FM Talk 1065 Podcasts
Fmr Secretary of State John Merrill - Jeff Poor Show - Wednesday 7-10-24
♪ Roach I roll, watch the paint right out my soul ♪ ♪ I don't want to miss her no more ♪ ♪ But I can't help it ♪ ♪ Cause I got bam on my mind ♪ ♪ Even hearing makes it cold ♪ ♪ Oh my, oh my ♪ ♪ Do my ♪ ♪ Roach I roll ♪ ♪♪♪ - Now welcome back to "The Jumpboard Show" of 4065, they should stay with us. We do appreciate it. Joyce, now a little blast from the past. Always a pleasure to bring this next gentleman on. It's been good to the show over the years. I can remember times at Huntsville, and I didn't know what the hell I was doing, and I can always count on Secretary, then Secretary of State John Merrill to come help me out here. But former Secretary of State John Merrill joins us. Secretary, how you been? - Doing great, Jeff. You're so kind, and I appreciate you giving me the opportunity to visit with you and your listeners today. - Well, tell us what you've been up to, Elia. - Well, so my term ended in January the 16th, 2023. After two terms, obviously, I can't seek another term in the office. And then that day, I started working for Wagner Engineering, which is civil engineering firm. It's based in Jackson, Mississippi, but we have 19 offices in six states, and so the Alabama offices in Birmingham. And it's a civil engineering firm, so we've been doing work in the area of water, sewer, storm water, roads, bridges, long-range planning, all the things related to civil engineering firms and how we can help communities grow. And that's our logo, is we transform communities. - Well, as soon as it's going well for you, then-- - Yes, sir, it is. - That's good to hear. That's good to hear. Well, do you ever miss it? Do you ever miss coming? - Yes, I miss the political racket. - Well, you know, I mean, I miss the people. That's what I miss. I don't miss a lot of the mess, but I miss the people. And one of the good things about my service with Wagner is it enables me to continue to travel the state. And so I've already been to 42 counties this year, so far, since January the 1st, and 257 visits to those 42 counties. So I continue to move all around Alabama and talk to people and talk about needs that they have. It's just with a different level of intentionality than before, where I might be going to a Rotary Club. - Right. - Exchange Club, Lions Club, whatever. Speaking to groups, Republican groups. And I still do some of that, but not with the same level that I did before. - You got to get to another 25, you think, for the new year? - Oh, yeah. This will be the 12th year in a row and the 13th time overall that I've done so. - Well, I'll talk about that. I mean, you know the state pretty well. - Well, it's just like coming up here. You know, I don't need a GPS to get here. - Right. - To Hinnaker, or to Sylvania, or to Fife, or to Valley Head, or to Mentone, let alone Fort Payne and Rainesville, or the other 13 municipalities in DeKalb County, because I know we're all a little more, and I know people from all over. - Well, I was going to ask you, do you have a favorite or something that would be Tuscaloosa, right? - Well, and of course, you know, that's where our home is. And that's where we still live today. And that's usually where I start my day from, but it depends. Sometimes I'll be moving around based on whatever the particular event or activity, and that particular client that we're trying to work with or that we hope to work with, and so we're trying to make sure that we're touching all of those people as well. But missing the people is the most meaningful thing, as I look at what I'm actually missing from my services secretary, but being able to expand and grow and help our company become what it needs to be is the most important thing now. - So, back to this question. Is there a place that you look forward to going to more than others? - Yeah, look, I always love coming up here. But this started from me, Jeff, and I don't know that I've ever talked to you about this before. You've heard me talk about it, because back in 2019, I spoke to the DeKalb County Breakfast, and you were at that breakfast, and that was when I was in it. (laughter) - The wife-slapping country, yeah. - That was when I was in the U.S. Senate race for about 10 minutes, and so as we were there, that made some national news, that particular event. - Sorry about that. - No, it's all right. I appreciate the exposure. But one of the things that I grew to love this area is starting in the fifth grade. When I started coming up here, going to Boy Scout Camp at Mentone Camp Comer, and that was an opportunity to be exposed and introduced to another part of the state that I wouldn't have been introduced to otherwise. So, that's why when I mentioned those municipalities earlier, I know all those municipalities, as well as Fife. I mean, I can name all of them because I have friends there, and I have spent a lot of time up here. This is a special place for Cindy and me that we love to come, going to Little River Canyon, having picnics down in the canyon there at Little River, visiting with our friends, Randy and Kelly Owen, visiting with a lot of the friends that were here today, just having an opportunity to come up here means a lot to us. - Well, this is funny, though. I mean, like, I think about, like, where you show up around the state, and, you know, as a guy who covers the state, we're like a statewide website. 1890 now. I mean, I think we're of our past cross to one night nose arc down to our grass. - That's right. - You see on the back porch in Alexander City from time to time. - That's right. - I see a mobile. You showed up at a mekrek meeting or two there. - Well, Cindy, I only meet four times a year. - A year. - You don't make one. - Yeah. - If you miss one, you missed a quarter. - You missed a quarter. - Fair enough. - The shoals. - That's right. - You know, over the years, we're our past across, but, like, I'm gonna tell you, you don't see a lot of that. I mean, Governor Ainsworth, we'll take Governor Ainsworth, yes, but, like, go into these events. There's not people that really know every nook and cranny like that. Little Wiregrass Republican Club, I think, at the time. - Right. - I mean, like, all these different places that we've been over the years. - That's right. And, look, that's really what I'm known for, Jeff, and you know that because people look at me, and, of course, I had the #All67, which means going to all 67 counties, but there's nobody now that Shelby's out of office that does what I do, and now I still am doing it because of my work, and that's one of the things I'm very excited about, is my work enabling me continue to be able to visit with people, all 5 million of our people, and all 67 counties, the 464 municipalities in our state. They're all very important, and we need to make sure that we're giving attention to all of them. - Well, let me ask you this. I think you went to University of Alabama, and you have a background in this state. It took me 20 years to figure this state out, and once you figure it out, let's tell Lieutenant Governor Ainsworth and Speaker Ledbetter, once you figure it out, it all makes sense if it's together like a jigsaw puzzle, but what was that learning curve like for you? 'Cause you seem to have a pretty good grasp of it. When did you start kind of putting things together and understanding how Alabama politics functions? - Well, I think one of the things is different from me than a lot of people is that I was born into it with my dad being Circuit Clerk of my county. He got elected in 1964. I was just not even a year old, and so I've been around it my whole life growing up in the courthouse there, going to the Capitol, going to the judicial building in Montgomery, having connections with people like that, having your phone ringing at your house when you're seven years old, and it's George Wallace calling to speak to your dad, and he's the Governor of the State of Alabama, having that kind of opportunity to grow up into that, and then having the privilege of service for as a student by the University of Alabama, knowing the people that were in those roles before, it has really just meant a lot to me. It's been more of an absorption through osmosis than it has been me dedicating myself to trying to learn these things. Well, I mean, do you think you're surprised? I mean, I guess they surprise us all the time, but like, you know, you look at the state, you think you know how something's going to go, but you just know it and it doesn't turn out that way. Like, do you ever, like, do you feel like you pretty much know how things are going to go before they start? No, I mean, it's different based on what races are, what the issues are, things change, based on what the politics are at that particular time, but one of the things that you can always rest assured on about the state of Alabama is you can never accurately predict what's actually going to occur, and when people think they've got it figured out, they realize they don't. And you look back at the last, let's say, 40 years, the biggest surprises in Alabama politics to be, and I don't see what you think of this, had to be 86 or Guy Hunt. Okay. I think the 2010 cycle, we kind of saw it coming with the Tea Party wave, but like, you put everything else into that, Bentley beating Bradley Byrne and the takeover of the legislature later that year. That's right. And those two stick out of my mind, and probably I throw in 17, but like, that was just a rear December special election and the weird allegations that were way more. But those events are the ones that really stick out of my mind. That didn't really turn out the way I would have thought it would. No, but in each instance, when you go back and review what occurred and why it occurred, you can understand why it happened just the way it did. The people who really have a handle on that, people like a professor I had at the University of Alabama named Bill Bernard, people like a friend of mine who was a professor at the University of Alabama, Dr. Bill Stewart, people that have an understanding of Alabama politics, Dr. Wayne Flynn at Auburn University, people that I'm close to, that I have invested time and energy in, can help see these things coming, because they've been an observer of Alabama politics for a long period of time. And what you have seen in many instances is a cyclical time of involving certain type personalities or certain type people on certain type roles. For example, the Bentley election was not unlike the five James election back in 1978 when he won the first time. Nor was it unlike the election when Jim Folsom won in 1946, the first time. When you see those elections occur, there's a reason that they occur. And so if you look at it and you study it, there's reasons that these things happen the way that they do. Because there's a conventional wisdom out there that we sometimes feel captive to, that didn't like, in retrospect, well, we were wrong all along, right? And it's like you were saying, there's some people that, well, no, you go back 46, yeah, especially, you know, the surprises. You have these, I guess it's like these populist times in Alabama were things. Absolutely. Do you think we're due another one of those any time soon? I think we could see one happen in 2026. Really? You know, that's the thing that you don't ever know, and that's what makes Alabama special and unique and different from other southern states. One of the things that has happened traditionally in our state is when a person, like in the gubernatorial primary, if a person led the primary, typically that person wins the runoff. That's just the way that it always has occurred in almost every major statewide office. Whereas in Georgia, for example, if you finish second, that person typically comes back and wins in the runoff. That has happened traditionally. So, having an understanding, and all that goes back to V.O. Key's book, Southern Politics and State Nation, from 1946. If you have an understanding of the things that happened a long time ago, 50, 75, 100 years ago, our people are basically the same as they were then, except for the folks that have moved in here. That's where some of the changes have occurred. You just have to be cognizant of those changes and see how they'll impact the area that you're actually looking at or thinking about at that time. Well, last question, and we'll get you out of here on this, and not necessarily from a policy standpoint. Since we're talking in these historical terms, my entire life, we've been talking about gambling in the state. You know, kind of watching it. Do you see the curve bending toward that? Eventually, it's just going to happen. Well, you want to think that that's probably what will happen politically based on the slow transition that we've witnessed, and I think the most significant event is the embracing of the Porch Creek Indians and what they've been able to do in the three locations that they have, where gaming is permitted based on federal law. And you know that there are many illegal operations that are currently ongoing in many counties around the state of Alabama, and you would want to think that if it's introduced as a lottery in its purest form, or even with some modified gaming legislation that allows certain things to occur, that the people will probably be more inclined to embrace it than they would otherwise. But it's not unlike the wet driveway forendums that used to happen in the state from time to time. And if you remember Jeff in your studies, when they first started making it where, okay, it had to be the entire county vote for it, in order for it to occur. And you had all these dry counties, you had all these wet counties. Then they went to a 50,000 person threshold. Then they went down to 10,000. Now it's 1,000. And so if you've got 1,000 people in that municipality, they can vote to go wet inside a dry county. And yet you don't see much of that now, because all the counties pretty much are wet. But you still see it in Coleman and in other places. - Well then it kinda creates you. - What do you go to Coleman? And the Coleman that I grew up with, and I'm sure that you grew up with, and I was talking to somebody about this last night, like these places, you kinda had this, like, pretty seem no shit about the people there. But now Coleman, Alabama, for example, totally different place. Completely different place to what it was even 20 years ago. - Absolutely. And not just Coleman, but other parks in the state as well. And that's where you start to see the transitions introduced and occur that cause Alabama to be just another state instead of Alabama. - It's very dynamic. - Absolutely, 100%. - Well, we'll get you out of here, but thanks for stopping by. - So be a stranger, next time you're down to Baldwin County, by the way, let us know. - So good to see you always. - Former Secretary of State John Merrill, we gotta get a break here, we'll be right back. (upbeat music) ♪ By the man she knew his cowboy ♪ ♪ Was a late night band addiction ♪ ♪ At the y'all come back salute ♪ ♪ She played for Pambourine ♪ ♪ With a silver jingle ♪ ♪ And she must have known the words ♪ ♪ To release date million too ♪