Vineyard Church of Ann Arbor Sermon Podcast
Twelve Steps: One Step Closer to Knowing (Step 12)
All right, did I mention that we were finishing up our 12-step series this weekend. We started at, in the beginning of 2004, one step a month, the first weekend of the month, the 12 steps developed by Bill W. And his colleague Bob, Dr. Bob, which has become, you know, one of the most successful treatment regimens for alcoholism. And we've been looking at these 12 steps as a description of the spiritual path. So we're not just looking at it from the perspective of someone suffering from alcoholism or another of the, like, distinct addictions. We're looking at it more from the generalized, kind of sin addiction, brokenness, self-will run riot addiction that we all suffer from that gets manifested in different ways in each of our lives. And so let's just rehearse the 12 steps just to bring us up to, up to step 12. First step is we admitted we were powerless over whatever, alcohol, in this case, that our lives had become unmanageable. Step two, came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. Three, made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him, for made a searching and fearless moral inventory of the world around us so that we could become compelling and religious critiques of the world. Oh, of ourselves, okay, I keep stumbling over that one, I don't know what it is, admitted to God to ourselves and to another human being, the exact nature of our wrong, we're entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character, humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings, made a list of all persons we'd harmed and became willing to make amends to them all, made direct amends to such people wherever possible except when to do so would injure them or others, continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it and then step 11 sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for the knowledge of His will and the power to carry that out and we're brought now to the 12th of the 12 steps. Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics and to practice these principles in all our affairs. I just want to say one more time, I said this last month but I think it bears repeating that I've really gotten more out of these steps studying them than I even anticipated and I anticipated getting a lot out of them and one of the things that I'm coming away with having studied these steps in preparation for these messages is a real conviction that alcoholics anonymous as a movement as something that is happening in our world carries a prophetic message from Jesus to His church and that's how I'm trying to understand these steps as a Jesus person hearing the voice of Jesus to me in them and hopefully to us as well. When you think of the history of alcoholics anonymous it emerged in the 1940s when religion in America really was obscuring Jesus as much as it was revealing Him and that's always the case because we're all earth and vessels, that's what earth and vessels do but in particular in the late 40s, for example in the Roman Catholic church this was before the reforms of Vatican II, Jesus in many ways was caged up in a catechism, He had been reduced to a dogma in that wing of the church. In another wing of the church the liturgical mainline Protestant traditions, if you don't know what that means you're not missing anything, Jesus had been, I don't mean you're not missing those churches, they're wonderful churches but you don't have to know all this stuff to connect with God, Jesus had been in those churches very much locked in stained glass. In the born again churches of the Bible Belt Jesus had been maybe dressed up in some cultural garb that just made Him look weird and unattractive to many people and the effect of this obscuring of Jesus by the church itself I think provoked God who has a kind of a jealous love for the name of his son in his son's church, provoked God I think to raise up alcoholics anonymous among other things for the sake first of all of drunks everywhere but then for others in other addicted states later but he sent alcoholics anonymous outside the camp of the church that he's the sent alcoholics anonymous outside of the institutional framework of the church which is where the alcoholics were and it's also where God tends to send prophets to speak back into the church sometimes and in that sending and this has been a real stumbling block for many Christians in that sending I think we'd have to say that at least God allowed the precious name of Jesus through AA in a sense to go underground because alcoholics anonymous wouldn't speak of Jesus as the higher power his name is not mentioned at all in the 12 steps though the wisdom of AA is very much connected with the biblical tradition and the Jesus tradition but through AA the name of Jesus in a sense was allowed to go underground but I believe that and I say this as a Jesus person that Jesus or something of the presence of Jesus has been with alcoholics anonymous anonymously all these years and I'm not asking anyone to agree with that I'm just saying that's my own sense as a Jesus person and by the way there is a long biblical tradition of God appearing to people anonymously even Jesus himself Luke chapter 24 on the road to Emmaus he appeared without being recognized all this is to say that these steps these 12 steps we've been looking at reflect the path the wisdom and the power of Jesus but with all the accumulation of the religious trapping stripped away rather radically and some things that are not in my view just trappings but precious and important even essential have been stripped away so alcoholics anonymous is not a religion it is not Christianity but it is tapped into the mystery and the power of true religion and I believe into the mystery and the power of Jesus so step 12 so what that means is there's something for us to hear in these steps there's something we're being told through this phenomenon and it's our task may be in the 21st century in the church to listen to what it is God has been saying to us it's not like this is some flash in the pan some just new thing that hasn't born any fruit by this time it should have gotten our attention and when it reaches that stage when it should have gotten our attention and we don't listen to the message we are in danger of distancing ourselves from God and that's something we never ever want to do so I hope I haven't put too fine a point on that but take that for what it's worth step 12 having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps we tried to carry this message to alcoholics and to practice these principles and all our affairs first part we're looking at having had a spiritual awakening many an alcoholic new to a a has said to his or her sponsor sponsor is someone that gives kind of one-on-one help to someone who is new to the 12 steps helps them make that journey with someone who's been down the path before them many an alcoholic beginning the journey of a a has said to his sponsor you know I have a real problem with all the God stuff in these steps and many a wise sponsor has said to his sponsor well that means you're going to have a very big problem with these steps because these steps are all about God and not only are they all about God but they are all about sweaty religion not just God in the abstract but God coming in and mucking about with our messy life that's what sweaty religion is all about but and we see this especially in step 12 which says having had a spiritual awakening the cat is out of the bag with what steps step 12 the whole thing is about mediating a spiritual awakening but notice that phrase spiritual awakening doesn't appear until the last step step one does not say our lives having become unmanageable because of alcohol we realized we needed a spiritual awakening and we said about to get us one that's not how any spiritual awakening actually get started nobody get started on the path to a spiritual awakening in a sense aiming for one when you're asleep spiritually you don't know that you need to wake up but when you're sleeping you can feel psychic pain can't you and so a spiritual awakening begins with an awareness of our pain that's what step one is all about it's a giving up on ourselves as the solution to the problem that we ourselves have become which seems to me like an eminently reasonable thing to do once you come to that realization to give up on yourself as the solution to the problem that you have become having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps so here's something for us to understand spiritual awakenings a spiritual awakening is every bit as much a path as it is an event Jesus walks a path that he invites us to follow and in the process of following him we undergo a spiritual awakening so a spiritual awakening is usually something you only recognize after you're already into it this this is instructive because many people are paralyzed in taking the early steps on the path because they feel like the whole thing has got to start with a spiritual awakening and they're waiting to get zapped and until they get zapped they're not really feeling like they can take any steps but that's not the way of the 12 steps and I don't believe it is the way of the biblical path to spiritual awakening either step 12 having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps we tried to carry this message to alcoholics to fellow sufferers I have to say that maybe slightly by way of confession that's too strong a word because this is not a confessional and you know I'm not really divulging that much but it's like when someone says frankly so what I mean you know when a politician says frankly it's like give me a break politicians should be banned from saying frankly or candidly you know because they're never candid and pastors generally don't make real confessions from the pulpit but a little confession is I've never really resonated with the various program programmatic ways that Christians teach each other how to share their faith and there are a lot of these I won't mention any by name because I don't want to step on any sacred cows and my opinions may not be even that valuable so why make it personal but just me I've had a hard time resonating with these programs for how to share your faith because even the best ones after going through it or reading the book or whatever I always felt like it was something I didn't want to be on the other end of and there's just something wrong with that and so I'm in this place of some kind of a inner conflict as an evangelical if I don't want to be evangelized the way that we go about it normally you know so this is an inner kind of struggle of mine and I think it's because there's something that's just of marketing in so many of these programs you know we've got something you need let me give it to you and it's just not working for me but then I read the commentary on step 12 in this big book Alcoholics Anonymous it's I think chapter 7 working with others and I just read it you know in preparation for this I read it on Friday I'm like this is what I've been looking for this is the Jesus way of sharing the message and anyone who shares the message of Jesus really ought to read that chapter chapter 7 working with others in Alcoholics Anonymous there's a well a little gem in there it's on page 95 I think of the third edition where I think it's Bill W probably the author never talked down to an alcoholic from any moral or spiritual hilltop simply lay out the kit of spiritual tools for inspection show him how they worked with you offer him friendship and fellowship tell him if he wants to get well you will do anything to help that's the way I want to be helped and so maybe that's the way I should learn how to give help to others see even Jesus who had every right to speak from a moral and a spiritual hilltop didn't he brought people up to mountaintops didn't he and spoke to them there but more often he actually went down to where they were in the valley and spoke to him there but he never spoke from the mountain to them at the base of the mountain so I'm thinking this is maybe a little hint from heaven maybe Jesus is a hint to all of us about how we as the church as his followers are meant to be postured with respect to others in this wonderful world that we're part of this wonderful and bizarre and hellish world that we're part of what's our posture so much of what is a turnoff to people about evangelism doesn't have to do so much with the method as it has or the content so much as it has to do with the posture and if we can get clear about the posture the sharing of the message will come out with much more well much more like it did with Jesus himself so here's an example in the Bible Paul a early writer follower of Jesus about our posture toward others in this world praise be to the God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ the father of compassion and the God of all comfort who comforts us in all our troubles so that we can comfort those in any trouble with the comfort we ourselves have received from God so this is our posture with other human beings with all other human beings our solidarity with them is that we are fellow sufferers with them this is what binds us together first of all we are all of us fellow sufferers we all have troubles we have trials we have rotten circumstances we have personal brokenness we have wrongs done to us and wrongs that we have done to others but the father of all compassion wants to comfort us and that word comfort is a little bit stronger than just the modern meaning of there there now it's going to be alright in the older English comfort is more like well like the word fortify come forth come fortify God wants to come fortify he wants to strengthen us and he does it also in tenderness but he brings the whole range of his nature into comforting us in all these troubles now the Bible so often is not speaking just to us as individuals but to us together and so it's not that any one of us thankfully has all the troubles but together we have a pretty good sampling of the troubles common to humanity and we are together in the process of receiving the comfort as well so there's troubles of plenty gathered here in this room and there's also comfort a coming to us in our troubles the comfort that's coming to me isn't just for me it's for others as well who share in my particular form of suffering and pain and the same for the comfort that's coming to you in your particular form of suffering and pain in your life so whatever it is that we have to share with others we share out of our pain because our pain is where the good news is most authentically good news for us right I mean that's where we experience the good news as really good when it's good news to us in our pain so sharing your faith is not about getting some canned rap together and getting smooth and shocking and marketing savvy about laying it on people who are not really interested so they accept it anyway it's about you being in touch with your pain and being selectively open with those who need what you have received sharing whatever comfort you have received there it's laying it out for inspection so that's the openness that's needed it's not this overcoming all this social fear about you know sharing something religious but it's being open to your pain and to laying out for inspection what it is that you have found comfort through in that process what A.A. calls spiritual promotion great phrase spiritual promotion speaking from some moral or spiritual hilltop just doesn't work I mean if it ever did it doesn't now in a culture that is completely you know built around defending against the power of marketing marketers have to get better and better because we've got better and better defense if it ever worked it doesn't now except in spite of itself and just because something works in spite of itself is no recommendation to the method you know what I'm saying oh well I do so so sharing in this other way of the 12th step requires us to be open about our shared pain that doesn't mean laying our pain on others all the time or even frequently but it means listening to others and speaking to others from that place in you that has been comforted by God so if you're an alcoholic who has found recovery you're on the lookout for other alcohol if you just are you're on the lookout if you have been in a place of deep marriage pain and the grace the comfort of God has come to you in that place you will be given in tonight for others who are suffering in that same place that you know from the inside divine appointments will be arranged for you to intersect and connect with people who need to hear a little word of comfort from someone who's received it themselves in a dark time and so on and so on now if this if this were the modus operandi of the church in sharing the gospel I mean I'm just telling you hallelujah I mean I'm thinking this that would like us if anything we can do would usher in the second coming that would surely be part of ushering in the second coming yeah I mean just imagine the impact you actually don't have to imagine it just look at the growth of alcoholics anonymous using the name of Jesus anonymously that's my editorial comment but I'm not pushing it on anyone I do I am speaking no and you're not so okay a couple of the things before we move on to the other part just in case you might miss this our task in the 12 step is not to fix anyone I mean we're not even charged with it in fact that's in a sense not even our aim to fix anyone but we are to try to carry this message all the power all the responsibility is in the message it's not in or on us how do we carry the message well the best way to carry the message is just to use the message yourself every day if you are using the message yourself every day you don't have to worry about carrying it you've got it on your person and so then what it really means is having those others on your radar screen so it's really quite a simple thing the other thing to mention this is in the in the book not so much in the step itself but the book says and this is I think something for us as Jesus people to hear especially our purest motive oddly is not to save others but to save ourselves that's our purest motive I don't mean save yourself theologically you know yeah what I mean is it's part of our recovery this willingness to be open and to share the comfort that we have received with fellow suffering it's part of our recovery we're not doing it as a favor to the other so much as we are doing it as a favor to ourselves because it's the only way we get to keep what we've received and we know that and it's important for us to know that because if we don't know that if we don't know we're doing this first and foremost for ourselves then we are going to carry and share this message with others polluting it with condescension and a patronizing attitude of we've got what you don't have and here it is and I'm your fuller brush man and you need a fuller brush and that is just a turn off for everyone I don't want to receive anything from anyone anyone when there's that patronizing condescending thing behind it but when you know that you're doing this first and foremost for yourself that just sucks all the condescension out of you and it makes the other person ironically or paradoxically more open to receive what it is that you are sharing so step 12 having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps we tried to carry this message to alcoholics and to practice these principles in all of our affairs what a great like closer it's really an opener isn't it for the 12th step to practice these principles in all of our affairs and this is really part of the wisdom of the 12 steps recovering alcoholics have discovered that freedom from alcoholism doesn't come by applying AA principles to their drinking narrowly it's not about learning how to throw the booze out and stay out of bars and turn off the TV when the Budweiser commercials get on or use Tivo and you know those things at different stages of recovery all have their value but that's not what it's about I'm thinking that alcohol the word alcohol only appears once in the 12 steps am I right in the first step it's not an alcohol focused program recovery is about admitting our pain and our powerlessness it's about surrendering to God it's about tending our relationships taking response curbing our dog speak cleaning up the messes that we've made in our relationships it's about in other words inviting God into all of our life and wanting him in every affair of our lives it's every nook and cranny granny every nook and cranny is what it's about and here's the beauty of this for for those of us who maybe aren't struggling with alcoholism it's the same for recovering sinners it's not about applying the principles of Christianity to your sin life you know what happens often when we're newly awakened spiritually is our conscience is awakened and there are certain things about our behavior that we that start to bother us maybe that didn't before or we allow ourselves to admit that certain things about our behavior are bothering us or we realize that God who we've led into our heart is bothered by certain things and then we go into laser focus mode and we say oh I want to apply all the principles of the Bible all the principles of Christianity on the sin that I'm aware of and we start laser locking on our sin and applying the principles and praying and confessing and repenting and trusting and doing it over and over and we sometimes get so frustrated with that that we just ditch Christianity because it just it's anxious it doesn't seem to be leading into and it's like I thought it worked but it doesn't seem to be working because that's not how the way it's meant to work we're applying these principles in all of our affairs not just on this to the problem with that approach is number one usually the sin that you are focusing on is not like the number one on God's chart you know I mean if you think that you as a sinner are going especially early in your spiritual journey to have good discernment about your own sin then your first sin is pride you know I mean it's just not going to happen so whatever it is that you know often that we're like all like been out of shape about that may or may not be like number one on God's agenda and so that there's a there's a like a fatal flaw built into that that approach right from the get it's all about applying these principles in all of our affairs see spiritual boredom spiritual boredom you know what spiritual boredom is is you know whatever it is that's been a spiritual boredom is not sometimes we're spiritually bored because we've never tasted the fruit of the spirit and so that's a lot of how we start off spiritually abort but once you've tasted the fruit of the spirit once you've taken a little you know little taste of the nectar so to speak and you do different things that give you a taste of the nectar and then you wake up one day and you realize it's kind of boring to me that's a shock but everybody goes through it and it's a wonderful thing to go through because it usually it's a sign that God is moving into new areas in your life and in this sense you know I just hate it when people say God is an American but because he's not any nationality but I think we Americans have one sense of the nature of God which is this like discovery thing this like going into new frontiers kind of deal God is like the big explorer God you know what I'm saying and your life is the universe he's exploring and so that's a sign when you're spiritually bored that he he's itching to move into another area of your life and you just haven't gotten with the program quite yet and you haven't realized it or maybe you're fearful about him getting in there or maybe you just haven't given him permission yet to go into that new frontier so spiritual boredom is a great sign for us and when you're in spiritual boredom you just ask the Holy Spirit to show you what's the new frontier that you're moving me into where you want me to apply the grace of the gospel and some new area in my life some new relationships some new whatever and that's when the spiritual path really gets intriguing and fascinating and keeps your interest I mean I'm more interested in Christianity than I ever was and I thought I was pretty dug on interested when I first hooked up with this thing I mean I just thought it was fascinating I just stemmed the stern but I didn't know what I was talking about it's really interesting now and it's not just the coffee that's making it that's making it interesting I think I just completed the series so that that 12 step part of it so I want to say a few things just about in conclusion about the the 12 step deal this has been a dip into the 12 steps so my purpose has not been to inoculate us you know to this 12 steps by giving us just a little taste of it and making us think okay good yeah yeah 12 steps I heard a sermon series about that so I pretty much got that down it's a taste if your appetite hasn't been wetted then I have failed you and I apologize here are some things you can do as an individual to pursue this a little bit more as an individual first off I mean if you are facing an intractable addictive bugaboo in your life well then by all meetings get your sorry self to a meeting of some kind you know ask around maybe there is a 12 step fellowship of fellow sufferers and you want to find comfort for your suffering where do you go you go to others who have suffered and the father of compassion has comforted strengthened in them in their suffering so find those people and get yourself to a meeting AA is not a self instructional program Christianity is not a self instructional program it is a fellowship first and always especially Christianity because God is a fellowship in the Christian view he is a community the father the son and the Holy Spirit so if you think you're going to get it happening by some kind of self instructional approach the self instructional part just what's your what's your appetite so get yourself to a meeting alcohol synonymous if it's alcohol alanon is for people who are raised in a family that was influenced by alcoholism alcoholism is a disease in much the same sense I think that sin can be understood as a disease and it has like most diseases has a family impact so you may not be the alcoholic but if you grew up in a family that was touched by alcoholism you've been affected somehow by the disease of alcoholism and alanon is people who have suffered in that way and have been comforted in that way by the God of all compassion and that's where you can find some strength there's I guess narcotics anonymous there's essay for people dealing with sexual addictions of various kinds there's 12 step groups for people with eating disorders and so find yourself a meeting if your struggles don't fit any of those particular patterns for which there are meetings a couple things you can do one is find yourself a 12 step veteran and invite them out for coffee and pick their brain just ask them questions you know 12 step veterans those who've gotten sobriety from whatever they're struggling with are like treasure our treasure chests of wisdom spiritual wisdom that has been hard one that's reliable because it's worked and their life is the field test of the principal and so a great way to learn is just and I've done a lot of my learning about the 12 steps from just asking questions of people I know who are down the path in recovery and just take someone out and ask them and get them talking and if you have struggles with this all day of a surrendering to God or admitting your powerlessness the best way to discover what that's all about is to talk someone who's been through it at that level so get some get with someone and talk to them you can know the thing you can do is read this book I recommend it as wonderful spiritual reading it takes some translation because it's all focused on alcoholism but the wisdom in it it just is dynamite don't read it as a fix it manual but a way to get a feel for this path that the 12 steps is it's a charming book to read it's easy to read it's kind of a meandering storytelling garrison key lore kind of a voice to it it's not it's not challenging to read but it's it's a great spiritual book and then another one is the 12 steps and the 12 traditions this little book and it's got a it's got a ribbon in here but that doesn't mean that a is a religion but it's very close because it has a ribbon in here so I'm thinking that this is probably a good devotional book because of the ribbon so you could use this in your quiet time or or you could use it in a small group and go through the 12 steps using this as a little guide okay now I think there are maybe some church wide vineyard in arbor things that I just like to mention by way of just soliciting your prayer and your ideas your help maybe we started something called 12 steps on the Jesus path it meets after the 11 o'clock service normally it meets in that adult edroom in that corner but I think this time it's going to be next door in the in the youth room is that that right what's that one o'clock so that starts at one o'clock after the service and that's for just for anyone who's interested in the 12 steps you might be in a recovery group already and you want to explore how the 12 steps maps on to the Jesus path and or you might just be interested in is a 12 step group for me and but before going to a you know sanctioned one you want to go to one here that's that's sponsored by people in the vineyard so that's and I'm hoping that we can multiply that and maybe have one after every service the time will tell another thing that I'd like to do is get a web feature on our website have a 12 step resources page and load up all the resources that we can gather about that links and whatnot so hopefully we'll be able to get that together pretty soon and then I think for 2005 what I'd like to do is the again the first weekend of the month do a little series that I think is a compliment to this series on the return of the prodigal son the story in Luke 15 that Jesus told so powerful because the that story the return of the prodigal is these the narrative the story that is just underneath 12 steps someone on the path of the 12 steps finds their story in the return of the prodigal in Luke chapter 15 so we're going to go through that this next year 2005 I would really like to get a print of the Rembrandt painting the return of the prodigal I'd like to get a life size one that's like eight feet tall but online there are like six hundred and fifty dollars and we don't have it in our budget but if anyone like a art art person and has some extra money and then beginning pretty soon maybe is maybe even in December might have to wait till January but our next series is going to be a series on prayer on really like a step eleven series on improving our conscious contact with God because I I think the prayer is just like if you can find a place of prayer that comforts you and strengthens you every day you've got just an amazing tool that people in our world are so hungry for and yeah I'm off on my strategic thinking here so stop that okay and that that series on prayer is going to include our Phyllis tickle weekend first weekend of Lent she's going to be here speaking at all three of the weekend celebrations and she's going to she's a woman of quite deep prayer and so I'm sure that will be leaking out of her for our benefit so okay we can get the band back up here thanks by the way to Rose who led the his lead in the worship band today and a little help from her friends and do Alan Crow who take care of the the PowerPoint development for us is that Alan and Carla also working it there and Ron Howard who heads up our sound team is allowing all this all this stuff to come through the airways to our ears so thanks to Ron let's take Peter's lead and stand up and we're gonna just we're gonna have some time to worship as we as we close together and experience God as he can be through worship and also this is a time for individuals who want to respond to him in a more personal way to do so by coming forward for for some prayer and this whole area up front here is a bit available for that so if you if you want to you don't have to be like a member or you don't have to go through an orientation class of how to get prayer to do this just have to have a need you can just wander up here anytime during the the closing worship if I were you I'd get a move on as soon as we start singing though to get up here and I think there's a couple of things maybe that might be worth our attention one would be for it just anyone who's in a state of spiritual boredom right now if you found yourself resonating with that whole little thing on spiritual boredom I'd invite you to as a first step to come forward and to receive prayer for that and what what to be praying for is first just light from the Holy Spirit to reveal maybe any new frontier that he has for you and then power from the the spirit comfort maybe for any fear that you might have of God getting into that new frontier maybe just a surrender to God in that area of your life inviting him in so that kind of business I think can can be transpiring here as we as we worship together and there's just a little extra sometimes grace by coming forward and and in that act kind of admitting your need and receiving some some prayer if you don't really so much want prayer but you just want to kind of come forward and do business with God you're welcome to like you can come up and kneel here by the stage or something like that and and just the prayer ministry team just lead the kneelers alone I guess because they're just they're just doing their own personal kind of business and if someone if you're kneel and then someone comes up to you and says can we pray with you just say no thanks just just me and God right now but thanks for asking and you know and then but others who want prayer just come forward and you know be available up here wait it takes a while for people to to get to you sometimes but you can start your business with God already and and I'm thinking too if if you're in a position where you are ready you are feeling the tug to surrender your life to Jesus as your higher power as Lord in your life maybe you've surrendered to God as you understand him and God is now expanding or elaborating for you an understanding of who he is and in response to that you want to surrender not to God in any anonymous way but to God the name to God to Jesus son of the father I just invite you to come forward and to do an act of surrender to Jesus and you know you'd be welcome to tap me or is Don is Don here Don's here good if Don could come up Don Bromley our associate pastor and be available for prayer I think Don else probably out with with the youth but Donna myself for sure available for that or anyone on the ministry team would be available for that as well if you want to just do an act of of surrender and I wonder if I should do this thinking I think there are some people who have actually experienced forgiveness from the Lord on just a you know a real dark thing in your life but you might still be holding on to some shame about that thing it's possible to actually have been forgiven and then need to let go of some of your shame and the signs of the symptoms of that might be just the raw feeling of shame which is kind of like a shudder inside it might be a symptom might be just not feeling apart feeling kind of alienated or isolated from a group of people that you love that can sometimes be a symptom actually of of a shame that's kind of hanging over you might it might be either a lack of freedom to disclose when it would be helpful on the one hand or like a compulsive need to tell everybody what that was on the other that can be a symptom of of a lingering shame or just a certain getting stuck in your in your experience that God's love especially if you have a sense that there is like a almost like a cap or a ceiling in your particular case about how much love from God you are going to experience in your life or how much holiness God is going to work into your life you feel like there's just a cap and you're pretty much close to the cap already that is a symptom of someone who has been forgiven but is still holding onto a bit of the shame of whatever it is that you were forgiven of and the way out of that place of shame is it's not forgiveness because that's already happened it's faith it's faith it's daring to believe that God is better than that that the good news is better than that in your case daring to believe that and beginning to step into that daring faith you notice in the gospels Jesus often said to people after he healed them he didn't say I healed you though he did he said your faith has made you well and he especially said that to people who were dealing with a very shame based kind of issues in their life the woman with the hemorrhage and others your faith has made you well because you wanted them to go away thinking faith faith faith I got to keep daring to believe got to keep daring to believe so that that other thing wouldn't stick on them so dare to believe that the good news is better than you think it is on this particular issue so you can come forward for that as well and hon did you have something you want to share kind of sense that there was someone maybe more than one person who was asking is there a safe place for me and I believe that Jesus is offering his heart to you and you might need a little comfort in finding that safe place so if that makes any sense to you at all I'll be happy to pray with you good deal I might go to Nancy get a hug myself but anyway rose better rip. 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