- Welcome back our two, the Fan Morning Show, Matt Marchegiani, Danieli, Francescio, with you here, sports net 5-9 to the fan, okay? So we talked a little bit about, well, we talked a lot about the year old before the break, but you had a gripe about England because I rambled on and we didn't have enough time to talk, I was talking about here at Southgate and I didn't, we didn't have time for your break. - We both rambled and then we, because we went along in the Blue Jays anyway. Okay, yeah, all right. - Let's go, let's get to your gripe and then we'll talk about Canada. - Let's do the England thing. - It's a PSA more so than anything else. - Okay. - And it's got a, it's, this is all about, you know, the, the parallels between England and the Toronto Maple Leafs. So I think you, and we've openly discussed to you and I have, I think we mentioned this last week where we said, hey, England is the equivalent of the Toronto Maple Leafs, the Toronto Maple Leafs are the equivalent of England. Now, I, generally speaking, I agree with that sentiment all the way in this respect in terms of scrutiny, coverage, pressure, and obviously the historical results are failing to win a title. It's all very apt and it's like the most, like being a, it really is. And I think James Sherman alluded to this when we had a conversation with him, you and I, where he, he mentioned, I've watched England play through the entire tournament and I've not enjoyed a single second. That's almost what it feels like to watch the Leafs at times, right? So the parallels are there. It exists. I get it. This is where I, I, I think that comparison now starts and has lost. It loses water. England has at least been to three made, I said, sorry, two major finals and a semi-final of a World Cup. Back-to-back Euro finals, semi-finals of the most recent World Cup. They've been in big spots. They've won elimination games and knock out stage games. I, I just, I had to address this because I saw the discourse yesterday on social media. There are a few things that irritate me. This irritated me. Part of the reason is because I have a friend of mine who is an English supporter and he also is a Toronto Maple Leafs fan. And I don't know how he lucked out and was born into that fandom. It's like being a, it's like being a Bills fan and a Leaf fan at the same time. It's very similar. Yeah. But I, and I, and I feel, I feel for him, right? And yesterday he was like more, it wasn't even a gutted feeling. He was just empty because it's the second one in a row that they lost. It's more of the same. Right? It is. But, but again, there is still always, as we say, though, it's the hope that kills you. Right? There's, but they've accomplished frankly so much more than the Toronto Maple Leafs have tasted in the last 60 years. They really have. Yeah. So to, for us here in this city, it's convenient to point at them and laugh and say, oh man, ha ha ha, we can relate. Look at the Leafs. They've at least one games that are meaningful and have made it to the doorstep of winning trophies. That is a completely different position than the Toronto Maple Leafs in terms of pure performance, production and results. There is no comparison there. Is there anything else surrounding the teams? Absolutely. 100%. There are parallels beyond measure, but when it comes to pure results, stop it. Look at what they've done. They've played for two straight Euro championships in the final. They have made it to the semi-final of the World Cup. The Leafs haven't made it out of the second round. It's a completely different dialogue altogether in terms of results and to put them on level pegging on that same plane in terms of disappointment in results, purely results, is foolish. It is foolish. It really is. And I saw, I saw somebody suggest that, oh, I had, we had to be cheering against, because we couldn't have, we couldn't be the only ones on, or we had to make sure we had company on Misery Island. Give me a break. They played for a trophy yesterday. Only one team can win the trophy. And as Brian Burke used to say, last I checked, they only hand out one Stanley Cup every year. Come on. If you won rounds, you went deep in the playoffs, by all means. Then the comparisons in terms of results, they're always that team that's just knocking on the door, but can't break through. They can't find a way to break down that barrier, right? The Leafs can't even get to the door. That's my point. England's there. England, at least, is there. The Leafs are waiting in line to get in through the door, but they can't get in. There was a good segue there to the Copa America in the final, but we're going to get to that after. So Canada falls to Uruguay for three on penalties. It was 2-2. It was, it really was an entertaining game on Saturday night. To the point where I say good on Canada, and I know, I know it's disappointing to lose that game because of the way that it almost ended. Jonathan David comes on, you know, he opened the scoring for this team. He could have closed the scoring for this team, and it ends up, it goes to penalties. Louis Suarez, I mean, he's that close. He's not missing twice. Like he's just not. I know how much you hate. He's a, he's a, he's a finisher man. And as a Liverpool fan, I got to watch a lot of great things from Louis Suarez. You rooted for that guy, even after he bit one of our own. That was really tough. That was a really hard, it was very hard for me to deal with that. God, he's a biter. Ten years ago, takes a bite out of Georgia O'Killini. Yeah. Formative moment in my childhood. Ten years later, he takes a bite out of Canada when they're trying to accomplish something that they've never done before. It's true. Everything comes full circle. Yeah, it really does. Yeah. But he's not missing that. No, he's really not. But here's what I, here's what I do want to point out, given the opponent, because that was as strong of a lineup as you're ago, I was going to dress. It really was. That was almost their starting 11, aside from, I think, one or maybe two guys. Jesse Marsh goes with a completely different lineup. We saw Luke Defu's Jules play center back and plays a Derek Cornelius. We saw Tani Oley-Wassay start up front. We saw Ali Ahmed in there, Matthew Chuanier, like there was a lot of changes to that roster. And the fact that they even got it to penalties was a real testament to how this team has grown under Jesse Marsh. Jesse Marsh gathering the team following the loss and speaking to them, saying you should be bleeping proud to be Canadian and be a part of this team. That hit me right in the feels. That is one of the first times that we can say, first time in a long time anyway, that we can say you are proud to be a Canadian soccer fan. My biggest takeaways from this tournament for Canada is they are ready to compete, but they're not ready to win, which is entirely fine. It also changes the perception of Canadian soccer around the world. Given that, and it was mentioned, I believe on the broadcast, you're going to get better friendlies. The competition that you are going to get is better. How other organizations perceive you is going to change. All of these things matter in the grand scheme of things. You and I talked about the importance last week of getting dual nationals. It's not just about Canada being the second choice now, or the third choice because the other teams are too deep or whatever. Now you are going to get players that look and say, I want to be there. That is different. The want to be a part of this organization is so much different than, well, I guess I'll play there because that happened for a long time. And I think that we are past that. The other point of emphasis here is for dual nationals for whoever, there's a couple of things. Stylistically, they're very enjoyable to watch. It's also probably very enjoyable to play for Jesse Marsh. One, because he is a very big personality it feels like. He's like Jurgen Klopp light is how like he doesn't mince words in post games and we're going to hear from him about the Copa America in just a little bit. But also, I look at this tournament and I look at how this team performed to me between the World Cup and this Copa America. These are seminal moments for this program in that there is a group of young players that are watching this and saying, I can be that one day and we're not going to see the fruits of that labor in two years. But what we are going to see is sustainability in the program because those kids saw and believed and those kids wanted to be a part of the Canadian men's national team because of what these gentlemen have done in this tournament. What Jesse Marsh has done in a short period of time. Which only leads you to believe that growth is coming. It's on the horizon. That's why this tournament was so important. That's why it was so impressive. And honestly, I'm saying this again, giving my, I'm getting chills right now thinking about it. The future is so bright here. Canada is going to be competitive and maybe one day ready to win a major tournament. Well said, Patty, I had goosebumps while you were talking there. That's exactly what I was going for. Well done. That was well said. Saturday was Jesse Marsh's 60 second day on the job. Pretty good. 62 days in the span of just over two months time. He went from taking a team that was kind of in a bit of a holding pattern. There was a lot of uncertainty surrounding it. Still hope and optimism because of course there is talent there. And we're all aware of that after what we saw leading into the World Cup in 2022. But in this two month span, he's helped elevate young players. He's completely reshaped their defensive structure and posture as a team. The attitude, the identity and culture of the team has sort of been somewhat reestablished but tinkered in a way with his own unique flavor to it. And he's really ushered us into a period here where there is now a renewed sense of hope and optimism, maybe even heightened than what we saw even two years ago when they played in the World Cup for the first time in more than three decades. That is wildly impressive for somebody that's been on the job in two months. And Saturday, I honestly thought, A, they deserve the result, that they deserve the victory. They were the better team for that, for the majority of that game. They generated better chances. They just suffered. As you put it, I think it was a wonderful, wonderful summary of it all. There, they've learned how to compete. They've proved that they belong, but they aren't ready to go and win yet. And that's okay. I think the important thing for everybody to remember is we're context is key, just to reinforce your point. We need to remember that the benefits of what we're seeing now, the fruits of the labor, we might not fully see that materialized for quite some time. It's going to take time, but it's there. There are young players who are coming through the pipeline that are now going to be fully, fully immersed and passionate about playing for Canada. That is something we haven't seen before. And look at the starting 11 on Saturday, man, just the youth, you alluded to all the various fresh faces we saw in there. Ten of their starters were under the age of 30, the only exception was Jonathan Asorio. Eight of their 11 starters were 25 years old or younger. The average age of their starting lineup was 24.8. For comparison, Uruguay, who's a relatively young team too, like Louis Suarez comes off the bench. So their starting 11 is pretty youthful. They have a lot of guys with experience and pedigree, but they're all in there early to mid-20s for the most part. The average starting age, 25.8. Canada's young. There are a lot of really fun, exciting young players on this roster. And you can hope, you can dream on what this team could be. They have the structure. They have now, hopefully, the infrastructure behind them. And you have a coach that is clearly, as we've seen, he literally left Saturday, leaves Carolina after that match. He's in Hamilton yesterday. Like, he's invested in trying to learn about what the developmental pathway looks like in this country, how to refine it, how to improve it. And that's massive for what the future of this team looks like, both long-term and in the interim here as they have an eye towards a 2026 World Cup that will be on home soil, which is a terrific thing to say. And the fact we can normalize seeing them play against teams like Uruguay, like Argentina, teams that have tradition, history when it comes to soccer, and many stars that they bear, that is the biggest testament to the growth of the country. Like we flipped on that game on Saturday and you're like, oh, well, that's Luis Suarez. Oh, that's Darwin Nunez. And we're just kind of like, it feels like almost we're immune to it. We're used to it at this point. Ten years ago, we would have just been happy to share the same pitch with those guys. And so we've come a long way, there's still more growth than needs to happen. But man, that was a lot of fun throughout this tournament. Saturday was a great cap. It's unfortunate they couldn't get the victory, but yeah, future looks bright, man. They were there like that. That's the best part about all this because they could have gone up against Argentina and got rinsed. They didn't. They didn't twice twice. They could have gone up against to Uruguay and got rinsed in a game where, like you mentioned, it was not the same starting 11, right? Like that's, you know, significant. That's significant. All the top guys were not in the game for the first 60 minutes. So the point, the point with all of this is, is that it is getting better. I think the other thing too is it's such a weird thing, but I believe that Jesse Marsh going out of his way to talk about not wanting the US job means something. And the reason why I say that is, is that we have the clip guys, okay, so let's listen to this and then I'll go on my little diatribe here. Here's Jesse Marsh talking about the US job. >> Can we play the United States and Kansas City in the fall? Which sideline will you be on? >> Come on, man. I'm not leaving this job. I have no interest in the US job. And to be fair, unless there's a big shift in the organization, I don't think that I'll ever have interest in that job in the future. So I'm really happy here. I couldn't be happier actually in terms of what it's like to work with the leaders in this organization and what it's like to work with this team. >> For him to go out of his way to say this, is so important because it's almost as if, because we have this, you know, the inferiority complex that we do in this country, especially as it comes to soccer. As soon as there's any sort of success among the head coach, and there hasn't been a lot, but I can look to John Hurdman. John Hurdman had success and automatically it was who wants John Hurdman, because Canada is not good enough for John Hurdman. It turns out it wasn't, TFC was the answer. I don't think he feels the same way about it. But I think it's important for Jesse Marsh to come out and say that and speak so low of the American job right now, because the one thing that the American job has that the Canadian one doesn't is money. >> Yes. >> But if you look at the two programs and their trajectories right now, that US program, and I'm not saying this because I'm Canadian, I'm saying as an observer, it looks like that team has stalled. >> Yeah. >> Even with some high end talent that is playing on big teams in Europe, you talk about Polisich, who was fantastic in the tournament for the US, no takeaway, McKinney hasn't really performed at that level. I know Sergio Niodes was hurt, but there are guys on that team that are on big clubs that aren't performing. It really does feel like they are, maybe it's the, and I don't even want to say that it's the manager because they go through them like you change your underwear. It seems like every six to eight months, there's a new American manager. >> Well, it's funny because they were unusually loyal to a burr halter. >> Yeah. >> Okay, so I think it's important that you referenced this and we discussed it. I mean, he was asked explicitly, hey, essentially, would you ever have interest in this job? I think it was the right thing clearly to say no, but I do think there's a level of bitterness there because he's all historically, Maddie and somebody that's, he's coached in the Premier League before this was a big storyline going into that game on Saturday. He was obviously former manager of Leeds United as was Marcelo Biosa, who was the Uruguayan coach. He was the former manager at Leeds. >> That guy looks like he hacks a lot. >> My gosh, does he not look like a, he is the embodiment, the pure embodiment of a South American soccer manager? >> Yeah. >> Like that is it. You have to paint a picture. You'd be like, just look right there. He literally was just missing a cigarette on the sideline and you're like, yeah, that's the guy. >> Yeah. They're like, oh, no, his staple is when he sits on the cooler. I'm like, this is great. Love this guy. >> He's a Sunday league manager. >> I love him. But back to the point, I think there is a level of bitterness when it comes to Jesse Martian, the United States job, a little bit because he's been openly critical and prior to getting back into managing and joining Canada, he'd done some like TV work and he's been very, very critical in his assessment of how the United States soccer program has performed. The job that was done by Greg Berhalter. And clearly there is, as an American, I'm sure he feels like, hey, if there's anybody that is best fit to lead our country in this role, I'm the guy. Look at me. Why am I being passed over? So there is, I think, a natural bitterness that happens everywhere. It's the same thing, you know, I see it all the time in basketball that is part for the course. We're all human, we don't want to be wanted. There are emotions involved. So I think that's where some of that commentary stems from. But I do think, genuinely, he's happy where he is. And I think it does show, and clearly it helps reinforce that Canada is, you know, potentially surpassed the United States in terms of the concacaf cycle where they rank and how it's perceived around the world. I think the great question would be, and this is just purely hypothetical, but a great question would be, if you had to pick, if you were picking any teams, like, not, sorry, not any team, if you had to pick between the United States and Canada, just purely on town, which one are you choosing? I think that's a tougher question. It's certainly a tougher question now. Because if we include the infrastructure and everything, I think the US job is miles better. Now, having said that, though, and the conversation is going to change in the short term here, is the pressure on that US job. Because again, they've stayed stagnant. Yeah, they haven't seen substantial growth from them. They're also one of the most overrated teams in world soccer. Let's be real. They're very talented. But they don't win? Yes, but they're like a top 12 FIFA ranked team, but they're not as good as those other teams. Totally fair. But now, this is where, how will somebody with a fresh set of eyes and a different approach maybe help that group? Like it felt like Greg Berhalter had no hold on that team. There was a clear, it was very divisive. There was, it just, it felt off. Like I watched some of their games in this tournament specifically, and they just didn't have the continuity. You visibly watching them, you felt like there was something missing from that group. So I am curious how a new coach is going to impact them. We've seen how it's benefited Canada, sure. So how is it going to potentially impact the United States? Of course provided, it's the right hire. That's the key. Make the right hire. Here are the teams that are behind. And again, the FIFA world rankings are not to be all and all. I get it, but my point is this, of the teams that are behind them in the FIFA world ranking, let's go to 20. Okay. So they're 11th. Here's the teams that are behind them. Morocco. Morocco is better. Okay. All right, sure. I'll give you that one. I don't know. Columbia. Yeah. Columbia is better. Mexico. No. Coin flip. No, I would probably go the United States. I don't think Mexico is very good either. Germany. Yes. Japan was Germany that way. Yeah, I know. They've been so poor. The rankings are flawed. They've been so poor internationally though. Japan don't know enough about them. Canada played them tough. Canada beat them actually and are friendly. Senegal. Okay. Coin flip, sure. Sure. Switzerland. I really. Switzerland has got some players. So they're better. And then Iran is the other one and I don't know enough about Iran to make a comment on it. But the point is, is that of the teams that are behind them, they're not tangibly better. And in a lot of cases, they're not better at all. Yeah. So that's where that's where my, you know, that's where my point of emphasis lies. I'm not certain that it's the, it's the be all end all of jobs. Even for an American born coach, I don't know that that's the answer. They went out and tried to get your in clop and clop even looked at it like, no, I still need a break. That's not that's not the job. I mean, I could understand it from your clops perspective to be also also as a as a Liverpool fan. That would be disheartening. I don't know that I could ever forgive your September rolled around. And then it's Canada, US and that friendly. And there's you're in clop. No, I can't. On the touch line. No, I can't do that. I would really struggle with that. Okay. We talked about Jesse Marsh and comments about the Copa America. And how it was run. Here's Jesse Marsh talking about the tournament. For me, this tournament has not been professional for me. There's too many gaps in the way in the treatment in the the overall experience from a day to day perspective. We've had our players be head-butted. We've had racial slurs thrown at our players live and through social media and not just the situation with noise, but the entire tournament from opponents fan bases and from from whether it's live or in social media. We've been treated like second-class citizens. And in the entire time, I've challenged our team to stay disciplined and stay focused on our task at hand and to make sure that we represent ourselves and our country. Because in the end, that's what this is. This is about representing your nation, your nation. You're on the national team and our players have held themselves to the highest level of integrity. There was one fan base that was not representing their country very well yesterday. That would be, I'm not even talking about the game prior to the Copa America final at Hard Rock Stadium. That was, for my money, one of the most disgusting things that I've ever seen from supporters. Now, I understand people like, well, South American soccer sport, no, at some point you have to be a human being. Showing up to a stadium without a ticket, breaking down barriers, putting, you know what, adults? Like, okay, whatever, putting children's lives at risk because you are a moron. You should go to jail. Climbing through vents to try and get into a soccer match that you do not have a ticket for is disgusting. Ridiculous. Breaking down an escalator at a stadium. Oh my goodness. Like, how do you do that without weapons? Like, what kind of a monster are you? Like this whole thing. And I know people will be like, oh, well, I don't know how Miami is going to have a World Cup match. That's not the city of Miami. As you eloquently pointed out on Twitter yesterday, Miami has hosted Super Bowls before. They've never hosted South American soccer matches like this. But they have hosted Super Bowls. So that is not on the city of Miami. It is not on the on Hard Rock Stadium. It's not frankly, it's not on US soccer. Who is the organizing committee of all this? The group that oversees this. Comable disaster that their security was worse than they're officiating on the pitch. And that was bad. Yeah. The first thing reeks to me of like Jesse Mars said in that clip, because this is why we played it unprofessional. This is this is the first time that I have watched the Copa America with the with eyes like I have, because Canada was in it. This tournament was a disaster. It was an absolute disaster. And then, you know, we had we had bad fields. We had the we had issues with officiating. You had a brawl in the stands with a certain fan base that was attacking another fan base, which was also involved in yesterday's debacle. All of this is just a bad look. And again, I know I'll be the first one to criticize the United States for whatever. But they are the the the American people, the whatever was in place at Hard Rock Stadium, that is not on them. That is on the group that oversees it. The security was a joke yesterday. That was one of the most disgusting things that I've ever seen. Yeah, yesterday was a black eye for like it was hard to watch some of those videos. I mean, honestly, it was challenging to even settle in and watch the the start of that game. I was even as they're they're showing visuals of the stadium, you know, the anthems and I'm looking and and I just had a sick feeling in my stomach as I as I looked at just sort of the crowd. And for a couple of reasons, one is what transpired obviously before the game. But even if you look at how the crowd assembled in that stadium, it was over capacity. It was it was overcrowded. There were cops going down and kicking people out. They didn't have tickets. It looked insanely dangerous because obviously security had no control over the entire situation and what transpired. People that were, you know, not ticketed that were sitting in seats that didn't belong to them. And they wouldn't move. Security screenings, because of course everybody just burst through the gates and decided to, you know, just just make it a complete frenzy and it was all chaos. I mean, it was it was embarrassing. It was a black eye for the sport, a black eye for the tournament. And I'm I'm with you like that city Miami has hosted 11 Super Bowls that stadium, hard rock stadium has hosted six Super Bowls. And again, it's like, oh, people will say, well, it's it's American sport versus South American or or international soccer, different animal altogether. They need to better prepare. Honestly, not really. Like I think this falls Super Bowls pretty big last time I checked last time I checked. Last I checked. That was a pretty marquee event. I think it falls on comable. I think it's a massive indictment of them. It's to cherry on top of all the issues that you outlined. I made the point last week in watching Canada's gaming in Argentina where I was like, how were they pulling on this pitch? Oh, it was awful. Which it was brutal was brutal, absolutely insulting to the teams, to the fans, to the product itself. Now NFL players would tell you they'd rather play on that. Yeah, I know. Then what they normally have the MetLife monster and and and this is where FIFA is going to be doing some serious inventory in determining a even like in MetLife's case is MetLife fit to host the World Cup final. That is the that's a that's a real question. That's a very good point. Look at that field. If that's the quality of pitch you're getting for a World Cup final, forget it man, forget it. You got to fix that. So that, but here's the big difference people are like, Oh my God, Miami, which is one of the stadiums that Hard Rock is one of the venues that is going to host World Cup games in two years. Wow, this is they they got to fix it. They got to reconsider. No, they don't have to reconsider. You know what they need to do? FIFA is going to step in and they're going to adequately do set this up correctly because as much as we think and we know FIFA's corrupt and there's a lot that goes on there behind the scenes that isn't great. They do know how to stage a tournament, the European championships, UEFA, they know how to stage a proper tournament. They've done it. They do it all the time. So I'm not concerned about what it means for the future. I just think unfortunately it has left a black eye on what this tournament is. It's left a black eye on the United States and them being one of the three host nations for the World Cup in 2026. It was just a really, really sour wake and a tournament because nobody cared about frankly the result after like last night. Yeah. Did anybody really care what ended the score and I went to bed and the game sucked. Did anybody care? No. No, we're all senior today. Everybody's going to talk about how this melee occurred because people just didn't have the wherewithal to be patient, to be courteous for one another. And they wanted to be they wanted to find a way to force themselves into a stadium even though they weren't ticketed and and deprive other people of having that experience that deserved it that decide I'm going to show out a bunch of money because I really want to experience this moment and have this moment. And those people were deprived of that. It was just a complete joke and people it's just like it really makes you think about humanity honestly in a bigger way. But that's for a different show and a different conversation because I'm not I'm not a philosopher. So I'm not going down that route. But it really does it makes you think about how like the world do not care for the common part in a decent way be a decent human being. No, the world sucks now. The fact that like I was showing my wife the video and again things do change when you're up things change when you're a parent. But at the same time if you have any modicum of humanity left in you, you can watch these videos and get queasy seeing these children who are, you know, looking like they are in distress because there are adults who are morons around them coming to a stadium without a ticket saying, I'm just going to get in. Yeah. What logic is that arrest them? And they are never allowed into a sporting event in North America again period. Their pictures are pasted all over the place. You can't go to sporting events anymore because you're a jackass. That's it. That's the crux of all of this. That is that is there are people that are just bad human beings. We see it every day now. And unfortunately, in the realm in which you and I both conduct our business, which is sports. Yeah. Unfortunately, sports brings out the worst in a lot of people as well. Yeah. That's that is part and parcel. And it's something that it feels like it's gotten progressively worse because everybody's a hero, but people are progressively getting dumber society as a whole is getting dumber. And these people were the they were the embodiment of that yesterday. Yeah. That's the last thing behavior, soccer does that as well, but I feel like yesterday was next level. Okay. We got to take a break. When we come back, we're going to tee up our Jay's text question. One more time, we're going to talk about the home run derby because this year, a little bit different format. I think I like it better, but we'll talk about that when we come back. It is the fan morning show sports at five nine in the fan Matt Marquesi Danieli Franceski with you here. You're listening right here on sports at five nine in the fan. Covering the blue J's from an analytical perspective, Jay's talk plus with Blake Murphy. Be sure to subscribe and download Jay's talk on Apple Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Say hey and welcome back. It's a fan morning show. Matt Marquesi Danieli Franceski with you here. So we asked the question at the top of the show, we're going to ask it one more time and probably multiple times text 59590 name and your location. What was your biggest takeaway from this team from the unofficial first half of the season? The blue J's that is 59590 name and location, standard messaging and data rates apply. You and I talked about this. It's, I think the one thing that we can say that we both agree on here is the inconsistencies within the within the team, but also the inconsistencies within the organization, whether that be the, you know, the message compared to the reality on the field. I think that's a big thing. Like the message is we want to be competitive, but the reality is is that you're not even close and can't blame injuries. We can't blame, you know, I mean, God, like the injuries is the one thing that you can't blame. The players on the field, yeah, can we even blame regression, like, is that even a logical reasonable excuse to make? You know, that's something else. Everybody wants to, well, you know, this guy has underperformed and isn't doing what he's previously done. Okay. Realistically, with the exception of Boba shed, because clearly there's an expectation in that bow, maybe it's not in a Jay's uniform, but at some point, Bo's going to go back to being bow. And he's, he's just naturally a really good baseball player and a good hitter. Besides him, who can we point to and say, you know what, based on what our expectations were for that player, player X is underperformed? Even with the majority of the roster, no, I don't think, but can we can't point to players and say, like, even Springer, who's had a bad year and has been much better recently, if we can we actually legitimately point out George Springer and say his performance in reality has been so vastly inferior to what we anticipated of his performance? Like I don't, I don't know, Kirk, like, he's been bad. He's been so bad on time, though, now, I know, but this is like next level right now. The Springer thing, I just don't want to get clouded by, you know, the last couple of weeks because he's been great the last couple of weeks before that he was dreadful. Yes. Like you can't play him dreadful. Kevin Kimer. I didn't have any expectations for, but he's been awful at the plate. Dalton Varshall started out great. He's been awful at the plate. I think so, but what if that's the one that stands out the most? Well, and that's, but that's what I'm driving at. Your point is the one that is well made is maybe this is just who they are. And for a lot of these guys, it's kind of what they've been their entire career. Correct. And that is where the messaging from the front office as to what is happening on the field are two entirely different things. Yes. We believe in this. We believe in that. We're going to be fine. We're going to be good. We expect to contend blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You stink. The Jay's record at 44 and 52 is the fourth worst at the all star break since 2004. In the last 20 years, this is the fourth worst record they've had at the all star break. And there's been some bad teams in there, some really poor teams, yeah. So 2018, 2019 was really lean to where they, this front office had the luxury of tearing it down a little bit and trying to replenish the system, which never worked by the way. But yeah, that's, that says something 20 years span. That says something. Here's, here's a text from Brian in Toronto, April 4th, I said 82 wins for this team can't really use injuries as an excuse for the current record. Manoa Garcia Romano. It's a case of Atkins having built no farm system for which he blamed his predecessor. He's had ample time. It's a disaster. So much under performance Guerrero ground balls singles doubles hitter. Now this team looking at perhaps three to five seasons of losses in the 100 range and then crowds in the 10 to 15 K range that I, I'll quibble with that a little bit. I don't think we're getting back to that. Yeah, I don't think so. Also because the stadium, the way that they have built it has become more of a place to be rather than just, yeah, it's more of a destination than it is just a, you're just going to watch a baseball. Yeah. Yeah. There's more that's going on. The social gathering event, even if the product isn't the greatest, yeah, but the other points are very well made. I don't even know about the hundred losses. Like I don't think they're going to get there. But the other stuff, yeah, they've had ample time to redo this farm system. Yeah. They kind of redid it and then they blew it all up again. Kudos to Brian. I think 82, I mean, 82 wins. He was on the right track clearly in terms of the regression that was going to happen for this team in the win loss category. I mean, it goes without saying they've dealt with injuries. Everybody's aware of that. But you know, again, I keep circling back to the point of, well, you know, I think you have to be realistic coming in and the folks that were realistic with the expectations for this club probably don't, aren't terribly shocked by what we're seeing, right? Like this was fully within the range of outcomes. I think if you were being extremely optimistic, even if you were on the heavily optimistic side of things heading into the season, your best projection could have been for them to be the exact same, in the same position they were last year, which is a third place wild card team. That's what I thought they were going to be in the nine games. That's essentially, that's kind of what you were hoping for. But even that, that, that mindset and that goal, to me, that's even that is just, we're so why are we settling as an, as fans as an organization, why are you settling to just get in to be a third place, to be the third wild card? Like I think you got to shoot bigger and it goes back to what really is the ultimate goal in sports is the goal, the goal, if you're not chasing a championship, mind you, again, there's a process that it takes to get there. That is part and parcel, what every season is going to help you build up to. But your goal should be to build a championship winning team. And if you're not striving for that, if we're just striving to be relevant, striving to be a fringe playoff team, then what are you doing? You've already lost before you even started. You were already behind the eight ball because your mindset and your thought process is wrong. It should be geared towards how do we build a team that is going to be sustainably successful, but ultimately the primary goal is how do we build a championship team? That is your objective. And if you're not striving for that, you're doing it wrong. You are doing it wrong. And right now it feels like because they've failed on that process initially, that it's been nine years since this front office, this group has come into power. Now it feels like their pivot point is, well, we're in self-preservation mode and our focus is staying relevant and keeping the team above 500 and keeping them on the periphery of the playoff mix, just so it looks better, just so the optics of it look better. And again, to me, that's the wrong approach. And I feel like you're setting yourself up for failure. You're setting yourself, you're putting, you're really taking steps backwards by doing that. The sooner you confront what the actual problems are and what issues need to be corrected, the sooner your team will be in a better position to actually chase something meaningful. That's why I know they're not going to do this, they're not going to trade off assets with more control, but the longer you put off those decisions, the less you're going to get to. >> There you go. >> We're going to talk more about that at the top of the next hour show, Ali will join us in studio. This is an early one for show. Like show is a night owl. >> He's a man. >> He's a man. >> Yeah, I'm going to ask how hard it was for him to get up. I know he's hosting JSTOT Plus this week, but yeah, it's, well, so we'll talk to show about that. Home run derbies tonight, 8 p.m. you can watch it on Sportsnet and listen to it right here on Sportsnet 590, the fan. So here's the thing, before we get into the do like a do not like it, we are going to see changes this year. There is a different scenario. So instead of being ranked one to eight based on how many home runs that you've hit during the regular season, all eight hitters will compete against each other. And then the top four will advance to the semifinals, players are then seeded based on performance in the first round tiebreaker as long as home run. So some other changes include pitch limits, first round and semi final is 40 pitches or three minutes, whichever comes first, excluding the bonus period. The final is 27 pitches or two minutes, whichever comes first, the bonus period is way too complicated for me to explain it to you. It's very hard to watch and listen to have it explained to you because it will happen. We all know why the original change was made from 2015. Yes. One is TV has more control over the broadcast. So there's timing. There's all that stuff. The other thing is they got to save these guys, like John, remember Josh Hamilton went on that? What was it? Twenty year old run rants a lecture in one round, I think it was 2008, yeah, final year of Yankee stadium. So do you like it? Do you like the format as currently constructed? You're the new one that's going to be implemented general because there was a time where it was 10 outs. Right. It was basically whenever you didn't hit a home run, which the nostalgia in me says, I like that better because that's what I grew up with. Okay. But I also understand this concept, but I like that there's a time limit, but I'm going back to like watching Ken Griffey, Jr. and home run derbies and like, I don't know, that just there's part of me that is like, I yearn for that. But I also understand why we are where we are. I don't hate this one. I just, it's nostalgia for me. Yeah. That's the big one. Okay. So you have to remember, Matty. So my first major exposure here we go. This is where Matt, you're so much older than I was trying to come on. My first real exposure to the home run derby in a meaningful way occurred in the 2000s, late 2000s, probably, no, yeah, late 2000s, early 20s, I don't know, something like that. When Jose boutista participated and to me, that felt like a big deal because I thought it was really cool to see a player from your own team, your own organization, a franchise in the Blue Jays that never gets featured on national television is seldom discussed outside of the market to have a player be showcased in that setting was awesome. And I was really excited about it. I hated the 10 out system because you had to be very judicious with your swings and your decision making, and you had guys that would flame out really quickly before actually being able to showcase their ability, like, naturally, you take a three, four batch swings and now all of a sudden you're like, Oh man, I got to really make this next one count and you start pressing a little bit. Sure. Like, I know it's a competent. It's supposed to be light hearted and fun, but it is still a competition. Look out how Vladi approaches it. He's made for the home run derby clearly. He wanted last year, but I do think the timing system. I think some of that in here in pressure off in terms of like, if I take a bad hack and I dribble one down the first baseline, who cares? Because now I can just keep going where I think they ran into a little bit of trouble and this is why I think now the pitch limit has come into play is they struggle to keep up. If you notice this, there'd be here's a swing, boom, balls out of the yard as it's traveling. Here's another one. Boom. Balls traveling it. And now you're struggling to keep up with what is the number? How many have the how many homers has this guy actually hit? Yeah. That tweak is to help mitigate some of that to in a way, slow it down, but to not compensate for the action because the one thing that the time system has done is it's really reinvigorated. The overall excitement and entertainment value, I think of that product. So I like the system. I actually do like the way that they've separated the first round and then the same, the remaining two rounds, it's great because last year, Adley Rochman hit 26 homers in his first round matchup against, there's 27 against Luis Robert and he lost. He was eliminated this year. If that format this year's format was in place last year, he would have been third overall in the first round. He would have been then advanced to the head to head match ups. So I like that little tweak and I'm excited for it. I always look forward to the homerun derby. I think it's a marquee event, big attraction and in terms of all star events, it's where I think it's right up there to me. It's that in the three point contest in the NBA and speaking of that homerun derby, it's time now for wake and rate presented by sports interaction, your homegrown sports book, 19 plus bet response. The homerun Derby odds leading the way unsurprisingly, Peter Lonzo plus three 10 Marcelo Zuna plus three 75 gunner Henderson plus four 50, a Dolas Garcia plus 500, Bobby with junior plus 500. This one hurts. Teoska Hernandez plus 1200, Jose Ramirez plus 1200, Alec Baum plus 1600. I'll tell you, there's two guys to stand out for me here. Yes, let's hear it. There's something about the evolution of Bobby Whit Jr. Playing in a small market like Kansas City and I don't think, I think people realize how good he is. I don't think a lot of people realize how good he is. Bobby with Jr is a stud. This feels like an event for Bobby Whit Jr. to really showcase his tools, especially the power because I think that's a little bit underrated. So I like that at plus 500. I really like Teoska Hernandez plus 1200. Same. Like I think that's probably the best value on the board here. Is that where you were leaning as well? Yeah, I'm big on Teoska or just cause it needs, then we need to rub salt in the wound when it comes to blue jays. So I'm big on Teoska in this tournament in this competition. I do like Peter Lonzo contract year for him too. I know. That takes this event really seriously. He sure does. He's the only one in this field that has won it before twice. And no, I just, I think he'll be, he'll be juiced up for this. Like he didn't have a great showing. No, we're not making any accusations here. He'll be, he'll be very excited. He gets invested. He takes it seriously. So I, I, I think I would lean Peter Lonzo and then if I mean long shot, so to speak, like Teoska's a great one. I think that's great. I really like Teoska. That was Wakenrick presented by sports interaction, your homegrown sports book 19 plus bet responsibly. When we come back, show Ali in studio and talk blue jays. When we come back, Matt Marchese, Danieli Franceski right here on the fan morning, show you're listening on SportsNet 590, the fan. [MUSIC]
