SEO 101

Do You Really Need to do Keyword Research?

Ross and John discuss Keyword Research, why is it important, do you really need to do it? They also look into High Profile Terms vs. Longtail Tools such as Google Adwords Keyword Tool, KeywordSpy, WordTracker, Microsoft Advertising Intelligence Plugin. They also look into the processing and evaluation process. Our Sponsors: * Producer Brasco: As digital professionals and business owners, we understand the critical importance of a secure and high-performing website. That's why I want to talk to you about Kinsta, a managed WordPress hosting provider that delivers exceptional speed, security, and reliability. Kinsta's infrastructure is optimized for WordPress, ensuring your site loads lightning-fast and ranks well in search results. They utilize Google Cloud's premium tier network and C3D virtual machines, which significantly boost performance. In fact, Kinsta customers often experience up to a 200% increase in site speed just by migrating to their platform. Security is paramount, and Kinsta provides enterprise-grade measures to protect your valuable data. They are one of the few WordPress hosting providers with SOC2 certification, guaranteeing the highest level of security for your website. Kinsta's MyKinsta dashboard offers a user-friendly interface with a comprehensive suite of tools to manage your site efficiently. From cache control and debugging to redirects and CDN setup, MyKinsta simplifies website administration. For SEO 101 listeners, Kinsta offers specific advantages. Their platform is optimized for speed, a crucial ranking factor in search engine algorithms. Their security measures protect your site from malware and hacking attempts that could damage your online presence. And their expert support team is available 24/7 to assist with any technical issues that may arise. If you're serious about your online presence and want a hosting provider that prioritizes performance, security, and support, I highly recommend Kinsta. Visit kinsta.com today to learn more and take advantage of their limited-time offer for new customers. That's k-i-n-s-t-a dot com. Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Duration:: 38m
Broadcast on:: 19 Apr 2010
Audio Format:: other

Ross and John discuss Keyword Research, why is it important, do you really need to do it? They also look into High Profile Terms vs. Longtail Tools such as Google Adwords Keyword Tool, KeywordSpy, WordTracker, Microsoft Advertising Intelligence Plugin. They also look into the processing and evaluation process.

Our Sponsors:
* Producer Brasco: As digital professionals and business owners, we understand the critical importance of a secure and high-performing website. That's why I want to talk to you about Kinsta, a managed WordPress hosting provider that delivers exceptional speed, security, and reliability. Kinsta's infrastructure is optimized for WordPress, ensuring your site loads lightning-fast and ranks well in search results. They utilize Google Cloud's premium tier network and C3D virtual machines, which significantly boost performance. In fact, Kinsta customers often experience up to a 200% increase in site speed just by migrating to their platform. Security is paramount, and Kinsta provides enterprise-grade measures to protect your valuable data. They are one of the few WordPress hosting providers with SOC2 certification, guaranteeing the highest level of security for your website. Kinsta's MyKinsta dashboard offers a user-friendly interface with a comprehensive suite of tools to manage your site efficiently. From cache control and debugging to redirects and CDN setup, MyKinsta simplifies website administration. For SEO 101 listeners, Kinsta offers specific advantages. Their platform is optimized for speed, a crucial ranking factor in search engine algorithms. Their security measures protect your site from malware and hacking attempts that could damage your online presence. And their expert support team is available 24/7 to assist with any technical issues that may arise. If you're serious about your online presence and want a hosting provider that prioritizes performance, security, and support, I highly recommend Kinsta. Visit kinsta.com today to learn more and take advantage of their limited-time offer for new customers. That's k-i-n-s-t-a dot com.

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

This webmaster radio.fm program is made possible, in part by the following. Ascon 2010, where affiliates always attend for free, June 21st through 23rd in Denver. Make your plans now to be at the most affordable, informative, interactive, trade show anywhere. Haven't made your plans to join us, then it's time to act fast. We have secured a limited number of hotel rooms at the fabulous Hyatt Regency Convention Center Hotel, the official host hotel of Askcon 2010. Book your reservations at our exclusive Askcon 2010 special ring by going to bitit.ly/cheaphotel. That's bitit.ly/cheaphotel. These rooms are guaranteed to be sold out fast. Remember, Askcon 2010 is giving you two days of back-to-back session, keynote presentations, exhibit access, and incredible nighttime networking for free, plus we're giving you unbelievable room specials for a limited time. Book your rooms now by going to bitit.ly/cheaphotel. Askcon 2010, the trade show that's free for all affiliates, June 21st through 23rd in Denver. Choose for today at AFMCOM2010.com, that's AFFCOM2010.com. The opinions expressed on this webmasterradio.fm program are those of the host, guest, and callers. And do not reflect those of the staff, management, or advertisers of webmasterradio.fm. Any rebroadcast or retransmission of this program, without the express written consent of webmasterradio.fm is prohibited. Welcome to FEO 101, your introductory course on Search Engine Optimization. So, turn on your computers, open your minds, grab your mouse, and get ready to get back to the basis. Hello, and welcome to SEO 101 on webmasterradio.fm. This is Ross Dunn, CEO of Step 4th Web Marketing, and my co-host is John Carca, the director of organic search for media ways. How you doing, man? I'm doing awesome, Ross, how are you? Good. You know, before we start, I'd like to thank you for your ongoing fight against the use of pesticides and SERPs. Thank you. Yeah. A good word of difference. Been working very hard on that. You've got a fundraiser coming up, I expect you to contribute. I was actually going to say, you know, if anyone want to thank you, thank you for your organic efforts, so you could just pass it out. Anyway, somebody out there thinking, "What is he talking about? Is there really a pesticide problem on SERPs?" There's not a PESSA. Well, I wouldn't know. Actually, that's not necessarily true. There's lots of pests on SERPs. That's a good point. That's a good thought. PESSA-side for spam. How could you do that? I guess not supposed to be the ultimate pesticide. Matt Cuts. Matt Cuts is the Orkin man for... Oh, we're going to do this soon. I love it. Yeah. Nice. Okay, well, anyways, today we have a show on keyword research. It's a hot topic. I know everyone... I think just about everyone who needs to learn more about this or even if they don't even know it. I've always learned something new about it, and I think you're right in the middle of something. Yeah, I'm completely revamping our keyword research processes and I'm learning new things. I've been doing it for years, and I'm still learning new things about how to improve it and change the way it can happen and make it simpler and easier and harder and all at the same time. Oh. Okay, well, why don't you sort of let us in? Well, I guess maybe before we start digging into how and why, but I mean, no, before starting to dig into how, let's talk about why. Why do we do keyword research in SEO? I mean, it's kind of a no-brainer. It seems very simple that we're in organic search. People use words to search. We need to understand or try to predict what those words are, therefore we do keyword research. But is that really the depth of it? How far do you have to take it? Because you could actually come out with, I did a list just the other day off a seed list of nine or 10 words, ended up with 30,000 long tail phrases, do you need to take it that far? Where is it important? Why is it important? I guess this is a question. And I'd love to hear a little bit about how you look at that, Ross, and when you tackle keyword research, what's your goal? Well, first of all, mine, of course, and again, we've got this good dynamic here. I'm small, medium-sized business. You usually do the larger in the corporates. So it's a different world, really, and it comes to keyword research. I mean, the basics are fundamentals are always there, but when we're doing research, you know, I like to look at the competitors, not to say that they're doing anything necessarily right all the time, but I like to go and look at clients' competitors. Ones especially we know who are doing well, maybe we've got some insight into that, inside, inside, who knows. And we just sort of, there's a tool I use, actually, I know we're going to get into tools in a second. But I really enjoy using the searched-based keyword tool from Google. If you go to google.com/sktool, and it's sweet, I mean, it's really nice. You just push in, type in the website address, and it analyzes the page and gives you some feedback on what, say, the competitor is currently targeting. And then it gives you some more other information. I just really like that. It's a good, quick glimpse of what your competitor or a particular page on your site may be targeting. It's essentially matching it to the content on your page. And then it'll pick from there which ones are the most popular search phrases and such. So we'll do that. Just maybe just start. If it's a new client per se, let's say we're doing that for their home page, we do that and find out what they're doing, and then from there perhaps find better phrases. Right. So, you're snacking the tool conversation ahead of time because I want to get back to that because I actually stopped using that tool in favor of going back to the standard Google AdWords keyword tool and using the URLL option in that tool as opposed to the one in the SK tool. So that's a little tease into our tool section because there's a very specific reason why I switched. And all right. So we understand the keywords are important, right? But to me, it's like, how do you know when you're doing your keyword research, there's choices you have to make. I said we had nine phrases and it ended up with 30,000. So a lot of people are of the mindset that the long tail is the king these days, long tail keywords the more the better. And then there's some like myself who are still pretty high on the idea of those really high profile or marquee terms being important. So what are you on, Ross, just because if you're on the other, we'll have a good debate. You know what, I think the way I go about it is I get the client essentially to go for a phrase. Pick a phrase is the goal, the ultimate goal. Let's say a year from now, they're going to get a top V top ranking. What is it they want? I'm like, OK, so that's our end goal. Then I go, all right, well, we need to get you some business in the beginning. This is a competitive phrase. They're not going to get that ranking really that quickly. We need to, we're going to need to do the link building. We're going to need to do all the different things that are required to get that kind of link juice and credibility. So then we tend to go for long tail. We'll go for stuff that is low hanging fruit that their competitors are most likely ignoring. And even though there's say fewer searches, they're higher converting traffic often. So I do a mixture. We're always going for that main phrase, but long tail is a great intermediate option. I think so. I've really been recently leaning towards focusing on high profile terms for sites. So if I have, if I have like 10 hours to work on link building for a client, I was focused on the high profile terms. And then the reason I'm doing that these days is, A, I know that the sites I'm working on are optimized from a technical standpoint. So I know the long tail content of the building. And I agree with you completely that it's got to be a combination of both the high profile and the long tail. But for me, if I'm doing link building, since that's kind of what we're talking about, the link building is going to be towards the high profile terms. Content creation is going to be towards long tail. So I know if my site architecture is correct and the bots are going to get through my site, they're going to, and they're going to spider those, that new content that's going to have all that long tail terminology in it, then I'm fine with long tail because the more I focus on building authority to those high volume high profile terms and the more that I cite gains authority for those terms, the long tail terms that are associated will do better as well. Exactly. So if my site has a lot of authority on, you know, popcorn and I have long tail phrases related to popcorn, even if I'm not building links directly to those as long as I'm creating content that has long tail, it's going to work. I honestly don't know if there would be an argument against that. It's pretty fundamental for me anyway, that's exactly what we do. Link building is always for the market term and long tail, yeah, like you say, it just comes from that. And also the content. Like if we find a particular phrase is converting well on a site and it's a long tail, we might just create an article around that. And then maybe we'll do some link building through, you know, a PR web through, you know, some intermediate, just fast, kicking the pants kind of link building, you know, get it out there and social that kind of stuff just to get a little more juice, but that's about it when it comes to that. Yeah. So really when you're talking about keywords and you're talking about the difference between high profile and long tail, it really correlates to, you know, the two main things in SEO, content and links. High profile coordinates to links, long tail coordinates to content. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Have you heard an argument otherwise? I don't know. It's not so much I've heard the argument, but I see so many people building links to long tail phrases or, you know, spending so much time focusing on optimizing for a long tail phrase where if your site's just optimized to begin with and you just add a new page of content, that's all you should have to worry about is I'm adding new content because my site's already done, but they spend so much time worrying about, I've got this article and I'm focusing on this one long tail phrase and I want to make sure my keyword density is right and I have to have the exact title, the exact meta tags, you know, those help, of course, but, you know, it's much better to publish more and more content than spend the time optimizing for long tail and not publishing more content. So if you have a choice between publishing two articles or publishing one article and optimizing it, I would publish two articles every day. Well, and I guess there is an argument actually and that is if you don't have the resources to compete for the market phrase and you know which long term long tail terms are really doing a good business, there's no harm in building links to them and maybe doing some focusing on it, but, you know, that's true, but to me if it's something that stands out enough and you're analytics to where, you know, hey, this is a high converting term, I know this is going to work well for me, it's no longer a long tail phrase, it's not going to be a high profile, but it might be a primary phrase, you see what I mean? In that case, you're absolutely right, you're going to build some links to it, you're going to spend a little bit more time making sure the title and meta tags are optimized properly, but yeah, but long tail to me is three or four searches a month, you know, and that's not worth assuming. Okay. We're talking semantics then, but that's important for everybody, just understanding the difference from my mind at least, because there's not just a high value and long tail, there's places in between two. True enough, to me it's top or long tail, I mean, no, if we really get that, we have primary, secondary and tertiary, I didn't know you were just a straight black and white kind of guy Ross, I thought you were going to get there, I like you now, but all right, on that note, let's take a quick break and when we come back, we're going to talk a little more about keywords. SEO 101 will be back right after recess. What is this? Why is my website not ranking higher? Sounds like you could use a link building report from SEO Fox dot com. What's that? You can't rank without good backlinks and SEO Fox dot com's link building report lets you enter domains and compare their backlinks. 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Did you know 99 Designs projects give average of over 70 different designs. Great options for a price that you set. 99 Designs. When designers compete, you win. The whoring of Facebook for promotional purposes continues with the webmasterradio.fm Facebook fan page. Join our fans by clicking the Facebook logo on the webmasterradio.fm homepage and keep up to date with all the latest. Become a fan on Facebook. Okay, Glass, take your seats and no talking. Recess is over and SEO 101 is back in session only on webmasterradio.fm. Welcome back to SEO 101 on webmasterradio.fm with John Carcutt, Director of Organic Search for MediaWiz and myself, Ross Dunn, CEO of Stepforth Web Marketing Inc. For the break, we're discussing about long tail and primary key phrases, which one you should spend the most time on and all that sort of stuff. I'm sure we've talked to that. We're about blue in the face, so let's move on to the next one. You mentioned a little bit ago about when you're looking at these high-value, you have a goal set for eventually you want to get rankings for these terms, but I actually have broken-up keyword research based on four different types of goals that we might be searching for and how that changes the keyword research. Rankings is definitely one of those goals, but when I'm doing my evaluation of my expanded list of keywords and I'm looking at which ones are really important, I look at what the goals of the site are to determine which of these evaluation points have priority. If that's your priority is rankings, is that your goal, then when you're evaluating these keywords, competition would be one of your most important elements you'd be looking at. If traffic was the goal, then search volume is going to be one of the most important elements you're looking at from your keyword standpoint. The other two that I have in my list, and if you have some more that would be awesome, Ross, is if your goal is conversions, then you're going to look for user intent type key phrases like things that indicate that they're ready to buy, and those actually would end up being more of the long tail stuff that we talked about earlier, and then there's just overall long tail support. If you're really wanting to increase the reach that your site has into the engine by that, then you're looking at content. What types of content do I want to target? Different buckets of content for my keywords. I'm trying to think, you've pretty much covered the map there. Would one of those, if I say they would follow traffic too, like I'm thinking, some people are targeting the viral aspect. They're targeting the stuff that's currently hot, the buzz, that which kind of combines a few of those. That's a real good one. So you're looking for timely. Your goal of your site is to publish information that's timely, maybe it's a news site, news-oriented site. So then your keyword research would definitely, you'd want to look at the buzz and some of those. What's that one tool that Google has insights might be a good tool to use to look at when you're doing your keyword research? That's a good one. Yeah, and they've also got the DoubleClick platform. They still have it called DoubleClick for some reason. But anyway, it's also got some phenomenal tools for demographics and finding out what terms are biggest at this time of year and that kind of thing. So you could target seasonal seasonality as well. There you go. Very good. That's another good one. So I think the point is, when you're doing keyword research, yes, you're going to come up with this giant list and you got to evaluate which ones are your most important ones, but make sure that you're looking at what is the goal of your site and that's part of your decision when you're evaluating those keywords without a doubt. Pretty extensive. And for buzz, I mean, that would really work around anyone who wants to ride the wave. They're constantly riding, trying to get the top digs, all that kind of stuff. I would guess that articles that are well written around something that's hot in the news is going to do better in social platforms than something that's just a darn good article. But in my market, the people that I deal with, could also just mean brand exposure. Exactly. If you're just looking to get some exposure for your brand. Cool. So you put together some tools here, why don't we leave that away too? That's the next bit. Yeah. So I just put together a couple because honestly, the system I have only uses like two tools. So I don't use a lot of variety. So if you have any other ones, Ross, that'd be awesome. And like I said before, the main tool that I'm using right now is the Google AdWords Keyword Tool. And it's an oldie, but a goodie. And I know some of the data is not always correct when it comes to search volumes and that kind of stuff. And to go back to your point before, the reason that I've switched back from the SK tool that Google has, which looks at a page and really breaks down what they think that page is about from a keyword perspective, is because if you do the same thing in the Google AdWords tool, there's a little radio button you click, and you can put a URL in there and it'll look at the URL itself, but it'll also crawl some of the navigation. And what it does, since it's an AdWords tool, it'll actually try to segment the keywords into ad groups. So what that does for me is that creates keyword buckets. So now I have a bucket that's, I've taken my core keyword, and now I have like seven or eight different buckets of related phrases around that keyword. And then in each site, each one of those buckets are long tail phrases. So it kind of goes back to that, you know, black and white, this tool actually creates some gray for me. Great. Good point. Good point. Well, one of the things that I'd like to mention is actually a little on the outside of things. And that's, have you ever heard of good keywords? Good keywords. I don't believe so. I've heard good keywords, but not a tool called good keywords. Yeah. I hope so. Yeah. Yeah. It's a tool actually. If you go to, see if I can bring it up here, goodkeywords.com/good-keywords. That's goodkeywords.com/good-keywords. The reason I'm mentioning it so prominently is it's a free tool that allows you to do absolutely the most amazing amount of sorting. Pretty much anything you can imagine, in fact, you can, you could download, like say, take Excel. I can't talk today, export an Excel file from your research in Google AdWords or, you know, the AdWords keyword tool. And then import it into good keywords. And then you can start to sort them or start to eliminate ones or just look for words that use this particular keyword. And then you can highlight all those, move them into another section and do even more. It allows you to really hone down all your phrases. You can have hundreds of thousands. It's very cool. I would definitely go to check that because right now we're doing that same kind of process with Excel. It works, but it's kind of cumbersome. Oh, this will blow your mind then. You'll love it. So there you go, everyone. It's good. It's good. Nice. It's just, just also talking about new tools. We talked about the Google AdWords keyword tool. There is a beta out for a new version of the Google AdWords keyword tool. We got access to it just a few days ago. And it's pretty killer. I don't know how to describe the differences other than it really, it automatically categorizes keywords based on, again, this is four AdWords, but it's based on Google content network. So Google content network has, you know, a set number of categories that you can put sites into, but now it will categorize keywords based on those same categories. So you actually get predefined categories of keywords that it was pretty interesting. Okay. That's cool. I actually just opened up my presentation. I was teaching advanced SEO at the local college and did a bunch of keyword research and tools and such. And there's a few here that came up, actually. If you have Office 2007, there's a tool called the Microsoft Advertising Intelligence Plug-in for Excel. Have you used that before? No. You don't have to say that like. That sounds interesting. It's a fancy, it's, I don't use Excel or, I mean, Office, I use Open Office and it doesn't have that. But if you type in online, Microsoft Advertising Intelligence Plug-in. That's just for our listeners, I figured that might make it a little easier to find it. But again, Microsoft Advertising Intelligence Plug-in. Again, if you've got Office 2007, it'll work. Any other offices, it will not. But it does some pretty fancy stuff. Now it uses Bing's platform, but, so there's fewer searches, but there's, I still think there's validity to the content that you're getting, so plays are honest. Certainly as it grows, it's going to be more important. Yeah, I will play with that for sure. And it's got an, I believe an automatic import feature. I just watched the video on it. I never used it because I don't have the platform, but it looked pretty cool. Another one is, and this is just kind of interesting, is use Google Suggest. Just go to your Google homepage and type in a phrase and see what comes up next. You'll see below a list of the different keywords that are similar to what you just typed in that maybe searched more often. It's kind of a suggestion. So, maybe I shouldn't be saying this because I might get in trouble, but I'm going to say it anyway. I've built a tool here immediately, and I'm trying to get them to let us launch a public where you can put in a list of like 10 keywords, and it's actually built in a Google Docs platform. So you put in a list of 10 keywords, and it will automatically show you the suggest for three different, the three different countries of Google, including Canada Ross, and Yahoo Suggest. You've thought of Canada, I'm touched. It's very interesting because you just put the keywords in and it puts all the current suggests into a spreadsheet format, right there for you automatically, for all 10 keywords. The problem with it is now, and the reason I don't think we're going to launch it anytime soon is just recently, I think the last week actually, people have been noticing it, and there's been a lot of talk about that Google Suggest is now localized. So if you go to, if you're in New York City and you type central, the first suggestion is Central Park. If you're in Chicago and you type central, the first suggestion is Central Park and Central Time isn't until like five in New York. So those suggests are now geo-targeted based on your location. Wow. They're always keeping us on our toes, aren't they? They are. Okay, well, I've got a couple more to add, and we'll take a quick break and we'll get back to that. SEO 101 will be back, right after recess. Hey, this is Danny Sullivan to talk to you about the Bruce Clay Incorporated. They've made ink magazines list of growing private businesses and have exhibited and fostered them by conferences since the very beginning. 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Okay, class, take your seats and no talking. Recess is over and SEO 101 is back in session, only on webmasterradio.fm. Welcome back to SEO 101 on webmasterradio.fm with John Carca, Director of Organic Search for MediaWiz and myself, Ross Dunn, CEO of Stepforth Web Marketing Inc. For the break, we're discussing a few tools for keyword research and you just ended with some interesting stuff about-- what was that, the Google? Suggest. Google Suggest, yeah, so it's localized, or at least it appears to be in most locations. Is that proven, or is it more of a-- I actually read about it, believe it or not, on TechCrunch. So they did some testing through TechCrunch. I can't remember the author's name, but I do want to give them full credit. Hey, good man, good man. Always the fair man. Okay, so we've only got four minutes left here, but I want to just note a few other others that forgot. I've got a little goldmine of stuff here. First of all, are questions relevant to your business? If they are, that's another form of search. We forgot about that, basically keywords on questions. So if they are, you can go to Word Tracker Labs, that's Word Tracker Labs, and they've got a keyword questions tool. And with that, you can type in questions and it'll provide one-- or type in a keyword and it'll find relevant questions to it. Pretty cool. Now, Word Tracker has always been kind of like a "B" in my bonnet kind of deal. I can't believe I just said that. I've never been real happy, personally, with Word Tracker. It does provide some very interesting results, some good results, but they tend-- since they use-- and in most of these keyword tools, they use the meta engines. None of them are getting any data from Google themselves or direct from Yahoo or MSN. But I don't know. And maybe it's better because it's been a number of years since I've used Word Tracker. It just always, to me, wasn't my favorite. And I even put it on the list here just because I wanted to maybe see if you had a better experience with Ross or if any of our listeners have had good experiences with it because-- I don't know. It's just always something that I kind of shy away from. Yeah, maybe it's because-- and I'm going to speak to myself here-- that maybe I'm just not advanced enough at keyword research, but I mean, I certainly do a good enough job. My clients are happy, but I don't use it either. I don't use that or keyword discovery. I actually dropped Word Tracker a few years ago and started with keyword discovery, which was pretty good. But even them-- even their stuff is-- like you say, it's not from Google. So I dropped them and I'm using Google keyword tools, and they're pretty phenomenal. Yeah. And I did exactly the same thing-- dropped Word Tracker for keyword discovery a few years ago and then migrated to directly to Google, getting it from the source. Significant money savings, I mean. Yeah. It adds up. So we're going to get a hate mail from both those guys, but hey, this is about our listeners, not about them. Well, yeah. And you know what? There probably are some really-- like, to be fair, there probably are some very advanced things you can't-- well, I know there are advanced searches you can do on keywords that you can't do within Google. So it really depends what you're looking for. Yeah. I agree. There's some stuff there that is really a merit. Another one is kwmap.net, kwmap, so keyword map.net, kwmap, and what's cool about this is it tells you what's semantically relevant to the phrase you've typed in. So you type in any phrase, outlook support or outlook crashes. [LAUGHTER] And now we're going to get a hate mail from Microsoft, too. Yeah. It's OK. I get the plot. [LAUGHTER] And you'll find all the different phrases that are relevant to that. So let's see what this should be good, actually. Outlook crashes. [LAUGHTER] It's thinking. I stumped it. But what it'll do is anything that seems semantically relevant. Now, the reason that's important is, a lot of ways-- I mean, I think there was an issue where people were debating this. But Google is semantic search engine in many ways. So I find this quite intriguing. And you seem to want to have to go there to try it out. In this case, Outlook brought up a bunch of French stuff, which is really different. But often, it does work. I will stand by it. It's got some pretty cool stuff, so. OK. Well, what next? I guess we've got to cut back, aren't we? And maybe we should continue this next show. Well, really, I think the main thing to cover-- and Raspa said we could go a few extra minutes. I don't think that people will mind too much-- is I want to talk about, how do we use this keyword research? Because so many of us know keyword research is important and spend tons of time doing keyword research. But then, how do you effectively use that research to improve SEO, to improve your client's performance, or your own website performances? I put a couple of ideas down here on how to use it. The most obvious is content planning. If you build a content calendar, or a publication calendar, or you have a content strategy or a plan, keyword research needs to be a part of that, because you need to know what to write about to meet your goals. That's a no-brainer to me. Yeah, and it's also in that same vein, it should be done before you even design your website. We're talking ideal world here, but really, these days, we're advanced enough we should be doing that. When you plan your website, you should be thinking about what sections are going to be in play. I'm sure you already have a good idea, whoever is listening, you've got an idea of what your business is and what different sections you should have, but how they're labeled, what keywords to use in the file names, in the directory names, in the titles. All that stuff plays a big role, including navigation. If you can learn all of this beforehand, have it all planned out, you literally hand the blueprint to the designer and they just follow the instructions. Frankly, there's very rare circumstances where the designer needs to do any creative ideas about keywords. I don't even think, maybe in branding. That's about it. Really, this should be set up by a marketer. That's a very good point. That's the reason back to those tools, the question we had earlier, I switched from the SK tool, Google, back to the AdWords tool, because it does create those groups or buckets, which a lot of times will help you plan categories for your navigation of your site. If that creates a really clean set of buckets of keywords, that can easily translate into your internal structure of your website. Excellent points. Well, there's certainly a lot to this, isn't there? We could go on and on. The webmaster radio probably even has a keyword-based show, if they don't, I'm surprised. We will just have to do a few of them if they don't. There's so much to it. It's a keyword world, so that's three times real fast. Keyword world. That's right. Yes. I made that up. There's not really a show called Keyword World. Well, I guess that's it for today. Awesome. Thank you, John. John put this together today quick, so thank you very much, and it's some good content. I hope everyone got a lot to see you said of this. Feel free to pass around the ideas, and we'll get a few more listeners to get past seven or so. Yeah, send us some questions too. If you have ideas and you want to say, "Hey, what about this?" We'll be happy to say, "Hey, by the way, last time we talked about keywords," but Billy Bob sent us a great suggestion on this about keywords. So, send us your thoughts too. Yeah. Any challenges you're having as well, please do. Well, on behalf of myself, Ross Dunn, CEO of Stepforth Web Marketing, and John Karket, the Director of Organic Search for MediaWiz, thanks for joining us. Our show is 2 p.m. Pacific, 5 p.m. Eastern every Monday, and we hope you tune every week. My Twitter ID is @RossDunn and John. I'm an @JohnKarket. How do you spell your last name? Well, two T's, C-A-R-C-D-T. How do you spell done? Because you end with a double letter too, so you've got to die by yours. I guess. D-U-N-double-N. Alright. Thanks, everyone. Have a great week. Bye, y'all. [Music] ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ (upbeat music)