The Howie Carr Radio Network

MISTRIAL: What's Next for Karen Read ft. Attorney Marc Salinas | 7.1.24 - The Howie Carr Show Hour 1

Howie is shocked at the news out of the Karen Read murder trial: a mistrial and a RETRIAL?! One of the show's go-to attorneys, Marc Salinas, joins the show to share his takes on the future of the case. Then, Howie turns to a better court outcome, the major SCOTUS win for presidential immunity.

Duration:: 39m
Broadcast on:: 01 Jul 2024
Audio Format:: mp3

This podcast is brought to you by the Eden Pure Thunderstorm. BOGO is back for one week only. Buy one and get one of the Eden Pure Thunderstorm free. Order at EdenPureDeals.com, code word Howie BOGO. [MUSIC PLAYING] Better strap yourself in. It's time for the Howie Car Show. A win for former President Trump in the Supreme Court. I'm by winning. I win here and I win there. Now what? So yes, the lower courts, again, will have to hear it. It will, in my opinion, slow down Jack Smith's persecution and selective prosecution of President Trump. Well, back to the drawing board. And I don't see how this case could go forward before the election. Live from the Matthews Brothers Studios. This is an opportunity for Joe Biden to go out there and show he has the stomach. Hi, my name is Beau Biden. Here to talk to you about something that's very important to me, senior abuse. We finally beat Medicare. We have 1,000 trillion years in Medicare. 80% of these crimes are committed by family members. Joe, you did such a great job. You answered every question. So if you suspect that anyone is affected by any of these crimes, please contact our elder abuse hotline. Go to Joe 303330. Rum swabs, hacks, and moon bounce beware. It's-- [MUSIC PLAYING] Howie Carr. Adam Lally, the human reigned the lay, just announced that the Commonwealth will retry, Karen Reed. I don't see that myself. I think you have to say that in the heat of the moment or the wet of the moment, considering it's probably raining in that I'm just like it's raining here. But I just can't see it happen. But on the other hand, I couldn't see a mistrial either. I thought this was pretty much of a slam dunk. But the point is here, it's another lesson. You never know what a jury's going to do. And we don't know how many jurors were holding out against, in my opinion, all logic and reason, going for a guilty verdict. How could it be beyond reasonable doubt? It's-- any one of these aspects of the case would lead it to be a reasonable doubt, in my opinion. But here it is. They weren't going to apparently sway the people that were hanging on for a guilty verdict. 844, 500, 42, 42, 844, 500, 42, 42. So we'll be talking about this all day. There's other news as well. Will Joe Biden be on the ticket or not? It's very funny that-- I don't know. Morning to be clear. No, you don't. Will the Biden family allow Joe? Will they continue to engage in this elder abuse? And kudos to whoever found that sound cut from Beau Biden before he was killed in Iraq. Because you know he was killed in Iraq. He died in Iraq, according to Joe's Thursday night. But he didn't, of course. He got cancer. But when he was attorney general, he made a spot decrying elder abuse in Delaware. Little did he know what was coming. 844, 500, 42, 42, Nick D, is it possible to hung jury as a majority guilty? Are we sure it's the other way around? Well, no, we're not sure of anything right now. We'll-- I think we will learn more in the next few hours. But all we know is that it was not a 12 angry men situation where there was one holdout. Because when Anti-Bev was reading the note from the jury foreman, it made it seem like there were multiple holdouts. So whichever side had the majority, there were multiple holdouts. So that's what I guess they meant when they were hopelessly deadlocked. But you know, I just don't think it gets any better for the commonwealth here. Because again, as I said during the crossover with Taylor, I mean, look, you have the accident reconstruction experts that were hired by the federal government who said they were PhDs. The state police expert was a GED. He didn't know anything. I talked to a state cop today about this. And he said in the old days, they used to have guys that were real nerds. And they would chop up tires and do all kinds of experiments. He couldn't spell Sir Isaac Newton, let alone understand the basic laws of physics. Trooper Joe Paul, trooper GED. And I mean, I can't believe that his testimony fought the experts to a draw. And the same with the dog bite experts. You know, and the timeline, Lally's timeline, he said that she hit him at 1245 and their own factually educationally challenged cell phone expert, Guarino, from Guarino's pastry of Norwood, tasty blueberry muffins. He said that she was back in John O'Keefe's house at 1236. Their timeline didn't work. And all of the suspicious activities of the McAlberts and Brian Higgins destroying their phones. And the disappearance of Chloe the Wonder Dog, the sale of the house. I guess they didn't know about that. 844-542-781, it's better for Karen Reed if they have another trial. Do you know much like trial must have cost those 781? I mean, I don't know if they're in for the-- I think they would have to pay them more money. I think her father's got some dough, but I mean, is this the way you want to spend your inheritance, your family's money on this nonsense? You know, she said, when they brought her in, she said, you know, is everybody in on this joke? And then she said who had really done it? And she thought had done it. And they didn't seem to care. 844-542-542-508, I moved to Texas because of dumb voters in Massachusetts, didn't know the jurors were just as dumb. They've always been this dumb. Come on, you know that. I mean, I said, I covered the Miles Connor, the art thief, was charged with back in the '70s. Same courthouse was charged with killing two women or having two young women killed with driving screwdrivers into their skulls, having his gang of thugs do it. And they had him cold, absolutely cold. I had to go down there one night and cover the jury deliberations on Saturday night. He was running around. I talked to him. He said, yeah, once I beat this rap, I'm going into-- I've been admitted to Harvard Medical School. I'm just listening to him. You know, I'm just killing time. I'm just on the jury watch. I'm just listening. You know, I thought this guy's really full of it. He's going to be convicted. And you know what? He thought he was going to be convicted, too, because like, day or so later, the jury was still deliberating. He was in the wind. He took off. He fled. I don't know what the hell he was doing out. I mean, again, how screwed up is that? That he was out. But then the jury came back and they acquitted him. They acquitted him. He thought he was going to be found guilty. He knew he was guilty, or he thought he knew he was going to be found guilty. So the question is, now, what do the feds do? You know, where do the feds go? And you know, I mean, if the feds really have these guys called, which many people think they do, and they certainly have all their phone records, they've-- you know, Higgins' career, such as it is, as an ATF agent is over. Procter-- Procter Trooper, as Jen McCabe called him, I think, was Jim McCabe. Procter Trooper's career is OVA. I would say Sergeant Buchanan's career is OVA. Another thing to stay trooper, I was talking to you today, said he said, those troopers in the Norfolk County District Attorney's Office have as many ethics as they have hairs on their head. I said, that's a nice-- that's a nice-- I'm going to use that one. I said, I'm going to steal that one from you. 844-542-- where are the feds now? Nobody knows. Nobody knows. You know, Josh Levy, the acting US attorney, he had a sit-down with the press that covers the federal courthouse about a month ago. And just to discuss what he's done since he took over for racial Rollins, he was asked about this, and he said, I can't talk about this. 617, retry the case, are you kidding me? Can we sue the DEA for wasting taxpayer money? The thing to do with the DEA is to oust him at the next election, which is in 2026, even though he has $400,000 in his account, which is a lot of dough for a county race. I doubt he'll run again. He's been at the trough for his entire life, and he's going to be 70 come August. So next month, next month, now that it's July, I think he's going to call it quits. Retra 661, a retrial is just beating a dead horse. Yeah, but I think they know even more. I think the feds know a lot more now, too. They've learned a lot. And you know what? They're also going to have to deal with this Sandra Burchmore case, which is heating up. And the canton cops are deeply involved in this, as you know, from the Sally port. And the canton cops, they weren't involved in the death of Sandra Burchmore, the pregnant woman. But she died in Canton. And they didn't exactly do a bang-up job on the murder investigation of Sandra Burchmore, just like they didn't do a bang-up job on the investigation of Boston police officer John O'Keefe. So the canton police are going to be getting pulled in all different directions. 844-500-42, 42-844-500-4242. The get a life crowd will need to find a new hobby. I don't know. This was a case-- you don't get cases like this very often. Cases like this have always captured the attention of the population, down through the years. I mean, it's always been this way. A case like this always is going. That's why you have all these true crime shows on TV. 844-500-- and a lot of these true crime shows, the majority of the audience, is women. 844-500-42-42, we will take your calls, your reactions, your first reactions to the not guilty verdict. We'll have a turtle boy on a little bit later. And we're going to have attorney Mark Salinas on at the bottom of the hour just to discuss what we thought we would be discussing. And we will be discussing the ruling by the Supreme Court. Another good win for President Trump today. He has immunity for presidential actions. This pretty much takes the final air out of the balloon of Jack Smith, the so-called special counsel, who probably shouldn't even be on a government payroll, or certainly shouldn't be prosecuting a case. Anyway, 844-500-42-42, you don't have to wait once a week for your favorite TV show to come on the air anymore. You just stream what you want, when you want, on demand. You also don't have to keep your favorite radio station on all day to hear a particular song or show. You could just play me or Grace when you want at the click of a button on your phone. The same rule applies to real estate. You don't have to list your property at a price and then start negotiating. You don't have to wait an unknown period of time to sell. You don't have to listen to negative comments or rising out of a home inspection. You can now choose to sell your real estate in a well-marketed auction event with JJ Manning under your terms and best of all, with no contingencies. Times have changed, processes evolve, and people do things differently. The way to sell your real estate is changing, too. JJ Manning uses their own 30-30 marketing plan. 30 days of marketing and 30 days to close. They have refined this process over 48 years. Luxury homes, rental properties, commercial, and JJ Manning knows how to squeeze all of the juice out of the orange. To learn more on how to get your commercial, residential, or land sold quickly, contact Charlie Gill at 805210111 or visit jjmanning.com. Call Charlie today at 805210111 or go to jjmanning.com and get your real estate sold. I'm Howie Carr. The Howie Carr Show will be right back. Howie Carr is back. I love my pillow's products. I sleep with their pillows. I wear their slippers. I dry off with their towels. Now you can enjoy all of their products with great discounts by using the code Howie at MyPillow.com. From pillows, towels, slippers, and even their geezer dream sheets, go to MyPillow.com and use code Howie for amazing discounts. Jared, what's the poll question? What are the results thus far? Today's poll question, which you can vote in at HowieCarShow.com, is did the jury in the Karen Reid trial do the right thing? No, should have been guilty. No, should have been not guilty. Or I'm satisfied with a mistrial. I know that's like kissing your sister to tie. But still, I figured that should be an option. I say no, it should have been not guilty. 77% of the audience agrees with you. It should have been not guilty. 12% are satisfied with a mistrial. And 11% think it should have been guilty. Really? People are bringing up the DNA thing too. So if they have another trial, don't they have to try to find the-- there were three separate DNAs found on John O'Keefe's clothing. There was his, obviously. And then there were two others. And apparently, I assumed they're going to say, well, they didn't check. There wasn't enough to check. Well, let's check again, OK? And then they're also the dog DNA. They said the state police, trooper proctor. And we all know what an upstanding moral guy he is. He has as much ethics as he has hair on his head. Yes, she's a babe. We have Fall River accent, though. Yeah, he's the one who took the swabs, right? And they sent him off to UC Davis to some clinic. And they said, oh, we didn't catch anything. Something tells me that they didn't do a real good swab job on his arm to see what was-- if there was any dog DNA in those cuts. That's my own guess. Because I don't trust anything about these state police, Canton Police, Norfolk County District Attorney's Office. There is a crooked as the day is long. June 21st. Not December 21st. Mark, you're next with Howie Carr. Go ahead, Mark. Yeah, hi, Howie. What I tried to do with this Canton Read trial, initially, is I put myself in the place of Brian Albert. And I'm in my house sleeping. And I'm completely innocent of anything. Nothing has happened. And yet, at 5 o'clock or 5.05 or 5.10 or whenever it was that morning, there's a fire engine and EMT vehicle, as well as two police vehicles. I'm sure with all their life money is shining. And yet, I don't come out of the house to see what's going on. Right. OK? I'm saying, if that was me-- You're a first responder, too, Mark. Don't forget, you're a cop. You're a first responder. Very true, right? And you correct me if I'm wrong. Didn't Jennifer McCain make two court phone calls to her sister, Brian Albert's wife? OK, so we don't know what we said. OK, so more than likely, it was stay put. Don't come out, something like that. I'm speculating, but one could assume that. I don't know. I mean, you know, the other thing, too, is you've had this dog for seven years. The dog sleeps in your bedroom. And you wake up in the morning, and the dog is gone. I mean, wouldn't that tend to make you think what's, you know, something's wrong here? Whatever happened to that, when did the dog disappear? Was the dog ever seen again after the morning of January 29? I don't know. I believe it was a couple of months later that they they rehomed slowly, but one quick thing, too, howie, about you had mentioned a trooper, Paul. Yes. This is what the Commonwealth faced their action or reconstruction, that she backed into him at 24 miles an hour. And it was the broken tail light that caused the lacerations in his arm, thrust him back, hit his head on the curb, and thrust his body 12 feet onto the front lawn. Right. He bounced, he hit his head on the curb, and then bounced, bounced 30 feet onto the grass. Yeah, I've fallen, you know, as Grace likes to point out, I've fallen repeatedly. I have never bounced, Mark. I could tell you that from personal experience, you don't bounce when you hit the ground. 844-500-4242. Have any of the jurors said anything? No, I think the reporters will be tracking them down. It'll take a while. Live from the Matthews Brothers Studios. 844-500-4242, Mark Salinas is an attorney. He appears on Grace's show, but Grace is off this week, so I wanted to have him on to talk about the decision by the Supreme Court. And we will ask him about that. But first, I want to ask him about his reaction to the mistrial being declared today in the Karen Reed murder trial in datum. Mark, you have any initial thoughts on this? Yeah, I mean, I was surprised. I was really expecting that this would be an acquittal, but for it to be a mistrial, I guess I can see that that is being a reasonable possibility. I think what was interesting was the note that was provided by the jurors to the judge said that there was a deep division amongst multiple members of the jury. That was pretty clear. So we're not talking about one holdout there, so it looks like the jury just really got hung up on this and couldn't come to a verdict. Yeah, I don't know. It seemed like it was rather overwhelming. And the prosecution case, weak as it was, it was shot full of holes in many cases by their own witnesses. Oh, it was unbelievable. And I'll tell you what, how the most upsetting part about this was the level of corruption that came out that exists within the state police. If I was sitting there as a juror, and I think any reasonable juror could come to this conclusion, they could simply say this. Given the misconduct that we heard during the course of this trial, I don't trust any of this evidence. And for that reason alone, I'm going to acquit. And that would be sufficient. And I wouldn't blame a jury for doing that. That's why this verdict is so surprising. Yeah, now Lally just went out there and said that immediately said, well, of course, we're going to retry the case. But do you really think they're seriously going to retry this case? Yes, I do, Howie. I don't know if you've seen this. But apparently, more of these officers already put out a statement that they're going to retry this case, which I just don't like at all. They shouldn't be coming out this quick. It just kind of shows some type of bias inherent in this prosecution. Why don't they just take a step back, take a couple of minutes, think about it, and then come up with a statement for them to come out right away with this? It's just a bad look. Yeah, I-- But I mean, doesn't he have to-- The last rest of the case is a bad look. He has to save face, though, doesn't he? I mean, to say this and then wait for it to kind of die down and then say, you know, in three weeks when they have the next hearing. You know, we've rethought this thing. And you know, the chances of conviction are minimal. So we're going to just take the best discretion as the better part of valor. You think that's going to happen or not? No, they're going to retry this case. They've already come up with a statement and you're right, because they would have an incredible amount of egg on their face. They've already committed to the fact that they believe the suspect in this case is Karen Reed and they want a conviction. So I'll tell you the reasonable circumstances when they decide not to retry a case is what they should be doing in this case. Talking to the alleged victim's family and saying, look, how do you feel about this and use their input? For them to come out and make this statement today that they're immediately going to another trial, it's like they're ignoring the victim's wishes in this case. And that's why you usually don't see somebody come out this quick from the prosecutor's office and say this is what we're going to do. Now, we don't really know what the feds are going to do, but we do know what they've done already. And they've grabbed the cell phone of a trooper proctor and it's going to probably end his career. They've been speculation that they have had wiretaps on a number of people involved in this. They handed over to the defense more than 3,000 pages of evidence. So how do you think that the feds are going to react to this? Well, that's the wild card here. What exactly are they investigating at this point? And I'm not suggesting I know anything about this, I certainly don't. But if they were investing some level of corruption within the state police that bleeds into the DA's office, that could entirely derail a future prosecution. So that's what's going to be interesting to see. What are the feds going to come out with in their investigation if anything and how does it affect this case? And that's for proctor. I get to tell you, the state police is in a dilemma with him because this isn't the only murder case that he's investigated. His credibility was shredded to pieces in this. And if they try to fire him or put him on leave, he's going to end up-- all these other murder investigations are going to fall apart. Brian Walsh, that's a terrible one. And they don't have a body in that case. I mean, that's-- Exactly. That could be a mess. It will be a mess. And it's his testimony that they have to rely upon. And what juror in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts now doesn't know the name proctor. Look at what's happened to his reputation. Yeah. And the other wild card here is, as I mentioned earlier, is the Sandra Birchmore case, which is also in Canton. It involves Stoughton cops, but it was investigated by the same crew of state cops in Morrissey's office. And it was initially investigated by the Canton cops who bungled this O'Keefe investigation. I mean, how many of those Canton cops are going to be able to survive the Birchmore investigation before the next trial of Karen Reed? Not many of them, not many of them. I tell you, I don't know about you, Hawi. But I've scratched Canton off the list of towns I want to be driving through late at night. [LAUGHTER] Yeah. I'm not worried about the cops. I'm worried about being hit by drunken cops. Apparently every-- you know, I said in an early column, Mark Salinas, I said, it's like Paul Revere. He's summoned in Canton, the midnight ride of Paul Revere. But he wasn't riding his horse loaded, you know? I think some of the luster, some of the luster is sort of weighing down that city, hasn't it? [LAUGHTER] It's still got the commuter rail stop. So I guess it's a good real estate investment. But it's just quite a mess. I don't know. So you really think they're going to try to push this through and have another trial? Oh, they absolutely will. They're so committed to this. And the reputation of the DA's office and the state police, if it could possibly get any worse, it would get worse if they didn't try to retry the case, because they'd be acknowledging defeat. And they're not going to do that. And you know, Morrissey's going to want to get reelected. So he's got everything invested in this prosecution now. Good Lord. OK, well, let's talk about the Supreme Court decision. It was a great win for President Trump. They said he could not be prosecuted for official actions taken during the presidency. But I want to move on to something else, Mark Salinas. Now we have an utterly corrupt Democrat operative as a judge, not just in the Jack Smith case in Washington. But we have this guy, Juan Merckchan in New York, who's got Trump coming up for sentencing a week from Thursday. Now that it looks like all the other cases, all the other law fair cases are dead, do you think they'll try to throw Trump in jail in New York? No, I've always said that. I don't think they're going to go that far with this. But again, once again, I've yet to not be surprised with some of these cases. Because the reality is, you have Donald Trump as someone who's going to be sentenced with no criminal or record, he hasn't had any issues before. So they have to take that consideration in sentencing. And anyone else would not be in prison for this. The sentencing guidelines just don't call for it. What I could see if the judge was going to get a little absurd with this is put draconian probation sanctions on him, such as whether it be house arrest or even worse, think about this how he, when you're on probation, it's a matter of course. You have to ask permission to travel. So if he has to ask permission to travel at every campaign stop, he's ostensibly going to be prevented from campaigning. I could see some more on a move like that coming out of that court. Could they-- they're not going to get any relief in the state courts, because New York has become a one-party state. But I mean, how quickly can you move into federal court, claiming your civil rights have been violated or you haven't been given due process, et cetera, et cetera? Well, Trump's got a great legal team behind him. And I'm not sure exactly what their plan is. But you have to know that they are planning for the worst to be able to go directly to the Supreme Court to look for any relief if some absurd sentence comes out of that New York court. They should already be doing it, in my opinion. There are ways and there are arguments that some legal scholars have looked at and said, look, we need the Supreme Court to look at this because of the grave consequences. And as with any other legal proceeding, if you don't ask, you're not going to find out what the answer is. So you should at least be requesting that form of relief directly at the Supreme Court and seeing what the decision is to lay the groundwork for whatever might happen in New York. Now, do you think that all these other cases are dead at this point? Much of them are going to be. So look, everybody needs to take a step back here. I know the left is completely losing their minds right now and saying, oh my gosh, Donald Trump can now kill political rivals. That's just stupid. I know, that's just insane. I mean, and how about Van Jones saying, this opens the way to thug rule. Van Jones is black. I thought thug was a racist term, right? But not that they're throwing it around. It's an actual dissent. What? The actual dissent, Sotomayor, is making these arguments that I'm talking about, that he could take bribes. You know, he could go kill political rivals. I don't even understand how you come to that conclusion because the plain fact is, those type of powers are not conferred upon the presidency to begin with. So there's never going to be that situation. This was a very middle-of-the-road decision. If you think about it, it protects the presidency and public interest. What I mean by that, it means the president can act officially without the fear of any type of prosecution. And the public has their fears taking care of and saying, we're not going to have a road presidency either. So it really is a middle-of-the-road decision when you take the absurd arguments out of it. I just-- you know, what did you make of Judge Clarence Thomas slapping Jack Smith around? Oh, it's just gold. It was absolutely beautiful. And, you know, there was a lot of language inside that decision that was preemptively sort of slamming the dissent. You know, Robert says, the dissent ignores the Constitution's separation of powers and instead relies on fear-mongering, posing the basis of extreme hypotheticals. That's what I'm talking about here. I mean, the dissent was just absolutely ridiculous. And Clarence Thomas pointed that out, Judge Robert's pointed that out, that we need to stop the fear-mongering. And the fear-mongering really only comes from the left on this. Right. Yeah, and this-- The sky is not falling. Yeah. But they've spent the last eight years saying it was falling. And now people laugh at it when they say that. And that makes them even angrier, Mark Salinas. I know. And then, at first, God, if Trump does not win this, President Trump does not win this election, and we're stuck with another Democrat, whoever that might be, somehow they're going to blame it on Trump anyway, the last three and a half, four years. Yeah, I saw that the Biden has this new add-out saying that Trump is responsible for higher prices. Is there anything you can't do? You know, I never fully appreciated the word gaslighting until I started listening to the Biden campaign here. It's unbelievable. Everything that they do, they accuse Donald Trump of doing. It's like you do live in a backwards world somehow. Yeah. Bizarro world. The old Superman comics. Yeah. Mark Salinas, where can people go if they need your legal counsel? You can find sslawteam.com, sslawteam.com. We have a small firm in North and over. You can follow me on Twitter and at Mark Salinas-ESQ. All right. Thank you, Mark Salinas. We appreciate you being with us to check in on a big day for legal decisions. 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Go to MyPillow.com and don't forget the code HOWE. I'm HOWE car. If you missed any part of the show, we've got you covered. You know what, guys? This could be a podcast. Subscribe to the HOWE car radio network on your preferred podcast platform and start listening to previous shows and exclusive podcast-only features. It's actually not a bad idea. [MUSIC PLAYING] The HOWE car show is back. [MUSIC PLAYING] 844-542. This trial has kept your network out of action. It's not going to be a retrial before the election. Don't worry about that. If there is a retrial, it won't be probably until next year. 844-542-542-617. What do the Macalberts have on Michael Morrissey? You know what? That's the question every. He's a 100% guy. And he just sometimes, you know what? He's a 100% guy. But we don't know what they've got on him, if anything. 844-542-542. Heather, you're next with HOWE car. Go ahead, Heather. HOWE. Hi. Hi. So, my God, I've got so many things to talk about in this trial. We're going to talk about the HOWE car. We're going to talk about the HOWE car. I'm going to talk about the HOWE car. I'm going to talk about the HOWE car. So, my God, I've got so many things to talk about in this trial. But I can't even believe. So, I came into this not knowing anything. Not one of these people that's been following it for the last two years. Something popped up, I think, in my Twitter feed or something. And I'm in Maine, so, you know, kind of close to home. So, I started watching it completely unbiased. And as it wore on, I was like, "There's just no way she did it." I personally tried to drive my own SUV 24 miles an hour in reverse. I couldn't do it. I got up to 19 and scared the crap out of myself. And don't forget, it was snowing. It was snowing that night, too. Snowing and drinking. And drinking? Heavy drinking, yes. Yeah, and I mean, I've done that woman before that, you know, had a little bit too much to drink and gone off the rails. But I still don't see how it, I don't see how she hit him. I don't. Yeah. And especially once they had the, um, the ARCA guys testify. Right. That should have left those jurors with no questions. Especially after the state police, the state police guy was such a clown. Oh my God. I was, during his testimony, when he was talking about the keys that go, "Oh no, that's the keys I go." And then it ends in cycle. In speaking, speaking to the crime scene. How about speaking to the crime scene? Yeah. Have you ever heard anybody say something like that? And how about this for, I, I, she ran him down and she killed him. And then she went back to the house and made 53, 53 voicemails for him. Yeah. I mean, we've all, we've all watched a million things on TV, read a million cases in the papers. Have you ever heard of such a thing? No. And as a matter of fact, they tried to say, "Oh, will she call their parents?" That's consciousness of guilt. Let me tell you something. If she did, let's, let's just, for devil's advocate, she did it. She'd go home. She realized if she did it. She called her parents. Her parents are going to say, "Listen. Lay law. Get the alcohol out of your system and wait until somebody knocks on your door to say that he's come up." Kind of like Chris Albert did. When he killed the Hungarian exchange student back in 1994. Yeah. And what you would do if you were drunk driving and did a hit and run, you would have, if you realized it, you would have gone home and you would have slept as much as possible, gotten the alcohol out of your system, and then waited for the knock and shut your mouth. Yeah. You wouldn't have gone back looking. Yeah. No. No, you would. No says she was establishing an alibi with 53 calls. I keep coming back to this other. Wouldn't 23 have been enough? 33? Okay. 43 calls. Why did she have to make 53 calls? Oh, don't forget how she was also wearing her boots in the house. Oh, yeah. If so, fact though. Yeah. John didn't like people to wear shoes in the house. She knew he was dead, so she wore her boots into the house. Your Honor, I move for a directed verdict of guilty and how I thought. [MUSIC PLAYING]