(upbeat music) We're back on Canucks Central Danricho's Satyar Shah. The roar is back at BC Place for BC Line 70th season. Get your tickets now at BClines.com. Developing news with the Vancouver Canucks, they have potentially a trade in the works, while they do have a trade in the works with the Chicago Blackhawks, but it is dependent on approval, citing several reports from Elliot Friedman, Rick Dollywell and Frank Serra-Valley on this, pending approval from Ilya McKayev, who does have a 12 team, no trade clause, but it looks like the Canucks are trying to open up cap space by moving McKayev to Chicago with a second round pick, and Sam Lafferty's rights as a sweetener to the Blackhawks. - And yeah, so Frank Serra-Valley has a details if and when the trade goes through, the Canucks will get a fourth round pick back in return. - Which is maybe what they're getting back in exchange for Sam Lafferty's rights, or something, or I'm not even sure, but it's probably just the way the trade works. When you look at how much money the Canucks are moving out, it's actually not a super hefty price. I'm surprised the Canucks are moving a second round pick 'cause my understanding was the Canucks were reluctant to do so. Now, if they were being quoted a bigger price on retaining on McKayev, 'cause we talked about Wollman, how he was owed 6.8 and the cost was a second round pick plus a prospect, and McKayev has owed 9.3 million these next two years. So it's actually three million more than what Wollman is owed, which would lead you to believe that the cost would be more than a second round pick. So the Canucks, maybe they felt like, okay, if you have to pay more than a second, we don't do it, but if we're getting a pick back and we're moving McKayev, then maybe the cost is a third. That's what it kind of comes down to, roughly speaking. And we'll see what year the draft pick is. I wonder if it's not gonna be, they don't have a pick this year, but I wonder if it's gonna be like a 2026 second. They do not have a 2024 second rounder. They do have their 2025 and 2026 second round draft choices. Should this deal go through? And given that Frank Sura Valley does have all the details, I wonder if this is maybe one of those things where Ilya McKayev might be asleep somewhere and over the pond, and just hasn't been able to formally approve the deal yet. What we do know is that his agent got permission, Milstein to seek a trade. So clearly he was open to moving and he would understand it was hard to find a new spot for him. Is he going to be really choosy on that spot? Perhaps he is. There are worse places to go than Chicago. Yeah, and you want to contend right away. That's a thing. Now it kind of comes down to that. Like he could throw a stink here and not do it, but I would imagine for a player that was also maybe looking for a fresh start after this season, he may not be opposed to it. So a 2025 second is what it would be according to Frank Serra Valley and a 2027 fourth coming back to the Vancouver Canucks. So a fourth rounder way down the line from the Chicago Blackhawks coming back in the deal. Yeah, so they get it later, you know, so they're not going to have a first round picking with a second round picking three consecutive years unless they acquire one. Or is it four now? Patrick Levine has traded a second rounder in each of his first two drafts and now trading already a third second rounder for next year. So like I said, I'm not, I'm not against the Canucks making trades. Yeah, they in 2021, so this would be one, two, three, it would be four consecutive years with no second round picks. Yeah, going back to the, the bending area. Hey, listen, I'm not saying this is going to, you know, sink the organization long term. It could, if you don't add more prospects down the road, you get to find ways to do so. But it's obviously, obviously something to me, the reason they're doing this tells me that they have some real things cooking here, right? And it's not just about keeping their own guys, I don't think. I can imagine. We mentioned the first segment too, right? Even if you, even if you gives a door up a little bit of money, like there isn't a ton to go around if even if you sign Genssel to nine. Like you wanted to create a little bit more room here if you want to make some more additions. I can imagine you are opening up this space with William McKay of being traded to Chicago just to sign Dakota Joshua and Nikita Zadorov, let's say, and Tyler Myers. To me, you open up this space to add something tangible that makes you better than you were this past year. Bringing back Joshua Zadorov and Myers doesn't do that. It goes against pretty much everything they said at their end of season news conference. Like, yeah, we were good, but like we need to be better. You don't get better by bringing back the same guys. So if this is just to overpay Joshua and Zadorov and these guys to bring them back, I'm sorry. That doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in me because, look, Dakota Joshua at four million bucks, I'm sorry, I'm taking a pass on that. Nikita Zadorov over five million, not something I really love. And if that's what the Canucks are opening up more space to do, that wouldn't be something that really, to me, makes this team tangibly better than it was a year ago. - Do you feel like the cost is worth it if you can land Gensil? - Then we're talking. - I think this is to me. - You move this player, to me, you pay this price to potentially bring in a needle moving impact player. And there's only one guy that really does that on the free agent market. - What the Canucks could not do this offseason because of their cap situation was keep all their players and add. They still can't do that because we know Lindholm was most likely not coming back, they're not keeping all of their UFAs. But this allows them to keep their UFAs and make a big addition, if they so chose to do. So this allows them to room here. 'Cause I think if they sign Joshua, Dan, I don't think it's gonna be like, famous last words, but I don't think it's gonna be four million of Vancouver. - Yeah. - Let's say it's three and a half. Let's just say it's three and a half. Well, you're still saving 1.25 on top of that. - Yeah. - Now all of a sudden, you have 1.25 on top of what we talked about. Let's say the Canucks signs the door off to 4.75 and sign another defenseman to three million. We said like, let's give seven and a half million to two defenseman two. So now the Canucks would have 11 and a half million, roughly, to spend on three forwards. Which would allow them to sign Genssel and also get a couple of cheaper guys too. Like, it will give them, sorry, actually 11 and a half because you're keeping Joshua, yeah, while he's trading him for Mikayev. But yeah, that gives you about 11 and a half million for three forwards, which isn't bad. Like, that gives you some pretty good ammunition to add some fire power to your forward group. - So as we talked about earlier in the show, because when we started the show, Teddy Blueger just signed a two-year extension with the Vancouver Canucks. And after that deal, Sat, you had estimated with 950K and some other things that fill out the Canucks roster that they have 16.75 in cap space to play with over these next few days to sign the door off, maybe do some other things in free agency. Should this trade go through, and everything is leading us to believe that it will go through, that Mikayev is off to the Chicago Blackhawks, you would add on another 4.75 million to that. So we're talking 21 and a half million dollars of flexibility for the Canucks to use too. Bring back Zadorov, around 4 and a half, 4.75, potentially signed Joshua at another three and a half. And then you still have money to go after a Jake Genssel and fill out the remaining spots on your roster. That's one of the scenarios that could potentially play out here. But the reason you needed to open up a little bit of space is because if it's going to cost you nine and a half million to sign Genssel, like you needed more space to be able to sign Genssel and still be able to do some other things. - So right now, the Canucks are in a position where if they wanted to, they could win the bidding for Genssel. - Yes. - Are they going to, I'm not saying they will, but before this move, I don't think you could reasonably be in a position where you felt comfortable, you could outbid other teams for them. As we discussed, the money kind of ran out and you want to improve the defense still, they're not going to take away significantly from the back end to improve the forward group. They still want to have a robust defense as well. And if you want to do that, it was very tight. Now it's there. The question is, are they going to use that to get that player? And I just, if all they're doing is signing as a door-out in Joshua and moving a second round pick for it, I don't know if they pay that price just to do that. I think they want to do more with this move. I don't think they move that pick just to retain their own guys. - Yeah, I would imagine so, you know, and when we look at the free agent market and who the Canucks could be in on to potentially spend this money on, yeah, Stephen Stamkos where, look, as of right now, I'm still of the mindset that Stamkos isn't leaving Tampa Bay, but a lot of the reporting around that has been, like if Tampa doesn't come out from their number, Stamkos is testing the market. So that's going to be an interesting one. Sam Reinhardt and Jake Genssel, like there are three clear-cut top-end forwards that as of right now are going to hit the July 1 free agent market, but the one that has been most linked to the Vancouver Canucks going all the way back to the trade deadline is Jake Genssel. And as far as what we know for what it's going to cost to get Genssel or be in on the Genssel sweepstakes for Vancouver at least, bare minimum, nine million per year on a seven-year contract. That's 63 million total money. Carolina is still working very hard on it. Eric Tolsky is on record with the athletic talking about that today and they're still working on it, trying to bridge that gap. They are the only team that can offer that eighth year, which means to give Genssel 63 to 65, like eight by eight matches the Canucks total money offer for Carolina. That's a lot easier for them to potentially do. I've always thought that the Canucks are going to have to have a higher bid than anybody else to actually land Genssel. This potential McCabe move gives them the flexibility to be able to do that. Like they could even go, they could even go to 10 million now for Jake Genssel if they really feel like that's got to be the number to get a Genssel to get down. Yeah, if they want to, they can outbid other teams. And they can create a situation where Genssel would have to say no to coming to Vancouver. Yes, you know, and I think what the Canucks truly want to do is raise the ceiling of their team this year. And if you had to pay an extra price to clear some money to do so clearly, they're willing to do it, right? And I still see Bounceback and Ilya McKayev's game. We talked about this, like whether it's Vancouver or elsewhere, I think there's going to be Bounceback and McKayev's game. And I'd be careful in just, you know, throwing money to get rid of them and throwing draft picks to get rid of them. But if you're getting rid of all that money, like it gives you a lot of options this free agent market. And if they choose to still hold a firm line on Joshua, for instance, like now you're talking about having about almost $22 million to play with in the free agent market. Like it's considerable money. Like I really don't love the idea of moving McKayev here, Sat. Like I don't like paying the second round pick. Like this team has given up so many second rounders. I don't disagree with you. They're so bereft of prospects. I don't disagree with you, but it comes to me like I, like I said, I didn't want a move of draft pick to do so, but it comes down to what the picture looks like at the end. - Yeah. - If this was what you needed to do to grab Gensil and have a better team next season with a higher ceiling, hey, it's worth the cost. Like if your team's better, I don't mind you paying a price for them. - You're in a window, right? Like that's the part of this that I truly understand. For those that are texting in, Gensil's too old or they're trading another second round pick. Like I'm with you, I'm with you on some of these things. Like yeah, committing seven years to another soon to be 30 year old is risky. But you know what? You have three years left of Quinn Hughes, one of the best defenseman in the league, making less than seven million bucks. You have two years left of Thatcher-Demko at five million per season. You have to do everything in your power right now to maximize those value contracts. So going out and getting a Jake Gensil or moving off of Iliya Mikayev to potentially make a move that increases your ceiling as a team. Like that's the cost of doing business when you are in a win now mode. But you still have to do a lot to inspire me that says this team is better than it was after losing to Edmonton in game seven. - Right, well obviously they're not better right now. But I mean, I see a pathway now that they have money to be considerably better. - Yeah. - It's not like you're doing this and you don't have options. - I see a pathway but I don't see too many, like outside of the trade market, there's not a ton of options here. - That's a three-agent market. - It's really Gensil as the best fit for this team. Even guys like Stamkos and Tifoli, they're right shots like, look, I wouldn't complain about seeing any of those guys in Vancouver but Gensil is for me by far the best fit as for what the Canucks ultimate team need and team priority is for next year. - Yeah, absolutely, but it can't be all or nothing. Like there's still pathways for you to be better if you don't sign Gensil. Like you won't be as good as having Gensil but you can still get better, right? And what this also allows them to do, we talked about getting into that secondary market, let's say you can't sign Gensil. Well, it's not gonna be cheap for the other players too. - No. - Like even Tifoli, like if you think you're getting Tifoli for under five million, it's probably not happening. - Well everything I've heard about the Canucks. And look, there's no tampering in the lead up to free agency but yeah, I don't think the Canucks number for Tifoli has been high enough as far as where things would stand right now. So do with that what you will. Now they have more space to potentially be able to offer more in those types of conversations for even the secondary market as you were alluding to. - Yeah, and that's, like especially with what the prices are, like we look at players and what they're getting signed for. You saw D'Mello, what do you got? You're seeing the cap going up, the numbers are starting to change, it's going to look a lot different. If you're afraid of paying your guys, you have to pay somebody. - Yeah. - And even just to get guys that are credible, like it was going to cost you a lot of money. I think we're gonna see with some sticker shock of some of these deals. And I think if the Canucks are able to play their cards right and even save a little bit of cap space later in the summer, which now they could do, if they're still ruthless on some of these signings, that they can also pick a bunch of players in about a month or so who don't have homes, who now we're looking at making maybe a couple million, have to settle for one million, have to settle for maybe close to a league minimum contract. Not a lot there. And I think you can put yourself in a position now where you can fish in the big pond and get that big fish and then sit back and also grab a bunch of value. I see a lot of pathways here for the Canucks with the amount of money they have right now to do a lot of really fun, interesting things. I just hope it's not the boring thing where you're just signing all your own guys. And that's how you're eating up all the cap space. But I'd imagine, like I said before, you're looking at this team making a sizable addition up front at some point here. - Yeah, and that's gonna be interesting 'cause for me, Jake Genssel is the name. I know some others are texting in. There's Toyvo Terravine and there's some others. Look, free agency is where a lot of mistakes do get made. Is signing a Jake DeBrusk to a 20-ish million total value contract something that I would be all that excited about, probably not, you know? So the cap space is exciting, but it can also be dangerous. Mckayev is one of their few misses. - And it's a sizable one. It's a $4.75 million salary, which now you have to pay a second round pick to get it off of. - It is a sizable miss. It was one of their first big moves. Probably the first big move of Patrick Olvin's tenure as GM. - The first big free agent signing. - Yeah. The first free agent signing that Patrick Olvin made. And now you're having to pay a second round pick to get off it. - I don't, like I don't think the, I don't think the identification of the player was all that off. You just, you can't really account for a player having a ACL injury in the way Mckayev did, you know, before he's even finished his first preseason as a member of your club. - Yeah. - But, you know, they've identified players really well for the most part. And this is their first, you know, hey, Miacalpa mistake of any player they've brought into this franchise. - Yeah, I would say too, because of a lot of teams not being afraid of admitting mistakes, like we're seeing some bold moves. We saw it even with the L.A. Kings when they traded a peer loop Dubois year into that big move they made for him right now. This one's a bit different. It was two years into L.A. Mckayev and he had a really tough year this past season. But I respect the ability to look past your mistakes and to be able to be humble enough to eat crow. And 'cause I think when you're trading away a draft pick and trading away assets, move off money on a player you signed only two years ago, like it's a little embarrassing, it is. And you have to be willing to kind of take that on the chin to make your team better. And I like that. I like that aspect of it. Even if I don't love the idea of, I'll trade you more sack around draft picks. Well, for me, I like it if the moves that follow, to me warrant that it was worth paying this price to move off of Mckayev. And I know like, hey, like Raymond and other people that listen to this show regularly, they poke fun at me for how much confidence I have in L.A. Mckayev sometimes. The guy scored one goal in the last like 60 games of the year. But I firmly believe like L.A. Mckayev is going to have a bounce back season. - I agree. And I mean, people are texting, you can't say he was a miss, he heard his knee, can't plan for that. Qualify your statement, reach is what people are saying. But no, but at the same time, like whether, you can call it a miss or not, it didn't work out. And at the end of the day, it's the same outcome. And it's not like, I think their process in adding the player was generally good. And I'm a fan of Mckayev, I had defended him a lot the last couple of years. And I'm a fan of what he can do, but it didn't work out. And the fact you're trading a sack around pick to move him is proof of that. - The interesting part is what is going to happen next for the Vancouver Canucks? Is it Jake Genssel? Is it some other move? Is it making a play for a few free agents to now use that cap space? I mean, these next few days, more possibilities, more doors have now opened for the Vancouver Canucks, assuming this trade with L.A. Mckayev to the Chicago Blackhawks goes through. - I would imagine we're going to see more action to across the league. We heard about how much movement there has been behind the scenes. We're getting into the draft now in a couple of days. There's going to be quite a bit of trade movement it looks like. And if you look at a team like Chicago, I think what's really fascinating here is we're seeing the price to move salary. Jake Waldman went for a second round pick. This one went for a second round pick. - Mm-hmm. - And are we going to see other teams do similar things here? - I think there was, I would imagine for the Canucks to only pay a second round picking it a fourth back considering the money difference on Waldman, I would say there was probably competition. - Yeah. - To take on this money. - Yeah. - 'Cause if you compare it just by the money itself, Mckayev probably should have cost more than Jake Waldman. - Well, the Chicago value of being able to get, you know, a forward here that they think does have some bounce-back potential. - For sure. - And also get another second pick-up. - But I would imagine it's also an indication of there are some teams that have some appetite to eat some salary. - Right. Well, there's a few teams that are very firmly stuck in tank mode right now in the NHL, Chicago and San Jose. The two biggest ones right now and they've both taken on money this year. But I also think there's a prelude here to what could be a very busy couple of days ahead of the draft and as we get to draft weekend here, I mean, we're talking about a Nietzsche's trade. We've already seen a lot happen on the trade market. The Linus Allmark deal on the eve of game seven there or just as we were in the lead up to game seven, the Pierre-Luc Du Bois trade. There's already been some pretty sizable moves in this NHL off season that's really just begun and now we're in the few days in the lead up to the draft. So there should be a lot more that's still to come. - So in terms of the big names available in the trade market, make it mention Nietzsche's, you mentioned Mitch Marner's a player there. Do we see one of these guys truly get moved at the draft? 'Cause I see people mentioned they're like, "Hey, there's-" - I think Nietzsche's gets moved. - Well, Nietzsche's because there's two years of control. - Yeah. And there's been reports that teams leading the way have their first round pick on the table for Nietzsche's. So I think by Friday, that's the one Carolina decides which is the best deal that's on the table for them. - My question with the UFAs, this includes Marner and it includes Nick Yellers and other guys that have a year left on their contracts, even Butch Nevich with the St. Louis Blues. Are you getting the trade deadline price right now? Which usually is a first round pick and a solid prospect. - Yeah. - And if you are, perhaps somebody moves and perhaps we know St. Louis has held a very high line for what they want for Pablo Butch Nevich. If they come down that ask, it's still a first and a prospect. And our teams today, considering there are free agents available, willing to trade a first round pick for one year of a guy. It's something they're not willing to do in the summer, but would be willing to do in season at some point. And that's why I'm more skeptical on some of those guys getting moved the next couple of days, just because are you gonna get the price you can get later right now? Or if there's teams that miss out on their targets and free agency that go the trade route to add to their roster. Again, the news of the day. Teddy Bluger signing a two year extension with the Vancouver Canucks, 3.6 million total value. And in the last hour, we've had several reports that the Canucks and Chicago Blackhawks are working on a deal that will move McKayev to Chicago and the rights to Sam Lafferty. The Canucks will receive a fourth round pick in return. They will also be sending a 2025 second round pick to Chicago in order to get the deal done. Now, as far as why it hasn't been officially confirmed yet, McKayev has not yet approved the trade to Chicago. He does have a 12 team, no trade clause. And they are waiting for McKayev to approve this deal in order for it to go through. But considering there's been so much reporting on it, considering Ilia McKayev and his aged Dan Milstein were given permission to seek out a trade. I find it hard to believe that this trade will not go through at some point. But it's a move that opens up extra cap space for the Canucks to do other things. And what those things are yet sat, we do not know. But we do know the door hasn't been closed on the door of. I mentioned on Monday that Joshua would be dependent on them clearing cap space. Now they've cleared cap space. Do they get that done? Would they quote a Joshua? Those are the two guys to kind of keep an eye on here. And the rest may have to wait to July 1st. The Canucks can, of course, make a trade and add somebody. And I wouldn't put it past this management team to make a trade and add somebody here between now and July 1st. But I think their biggest addition is probably gonna come in day one and free agency. Well, they did get an extra fourth round pick to trade to Carolina for the rights to Jake Genssel, so. - Is that what it's gonna take? - A fourth? - I'm not sure, I joke, I joke. Lots to discuss. Lots of water cooler talk for the rest of the evening. And we'll be back tomorrow at four o'clock, hopefully with more Canucks news to talk about. Four producers, Ben and Josh, my co-host, Sat. I'm Dan, you've been listening to Canucks Central. - Hey, it's Jamie Dodd and Thomas Drans. Get your daily dose of Canucks talk with us weekdays from 12 to 2 on Sportsnet 650. Or catch up on demand through your favorite podcast app. (gentle music)
