them to the playoffs. So, you know, he's trying to find value that matches with it. And I think that's going to be hard just getting the value. And then you get the no movement clause. And then you get, will he sign an extension? Those are just, there's so many factors working against, you know, agreeing to a deal, getting good value in a deal, it's, you know, to me that trends more to the point of just, then you bring them back, you have a new coach, you improve the defense and you see how it goes again. Yeah. The thing I've been thinking about was it was one thing when true living was making those comments about Kneelander when Austin Matthews wasn't signed and you have to kind of, you know, throw up the beacon to Matthews of don't worry, like all the guys you like playing with are here, whatever, whatever it is you like is going to be here. We need to make sure you get yourself done. I do wonder if that's the one kind of difference with Marner now, although Matthews was signed when Kneelander still needed to deal in November and needed to deal in December. And guess what, we were still here and we want to get this player signed, we're working away with the camp. I don't think that's nothing. There is obviously the bonus and I think that certainly matters to some franchises more than others in terms of if it's paid out. Do you think there's a world where the Jake Gunsell free agency affects the Marner market? They're different players. They give you different things, but if I'm looking for a star winger and I can't get Jake Gunsell for free, maybe I have to pivot to try to get Mitch Marner for something. It's possible, I mean, the part of it too is when does Gunsell sign, right? Is he going to be a day one signing? He could probably take his time and do essentially whatever he wants. So if it stretches, you know, July 2nd, July 3rd, the deeper it goes, and I guess that's the same piece with the kind of in relation to Marner, it's like the deeper it goes, the harder it is to trade up. So it's hard to know if Gunsell is a day one signing to a point where all bets are off, but I think the teams that you hear, I think Carolina makes sense as a trade partner. I don't think Carolina makes sense in terms of their salary cap structure, their owner, their market, all those things I'd find a hard time sitting there and looking at that franchise and saying they're going to pay Marner 12 or whatever it is, you know, close to a $100 million dollar contract and bring up Carolina because we know that they want to keep Gunsell or Vancouver is obviously aggressively pursuing. I'm like, I find it hard to see Marner waving from one crazy Canadian market to go to another crazy Canadian market, and I'd still find it hard to see Vancouver saying, okay, Mitch Marner is going to be our highest paid player on our team. So, like those, it's, I don't know how tight he would be to the teams interested in Jake Denfield, but I do think that Domino is like, is noteworthy in the overall story of it, but to that point too, like I think that's also noteworthy in the Marner trading conversation. It's like, how many teams are going to be willing to make this guy their highest paid player? Yeah, face of the franchise. We shall see. Perhaps we get some clarity after tonight's draft. Anthony, really enjoyed the piece and thanks for doing this today. Thanks for having me on guys. Have a great weekend. You too, Anthony Petrielli, Maple Leafs hot stove. I need this Ryan Smith to be a crazy owner. The problem is, is like, he's already used to it in the NBA, he's like, guys, I'm an NBA owner, it's not like, if I wanted to get crazy, I would say bring me Luca, not bring me Mitch Marner, but easier to do one than the other. I think right now, that's the thing I keep kind of coming back to is none of the situation situations make sense. Like, there's no perfect, he'd love it. This is the spot. But the thing that does make sense is a new owner coming in a new market, they literally don't have a name and saying, let me sell you this. Let me show you him doing the gritty and dancing with kids and whatever it is. And then if you're not 12 years old, let me show you him as a hockey player and you can love that too. Like, we're so, there's just so much scar tissue with the player here and look, I'll say the thing a million times, it all goes away with winning. If you ever win, all the scar tissue melts away, like it never even happened, but there's just so much here that it's hard to view him that way for some people, but I got a new lease on life in Utah and yeah, fit him perfectly. It would be interesting to see the Mitch Marner team though, like where he's the, he's the well. Yeah, he's the star and I don't know if immediately he gets the C slapped on him, but like eventually, obviously that's the plan, right? And the other part of it is that we've talked so much about, well, the reason you need to trade one of these guys, and this isn't so much the this year conversation, but this is two, three, four years ago that we've been doing this is not what you get for the guy, not the changing of the cap landscape that you do. Those are all nice things, but the actual benefit, or at least what a lot of people bandy about is the number one benefit is the punch in the mouth. It would be for all parties involved and can you put past the world where Mitch Marner is, you know, whether forced or he feels he was allowed to choose to go to Utah and having that be the, and I don't think Mitch Marner like needs to do growing up, but that'd be the moment where he becomes a little bit more captain serious and he's, you know, got that Johnny Taves in him or whatever and he just kind of has a new lease on life as a pro. And again, I don't say that to say Mitch Marner's unprofessional or anything along those lines, but if you go to a new city, you're the face of the franchise. They want to make you the captain. It does change your demeanor a little bit. At least I would think it does. Yeah. Yeah, it's different when you're, yeah, you're the homegrown kid and you're almost a hundred point guy, but you're playing on not just the same team on the same line as the greatest player in the history of the franchise. And when you're not with him, you're on the guy who finally did the thing and came home and he's the captain. Yeah. It's, it's so insane that yeah, you're the fourth overall selection, you're the hometown kid. Right out of the gates, you produced, you play 200 feet of hockey. Yep. You're the best, the third billing as far as fame on this team. I think now second, but there have definitely been times worth third for sure. Yeah. It's never one. No, that's the only, like really, when we're talking about this, that's the only thing that matters is never one. Yeah. Never. No, never. I mean, and like, not just win big, like one around, like, come on, it's just, it's so insane. Anyway. Great. Anyways, fun times. The discourse only continues tonight's draft and Monday's free agency. By the way, obviously we'll be on the air on Monday full edition of the show will be live from the Legion. Yeah. As everyone gets, like, so excited to tell us, like, happy long weekend. I'm like, for you. Yeah. I love biking. You know me. I actually do love working. Well, of course, we'd be up that time refreshing our Twitter feed anyways, so might as well flip on the microphones. All right. We'll have the Waken Reich presented by sports interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. Blue Jays trying to win two consecutive against the vaunted New York Yankees who are going through it right now. Blue Jays won two consecutive scoring 18 runs across those two games. They have, you say, Kukuchi on the mound against Marcus Strowman. And the Yankees are favored in this game minus one 22 blue Jays plus one oh five. The total is eight and a half, Brent. Yeah. But this one, I think big bounce back from the Yankees. I saw how the game went yesterday. It all got started with like Vlad's like broken bat double and everything. Give me, let's try it again. Give me Yankees on the money line. Yeah. I don't hate that especially you say Kukuchi has not been very good recently. Yeah. I also like the team that doesn't score runs that has now scored nine runs in its last two games for that to continue for a third game. I find that unlikely. So I kind of like the under, which is you got to pay a little extra juice on the under eight and a half minus one 15. I like the under and the Yankees blue Jays game two tonight. And let's look at the 24 25 heart trophy futures. No offense. Blue Jays buried the lead here, Ben. This is great. This is awesome. Conor McDavid is the favorite plus one 75, you know, anytime you can get Scotty Scheffler major odds on the heart trophy for next year, like what are we to accept half like Scotty Scheffler? It's like outrageous. Scotty Scheffler plus 300 to win a golf tournament before he teed it up before a game has been played. Conor McDavid plus one 75, which is like, okay, yeah, I guess I if I had to guess who's going to win it. I mean, but like, you know, I could be injured like the value in it before, yeah, the value is non-existent there. Nathan McKinnon, second favorite. He's not going to win it. No, no, plus 700 awesome at these plus 800. Don't hate it. Leafs had a bad playoff though. So as we discussed earlier in the show, that can't work. Jack used plus 1100 that was one of Sheldon Keith. That was when I looked at, I think it's more likely that that's the year he like inserts himself into the discussion and wins the Jack Adams. No value. The value here is kale macar plus 4000. Okay. We'd love narratives. A defenseman. How long's it been? Like we're just going to do the same team though back to back heart trophy winners. Yeah. Like, sorry, Nathan McKinnon, you're going to get hurt and miss 20 games. Just enough that it's like, oh, my car, steal in the show. Yeah, that I don't think he's going to win, but in terms of value, I think that's the best kind of spot there, or he was at a plus 1100. I don't disagree. All right. That was the wake and right presented by sports interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, talk to a former Stanley Cup winning executive. Mike Futer next as the fan morning show continues bed and a sprint gunning sports at 590 the fan.
