>> [MUSIC] >> Fan Morning Show Sportsnet 5.9 of the Fan, Ben and his brain gunning. Vegas baby. It's where all the NHL people are at. This week, got the award ceremony on Thursday. Got the draft on Friday. Free agency opens up on Monday. >> Mm-hm. >> And we'll be live on the air on Canada Day for that. >> Trump, I believe, was at least $20 million in cap space. >> At least. Perhaps more. >> Mm-hm. >> And part of that does hinge on a potential Mitch Marner trade. Who, as you may already know, has a full no move clause. >> I've heard, too. >> He does have one more year on his deal, so is eligible to sign an extension come Monday as well. So, mention it, Elliot Friedman on the latest edition of 32 Thoughts. It could be a bananas week. >> Bananas. >> We've already seen former Vesna winner traded within the division an hour before Puck drop a game seven. >> For nothing. >> [LAUGH] >> It's, no, again, it's really just it's great that the Leafs can't make trades with teams outside of their division because their GM used to work there three years ago. But it's awesome that the Bruins just give away a Vesna winner for a backup and a first round pick and a draft that everyone says sucks. No, it's great. It's great. It's great. It's great. >> Yeah, there is reporting now that may beliefs were runners up for Jacob Markstrom and that their package may, in fact, have been more significant than what the Devils gave up for. >> It's great. No, it's awesome. >> Awesome. >> Okay. >> [LAUGH] >> Again, get ready to start the Laurent Brassois era. It feels like that one's fedocomply. >> Joe Waller actually, but yes, sure, sure, sure, sure. I don't get distracted, I know. >> Okay. Mitch Marner, right. So still unresolved. I mean, anything officially from his camp has been we're on to contract. We're Toronto Maple Leafs. That's what we're gonna do is be Toronto Maple Leafs going forward. Same with Brad for living. Hey, he has his contract. Don't move. Nothing we can do. Of course, this could be very different and probably is very different behind the scenes. Do you think that this deal, if it happens, has now a ticking clock and that it happens before Friday's draft at the sphere in Las Vegas? >> I think it'd be very prudent to do it, but I don't think it's a hard and fast stop on it. I know it's kind of been well trod ground, but I keep going back to it. Like the biggest trade Brad shall living has ever made didn't happen at the draft. It didn't happen before July 1st. And quite frankly, it's one he definitely would like to have back, especially that dinner in Montreal, where he inked Hubert ode to the Cajillion Dollar contract that the flames are probably still mad at him about. And that's why the Leafs can't trade for Jacob Marksham. But I look at that and I say that that's just proof of concept. This is a guy who doesn't want to do it or doesn't want to feel like he's under the gun. I was thinking a huge part of this as well is that who felt like he was under the gun last year and couldn't do it. I don't think he wants to operate in the exact same circumstance. So of course, it's easier before July 1st. Of course, it's easier before teams go and give millions of dollars to middle six forwards because, hey, baby, that's what happens in an HL free agency. But I don't think it predicates it from happening just because it doesn't happen on Friday or Saturday or Sunday. >> Yeah, I agree with you. And beyond that, it's because the return the Maple Leafs will be looking for real world assets. >> I mean, maybe it's draft picks as well and to make it all even out. And yeah, you can couple that with the savings when it comes to the cap number that they save. But they're gonna need a physical human being who will play hockey for them in the year 2024-25 season. And that's still the case. And so in that way, it doesn't, like this draft is kind of secondary to that. And whatever you end up recouping as far as traffic compensation, I don't see the draft as this be all end all part of the equation. Plus, just frankly, the timing on this, unless so much of the legwork has been done, which I can't discount the possibility, but we have some pretty good reporters. And that's a pretty big deal. And the idea that nothing would have leaked that, hey, they've actually got something like on the goal line, and it's being presented to Mitch Marner. So in three days, you're telling me that you're going to create this trade package between two teams. Both teams are gonna be happy with that. You're going to bring it to Mitch Marner. He's going to decide that that's a market he wants to go to. But beyond that, I don't think any trade is being consummated without, if not an explicit agreement, like an implicit agreement that an extension is coming and what that extension looks like for that team, just ginormous. We're talking about one of the bigger contracts in the NHL right now, as far as capid, like if he, it's over 12 million bucks. And I know there's some other big extensions that are that are coming. You're telling me that all of that is going to happen in a span of three days. I just don't see it. Well, I think the, I think the extension part of it is actually kind of the easiest thing to kind of get by because, you know, maybe I'm naive to think this, but I think occasionally their backdoor conversations had between agents and teams. Like maybe if an agent was talking to a team about another one of their players, they could, you know, spitball at what a 99 point Selke winger might be worth. Should he be acquired by that team? Like, I think that part is actually relatively easy. We're so bogged down on the contract here in Toronto because it's all we've talked about for the better part of over a half decade now. The other team that's trading for Mitch Marner is going to be so thrilled to give him, you know, not whatever he wants, carp, lunch, but they're requiring him because they're very excited to get the player and they're going to pay him in a big way. So I actually think the extension part of it is kind of the easiest thing there. I think the other caveat, and I'm not wavering from where I started on this. I still don't think it has to happen, is that, you know, we talked to Buchola about this yesterday, is that the entirety of the NHL world is like all traveling to Vegas together because of the cup final, it all got jammed together. And it just takes two. If one team's interested and another team was saying, this is something I want to kick tires on in a couple of weeks, and you think you don't get the opportunity to, then things start moving. Like if one team's interested and another team had it on their list and they have to, it cranks up the urgency there. So I very much think it could happen at the draft, and I just don't think it has to. The other thing regarding the assets in the real world of it all, I agree with you. I think it's going to be a big-ish piece coming back. I think if Bradshaw Living could have his druthers, it's a defenseman that makes $8 million or 7 or something like that where he gets a piece. It's a massive part of it, but it's never seen as a, hey, this guy is what we got from Mitch Marner. He's part of the puzzle. So I think that's the way you go about it, that you can still look at that and it doesn't need to happen. You can make a deal for a $7 million defenseman in the middle of July. It doesn't need to happen right now. >> So I understand your point about the extension being relatively easy as far as the cap hit, right? It's going to be over 12 million bucks. It's going to be eight years. >> Is it though? >> I think. >> Okay, so that's the question I have, right? Is Mitch Marner, does he look at the guy that he wants to be compared to and wanted to be compared to when he was negotiating his last contract? >> Justin Bieber, no, that's me. >> Austin Matthews and saying, yeah, I see the cap going up. Like me and Austin, we're not that dissimilar. I do the same thing because I'm one of the best players in the NHL and I want to maximize my career earnings. And does he have enough confidence in himself to say, all right, fine, trade me to Vegas, whatever. And I'll sign. >> Yeah. >> But it's only four or five year deal. >> Well, this is all part of this is all part of what how hard ball the Leafs are going to play. Like there's many a thing they could leak, right? It could be eventually, hey, he's not really given us any room to work with here. He's given us one team. We've brought him four or five deals and he said no to each of them. The other one you can do is that it's the extension that's holding this all up. And if you want to, it's actually funny to think that it would be more of a bad look for Marner in this market to be hurting the, to be asking for a better contract than it would be to hurt the team. Like I think we all look at it and say, oh, if the Leafs want to play hard ball, they say, oh, he's not, he's not willing to wave. And that would be the thing that would really get people to turn on them. And it certainly would. But just without sensitive, everybody in this market is about contracts. If it came out that the actual stumbling block on this is that every team that wants to trade for Marner wants to give him six, seven, eight years, and he goes, no, no, I want three or four. That would actually borderline be a bigger sin in this market than just saying, I'm dragging my feet and I'm not going. Because I think people look at the no move and they say, well, it is what it is. Someone gave it to him. That's his right. I don't think anybody looks at specifically Mitch Marner right now and says, Oh yeah, no, a three year deal and ring the bell again. I mean, it absolutely, let me be clear. It is his right. But I don't think anybody wants to hear that right now. It would be not so. But yeah, I mean, you, I can make him financial argument course of course, of course, you can, of course. And I think from the players perspective, why wouldn't you want to lease instead of buy, right? Like you've lived in Toronto your entire life, even when you're even when you're, this isn't, this isn't Austin Matthews who went to Zurich. When he was a junior hockey player, he lived in London, like he was right down the road. But even those things being true, he didn't sign for eight years, the first time around. Yeah, right? Like even here, he didn't sign the first time around. Oh, that's a good point. Yeah, that's so the idea that he's like, yeah, I'll go to Vegas. I'm sure it'll be great there. But yeah, I'm going to make a bigger commitment there than I did with my hometown team that's still giving me the bag. Having said that, it's like, we can get our backs up about that. I, as long as it is a, like, I don't think any team's trading for him and giving him a three year deal or something like that. But I still think as angry as we'd all be about it, there are still teams lining up to say, oh, yeah, I'd love to pay Mitch Barnard for four years. We're so close to it. It's so hard, but there are still teams dying, dying, dying to do that. I don't know if it's a team that, like a Vegas that already has like a winning pedigree and is also like, have you seen like the no-state taxes there? And like, if you talk to anyone on this plate here, like seem to enjoy it. I'm sorry, you don't want to. Okay, that's fine. We don't need you. Like, we're already a pretty good team. Well, and again, they, I don't know that they would think of it this way, but they did their big sexy forward ad last year. And not that they're not in on every guy, but just, I mean, you know, like Jack Eichl, Mitch Marner, which one you want to build around. They've made their choice, right? Mm-hmm. And he was, I do recall him hoisting it. I've seen it. Oh, oversight. It's back held up. It's for him. It's heavy trophy. You know, you'd hate it for it to compress it. Yeah. There are multiple intriguing players with contracts, expiring at the same time. Yeah. One guy we spent a lot of time talking about, because he was playing it and saying like a final on a brown. Yeah, no, he's a free agent. They can go that he's, he's coming up earlier than Leon Dreyseidel, but Leon Dreyseidel, is a heart trophy winner. Mm-hmm. He is coming off a Stanley Cup final appearance where he, yeah, notably scored no goals. But yeah, he was instrumental in the Oilers getting to the cup final. And I'm still waiting for like the admission of injury. And I guess that will come in their final final media availability. Maybe they'll go leaves. Yeah, this is weird. What happened? He was weird. Yeah, that would be bad. That would. If I was Leon Dreyseidel, I'd be fighting somebody if they came up with that. He's gone into his final year of his contract and he's making eight and a half million bucks. Yeah. Does his negotiation and the number that he ends up signing for in extension and all reports and Frank Servelli says that they've already been communicating the Oilers and him. Does that impact the marner number at all? If he goes first, it does. I don't think Dreyseidel being out there and it's like, hey, what'll Dreyseidel get affects the marner number. I don't think this mythical 14 million that we've heard. Tell somebody puts pen to paper. I don't think it affects marner a lick. So I think that if as long as Dreyseidel is unsigned, there is no correlation there at all. If Dreyseidel puts pen to paper July one and it's for quite frankly like anything less than 14, how can that not squeeze the marner number down? How can it not? You can't sit here like it's a center. It's a heart trophy winner. It's a guy who just played in a cup finally as the second most points since he's came into the league since McDavid, he's like fourth all time. And well, I imagine the cup final kind of digging those numbers a little bit, but whatever the numbers were that he was him, Gretzky and Mario and Connor, a pretty good company to be in. So I think if he goes first, it has to, has to, has to affect it. The other guy in all this that I actually think is the way bigger comparable that there has not been one lick of noise about is Michael Ranton. That guy's a winger. That guy has similar numbers to Mitch marner. That guy is a more of a dead one to one comparable. Now the thing about Ranton and he's going to need a little bit more of a raise. He's coming in at nine to marner obviously at 10, nine. I think it's pretty fair to say those players deserve comparable value. Now the difference with all this is it's the avalanche. So no one has ever talked about it. I actually think there are people right now finding out that Michael Ranton isn't signed some 10 year $5 million contract. I was wondering if I was just missing this. I went and searched. First I just searched Michael Ranton and went to like the Google News tab and there was nothing there at all. Then I got very specific. Michael Ranton and extension. The most recent thing I can find was three weeks ago in the Denver post talking about, here's what the numbers might look like. That just one. I mean, I'm not going to get too down on my hobby horse of like, it's just easy elsewhere. But let me point that it's just easier elsewhere. But that's the one that should be the comparable for marner. We talk about dry side. Well, dry side should be boxing him in if he goes first. But if Ranton comes in at some number that's team friendly or unlike Mitch marner, Michael Ranton and can get a $2 million raise and barely be over $11 million. What does that do to marner's value? Again, Ranton is at nine to if he took a two and a half $3 million raise that gets him to 12. What does that do to marner's leverage and negotiation? Like there's so much talk about dry side. Oh, Ranton is the one that I think we need to pay attention to. But again, if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears or if a avalanche player needs a contract extension, like, how does it affect things? That's the one that I actually keep kind of looking to here. Who'd you rather have? I this is a cop out answer, but I genuinely think it depends on the team. I think if you are a I think if you are a team that is starved for offense and push and jump and the ability to make special things happen, I think you'd rather have Mitch marner. I do. We're all down on the player, but I still think that's the case. But if you're taking a ready-made winner and just want to inject someone in there, it's not even close, in my opinion. And that's unfair to marner. But man, that guy's a cup champ. Okay. I mean, he's a great player. He's a power forward is mean. Two straight hundred point seasons scored 55 goals, two seasons ago. Like, yeah, now now you have now. This is the thing that has to be said. It's like Mitch marner and you can make, I guess similar arguments, but he's not a goal score. So I don't think it works quite the same way. It's like, ranting gets to play off of McKinnon and Macar, like he's part of this great power play and Landis Cog's been there as well. Not say that marner doesn't have a share of offensive talent as well, but I think the goal score, it's a little fair to say that he's more dependent is too strong a term. Well, and more at 200 foot player to marner is, right? Like, yeah, it's not an obvious slam dunk that rannons better, but you can make the argument easily. You can easily make the argument. He can stop. 27 years old. Yeah, he's been there. Yeah, hoist in a cup over his head. Yeah. It's like also the counting statistics and the goal scoring like the most important thing on sport. Like he's done it to a higher level. Totally. And that's why I think if you're, if you're the Leafs and you and I actually don't think this is happening, but we've heard the like, hey, we're living open to extension. Okay, sure. Better not happen until me go ranting in sciences. And also the idea of marner, like we've talked about this before, it's like, yeah, they put 14 million in front of them. Obviously he's going to take it or whatever. But the idea that Mitch marner didn't see the William Neelander thing saying and realizing I'm coming off the worst season of my professional career, which was still very good. Yeah. That how like, why on God's green earth would you sign an extension right now? Especially if ranting comes in with some, you know, team friendly is not, he's not taking a pay cut, but I can easily see a world where Ranton then says, eh, give me 11 five. Let's, let's see what we can do here. Well, at best he's making 12, right? Because McKinnon's at 12 six. Yep. He's not, he's not going to be more well compensated than Nathan McKinnon. The best contracted hockey as well. I'm just on the abs cat friendly page there. Kayle McCarr three more years for nine million. Yes. Genuinely. It's actually just a dry saddle contract. Like it's the exact same, but it's like just a guy who hit the right time and took off. And God, that's going to be expensive. Kayle McCarr is going to make like 20 million dollars a year when that contract's up. Yeah, it's going to be a lot. That's because the cap's going up. That's because the sport of hockey is growing. Yeah, the numbers now being released for game seven, as far as ratings are concerned, it was sports that's most watched broadcast ever. Average minute audience of 7.55 million across sports. That's it to be in CBC. Did that surprise you? Not necessarily. I would, I would have thought just like if you asked me, most watch brought, I would have assumed one of the J's games, like one of the jet, like a 15, 16, something like that would just wear my first blush. And we are still a hoggingation. No, no, I don't, I don't disagree. It's just like, I think there are, I mean, you've had these conversations a million people like this is 42 degrees outside. I'm sitting in my basement launching a hockey. This doesn't compute, but we don't have that in baseball, right? Like people are thrilled to sit on a patio or something. I was just surprised. I don't like, I, I agree. We are a hockey nation. Don't, don't take it as me dot say in that. But yeah, that surprised me. Do I think like the Leafs in the same circumstance aren't doubling that number? Like, I think that's, we're talking about like 2010 golden goal type. Nut ratings for the Leafs in a cup final. People would move like the population of the country would go. People would be moving back to watch it. Like that's how, that's how highly watched it would be. Yeah, it'd be ridiculous. Of course. Yeah, of course. Yeah. But yeah, it's a Canadian franchise with the sports best player in a game seven with historic states and stakes and the Panthers were there. They got a, they got a great view of it. The number obviously also huge in the United States. So across North America, 16.3 million viewers across every network, United States and Canada in North America. Second most watched NHL game in 20 years. And this is a, a world in which ratings aren't going up. No, like even though the, the rights fees for live pro sports are going up and up and up and up and up. It's like not correlated to ratings. It's because, you know, people have to watch it live. Yeah. So it's tape it. And it's, it's on its own in that regard. But it's not like the actual physical number of people that are watching these things is going up. There's just too many choices anyway. Else, elsewhere. As far as the North American media consumer. So what happened here? Because it was what I said is true and undeniable is historic stakes. It's a game seven of a championship series. But it also happened in late June. And we were along like the parade had already happened for the Celtics like well before. Yes. Game seven. Is it just, hey, you can't recreate that because you can't force as far as we know a game seven of a cup final every year with the world's best player in it. Is that all it comes down to? It's not just that. It is actually just the perfect storm of everything meeting. It's not just that the NBA finals was quite frankly dead and gone and out of our minds. It's that there wasn't big like legacy referendum stakes coming out of this. Like quite frankly, if, you know, not to make everything about LeBron in the NBA, but if like LeBron would have lost a finals, we'd still be talking about this for three weeks. And I'm like a more talking peak of his powers, but it's like there wasn't the the super unfair to Jalen Brown and Jason Tatum. But it's like, we don't think of those guys that way. We just don't care as much. We had the talk and now, okay, we're done. Good. Enjoy it. Maybe we'll see you again next year. I think the fact that it's McDavid, it's super easy for the sport fan, even if they're not a hockey fan to say, hmm, this team's choking like dogs. And that guy's the best ever, apparently, or has a chance to be. All right, I can wrap my heads around that. One other thing that I think cannot be understated in all of this, and maybe I'm overstating this, but to me, I'm not the NBA draft sucks this year. No one cares. We're not even doing it. It'd be one thing if it was like a one, two debate. And I don't know, maybe there is one, not paying attention, like do not genuinely not on my radar, do not care. But this isn't even like, Hey, Victor, when man Yama's coming and we're all looking for the content and we want to see him and we're wondering what he can be. And we have the debate about how quickly he's going to change the game. I genuinely think everything came together of just a perfect storm for this. And you cannot intentionally recreate it in any way. Also pro in that baseball is just kind of, there isn't the, like this isn't we talked about this. This isn't like socks, yanks of 2003 or anything like that. We've had little fleeting moments like, Hey, Dodgers and Yankees, that's fun. All right, that was fun. It's gone. We're not at the time where the public consciousness cares about baseball outside of your team yet either. So I think it's really just kind of the perfect storm. The NFL relatively quiet now. It all kind of comes together. Yeah, the human body is condition for this time of year to see incredible historic stakes in sporting events. And we just didn't get it out of the NBA finals. So we were like, our cells were like, what happened? We're breaking down. People needed to see something more than we got in the five games between the Mavericks and the Celtics. To me, that's the one and only thing is the separation of just quality between the two series. And usually it's the other way around. Like, quite frankly, totally, the NBA finals is usually amazing. And it has historic stakes. We got historic players almost every single year. And yeah, Luca Donciches does feel like a historic player, maybe Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown will be that liner. Yeah, but yeah, that that series not only finished a hundred years ago, but stunk. Yep. Like that just was no juice to it from the get go. So whatever you have to do to separate yourself from the NBA, honestly, and whether that's starting like we're talking about starting the NHL season early, how will I start it later? Like, could I see a world? No, no, no, no. Stanley Cup final starts like in mid June, well, wraps up in July. I don't know whatever it takes to just, because I think that's the number one reason is that the North American sports fan is conditioned to see something amazing this time of year that we just didn't get it. The NBA finals, I think, and you know, this has been an idea bandied about by like several people in basketball circles of like, when does the NBA season start in earnest for most people? Yeah, it's Christmas day, right? There is very much a world I can see where the NBA more alters its calendar. Like, why does like baseball is a popular sport because people love it. It's a great game. It's beautiful. But let's be honest, one of the biggest reasons why it has the placeholder the conversation it does is because it's alone. It occupies a conversation all by itself. I think the NBA, they're a massive league. They're huge. They get swallowed up by the NFL at times. And I think by trying, there's very much taking Christmas day next year, by the way. Right. So I think there's very much a world where the NBA just says, you know what, like, we start in November. We start in December and we're a league that runs through to the Olympics or whatever it is. And maybe they have to alter their schedule for Olympic years. But maybe the NBA kind of takes care of this problem for the NHL because say what you will about the end of series and there are definitely years where everyone in the Cup final is just out of gas. Guys playing on fumes. And then to your point, we have like, Warriors, Cavs, or some incredible final. But if it's Cup final against first round of the NBA or something like that, it's not even close. It's not even close in terms of what what people care about more. And it's the Cup final, it is. Yeah. This Cup final was just way better than the NBA playoffs. So I do think this, this might be a happy accident and the NBA kind of takes care of it. But let me just also say if that's going to be the case, lean into it NHL and start earlier in September. Yeah. And not just so I can have my Canada Thanksgiving quadruple header. And if you, if it's just about ratings for the NHL, it's a big part of it. And like you can put your finger on the scale. Like I said, double the ratings if the Leafs are in a Cup final. So get to work on that. But then, but then people in Florida, oh, I was going to say they'd be sad, but they wouldn't care because they'll just be fun. You know who would be sad. Who? Gary Betten. Yeah, I guess. Maybe live it. I don't know if that's true. Talk to me wrong. Challenge is there. All right. When we come back, we'll talk to our pilot, John Morose of MLB Network and NHL Network Nexus. The fan morning show continues, Ben and it's Brent Gunning, Sportsnet 590, the fan. Hey, it's Nick Kiprios. And I'm Justin Bourne. We're diving deep and everything happening in Leafland and the biggest stories around the NHL. Real Kiprios and Bourne weekdays from four to six on Sportsnet, Sportsnet 590, the fan, and wherever you get your podcasts. Fan Morning Show Sportsnet 590, the fan, Ben and his Brent Gunning. Blue Jays on a one game winning streak, okay? Forget about the seven game losing streak that preceded it. Plan to pray. Blue Jays are one of one in victories as they can win a series. In Boston against the Red Sox tonight, before they start a home series against the Yankees team that's got floundering right now as well. They're undefeated on June 25th this year. That's correct. You got Yankees and Astros at home to wrap up the month of June. Actually, the the Astros series starts on Monday on Canada today. So that'll be the next month. All right, time now for our insider brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect excellence online and in the showroom visit Don Valley North Lexus.com. It's John Morosi of MLB Network, NHL Network coming to us live from Las Vegas. Are you in Vegas now, John? Are you headed out there? Ben and Brent, good morning. I'm not there yet. I'm actually in New York City at the moment. We've got the Yankees and Mets tonight on NHL Network, which is pretty exciting. I get a chance to work with the great Bob Costas and Tom Bernucci tonight. So that's that's on my immediate plan. And then I will wake up in the morning bright and early, pre dawn tomorrow and fly out to Vegas and see not a lot of drama at number one, I would say with celebrating. But after that, I should be a very, very interesting draft and maybe some trades as well. So this is a very Morosi kind of week. I was there. I was in St. Louis that we had a game there on Monday. I was in I was in the press box, press viewing area while I was watching the Italy match. I may have violated the note sharing the press box rule when Italy scored the 98th minute. That was pretty cool. It's been a very, very fun week of sports for me. Yeah. I remember talking to you. I think it was last week, a couple of weeks ago. I know you're excited to I know you're excited to get up here to be watching the Italy game there. And you know, I know I know I know you love your beloved big blue, but so it must hurt you to see like a Michigan state guy. I'm just looking at the rankings here rank second in the draft ranking. So don't be a homer when you get out there. You have to be happy for all the the guys selected Morosi. You mentioned you're there in New York. You're mentioned you're there in New York for the Subway series. I just wonder what the feel is kind of around that thing. You know, Ben and I have been talking about, you know, baseball, it obviously it has its peaks and valleys. But to me, anyways, it like never felt as good as when the socks yanks were going. And you know, I know the the Mets and Yankees aren't there now. But what's just kind of the feeling and being in the city and how much does that rivalry like obviously it never dies. It never loses its its loss. But it also doesn't feel like it's kind of at a fervor pitch right now either. It is still a special rivalry for sure. And and I think whenever it's certainly I grew up in Michigan. So I didn't grow up with the Subway series lore as a local fan, so to speak. But I do think when I when I arrive here and these two teams are playing, it is special because certainly working at the network we've got a lot of Yankee fans and med fans in the building. And I feel like I'm even though I didn't grow up with these teams, I'm very closely connected to them because a lot of my friends and colleagues are. And so when you walk into a game like last night and and Mark Vientos who's got some connections to the area growing up nearby, he's able to have have a two homer game against Garrett Cole. Are you kidding me? So like there are there are moments that that really stand out as being very special. Harrison Bader grew up in New York. He gets the homerun last night for the Mets against the Yankees. He was the former Yankee. There's a lot of really cool through lines. And then of course, Judge walks up. It's a grand slam late in the game. And that's another moment where the last two months he's put together been two of the best months we've ever seen from anybody. So it is pretty cool. And I think I'll say this. I mean, looking ahead to the game tonight, when Bob Koss is on the call, I'm just I'm always lucky whenever I work with Bob. And of course, we're now a week removed from Willie Mason's passing and the storytelling there and how Willie Mays was part of the subway series when it was a when there was a giant Yankees World Series. And he was playing in giant Dodgers games in New York City against Jackie Robinson. And he looked at the Mets and certainly, I think whenever I visit city field and you think about the history of baseball in New York, there's a Jackie Robinson Rotunda at City Field as part of the honor and the heritage of National League Baseball in New York. Of course, Jackie never played for the Mets, but he played for the Dodgers. And he played in Brooklyn, which is not far from where I'm talking to you from right now. So there's there's always those those threads and certainly many baseball fans know this, but I always like to point this out. The Mets, the Mets colors not chosen by accident. So the Mets, this was obviously, they were founded years after the Giants and Dodgers both left. And they took the blue of the Dodgers and the orange of the Giants. And they said this is the new nationally baseball identity in their city. So I'm always aware of the history. And that was more than 60 years ago now that that was the Mets were founded. But it's pretty special when you reflect back on on why the Mets wear those two colors. And when they play the Yankees like to do tonight, it's pretty special to see. Yeah, it's very special. Lots of history there. And now a new addition to this Mets history, it's the grimace effect of him throwing out the first pitch. And they've lost a couple of games, but you can't deny that ever since grimace throughout the first pitch at city field, they've been on a heater, John. Yes, they have been. And now I have to reflect and think about it. Would it be too partisan of me to wear a purple tie tonight? That's the dilemma because you're always careful. You know, you never want to wear something that looks too much like the color scheme, one of the team playing. The purple has now become one of the Mets colors because of the grimace. But I think it might have a little something to do with Lindor really getting going. They've changed up the lineup. Lindor, that's Lindor and Niveau and JD Martinez and Alonzo, the new beginning quartet since they've done that, the nine and two. But yeah, the grimace note is much more, much more enjoyable to point out. And we had last night at the Subway series, Mike Piazza was here, Guy Fieri was here, was crazy. So yeah, everybody on the scene was that was on the field there before the game last night. All right, speaking of Francisco Lindor, guardians trade them away, remake their franchise. They seem to be doing fine without Francisco Lindor. They've honestly had a lot better run since Lindor left than the Mets have with Lindor. And that's not the fault of him necessarily. But I mean, it's hard not to look at that and think about Boboshette's future here in Toronto. The Blue Jays, hey, they won a game, but it was coming off a seven game losing streak and they are staring way up to even see the third wildcard in the American League. Understand there's still a year of contract when it comes to Boboshette. There's some teams with some real need at that position. I mean, who doesn't need a shortstop that can hit in a above average level and play at least average defense, which is throughout the course of Boboshette's career. I've been the case and I think of one team in particular that could really use them that has all the impetus in the world to push more chips into the middle of the table. That's the Los Angeles Dodgers. How likely, because I think we're at the point now where I think everybody understands the Blue Jays are more than likely to be sellers to some degree. How likely do we do you think it is that we see something more than just the guys that are pending free agents dealt before the July 30th trade deadline? You know, Bennett, it's a great question. And I think it really is the one of the big questions in the industry right now, because there is interest in some of the Jays players. And the question that I keep coming back to is have enough circumstances changed from the Ross Atkins press conference about a month ago, in which he basically said they're not going anywhere. And that to me is now things can change in baseball. I would still place the chances at of a vote trade at less than 5050. But they're certainly nonzero. And I think that the Jays would have to be convinced in the record right now should convince most objective observers that they're they're not going to make playoffs this year. So that's that's one piece. The second piece is they have to be at the point where they believe it's just the best thing for everybody. Maybe the best thing for for Bowdo move on. Maybe the best thing to to bring back as the Guardians did. And that's a very good point that you make about how Andres Jimenez has been a really important player for them. And they also brought back Rosario in that trade, who's helped them bring another players too. They have to know and believe that they could that they could really remain a competitive team enough where they maybe they get some younger younger everyday players back. Or the other piece of this, which is if Kukuchi is a free agent after the season is over. And if you're going to move him at the deadline, which I think is a much easier decision based on the contractual nature of what he's got or I would even say Trevor Richards is put together a pretty good year pending free agent to that that you're going to have to replace some pitching. So could you trade Bow for theoretically a landed knack with the Dodgers, who's a pretty good young arm? I don't think the Dodgers there's no way they're going to trade Gavin Stone right now, especially I just don't see it because he's too important to them. They're dealing with some issues where they're not really sure when Kershaw is going to come back and when Bueller is going to come back. So they're going to be probably a little reticent to move some of their younger pitching. But the idea, I think, has some validity. I just don't know yet is everybody in the Blue Jays management structure aligned on this to where they believe they could make this trade and still stay competitive and good for the next year and a half, let's say. I just I do not believe the Jays are at a headspace where they would trade Bow for two guys who are in low A. I don't even if there's great value with those players. I don't see it happening. Even though there is some there are some depth concerns with the pharmacist right now with with injuries. Obviously the Tiedemann injury hasn't helped them at all. They don't really have one of the better farm systems in the game right now. So you really there are a lot of factors there that are saying you should really be open minded to doing this. I just think that the return is going to have to be deficient enough that the Jays can explain it to their fans by saying we traded Bow and we got players back. We're going to make us still a competitive team in 24 and 25. And that is a very, very difficult needle to thread that I'm not sure that they're going to be able to execute between now and July 30th. And it's interesting to hear you say that because I think Oh, look, anybody that follows a team would like to watch that team win more games than they lose. So I think there's obviously a very large part of the fr the fan base that would say, yeah, we would like players that can help us in 24 20 or sorry, 25 hockey brain, sorry, season spanning over two years. But I look at the I look at I look at it and I say, there's also a massive segment of this fan base that would say, okay, if you're going to do it, don't don't take a half measure here like completely retool completely try to start this thing back up. And that's why I think the Beshet conversation is such an interesting one because you're right. It could be the big domino to fall or in my opinion, it could be kind of the first domino in a long long series of them. It was interesting to hear you mention Richard's there. I think he's a guy that kind of slides under at least my radar anyway in terms of a trade candidate. The other guy I've been wondering about is is Janssen. And you know, I know he's cooled off a little bit since his kind of towards start to the season. But how hard is it to find a suitor for Janssen? Because you know, unlike, you know, we've made the point with Beshet, you could slide him over to second base. You know, maybe a team needs a short stop. Or if it's a corner outfield, they're pretty easy to find a home for that guy. But if it's a team looking at a catcher, how kind of few in far between are those? Because I could make the case that Janssen is maybe, you know, outside of the guys with with control beyond this year, the most valuable asset they have. If there's a right contender for him, how many teams do you think could realistically be interested in Janssen? It's an excellent point, Brian. I think that when you're at this stage of the season, so definitionally, if you're going to bring in Danny Janssen right now in a trade, you are a really good team because you're not going to be trading for a rental catcher unless you are a really good team. And on really good teams with solid rotations, which is typically the case, almost always pitchers have a very high degree of comfort with their catcher. Or maybe it's a thing where there's, and personal characters aren't terribly common now, but there's a lot of relationships that exist there over a long period of time. Honestly, watching the Yankees this week, you know, Trevino has had some issues with throwing. Wells has not hit a ton this year. I'm a big fan of him, though. I like both those catchers, but I could see, for example, if the Yankees say we need both a bat, especially with Stanton being out, they don't really have much of a DH at the moment because of John Carlos injury and he's going to be out for a while. The Yankees, I know that probably isn't the easiest team for Jay's fans to hear me mention right now, but the Yankees look like the kind of a team that would have interest in Danny Janssen because he could be a DH for them at times. He could catch obviously a lot, and I think there is, there could be a fit there. Let's put it this way. Last night, Subway series, Jimi Jones with their DH, like they need a little bit more pop. And so I think that that is, that's something worth keeping an eye on. You know, the stand injury is obviously very fresh. I don't think that there's anything hot right now between those two teams in terms of talks, but it wouldn't surprise me. If you get to the spot in a month where you're really trading pretty much all your pending free agents, at that point, you're out of it. And you could argue that they're pretty close out of it right now. At that point, to see Danny Janssen put on the pinstripe for two months would not be, would not be a disqualifying thing for me. I mean, now, for an office, and they have their own opinions about trading within the division. But if you've reached that point where you feel like you need it to get younger and it's time to move on, I would, I would recommend not having any reluctance trading with the Yankees because honestly, they're one of the teams that would fit very well for Danny Janssen because they have needs right now like catcher and DH. Yeah, I know. I don't care about trading within the division anymore at all because there's there's two reasons here, John. And I don't know if if this is taking hold amongst front offices, but you only play your divisional opponents 13 times a season. And we got three wild cards now, right? Like, I mean, that changes everything. You're not just playing the Yankees. I mean, you are playing them more than anybody else and the Orioles and the Red Sox and the Rays. I get that, but it's not as much as previously and you play everybody in baseball now. And there's three wild card teams. I wonder if if we'll we'll start to see that that thinking that, ah, you can't possibly trade within the division, start to change considering those factors. It should. And it's an excellent point. I mean, we're still in a lot of ways just getting used to this new normal, the schedule and obviously it's your two of it now, but there's there's a lot of there's a lot to be said for what you just articulated there that that being more open minded. It's there are probably some old fashioned thought processes that exist where you generally speaking prefer to deal out of your division. That's probably generally the case. And honestly, especially when there's some term on a player, for example, I would not see the Jays trading a bow or a Vlad in the American League. I just think that would be that would be hard there. Those are core players that you're at least playing a number of times and you're competing with for a division title. So I think there's a sliding scale there, but I remember back back in the day you would hear, well, we're not going to trade this player in the division. I think that there's always or you could say there's a premium to be paid. We're going to make this trade. You've got to clearly be above and beyond what the Dodgers or the Mariners would offer because because that and if anything bent your point is actually interesting. It might it might further incentivize because you're you're more directly competing with the other teams in your league now for those those broad broader playoff spots. So you basically you're competing with with the with the league for three wild cards as opposed to the teams you're in division for one spot. Yeah, that's a great point. You're more broadly competing with the other teams in your league. It might if anything, especially incentivize trading out of the league entirely. So you're more likely to trade in the national league because of a direct competition. But obviously that's only relevant when you're when you're in the mix. Yeah. And I think we would probably argue here that the J's are not in the mix. Hey, it's fair to say. Yeah. It could be an interesting month though for this team. John, enjoy Vegas. Enjoy the sphere. Thanks for this, buddy. Thanks so much. I'll let you know how it goes. And I will bring back glad tidings of the least prospect when we next next week. Okay. All right. All right. From your mouth to God's ears. See you buddy. All the best guys. Thank you. John Marosi, our insider brought to you by Don Valley, North Lexus, where you can expect excellence online and in the showroom, visit Don Valley, North Lexus dot com. It's great point by John. Three wild cards, one division winner. Guess what? No matter what the Blue Jays do to remake this team, they're not going to be competing with the Yankees and the Orioles at the top of the division cares about trading with those guys. Yeah. Don't trade with the other mediocre teams in the American League. Those are the guys you have to beat. It's a good point. I honestly hadn't thought of it. That was kind of crazy because we think a lot about this stuff. And yeah, that's a it's just nakedly right when he puts it that way. Yeah. There's just no debate. All right. Time now for the Waken Reich presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet responsibly. Blue Jays trying to run that winning streak to two tonight in Boston against the Red Sox. Take a series against the Red Sox. Ariel Rodriguez against Qatar Crawford. And Red Sox favored to return the Blue Jays to the loss column, minus 154 Blue Jays plus 125, the total nine and a half. Blue Jays still bad. I regret to inform you all. And I think if you want a little value on this one, you take the Sox minus a run and a half, get a plus 125 there. I think that's what I'm liking. Yeah. Ariel Rodriguez at a nice little start to his Blue Jays career. Last outing did not go so well. Emile dubious. Yeah. Fenway. I've heard hitters bark. Yeah. I like the over nine and a half. That works minus 105 at Fenway Park. That was the Waken Reich presented by Sports Interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, Stanley Cup final game seven, doing a bonco's number for ESPN. Dr. Greg Wachinsky, ESPN senior writer, co-host of the Draw podcast, next is the fan morning show continues. Ben and his friend Gunning sports at 590, the fan.
